No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 322: Jim Nantz

Episode Date: June 18, 2020

Jim Nantz joins to discuss the challenges the CBS crew is facing in the current environment, commercials on television, some takes on the coverage takes, how CBS compares to other networks, and basically anything we asked about. We also discuss the 2019 Masters, rebroadcasting with Tiger, how he knows so many people's names, Tony Romo, and a ton more. Thanks a ton to Jim for taking the time and being willing to come on.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to be the right club today. Yes! That is better than most. I'm not in. That is better than most. Better than most. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the No Lang Up Podcast. I'm not going to lie, a podcast episode I did not think we would ever have. We had the opportunity to speak with Jim Nance. We've obviously been very well documented in our criticisms of CBS, of golf on television.

Jim was nice enough to spend well over an hour with us addressing a lot of those questions. And we had some fun as well. It wasn't just a, it wasn't a raging debate, but we challenged him on a couple of things. He had great things to say about a lot of things and added a lot of color, answered a lot of questions some viewers may have on the telecast,

especially with what's currently going on in their current technical setup. So I'm gonna get to it very quickly here. This, once we get rolling here, we are going to be interruption-free. Thanks to our friends at Callaway Golf. You know them, they're makers of the Maverick drivers, fairways, hybrids and irons, Apex and Apex Pro irons.

The M-D-5 wedges, Chrome, soft golf balls, hyper light golf bags, all products you've heard us talk a lot about. Those hyper light bags I just put in play, available in single and double strap options. They have the distance fittings, the wedge occasion. We have again, we've highlighted a lot of this, but I wanted to thank them for bringing this bonus episode to you this week. So without any further delay, here is Jim Nance.

All right, there's many different ways we could do this. We are not necessarily fans of how golf is presented on TV and particularly your network, but you're not afraid to step into the Lions Den with me here today, Mr. Jim Nance. Well thanks for having me on, Chris, and I'm really ready to answer any questions you might have about broadcasting. Well, first thing I want anything else for that, Matt. Oh, I know. We got a lot to go. We got a lot to cover just to give the listeners a run of show. We're going to kind of hit some of the some of the hard hitting stuff here up front. And then I promise it'll get more fun here on the back. And who knows? This might be this part

might be fun as well. Maybe it's on throughout. Exactly. The back works not going to be fun. Exactly. Well, I said this to you earlier, but I would also say that, you know, I think a lot of our, I'm not just saying this because you're here, but a lot of the criticisms and critiques we have are not necessarily directed at you so I don't want to put you in difficult spots to speak on things that, you know, you're here, but a lot of the criticisms and critiques we have are not necessarily directed at you. So I don't want to put you in difficult spots to speak on things that, you know, you're not in charge of anything like that. But first thing I want to talk about, we had some changes in the broadcast this past week. We had a player mic'd up.

There was some discussion on the air about, you know, trying to get more players involved in it. Maybe some confusion. Some players had thought they had volunteered. I'm wondering if you can kind of take us through the timeline of what the process has been like trying to get players might have well first off let me i'm going to steer this question toward it's your you know deal with last week and this seems to be the one thing that's

coming out of it i want to say this and i know that's lost the most people and they say well we don't care just give us the damn golf but what our crew did last week, and I went into it. The conference call has week saying it might be the greatest challenge I've seen in my 35 years. I was talking about the whole crew, primarily the technical and production teams. And I mean, it was really difficult. It's going to be this week. It's going to be for a while until we have the ability with the safety protocols and everything to have our full manpower. Now, that may sound like a bunch of rubbish, but it's going to be for a while until we have the ability with the safety protocols and everything to have our full manpower. Now that may sound like a bunch of rubbish but it's not Chris. I mean we had about 40 to 50% of our usual manpower and what does that mean? What does that

look like? Well you got videotape replay machines that are coming out of Burbank. You record some golf action on one hole and it's being recorded and sent back to you a thousand miles apart. Now we have one I think one video tape operator on site and a number of people again off site. We had the graphics, the scoreboard graphics. We had LNLJ Christian was here but I think we had more again graphic operators off site. Normally, when we do a tournament press, we have what are called 10 hard cameras. Do

you know what that means? Sure. Yeah, just the stationary cameras, right? Exactly. There's the stationary cameras that are locked down like on a giant oversized tripod and they don't move around. Usually, we have about 10. What's usually 8-10 operators? We had four. I mean a lot of people had to jump around. We had, I believe it was five handheld cameras. I think it was five. One of which was dedicated solely for shot tracer. solely for shot tracer. So I want to just say that the headline for me is that, you know, thanks to these people that get never get credit. For them running around in 93 degree heat on Sunday, wearing a mask, and you can't cover

an entire golf course with that limited number of resources. Plus, again, you're sourcing things from literally all over the world, including New Zealand. We had some virtual reality coming in live from New Zealand that was integrated into our show. So a nod to the people that were asked if they want to work. All of us were given the chance to either go out and do this or no harm no foul nothing will be held against you you know come out later we're not going to hold it against you if you decide you don't want to work it in everyone had to make that decision that they want to put their help at risk go out there and try to do a golf broadcast and try to deliver back to people or not and we had some people that said no to be honest. I was originally by the way on my side. I was originally going from my home. You know, I'm not looking for any kudos for that. I felt like I could do the job better

being there in person and getting a sense of what the scene looked like. So it was hard. Even our number one audio guy run in the board actually had some health consequences after the show on Sunday. And as of this morning, he was still in the hospital and forward. It's stress-related. I won't get into anything more detailed than that. It was tough. And our crew deserves a round of applause.

And myself excluded. My colleagues, I'm in awe of what they did. So now the question is about making your players. Yeah, thanks. We were trying to do some things Chris. The right moment, right time to try to spice up the broadcast a little bit. I know you guys have always wanted more sound, right? I think the fans would, don't you agree? So one way, of course, is making the players. That's not the first time we broached it it nor anyone else. That has always been something that's been

discussed, asked for and it's just never happened. But we live in a different time. And this is a wonderful opportunity for the game to gain new fans a bigger audience, a younger audience. Let's hear from these guys. And I think everybody, the players, the tour, gets it. We don't have a lot of live sports competition coming into people's living rooms right now. Let's do the best we can to put the best light on. So last week we had Ricky on Thursday, where a microphone.

I think he shot 73 or 74. Didn't work out. Great for Ricky, but we were the beneficiaries of some really cool inside book of Ricky over the weekend We didn't have anybody, but that's gonna change this week by the way I don't know when your podcast goes out, but from what I hear right now I believe we have Adam had one one day in Joel Damon Another on Thursday and Friday there might be more to come, which great, it would be fabulous. Yeah, I think that's a fantastic development.

I think one of the things that was a very, very noticeable change from, you know, prior, you know, prior to the crisis and afterwards was an effort to lay out for player-cadi conversations, get those boom mics as close as possible and really set the scene for those golf shots. But I can say, technically, from a viewer perspective for this past week, it was almost unnoticeable. I would say even unnoticeable. I thought there would be some delays

between yourself and Sir Nick, and I did notice any of those. I honestly, as a viewer, forgot all of those things were happening behind the scenes, which I think to your point is a testament to the crew and everything that it looked almost the same as it normally does with a much more dial back crew. So... Well, thanks for saying that.

