No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 176: Mailbag (Part II)

Episode Date: November 5, 2018

In Part II of our mailbag podcast, we talk about future NLU events, how we would design a golf course for the PGA Tour, pulling in podcast guests, The Match between Tiger and Phil, who... The post NLU Podcast, Episode 176: Mailbag (Part II) appeared first on No Laying Up. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to be the right club today. Yeah. That is better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most. All right, guys, welcome back to part two of our mailbag podcast. If you missed part one, be sure to check that out. It was posted last week, a myriad of topics and a lot of interesting ones here on the

second half. It was way too many good questions. Glad to make this into two parts. I'm on vacation at the moment. This will be the last podcast of the week. We'll have another one up next Sunday night with a player. It's already been recorded. But if you're looking to add some new podcasts to your stream,

go to the Calaway Podcast Network. First has the ship show pod. It connects listeners with the cool things happening inside Calaway's marketing team, new products, limited releases, content, personal stories, and just some goofing off. Join Jeff Newbarth and AJ Volpel for new episodes every Tuesday. If you're into the geek year tech side of the game, you got to go to the fitting room podcast, Nate and AJ.

Do a deep dive into the world of fitting and technology, golfers and help golfers all over the world beside which clubs to play and what they should be playing. And we'd like to get involved in this world. So whatever interest you guys the most on these kind of topics, please let us know. We want to invoke some more technology stuff into our content in the next year, but a little bit am… We're a bit amateur, amateurish.

I guess you could say on that end, and we want to learn what you guys are most interested in and hopefully can deliver on that end. So just search Calaway products on iTunes or Spotify and subscribe to their channel. And without further ado, please enjoy part two. And we'll see you guys again next week. This is from Sir Bro Hammer. When will you guys have a ringer style golf tournament for your fans and where in the Atlanta area will you host it?

Well, so obviously it's no secret. The Carter family is from Atlanta. Atlanta's a tough ask as far as an event goes. Well, so that was my thing. Atlanta was one of the first cities. So let's preface all of this with saying, I think we can announce pretty, you know, unequivocally that we do want to host two or possibly three.

Hopefully three events. Regional events, let's get the fan-based out and play some golf and have some beers and do the whole thing. Community organizing. We want to do some light community organizing. Are we going to run in 2020? Hard to say at this point. Let's do some community organizing. Atlanta was one of the first cities that sprung to mine, centrally located, hard to say at this point. But let's do some community organizing.

Atlanta was one of the first cities that sprung to mine, centrally located, easy to get to. Problem is, I don't know where we would do it. And I'll take my answer off the air from you guys on that one. We did two events at Sweetens this year, which not our events, but we've been to two of them. And that is like, it's hard to follow that.

That golf course is so perfect for you. You can rent out the entire course. And there's nothing else there, but like it's all the different formats you can play. And it's it wouldn't I don't think it would be a tripper. You just like have normal t times in a certain window. And because it's going to we want to be for a lot of people. So you probably kind of need to rent a course out in some way. And you still want it to be relatively intimate. Yeah. so it's, we're not looking like for the best golf courses in the world to host it. We're kind of looking for any other sweetens coves out there

that can kind of host this and are small enough and affordable enough to rent out for a day. Or so if there's anyone out there that kind of has, we're open to suggestions on where we're going to be. We have some ideas on regions we want to go, but we need, it needs to be the right course or courses in particular days to really make it work. But we're thinking globally.

But acting locally. All right. We're just going to leave that there. Yeah, I think that's the right way to look at it. But yeah, we definitely want to make this happen. And it's a huge initial. Oh, well, I think, and I mean, you kind of touched on it, but yeah, it doesn't have to be a top 100 golf course that we do something like this at. I think that's hopefully in this one. Oh, I think, and I mean, you kind of touched on it, but yeah, it doesn't have to be, you

know, a top 100 golf course that we do something like this at. I think that's hopefully not a miscontact. I would rather it not be a top of it. Yeah, I mean, that's like some of my most fun days I've had playing golf are, are, you know, has little to do with, uh, with the golf course. And I don't say that lightly, like, you know, the golf course doesn't ever matter, but it's so much more about the people you're with and the kind of access you have to the golf course.

And that's where I think you're point about sweetens where you can just kind of run wild and do whatever you want is pretty much the awesome. We all have one of the tweens, yeah. In the fall. That's the natural, like, all right, if we're gonna have one in the southeast, it's there. It needs to be there.

And we've seen, which is only what, two hours from Atlanta? Exactly. Yeah, and people fly in from people travel for these things. It's close. You can fly in the Nashville You can find them at land you find a Birmingham. It's kind of equidistant from all those places. So All right, well fingers crossed. Yeah, on a completely different note. This is from Cluster Fluff. I really just chose the chose the questions based on how good your username was. If you could design a brand new course for the PGA tour that would test the modern day golfer, what would it look like?

Love this one. That is a good one. Gosh. I feel like I'm leading off too much. Let's get to the number two hitter here. Well, let Tron load up, and I'll start with. I thought about this a lot. I thought about this a lot.

I thought about this a lot, and I thought about double play for selling. What are the most interesting shots that I watched happen this past year? And the whole that I kept going back to was the sixth hole at Carnegie Stee. I was like, when guys would step up that tee, I just remember thinking, like, I can't wait to see what he does here because it's a part five, and there was space between like center line bunkers and OB left. And if you wanted to try to get there in two, you had to go down that line because the further right you bailed, there was more just slightly off center line bunkers to the right.

I mean, you could take like an iron down the right side, play as a three shot hole, or just take on a ton of risk, play down the left side and go for it in two. And I just remember being like, that is intriguing as hell. Way more intriguing than like, oh, can he carry this bunker at 320? And if he doesn't carry it, like he can miss five yards to the right and still be fine, that kind of style and making guys think,

like, all right, if I want to bite all this off, here's all the things I got to think about and like all of the mapping and what not to get you to a hole. Like the old course is probably just too easy in general for these guys, but something like Karnusti was one of the more perfect tests and it was like, all right, how much you wanted to bite off was a true risk reward evaluation. And I think that's the mindset. I don't know if that answers the question as much, but that kind

of mindset of like setting guys up to try to figure out what they actually need to do off the tee rather than taking the shot that is just the least risky is would be very interesting. I think the most interesting whole, I think this was two years ago, the most interesting whole I've watched guys play was in the USAM at, or there's other USAM, no, it was the Walker Co. LACC. LACC, number 15.

