No Laying Up - Golf Podcast - NLU Podcast, Episode 799: Netflix Full Swing Season 2 Deep Dive

Episode Date: March 6, 2024

As the second season of Full Swing gets released on Netflix this week, Soly, DJ and Neil hand out their reviews of the sophomore installment for the series. We touch on the episodes that we liked, the ones that were duds, improvements from season one, how we view the 2023 Ryder Cup differently in light of the final episodes, and the stories we wish would have been a part of the retelling of the 2023 year in professional golf. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The right club. Be the right club today. Yes! I mean, that's better than most. How about him? That is better than most. Better than most! Better than most. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the no laying up podcast. Sally here ready for the season two recap of full swing.

If you missed season one, we also did a recap of that probably a little longer than we'll go today. This is of course the Netflix series about the world of men's professional golf. Joining me are film critic himself fresh off the Oscars podcast. Mr. DJ pie. Hello, pie man. Hello guys. Happy to report. We kept the Oscars pod under four and a half hours. I'm confident we can do the same today. Joining us as well. Mr. Icarito. He said he was done with content for a while. He's on, as he's on baby watch, but we learned him back in to talk a little bit of Netflix. Hello, Neil.

A little Sierpa Co reference there. I love that. You know, I consider myself a bit of a, a critic as well, Mr. Pie. So happy to be back. Happy to see you. This episode is brought to you by our friends at rowback active where you all know rowback best fit, best feel they are fresh off new stocks of our favorite polo's hoodies and q zips trust us when we say there is not better gear for when you're playing golf or just out and about the fit the feel the quality it is all perfect the performance polo's fantastic material is moisture wicking it's got great stretch the collar is crisp it does not lose its shape they fit way better

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Q zips hoodies and more with code NLU get ready for the golf season with rowback. D.H. I'm going to start a subtle dog logo tracker, maybe a weekly tracker. Wow. Might update the group, maybe a slack, a slack update for people. How many, how many subtle dog logo tracker, maybe a weekly tracker. Wow. Might update the group. Maybe a slack, a slack update for people. How many, how many subtle dog? I can see him. I just can't go anywhere. Yeah. I'm with you. All right. DJ, I'm going to throw it to you first. You know, we had, we had a lot to say about season one of full swing. Yeah. I want you to just, if you can just kick things off a little bit, tell us how it cut works.

Sure. Well, you know, tell us how it cut works. Sure. Uh, well, you know, it depends if it's a designated event or not designated event. We've got all this kind of, no, uh, guys, I'll start big picture thoughts. Uh, I was, I wouldn't say I, I liked or disliked the first season. I think I was, I was pretty neutral on it. It was, it was kind of, kind of meh for me. Some, some, some highlights and some, some peaks and some valleys. I really, really enjoyed season two a lot for a lot of the reasons that we're going to get into. Uh, it felt good to, to really like something about pro golf. I'm sure you guys felt a little bit of that as well. It feels like there's been a lot of negativity and cynicism going on.

And I got through those first two episodes of season two, which all kind of, you know, dive into, uh, the into the goings on of live and June 6th and all that stuff. And I kind of thought they knocked those first two episodes out of the park in a lot of ways. They made it, they really distilled it down to what happened and what you needed to know and how people felt about it. Felt like they had cameras everywhere. It truly felt like there was, you know, I think we've said this on the podcast a million times, but it's like kind of the, the big day, the day that we'll live in infamy for, for golf. And I truly felt like they captured it on video forever in a way that, you know,

I'm really glad exists. And, and so from there, once you got deeper into the season, you know, I think if I had written my review after episode two, probably would have been 12 out of 10. Can't believe it. I love it. They rocked it. I think some of the later episodes maybe reverted back to some of what I didn't like as much from season one, but then we had two, you know, fun in depth

looks at the Ryder Cup as well. And so overall, it was kind of like a, if you're a golf fan, you definitely need to watch this series, which is, which is, you know, I don't think you can ask for too much more than that. So I was, I was really pumped. Neil, how, what was your overall impression? I would say I echo some of that. I, I worry that I'll sound like the, uh, the instructor from whiplash of like more, I need more, you know, more, more, more, more, like, I felt like every time we, you know, I agree with you, episode one and two, I felt like we're had the most depth to them.

