No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 399: Waste Management Recap

Episode Date: February 8, 2021

We react to a wild week at the Waste Management, including Koepka's furious finish, Spieth's insane Saturday, his future (is he back?), TPC Scottsdale, Xander's Sunday struggles, and everything else from the desert. We also discuss DJ and Finau in Saudi Arabia, a tough Sunday of TV coverage, and this week's consequential report from the USGA & R&A.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm going to be the right club today. Yes. That is better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most. You are a survivor. So I think we're probably safe on that front. T.C. is here. Greetings. DJ Pies back in warm ish, Florida. Hello. How are you? Great to have you guys back. A lot to talk about, a lot to unpack. Little somber. Did I kind of suck? Let's just be honest. But you know what doesn't suck? When Odyssey created their White Hot Putter 20 years ago, ignited a putting revolution now. The most iconic, most played and

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That's where I played. Growing up. That was everyone played the Rossi. I mean, I was, I played the number two. Okay, well everyone I've played the Rossi. I mean, it was- Oh, I played the number two. Okay, well everyone I even played the Rossi. I never played the Rossi. Yeah, and they haven't called the number two yet. I'm waiting for it. I'm fingers crossed, man.

I'm begging. It's exciting news. The hype has been big on this, and I'm excited to see it. Yeah. All right, Brooks Keppka wins the waste management. What made Brooks Keppka try this week? I think it was all of us fluffing Jordan's beef for 24 hours. It had to be. He had to kick it into overdrive. Or P pistol. I think I would like a mea culpa. I think it was last week that was like two hours

in. I said, Brooks Kepp gets the most irrelevant good player because he's missed three cuts and wrote nobody even like noticed. And I believe he said, and I took that personally, you could be partial. I'm going here as well. I still feel like he's the most real of a good player. Yeah, I just have, like, I think we've all kind of joked about it in the past of, you know, not winning as many Toravents as majors. What does that mean? I still don't know what to believe. What it all means. But I know if he's winning PGA Toravents, I think that's a pretty scary sign for the majors to come this year.

And the venues that they line up at Tori, Kiowa, I mean, who knows, we're all saying George's, but that seems to be fitting the mold for a healthy Keppka, I would say. I just don't feel anything. Oh, so let's unpack that. I think we have a couple of things here. When you say irrelevant, that's a,

I take it, that's a very personal, yes, personal, relevant that you you have watching Brooks kept play golf. I would say irrelevant means more than like, when you play stinky, nobody really notices. Yeah, it's not good. It's like, oh, cool. Brooks is up there. But when you play bad, no one's like, what is wrong with Brooks? Totally. I don't mean no one, but most people don't talk about it. No, less so irrelevant and more. Just, it's only upside for him, basically. He can kind of, he can work on all the shit, kind of almost undercover of the shadows, right?

Which is a point I made a while ago, Vee's a Vee, a guy we'll probably talk about Jordan's beef, that he does not get that benefit. It's, don't have that on the agenda. Oh, okay, well maybe we can get to it at the end. That'll be my soapbox Sunday. I guess the natural question is why? That's a big question.

I don't mean it as something- I think it goes back to speed as well. I don't mean it like a disrespectful way. Like I respect his game. I respect his legacy or whatever you want to call our respect is track record. But at some point, like he just doesn't, he doesn't look passionate and he doesn't

invoke any passion for me. That I totally agree with. I think there's a lot of, if he looks like look passionate and he doesn't invoke any passion for me. That I totally agree with. I think there's a lot of, if he looks like a motionless, kind of cold calculated robot going about it, it's hard to elicit strong feelings from myself casual fans. Unless it flips so hard in the other direction

to where he's just beating everybody by so much that you just have to take your hat off. Like we saw a couple of these majors where it's like, man, this guy just is ruthless. He's so ruthless that like, now I do like it. This is pretty sweet. It feels like some stolen apathy valor. Well, you're right where he's basically fine as fly.

I'm like, yo, look at me. I don't give a shit about golf. I don't care if I win this tournament, book this. And then like, you know, I'll, I never't give a shit about golf. I don't care if I win this tournament, book this. And then like, you know, I'll- To prep quote. I never practice, I never practice. And then the post-run interview,

man, I've been working so hard with Pete Cowan these last couple of years on this, this and this. Well, you know what? Of course he's been working hard. I thought you didn't practice outside of major weeks, man. Like, those two things don't jive with me. You can't have it both ways, dog. Well, all the sports fans are distracted

by Super Bowl Sunday, so you didn't need to try to appeal to them, you know. You don't want to be seen as practicing that nerd sport. So I thought about this a lot today, Randy. I think Keppka is inherently just not likable. Like he doesn't endearing in any personal way. Yet I do enjoy watching him play golf and compete. Like I enjoy watching him beat people. It doesn't come from a place of I like and root for this person.

It's just, some people that win a decent amount that I don't get that feeling, but I do feel at least like a little something, you know, move in my trousers when Capca's making them. Does it matter who he's beating? Not necessarily. I mean, this didn't do a ton for me, but like when he goes out and wins of majors

by four shots, like Bell Reeves. Totally. I mean, we are rooting for the cat that day, but that was fucking awesome. Like that shot he hit into 16 or 17, whatever that par three was. He can debate whether that was a major, but. Well, yeah, we can, but still. You didn't get jacked up,

seen him just beat the show out, James Han today. Alexander gave it his all. He really, what a weird group. In case we don't get to this later, James Han, Steve's trickered, Brooks Kevco. What a sport. A couple of things on the Brooks thing as well. Okay.

I think that on some level, I think golf fans and golf in general, I mean, you've only got so much room for superstars in your head, right? Like everybody lives and dies with what the cat does. As we were reminded this week, there's a shitload of people who live and die with whatever speed does.

Rory, we haven't really seen too much form from him, but I think he falls into that camp a little bit. I think on some level, it's like, dude, I just, you know, I don't really have the energy to fit in too many other guys here. And it's, there's probably a bunch of other guys ahead of him in that category too, you know? Like, Dustin's playing better than him.

I don't see anybody really get super passionate about Dustin other than Tron. I think more people are getting passionate about Dustin. I think they do too. That's what I'm saying. Brooks is almost even further down that packing order. Dustin's a lot more artistic than Brooks. Yeah.

That makes sense. He really shapes the ball. It does like, Brooks just feels like, like, brute force. He reminds me a lot of the Jason day of the last five years. Where it's like, Oh, yeah, no, I mean, he's, yeah, he's good. He's really good.

Yeah. Randy, what are you all about? All right, cool. What else is on it? Well, I agree with that. Well, I don't disagree with that. He's really, really, really good in case scores. Of course.

I hope this is, of course, he was sound like a shitting on him. It has nothing to do with his golf. What's wrong? But hasn't been lately. No. He's fallen to 13 in the world and he was up to, he got to number one, right? So it's it's worthwhile to note. I mean, yeah, he was the number one player in the world as of Abu Dhabi last year. So I think it's interesting. He doesn't quite fit into a archetype, I guess, where, trying to your point, DJ would strike me as the example of apathetic and cool and, you know, like guy is guy.

You know, he's not sociopathic, Brooks isn't. So he doesn't really fit in that mold. I think it's just a question of like, what are you? You know, what? But he is really good. And he's won four majors, which is incredible because when you start comparing him to most of these contemporaries,

like outside of Rory's, I mean, he's one more than anybody else. Totally. And I think that's almost, he kind of gets stuck in the middle a little bit between, and this kind of gets into some of the parody issues in golf maybe, but when he was on that major championship run, I think people were starting to really come around

and we're like, oh, he's the guy on social media, he's chirping everybody and he's doing more articles and people are interested to learn more about him and then for a lot of reasons, injury stuff and probably some swing change stuff he hasn't really talked about much. I mean, he's fallen off and I think that kind of killed a lot of that public momentum maybe.

And so if he goes on another tear, I mean, people, people like people who win constantly, right? And there hasn't really been one of those people other than Dustin in golf in quite a while. Brooks is, he should endear himself more to people than he does. And I don't know why. And I'm including this group for how vocal he is and like how straightforward he is of the answers and like doesn't sugarcoach it and doesn't do the class act routine.

That should be more endearing to me and there's not a difference between not doing the class act routine and just not doing any routine, right? When you just give one word answers or like, you make it a point to be a dick to people who are just doing their job. Like that, to me that's what comes off is.

I still. He's also a dick to Bryson, which is cool. Yes. Totally. I think everybody loves. Respect the hell out of the lockers, which that's his opening, right? If you were to carve out this persona, I think it would be Bryson antagonist, kind of a bully to the golf dorks, is where I would like to really see him lean into.

Yeah. Quick question for you guys. Brooks, Capca, the holes 13 through 18 this week. So he shot 1900 par total for the tournament. What do you think he played holes 13 through 18 and the final six holes? I'm on the back today, so probably. I'm looking at it right now. There's a lot of circles.

Probably 1400. 1500 par with a bogey. Jesus, that's 24 hole, 1500 and 24 holes. The final six holes of every round. Listen, there's some birdie holes out there, but still that's, that's, so that, I wanted to go look up. That, the, his chip in on 17 is, you know, I haven't been, like I love, we guys know this,

I love falling the data golf stuff, trending throughout the course of around. I don't know if I've ever seen somebody's win probability jump so high from one golf shot. They went from 21% to 73% in one shot, which was sick. Does that take into account like the rest of the field simultaneously shitting themselves too?

I would, I don't know if it happened all of this at the same time. We have to get in that. I'll go over that point. Yeah, it's whatever happened in that five minute span, it went from 21 to 74, which was unreal. And that, we'll say that way. Yeah, it's whatever happened in that five-minute span, it went from 21 to 74, which was unreal. And that, we'll say that for Hampshire Dan, but that happened during commercial.

And they actually like it was live, which was sick. That should be off topic, but what do you get from the prediction stuff? I don't understand the thrill of that. I just like see, because everything on TV is gonna make it seem like, so like Xander coming in today, it makes it seem like he should win today.

Like he, you know, the number. It's called his context. The numbers say he should win when like in reality when he started the day. All right, so that example, he was like 50% to start the day. But like, you know, it shows like, when Carlos Ortiz got in the house at minus 17,

his winning percentage was 0.2%. And everyone on there, like that's all people and social media like, when Carlos Ortiz got into house at minus 17, his winning percentage was 0.2%. And everyone on there, like that's all people on social media, like, oh, Carlos Ortiz needs to stay warm out there. He is not in this tournament. He is not gonna be in a playoff. So that kind of stuff, like how, especially on a course that has so many birdie holes

coming down the stretch, like seeing what's actually unfolding in the tournament and not being like, you know, Zander like really gagged it down, he wasn't like really behind, like on the leaderboard he was, but he had the birdie holes in front of him. He reminded us of a certain someone.

I know, yeah, Web Simpson, I agree. So that's what I get out of that. He likes it, it answers the how far back is too far back question. Yeah, which I believe you could have used some of that help from what I saw on social media. You said 1300 was too far back question. Yeah, which I believe you could have used some of that help from what I saw on social media. You said 1300 was too far back. Yeah, I follow that up. I said the stink fast out of the leaders

was a true black swanament. You know what, you can't model black swanaments. So, but it also just makes you like take a victory lap on that. Also, Capcus first win at the Phoenix Open. Kind of some whiffs of a home game, maybe, for him. Little home cooking. Noto was talking about home games. The problem is when you get too many home games, it kind of, it's, you don't really have a home game. Did you have James Han? The HGF

goes down for everybody. Were you tipping James Han and your subscribers only news letter this week? Of course. Of course. Well, I think it also, I can't tell the general public, but the models are spinning out, James Hottie, knows he's greased better than anyone. I think it also, that's the premium subscription. It also comes back to what, what part of the valley you're hanging out in. That's true.

Are you up at Frisperok or Silverleaf? Are you down, are you down a little bit closer to the valley floor that, that bones referenced 1700 times today? Before we get to the next segment, which I think might take a little while. I imagine this to be the case, but have you guys ever wanted to give yourself,

just give yourself better odds on winning a bet? Have you ever wanted to? I had about 515 PM. Yes. Did you go over five this week? No, but I also placed a good deal of real money while I was across the Illinois state lines that I believe I texted you guys about.

I heard George is going live. I know, it's gonna be a certainly a shorter drive to do that. Well, the Draft King Sportsbook is giving you a chance to do that. All players who place a bet on Sunday nights, this coming Sunday night, the Sunday night basketball game between LA and Denver will have a hand in lowering the over under on the game.

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They're just chit they're throwing curveballs there in the ass All sorts of numbers Randy. I want to congratulate you on your King. Oh my gosh, T.C. The Kings are, it is fun watching that team grow up. Seven and three in our last 10 games. Dick Cheney in the back court. My jazz, we're not in one of the last 10 though. Jordan speed.

We don't get to have the elation as we support this here on Sunday night. A lot of calls for an emergency pod Saturday night. You know, if you, it's like you're riding a hot streak at the table. You don't want to mess up the flow. It turns out we couldn't have messed it up more than we, whatever we did. Then he quifed the hybrid off the first table. That was fine.