Yeah. Like that, that to me just made all the ball and equipment and technology stuff kind of describe the whole disappear for a little bit It's like a 90 hard part through well some days. It's a 90 yards some days It's what like 160 exactly something is just the gnarly screen and if you miss your completely host But yeah, people just like freak out on the tea. It's awesome So I would make sure that there's at least a few holes like that. And it would probably be, like if I was to design something for, you know, PGA tour players, it would probably be

something more along the lines of a harbor town. Yeah. Well, yes, that I think speaks a little bit to what I was going to say to you. It shouldn't be ignored that we're designing a hole hole for the PJ tour and so I picked the only Link's course that the PJ tour play is correct all year which would be a tough sell I think if you're building this and where are the new PJ tour events Minnesota and Detroit you could build a Link's course there maybe I think like this is a very

unpopular opinion with the like with the angles crew. And hopefully it'll lead to another discussion here. But in mind was probably unpopular one with the tree management. Well, so that's kind of where I'm at. Like honest to God, when you, you, this is, I can't believe I'm saying this, but you said,

you know, when I think about like what shots I had the most fun watching this year, you know of course popped into my head was Mexico. Yeah. And just watching guys punching out of trees and carrying trees and like hitting wild ass recovery shots. And at elevation. And at elevation.

Yeah, you know, yeah, the ball doesn't curve, they have to figure it out. So I couldn't be more of a proponent of the width and angles philosophy for the everyday player and even elite amateurs and and all this stuff. But with how far the ball goes with what PJ tour, you know, in professional golfers in general, just like to see and knowing what they're gonna bitch about, what they're gonna like and all this things. Like, it would probably be a course that was relatively tight like you're saying, Tron.

I mean, I think it's, I think Harvard Town's a good one because it kind of hopefully, you know, theoretically limits the distance stuff and kind of maybe smashes everybody together, although then you also have dust in hitting two irons as far as people's drivers. But yeah, I don't know. I think that's what I would lean towards something that was like more tight and penal rough.

And it's crazy how much that kills the recreational game. And but just looking at like, like, look at Sanderson this past week. There was no, like, where was Cameron Champe gonna drive it that, like, put him in trouble on any of those last five or six holes. It was like, yeah, he might, I think he hit the fairway, I'm gonna be misremembering the holes, but I think on 16, he like striped him down the left side

of the fairway, but the other ones, I think he missed the fairway on like almost all of them. And it was like, yeah, cool, there's like, it's like dormant, Bermuda, basically, that you're hitting it out of, and you just hit it anywhere you want. It's totally fine. And that is the stuff that's like, dude, that can't work.

I think there's ways to emphasize accuracy off the tee without it being super high-ruff or tree-lined, though. And that's kind of what I was getting at, is like, for sure. With the ball rolls and guys get it on the wrong line, like, I know I'm comparing it to links, but I'm trying to capture the spirit of kind of a shot that you just can't bomb away and hope it ends up

in a good place. Like, no, you have to play a specific kind of shot if you want to take it on 320 yards. That's, again, that's really hard to accomplish. But even that, so like, let's say it's not a links and it's in Detroit or Minnesota and it's soft and they get a bunch of rain. And now you're talking about like,

I get the spirit of, you know. The variables are neutering you. The variables are new. Yeah, exactly. And that's where I think you saw that at, oh, at a run-a-mink, where they had all of these things that we're talking about, except for like, you know, there were bunkers that were in the 1920 spot.

And so all the long players just nuked it over them. And so we're looking at like how much roll of wet PJ tour fairway gets, which is, you know, not a lot. Then all of a sudden it's like, okay, you're talking about where that drive is gonna land. And then it's like, well, all right, now where do you put that bunker that you're talking about?

Because now you're gonna either kill half the field or give half the field a huge hand up or whatever. I don't know if that makes sense. But it's just like every conversation we've had on this podcast so far, it's just so hard to compare things in the UK to things here. And then you get a course that is kind of with an angle like say Trinity Forest and the tour waters the hell out of it moves Tisa, you know. Straight with an angle and the professional golf doesn't work, like super mega wide. They hit it so damn far that the angles just don't matter that much.

That's why the old course, like if the wind doesn't blow, like the old course gets eaten up by the professionals and Trinity, like unless it gets super, super firm and the angles don't mean that much, They don't mean enough. It needs to actually mean something that mound between your ball and the hole from like 70 yards should mean something. Well, and that's when you get to something like, I mean, even like Aaron Hills, right? Where it's like, okay, this is kind of like a width and angles course. It's much much much wider for a US Open venue, but like, yeah, it's gonna be like 8,000 yards long. So, I mean, as you just can't have it, you can't have it both ways with, so like even like, like Aaron Hills would be a cool annual tour stop.

I'd be down for that. I'd like to see that course without the conditions that they got. I mean, I know it's kind of how the way a lot of these things go, but they weren't going to water it. I mean, the tour will, if, you know, if it's dry in a certain area leading up to a PGA tour event, the tour will dictate that you water it. The USGA will not. It was,

the USGA does not want to live under par. No, they do not. It was Aaron Hills where we got the Fescue Gate also. Yes. That was awesome. So sick. But those guys hacking down the rough on Wednesday after dude. That was too many.