Some of the stuff with Rory in the locker room. And like, you know, I can't, I might need to do a full, like, full rebuild, you know, that kind of stuff is like, man, I can't believe we got that on camera. But then I felt like the depth started to trail off after pretty much after that third episode with Joel and Wyndham, which I thought that was, there was some good stuff in that one too. To me, it's a good, I have to view this through the, this isn't really made for me lens. Like I, season one, I was like, man, this is like, this isn't real was my reaction to season one.

And talking to my friends that don't like golf, they were dying to talk to me about it. Like, I loved it, man. I loved it. And I'm like, okay, whoa, I totally missing the mark here because I don't feel that way. But it kind of, you know, altered my perspective of it. So I have to watch it in a way that I watch, you know, I'm watching at the F one new season is out, the drive to survive and breakpoint. I've enjoyed watching both of those.

Those are sports I follow very casually. And to me, those are good, almost yearbooks for, Hey, I didn't really watch ton of F1 last year. Like what, what actually happened? Oh yeah, I think Max, well, yeah, he probably wins this, this, but you know, I didn't realize all the stuff with, with stroll and he broke his wrist, but I didn't realize all the stuff was stroll and he broke his wrist. Some of that.

So if you're a casual fan, I think this is probably doing a good job. So maybe it's up to them not to get stuck in the middle of going way too deep on stuff that somebody like me wants to see and make sure it sees kind of surface level of an introduction to like, here are some people, when you watch the masters, you can watch Wyndham Clark and you'd be like, oh, I remember that guy from full swing, right? Cause he's probably a golfer that is on the rise that not a lot of casual fans know. And now they, I feel like they did a good job profiling him specifically. You know, I was reading when I got into formula one through drive to survive, like a lot of

us did. I remember like reading about, I listened to a podcast, a Formula one podcast and I was listening to them like critique drive to survive. And they were, you know, kind of a little hard on it. And I was like, you fucking losers. Like, come on, man. Look how many new fans are coming in and realizing as I combed through like the golf related stuff.

I was like, oh, I'm totally that loser of, you know, not see, it can be guilty of not seeing the big picture of all of this yet at the same time. There's a lot to unpack on that because I think it, uh, go ahead. Well, I, one thing I would add that I think the reason I felt that episodes four through eight, uh, like trailed for me or, or kind of, I was losing interest is it was way too much off the course stuff this season compared to like, I felt like we were getting the same clips from Augusta of Rory and the

like the same shots basically instead of it was a lot of the Zach Johnson captain stuff on the phone. You know, Tom Kim at the photo shoots, I don't I don't need that stuff. Like that's, you know, but I guess that's a that's a formula that they're following from F one because you see that and drive to survive a lot of these guys doing activities outside of the sport to get to know them. But some of that stuff is, uh, like that's my least favorite part of the show. And, and, and that stuff ramped up a lot more in the back half of the season. I think what's really hard, and this was kind of like the big takeaway from season one for me is I kind of like joked. I think I've titled my written piece

about it, like growing the game versus showing the game. And a lot of it was like, when you get into that off course stuff with the golf, golf, golf in general is like, it's just so much less interesting to watch than F one and F one, you can always fall back on cars going 200 miles an hour and, you know, whip and pass the camera and all these like really dramatic shots. Whereas with golf, it's like, it is so easy to get stuck in the middle between, oh, here comes a big montage from like the Zura classic is when you just start to fall asleep in your, your chair, unless you're really doing it the right way.