He's an ominous son. That was always going to happen though. I wasn't worried then. I was worried when the putts weren't dropping today, but yeah, he listened. Did he have it today? Who could say that? How could it happen?

It was the approach into one from, oh, straight. It's one of the bush. It was, it was faint. It was. It was. It was, it was a dream start if he wouldn't have hit a range ball. You know, like he rushed to the first time.

He quieved the first one off the tee, you're scrambling, tapping five, and then the tapping five, and blood, we are good. And then he's has a look on two. Exactly. So now he's there. He's ready. He's so concerning when he pull hybrid off the first tee

and do that. Let's go to, can we start with Saturday? Sure. So we have Thursday, 67, which is one of the most outrageous rounds in PGA Tour history from what I've seen of it. Well, he was 127th and Strokes Getting Off The Tea on that day and shot 67th and made everything he looked at. Some of that I was not able to watch much golf

on Thursday but was kind of going through on shot tracker and stuff. And today, some of the reminders of like, here's where Speed has hit it over the four days. I'm like, whoa, what happened? That one's like 70 yards left. Is that a glitch? What the hell?

It was shaping up so perfectly because he just like covered all of his warts in the first two days and got eight under out of it. And then legitimately played a great round of golf on Saturday. It was, I was standing on Twitter, it felt like watching a picture throw no hitter. Yeah, just, was there a couple guys that took him deep

for sure, but a couple loud outs in there. It's like a no hitter with like seven walks. Yeah, of course. I'm like, you hit a couple guys. Yeah. We loaded the bases a couple times. Shout out AJ Burnett, I believe he. Yeah, exactly.

He spun one of those back in the day. So a Bogey free 61 on Saturday makes his first birdie today on the 13th hole and goes and shoots shoots one over birdies Allast of course, but I was not that was a gross shot in 18 he stayed in it for way longer than it felt like he Deserved to be he felt like he played himself out of it 35 times today I mean he should have withdrawn after like he's like yo dude. I should not be in this tournament. I mean with draw It's not right everybody else is crowning my ass here. That was the only thing that kept my hope alive was like, man, everybody is punting this away.

Like this maybe it is meant to be. Who knows? And then as soon as that ball splashed on 15, I was like, you know what? I think I started thinking about that at like Friday afternoon. Like of course he's gonna drive in the water of 15. Where else could that ball possibly have ended up?

But I thought he was going to guest on Saturday and he did not. He striped it right and that second shot in there on Saturday. That was the moment for me that I was like, oh, yeah. Maybe he is back. I think he's got his iron play at a place that is near when he was, like he led the field in Stroke's Game approach to green this week. So hit the shut up his irons. That's about, I don't think we can expect that every week,

but if he's gonna play like that, that's great. Off the tee, it is not resolved. You know what he was in Stroke's game approach coming into this week? What? T204. Mm, sick. Behind you.

Ried with Lee Westwood. Charles Howell's up there. No, read everyone. Oh, sorry. Uh, he's just had a boband pill. Like, speech seems like, you know, in Granity, missed a couple of shorties today, but most guys are like, when they win or when they contend, it's when their putter gets hot.

And for him, it feels like the opposite. It feels like when his driver gets hot, he's going to contend and he's going to win. I got bad news. He was third to last in Strokes Game Off the tee this week, even with like... So that's what I'm saying though. It's like, you know, the irons are gonna be great, hopefully. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of flashes there.

The putting, the putting is gonna be streaky, but again, hopefully that irrational confidence comes in. And then it's just a matter of if he drives it well, that week or not. Yeah, it wasn't the irons and the putter and the wedges that, well, it was the wedges. But that's, we can talk about that separately. But it wasn't those things that kept him

from shooting one under par and getting into a playoff. Does it feel like he's trying to pick up distance? Like he's trying to hit that draw and just squeeze as much distance out of it as possible? I don't think he knows where it's going off the tee just yet. I just think it this course was it played very well for that. I mean, we can talk about Scottsdale a little bit here. Um, after we, you know, we should celebrate this. I think more than anything. This was this was Saturday total celebration. Saturday made me feel

alive. Maybe feel hopeful for like the future of golf of watching it on television. I screened my head off when the putt went in on 17. I tweeted this out, I legit didn't read the replies because I knew everyone was going to be mad. There's two players in the game that are capable of making you feel what you felt on Saturday. It's the cat and it's speed. I wish I could tell you why and I want to to unpack that, but those are the only two guys that can make me feel that.

And he's only 27. It's not over. For a weekend, they talked about him like, yeah, this guy, like, back in his heyday. He's back 25 years ago when he was in his prime. Like, no, he's fucking 27. I may have made a, at one point over the last year, 27 club

Image you know Jim Morrison and Jimmy Hendrix and all these famous people died when they were 27 Never posted it because he's not dead. He's he's coming back, man Dennis joblin. I think James joblin Brian Jones of course. I started a rewind high school that M&M died Really? Yeah when he was 27 fucking weird thing to do Why are you flexing on that? But the funny part was it was in a roll over accent and a Saturn. That is fun-ful. What is it with you and Saturn?

Exactly. Anyway, kind of inspired by, Stan a little bit. A little bit. I was hopeful. Oh, damn, it was you. When Speed hit the drive on two, I was like, oh, shit, all right, back baby.

Like that was kind of a gut check moment. And then, but so, you know, so why? It's got a trail though. Why can you, this question has been floated a lot. And I legitimately don't know the answer. So over the course of their career, Speed and JT have won about the same. I don't know about the exact number is, right?

And no one feels like that kind of ride when JT's on a heater and goes out and wins a golf tournament. Why is that? I don't have the answer to that, but why is that? I think it's a lot of different things. Charisma, baby. I think it's charisma. Is that charismatic?

Of course. Or is that playing style? Well, it's so vulnerable all the time, right? He lets you in and he lets you think about, you know, what it is he's going through in that moment, takes you into his process with Mike, who's really who we should be talking about here. And, uh, big week from Mike.

Whereas like JT feels like he has all of the physical tools. Like I was saying earlier this week on Twitter, about earlier today on Twitter, like, Fienaul, the reason that we feel so, like, that we're so hard on him is because he is so, like, he has all the tools, he has all the physical tools, he hits the ball of mile, he has the advantage, and he doesn't capitalize on it.

And speed feels like you're just cobbling together all of these weird little strengths or little like very intangible shit and it adds up to a hell of a lot more than it seems like it should. I'm, amen. I agree with everything my colleague just said there. I also think that as sports talk radios,

this is gonna sound, there's fucking big moments and he hits big shots. And that is, you can tell me like what the stats say and how, well, technically he shouldn't make as many as he does and really he really misses these and blah, blah, blah. Dude, there's so many examples for a 27 year old guy of just, it was everything we saw on Saturday. He steps up and he just fucking does it.

And that is what people respond to, you know? He conjures it. Yeah. And, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and and and and and is some is a big portion of that luck for sure and has some of that luck run out. Yeah, it has some of that run out the last few years of course, but dude, I don't know. I don't know what it is. He just somehow finds a way to do it and that's going to always be the thing that people respond to. Whereas it feels like JT has a higher ceiling, skill wise and swing wise and all that. Like, you know, I think part of it's just the way that JT

or that speed looks doing it too. He's got the chicken wing and he's, you know, I think part of it's just the way that J.T. or that speed looks doing it too. He's got the chicken wing and he's, you know, he's just always in shitty spots. And he's just a uncomfortable over it and all that. And it's like, no man, like that's the journey. That's the process. That's the reward of watching him. I think what's so cool about him is he both,

Simon, like it's just this massive confluence of a million different things. But I think he somehow is both always the underdog and also has more skills than everybody else. You know what I'm saying? He doesn't hit it the farthest, so he almost feels like an underdog when he's playing against a Brooks or Dustin Johnson

or JT. Or JT. But somehow, it almost feels like he's just gutting it out. Of course, he hits it far enough to contend everywhere. But it's a really, really weird combination. And I think there's a bunch of other just off the golf course stuff about him too. I mean, he's been famous since he was 15 years old.

So I think he's really just good at being famous. I think all his family stuff is weirdly humanizing. All the stuff with his sister running on the green when he got his first couple of wins, like, who isn't going to respond well to that and root for that guy? humanizing, you know, all the stuff with his sister running out on the green when he got his first couple wins like I mean who who isn't gonna respond well to that and like root for that guy, you know It's it's I think he's the perfect storm of of people to cheer for he's been famous since the commissioner told us about him Commissioner tip to solve Way back. I think there is just something to

Like the way that I felt Saturday it just being a flashback to like the putty made on 16 at the at the old course at the open chain. And he ended up winning that, but he made a 45 footer or the one of Chambers Bay. The putt of Chambers Bay, like those putts just felt like they were going in no matter what. And I think back to the pod, I did with them two years ago now,

which is wild, talking about unpacking the final round, the lost round, the final round of the 2018 masters that like he bogey the last soul to shoot 64 and the way he phrases like all I gotta do is hit that ball in the fairway because the next one's going on the green and the ball's going in. Like is that kind of confidence

and that putty made on 16. And Augusta that year he just looks at Mike and it's like are you kidding me? Like it just he has this knack for, I hate like the generality of that statement of, he has this knack for, I hate like the generality of that statement of like he has a knack for the big moment, but he's given us so many in like less than a decade. And I don't know why it makes me feel so alive,

but it does. It's something you can't quantify or you can't. And like, I mean shit, going back to San Andrews in 2015, even the putt that didn't go in on 18, where you feel, was it a putter didn't go in on 18, where you feel it was a potter at chip. I miss like an eight footer on 17 and then he didn't hit a good wedge into 18. If I remember, he was way left on 18. Like, all right.

This thing might go in. Oh, yeah. You know, I just, yeah, I get excited just talking about it. Randy? All right. Yeah. I don't know. Well, what, what excites you about him?

You've been on this block. Like, we talk about this all the time. He's the only guy other than the cat that does this. Yeah, he makes golf fun. He plays fun golf. There's massive rewards and there's massive disasters. It's honestly, for me, it's why I love Phil Mickelson. Like, he's more on the artistic side, right?

He sees things. He's got a flare for the dramatic. And obviously he's come up huge in big spots and he's broke our hearts in big spots as well. I think his humbleness for his prominence is draws a lot of people in, right? He's an easy guy to root for that way. But yeah, other than that, I mean,

I would just agree with everything you guys had. It's, you could go sport by sport, right? It's the same, like what makes some guys more popular than others? It's probably a mix of personality and the way they play the game. It feels a lot like Steph Curry, right? Where he's, he's undersized, you know,

when's it David, like it just never really, like he wasn't the Steph Curry, right? Where he's undersized, you know, when's it David, like it just never really like, he wasn't the sure thing, right? But he's streaky. Got him so much out of his talent. Yeah. And that's what's crazy about Spieth is that he so obviously was the sure thing. You know what I mean?

That he was that guy, but somehow he also can almost convince people subconsciously that he's, that's what I'm trying to get at at that he's like this underdog. It's like, dude, you've been like a thoroughbred your whole life. But in this trackman era, he doesn't jump off the pace. He's a sure thing, but he's not passing the eye test or he's not passing the trackman test. I do think unfortunately it is similar to the cat very much a, depends on the golf course situation for spieth.

Like Phoenix played into his hands because you can find it in the desert over there. You can make shots out of there. And if you're gonna hit 23 of 56 fairways dead last in the field, that's probably a decent place to do it. And a place like Tory, with thick ass rough, it's gonna be way longer like this year's US open.

Yeah, probably not great. So. Just here hearing you say that, like, isn't that Mikkelson to a T? Or am I just reading too much into it? I mean, the way he's trending is like, oh God, that's Phil Mikkelson for the next 25 years. Yeah. Well, yeah.

Can he have fairways? It's for the right. Does his driver suck? Will he make it like a ton of unbelievable recoveries and up and down? Mikkelson comp is very interesting. Also, the over-end drone speed's winning 40. I forget if that was a porter,

I guess a porter thing. Will he win 40 times? And I think he still wants the over. I mean, I think we all want him to be tiger, right? Or at least to have that type of dominant potential. But like, he's not tiger. He's a bit of a... No, no one has, no one ever will be.

But is he Phil? I think that's an interesting question. It took Phil six more years to get one major and speed and speed has three at age. And that's just in my time on. I'm sure there are better comps going back further in history. You know, guys who have had much more success earlier in their careers, but just the roller coaster ride is, God, it's, I mean, it's Mikkelsen to a T for me. With, so with that many misses in the desert, if a couple of those balls bounce into bushes,

are we having the same week here about all these massive positives to take away? Probably not. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm with you. There were a couple that I'm like, oh my God, he's like today on one. It's like, fuck, he got lucky that they could have been over

after the one swing, you know. I wanna see Jordan go over and play Abu Dhabi due by Saudi Arabia, Oman, Qatar, all that shit man. We'll try, he's swing. To that point, Oman, Carter, all that shit, man. The dry heat swing. To that point, I think, and not to transition this in the distance stuff, we'll get on the back half, but it goes to show, and you said this earlier this week, I think, that the T-Shot is the least

an exciting shot. That was gonna be one of my big takeaways here was, for all the people who were on the opposite side of the distance, I don't know, discussion, I don't know that it's really a debate. I think Mike Davis kinda said that. If you can point, just write down the shots that you remember this week and how many of them were drives

and how many of them weren't speed drives that he drove off the planet, because trust me, we're writing for more of those balls. But how many of them were just like, yeah, there's another one, 342 right down the middle. Awesome. Cool. Now he gets a little wedged. Yeah, he's just a nut.