That was too much. That was too much. All right. It's a really interesting question. It is. And as far as much as we're hard on PGA tour. Yeah. And it is like a really hard question answer because I think like what Gil Hans did at TPC

Boston last year or you know the bunker. He put in a new bunker and then up coming out because the players hated it. It's like, no, when they hate it, that's what you need to do. And the players couldn't describe why they hated it or why it was unfair or anything like that. It's just a bad bunker. So the problem with, another problem with everything we're talking about,

and this is where kind of credit to the PGA tour too, I guess, is like, you have to do all these things that we're describing. Like, let's say that this place has all of these things. It also needs to have a membership that's willing to give up their golf course for a month. It also has to have places for people to park and places for people to put up tents and places like, so it's super easy to, and kind of fun,

to rip on the PJ tour schedule and be like, that course sucks, why would they go there? But it's like, there are a billion factors that have to go into making all this stuff work. This similar line, I'm fascinated to see if the PJ tour lets lets Ernie L's have any discretion as to how Royal Melbourne's set up for the president's cup next year.

Yeah, I agree. It was firm when they played it in 11. I do remember that. Oh, super firm. Yeah. The guy's putting off greens instead. Oh, it was awesome. It was tremendous.

I hope I really hope that happens. All right, Levi Dunnigan asks, when are you guys gonna get Brooks Kevco on the podcast or does no laying up stand with Alan Shipnook Try this route try it last year try to long time to like two years ago before he was a major champion and all that Struggle to get it done through management often. There's a lot of complications that come with that. You know what? Maybe there would be he feels Disrespected because he hasn't been on the NLU podcast. Well, I was gonna say maybe there's a lot of complications that come with that. You know what, maybe there would be, he feels disrespected, because he hasn't been on the NLU podcast. Well, I was gonna say, maybe there's,

I just, look, let's not be pessimistic here. Maybe all of this works in our favor to where it's like, hey, maybe now's a good time to come on and share your story. Yeah. The catch is like you have to say something. Yeah. You have to open up a bit. Yeah, I don't think we're interested in an hour of kind of like,

throw away press room cliches. Make ultra speak. Yeah, let's make it happen. I'd love to. I mean, if you got things to say, there's not a lot of players that like, like, do doesn't win the US Open twice in a row, and we just like didn't think of having that. Oh, yes.

Oh, man, we should have that. I didn't think about that. Anyone who hasn't been on has probably said no at this point. It's a pretty safe assumption. Shout out to Kessler. Tell me out, Tronus, I know you know this guy. Amel, Yannick, is that my same name, right? Amel.

Amel, yeah. He has three questions. I think we, I don't know, we'll ask the three and you can choose what you want to answer. You're picked for breakout star of 2019. You have to pick one to make a bigger impact on the tour in the next five years, Cam Champ or Matthew Wolfe.

And where does Rory have more pressure to win in 2019? Augusta or Rowe Port Rush? Which one is, which one do you want to tackle? We can each do one if that works. I'm going, I'll do all three. I'm gonna go, Sam Burns, shout out to my Fred X Cup squad. Sure. That's maybe the, maybe the pick of the draft. I kind of, although granted, I have a guy that already won, but yeah, I think Sam Burns is a

menace. I think KM, Sam, just because he's got a head start. Yeah, that one is tough. It's a good question, but I think in one week, the Matthew Wolf hype might have already gotten too big. I know he's going to be really good, but... Yeah, but I mean, he's also like a freshman, or I guess he'll be a sophomore. He'll be a sophomore, but five years is like, dude, he might have only been a pro for two years because Cam Chan will have been one for five. Right. And then I'm going to say Augusta for Rory, just because I think that's...

I think if he wins a Port Rush that's like icing on the cake, if you win to the gust of that's like, cement the heck out of his legacy. Yeah, I think I think I think I'm going to say port rush just because I think it's going to be like the Fleetwood treatment for Burkdale, but even worse, like it's this huge deal that the that the open's going back to Northern Ireland and I think it's good. I don't not sure it's more pressure, but it's gonna be way more of a distraction than any other tournament he's probably ever played in before. Bigger impact on tours definitely. I mean, Cam Champs already won on it. I think that's kind of where we're going there.

Breakouts star, I'm riding with my Fred X Cup team, SungJM. Yeah. He's like really, really, really, really good. I think he's gonna... Probably shouldn't have slid to number five in the draft. Probably shouldn't have. I think also's gonna... Probably shouldn't have slid to number five in the draft. Probably shouldn't have. I think also got some ill-gotten earnings.

It was not that much. He was in the CJ Cup. He was the only guy in the field from the Fred X Cup. That was in the CJ Cup. You guys had... You guys had every opportunity to draft him in your past. Had he been the first pick in the draft, I would be very much on your side here

in rallying for you, but we did have a chance to draft them and didn't. What, are you taking all three questions? Uh, sure. Breakout star. Um, God, Sam Burns is a good, that's a good pick. Uh, I mean, again, like, Cameron Champ already has a win. That's, winning is super hard to do. Really hard.

Uh, like, I kind of was thinking we wouldn't, like, we might not have a win in the Fred X Cup draft. Like, it's only, you know, the fall is the time for hard to do. Really hard. Like I kind of was thinking we wouldn't, like we might not have a win in the Fred X Cup draft. Like it's only, you know, the fall is the time for it to happen. It's only 30 guys and, you know, whatever. The fall or July, when it's like the, basically it's like major season, John Deere, Reno, Barbousall. You know, I guess, how would you guys define Breakout Star? I mean, is that like someone who's coming up? How would you define it?

Well, I don't know. I think there's a lot of guys that kind of live in relative obscurity and this is not a slight to these guys, but like is someone like Emiliano Grillo? Like if he comes out and wins like three times. It's a breakout star, right? Like he's one on tour before like is that? It's like a man who, a shopping mall major.

Is he a breakout star? Probably, yeah. It depends on the semantics here, I guess. But who would you want to be a breakout star? Can we say that? KFS, I want him to win three events next year. It might happen. There was a couple KFS questions.

I really like Kyle Stanley. I really are writing the questions. But, I don't know. That was a cool winny at last year, but what happens when he wins? What do you mean? Nothing. He's like a robot. Oh yeah.