And so it, it is easy to get stuck in the middle. I think between like, we're going to go to the photo shoot with this guy and we're going to try to build this profile of him off the course, but a lot of these guys are just like,'re really boring and then the You know and you don't really have the cars on the other end to like kind of wake up the audience So that's where in a way. I almost enjoyed the on course stuff like the most and I think sounds like you're you're kind of there with Me Neil is like so I know we were talking about it And you you weren't big on like the Fitzpatrick's episode, but like Alex Fitzpatrick

I missed like so much of that round that he played at the British open and watching him like build it and go shot for shot. I was like, fuck yeah, this is awesome. Like I'm, I'm like, I have no idea what happens. This is, this is great. I really enjoyed when they actually would kind of sink in and show, you know, just like show the golf man, show the golf, show more golf shots. Well, a critique I had of season one and kind of an overarching thing I left it

with, I think was if you want, I don't want this show to be, uh, if you do the formulaic approach to say, here's what worked on drive to survive, let's do that in golf at best. It can only be 60% as good as the original, right? If you just take the same approach and go this way, right? And they went heavy in season one on like character pieces. Everything had to be around these characters. The chronology of the season made no sense. Tulsa became the center of the golf universe because how many times they came back to it. And it just became like, hey,

you're going to run out of characters really quickly if you, if this is your approach. And if you do treat it more like a yearbook of like look back at the year in golf I think that is way more interesting and I think that'd be more interesting for the casuals and you can tell individual stories within those Uh kind of ways of looking at it. That's why episodes one and two I thought were like easily by far the best of the whole series was like here's what's going on were like easily by far the best of the whole series was like, here's what's going on.

And we're going to do that through the lens of like Rory and DJ and Brooks and the characters involved in this. And we're going to dive in, like we're going to get into the depths of this. And they nailed that man. Like that was such a great start to the year. Compare that with season one opening disaster of JT Spieth where we all saw that one. Like, Oh my God, what is this show going to be? The season did get a lot better. Uh, past that better past that that episode, but it's just start so strong a really dramatic like hype sequence to kick things off like a good hook in there and starting with you know, Rory and everything he's working on and

It just felt like the proper jumping off point to Chronicle, you know this year and golf and again Like I think that works for the mass public outside of the sporting world. Like this is on the homepage of Netflix. Like you need to tell the drama story. I mean, I think back to Chris Ryan's line when we did this pod last year was like, does it pass the, what if I told you story? Like, what if I told you Jordan Spieth and Justin Thomas were good friends? No, that doesn't pass the test. But like, what if I told you like the golf world is in complete turmoil and one of the game's best major champions has been heavily distracted by all this off course stuff. Oh, and he's getting bypassed by the other great major champion, uh, right

in front of him here in 2023. Boom. There's your hook. Go. That's what worked in this opener. Yeah. I totally agree. And I think what, I think what's really interesting about the yearbook approach too is it does allow it in a positive way, I think, or an interesting way kind of flattens the year. And I think for us,, blah, blah. And when you look back and you zoom out and you just kind of see like the big building blocks, it's crazy how it can change perception. I don't know how you guys felt after those first two episodes. But like, if I was a very, very, very casual fan who's not following all the ins and outs and doesn't give a shit about, you know, the legacy of the farmer's insurance open and all of these things, it's pretty hard to watch those first two and just be like, man, like, yeah, why don't you just like take the money?

This is like, this is kind of silly, you know, like you should have, oh yeah, it should just take the money, man. You look like an idiot. They were a little light on explaining the whole live thing and what the controversy is. But that's what I mean. Once you distill it down, it is like, it's like, all right, we can, we can take 45 minutes to try to like explain all the nuance or we can just be like well This guy got this much money this guy didn't I don't know you'd be the judge And that's they're all gonna meet up and play at these four events. Yeah, so wait, it seems like those are the only ones that matter Which is a whole other thing and one thing I want to shout out

I think the the filmmakers is like it can't be easy to It couldn't have been all that easy with all the PGA tours buy in and support and, you know, kind of like gasoline that they've poured on this thing. It can't be easy to ignore the PGA tours as much as they did in this. Like this thing was only about the majors and the Ryder Cup. And that's like really interesting because I think it really reflects how fans feel. You know, the Ricky episode was like, no, here's him choking away or not choking away, but here's, here's him kicking away LACC. And then, oh yeah, by the way, one Detroit, like here's a little sprinkling of that. It wasn't like the bad version of this is like,

yeah, he lost at LACC, but what if I told you a real story is he came back in one Detroit and they didn't do that, which is like, had to be kind of, kind of tempting with all the PJ Tor involved in it. It almost felt like they were intentionally going the opposite direction. Like, listen, could I have used somebody sitting in an opposite chair, challenging some of the things that Claude Harmon said? Sure. I think I could have because he came in blazing with, uh, one of the great straw

men of our times, I believe this was would qualify as I was told Steph Curry couldn't shoot. Was everybody kept saying it Augusta the worst thing that can happen to professional golf is is if a live player wins a major. I believe this podcast said the worst thing that can happen to Scotty Schaeffler. You know, I would throw a flag on that one. So yeah, that was I would say Harmon. Harmon, definitely a lunatic, but also like if he was my coach, like, you know, Oh, for sure. Almost like football, cause I want to play for that guy.