Dude, it's none of that. It's like the shots like Sky Shepler from semi behind the tree on the front line. Oh my God, that was awesome. That was so, so good. Or even just, I mean, the stuff around the green, after you hit one of those shots, you know, the wedge that JT had that he kind of spun off the front of that green. And there were some, that's a really cool, of course.

You want to talk about that now? Because I'm ready to say, like, Scottsdale's like, now, maybe the fans kind of being a little less prominent this week, like made me appreciate this because it's a PGA tour golf course even more. There was the same thing with Tore last week. Like you get more, and I think CBS did a much better job with the, I can't believe I'm fucking saying this. With the officials, the camera angles and all that.

I thought the camera work was abysmal today. But, but yeah, it's just like, even having been out there a couple times, like one, two, three, don't really do it for you, but that, that, like last half of the back nine, and then even the first half of the front nine, it doesn't get all the acclaim. Like it's just, it's a fun place to watch these guys

play golf. Like it's not, I think it's, it doesn't necessarily favor anybody. I think that's what I like about it. I think a lot of the TPC courses aren't, ironically aren't very good for Pro Golf. And I do not feel that way about Scottsdale. I think it's one of the most ideal Pro Golf tournaments.

It's got birdie holes out there, but like some of the par fours have some serious teeth. The way it's defended with contouring around the greens is what I find super interesting. Like watching... Contouring in short grass. Short grass, like watching JT's chip on nine or something today. He had an awkward chip in the fairway

but couldn't land it up on the greens. Oh yeah, I was talking about it. And it was just funneled down to the left. And it was like that, and Brooks' shot on 17 was so difficult. Oh my God. There was a couple, oh God, who was it that chipped in earlier this week,

or chipped in yesterday? Might've been cage Lee, but there was another one of those two where it was, I think it was on 17 where it was like, oh yeah, oh, he chipped in, oh, cool. And then they showed another camera angle. And it was like, oh my God, he had to drip it over that ridge and then it's running straight downhill to the water.

Like what a hard shot. I was similar to Brooks's today. I do think on TV it gets flattened out. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, all those contours and everything. They're looking from above. It's an awesome golf course. It reminded me, I know the desert

and all that stuff isn't really the same, although I guess it kind of used to be when it was first built, but it reminds me the most of Sogras, I think, right? I mean, the way that it's, like you said, it doesn't totally favor anybody. I mean, if you bomb it great, you can have a lot better chance, but there's a lot more risk in trying to do that in some of the holes.

Yeah, I really, really enjoyed it. I do think the green seems slow. What kind of firm though? They were firm, but slow. It was like a weird combo. I mean, and maybe that was just guys being off in the final group, but it seemed like it was, it was outside of the final group too,

where guys just kept leaving putt short or just having really, really tough time judging the distance on putts. And then I think 18, like the teeth are gone from 18. I feel like 18 used to be a golf hole, right? Yeah. 17's gotten better over the last five to 10 years. 18 seems like a fucking push over now. Well, they lengthened it and added, I don't know if they lengthened it, but they added those church pews on the left because guys were just bombing over the pond and flipping a wedge up there.

But still, it's just like pound, Xanard 70 something yards, or Brooks had 70 something yards in to go. Which by the way, they kept making a big deal out of the altitude. It's like 1200 feet. I was gonna look that up. Yeah, I was like, man, did it?

Please get pushed up a little bit. I didn't really remember that. It's a thin feet. I was gonna look that up. Yeah, I was like, man, did it. Please get pushed up a little bit. I didn't really remember that. It's a thin air though too. I mean, the ball flies out there. Yeah, it's a dry heat. It's a dry heat. A ton of people forget that. But legitimately, like, you know, the baseball,

the ball flies. I believe I've said this, but I want to emphasize it again, just how freaking great of a hole, not only where it is in the round, but like watching the 17th hole is truly one of the most fun holes to watch on the PJ tour, just every I don't know what a flaw in it would be because if you go left, you're in the water and like statistically looks like 13% of T shots went in the water, uh, this 21% today in round four, like with the pressure on balls go in that water. Guys are sending it, but like there's just so much to consider.

There's that one little pot bunker, the female RIP female bunker, and then all the contouring around, like where you have to play. God, I never would feel like a laid-up into that bunker. God, I was sick. He made parries, fine. Like where guys, how much? Can't catch a break. Like the far right pin today forces you.

Like if you bail right, you can't get close to that pin. Sully setting up the alley, you guys are so easily distracted. For the hard food, for the hard food take, you know, about the rough feet. Oh, now that you brought it up. Hey, yeah, the shaved bank on the left, and actually people are still going for it. Who'd imagine that?

That's unbelievable. The big takeaway from that one, you know, kind of talking about Speed's ball, like you said, if that was 15 hour for it, it might have stayed up. Which I don't know, it was motor, it was moving pretty good. But it was barely crossed. The, that was the best example I thought this week of, you know, again, talking about the distant stuff.

It's like, dude, all the excitement in golf is one of the balls on the ground. For sure. Like, how awesome was that just, as soon as it left the clubface, you're like, oh my god. Same thing with Han on, like, what's gonna happen? What's gonna happen? Han on 11, you're like, oh shit, oh shit, oh shit,

is it gonna go on? 11 to cool, whole two, 12 to cool, whole. I will say this about Speed's Paul on 17. I've tried to find the DJ video of, the most important thing you need to know when hitting a fade is to fade it. Speed needs to go to fade on that shot. You should, yeah, yeah.

I forget the whole world. You're right. Somebody tweeted, it was like, oh my God, I can't believe that rope hook rolled all the way in the water. I appreciated his kind of faux outrage about, you know, about that ball going all the way to the water. It's like, yeah, come on,

we're else, did you think that was going? 15, I just, I love that that Sunday pin in the front there. Or like it truly, you truly have to hit a great shot to get it to stay there. Like either you're going to come up just short like Shuffleers Ball did or you're going to go 30 feet by and have a tricky putt coming back down. Same with 13 on Saturday, Saturday was a similar pin, super accessible, but yeah, 15, again, these are just really good pro golf holes,

probably great. Probably great. A disaster for an amateur, a lot of these force carries and water holes and how this balls feed away from some of these hole locations, but watching pro golf on these holes is really fun, I think. Any aces this week, Randy? No aces.

Socks. Hate that for you, bud, especially with, you know, 16, playing with 120 yards or something. They say it's just a flip wedge. I would say shout out Tom Wisecoff, who is battling pancreatic cancer as well, but was this the one who designed it? Did the renovation. I think he originally designed it, too, right? Did he? Yeah. I thought he just did the renovation recently, but was the one who designed it. To the renovation. I think he originally designed it too, right? Did he? Yeah, I thought he just did the renovation recently,

but I stand down. I played three or four Wyscuff courses. I always come away just liking them. I don't know why. He's one of the four astunes, the original course up there. We need to do a deep dive on Wyscuff. One of the low key most interesting guys that very few people know much about, I think.

Scott sales grown up really well too. I mean, the year that Phil won it several years ago, it's like at 30 under, like they cut, all right, this got to go under the knife a little bit and they've made some grown up changes to it and I like the watch in the waste management. 16 continues to be not good. I hate how they've enclosed it all with corporate hospitality that like truly is a bummer.

It's gentrified. Yeah, yeah, it's exactly what it is. How much do you think it costs to play there? 399. In the summer, I've heard it's cheap because you'll die. 600 degrees. It's a dry, dry, it isn't dry. It looks like there's a...

I mean, I bet it's cheaper than the saw grader. I bet it's about 100 in the summer. I was just looking up July 1st. I mean, I just skipped ahead a couple the saw grader. I bet it's about 100 in the summer. I was just looking up July 1st. I mean, I just skipped ahead a couple of Saturdays to see what the tea time was. Seven, you can get you a 740 tea time for 380 bucks. I don't think I'd, I don't work that. I mean, how much does saw grads go?

Good job. You got your whole day at least. It's $450. Yeah, it's a lot. It's truly one of those golf courses that I would rather watch somebody else, really good play. To close the book on speed, I don't need to play it.

Are we, yes or no question, is he back? We're in beta testing. Yes or no question. That's a really good way to put it. Yes or no question. He's gonna be back, he's not back yet. But, but it's, So it's a no.

If it's either yes or no, I'm gonna say yes. Okay. Because the beta, it's so, all the results we're seeing from the beta testing are so popular. It's so far along. He's, I'm gonna say yes. Okay. Because the beta, it's so, all the results we're seeing from the beta test and you're so positive. It's so far along. He's breaking news. He's up to 69th in the world ranking.

Nice. Nice. Nice. I, he will be back. For sure, he will be back. How many spots did he jump then? Uh, by my math, about 23. Gosh, he's only up to 111 in the FedEx cup.

Which everybody knows is the truth. That's the truth for Garner. I'm gonna say, if it's a yes or no, I'm gonna say no, but I do wanna go back with my colleagues again and say he will be back for sure. We're gonna get with our developers and all that stuff. Yeah, I mean, he's going to Pebble next week. Like Pebble, one there. Randy's back. Next week will be a really good, good bar know, I mean, he's why he's going to pebble next week likes pebble one there

Hmm, Randy's he back next week will be a really good good barometer, I think At the second he's not back. He trove it's so fucking bad. Yeah, so bad But it kind of but he'll for sure be back It's like point like do I did this make me thrilled for the masters? Yes He's gonna win the master. But is he back? I would say no. I'm not saying yes. I'm gonna say yes.

A week after or two weeks after, you were writing him off as dead in the World of Golf ranking. What an unbelievable stretch. It was just a bit. No, I was hedging my happiness. Did I? I laid it out very clearly.

No one's gonna be more thrilled, but am I betting on him being improving his broad ranking? No, I wasn't thinking that was gonna happen, but looking for a sign of life and we got it. Who do you think wins first? I lose every bet. I did this for you guys.

Who do you think wins first? Oh God. Speed or Fino? Fino. I mean, Fino's so freaking good at golf. Like, yeah, but he's not getting a winning. I would bet on, you want to, you want to wager on that? Sure. Apology wager.

Sure. I would love to. I'd love to. Formal apology. Formal apology. It's got to be. How about these stakes? If Finoins first, I will publicly

and with 100% conviction declare that Pittsburgh is in the Northeast. Wow. I can't live if you do that to me. And if Speedwins first, Saul, he needs to publicly declare that's absolutely not. Absolutely not.

Absolutely not. Oh, it is not in the Midwest. We've been over that. I'll do an apology wager. All right, I think the apology has to be a standalone video. And it needs to be over one minute long, with somber tones. Yeah, very earnest tones.

Love that. I mean, on that, you know? You saw it maybe like a PGA, or a gust of national Billy pain. Yes, a apology. 100% lettuce. No, no, no, like the blue curtain apology. The cat apology.

Okay. All right. All right. Sorry, no, no, no, be like the blue curtain apology. The cat apology. Okay. All right. Sorry, before we move on from speed. If you know when, do we have to do ours together, you don't do separate. I think separate. Okay. We can do them separate, but in the same video, maybe.

Okay. We'll stitch them together. Fix it in post. What'd you think about the skunk man? Oh, gosh. Yeah, Robert Dimmer on tweeted, which harmin is a genius on Saturday. Insignual, what I would do,

yeah, no context. No context. He tried to play it off like, whoa, it was my statement not true, but like insinuating that Bunch Harmon was responsible for a spieth comeback here, which is, as we've covered in previous episodes, complete bullshit and need to call it out.

So, that's it. Not yet. All right, putting a bow on speed. Can we talk Xander now? We can. Hmm, tough. Stinkiness. Guys, it was, I'm worried that Stefan might not be

his biological father, that he's one of Finaus kids. So, everybody that I trust, out that like everybody caddies, media people, other players. Electrons across the world. All of them are like, dude, I love Sanders' game. I love his attitude, I love his mental makeup. He's a dog. I love his practice patterns, I love his work ethic,

all that shit, and then like over and over and over again. I just feel like I'm being snowed over here, man. It's not good. So I have some numbers when Zander Shoffley, since his last win, which was talking towards championship win, are we talking full field or not full field? Well, because the tour, he won the tour championship. He won the gross division, not the net. The tour championship.

He didn't win the FedEx cup. Right. So this is included within that, okay? Since his last win, he went entering the final round anywhere between first and fifth. He has performed to a true, true stroke's gain of 2.0, which is very good. Meaning, so the base on his probability going into the final round. That sounds a lot like his father. Expected wins 2.05, expected wins given how he played 2.91.

So he's actually even played better in final rounds than expected. I'm just throwing that out there. He knows this opposite. So this is a different situation I think. Listen, for sure. But you always hope your kids could live little better life than that you were able to. Like, I don't know.