There's not a lot. His interview after he won last year at the Quicken Loans was like, that was awesome. I was like, I liked him more in that moment than I ever have. You won't see a ton of emotion from him, like, or like, super pumped up in any way, but I wouldn't say he's like a,

on the golf course, he's like a robot and he like, takes it all, all the, everything that happens to him again stride. You know, I could see kind of freaking out and winning a couple times, Kevin Tway. It's already done at once. I know, that's what I mean. What that's what I'm saying is like,

is that not a breakout star or is that, I mean, I could see him. Yeah, that works. Mega hot. We've maybe buried the best question for way too late. I don't know if we're past making this too long. Well, sorry, real quick, but who was going with,

like, would wanna see as a break up star? DJ D funk, Dylan Meyer. Yeah, that was cool. We'll see him at, like, to see Cameron champ winning Sanderson and then Dylan Meyer, like, hit hybrids into the greens and finishing like six or seven, that was sweet. I would love to see a lot more of him on Telecast.

I think if I could pick one guy to be a breakout star, it would probably be Curtis. Curtis luck. It's just because he'd be good for the game too. He's kind of a... Also good for my team. Yeah, that's true. Also, I'd like to see Zach win like five events

and just fund the bug club by himself. For sure, and it's all public. Yeah, I'll play for $10. Jameson Parker asked potentially the best question of all of them. Only a few VIPs will be attending the match in person at Shadow Creek. For gamesmanship purposes, named four VIPs, each player should place in the gallery in order to gain a mental edge.

Oh, this is, man, four. Gosh, four is a lot. Let's just take it one at a time. All right, so we're really eight then, because we're doing four for that. That's right, man, that's a lot. So I think this hat has to pick like Billy Walter. I was just saying that the IH for sure. Yeah, for sure. I think those two are our no brainers. So like does he pick Bob Mueller? Like Robert Mueller. Or like who was the guy that was the New York prosecutor? Who was the guy that was the New York prosecutor, pre-Bahara? Pre-Bahara, yeah.

Yeah. That would be great. Right the head of the SEC, or for sure. I think that's it. The CEO of Chlorok. Pre-Bahara. I did not see that. Did not see that one coming.

That's good though. I think this is kind of a shout out to Trump at the debates when he brought... Obama's brother. Obama's half brother or whatever, and sat over the front row as well as some of those accusers. Gosh, that's a really good question. If I'm Phil, I would pick...

I mean, I feel like you probably pick Stevie Williams. Hank Haney. Hank Haney. You could put, gosh, I mean all four could be, it couldhmm. Hank Haney. Hank Haney. You could put, gosh, I mean all four could be, it could be Butch Haney. The easy route would be to. Sean Follie and. I think Butchers can.

I don't think they have a bad relationship. They're cool. Butchers can. They're cool. I don't think Butch, I don't think Haney is a killer. I'm not evil. I was gonna say, do we do, do we do the, I think they're cool too.

I think they're cool too. Yeah, do we do the tabloid route? I've just started naming some of the women from the scandal. I don't know. I feel slow're cool too. Do we do the tabloid route? We've just started naming some of the women from the scandal. I don't know. I feel slow ground. Gosh, we should have thought about this one a little bit more. It could have come up with some disease.

I think we have some good ones, the FBI. Didn't Charles Barclay and Kat have a falling out? Like they'd be like, that would be one. You could do that. They don't really speak anymore. But I don't think they have like a true beef No, but that could just kind of make him feel Relatively uncomfortable. Yeah, you know, I would probably throw in there is

Those guy the Navy seals that tiger didn't pick up the check for I Think maybe just pick four of those guys and throw them throw them in there. What about the harbor master? What was the story on that one? He called down and he left his tennis ball. That's right. Has his tennis ball. Call down with that harbor master to secure the tennis ball. I want to hear, yeah, I want to hear from people on this one because there's a lot of a lot of things to be good with. We probably left a few out there on the table. We didn't do a whole lot of prep for this, which is not dissimilar to a lot of podcasts. Joshua Rooker asked, at which point did you all feel

comfortable, confident enough to leave your former job and make no-lang up your number one priority? I think the... When you guys asked me to? That was gonna say, the easy answer is like, when we did it, but it was probably just, I don't know, right after the Rory, couple Rory podcast, we started to see

just everything's kind of skyrocket. And I don't know, right after a couple of Rory podcasts, we started to see just everything's kind of skyrocket. And I don't know, when we started out, Tron, you could probably add to this too, was like, we never really do it to have a big audience or have a business model in mind or like try to make any money off. I was just like, we just... It's a happy accident.

Yeah, it was like a hobby and we just kind of for fun. And then once, I remember, it was specifically, it was a player's agent said to me, he's like, dude, I can just tell him, talking to you, you have no idea what you have. And we didn't, I had no idea how big the audience was. You could see the numbers on Twitter and stuff, but you just don't really know the impact that it had.

And it was kind of having a couple of those conversations and learning kind of quickly how the model would look if we were to do it and the support of Calloway, reaching out to us really and wanting to get involved is what kind of triggered the whole thing. And that's pretty much when it all changed, just kind of spring of 2017. It seems like a long time ago now that it's gone on.

I think part of it too, that played into it, I think for both of us, was like having to do kind of two jobs at the same time, whether, whether this has ever been considered a job or when we were kind of doing it part-time, but having to switch back and forth between those things and kind of burn the candle at both ends. I think that's, when you do a golf podcast

and then go back to talking about, in my case, talking about revenue per available room night or all sorts of, you know. It's two totally different directions and they're not really helping each other. Yeah, and it's just tough to switch gears and every time you go back to the other one, you're like, man, why am I not?

Well, that was the thing. It was like, we kind of had to ask ourselves a question. Like, do you want to end up doing this full time? And when we knew for sure that the answer was yes, like we couldn't get out fast enough. Yeah, we had to like make sure we had the finances in order and you had to make sure your wife was on board and she was incredibly supportive.