Yeah, you are. We are getting fucked. That's right. Yeah. I didn't think about it that way. And his guys riled up, motivated. You guys want to go go episode by episode here or a kind of start big, big picture winners. Let's do winners and losers. Try it. Try it in true format. Solid. Let's disclaim this upfront. Like we are, we are working within the realm of, of the editors, right? And how this is edited. And, you know, we've talked to a few

players involved with some of this stuff and like some of it's a lukewarm reaction, I'd say, from some several players in terms of like how the story is constructed, right? You can do a year's worth of interviews and they're going to decide what they want to hone in on. And that's going to be what you're known as to 50 million people, right? And so I'm hesitant to like, I want to lean a lot more on all that we know outside of this series on these guys. I don't, I think Keegan was a massive winner from this season, yet at the same time,

like conveniently ignoring a lot of the reasons why Keegan wasn't selected and why a lot of people don't like Keegan is also going to weigh heavier on my mind than like this reality television kind of edit, right? So I think the reaction is going to be very strong for people to be huge Keegan fans on the backs of this. I'm not saying not to. I'm just saying like it is like clearly structured this way to display that fact. And Keegan handled the Ryder Cup stuff unbelievably. And I do give him a ton of credit for that. It's not a slide on him. That's what to say. Like I am more of a fan of Keegan after seeing that reaction.

We'll get to that episode, but he was a big winner in this and all of me. I know who your answer is going to be DJ because you were super, super amped when you saw Brooks hanging out with, with Jake Paul and literally in our slack. He goes, I can't tell you how cool Brooks looks. And I hadn't seen the episode yet and I flip it on and he's on the Jake Paul podcast. And I was like, Oh God, okay. DJ is a big Jake Paul guy. That's exactly right. I've been doing a lot of self exploration up here in the depths of winter. And I discovered that pod, just loving what those guys are

doing. Yeah. Sure. I'm with you on all those disclaimers, but also I would, I would challenge that or, or counter that with like, to the millions of people that we're talking about who are just coming to this like, yeah, that shit doesn't matter. So big picture, like big picture winners and losers. I, I think you, you mentioned Keegan already. I'm, I'm right there with you. I think he's up there. I do think Brooks is, Brooks comes out of this, like looking really good.

Jake Paul stuff aside. I thought that was a little cringy and strange, but I feel like he, you know, again, when I come back to like the flattening of, of everything, and if you throw a lot of the nuance out, out the door, it's, it's hard to watch these first two seasons and not be like, man, that guy kind of just like played it, played it right. I don't know. He was like really struggling with where his game was. He didn't know if he was going to be able to come back. He had the kind of vulnerability

moments in the first season that I made me like him more than I think I ever had in the past. And then not only does he like get, you know, a truckload of money, he also like goes out and does the thing that Rory is clearly so obsessed with and thinking about it every moment of every day. It was like, Oh yeah, no. And then I did come back and win another major. Oh, I guess that does put me ahead of Rory. Yeah. I guess I am the best player in my generation.

Huh. How about that? And I'm, and I'm just, you know, in the sim with, uh, with the boys, you know, crushing Celsiuses or whatever. Can I, can I just double click on one thing here? Here's what I cannot have. Prime, not Celsius. Yeah. Sure. I cannot have Jenna Sims, Kepka coming on and making fun of the stereotype of live players being washed up. Like you guys were the ones saying

this in season one. You were the ones you put this on season one. You were the ones that convinced me like, Oh, Brooks is fucked here. Like this was not a live creation or a of any kind. This was like, you guys came out here and put on display like how, but again, that's where some of the editing can be like, dude, that might have been like a one week thing where he's like really struggling. And then by the end of the season, he's healthy and feeling a lot better, but Brooks had a bit of a Hamlet, you know, like he's rotten in Denmark and season one. He's got the frosted tips, you know, he's seeing ghosts and then all of a sudden he comes back and, and takes the throne.