At some point, it's, it's the old saying, you know, you can't piss down my leg and tell me it's raining. Like, I, I don't care what your numbers are saying over there. I'm with you, Randy. He ain't doing it. Yeah, it's... Like today was fucking damning. It was really bad. Today was definitely not good. He should have won that tournament, but...

It was like five shots. Fina was last year. Like Fina, I feel like it was the, the Roars got louder and louder of, hey man, like what's going on with Fina after he gagged this last year when the rest of the field played like absolute dog shit. That's a cheap shot.

We're obfuscating the conversation. We've litigated last year's Ways of Adria Fenix open many, many times. Many, at least we have a picture shot. We gotta pick our bell. At least Sanders going for it though, right? Whereas Fina was laying up into the pop-onker. I don't, I don't even know what your point is.

So I'm just saying, I respect Zander a lot. I don't even know what this point is. It's objection. I don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Well, if I may, T.C. If I may. What he's trying to say. My co-counsel isors could take over for me.

Which say his love is bad. Oh. I think, listen, we gotta keep in mind, uh, a feed-out, the level of, uh, depravity, depravity, I can never pronounce that word. That's like Neil saying, the whale bird walker. Like, it's, it's, we're not that, we're not in that situation. Like Xander has at least had some bona fides. But to your point, there was nothing out of him I saw today that would be like,

oh, he's a top five player in the world. It was like, but like all the objective metrics are there. Like he's absolutely crushing his driver. Right. He's hitting great iron shots, all that. He's like, he's 27. He's the same age as speed. And like, why does speed with seemingly far less

physical talent or objective physical talent have so much more on his resume than Zander? Zander's wedges were asked today. He was so bad. Really, really stinky. I mean, speech work. For sure. It's hard to win.

Some guys, and you know, maybe it's just that. It's a mixture of luck and, you know, being able to execute when you have to execute. And that's what was weird was, I mean, he started to look just a little swaggy. Birdies 15, birdies 16 after getting a great read, but birdies 15. This was a seven footer.

Birdies 16 and then God damn, that swing on 17. Like, he suddenly said it would look like the drone flag into the tree. Like it was just, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, immediate homing missile into the water. like it was just, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, immediate homing missile into the water. That was not good. I mean, the drive on 14 too, missed down the left on 14 and like, you know,

487 yard par four, but the end of the day, like, that's not the side to miss it on, right? That was, so I just, I really want them to be, I want them to be a killer. Seems like a killer. Oh, it smells like a killer, but everybody's not a killer. And then to be a killer. Seems like a killer. Oh, it smells like a killer. But everybody's not a killer. And he's a killer.

And like, I want to believe in this guy, but at some point, show us, man. Go get it. So I know that's a Tony Fiena. I know, very, very well. I'll get it. I know very, very, very well that this has, like, this has zero chance of going over. Like, absolutely none.

You got to throw some red meat in your soul. You're trying to set up the egg on set. My guy is the speed fungal. My guy on the opposite side of the court is beat on the back door. I'm running over to take the charge, but I'm just going to get dunked on here. I'm very well aware of that. We are as a golf watching community. Desi, like, in here, these trees to be self-evident. That winning is really hard.

We are told, we can week out, that like being great at the game means winning on these individual occasions, right? So if somebody goes miscut, miscut, miscut, miscut, miscut, win, that's better than going T4, T4, T4, T4, T4. Like that is inherently like- Of course. And-

That's a big time paradox. I give you, yes, I'm with you. Right? I don't even know if it's necessarily that, because that totally depends on your value system, right? As a fan versus as like a, you know, appreciator of a game or somebody who's trying objectively to. But it always ends up, well, he's got more wins than Ricky Fowler does now.

And that's where it's like, it ultimate barometers judged by how many times in a four day period you were the best. One guy out of 156 or whatever the wins, I get that. So, I'm trying to, I'm trying to get, just where I'm going with this, right? It's like, the best tournament players,

let's look at a landscape different than the PGA tour, right? The best tournament players, you would look at the dudes that like finished the top five all the time, like dude, that guy is always beating me, like he is. So that's where I struggle with some of these dudes that like seemingly can't get it done in the final round, even if they played decently and it hasn't worked out

in their favor, for like some of these guys like looking at a, it done in the final round, even if they played decently and it hasn't worked out in their favor. For like some of these guys like looking at them, like if we're talking about who we're just talking about, Jonathan Vegas who has three PJ Tour wins and Zander has four and they granted their careers or different links, but I'm like, yeah, Zander beats John the Vegas all the freaking time. Like Zander beats, Data Golf's got him as the third best player in the world right now

for Stroke's game right now. Like he beats people constantly. That doesn't mean nothing. I think it can always, when it gets like at the end of the day being like, yeah, stinky zander. But that does mean the expectations are higher. A hundred percent. As well as like, he shuts 66, 64, 65, and then 71 in the final round.

When everybody else was collapsing. And I don't think that's necessarily not 67 today. It's not like it was, I don't think that means nothing. That's not my point. It's just, that's where I struggle some, that's where I don't, I have no personal ties to Finau, but that's where I come at. It's like, my take, it's fucking unbelievable

that he hasn't won more of these things, but I'm also like, how is he beat so many people every single week? How do you beat 99% of the field every week? And I struggle like, and I like as someone who has played in some tournaments, if I was like, if I beat 99% of the people all the time, even if the fields are shitty, I'd be like, oh my God, I feel really good about that.

And I know it's not like that in the in the sports society and that's where I come from on all that. I will take any barrel fire. No, no, no, no, no, I think that's totally fair. It's the thing, it's the whole disconnect that you gotta be really, really good in order to choke in the finals, right? Like, in order to get to the finals,

you have to be really good. You have to be really good. It's a bad mark for a brand of loss in the finals six times. Right, like you're taking the perspective of an objective observer, and I think everybody else taking the perspective of an objective observer, and I think everybody else is taking this perspective of a fan who also has high expectations for the number three or four player in the world.

And I think by the ultimate metric, he succeeded wildly this week. He went from sixth to first in the FedEx cup. So that was weighing on the whole time. But so I think to your point, and I kind of mentioned this offhand earlier about, you know, just the parody in golf and not really having, we have Dustin, I know, but outside of that, there's nobody that's really stuck their hand up is like, all right, I'm the guy. Like, come, I'm going to fucking win all the time. And I think that would be the absolute.

But he hasn't been for six years. You know what I mean that would be that. In the absence. But he hasn't been for six years. You know what I mean? And he died. Yeah, it's just, I think in the absence of those guys, and of course this is Tiger throwing the whole metric off.

But I mean, in the absence of having that, it's like, how else do you separate these guys? And if you're expecting a fan to lay out the case that you just made, which I think is a totally rational fair one, I just, like, people aren't gonna do that. They, like, they don't take it, they don't look at it the same way that we look at it, you know, for 50 hours a week here. It's much more just like, dude, who won and who didn't?

And who hit it in the water on 17 and who didn't? But, and watching today, it's like, Brookschipped it on 17, Zander hit it in the water on 17 and who didn't but and watching today It's like Brooks chipped it on 17 Zander hit in the water on 17 like what else am I supposed to say other than that I can analyze it for the next seven days until Zander probably finishes second next week to or Fina finishes second next week Or something like that But can I ask you why that is though because I do think their attributing factor is the way it's presented like The way golf is on TV is presented is like, he could hold this from the fairway to get into the playoff. Like, they don't even, they don't present

why you should care about second place. So I think what that leads to is a lot of people not caring who finishes in second. 100%. Second versus fourth. Why when we watch Formula One? I was gonna say the same thing. When Carlos signs passes Esteban Ocon on the final lap

to get an extra couple points for his team, why do we care about that versus how many FAQs is a fifth place guy get? Do you know the answer to that? Well, shit, loadout. We do this for a living and we don't know the answer to that. Do you know, can I guess? I, sure.

I'm concerned though. I'm concerned though. I think it's less. I'm gonna say 76. I'm concerned that you're arguing that the FAQs cup is the answer to this. I'm like providing context. No, it kind of is though.

So which might prove that this is a bad way to look at the game, but I mean, he's right. And that like if you, the FedEx Cup, it's not a zero sum game. The FedEx Cup by any measure is a great indicator of who had an awesome season. Like no doubt. If it was like average number of FedEx Cup points per start,

yes, but like I just don't fucking care about that. Nor I don't think do any of you guys. So that kind of almost proves my point, which is like, dude, I've only got X number of time to dedicate to watching golf on TV. All I got time to care about is who wins. You guys are also talking like Atlanta Braves. Like a guy that grew up watching Atlanta Braves.

Like the Braves won 15 or however many division titles in a row. Like that feels to me like getting a shitload of top fives but not winning, right? And it's like at some point like the banners, the penance are out there or they're not. And that's it's like it's, it, it, it maybe it is a zero sum game, right? Of like, like that's what the money's for.

These guys are getting the money, but if they really want to be talked about in a certain way, and I think with Xander, you can be a little bit more patient with Xander because it's not like he was some... He's one four times. Some, you know, sure thing from the start. A long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, long, you know, amateur career. Like, I could see him being a little bit more of a late bloomer and like, once he gets his feet under him and learns how to win

and how to close people out, he's gonna be fucking dangerous. But I think it's just gonna, you know, it's like, take a couple more years. Now, when he's 31 and he's still doing the same shit as Tony Fiena, then we'll have that conversation. Okay, I got some thoughts. I think the money has changed everything in professional golf. I think to answer your point about Formula One,

Formula One has constraints built into the sport, right? The technology is different, the resources of the teams are different. There's only 20 guys. There's a limited number of guys. And so we know that, for example, the Hoss team, they don't have the resources. So if they would finish in the top 10, in earned points, that is a massive victory for them,

given that disparity. Shout out to Gunter. I think if you look at Cornfairy, or even you see it on the LPGA, the money that a person could make by finishing like fourth in a given week is life changing, right? And it can do so much for them.

Where on the PGA tour, it's like, oh cool, they go cash another big check, but like, why do I care about that? You know, it's, so I think in that sense it has just turned into, listen, you're either winning or you're not winning because I don't care. Like, you're adding extra zeros to your bank account.

That didn't do anything for me. So, yeah, I totally get your point, too. And I think it's a good point. I just think it's like, as coming from a fans perspective, I'm not asking you to care. Yeah, yeah, I don't care. But it's like, yeah, like why? I would like to care.

I would know with you. Or even back in like the you know before Pre-tiger right when it was an amazing thing to make a million dollars in a year when the money list actually mattered right and it was like Oh my gosh, well, we'll so until make a million dollars this year. I'm sure a guy finishing in the top 10 like three consecutive weeks like would excite people a lot more than it does today, because it's just, I don't know, like there's just so little to care about in golfing. It goes back to like the Adam Scott's thing. Like only like four events matter each year.

And so it's like, what are we doing the rest of the time? You're either winning or you're not. Zander made $649,700 this week. Like the guy that sticks out to me in the top 10, that it probably meant something to him, was like Matthew Neesmith. At, he finished T7, made $229,000. I was getting ready to ask, without looking,

how much might an Andrew Puttner make this week? I had no idea, he made $229,000. So that does mean something to them, but at the end of the day, that story's not even for a movie. Right. They're not telling me that story. Legimly I know Andrew Putnam was on tour still. Did not see him hit one shot.

For an event that's a bad example because they're our fans of this one. The idea that some of these guys get six figure paychecks for playing golf in this entertainment event that like didn't entertain us at all is, that's a separate concept. It's wild, but anyways. And then we get into the fact that like the top players are probably still underpaid too. So, you know, a guy like, Speed, like probably was underpaid this week for what he provided to the tournament. That's right. And sorry, this is, this is a pet peeve of mine. But when you hear, and none of these guys

specifically, but you'll hear some men with regard to the pay, equality debate, say, well, it's simple, supply and demand. It's like there are four people in men's golf that truly drive demand. And everybody else, like, I hate to break it to you, you don't have a market. Yeah, there is no market. There's some of you that are like, name names over here, but. Well, I mean, no offense,

but like Putnam and Neesmith, like nobody cares, no market there. It's tough. Before we move on from this conversation, if we're gonna be putting somebody on notice for not closing tournaments, is it time? Steve's trickered. Is it time to have a discussion about Scottie Schaffler?

For sure, I was very, very, I mean, granted. Yeah, I wanted to see more this weekend. I did. At the end of the day, though, too. Honey, he looked better than Zander in his speed. He's 24 last year. Was last year's rookie year on tour? Who could say?

Yeah, it was. Right. He's been on tour for like 24 and dog year, so. So he's had a he's had a final round starting position of T1, T2, T2, T3, T3, T5 and Solo Fit. He's been in the top five that many that many times. Just throw it up. Which last year in the top five that many times. I'm just throwing out.

Which last year he was actually struggling on Saturdays midway through the year. So I'm, you know, it seemed like he's gotten the Saturdays figured out and he's working on the Sundays. He's fun to watch, man. He's awesome. He's a blast to watch. And it's like raw athletic ability.

There's nothing mechanical or, you know, like just, just like boring about it. It's a flourish. I believe the term you've used many times in the past, he's very greasy. Oh, he's so greasy. Which always sticks with me. He's like the 38 year old dude banging down low at the wreckley cams and then-

I'm so glad you went basketball. That should like high floaters over people and like step back completely sweaty. Yeah, like nobody wants to go down the floor. You know, the mid length white crew socks on. I don't know why he might be 20 years younger than everybody. He reminds me of Ryan Palmer for some reason. Really? T.C.'s boy?