I was saying to people, because I heard from so many in the industry, that we normalized it. We made it look like it was a golf tournament that could have been in the other year at Colonial. But all I can say is when you're there in person, it's not that way. It was anything but normal. And I'm not talking to again about the little business nuances and challenges. And I just want to emphasize, I'm not lamenting what I had to deal with. Although it was completely different and awkward. And you know, we talked about it more than enough that I was the only one in the tower

I had no one up there which is not making it anything to overemphasize but it just the first couple that I had to turn the lights on and they said they're coming on camera I had to actually turn the camera lights on in the booth so you know it's just there's a lot of little things that when you set down, it didn't feel like any time L to you that have been going on the air. But mine was the easiest of the ones to get close to normal. And I think the show really, that again, the technical team and our production team did an unbelievable job.

And people in the business understand that. Yeah, I think one of the things that we've well documented issue with golf on television, I want to exclude anything currently going on from this because I think this was a topic well before the crisis hit is just the volume of commercials and we've learned a lot more understanding how the rights deals work between the networks and the PGA tour and how this is not necessarily CBS related. But I feel comfortable

asking this because there was a story in 2017 you were caught on air kind of talking about the volume of commercials. So, it sounds like we can at least agree on one thing, but I can't remember that, but I'm sure I did. But go ahead and ask me anything you want. Because, you know, I think I have a pretty good understanding. I know we get beat up. I'm not saying it's from you guys, but it might be from the people that are following you

guys. Everybody thinks the CBS is the people that are following you guys Everybody thinks the CBS is doing something that other people aren't well I'm my question related that is I it's do you think it's something that golf fans can hold out hope for as something that will likely Change in future years because as I under you know the excuse I guess I don't want to say excuse, but the reasoning we get from the tour often is you know This is an antiquated contract, antiquated contract, but do you see kind of the future of live sports, particularly live golf, because it's the one that doesn't go to break

when play goes to commercial, when the broadcast goes to commercial play doesn't stop. In football, it doesn't basketball, it does, and there's just not that luxury with golf. Do you foresee that changing? And again, I know this is a category that isn't you know where your duties lie but for somebody with so much broadcasting experience i thought you could speak on that

i can't speak to what the new contracts going to to say as far as what the loud so all i can tell you right now is that the current contract which it belongs to cbs and nbc this is my understanding I haven't read the contract, but I'm sure it's correct. You're allowed 18 minutes of commercials per hour. Correct. That's up to 54 minutes, okay, over three hours. And if you run, let's say, 10 minutes of commercials

in the first hour, well, you know, somewhere along the line, you got to make up for it because you got to get all your spots in, but it's going to be 54 minutes any way as high as it. So guess what? We run 54 minutes of commercials. Now there are some extenuating circumstances. I know this last weekend there were, I don't even know how to properly determine maybe some sales make goods or something like that, and we may have gone two or three minutes above it with the two or approval. But at the end of the year, and there will be some turn of the spi all the way, where we might be 52 minutes, but at the end of the year, it's going to be 54 minutes per tournament.

That's that we actually went away for break. And guess what? I know everybody, and I'm not saying you guys have condition, your audience to think we're the only ones doing it. NBC is running 54 minutes where they're commercial. Right. They're not running. They're talking to you.

They're talking to you. I'd understand that that's not really the message out there. CBS and all of its commercials. But maybe you guys hate the same thing about NBC. So, but I'm not sensing that people feel that way, but you know, at some point, and I, again, I haven't read the new contract, as you pointed out, it's not my business, maybe it changes. I mean, I'm a viewer too, and I care about the welfare

of the sport. That's what's really important to me. I don't want people to be turned off in any capacity. If you love the game then your friend of mine self-regardal problem aren't you so they can't uh... but i believe in that and like you guys you know you're taking your wax at cb us but you love the game right and i respect that that means a lot to me and we need to grow the audience and you

guys have done your part to help do that and the question i have in relation to that is one of the challenges of your job is what kind of demographic do you find yourself broadcasting to? Because I think we are at least somewhat representative of a demographic of young golf fans that are hardcore fans, right? We are watching PGA tour live.

We are streaming stuff online. I know you are. And then we are flipping on to television. we need more people like you guys we really do i is a serious question i'm not even faulting you for this in any way saying like how do you balance as a broadcaster broadcasting to both casual fans and hardcore fans at the same time how do you balance that i think my job primarily is to tell the story now that sounds so simplistic but i have to personalize

the players. So I'm not skewing my delivery of a story toward any demographic whatsoever. You know, I find it my responsibility to do justice to the subjects that we're covering. If somebody gets in consention, then they're going to be on our air that weekend. I got to make sure people know who they are. I like to build up stars personally. I don't like tearing people down. It's just the way I'm thatch is in my DNA. And I never been asked that before. What demographic are you televising to?

I'm there to tell a story. By the way, storytelling is evergreen. It's going to be 100 years from now important. How somebody presents a golf or a football broadcast. It's not in my world, it's not about numbers. I would say this about broadcasting the NFL with Tony or college basketball with raft and grant. It's not about numbers. The guy average is 16.8 rebounds again. Who cares? Guy is 68250 pounds, who cares? You know, sometimes if it's jaw dropping, distance averages and things like that, but a lot of the numbers in technology are on the screen in graphic form.

And you look at the innovations and golf television. That all of us have done in recent years, shot tracer, for example, which was invented by CBS, by the way. Okay, we were the first ever have it, and I can't say of the year, probably was, I don't know, I guess the year, but it debuted at Torrey Pine's number years ago. And all the track man type stuff that you see with the pro tracer and the other graphics that you see integrated through shot links when I'm trying to come up with. We have plenty of numbers. We can crunch the numbers and I'm not a big numbers guy.

I'm a heartbeat guy. And I think that gets filled in. If you want the data, you can get that from all kinds of sources on our air. But did you watch Chris, did you watch any of the rewinds during the 13 week absence? Did you go back and look at any of the shows or like Masters week? Did you go back and look at any of the shows, or like Masters week, did you go back and look at any of the old shows that ESPN ran, like 86? And did you not tell how far the industry has come?

I said there's probably no place other than Augusta. Augusta has to be the place that has benefited the most from high definition television of any one location in sports. No press. But I was talking more about technology. has to be the place that has benefited the most from high-definition television of any one location in sports. But I was talking more about technology. Sure. Yeah. Oh, it's completely different.