Unbelievable. It's just Shakespearean stuff on Netflix. Do you disagree on any of the Brooks stuff? I feel like he comes out of the last two years looking the best. Yeah. I think, you know, casual fan at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at, at winning, yes. Winning solves everything. Right. So that, that win does a lot.

I found it to be pretty cringy in season one. All the kind of woe is me stuff in, in my mansion. And, you know, just like tuning out my wife and like, I didn't find him to be like any type of, I wasn't like, Oh, I'm dying to trade places with Brooks Kepka. But you know, winning, winning is an antidote to a lot of things. So yes, it looks great. But on that from season one, this, that was where I was so disappointed with him joining live was like, I've always painted Brooks as this super hyper competitive dude, right?

Like that's what I really respected about him personally. Do I think he's like an aspirational person? No, of course not. But like he was the dude, he was like the killer of the generation and to watch him kind of going through all that and see how much that was like affecting him at home and then bail on the PGA tour to go to live was just like, dude, what? These two things are not working together. And of course, you find out very shortly after that he is expressing some regret to other players and wants, you know, would potentially want out of it if he could. But, you know, he has to pretend like he's made the, made the right decision. Uh, it, it, that was,

that was part of the story as well. Right. And, um, I don't know. That's why his deflection bothered me. I think where, again, I don't want to talk it up both sides of our mouth is like, we can't also say like, Oh God, none of these PGA tour events matter. The majors are the only thing. And then, and then critique that decision because he fucking did go out and win a major still like he, he totally. So the, but we can all agree, like the PJ tour events mattered a lot more

when everyone played on that tour, right? Like that was like what bridge the gap between golf cannot, is not going to survive as a four week a year sport, right? And the, for all the criticisms you of the PJ Tour, almost all of them probably valid. It gave us a lot to be engaged with and to talk about and to it did matter. Like if I always think back on like speed and read in that playoff at the Valspar, like, dude, that fucking mattered. Like don't I cannot pretend like that did not matter. And now all the events really don't. And I get like the tides had changed enough, like, you know, a bunch of dudes had already left and, you know, probably

more were coming that, you know, neither tour was really going to matter. Might as well get the bag. I get that. But it just seems counter to Brooks's competitive nature. And I don't know. Well, he says it himself in this season. He's like, yeah, the majors are all that matters. I think he literally, that's like a quote from him. So he's, it's funny to me, like how does that make the powers that be at live feel when they watch this? Right.

You know, it's like biting the hand that feeds a little bit. But I mean, listen, a credit I will give Brooks is like, if that, he definitely made the right decision. If that's all he cares about and he has access to majors, now he does for the next five, 10 years, whatever, then, you know, good for him. And the rest of the year is just kind of a time off and prep for those four events. That's, that's a, that's a strategy that he, that is, that is going to pay off for him. Let me put it that way. Yeah. Yeah. And that's where I think, Sally, I'm like, I'm obviously with you. That's a strategy that he is going to pay off for him. Let me put it that way.

Yeah. And that's where I think, Sally, I'm obviously with you. Like I would have preferred that he stayed. I love watching the Valsbar. I love watching the Reed and Spieth playoff. I know all of those events are worse now because of these guys being gone. Like I'm obviously on the same page.

But I think there is something about so expressly coming out and just saying, like, these are the only four things I care about. This is it. This is all that matters. And then coming out and being in the last group in the Masters and going into the PGA and just being like, oh no, all you guys are trying to peak at these times, like come and catch me is, I don't know how that can't be somebody's read after watching Brooks the last couple of years. And I think that's why KVV and I were talking, kind of going back and forth, writing this, this thing about Anthony Kim and like, which players moved the needle and why? And I think Brooks has kind of forced himself into being one of those

guys for a, like generation younger than ours, because we were so connected to Rory and Spieth and some of those guys like coming up as, as Brooks was kind of toiling and, you know, the challenge tour and playing the, the Euro tour and kind of like just so much slower of an ascent. And I think he's kind of caught up with a lot of people who have just kind of looked at the scoreboard as they're, you know, as they're younger and getting into golf. And I don't know, Brooks has gotten infinitely more interesting to me the last couple of years.