But it was kind of like, all right, if we want to do it, then let's not waste time working on other things, because the more time we dedicate to it, now the better we're off we're gonna be. That's not layup. Yeah, let's go for it. And honestly, bringing DJ in helped us, he also kind of helped us realize a lot of things

that we probably didn't know. And we needed somebody with industry experience to help us with, you know, when we go do, knowing what to do and what not to do is like very important thing. We could have gone a completely different direction in the last year alone and it could have been the totally wrong direction. So, having DJ being willing to be involved kind of helped really map things out as well down the road. Thanks, guys. Well, what about yourself? You

left the BJA tour to do this? Yeah, I think that for me, it's a lot of what you guys are saying too. I mean, I think for for me, it's a lot of what you guys are saying too. I mean, I think for me, it was like kind of figuring out just what I wanted to do with my time. I think a lot of it was figuring out what I was passionate about and what makes me excited and a lot of that stuff is, I mean, it's a lot of what we do, what we do every it sounds cheesy, but it's a lot of what we do every day. It's talking about golf, like a normal person talks about it. It's highlighting cool, like, you know what I think the, sorry, it's a wide-ranging answer,

but I think the biggest part for me was when I figured out like what I liked about golf. And what I liked about golf was not tracking, you know, world rankings or FedEx cup rankings or like watching, you know, who's going to win the Quicken Loans National like make your whole week about this. Like that, I was like, God, what I like about golf is like playing golf and talking about courses and talking about, you know, just hitting shots and doing all these things. And I think that's no slight at the PJ tour. Obviously they're incredibly good at what they do and what they promote and what they

put out and stuff. But for me, it was so much more on like, okay, I think I've forgotten a lot of what golf is by being so focused on one tour and one schedule and one set of players that I'd like once you kind of take a step back from that and you look at like, man, I'd like, I love golf. I wasn't sure that I loved PJ tour golf at that time. And I think that was the biggest difference for me and just kind of looking for something different to do.

And I think what's kind of cool and not to fluff you guys too bad here. But please go on, we have all the time in the world. Oh, the card's almost full. No, what I think is really cool about it is that, I think what drew me to it was that it's kind of a, it's a product or a brand, a hashtag brand, or whatever you want to call it of things that are, you guys started doing it

just because I think you correct me if I'm wrong. You guys started doing it just because you really, really, really liked doing it. And that connects with people so much more than like, okay, how do I get rich? Let's reverse engineer this and let's start with the product and then we'll try to figure out how to make people like it.

It was instead of just starting with something that people like and trying to make that into a product is so much more fun. Even now, it's kind of easy to work on. Of course, we want to be successful and be able to go do the stuff we want to do, but for us, it's still like the conversation is not, hey, how do we milk this thing for all it's worth? It's like, how do we sustain this and get to the point where we can do it for however long we want to do it. Yeah, I think if we had, I say we, more you guys, I think if you had gotten into this for

like dollar signs, you would have been sorely disappointed, which I think is kind of the good, the good part about this is like, all right, let's make enough to keep the lights on and travel and do what we want to do. And then, you know, everything else will kind of figure out. I think part of it too, there's this other ancillary, like all the other, all right, let's make enough to keep the lights on and travel and do what we wanna do. And then, you know, everything else will kind of figure out. Fallwear, man. Part of it, too, there's this other ancillary, like all the ancillary stuff around professional golf

is one of the things I like about it. Yes. Aside from just the golf, you know? Oh, you got it. It's like there's all these personalities and there's all this travel and there's all these, you know, pseudo beefs. And like, you know, just all this,

it's like this menagerie of different stuff that like this cottage that's just around professional golf at large. And the European tour is a part of that. The PGA tour is a part of that. The champion's tour is a part of that. The web tour is a part of that. Like it's this entire ecosystem,

but it's not, you know, like the golf itself sometimes is almost the least interesting part of it. Yeah, for sure. Watching it or yeah, yeah, definitely. And I think like back to your point of like a reverse engineering or, we could make, I would imagine, we've never tried to, we could make way more money

off this podcast than we'd like choose to. But like, I think that ruins the product a little bit when you have, you know, a lot of other podcasts have five, eight minutes of advertising. I think that dilutes it, and it takes away from kind of what has helped make this thing successful, and it would be easy to really, truly just like sell ourselves out,

but that's not at all how we do it, and it's not our business model, and that's not, it's art, so it's kind of cheesy to say. No, for sure. I mean, we can stop patting ourselves on the back after this, probably, but it's like, I think that speaks to the videos and stuff too, where it's like, yeah, we could make stuff

that gets a lot more views theoretically. I don't put us to the test on that. We totally good. I was like, we should probably do that. No, I mean, there's a way to make click baity stuff that would be very easy to like get a ton of eyeballs on, but those kinds of people are not going to show up to an event at Sweetens' Cove

and they're not gonna sit and watch the premiere of Taurusos, which a bunch of people sat and did this week and they're not gonna email us funny shit all the time on the refuge that just like makes us laugh. It's just the more, I mean, this is like the oldest cliche in the book, but like the more you chase the wrong stuff,

like just the more solace it gets and the less fun it is. So I would way rather have fun with like a very small passionate fan base than chase, you know, whatever. DJ, were you going back to your time at the tour? Were you afraid to go low? Super afraid to go. I'm afraid to go low in every aspect. Yeah, I assume you're referring to live under par.

Yeah, I was much more comfortable in kind of a US open, grind it out, set up. If you get one or two under, I mean, you had a really, really, really good day. So stupid. Moving on, Chris Arnato asks, how much of a hassle is it to film mid-round? Does someone have to take turns sitting out or do you have a small crew you hire? Very small crew.

You're hearing from all of them right now. It's a pain in the ass. It's a huge pain in the ass. Yeah, I mean, preface all of this with like no, like no one should feel bad for this. Like it's still very easy. But it's nice, it's really, really nice to go play around a golf and not have to. Yes, like I don't, and we do that.

I don't get like a huge thrill most of the time out of playing on the road or playing in any of the rounds that you guys see or whatever, because your mind is going in 55 different directions. It's like, fuck, do we get this? Do we get this? What shot do we need? Hold on, hold this.

Don't hold on, don't hit yet. Oh, God, there's people behind us. Oh, God, it gets... It's hard to do. Yeah, it's hard to do, but it's very... Relatively. I mean, coal mining is hard to do. Like, what we do is not that hard.