Yeah. The way it works with the viewers, I think, is once you've kind of introduced some of this stuff, it becomes almost compulsory, right? And you don't even... Now, it's super hard to go back and watch shots without shot tracer, especially when it's live, right? When you, when you're watching a replay of something, you least kind of know something about where a ball is going, but gosh, the shot tracer, innovation has been, yeah, I, now I don't

even think about it because there's so much shot tracer on the broadcast. It's not, it's something that has been addressed and clearly there was a call from golf fans that we need a lot of shot tracer. And now almost never do we get a shot that doesn't have it that needs it no there's gonna be a lot of shots where you don't have it there what you're saying is a crucial shot right because yeah but can a guard was our director of operations and he was always on the cutting edge of all this kind of technology and he's the guy that brought us to us that i can remember the first

time I'm on the air took like one look at it to say, oh my gosh, this is a game changer here. This is going to be exactly what your point is. I need more of that. I got to have, it's like going back and looking at an old football, right? Yes, without the first outline. How did we do that? You know, like all of a sudden, a yellow line goes out, that's what they need to get to the first. It's changed the way you watch a football game. And golf has come a long way, a long way. And I've had a seat for all this. I've been fortunate enough to start really in my mid-20s and be taught so much about

the industry from the great Frank Chirkinian. God love him. He was just an amazing man to work for. But those shows that Frank was producing back then versus now, I mean, it's a world of different, it's so much more complicated. And it wasn't so much of this technology was not around in Frank's time.

On your note there about the storytelling, I promise I don't want to keep coming back to commercials, but I want to ask, do you find it more challenging to build that story because of the interruptions and the starts and stops and all the places that you need to go? Do you feel hamstrung in that regard at times? What you do feel like you have to make quicker work of it, you can't ever really linger on anything too long because you have commitments.

That's what you're saying. To personalize a player and to jump around. Actually, let me say, this is where it starts. You go to commercial, and let's say you're away for two and a half minutes. How many important golf shots do you think we're struck in those two and a half minutes? I mean, it's just a random guess that depends

on the tournament, but I would say on average, either been six or seven or eight shots minimum, but if there was the infr third and Friday is a different animal. You got so many people on the golf course. But let's say on a Saturday or Sunday, there are at least six to ten shots that happen while you're away. Now you come back from commercial and you have a player alive, rated here to another shot.

You still have to make up for what happened while you're away. So the rhythm and timing of it, it's a massive cross, well, let's call Rubik's Cube, trying to figure out how to slot in live. Let me go back because I have to get this and this happened while we were away. Back to moving in the live shot, back to two tape shots. This was a moment to go over here. I mean, it is an incredible challenge to try to get that. And then they all face it. Lance faces it. And so does Tommy Roy and Mark Lumin. And I respect all those guys. And they all know that. They're all friends of mine. That's what I asked Tommy Roy once. I just said, you know, don't take a deep breath

when you go to commercial. You look at me like I had three heads. No, I got the hardest part when we go to commercials. You're still working. They're still working. They're still recording and trying to get a sense of timing of how they're going to come out of this and then work all this stuff in to get caught up. And maybe just when you get caught up, you have to go to another commercial again.

You know, this is one thing about limited commercial operation. Like the masters has, obviously, as we all know, this is one thing about limited commercial operation. Like the masters has obviously, as we all know, fewer breaks. That's easier to do because you're not backed up. There's a continuity to the masters coverage. That's kind of my point is where it's a noticeable difference, you know, when the US open goes to the last hour of coverage or whatever that's commercial free and then the dial back commercial interruption at the masters. It's the reason I'm kind of tying the demographic question

in with that is I'm 33, I think. Our generation's kind of coming up in this Netflix era where we don't watch anything with commercials anymore. So I grew up when I was a kid, we watched, you know, Seinfeld and Friends with commercials, but we don't do that anymore now when we flip around. I get it. That's why I was asking if you first saw a way to change it,

whether or not was, you know. Obviously, that's something that I wish I could fix and change and we all do, but, you know, we also have CBS, biocomps, CBS is a publicly held company. Right. You know, we got to pay for it somewhere. So if you're going to, I mean,

it's such a simple thing of economics. We buy the rights to the PGA tour, and I don't even know the finances on that, but those new deals were just worked out. How are we gonna recover the cost? Right. Are we gonna do it for free? Nope.

We're a publicly held company. You think our shareholders are gonna take that? You're gonna take a, whatever, $100 to millions of dollars will offer, because we're a publicly held company. You think our shareholders are going to take that? You're going to take a whatever $100 to millions of dollars will offer, because we're not going to show commercials. Do you guys do your podcast with no commercials? Nope. So why do you do them? Well, the reason I was asking was what was could change is where I'm coming from is you know soccer has figured out ways to without stopping play. Well, look at playing through. Yeah, we get playing through our eye on the course. That's what we call an eye on the course. I think that's a great step. I don't know what the return is to the sponsor on that, but I know we had on Sunday. I believe we had fixed both

Saturday and Sunday. Six of our breaks were eye on the course. Does that help you? I mean, it helps me when I'm a viewer home, and I'm able to still see what's going on in the course. Does that help you? I mean, it helps me when I'm a viewer home, and I'm able to still see what's going on in the course. It also, you know, certainly helps the truck as well, because, you know, in theory, you've already watched it. Right. But it's a simple thing of economics. You guys, I don't know what your expenses are, your operations are. You guys do some traveling around. I mean, you have sponsors, right? You have sponsors to cover your expenses and make a living.

And it's a much bigger picture here when you're talking about the rights to whatever it might be. The G.A. Tour, the NFL, I don't know how to solve it. I do think this eye on the course is a great way to go. Maybe we get to the day, Chris, we're all 18 commercial breaks or whatever, I guess it's 18 commercial breaks. Maybe I guess is 18 commercial breaks maybe all of them are I on the course Oh, that's that's a dream for for golf fans, but I'm gonna give you hey listen. I'm a fan too. Don't forget that. I know I know I know

I know everything I will say this too because I love our team I'm in awe of our team and I know Virtually everyone that we work with on our team. They're friends of mine. In a lot of cases, I've worked with them for 35 years. We know each other's families or kids and the whole thing. And I'm proud of them. I don't like them being portrayed like they don't know what they're doing.

I mean, it's like the commercials are missing this or whatever the argument might be. But I want to say this, when we're not on the air with golf, and I mean this from the bottom of my heart, I pull for everybody in this business, all of them. Because our sport, other than guys like you who are die hard, and me, in some circles, we're considered like a niche sport. We're not the NFL, we're not the NBA,

we're not Major League Baseball. The ratings support that. I mean, we know who's watching every week and golf is able to sustain itself with its audience, its core garden followers. But I would love to see the numbers get bigger. I think the message from this game is fantastic, the sport, because so much for so many people in philanthropy and on and on and on. And I think there's room for it to grow. And I hope that we can be on and on and on. And I think there's room for it to grow. And I hope that we can be a part of that movement. And now is a crucial time. Right. We're coming out of this lockdown. People dying to watch anything. And I really think that

golf has a chance to gain some following. I know I'm circling back here a little bit, but some following. I know I'm circling back here a little bit, but this is why, and I think there's more willingness to, like, consider audio on the golf course. Like the Miking of the Players, that might be a great idea, and it might not be as great as you think. Now, do you know what I mean by that? Oh, yeah. I think it's, there's a lot of challenges that come with it, and speaking to some of the producers about it about how you have to Submix all the audio and all the things that come with it's not a problem. Well, yeah, the problem is the equipment they have Well, two things the problem is let's take Adam Hadwin great guy and I didn't realize that I guess he had told someone that you'd be willing to do that. Good for him. And he's going to do it here. And he stepped up and did our inside the roads. Well, you have to have, especially where we are right now,

with not the same amount of manpower that we normally have. If you're going to have a guy miked up, you're going to see if an obligation to keep going back to that. So you have to have a minimum of two cameras on that player. Now, why would you need two cameras? Well, you need one to be next to the player. Let's say when he hits a fairway shot and you need somebody to be a catcher. You know what I mean by that?