Can I propose two other winners? I had Keegan on my list. He was definitely a sympathetic character and seems like a genuine dude. So I was like, he's definitely a winner of the season. I would put Ricky on that list. I thought Ricky had a pretty good profile. I still wish we got a little bit more out of Ricky in some of those interviews, but there's definitely like, uh, you know, everybody loves to come back.

And I thought they did a pretty good job profiling his kind of comeback from, from some tough golf. And then I think Wyndham Clark, I mentioned it earlier, but I think he's a big winner here. Probably the only guy that shows any authentic vulnerability. I feel like Joel Damon may have, I don't wanna say he got done dirty, but it feels like every clip of him is just saying, fuck this, fuck that, after a bad swing. It feels like maybe he got done a little dirty in the edit to fit that episode storyline. But I give Wyndham a lot of credit.

It feels like he was like, hey, I'm I am an open book here, whatever you guys want. You guys want to see me meditate, like come on through and the stuff with the sports psychologist for me as an avid golf fan, I'm like, I would like to like to explore that space a little bit more. That's good stuff. I thought that whole episode as a whole was again, another way of like doing the character story, like side by side of like two guys that both experienced trauma in their lives, both losing their mothers at young age and

like comparing it how, you know, maybe a little made for TV in there, but comparing it to how they're handling it currently in the different approaches was, it was good TV. It was, that was, that was really good TV. Any other winners? You guys, am I missing anybody? I'll throw, you know, honorable mention to my guy team Rose. I actually, you know, a lot of, a lot of cringy stuff in there as well. And him working out and him making pin cups and him making his lot. Sure. Like all that stuff's awful.

But I still, you know what carries a day for me is like, it's so fucking cheesy, but the him making that putt on 18 on, was that on Friday or Saturday? That was Friday. Uh, to, to, was that to really just like put the nail in the coffin of team USA split the match and he looks and like points at every one of his teammates is like, you lads here by the green. That's good stuff, man.

That's good stuff. I, you know, my, my thoughts on team rows are well documented, but it's, uh, I came away from that being like, ah, what a, what a harmless kind of cheeseball. You know, I know he's, he's, he's like authentically smug. Yeah. You know, it's like, you can't really help himself, but it's like, all right, that's really is him.

So you're not hearing anybody, man. Who can't, he's just, he's just like the prototypical chap and, and, and he's comfortable in it. So, so good for him. I mean, we were just kind of discussing this to bring it back around winners. Like I feel, I do feel like, uh, I couldn't have a walk away from either episodes one and two film, like the live guys were painted as heroes. Claude Harman's line was something along the lines of that live guys were going to maybe viewed as pioneers in all of this was kind of like, man,

I kind of could have used somebody just coming in here and being like, OK, yeah, these are why these guys made the decision. But the effect of this was like tearing down the competitive structure of everything outside the majors. Again, in a vacuum, does this make sense to make a lot of money to work less? And of course.

But here's the effect that it's going to have on golf fans was just something I could have used a follow up to because it does come off like, man, looking pretty smart here and it doesn't change the fact that no one's watching live. Like, and you did not get that from this series. Like they got all of this one really good cut. One really, really good cut where they had some, something about like, you know, one of these tours is seems to have a lot more momentum than the other one. And then they cut to like the Orange County national with like, yeah, just the natural

sound. There's like three people just kind of like, that was good stuff. That was that. Rory was like, it is, it is what it is. But I don't know. It just kind of didn't really fully portray what the live situation is and it's totality in my opinion. But I mean, like at this point, like TC said last night, let's try for Kate. Things forget by for K. Let's let's let's get it so disparate that it all falls apart

and the TV contracts fall apart and we can just start controlled detonation. We can start from the ground up. Yeah. I just felt like I could have used, I'm going to kind of get into more critiques from this first episode, but like could have used someone on there saying like golf is not big enough to be this split. Like it's, it's not soccer. It's not, uh, you know, formula one and Andy Carr, like it's, it's, it's just not big enough. Not, not that many people are watching PGA tour golf as it is. We're not big enough to split this off. That's just kind of something I felt like needed to be in there.