But, yeah, it's something that... It's a process that we probably need to greatly improve. But it is. And yeah, we do do it run and go in and run ourselves. And it's, we just, that, it's so different than, you know, if you hire a camera crew of three people or whatever one that's really expensive, to, it just takes, like, sticking a camera in, like, in somebody's face that you meet is way different than, like, just coming up with a cell phone They it takes involves so much more staging and just kind of gets rid of a lot of the authenticity of what we're trying to accomplish

I think I wouldn't say we accomplished it perfectly, but we're learning and working on it and But yeah, it's not a process. It is a process. It's not some huge if you can't tell it's not a big budget operation That's where Matt Golden, our editor, earns his stripes because he turns our random everywhere footage into something that looks at least somewhat presentable, I think quite presentable. So.

PK has been bucking his head a little bit. Oh, we got a PK watch, go ahead. Yeah, I mean, he's just, he's firing kind of the same usual, same usual drivel at the time. Some people dole, yeah. Adorable, deplorable. same usual drivel and people dole Yeah Adorable deplorable he says it's kind of a fun rhyme scheme

I've been in the golf media industry for 25 years. I've negotiated every media deal possible in every medium You shouldn't be negotiating that many deals if you're yeah, just for whatever Maybe have the deals last a little while. Yeah. With the biggest and smallest names in golf, players and companies, how long did it take you to become a nut bar? The medicine will take hold on. A lot of, you know, in this national conversation,

we have a lot of mental illness jokes as well. Yes. Very on becoming. Let's go back to the match for a question here from Jared Gowdsch. On the viewing scale of watching web Simpson, he says, no hate, I love web. On the viewing scale of watching web swing

to watching Tiger Walk in 15 foot birdie putts, where is the Tiger versus Phil match for you guys? This is a tough one. I feel like it's kind of venturing into. It's a tough spectrum we're dealing with. It's almost, it's getting a little painful to where it's almost flipping to like, I'm going to watch it because it think it might be a train wreck. And I can't look away.

Yeah, it's hard. I mean, I was listening to Andy and Porath's podcast, and Andy, I think, summed up a lot of what I was feeling, which was, you root really, really, really, really hard for it to be successful, because this is exactly what golf needs, maybe not this specific thing, but it needs alternate formats, it needs alternate, just alternates to the PJ tour.

I think what he said was basically like, the reason the tour doesn't evolve is because it's not like there's no competition really. Like why would it, everything works fine for them. So like why change anything, which is totally fair. And so, yeah, that being said, it's just, I mean, it just feels, and I will reserve judgment for the most part

until we can actually watch it, but it feels a little phony to me. It definitely, I mean, is there something phony about these two playing for nine million dollars about the other people's money? The thing you know that they released on the HBO, like the preview of the 24-7 thing, and they're both kind of hamming it up,

and playing a role, it just felt so inauthentic. like the preview of the 24-7 thing and they're both kind of hamming it up and Playing a role. Yeah, it's just it just felt so inauthentic. It's just all like and I don't even know whose fault This is because it's not really tiger and Phil's fault because they get put in this situation where it's like, okay The cameras on now like trash talk. Go ahead. It's exactly what we're right. Okay. We're ready. Go ahead Go ahead trash. It's funny. Yeah, go be funny. And it's like, hey, they're not funny at all. Really, like, do you think about Tiger?

That's funny. I was thinking about this the other day, like when he was at his like, quote unquote, cool list, was when he would give like one word answers in the press conferences. You're like, oh, sick. Like, that guy doesn't talk to anyone.

He's like, he's a killer. And now it's like, hey man, like, you're a new Tiger. Like, be fun. Come on, like, be cool. But like, kind of mean, and kind of edgy. And it's like, yeah, Tyler! And now it's like, hey man, like, you're new tiger, like, be fun, come on, like, be cool. But like, kind of mean, and kind of edgy. And it's like, yeah, it's just the whole thing. It's like, the whole thing is set up to,

it's just, those two are in a position of weakness, I guess, in this whole situation. Like, I don't know what they can do differently. It'd be so hard for them. Besides play for their own money. Like, that's the thing is, they could be playing legitimately. I'm not being hyperbolic here. The $9 million thing, I could not.

I can't fathom how much money they have to begin with. So I don't know. It's that important to either. Yeah, it gives a shit how much. If they were playing for 50 bucks and you had to watch the other person take out their wallet and pay the other guy on the 18th green, that would be just as interested in that.

And you know, the nine million. The whoever paid that $9 million, Ith green, that would be just as interested in that. So like the nine million. So like the nine million. So like the nine million. So like the nine million. So like the nine million, the nine million, it was gonna be more, but the PGA tour,

but the Kabash on that. And then again, the nine million is such an arbitrary. And then B, like I know they're getting more, it, you know, on the, on the back end of it, like they're, you know, they're probably,

you know, depending upon, you know, maybe it's, maybe it's a total flop and they're not making a bunch more money end of it, they're probably, depending upon, maybe it's a total flop and they're not making a bunch more money off of it, but I think at the end of the day, they're both clearing a lot more money than not knowing about it. And then all the, they keep talking about all the kind of side challenges that are gonna be, yeah, it's gonna be closest to the pin,

which all that stuff, I would assume, I don't know this, but I assume you gotta set all that stuff up ahead of time, so like the cameras know what's coming, and they have graphics ready to go, and all that stuff. So like that stuff's gonna be, I don't know, tiger, what do you think? We're here at the 13th hole, should we do closest to the pin? Oh, you're on for 100 grand to your charity. And it's like, what am I, okay,

when I was supposed to root for like, whose charity doesn't get the money now? I got it, like, what is this? It was the whole thing, it's just like, it's like, well, what am I, okay, when I was supposed to root for like, who's charity doesn't get the money now? I got it, like, what is this? The whole thing is just like, it's just weird. You know what would have been better? They should have played poker against each other. Like if we could like see their whole cards and they played heads up hold them against each other,

that would be like more entertaining to me. And they were betting their own money. Like we've seen the play a ton of golf against each other, but what's, they, this doesn't gonna solve anything. It just makes one person really a lot more rich. I don't even know if it's a lot more, more rich than they already were. I think part of the distaste, I think, too,

just comes from, it's on the heels of, you know, if this was pre-rider cut, people would probably be excited about it. Well, I think the momentum for it was so bad that I'm starting to come at least somewhat back around on it. I think people are like, oh, it's pay review, I'm not paying for that. It's like, yeah, that doesn't even bother me.