Yeah. No, much, much higher upside. The game? Oh, much higher upside. For sure. I'm just saying, this game, you know, Texas guys, similar kind of look about him a little bit. Scotty Shuffler is the poster boy for if a player hasn't won on tour.

You are obligated to say, it's only matter of time. The first guy runs out here. I heard that four times related to Scotty. one on tour, you are obligated to say, it's only matter time. The first guy runs out here. I heard that four times related to Scottie. He's talking about FedEx, he finished what, fifth last year or top five last year as a rink. No, you like top five. No, I'm saying context, baby.

So yeah, the numbers on him show that with the, you know, he expected probability going into a final round, he would have one win given his play. It falls to 0.6. So he has struggled in final rounds, but it's only matter of time. It's only matter. It's a, you brought up a really good point. You kind of got me, my head turned it on the money stuff and how you, how you really make, you know, and we talked about the player run organization and all the players have an equal voice and yada, yada, yada. I just, man, that's a tough conundrum to make that, to make that many people care about that many players.

It's just, that's a really hard system to try to figure out. It was making him care about some of the players. And when you whitewash them all and class out to everybody, you don't do, you don't do yourself any justice, like truly creating interesting storylines. When it looked like James Hahn was gonna ruin the Speed Zander duel today,

I should say the PGL should ran a commercial right then and there and expect, hey, we won't have James Hahn. Like that's the whole point. And we're not gonna show you gangnam stuff. Yeah, there's gonna be no curve balls don't it? Like you're gonna get Speed for Zander and no one else is gonna get in the way of that. And that had been very effective commercial right at that moment.

Tough, tough back then for James Han. I kind of like James Han. Man, that was a super bowl, no pun intended for what's currently going on as a percentage for Paul Azinger, Han getting into the lead, the pressure, the pressure, the Kater, later more of your Avedi. Choking on.

I mean, he was told he was very right though. Yes, extremely. I just, like, the leaderboard gravity. Choking, I mean, he was told, he was very right though. Yes, extremely. I just, like, at some point, like, there's, Han has done 50 more interesting things than that fucking dance. Oh my God. It's, that is infuriating every time I see it. I mean, if that's infuriating,

that's you letting that infuriate you. It is. Of course they're gonna show that. It's at Phoenix, come on. It infuriates me too. It infuriates me that's you letting that infuriate you. Of course they're going to show that. It's at Phoenix. Come on. It infuriates me too. It infuriates me too, but like, come on. What are they supposed to do?

Not show that. I'm sorry, I don't know what led me here. I think it was the Formula One, honestly. We've mentioned the PGL stuff, but like, think about creating a, and I'll have to turn into that But if you had a model where you had 32 40 guys all these head-to-head matchups Read you know like how much more invested you would be in like the golf outside of just purely Oh, he he won I care about like one thing this week, right? They'll create so many more

And they'd be relegation and they'd be, like, there would be very distinct tears versus like, no, there's 125 guys that keep their cards. Plus, if you've won, plus, plus all these, these other eight subcategories that we've gerrymandered in. But you know what, they have a future of? And I know joke for me, and this is, like, of course, their response of ours,

but like the trafficking stuff that we do has got me like following shit. Yeah. Way more shit than I usually would. Like, those out tours, I was living and dying by the shock absorber here. So bummed that he can't feel his pants today. Create your own reality.

Yes. I mean, that's where like the tour golf, you just have to have if you're not gonna like promote and encourage truly interesting personalities, right? And, you know, we're just so far divorced from people driving week to week and having actually interesting people as pro golfers. Yeah, all that we're left with is like, well, yeah, did you win or not?

But then the core can't even bother to get us the fucking updated scores on the app on the leaderboard. Like, that's what kills me. It's like, at some point, like, if you want to grow the game, fine do that, but you got to serve the core audience as well. What's next, handshake? Sorry, it's rarely stumbling to, you know, the substantive conversation on this part.

So I want to keep this going, but Randy, I think one thing I've always thought about is like, I obviously did not watch golf in the 70s and 80s. So I have, Randy did, I know, Scotty Sheffield did. In a previous life. What about you? Grudal of the game.

Like I wonder all that, you know, driving event to event and back when guys were characters and blah, blah, blah. I wonder how much that is real and how much of that is romanticized after the fact because I would have to guess everything still had to be so star driven in those days. And of course you had, you know,

the former and then Jack and Trevino and then Faldon, Norman and all those guys. But I think that's why I keep coming back to you. And I tweeted something, or I think Brandl was chirping at me on Twitter this week about this, but that's where I keep coming back to like, no, we don't have that many stars. And that's what this week stood out to me more than anything

was like, spieth is the guy. He's the guy that like gets people excited and that doesn't happen for anybody else, other than Tiger, like you said. And part of it though is like, how do you develop stars? You let them do shit that's outside the norm. Guys do stuff that's memorable, guys do stuff that's like, and you don't punish them for it over and over and over again.

Like Zander saying something, you know, like, I'm sure he got a talking to from Big J this week or, all right, cool. Like, make read into a true villain, you know? I think there's that. I think there's definitely things you do on the marketing side, but I also think this leads into the equipment conversation. And the paragraph you read on the Shackleford podcast that I like so much, what blew my mind about that and just crystallized it for me was when you make the game involve

more skill at the highest level, the more skilled players are going to rise to the top. And you just cut so much of this middle ground out, and it just seems like it would make it so much easier to have less parity on the PGA tour. And you make these, you know, I'm not as caught imagine how far offline Speed would have drove it this week if we had any of the equipment changes in place. But other people who have been there with them. Yes. The point being like, it makes Rory better, it makes Ron better, it makes Brooks better, it makes Brooks better, it makes all these guys like. As a foul ball back, bring variance back.

The tournaments get so much more exciting if there's variance and there's acts. Totally, and I think that loops it all the way back to the Brooks conversation, which is like, yeah, maybe with some sort of equipment change, like Brooks does win more. And he starts running downhill more, and he does start to win more majors,

and he does start to be more interesting and all of those things. I think, I don't know, that's what gets me the most excited about the distant stuff. And there's a bunch of obfuscating conversation about, like Shackford said, they're coming to take your guns away. But I think that's the most important crux of this is that it makes the PJ tour hopefully create more stars because you're not doing it with the Gangnam style package. You know what I mean? And we'll talk distance here in a second, I promise.

The best way I can think to explain it, I forget if it was one of you guys that said it initially, but I know this is bad radio, you can't see what my hands are doing, but picture a bar and I'm holding a bar up high, like above my head. With technology, the game is trending like closer and closer to this mythical perfect golf.

Like it's no one's ever gonna play perfect golf, but it rises so many people close to that level and no one's gonna ever touch it, but then you just become, it becomes kind of this probability ridiculousness that a game ends up with. So desensitize to actual, like, just point scale and excellence.

Yes, and so if you are lowering, when I say lowering the standard of play, I don't mean like, I'm not saying we're gonna watch guys just play shitty golf, and I think that's what a lot of people think the rollback means, but if you lower that, and so no one's coming close to this, you know, mythical, perfect golf, when people are separating themselves,

it's gonna be that much more special. And the cream is gonna rise to the top. Yeah, like a million times over. Like every week and then also on a month-to-month basis, also on a year-to-year basis. I mean, that's, again, that's what gets me the most excited about it. Hamsterdam or Saudi Arabia next.

Whew. Gosh. Let's talk, let's talk. Let's talk Saudi. Okay. DJ wins. That's, that's all I've got. I don't know if you guys have anything else.

Twice in 30 years. Beautiful views of bread, taking views of the Red Sea. They got the boat out there on the Red Sea where they go. Hookers and blow. It's weird that he won the league. Allegedly. I would encourage, first of all, everybody to go visit the trap drop podcast from this

past week. Randy and Tron talking with Mr. Cody. Mr. Cody. Co-dnamed Cody. Co-dnamed Cody who has spent a good deal of time in Saudi Arabia and all over the Middle East. So weighing into some of the complex issues over there, who better than Tron and Big Rady to bring you closer to those issues?

Well, the same day that that was dropped golf.com slash golf magazine. Quite a jack's position. Slash Nicholas design. Yeah, posted a, yeah, a Nicholas design, you know, broke the news of their new development in the Kadea, which Jack has a wonderful vision for the Kadea. Which Rady doesn't share, which I heard of the podcast. He should see this Kadea. And then they, and then they, I wish I could bring you sometimes.

They don't, they, they don't like you very much over there though. And then, that's fucking dark. Well, the off.com runs basically a PR statement from the Saudi Arabia and their PR agency. Like written word for word, I've talked to people. Like written word for word from the PR agency as like an editorial column. So like, fuck you guys.

Respectfully. I commend them for it. The more the shit trends that way, the more important we become. So let them do it. Like I think the course was probably the number one. I said Bombers' course. I meant golf, golf, Bombers' course.

DJ wins masterful job by DJ. Just steps up a couple of times on the back nine and absolutely stripes one up a net's ass. Meanwhile, Tony struggled a little bit down the stretch, got that late bird on 18. It's really up the strokes gave versus the field stats. He's he's he's gerrymandering the stats there. Struggled down the stretch to a 200 par 33 on the back nine. Yeah. But I was struggling. Bogey Bogey 16, 17 though. He did. Yeah.

Yeah. Tough tough, tough, two on Sunday. Uh, he played the last three holes. One shot worse than DJ yet lost by two. So even if he'd played him three shots better, he wouldn't need to play him three shots better to have won the tournament. Any beat DJ today. So listen, I want to give a shout out to DJ's hat. It's just a tough lock. That's something you need to break.

DJ's hat was, I blew a bunkie set on Twitter. He looked at you and was playing in the bass master's tournament this week. And what about the tweet of the week? Tweet of the week, week. And what a weirdo week, a week, hey, it's dad. Yeah, what a weird ass tournament. Like what can the tour, what is the tour? I don't know, now with the strategic alliance,

the PGA tour, what is there to thought on like fill, go leaving the desert to go play in this tournament and people that live in Scottsdale, leaving the US to go play in this tournament on the European tour in Saudi Arabia. They got a sign of labor for it. Like, can't imagine they like it.

How about like Fina? Fina was gonna win this week in Phoenix. Yeah, I think you should count as a win. And then he chooses to go over there. Legitimately, I think Fina would have blown the doors off everybody today. I say that, I say that absolutely sincerely. I think he would have won today.

Well, today was the day. Today was the day. Will you add that to the bet then? No, no, we just made the bet. So, you know. No, I'm not saying that. No, no, no. Okay, he's not gonna win again.

Yeah, sure, I'll give him Phoenix. That's why. He won Phoenix. Yeah, he won Phoenix. That's on the record. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, like, in granted, you kinda lit up, Michelson about it, Randy.

But, I think, like Paul Casey went to Arizona State too. And, and, and then like, that was the Paul Casey statements were, were tough. That was the, that was when I had a problem with, we're like, all right, like, like Steve Weakcroft gets in the, in the, in the replies this week. You know, like, and I'm like, weedy, like, well, you called out Paul Casey on Twitter for his,

because two years ago he was adamant about not going to Saudi Arabia and now he, he's'm like, wait, he like, what you called out Paul Casey on Twitter for his, because two years ago, he was adamant about not going to Saudi Arabia and now he, it's got a fucking unicef bag, like he's, you know, he's like, I can't believe this, this is, I can't believe we're having a golf tournament here, all this stuff. And then this year, he's like, yeah, you know what? Like I've really educated myself and done a lot of research

and really, you know, and like, they're doing a lot of wonderful things here and there and then they ask him about it in the press conference. And he's like, oh yeah, like, I have no idea what you're talking about, like, you know, it's like, like, then, like, don't, then don't show up at all, or don't make the stand in the first place.

Like stand for something. If you actually stood for it, you can go to Saudi Arabia and not collect a paycheck, and just go visit and do, like, whatever, like, if you want to go on a learning visit, go do it where you're not getting a paycheck. Like, if you're getting a paycheck to go do it, we're not gonna sit here and believe what you have to say

about what you're learning. That's the thing that kills me. It's like all these guys are so, like, we'll, like, we need to roll in in. Well, you know what, like, these guys deserve to make a living. You know what, there's how many tournaments every year, and like, you guys skip, however many of them, skip this week if you know,

and like, if you don't want to talk about week if you you know and like if you don't want to talk about politics or you don't want to talk about these guys laundering their to quote unquote uh group us leaners laundry their image before the world then like then don't just like quote then don't talk about that's where I've been on these tournaments for a while is like do I begrudge the the guy playing on the fringe or the margins of the European tour who's trying to keep their cards? What's so up now?

I get it, man. No, leadership's putting them in a bad spot. That sucks, but I get it. But like, fuck, man, Dustin Johnson, Phil Mickelson, Bryson, Tony Fienau, all these guys, like, Coke, right. Like, you do not get to have it both ways, man.