Someone that can actually follow the ball and watch it land. So it comes down to the decision. Are you going to move two people to some point on the golf course and maybe take that away from one of your feature groups or somebody to send contention if this was happening over the weekend. So it's a little tricky and do you feel obligated to justify having that mic on that player and maybe be taking shots away at the same time from some players that are more deserving that are in contention. So it's a

little tricky. That's why I think that inside the ropes, audio that we had, I think it has a world of potential. I really do. I'm really excited about a Chris. We need the players, you may have heard me a little bit of an outcry about it, but I love these guys out here on this tour. And I have a deeper spectre of what they're doing,

but we need their help, they need it to hear it. Yeah, that was trying to help. It's not personally helping me. I'm trying to help the viewer which is going to help in the end, it's going to help the tour get more popular. It's going to help their own personal brands and more importantly overall the BGA tour brand. Let's get to know, let's see what they look like and sound like and see them smile

or whatever the case might be. This answers a question. Walk up to an unmanned camera with a boom mic drop and walk in and whatever the case might be. This answers a question. Walk up to an unmanned camera with a boom mic drop and walk in and whatever the question of the day is from inside the ropes during the heat of competition. My, I thought it would be 20 seconds. Most of them were like eight to 10 seconds. Fine, great.

But imagine that we had a point, it's this growth and it's gonna grow where you get to a point where you have, and you can justify it as a producer on the show 25 to 30 guys you hear sound from in one day and a final round Well, that to me could be even better than having players might you know and you can put them in packages You can go to break with which we did last week Our guys put the five guys together on Saturday five guys together on something and a two man pack with uric and polter on Sunday I think that can breathe a lot of life into this and we get to know

This for the guy at home. We get to know these players a little bit I'm really excited about that and this is just something that again We at CBS trying to find ways to get better generationally trying to you know a younger millennial audience But then get to know who these guys are a little bit better more like ability to get better, generationally, trying to, you know, younger, millennial audience, but then get to know who these guys are in a little bit better. More likeability. These are likeable guys, Chris, you're around them a lot, you know, but Andrew Landry,

he wouldn't have been on. Right. Last week if he wasn't on that, you know, he gets a chance to put a chance to go in, the sponsors get a little bit of a, you know, on camera, you know, like, you know, 10 seconds of air time has worked, if you're buying a commercial, they a, you know, on camera. You know what, 10 seconds of airtime is work. If you're buying a commercial, they ought to look at it that way. You know, we're trying to help them. We're not trying to take them out of their focus.

There's no chit chat, go over there, and all the per-functree, hey, how you doing? You playing all right? Good. Because they're going to lie out of the player. If I was a player, I wouldn't want to go over there and have to strike the conversation. I was so blocked. That's why I thought it'd be best if it was unmanned when we were discussing this.

Because you want a player to go over and feel like, okay, there's a question that's written down on the card on the ground. Okay, I'll look into the thing, I'll answer it and I can move on. I don't have to have the family. By the way, say hello to Stone. So, you know, they can get in and out without any of that kind of nonsense. What it did for me as a viewer was it brought my eyes to the screen, right? Sometimes I can get caught looking at my phone, but that and the post-traumat interviews that were straight on with the player. I was in on that. I thought that was in the,

to your point, to your point about, kind of steering it all together where everyone working towards making, making entertainment, entertainment product. And that's where your tour players help on that. I'm with you, Hunter. And I tell you, I've said this anywhere publicly, Chris, but not that it's that big a deal,

but you're into it. And so I think we had seven players in that post ground setup. We didn't know if that was going to work. I couldn't see them on a preview monitor. Every time I kind of led to a guy's a little worried whether or not this was going to work, we couldn't see them on a preview monitor. Every time I kind of led to a guy's a little worried whether or not this was going to work. We had never done it before. So between the inside the ropes and those we interviewed after the round, maybe it was five and seven. We had 12 players on our air with sound on Sunday. I could tell

that's not, and again, this is no pre-round sound. This is either inside the ropes or after they've just finished around. It's got to be pretty close to a record. They hear from 12 of the 67 players that made it cut. That's pretty good. Now when we did the post-round thing, just to get a small technical point here because they were hearing me on a speaker. Our audio team had to pot me down when they were answering a question. And I had to like get the beat when they finished an answer for that. Someone was over there that would pot it back up. This was, again, short of personnel trying something new.

We had some glitches, there were some players that didn't hear us. But it worked out and it was quick. You know, it was in and out. I think that was one of your points you were making, Chris. You know, hey, we got Justin Rosewell quick. Hey, Justin, what happened over on, you know, the put on 18 and almost we thought it was in. Did you think of it then? He answered it. Good luck. I know you're not out of it yet. Stick around. Thanks. And let's go back out to 17. You could just get in and out, it didn't linger. It was snappy. And I thought it worked out well. I agree with that. And the nugget you got a bit from Bryson too, about not quite being over, that was perfect too.

But I think, there's gotta be some people screaming at their speakers saying, you've got Jim Nance on here and you're gonna badger him with coverage questions. I think we've properly- Don't please, go ahead and by the way, if you need to do part two of this we can repeat this tomorrow i don't know if you can do that as important we answer yeah i think you've you've you've uh...

we i think we've covered the coverage if you will and there's a lot of stuff other stuff i want to get to you no i don't have one thing i want to cover on the coverage because uh... and this is some some people portray it like i hate cbs comes on the air they they go to commercial, they come back to show one golf shot, and they go back to commercial.

Right? Yes, there's probably people out there that say that, yes. Okay, well, I didn't do a lot of research for this, I don't need it, but I did ask for, what does the length of a segment look like during the course of one of our shows? What does it look like? So I have I have the breakdown of what like we did. Uh, I've got Saturday at the Schwab. I have stuff from NBC.

We all are the same. Basically, it's all comparable. Now Saturday at the Schwab. Okay. This is going to sound like a lot of minutia here, so bear with me, correct? Okay. Our first segment was 19 minutes and three seconds, and I'm going to speed it up. We went in 833, 1026. Now remember, you got 18 minutes per hour, it's in the contract. Okay. Then there was an eye on the course. 19, 8 1 1 1 half, 10 1 1 1 half, rounding. 414, 551, eye on the course.

5 minutes, 859, 916, eye on the course. Did these sound like one shot segments to you? No. They definitely don't. Okay. 608, 610, 305, eye on the course. Now, why do you take a commercial like You don't want to be cookie cutter, right? I mean, you wouldn't want to say, you know what? It's been seven minutes. I've got to

average this out. It's seven minutes, take a commercial. Or you might have some guys tee off on a par. Five, and though they've got the long walk, and these are the guys that are maybe leading to tournament. This will be a good time to take a break. So you have a shorter segment. But, you know, we're not talking about one shot here. 523, 332, 423. Here's 152. That was our shortest segment. It was probably in the last start of the last hour. 5108, 724, 738, 1014.