It's 20 bucks. Like, come on. That's like, how much? There's not shit going on the Friday. Right. Yeah. And there's been a lot of missteps. And like the more brands that get involved,

the worse off this thing is always gonna be. That's just the way things work. And, you know, not allowing spectators was probably a mistake. And I have no idea what the atmosphere and vibe is gonna be like that's just the way things work. And not allowing spectators was probably a mistake, and I have no idea what the atmosphere and vibe is gonna be like, but like, I mean, come on, I mean, you paid 20 bucks to watch it. Like, I still kinda wanna see what happens.

It's not like, this isn't gonna be the dream scenario at all. It's not gonna be, and nobody out there thinks it, but I think, I just feel like it's gotten a little too far of like, I will never pay for that, just because it's pay-for-view. I will not click two buttons on my phone to pay $20. We're like, well, when people are tweeting about it, like, you're gonna kinda be like, I will never pay for that, just because it's pay for view. I will not click two buttons on my phone to pay $20. Well, when people are tweeting about it, like you're gonna kind of be like,

okay, I kind of want to see what happens. You know what I would do? I almost went to go pay $20 for the perfect club for my Halloween costume, had the store not closed. Like I'd pay $50, like Patrick Reed against like anybody. Yeah, first, well, so that, yes, let's transition out of this in like one more thing, but then like that brings up

a super interesting point to where like, is this kind of like a watershed for other, you know, matches like this? And I think someone had kind of floated that when the report first came out, maybe with Shipnaker or whoever, but real quick on the pay-per-view thing, it's like, I would guess, a lot of people who watch pay-per-view stuff,

either obviously people watch it at home, but a lot of people I think go to bars and, you know, whatever, like let's go go to a bar and watch whatever fight is on or whatever. Part of the charm of this is that all these guys are, you know, these two guys are gonna be super mic'd up, so you'd be able to hear what they're saying. So the other aspect is like, you go to a bar like you're not gonna be able to.

Right, here any of that. So it's like, it's just like watching like a quiet event at your house, I guess is kind of no different than watching golf in general, but that kind of gets to the point where it's like, well, this should feel a lot different and I don't know that it does. I was gonna,

also there's no, yeah, the no fan thing is like, I was gonna reserve judgment. In the middle of the day. Until the 24-7, because I'm dying for a non, like PGA tour media company of some kind, an external, you know, company that has extreme success in doing documentary stuff, do this. And I think there's totally something there

with the history between Phil and Tiger. And I hope they get into that. The trailer for it did not get me excited, but I think they're trying to draw in the casual fan, obviously, to this. I think that's the other challenge is, hey, they need to appeal to a wide swath, sports fans. And you know,

paper view events are at night, almost always. I've never heard of a paper view event during the day. So like, I don't know, are people gonna buy it or not? I think we're at least to the point. I was like, all right, let's at least see what happens. We'll give a paper view event during the day. So I don't know, are people gonna buy it or not? I think it was at least a point. Let's at least see what happens. Give her a shot. I think the reason I'm not gonna totally flame it is just because it's the first iteration

of what I expect to be. Like you said, more of a routine, more of a regular thing. But just thinking about the skins game, like my favorite moment in the history of skins game was when, it didn't like, somebody say something to Gary Player on time with the skins game, like Tom Watson, I think says something.

Oh, they got like a huge fight. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's sick. That's awesome. Yeah. Well, so that's what gets me the most excited about this is, I mean, the like world that we live in now sounds like a big statement, but like everything is so just

meme driven and it's so just like these, these little like snacky bites of content, hashtag content is just like what seems to drive everything and like this couldn't be more perfect for that. And I was thinking about, if you look at the last couple of years of major championship golf or whatever, the moment that sticks out to me the most, as far as like, if you said, what's the most memorable thing that's happened in the last two years,

that majors, what would stick out is like, go get that moment, by speed, then it's like, if I'm an agent or something, and if I'm a speed agent or JT's agent or any of these people, and I'm looking at this opportunity it's like, if I'm an agent or something, and if I'm a speech agent or JT's agent or any of these people and I'm looking at this opportunity to be like, you get the cache of tiger and fill and you're mic'd up for 18 holes, and it's gonna be all go get that moments. That just get ripped down and turned into memes

and gifs and all these different things. And as far as a way to showcase your's personality, like what's gonna do it more that or like post tournament press conferences where you get asked about whatever or just like, you know, watching you play golf with no, you know, with no mics. And so I'm not advocating for, you know, all of this should just be nothing but wild ass entertainment. Like, you know and it should be like the access hell, but it's like dude

It's it's what yeah, what I mean that's the biggest question is like okay is this what is this for entertainment purposes or is this like You know to decide who the best sportsman in the world is like what's the FedEx cup about? Yeah, it just decide like who's the greatest gol, and who's the greatest sportsman, or is it like, yeah, let's keep fans entertained for 52 weeks. And handle out a boatload of money. Yeah, and you can't get stuck in the middle in trying to figure out which one it is.

I don't know. What I'm grasping at is maybe my favorite Skins game moment, which I could be remembering this totally wrong, but I'm pretty sure onika Sorenstam and Fred Funk and Tiger were all playing in the same skins game. And I think it was some deal that if Anika out drove, Fred Funk, he had to wear a skirt,

which probably wouldn't work out very well in 2018. So Fred Funk is wearing a skirt and he bends down to read a putt. And he's like, what do you think Tiger and Tiger's on the other side of it? And he's got pants underneath the skirt. And Tiger's just like, I think it's maybe one, maybe two balls outside left.