You know what, I just, I would rather. Explain why it's different. Like, explain why this is different from China. There's a lot of what about us. Because they have all the money already. But like, what aboutism about like, will they go play an event in China? Explain why that's different.

There's very good reason why it's different. What? I mean, like a China HSBC is the sponsor of the event. Yes, exactly. It's like the Chinese government trying to whitewash their image. That Saudi Arabia is literally just like the Chinese government trying to whitewash their image. That Saudi Arabia is literally just like trying to... They're trying to normalize their standing

before the rest of the international community. Right. Group, do it the right way. Like, Group of Sillinus does. That's not a lot of them. So that's the good thing. I would encourage Cody does a much better job of summing up the situation than any of us would go to.

Well, I think the real problem too is that, you know, Group of Sillininas does that and they have a economic model for shared prosperity. Of course. Which we all know what that means. Which I'm not sure the Saudis have that. So, I do also want to say, Victor Perez needs to be on your radar screen as a manipulator.

A habitual line stepper. As an OWGR manipulator, I didn't realize he was six foot six,. He's a big guy. Oh my god. I didn't know there were big guys in France. He's from the Pyrenees. He's been on an absolute heater since the beginning of 2019. I'm fascinated by him. And I've word has it. He's one of the slowest guys out there. We're monitoring. Not good. I see the OWG are points you're making here. The a solo second at the BWBMWPGA championship, the flagship event that gets the artificial world ranking points boost. That got some up got about 34th in the world. A solo seventh at the DP World Tour championship in Dubai.

That's a legit Turkish Airlines open is a that's a hotbed for manipulating. All right. RIP. I think they're not having it this year. The manipulating events are the ones that get the minimum number of points despite having no strength to feel. So that's what we're looking out for. That's the Alex Nord special. Speaking of manipulation, team Rose very, very, very excited to get their world ranking up. That was what he posted about today. Oh, team Rose. Very excited to get their world ranking up. That was what he posted about today. So team rows, very excited to get my world ranking back up.

Yeah, it was a huge week for all of us on team rows. As Sali said earlier, the forums were absolutely just popping off this week. I think there's gonna be some limited edition merch. Commemorate team rows is T2 finished at the Sadi, whatever, the bone saw, invitation. Yeah, huge huge huge week for all of us at team rose. Kind of a fascinating mix of all right, 30th, Kansmith, 31st, Co-CRAC, 32nd, leash, 33rd, Justin Rose, 34th,

Scotty Sheffler, and 35th Victor Perez. Kind of a murderous row there of guys going all all over the map. You guys wanna talk some distance stuff here? You ready for that? We doing distance, distance in that, and then hamster them? We're gonna do hamster them, let's do hamster them. So, surprisingly, I'm gonna yield my time.

I will yield my time back to the committee as well. That was, it was whatever. So many commercials, we've talked about the commercials so many times. I'll say this, if I had to power rank last week and this week I would put CBS one, NBC two. That's my big takeaway. I would agree.

I'll yield the rest of my time. How about the mini coverage gap today? The micro coverage gap. Yeah, throwing Fairety on it, 254. And then not showing golf for 10 fucking minutes. Thanks to the US bank sports update, which cause I mean, yeah, I don't know where I'll say it was. I was born.

No, he wasn't even on there. We got a Bob Sliding update for the second day in a row. The QZolo Jones is killing him on the Bob Sliding scene. So the issue that I see unfolding with NBC is it is a Russian nesting doll of promotion of their own stuff, which like maybe NBC is just too big because it's promotion for the Office. Oh, you're talking about it. I like my time. That's a that's a calm cast take. I hear my reclaimed. It's just like promotion for this promotion for this promotion for this promotion for this it's just a Ponzi scheme of promotion because you get to whatever they're

promoting and they're just you're going to get there and it's gonna promote something else. And it is out of control. The amount of commercials is out of control and then they'd come back and they would promote something else, promote something else. The amount of commercials for the players that I saw that's also on NBC. If they're not promoting the players during the players,

we're gonna have issues. They are guaranteed to be promoting the players during the players. It was pathetic. I hated today. I was so bad. Are they selling any ads? I don't know.

Because there's all sorts of PGA tour ads and just sponsor ads that seem to be make goods from tournaments from last year, right? That's the part that, yeah. I yielded my time. No, speak up. But that's the point. Maybe they should be yielding.

Maybe the tour should be yielding their fucking time too. Imagine if on this podcast, we, we just take a break right now. Like they did like six times in the course of an hour. Take a break to like promote our own. Listen to our, listen to our players episode. Listen to our players episode. Players isn't coming up for a couple months, but just mark the calendar. It's hard. It's, it's so many house ads. I'm already watching it, months, but just mark the calendar. It's hard. It's so many house ads. I'm already watching it, dog. I can't pull over any farther. I'm already pull over.

And then they didn't, like, it was worse on golf channel earlier today. And I'm with you that it's better when the tournament's better, right? When there's a through line like speed playing is dick off, it's unbelievable. I'm really wondering, I'm of the more encouraged of the belief now, I guess,

or a boy of saying that, but that you can't make a good broadcast out of shitty, and I guess just a shitty interest public interest story. I watch European tour like every week though. Yeah, that's good. Right, but that's not, yeah. The broadcast wasn't amazing on Saturday and terrible on Sunday. It was like the content was amazing on Saturday and the content was kind

of shitty on Sunday. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. I just think it's like the broadcast is probably shitty either way, but it's just a matter of there's something distracting from the broadcast being shitty. I think with like watching on golf channel today with sands leading it nothing against Steve Sands. I don't have anything against him, but like I'm not sure anybody shut the fuck up for like an hour and a half. And then it was the same thing on the NBC thing where like I don't know bones and noda and sands and Todd Lewis. Those guys are getting paid by the word, but like they wouldn't like. They didn't take a breath. Steve Butchegras was tweeting about it.

Like it was John Butchegras, sorry, sorry. Butchee, come on. Sorry, sorry, sorry. Four-door trap-draug, yeah. Like, Steve Burkowski, John Butchegras, I crossed them over to that, my apologies, of course, but that, it was noticeable. It was just like, man, I don't know.

Maybe, I don't know if it was just the one week of CBS that like, man, at least they are, and like their broadcast was different this year. And I get it, different producer, all that. You could feel the fresh look, right? And like, now I really notice when NBC puts the full screen score graphic up. And like, oh, I was like,

oh, I kind of missed the little thing in the corner. I was like, that's four seconds. We could have back into the telecast kind of thing. And that's where, I want to give NBC the benefit of the doubt because this isn't normally their event. This is normally CBS event. To one-off week, then they're going away. Exactly.

That's kind of what I was saying. Maybe they're mailing it in. I felt like- First one of the year. It was a last minute. They got new talent. They got surprised that the Super Bowl was giving it on CBS.

That's what I was saying. It's not a couple of. I think you needed your time. I wanna say something positive. I think John Woods really great. Yeah, yes. I've greatly enjoyed having him on the broadcast. I think he's your time. I want to say something positive. I think John Woods really great. Yeah, yes. I've greatly enjoyed having him on the broadcast. I think he's brought a great element.

But I think the question is, is CBS the top dog now? That's such a jump. That's Speedplay well for one week and you declared him back. We'll be monitoring. Yeah, there's hints here and there. So, but yeah, that was, today was very rough. And I do wanna say, Hicks was petrified after he said that they were going through the schedule

and he was taking us through the West Coast and the Florida swing and then the Valero and then he said, yeah, and then the Masters is the first major of the year. And he was like, oh, no. Oh, I meant the next major of the season. Next major of the season. Oh my God, they're gonna, they're gonna,

they're gonna, they're gonna, the season or year, this is, he said year, he said year. Pot of Beedra is gonna kill my family. No, I said season. No, he said year. Did he? Yeah, he said year.

I went back and rewinded it. That's bad, rewind. I do not think that was a pot of Beedra thing. No, he said, year, did he? Yeah, he said year. I went back and rewinded it. That's bad. Rewound. I do not think that was a pontovedra thing. I think that was truly like, within the pontovedra, FedEx cup season, there's already been two majors. I think that was his point of like, oh, it's gonna be the fourth major of the year

as far as pontovedra concerned. Yes, as far as pontovedra. You've already granted the players a major this year, not the US open. We said we're considering it, right? It's under consideration. All right. There was some news, which if you listen to our podcast this past week with Jeff Shackleford, there was some news that came out on Tuesday, the USGA and RNA. Basically, with some findings related to distance and golf, they proposed three new equipment standards. They're a

little technical, little boring, but basically the main one being restricting clubbling from 48 to 46 inches. Sorry, I bet you're ready. I hate that. That feels targass. I feel, I feel singled out. Coming after you, Victor Perez. That is bullshit, which as Jeff Shackleford pointed out,

the comment date on that is in March, basically, so like there's a potential that this could be pushed through before the masters. Before the year years first major. The riddler's fucking has had guys. There is an updated method on test update on testing method for golf balls, which is important, but I don't think there's that much importance to discuss there as well as changing the testing tolerance characteristic time from 18 microseconds to six.

I have a lot of people pushing that. No, I'm serious. It's a change. It's the way that those matters, if they test stuff. Well, for sure. So, and then it's a voluntary testing system. Separately, a six areas of interest for basically for further exploration,

a reduction in the limit within the overall distance standard, modification and the limitation of ball efficiency, other ball specifications, reduction in the performance of drivers, club-length and club head dimensions, including volume, changes into club head specifications on spring, like effect and moment of inertia. That's the big one there, in my opinion. And lastly, production of spin from all clubs

from all areas of the course. Very vague on the areas of interest, I think, which is like two, I would say to the benefit of this report, right? Everything's on the table, baby. Yes, it's all out there. We might change anything. You don't know what we're gonna change.

It, so like... Groves, can we change the grooves? Can we make the ball bigger? Can we make the head smaller? Bigger cups, that's what I'm holding for. Shout out to Mark King. Mark King, Taco Bell guy, is that right? the ball bigger can make the head smaller bigger cups that's what I'm looking for shot the more king my king talk of the guy's alright live boss live boss ready bigger cups so I'm craving a lot a lot of people through their arms up in the

air on this pretty quickly so I I read this a coming for your. A very heavy emphasis on the bifurcation aspect, right? The local rule that we go- Hold on, hold on, hold on. We gotta get it out on the table. Okay. Everybody stay there, stay there position right now. Are you for no rollback, bifurcation, or total rollback? I'm for total rollback.

I'm bifurcation. Bifurcation, which I think will lead to total rollback. A T-C-I'm with total rollback. A TCM with total rollback. Roll me back. Roll me away, man. So you want to take people's guns away. That's a bum. Hell yeah.

Yeah, roll them back. Hell yeah. What do I, I- You cared a little, I said it. I said it in our little text, like what the hell do I care if I'm playing a golf course from 6,500 or 6,000?

That's the thing, it's all relative. And so I think going along with this, I wanna give a special shout out because I shit all over the USGA all the time. I wanna give a special shout out and this is very earnest. The USGA green section did like an accompanying report looking at architecture and historical aerials from courses.

And- How courses have changed over the years? Yeah, and trees, green sizes, fairway sizes, all that stuff. And like, it's worth a read. Yeah, I'll post it. It's worth a read. I think that was, because it adds so much context

to the why on this whole rollback issue. Right, and whether or not people realize it, there is a race going on in terms of, like with the current equipment you play, Randy, you might be more apt to play a 6300 yard course, right? But if you play with different equipment, you might be more encouraged to play from 6,000. Which is great, I'd love to.

That's what I think, like, people haven't really fully realized that as technology has gotten better and better in the ball going further, you have probably moved back in T's in some way. They've put the T's further back. For sure. But yeah. And the game's gotten more dangerous. It's required much more land. Well, it takes longer. Yeah.

Well, I think you're totally hitting on the biggest, one of the biggest misconceptions of a number of misconceptions, I believe, about this report, which is this disconnect or this misunderstanding that they're going to roll the ball back and you have to play the same tease. Like, yes, of course, that's not going to happen. Right. Right?

Is that what, like, that's kind of what I think people are getting at. It's like, oh my God, you're gonna make people hit it shorter. That's gonna make the game harder. They're gonna say, fuck you. I'm not playing golf anymore. It's like, no, I think they'll just move up T's

and it'd be exactly the same thing. Isn't that what we're getting at here? Except for it would take, like, there are so many people that, there's so many different, a lot, shout out to the T.C.

A lot of different ways we could go with this. We're so early in this. We're so early in this. A lot of people saying things, and this was kind of the crux of the first part of Roy's comment, which I guess I don't disagree with, but I think it was kind of short-sighted, which is, you know, they should be taking this opportunity,

it's spending this money to make the game more accessible, more affordable, more inclusive, all of that stuff. It's like, dude, a big, big part of that has to do with how much money it costs to play the game. How much money, like, I don't get this, it's not either or. Yeah, I don't get this camp of people who's like, you should make the game cheaper,

but don't change the size of the product at all. Well, I ain't like, just make it cheaper. All right, Rory. It's like, well, you gotta make the field smaller then. How else are you gonna do this? All right, Rory, go to any muni in America. It's basically, you can't hold, you can't hold a tournament there anymore

because it's 5,900 yards or it's 6,200 yards and it's irrelevant, man. It's not even, you're telling me that that's not an issue? It's not even just that. It's like recreational golfers. I mean, I don't hit the ball far. Randy, you don't hit the ball far. Tron, you play left handed mean, I don't hit the ball far. Randy, you don't hit the ball far.