10 minutes and 14 seconds. That's reality. I'm just dealing with reality here and not perception or not trying to push Something that isn't true. That's important to me that we just really tell people You know what it is now you can say well, that's you know, that's the Schwab but what about like the Genesis I you know, I have that in the product. You know, you probably don't want a bunch of numbers again But it's you know, it's that in the product. You know, you probably don't want a bunch of numbers again, but it's just, you know, it's just a big thing.

Oh, it's not much homework you did. It's impressive. No, I mean, it's, you know, it's one program here that I got. But, you know, you look at it, and I'm not going to try to spit out what I've got here from a Honda or the World Golf Championship, but it's all similar. And they do a fantastic job, these guys that are in these chairs, figuring out the timing and the rhythm of it and how to do it. It's not easy, it's not easy.

And I have great regard for all of them. And I especially do for the guy that I've had the pleasure to work with for 35 years in that plan. Yeah, I think in regards to that, there's definitely times when people will notice an especially short segment. And maybe not be watching the whole day. Yeah, it's gonna happen.

Maybe not be watching the whole day, not timing stuff out and not knowing the, I think a lot of people, when you get a 19 minute segment, like you talked about at the start there, you don't notice that you got that, right? But you notice it when there's like close commercials back to back. And I think we've documented this point that it's,

you know, the commercial allotment is the exact same across the networks. Yeah. The exact same throughout with CBS is not hitting you over the head. Right. With more commercials than anyone else. It's just a reality of it. Well, on that note, I would like to move on to some other topics because, you've had a wild career in covering sports and many, many, I got a lot to ask you about.

But first, I want to go to last year's masters. I want to know what you're what you're thinking coming down the stretch because we're all sitting here like this, this moment, it's too big. It's too big to like comprehend. And I don't mean this in saying, you know, I got a kind of separate question on how you come up with your calls. And I know that's one you've been asked a lot. But how do you prepare yourself for what's about

to happen at the end of that tournament compared to how you've prepared yourself in previous years? And I mean separate from your actual call before the putt. I prepare for the same way I do every year. I really do. Same way I'm preparing for this weekend from the RBC. I find out who the leaders are, who I expect to be in our coverage. Of course, that starts

to figure itself out by Saturday and Sunday, and then I start to figure out what it is I want to say. Hopefully some of its fresh information, you know, it's not PGA2 or Media Guide information. It's sometimes though you do have to, you know, stay true to, you mentioned it earlier, where there's people sometimes coming in, do you dumb it down a little bit for people that are at the French band? And yes, you have to be able to give a player's profile of what their record is and what their highlights are.

But fresh information is always key. You take this past weekend, Harold Barnard was such an amazing story and how he did it, how he hit 18 greens on Thursday and then bounced back on Friday after making an opening triple. And on Sunday, if he was coming down the stretch and going to win that tournament, I think we're really ready to tell what would have been one of those remarkable stories that we could ever tell, given the time in the moment. And I admire him so much. We've talked to his dad, I say we, Tommy Spencer's been my

information guy for over 25 years and he was home until Philadelphia, unable to travel there, again trying to limit the number of people that were traveling and exposed and he was nigh on sight but he talked to Harold's dad and I had a lot of history of how Mr. Barnard had taught him the game, and he had worked his whole life. He's worked for a car dealership and a car salesman now for 40 years, and none of this gets on here. We talked to his coach,

we talked to Tommy, talked to Ron Green, Junior and Charlotte, who knew Harold well enough on some local stories about what he's done, his bar is charity and giving back with his foundation. And there'll be another time to tell that story, all those stories. But that's the way we approach it every week. Yeah, I've kind of forgotten what your question was.

Well, I was going to say specific to capturing Tiger. And the way you said it was, yeah, the way you said it was, was great. It just, you know, a lot of people never thought this would happen again, but here it is, but how do you, there's so much build up to that moment that, exactly like you said, but how do you prepare yourself to take that in? As a viewer, I could not control my emotions during it.

I was like, how is this happening? We were all freaking out here. How do you do this? I was freaking out. I was freaking out. I hope so. was it was not a clock in the morning when we came on here I got there at whatever maybe six, you know people kind of forget now This was the first ever masters to go that early and it ended we signed off from the cabin at two forty eight It was the time I used to say this and I've said a long time, but I think it still holds true when I'm broadcasting golf Yeah, there's a lot of information floating around on my head

But if you saw me in the football booth, I've got all these over to come spotting boards with cover-coded Information and stories and lined up in a certain order for every man that dresses for those games It's complicated. I work on that board all week long. Every play by play broadcaster does the same thing and they have their own unique way of doing it. That's the ball the same thing.

But when it's golf, I kind of like to go through before the day begins, a few thoughts on my head where we're going. And then I kind of just like to have it in my head. I don't have most of the time any notes. Now there's a lot of paper you saw some deaths last week. Had billboards. One time I picked up a wrong billboard and you know, somebody got a double run on the air.

That's first time it's ever happened for me last week. But as far as like information on the players, a lot of it's in my head. And I've gone through it before it starts. And then I want a broadcast as a fan. I like to broadcast from my heart. Now, not the sounds syrupy here, which, you know, a lot of people think I go over the top on that, but that's just who I am.

Sorry, it's in my DNA. You know, I get emotional and nostalgic and sentimental about things, and that's who I am. Some people don't like it. Others do. That's just the way, you that's who I am. Some people don't like it. Others do. That's just the way, you know, I'm wired. But when Tiger was coming down the scratch, yeah, the moment was gigantic. And I think it's really key to let the moment

have some air. You're talking about audio and your best to be able to pick up on some of that player, Cady, back and forth. But what really, me again, I'm at living, all of us are, we're at living through all of this. But when he got to his T-shot at 18, and you saw that he was a little bit blocked,

you saw him discussing, and you could hear him discussing what Joe what he wanted to do. And then Steve Miller, our director, cut to a shot of the family behind the green. Why had asked on Saturday inside of Tiger's camp was anybody gonna be there where the kids gonna be there on Sunday because we found out that later Sam had a soccer game I guess they lost and the summary finals and they ended up coming in but I didn't know it. I did not know they were gonna be there, but Leave it to Steve Milton who's just exceptional what he does our director and someone framed up the shot for him and there

They stood behind the 18th ring Well Minute I saw that I knew as long as he makes five we're gonna have one of the greatest things ever in the game. I mean they're standing right where his father did Mm-hmm all those years before 22 years earlier and I first thought just about the emotion of it If you can close the deal and I made a comparison I believe it was at that point right before he hit a second shot That if he wins this we're gonna see a side to tiger. I'm paraphrasing

Like what we saw in 2006 at Hoylake, which was his first major win after his dad had died on May the 3rd, 2006. So here he was in July, melted in the arms of Steve Williams, and I just never forget that scene. And I wasn't trying to foreshadow anything. It's just what my heart told me to go with that this is going to be emotional and by the way personally I thought it was just fantastic to see that the family was there and and so eager to see him close the deal and you can see the excitement and

nervousness on their faces and He puts out and oh is he's walking up 18? He's still you know, he's got a third play. And he might safely up against the ridge. I just, the word glory kept floating around on my head. There was a minute by minute kind of peace and golf guy just about this, so I don't mean for these great golf fans that you have repeating everything. But I just thought of the word glory

because I thought of it more of a sense of glory in his life, his full glory of coming back, his kids are there. The scene I expected was going to be, and it was proof to be. And it was a return. I didn't want to call it a comeback. I didn't know. How do you say it?