Yeah. If Tiger could pull off like four hours worth of those, then I think it's gonna be someone interesting. But we're gonna get a shot. Yes. For sure. They've made a ton of missteps. It is not have a lot of momentum.

There's a lot of things I think we love it for them to do differently about it. I think part of it's just the cycle. It's like the hype cycle has just been too long already. Yeah. Well, it's going to say it's the hurdle to clear for golf fans is honestly not a big one. Like, there's so much content out there as it is. And people really, in my opinion, really love very average content might even include this podcast. But I'm not saying we're about that. But the vitriol for which the people reacted to this was amazing.

Like it truly was. This is like golf fans are not that hard to please from like an entertainment standpoint. I say that saying like most of what we do here is complaint about like broadcast, but like it was amazing how hard people were so vehemently against this. Yeah, I think part of that was just,

I mean like you said, you're on the life cycle of it or whatever, it's just like, it's just been like a slow drip of bad news. Rather than just like dumping it all at once, I mean, like, here's the price, there's no fans, it's this, people are like, oh God, I don't even know how to... In your announce that...

It's just like, and maybe that's just like, how the deal got done and all this stuff was happening in real time, but I don't know. You guys want another PK tweet? Yes. Feed me. Someone said this was a response to being called a nut bar. It said, it sounds like an insult

from those fifth graders NLU who made that content. You're a joke and you responded with, probably why sports illustrated called me, this is all capitalized. A symbol of integrity, because I make stuff up to a complete nutter like you. There you have it. This is the bad, we may just have to do a whole, it might be a developing situation. Might take a whole podcast just to read all, he's probably about 150 tweets now.

We'll keep you guys posted as, as more shit comes to light. We'll get to a few more here and then wrap it up. I gotta go here pretty soon. All right, let's wrap it at this one then. Brian Whipple, best one round experience you've ever personally had playing golf. Not course or score or prestige, just the most memorable, fun, emotional round you've played.

Could be this year in Scotland or when you were 10 with your dad. Deep question. Very deep question. Gosh, you go ahead, Saul, you haven't let off yet. I think I'm gonna go with, and we'll, we'll make it into this in episode four of Taurus Sauce this year.

The round I played last year at the old course was like, just light bulb going off. I had the best caddy in the world. My man, Brett Murray, who just like opened up my eyes to what strategy meant in golf. And the light, it's just like coming into town, I played really well and it was in it just like coming into town. I played really well and it was in the wind and coming into town with the wind at your back and making a bunch of birdies in the back nine finishing in town.

And feeling like that was the first time I really understood the old course and like pieced it together and thought my way through it. And it was that was the round I walked up being like, oh my god, like that, that's golf. Like it is not like playing like resort courses where you just bomb it up in the air. Like that is, I wanna do all of that all over again, like every single day. It's kinda like the first time I went skydiving

or the only time I went skydiving. I never really understood it. And then I got on the ground, I was like, I wanna go back up there right now. Like I wanna, let's do it again right at this moment. And that was like a taste of closest taste of golf adrenaline. I think I've had and it was phenomenal. I would say, well, it's probably a tie between first time I played

Positimpo with Neil, like just, I don't know, I'd never really played. I'd never put an Alistair McKenzie. I'd never really played golf in California before. The weather was perfect. It was just one of those days. But more specifically, I would say the, the'd never really played golf in California before. The weather was perfect. It was just one of those days. But more specifically, I would say the round that we played this year on Pacific dunes. I was kind of thinking about that one too.

There were some performance enhancers involved. Yeah, it was kind of spiritual. I mean, Randy passed out later that day. I think it was, yeah, it was like a spiritual. It was just like, it was really sunny at the beginning and around, the fog rolled in, and then, and then got cold, and then we finished up on the punch bowl. It was just as cool as you could ever experience.

Yeah, that was up there. I think for me, I mean, I've had like the old course when my dad was awesome for all the reasons that you would think it was. And my brother, what was there as well? Gosh, you know what was up there? It was the lost farm with, we put a six-some. Yeah. You guys, and Wild Bill.

And Wild Bill and ZV. And I think that was like, and that was the, I think that was the moment of like our Australia trip. It was just complete jet lag and euphoria and good weather. And I mean, that was like, the golf course was so fun. I think that was right. And then the next day we got a Metro and Keach. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, exactly. So it was like the highest of all. That's exactly right. Or similar to your experience. I think playing North Barric for the first time was like the first time I played with Sean Martin and Matt Van Zant. And that was the first time I really played any Link's Golf whatsoever. And I mean, it was again, we can look for more of that in this tour sauce episode too. All right, we will totally wrap up this question from Phil R. Will Bren and Dassy or Stephen Avery ever get out of prison? I don't know if you guys are making your murder watchers?

Never seen it, never watched it. Well, way in anyway. What do you think they will? You know what, man, it's tough to say. It's tough to say. I'm going to say yes, they will get out of prison. It's not going to be for a long time, though. That is a really good answer.

Have you watched season two? No, I haven't. It's incredible. Really? Yeah. I mean, it's really good. It's really good. I mean, they can't hold up. Yeah is a really good answer. Have you watched season two? No, I haven't. It's incredible. Really? Yeah, I mean, it's really good. It was left. I mean, they got a whole appeal process. Yeah, the whole appeal process, they got new lawyers,

they like, retry to recreate the scene. It's really good. I'm deep into the scenes of this question really resonated with me. I don't think they're going to get out. I think the hurdles big, too big to climb. That's not to say that season two is. The life sentence, definitely.

Life, Brennan's got a life sentence with eligibility for parole life sentence definitely. The third and four. The life sentence. Brennan's got a life sentence with eligibility for parole in 2048. See, there you go. And Stephen Avery has life. He's thinking nail it. Well, it seems like Sean nail it. I don't think I need to watch it. Yeah, it's tremendous.

So let's wrap it up at that. This was a long one. It was a lot of fun. I hope to maybe do some more of these in the future. Until then, cheers. Cheers. Crackle. Come on.

Let's give it a try club. Be the right club today. Yes. That is better than most. How about in? That is better than most. Better than most. Better than most.