Tron, you play left handed. It's all you hit the ball far. But there are plenty of people out there who, A, the farther the ball goes, the farther off line it goes. Like, there are plenty of muni golfers out there who can hit the ball, 280 to 300 yards, and they can hit it really far offline.

And that's horrible for pace of play, which is horrible for the T-sheet, which is horrible for how much money it costs to play, which is horrible for the T-sheet, which is horrible for how much money costs to play, which is horrible for how much time it takes to play. Broken windows that you're hitting in the other way. There's just, this is often easier now than it was 20 years ago. With the arms race of like,

you, the golf courses are starting to respond by making the courses tough for moving the T's back and all that, like, I don't think it is. Well, and I think inherently it is. Of course, it's easy. Like the technology makes it easier to hit the golf ball. But also, I think there's certain stuff in the technology that like isn't gonna get stripped away.

When my mom goes out and plays, like her irons are still gonna be super fucking easy to hit, right versus the stuff that she was playing 25 years ago. And she's not really any better now, but at least she can get the ball in the air now. And I don't think that the USG is trying to take that away from her, right?

Now it's why I had such a big problem with JT's comments of like, yeah, it's just so unfair to all the manufacturers that they've done all this research. And- Sell-sale-sale, I believe, was the one. Yeah, and no, man, you know what's really unfair? It's like however many, 10,000 or 20,000 golf courses in the United States, it's really unfair

to make them change every three or four years and push things back. I almost think. That's a ridiculous premise to think. It's selfish to think of, oh, these four, five, whatever the number of equipment companies is that really matter in this equation. Gosh, it really selfish to screw those over versus like every golf course in the world.

Owners, members, people that pay to play them. Superintendents. Like that's, we're better off screwing them over than the equipment companies that have confessed it is R&D. The water, the grass, more fertilizer, all that. It's like, no, like at the end of the day, if these changes lead to more people playing golf in the game not taking as long to play, the OEMs are gonna make just as much money

or like they're gonna sell more golf clubs. Well, and there's ways to differentiate too, right? The OEMs can, we can change the parameters and then let the OEMs, you know, work within those parameters. Yeah, and they're free to develop and, you know, differentiate as they will. I wanna say one thing about the OEMs,

because I think that what's, what gets a little bit lost here is, like, does this suck for them? Yes, like, we should, I think so, because I think if you're a company like titleist, if you have market share at sucks. Yeah, where you do have market share and you have spent a lot of, and this is what JT was getting at, and he's right to

extend. He stands for by titleists. Yes, as his web, as his, once and only many of the people who say this. As his brandl, but I think he's a tailor-made guy. No, I know. But I see that. As far as you think. But does it suck for them to spend X number of dozen years

working on R&D and building market share with a great product and all this stuff? Like, yeah, it does. That sucks. And I think a lot of the pro rollback stuff can sound pretty cold to like it doesn't understand that aspect of it. And I don't think that's the case. Like I do get that that blows.

That's an L for them. At the same time. To start with. At the same time industry regulations change. And like literally, and that's where it's like dude, you got it. This is a massive issue. And like if that's gonna be where you gotta cut.

It's like the swimming suits back in like, like, I'm sure Speedo or whomever put in all the R&D to do those, those, you know, fast suits or whatever, like in the whole Pido. Yeah. And like, and then they all love and like, that's all that money out the door. But man, that sucks. But it's for the good of the sport, you know, and that's where like Kudos to hopefully the USGA and RNA follow through and really feel free to make these changes as stewards of the game. I was going to say, Sally, you were exactly right. You know, think about carbon emissions and cars. And, hey guess what, we're going to change the regulations and And it kind of sucks. You're gonna have to, you know,

do some more investment, different technology, but here's what it is. And, you know. And maybe the OEMs get more, like maybe four styons or, you know, spinning your balls or whatever, like there's gonna be different priorities and different preferences. And that's a good thing, right?

Like it could get back to craftsmanship and accuracy over distance, or like, we don't know what that looks like, but at the end of the day, like, that's a good thing. So get, tell me where the OEMs fit into, and I don't think there's any bias either way here. We are sponsored by an OEM, but that's please separate from this conversation. And credit to them for like letting us.

I don't even have this conversation, because there's other OEMs that would, that would squash it. Call us tomorrow and say you guys are off. Yes. Um, the USGA mission statement, USGA promotes and conserves this true spirit of the game of golf as embodied in its ancient and honorable traditions. It acts in the best interests of the game for the continued enjoyment of those who love and play it.

It does not, that's an end quote. It does not say we act in the best interest of these OEM shareholders. Yeah, very much so. And I think everything we've talked about so far basically pertains to what would be a total rollback, right? We're not even really talking about bifurcation, which would be essentially leave everything as it is right now in the recreational game, but just rollback the pro game, which Rory for the 15th time after his incendiary comment about how stupid the distance

report was validated exactly what the distance report said, which was the golf ball goes way too far in professional golf. And so yeah, if they want to inject more skill into the game and they want to roll it back, for us as professionals, I think it's great because you know, that would really just help the better players. He said something to that effect. That was very well summarized, yes. And so, that's what my head starts to spin a little bit with, you know, who is on the other side of this because it just feels like either a, listen, people like different things and maybe they like different things than I like,

but this camp of people who are like, no, I love watching pros bomb the ball. I love it. You can't take that away from me. I would push back on that and say, like, you don't love it. You love it, you know, with context to how far they're hitting it in relation to each other,

right? Like everybody loves watching Bryson because he hits it 40 past the next guy. It's not because he hits it 110 past you. So she does. It's all relative. But it's all relative. It's all completely relative.

It's Bryson sitting at 310 and he's sitting at 28 past Brian Gay then like that's still relative right there. And it's ripping one bandaid off and then it just becomes wooden bats and aluminum bats. Just like talking relativity to, like I think it, sorry, I think it introduces bifurcation to me just introduces complexities that like, I don't understand the need for.

Well, so what I would say is the need is, your favorite word from last week's podcast, Optics, I think is there's no way the USGA is going to get away scot-free We've seen how good they are at PR and and how much all the pros seem to hate the USGA and all these things There's no way they get away with in my opinion rolling everything back completely without it being painted as You're taking our guns and you're making the game harder and why would you do this? You're gonna kill the game. They're not gonna tell the complete story.

Right, I don't think there's, like we saw what happened with Roy's comments this week. People aren't gonna listen either. Yeah, Roy said two things this week in the same answer. He said the distance report is stupid and it's a massive waste of time. And he also essentially said distance report is totally right about pro golf

and they really should roll the ball back. Which one got all the headlines? It was, this is stupid and this was a waste of time. And I don't think they can trust like that story to be untarnished. And it's just gonna be dead on arrival, you know? It's like they can, I guess they can force it through

and people can listen to him or not. But I think it all comes down to optics, which is where when we first started this and you ask what your position is, I think it's you start to optics, which is where, when we first started this, you ask what your position is. I think it's you start with bifurcation. I think slowly it's messy for 10 years as people are kind of transitioning. Then I think eventually, after 10 years, people realize, like, oh, wait, okay, this isn't really the end of the world.

I guess I can just play a shorter golf course. I think eventually everybody just switches over to the rollback equipment. I say this knowing that like when we went to Royal Melbourne, you guys played Hickories on the East course. I didn't even play the Hickories that day. Watching you guys do it was all the information I needed to understand the benefits of rolling back. So I think a lot of people will have not never even tried to

add that perspective. Yeah. And I know it sounds great because on that day, it sounded crazy to me to play hickories on that day. I didn't want to. One of the best golf courses in the world. I was my attitude and I don't regret it. But my attitude was like, I, it's the top one in the course in the world.

I want to play my own equipment. I don't want to do. There's also varying degrees of like you can go play hickories with a ball out of ball. You can go play hickories with your regular ball and like seeing the difference between those. Exactly. And we're not saying we want to roll back to hickories with your regular ball and like seeing the difference between those two. Exactly. And we're not saying we want to roll back to hickories.

I'm just saying like watching Zach and watch you guys being like, oh, par-fives are supposed to be like this three shot thing. And your minds were just working in a totally different way, but it was engaging and it was fun. And it like golf, I think there's this myth out there that easier golf is more fun. And I don't mean like beating you in the head

super penal golf, but just like, you know, you playing left-handed for a year comes from a place of like, I'm rediscovering just like how to get the ball in the hole and I'm not as much golf swing. And a little bit of a rollback of some kind is gonna move people up closer to ease. It is gonna stop this unsus-

I've never heard anyone come up with a response to like, hey, where the hell are we gonna put these Tees? How are we gonna keep doing this? It's gonna make the game more intimate and more personal. Exactly. And something that I come back to is like, is thinking about the outsized influence of the OEMs in the game. Like, if you consider all the other stakeholders, all the golfers in the world, all the golf core owners, all the superintendents, everything involved with that of how small

that the market cap of the OEMs is in relation to virtually any other industry or any other, you know, even like from a real estate perspective in the game, like how that pales in comparison to some of the other stakeholders, and yet they have the loudest voice at the table. Yeah. And some of that's because they have the most,

you know, the best players in the world. Like the shit that web Simpson is saying is like, oh my god. It's some of the dumbest, most nonsensical stuff I've ever heard. But before we get there, that was one thing I meant to mention on bifurcation is I think that's probably the other

Shacklford touch on that a little bit in the pod, which again, if you haven't listened to the pod with Jeff Shacklford, please go do it, because it's great. It's an advertisement, it's our own. It is. It is. It is. It is.

It is. On the edge of the marvel at our treasures. 17. What was I, the fuck was I talking about? Shackford said something important. Bifurcation. So I think another massive part of why OEMs against bifurcation would be,

they've spent so much time marketing these guys as stars, which I guess kind of goes back to our conversation of 40 minutes ago about how there really are no stars, about using them to sell their golf balls, and that's such a massive, massive, massive part of, you know, their marketing strategy is, oh my gosh, Justin Thomas plays this golf ball. So you should play this golf ball. That's totally fine and makes a ton of sense. But as somebody who plays a lot of golf, watches a lot of pro golf and has played a fair amount of golf with pro golfers.

Holy shit. Me and Justin Thomas don't play the same game. Like, we really don't. And so this whole model of using pros to sell clubs and balls and all this stuff is just, when you take a step back and look at it, it does not really make a lot of sense in the first place. I get it, but it's not like selling a pair of shoes or a clone or a watch or something

that another celebrity would sell, because it's not the same game. It's not the same game, but it's powerful, right? And that when it's destructive because it leads to all of, it leads to all this stuff. You know what I mean? It does, but I think like, I think to, it's same with like when you're in the market, I think about this stuff. You know what I mean? It does, but I think like, I think to, same with like when you're in the market,

I think about this too. When I was in the market for car insurance, when I first got a car, I knew of a few brands that are most prominent on TV, like all the things I watched, I went with a particular one, no free ads, of course. You went with farmers because they're Ricky. I went with the guy that had an animal on there.

I was like, oh, I recognize that name, right? So there's something to be in front of. I'll stay for life. A lot of golf fans with your brand. Totally. Out with tour players. The hats, all of that hasn't effect on people more so. To your point, it's not like so and so plays ball one,

I need to play ball one because I'm gonna be as good or that's gonna help me a lot. But it is kind of like a, oh, Callaway has this many options, Taylormate has this many options, title is has this many options, it does have an effect. Of course.

Yeah, but I guess my point would be that effect would still be there if, if event, if it could be suffricated. You know what I mean? If, wouldn't it still be there with a total rollback? Like why can't they still sell? I think it's their limited flight goal.