I didn't have, again, anything written down. But when the whole, and I said, either the return to glory or a return to glory, one of those two, and didn't say anything for a couple more minutes because there was no way I was going to insert myself over that scene. Now, full disclosure, I was not sitting in the 18th tower when that moment happened. I was down at a cabin. I already broken off and gone to the cabin.

I was working off a headset and I like a 12-inch monitor watching that. I mean, tiny little monitor, the size of a was working off a headset and I had a 12-inch monitor watching this. I mean tiny little monitor, the size of a little bigger than a viewfinder for these cameras. And Nick's in the tower at 18, Lance in the compound is two tenths of a mile away from me, maybe a quarter of a mile away from where I am. So we're in all these different places. I happened to hit the talk back switch so the Lance, as soon as I said, returned the return to glory and I said lance just so you know so that Nick doesn't think my mic's gone down Or the might say you know anything he's expecting for me to to stay over this just let him know

I'm saying nothing And it's going to be a long time before I do And I wasn't trying to tell Nick, not to say anything, I was wanting him to know that I was gonna lay out and I'm sure he figured out that that was the right thing to do as well. And I'm glad we all made that decision because we would have done nothing but probably

one of the great things in the history of the sport, forget the sport, transcend the sport from the great scene you'll ever see in any, any live sports competition. And like I said, it played out for, I believe, more than two minutes. And was I touched? Was I bouncing off the walls like you were at home? Absolutely. I was. And that moment just tugged at the heartstrings, I think for golf fans, at least for me personally. I felt like I rooted for a robot playing golf up until 2009. And then I felt like I was rooting for a human near the end. And that

kind of came through in that moment. That's what really, really hit people. And what you guys rebroadcasted previous rounds of the masters, which was fantastic, by the way. You had Phil Mickelson on. He was Phil. He was an entertainer through the whole Saturday show, Chris. Yes. Yes. And he did some play by play with me on the, what would have been the Saturday this year of the Masters, he did a great job. Right. And he's gonna make, he's gonna make someone

a great analyst on day one, he's gonna have to do it. Yep. And then Tiger, you had that on the Sunday, and he, I thought he was a bit reserved at the until the end. So I have a two-part question here. Do you think he was hesitant to give away any of his insight that he's kind of picked up on on Augusta over the years until he's done playing and on the second end? Did you have any idea that at the end of that, he was going to open up the way that he

did? Well, I haven't talked to anybody about it. So you're picking up on some vibes that I had too. So we taped maybe three or four segments, which those segments included, cutting around to other players. We just took the broadcast feed, we kept the the present, the audio that was on site was still there. We took out the commentary and in turn Tiger and I called the action again as if we were a broad cast duo.

And I mean I think he did a very good job, but he really got good when we got to 16. And two things happened when we started that segment at 16. One was I happen to ask him because if you remember the T-shirt, I know you do, this for our listeners, you know, he almost spun it off the hill and made hole in one very nearly. And I happen to ask him how many holes in one does he have in his career. I knew the answer to it because I can remember there's a kind of a to-do about it when he had made one in the fall of 18, I believe it was, playing a practice round out in the desert with Freddie. But I wanted to hear him say it and he said that he had made 19

aces up until 2000 but from 2000 until 2020 he's made one In the best years of his legendary career. He's made one that didn't come in competition That came in that practice round with Brett and I think a lot of people really got into it I think tiger got in that moment But when we were taping that segment with all that was going on at 16 in the replay sequence and everything, remember I'm working on Zoom at my home, my four-year-old little boy, Jameson,

came into my office right in the middle of it. And I didn't even see him. I was looking at Tiger on the Zoom and all of a sudden I saw Tiger really smiling on or what He's smiling about it all of a sudden I felt James and tapped me on my left elbow and I said James in what world are you doing here? I knew of course the segment had just come to a halt and he said daddy I just wanted to say hello to Tiger wow So I put one of those a little air pods in and he said, hi, Tiger.

And he said, hi. And Courtney, my wife came in and took him away. Jameson was very happy. And you know what? It kind of like relaxed Tiger and we went back into the segment over again. It is kind of like broke the ice. This little moment of a child play coming in and stopping the recording and we did it over. In the segment was superb.

It was really good. He knew the path I was going to go down, I was going to go right back and have some rough career aces and everything. That was the last, I believe, the last segment until the segment at the Empory got, you know, some I am emotional, didn't you think? Oh, for sure. I mean, he teared up and as a viewer, I just had never heard him go. I never seen him speak consecutively on a topic like that. I mean, it was a couple minutes that he talked about,

you know, not being able to get out of bed or, you know, what do you say about Joe? I never knew that about LaCava really helping him like that. And I just thought, you know, I was just thought, I was tuned in watching it, and then I just perked up as to, whoa, there is a moment here for golf history as being documented, and I thought that was, I thought that was-

It was really cool to do. It was really appreciative that he got into it so much. And it was nice to see the reaction, and I think it was good for Tiger to see so much. And it was nice to see the reaction. And I think it was good for Tiger to see how much people enjoyed and sharing those thoughts that we felt. And it was just, there's something about it that we needed to know that he felt that. No, like, gosh, you know, he can sometimes not let us in.

But did you feel that? Oh, yeah. I mean, what was that like hugging your children back there? In essence, what we're saying. I mean, it moved me as a dad. I mean, my gosh, the juxtapose tiger being the son is father there in 97. And 22 years later, you know, he's the father hugging the son. I mean, it's rich. It's some heavy stuff It doesn't take stuff that heavy to get me, you know, kind of tear it up But it was nice to know that it did for Tiger 2

Well, the even you know, it's been well documented that he Perks up, you know about when people ask him about his kids and stuff like that Like he's that's the topic that he'll expand on. He just, ever since he became a dad. That's been pretty well documented. Even when he's explaining how he was shielding Sam away from the camera, because she doesn't like the line like that much, I just was like, wow, that's just a cool,

little tiny little nugget. But I have a question. And it's one thing I've kind of, I would have admitted to have teased you about over the years But I'm always so impressed as how you know so many family members names of the players that you're covering Does somebody gather that for you? Do you do all that and I have to say I Can't believe it for as much work as you've done on people's names. We were in the Dunn vegan a couple years ago And your pictures up on the wall there and your name spelled wrong i had to laugh at that when i saw that

all that right well you know i'm pretty good about names and uh... i've been in the done vegan one time it's a couple from texas that owned it probably the time you were there and her names are jack and she left now you don't sound like you can confirm that what that is they sold it but they did own it. Oh, they did start.