Or the total rollback. Yeah. That's why they would be more in on total rollback than they would buy for Cation, right? Cause they lose that angle. Yeah, I think there's gonna be a natural buy for Cation. Like I, I don't know how they plan to do this, but if I were guessing or if I were put in charge of it,

I just have to pick a year out in the future, maybe five years from now and tell the OEM's every club, every ball that's manufactured beginning this date has to conform to our new rules. And so in that interim period, you can still sell this old equipment. And then, if I, nobody's gonna, if I show up to the course in 10 years with my old,

like, you know, further flying clubs and ball, like nobody's gonna tell me I can't play, like you could go on playing your clubs forever. It just, if you want new clubs, they're gonna be under these new regulations and standards. So I don't know. That's how I look at it. I think there's going to be a natural bifurcation period just where you got to switch everything

over, telling OEMs to continue manufacturing and selling two different kinds of clubs and two different kinds of golf hours. The kind of already are though is silly a little bit. But what happened with the grooves? The grooves of clubs changes. No, but he cared. And everyone pointed out Like the grooves and clubs changes, nobody cared. And everyone just, no, no, amateur golfers cared. Right, you had to upgrade your equipment

to not have square grooves anymore. But like, I'm not like, we've had a few guys in the DMs this week. Like, what about me, man? What about like, I'm a really top flight amateur player or like, I'm a club pro. Like, do I have to go buy new stuff? Like, yeah, do you, like, you buy new stuff every year anyway. Like, who gives a shit? And I, listen, that's a very legitimate plight of,

you know, I get that. But it's such a small, new system of the puzzle. Yeah, I don't know that we can really let ourselves be totally just, like that's not what the decision hinges on. Like we solve for that, you know, once you figure out what the right decision is, but that's not, you know, we don't hold up like,

and so many, honestly, some OEMs gonna figure out like a cash for clunkers program. And like gain loyalty through, hey, we'll exchange your old clubs for new ones, you know, at a severely discounted price. Like there's things you can do. It's just, and so much of this idea, it hinders on like the assumption

that there aren't rules in place on distance and specifications and things. No one's ever even thought of the driver distance, like the length of a driver and been like 48 inches. Is that too long or too short? Literally until very recently, that conversation I've never heard that had. And so what was that, what Shaqfur was saying

about the T-length? He was out on the pod. I remember that from elsewhere where Azinger was all over the T length when we went to he was when we saw that there's that the big C are large. Yeah T length is okay, but like three woods No, but I think his point was I think it was on the pod. Maybe I'd listen to too many other pods this week But he was asking David Fay about how did you guys come up with the limit of four inches,

because Bryson uses a four inch T, which is the max, I believe, and David Faye, I think, was just kind of saying like, oh, well, yeah, I don't know, we just kind of, it's kind of like randomly just picked that, and that was the limit. And then eventually someone bumps up to the limit, right? And Ed's, I don't know, I think it's this fear

of going backwards, I guess. There's a certain sense of going back to how will these guys ever adjust? How will they ever just, first of all, they're changing clubs all the time. And secondly, like, Clayts always points this out on Twitter. Michael Clayton basically says, like there was a different size ball.

I know. In the rest of the world, and then like the US switch, and the rest of the world had to switch. And the fact that there's so little understanding of golf history, and then I'm sure somebody will use that against this and say, well, yeah, old Tom Morris was bitching about, this kind of ball back 100 years ago,

but at some point, you are running up against these natural, physical limitations. Yeah, that's, I think the biggest difference is, we're now getting up against the realities of like, all right, who's gonna take care of all this land? Who's gonna build these teas? Who's gonna move these bunkers? Who's going to make sure that it's cool

that every round of golf takes five hours? That's just, doesn't resonate with a lot of people. I don't know why. And I'm kind of like, I feel very preachy when I'm like trying to get it through people's heads that like that is not a free thing. And you are paying for it, whether you realize it or not. And I know a lot of people have the attitude of,

you know, why do I care about the 0.1% of golfers? Like I care about my game. It bleeds into the regular game in so, so, so many ways. So instead of like listening to what web Simpson has to say about rollback, like go talk to you, the super incendent at your club. Yeah. And see what he has to say.

Or she, like I'm sure that they might have a little bit different take than web. Yeah. Also, I forget, I don't know if it was somebody on Twitter, might have been either deep fried egg or one of the boys was talking about web's solution that this is a golf course, architecture issue and you need quote more dog legs and more trees. They were saying, you know, this isn't the Sims where you just like drop in these 100-foot trees.

Like that's not how this fucking works, man. That's the national can do that. Yes. Nobody else. But all these people are like, yeah, you just 100 foot trees. Like that's not how this fucking works man. That's the national can do that. Yes, nobody else. But all these people are like, yeah, you just need more trees. It's like, oh, that's gonna take 70 years. And then it gets tougher to grow turf if you have all these trees.

Not to mention, these guys play their four days a year who's playing the other, you know, 300 plus days a year at these golf courses. It's like regular people who are clanking around in the trees all day. Like that's not, whoa, that is not the fix. It, the idea, like all the people that want to address this through course setup, like I don't even want to have the debate

anymore about like why thick rough is bad for accurate hitters. Like, it was short, accurate hitters anymore. Like that is so, we are not talking about course setup. And you cannot address with how far this ball goes, what we're talking about, you cannot address hitters anymore. Like, that is so, we are not talking about course setup and you cannot address with how far this ball goes. What we're talking about, you cannot address the course setup. I know so many people out there think, just grow the wrap up, narrow it, punish the long drive hitters that are always in the shit.

It benefits the long drivers. I know it's really hard to wrap your head around that. I'm so, so do the trees in the dog like this. I'm still struggling with like wrapping my head around it too, but it's just how it is and we're not talking about Addressing this shit through core setup because you can't do it evidently webs never played links golf either Yeah, cuz there's no fucking trees over there Yeah, it's a tough tough look

I and you know a lot of people have clamored that we need to have somebody on that is not against, that is opposite side of the debate because it's a bit of an echo chamber in here. And I hear you there, we've had a conversation, I had one Keith Mitchell in December. Just a few Mitchell, it wasn't one of that. It was one of the, some of the best points. It was a decent perspective, a very good perspective.

I thought from a Torpro that, you know, made some good points in there. We had a Randall Champlain, it was on the podcast in December of 2018, it was two parts. A lot of people are calling for him to come back on. It will be a repeat of the same conversation. So go find that one if you want to hear somebody on the other side of the debate. I don't know. Brandel seems to seem to completely do a 180 on this. About about every two and a half years. And it's easy to make fun of that. But like I also

want to encourage people to like open mind. You can change your mind on this. You don't have to dig your heels in. I was not pro-roll black rollback when we started no laying up. Not even, I didn't understand it. I'm in this totally same boat. I thought that was a great point that you made on the pod last week, which was, I was in the same exact boat.

Like I totally didn't get it. I thought it was awesome that guys were nuking nine irons, 200 yards. I thought that's just, that's so cool. That's human progress, baby. Yeah, and then yeah, you started thinking about what that means and it makes your head spin a little bit when you actually read into it a lot, lot, lot more,

which I think all of us have kind of done over the last 60 years or so. And I floated on Twitter this week just because I was curious as to, you know, if other people had, like, and I think 58% of people had said they have, their opinion has changed or evolved over the years. So I was kind of like, why are we having this debate?

Like people even moving sides at all and we're just kind of screaming at each other and no one's really listening to the other side. I was pleasantly surprised that a lot of people, you know, maybe they're lying in the answer, but I said that they had moved, their opinion has shifted over the years. So I think there's just a lot of bad faith arguments

out there. There's a lot of like, there's a lot of propping up boogie men that either don't exist or don't apply. And there's a lot of just, you know, smoke screens and stuff, which, which, listen to that. It's a bummer, but I would say like, read the actual, the USJ made everything public to everybody.

Like read it and think critically about what, what they're actually saying out there. Best argument against it in my opinion, begins changing anything in the pro game, I think is it's not gonna be that much more interesting to casual viewers if the ball goes less distance. Like it is not, I am not gonna end quote to the argument. I'm not gonna sit here and tell you ratings are going to fly through the roof if they limit

how far the ball goes. Do I think it can contribute to long term health of the game? 100%. I don't think it is a argument I want to stand on that like, hey, all we got to do is change this and everyone's going to love golf. Like, I don't think that's the stance. That's why I thought it was interesting that an important that they included the bullet point about spin in there too.

100%. That's more concerned about spin than I am distance because I think those two things are... I think they gotta go hand in hand though, right? The more it spins, yeah, I mean, if Bryce wants to do this, there's no way he's launching it as high as he is without it spinning. And that's, I'm sure we've beat this to death

on this podcast, but that's the crux of the issue, right? Is that there's so many guys swinging as hard as they possibly can because the penalty for missing, can you still miss the ball as we saw with Jordan's beat this week? Yes, you can still miss it, but there's so many less big misses that happen on a week-to-week basis, which keeps people from making double bogies and it keeps the leaderboards, I think a little more boring than they would be if the best players were rewarded for how good a drivers they are. Web is a great driver to golf ball.

Rory is a great driver to golf ball, but they hit it to very different lengths, right? And that's where it's like, if you make it spin more, I feel like you reward Rory and Web, maybe not equally because hitting it farther is better, but you reward Rory and Web, maybe not equally, because hitting it farther is better, but you reward them at the same time for a skill that they should be rewarded for while also not making that the only skill that matters in the game of golf, which is kind of what's going on right now. And also, managing your trajectory, managing your spin rates.

I think that's something that's been lost a little bit more, and then it gets back to firmer greens and all that. But I think the most demoralizing thing for me, when watching golf is when it's coming down the stretch and there's two holes left and you know that a guy can't make a bogey or can't mess up. Like it's just like... Like Harbor Town this year.

Yeah, it's just like, oh my god, like it's just like, it's already decided. Yeah, I think, again, important, it might be probably preaching to the choir if you made it two hours into this podcast, but it's not that we're trying to, it's just de-emphasizing the prerequisite of driving distance. It is a huge factor in this, right?

It is not, Jeff said some things on the pod about this has kind of taken skill out of the game. And I think a lot of people kind of misunderstand what that means. Well, I can still hit a pretty far offline. Well, Jeff, you should come play with me sometime. Are we saying these guys aren't skilled? It's like, no, it's like, it's like,

just prioritizing a certain skill. Exactly, exactly. And driver wedge is honest. Like, I tried to engage some people on Twitter this week with like serious questions and not being a smart-ass, but do you enjoy driver wedge? And if you say yes, I don't, not judging you there, I don't necessarily enjoy that.

Do I enjoy watching that every week? No, I don't think, I think that's a lot of the reason we have a lot of the discussions we have, is like there's not a lot of variety at times. And yeah, if you enjoy watching driver wedge, then you probably think we're silly for discussing it this far, but there's a lot of issues to come with Driver Wedge. Couple of ideas I saw floated this week. Take like four to six clubs out of the bag for pros. I've heard so many ridiculous ideas.

I've heard so many ridiculous ideas. And there's another one, much like Formula One where they do a hard, a medium and a soft tire, do you like a super spinny ball, a medium spin ball, and like a freaking knuckle ball? That would be awesome. That's what people have claimed. Based on tournament, like tournament to tournament you're saying, is gonna happen at Augusta someday,

they're just gonna be like, here are six options to choose from, go ahead, this is your tournament ball. I guess I, I don't know, I'm sure we're getting close to wrapping up here, but I would say like the biggest takeaway, at least for me, is you should not bear your head in the sand here and just pretend like everything's going to just keep going forever without changing. It's going to change. It has to.

That was Mike Davis' entire thing was like, dude, if you're not, if you don't, if you look at this data and you don't see the massive problem, you're either like bearing your head in the sand or you have some sort of bias here. And that's very, very, very strong words from the head of the organ, outgoing head of the organization. But it's like, something's gonna happen. So I would, brand of it, full monkey meme at that.

I took that first one. I would say like get ready for something to happen. Yes. And so we can debate what that is and what makes the most sense and the ripple effects of everything, but something's gonna happen. Can we talk about the real issues now? Aaron Wise is putting.

Amely Aaron Wise is putting. Oh my God. This is gonna to be the last I fully the last day we cover here. But Aaron Wise had some things happen this past week. He hit the par five third hole in two on Thursday and made a double bogey for those counting at home. That's five puts. Also on Thursday, he hit to 45 feet on the fifth hole, par four, and made double. That's four puts. Then on Saturday, he hit to 33 feet on 16 and made double. That's four puts. I don't know what's going on there. That's, that's just you don't see pros five putting and he had, he had a put two inches at one point from two

feet. I don't know if that's a lip out that came right back at him or whatnot, but some of the shot tracker was jarring. So, not good. Couple of quick ones. Sam Burns keeps going backwards on Saturdays. I hate that. Good to see him back in the mix, but wanna see, see a little bit more consistency

on the weekends. I didn't realize Ram and his wife are expecting. She's with child. Ram getting new perspective. Plus. Hi. She's with child. Rom getting new perspective. Plus. Hi. Plus managing his emotions. It's gonna be big.

I just wanna point out real quick. Aaron Wise lost 10.2 strokes, putting for the week, which is over four shots worse than next guy. And Sandbirds gained over 10 shots on the green. They had over 20 stroke differential on the green. What did Wise finish up for the week? Dead last, okay.

That's made the cut. 66. Okay, I want to give a shout to K H Lee. Good to see him in the next video. That was great. Well, I like his game. And I want to give a shout to Kessler Karein for getting in some asses on Instagram.

He posted a great meme. Great meme that included us in it with a Darth Vader. Somebody else made it. Some, one of the Boko Haram accounts. But that was great. I had a great laugh all of that. Like, that is the villain. Like, you got to play that role. And I thought, I talked to a few people at Tor HQ's

where you can say, man, like, lay office a little bit. Like, Justin Reed is threatening us with lawsuits. Anytime we do anything. That's amazing. They're like, they're, they're scared shitless of her. She's an alpha. Big, big lady McBeth vibe. Yeah.

All right, we did it two weeks in a row, over two hours. Thank you boys. Thank you everyone for coming. Five more things about the distance. Now let's please, I gotta go pee. Let's go watch the Super Bowl. Shout out to Cooper Bradley. Yeah, the Kingegan Bradley's...

That's gonna be interesting. That's that develops. That's an interesting strategy there. But thanks everybody for tuning in and listening all the way through. And we'll see you on the other side. Cheers. Be the right club today. Yes!

That's better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most! Expect anything different.