I know they sold it in a spearheaded by a group out of Canada that bought it, but they ran it. And I just remember people's names. Now, I'm not 100%. But God bless me with a very good memory. And I'm grateful for that. And the paradox of all this is, my dad is becoming up on Father's Day this weekend,

my dad's life was taken by Alzheimer's where he lost his memory. And I was as close as any father and son could ever be. And I'll be thinking about him for sure a bunch coming up on Sunday. And his memory failed him him and this disease overtook his life starting at the age of 66 and he died at the age of 79 and I always think about that people that know me always say how do you remember these names I know I've I've gotten again I was blessed with a pretty good memory not

photographic nothing like that. But when I meet someone, I try to pay attention and look somebody in the eye and give them a respect and try to remember them. That's as simple as it gets. Now, family names, it depends on the player. You know, some of these players I know really well and I know their families. We travel in small circles out here and been doing 15 to 20 weeks a year for 35 years. So, do I know their families. We travel in small circles out here and been doing 15 to 20 weeks a year for 35 years. So do I know, brand and Mandy Snedeker and their children often and Lilly? Yes, I do.

And our wives are close and brands get front of mine. Do I know, go on and on and on? Do I know, Phil and Amy, you know, really, really well. And do I know all the children, Amanda, Sophia, and Evan? Of course I do. You know, they've been in my home. I've been in theirs.

So, it's not the case with everybody. But, you know, you talk to them of preparation and what generation might speak to, who can't relate to a family standing behind the 72nd green as someone's about to win a tournament. And you see all that love and emotion on people's faces and you know it's nice to be able to identify them. I'm not trying to show off that I know their

names or I may know them because I've run into them a number of times through the years. I think they deserve to be recognized if they're in the frame. It's as simple as that. And I will say this that moment when people put out or the plane 18th and they're about to win. It's as simple as that. And I will say this, that moment when people put out or the plane the 18th and they're about to win, I masqueraded as a golfer as a kid. My playing ability has been like one of the great overrated things I've ever been around in my life. I said masqueraded, I was on the Houston golf team,

but I shouldn't have been, to be honest. I think the coach took us shining to me, saw a gold-minded person who was really driven to try to do something good. And I think he wanted to be around the golf team to be in his mind, maybe a positive influence on people. And how he'd deduce that, I don't know, but I was never a threat to be a player of any consequence at Houston. Now, having said that, growing up as a kid and playing in junior tournaments in high school tournaments and trying to get

better and then being around great players in University of Houston, that I stand and grind over every five-footer and play in my mind of an announcer's soundtrack describing this and telling the story of how much this moment meant to me as you imagine. You know in your head you put yourself on that spot trying to put a little quasi-pressure on yourself and see if you can live up to that moment. You know, this is to win whatever the tournament is, a master's right here. Yeah, I did that all the time. But you know, I made the determination a long time ago.

Man, I would dream so hard. Did if I ever gotten a position, be the guy that was going to document that story at the end. These players, especially in our sport, they've gone through so much, particularly first time winners or a first time major winner. To get to that point, man, the number of people who have been involved in that process forget Forget to swing coaches and things like that. It's true, they're worth mentioning. But how about Tiger, I think mentioned it. About his mom dropping him off and driving him to the terms. Think about all the people that gave him the ability to play somewhere or gave him a helping hand.

The family of support and a support that is so downright lonely sometimes, particularly when you don't have it and you're failing and you have the doubt creep in your mind. The point of it is, I always feel like it's really important to do justice to that moment to that player, as I would want someone to do that for me. If I was ever good enough to win anything, another one than winning a high school tournament or two, I didn't do anything. But if I had the talent and skill level, I would want somebody up there to really like be able to tell that story that is an expression of the travels that took the battles that took the support it took for me to have that moment. That's how I approach it.

Nope, that definitely makes sense. You touched on something on University of Houston and I promise I won't take up too much more of your time. But your relationship with Fred Couples has been pretty well documented college roommates at Houston. But the question I have is this in doing some research and reading, when you were working at, I believe, a Houston TV station, you had brought equipment back to your dorm room or suite and you were messing around and you filmed a mock butler cabin ceremony. The question I have is, whatever happened to that footage, is it long gone?

Does it exist? No, it's not footage. It was into an audio cassette deck. Okay. Is it exist? You got to remember, my mom claims it's still up in her attic in Houston. She's 89 years old, still going. She claims she's got it in a shoe box and I think she does you got to find that

Because when she moved into this house and well after my father unfortunately was really failing we try to give her a new Way of life and keep things positive. We needed to get her out of it The older home and get her into a smaller place and get a fresh start for her. And she claimed she saw, there's an audio cassette that it was on. You got to realize, we're in college, you didn't have recording devices on your phone. And I was working for a radio station anyway at the time. I was working for KTRA radio in Houston.

And yes, we used to sit in our dorm room. And I want to give some props to my guy, Blaine McAllister, because Blaine, you know, I don't know if you guys your history on this stuff goes back that far, but Blaine won five tour of that. I'm darn proud of him. He came out of Fort Stockton, Texas. Didn't even have grass green, yet stand greens showed up at the University of Houston. He was recruited, got a half scholarship, and made himself into a really great player with a long career on the tour. So it was Blaine and Freddie and a guy named John Horn, H-O-R-N-E,

and John was on the tour in, I believe, 87 and 88. So all three guys that I lived with in school made the PGA tour, and they were completely, completely obsessed with the idea of being professional golfers. And I was hopelessly in love with the idea of being a guy that was going to be broadcasting golf tournaments. That was where my passion was. And it was, hey, it was obsessive. I mean, it was obsessive compulsive disorder on my part.

No question as a kid, try to figure out how to one day get there. I mean, it just, I just couldn't stop thinking about it. And I think they were in their own way the same way. And I will say this, we all got to do what we wanted to do. They all made it to or Freddie, you know, made the hall of fame. I got to be his presenter. And I love those guys. They're brothers to me. My amigos, as we call our group and our fundraising efforts have been through the years we called the Amigos. But times are different, cultures different, the way people interact is different. I'm not saying it's better or worse, but there was so much positivity around that dorm suite. If you made some outrageous comment, one day I'm going to work for CBS, that was my goal.

I'm not just making this up, sounds like good copy and revision is history now. My guys all know, and they would tell you that I dreamt of working for CBS one day. I wanted the broadcast to masters and I like the way CBS broadcasts. The NFL too. So I love that network. And they at the same time, they would openly tell you about how much they want to be pro golfers. And you know what? Nobody laughed. Yeah. Nobody threw it back in my face and it got snarky about it.

Yeah, you're going to do that. I'm going to fly it to the moon. You know, there was none of that. It was like, I believe it. And I think there was some really good karma. And some of the be said for the fact that the people that you cared about, your brothers, we're all looking at you telling you this can happen. It helped me. And I hope in some small way it helped them too. I'm sure there's a lot of details of how your career came together.

Maybe we can cover that in a future episode. But I wanna know kind of what day-to-day life is like for you because I would consider you to be the most recognizable broadcaster in the country, especially just considering how many different sports you touch and do, I mean, if you are a sports fan in this country, they've watched a game that you have called. So, what is day-to-day life for you when you go out to dinner, when you are at an airport,

when you do normal day-to-day stuff, is it kind of compare that to, I don't know what you go out to dinner, when you are at an airport, when you do normal day to day stuff, is it kind of compare that to, I don't know what you could compare it to, but what's it like when you go out? Yeah, you know, the words that people come over and say hello. Yeah, I get that kind of stuff. Like do you feel comfortable going out and stuff?

Is it as awesome? I love people, I love people. So if somebody's gonna come over and say hello, you know, I'm gonna treat them with respect and they're gonna be met with a smile. Of course, I live in Pebble Beach, which was something that I first started to kind of hold on to this dream when Frank Trichinian first took me to Pebble in 1986. I'd been there years earlier, my parents took me on some weekend trips down to Carmel and Pebble.

We lived in the East Bay area at that time. So I was fully smitten in the love of Pebble Beach and then I came back under CBS's watch and I thought, man, there's something about this place, it feels downright spiritual. And I love the vibe and people are happy here. People are really happy when they come to Pebble Beach. Obviously, the area depends so much on tourism. And it's such a bucket list thing, Chris, for people to come out there, that when they come, like, it's just like, everything feels good. And that's what it was like for me all those years coming as a broadcaster. I wanted that. Whatever that drug was, the feeling of being a Pebble Beach and your own sensory overload. You're connected

with nature. It feels great. Smells great. You know, the ocean spray and the pine trees and cypress and trees and it just there's them. You don't have anybody there that's got rage going on in their lives. They're completing a bucket list thing. So when we go out to dinner there, you know, choosing to live there, I knew I was gonna get more of that because these are golfers. These are people that follow you guys. These are people that follow the golf on TV. They're in on this sport.

And darn it, you know, I'm appreciative that they were excited to come to Pebble Beach and they can see in some cases people are excited about coming over and asking they can take a picture and that happens You know being there it happens pretty frequently. So I'm honored if people are nice to me. I Really am you know, I've seen some of the best of all time Chris at how they interacted with the public and I'm pleased.

Triple hedge and qualifiers on this, I'm not putting myself in their category, okay? I'm just saying I was an observer. So I saw how people did it right. You know, in the political realm, I've been around enough time just being very fortunate. You know, some people that have served the highest office in this country including both president pushes and president clinton and i played with all of them president bush forty one of course has been gone now for a year and a half but president clinton's a friend and i play golf with him more than one and president bush forty three i played golf with and Arnold Palmer i played a lot of golf with, I mean dozens around with it.

And again, just watching the way that all these men interacted with their public, it was awesome. It was awesome. It gets me downright emotional thinking about it. Not nice these guys who are the people. I mean, man, we need more of this in the world right now. We don't need hate speech and people trying to find reasons to get your gotcha, whatever, shoot you down. We need to love more. We need more respect and empathy for people.

But it's take our own. It was amazing. The love that poured out of that guy's heart, and I'm just stand off to the side and watching it. He never did anything other than treat people with great respect and love and kindness. That's a big thing to take on when you're as big as those guys. Again, I'm triple qualifier over here. You're a qualifier. I'm just an observer here. But I watched how they did it and man, in my little world, it's been a sports broadcast or somebody's gonna come over and want to say hello to me. I mean, it's my nature. I believe anyway. My mom and dad both that way. But look, I'm a father. The proudest

thing in my life is to be a dad. I've got three children, three amazing children. You know, just take today. I'm in early at Hilton Head. We've done a lot of walking around. We picked up some rental bikes. We went down to the beach twice, by the way, social distancing, the whole way, Chris. Got a boogie board and ran the kids out through the ocean on the boogie board, rode the bikes around.

And we're going to eat inside tonight, as we're trying to follow all the safety protocols CPS has enacted. I couldn't be happy to be a dad. It's a big balance though, living where I live and trying to get out to doing a van every week. Most of it primarily on the East Coast. There's a lot of travel. But then I'm always trying to find every single way I can to maximize

number of hours and days that I have with my family. Well, I'm going to let you out on this. I can't have you on and not ask about who I would consider my favorite color commentator in sports and what it's like to work with Tony Romo because I'm a football fan. I don't, I'm not necessarily, you know, I don't follow any particular team, but I'll watch it. But I will actually seek out games that you guys are calling because of his ability to, not predict what's going to happen, but tell you exactly

as a viewer what to look for, what the hot routes are going to be, what the audible's are going to be, what he's reading, what is it, what is it done for you as a football commentator to have somebody like Roma at your side? Well, I've loved every minute of it, and I've got to say it truthfully, I saw for years in advance that he was going to have the ability to do that just by television production meetings. Now I know that might be lost on people, it's a television production meeting. But before the COVID and everything, before Zoom became all the rage, you would go in early and you would be with the home team all day Friday, you'd talk to the quarterback, the coordinators,

the head coach, in three or four of the players, and then Saturday you'd do the same thing with the visiting team. And I've been doing the NFL a long time, but every time I had a cowboy game, Tony would walk in the room and he'd say, holy smokes, this guy has a personality. And can he break down the game for it? I couldn't take down notes in my mind fast enough. I would write down a little key word because he was just giving me a million different things. But he also had this other thing called golf in his life.

I said it earlier, people that love the game were bonded, were connected, and Tony and I had that connection. So what happens is there's a apprenticeship there, and so much so that when I would come into town to do either the colonial or the Nelson, I would check in with Tony. All right, so I might say, well, that's kind of strange. You're covering one of your subjects and whatever. It's innocuous.

I want to come out and watch the golf and sit in the tower. Off to the side, pull up a chair. You're not going to go on the air. You just watch it from the 18th. Tony used to live out there at lots of cleaners. On the other course the Cottonwood Valley course if you remember they played courses at a PPC in the old days remember that right yeah yeah so he lived on the CV course Cottonwood Valley

so we had a friendship going back to 2011 I was he actually got married on one of the weekends of the Fire and El'll fight it me to the wet it 2012 debuted a wine endeavor that I'm really proud of And we had our grand opening actually at a stake house in for work 50 people came was gonna donate money to the national Alzheimer's Center all of it every ticket and a hundred percent of the money Was gonna go to the to the to the nance center named for my dad Tony came over bought a ticket so through the years he would go to final fours. I had a friendship. I had a chemistry I had a bond of golf

together So now he has three of the last four years curtailed cut short by injury Well, we had this thing called the you know friendship and he decided he wanted to explore football on TV and All I can say is when you go into an on-air relationship and a guy's brain is working as fast and It's insightful as Tony's but you have that chemistry already in place. It's a good thing and I've loved it. I mean it has been a wonderful gift at this stage of my career to have Tony every single weekend is a blast. The preparation, the whole process,

going out to the dinner, thinking about the game, not even talking about the game, talking about life, talking about our families, our kids, about the same age, our wives are close, for good friends, it's greatness, and he's awesome, and he's gonna have a terrific long run, and I look forward to having many years to go to still do it with him.

All right, well, that is, we've taken up a lot of your time. Thank you so much, Jim, for coming on. I've got two more pages and notes of questions to ask you for the next time you come on. So, so... Let's do it. You invite me back. Anytime, absolutely anytime, if you'll...

There's a part two, let's do it later this summer before the PGI before the first major. I'd love to. I'd love to do one in person someday and I really, I do appreciate you coming on and engaging in the conversation. I enjoyed it. Thanks Chris. Alright cheers.

Get the right club. Feed the right club today. Yes. It's gonna be the right club. Be the right club today. That is better than most. How about in? That is better than most. Better than most. Expect anything different.