But I think this is one kind of last thing I'll say on like the production side and I get the edits are probably very tough. But what is becomes nails on a chalk board for me, especially if you watch them like, or, you know, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang is you have guys like Dylan to chair friend of all of ours who's like a very, very smart, insightful guy. And it just starts to feel like they're just kind of feeding him lines. Like I Dylan, I'd like, I like, I would way rather hear like Dylan, X, you know, just kind of explaining on a, on a loose kind of prompt,

like how he's feeling about stuff rather than like the next stop is here. If this puck goes in, this changes everything. And I don't, you know, I don't think that's his fault. I think he's kind of being steered in the, in a direction of where to go. And it's like, man, I'd rather just hear like somebody's actual thoughts rather than just the expository like bridge between scenes. On that note, again, I know I'm hammering this, but it said, he has a line in there that says like a live guy winning the masters would change the entire dynamic of professional golf. I personally would say it changes absolutely nothing about the fact that

nobody watches live. Uh, somebody did win a major, the very next major and it changed nothing. And I, he said the momentum has shifted. I do not remember the 2023 live season being anything other than dull as fuck. Like it got a lot more interesting when Ram left at the end of the season, which isn't covered within here. But again, it's just kind of that's not the accurate. Well, okay. So that's, and that's, that's fair. But also where they box themselves in is they had those lines and then they don't show they were telling us not showing us that totally. It was almost like real. It was kind of creating a like fake, fake drama a little bit. And so I think that's a fair critique of the show itself.

To pull a line like that and then not, well, show me the other tour, right? Because it seems like he keeps showing me the PGA tour stuff. And maybe that's because it's green lit by the PGA tour. Like, again, there's probably a lot of cooks in the kitchen on this stuff. But I'm surprised, I was a little surprised there wasn't more content from a live event to show, to give

a casual fan. Well, what is this other tour? It just kind of seems like the, the monster under the bed a little bit, which is a pretty good illustration actually of just the world of pro golf right now. So a lot of just like talking about live. Yes. Like very little of like, what, what, okay, what is, what are the birdies and bogeys look like here? Show me the watering hole, Neil. You know, show me the party hole. Uh, spinning this week, Deige. How did you,

how did you guys come away looking at Rory? I feel like, I think solid set it up top. I think it was a good decision for them to start with him in episode one and it sets the tone. I think in, you know, juxtaposed with Brooks, it doesn't look great. I think he's a lot more, I don't know, authentic is not the right word, but like, like Rory seems to wear his emotions on his sleeve and doesn't care when the cameras are around. Maybe that's at this point to it, like to it a fault. But I would like to see, I said this last night on the, on the pod, like just with some of the press conferences and stuff like, okay, the last three, four months, Rory's decided to leave the policy board.

I'm done kind of a little bit of a throw my hands up and you guys, you know, don't want to, I don't, I'm out basically, but still continues to like step up to the mic and, and say stuff. And so in watching this all last week, back to back, I'm a little bit like, Rory, I kind of want you to go, go, let's go do the rebuild that we were talking about it at Oak Hill. Like let's, let's get in the lab. And maybe just be scarce for a little while is kind of, so I would say, I, I wouldn't say one season two at all. Yeah.

That, that's how I felt as well. I, there's a lot of, it's also hard when you, you have these moments that, you know, a lot of them are probably captured in what April, May, June, why? And then in, you know, October, November, you're like, yeah, hey, I think I'm not gonna say anything for a while. Oh shit That's right. I already have all that stuff in the can is is kind of tough a couple moments in there that like I mean everybody's gonna be talking about and you've referenced it but the the moment at at Oak Hill where you know, I don't know if he knows he's on camera and He's talking about how like Essentially like I don't know if I'm good enough to win a major right now.

I don't know if I need to rebuild everything. I think there's a really, I can't wait to see what players, both like on the record and behind the scenes say about this season, because I think there's, what upside is there? Like I appreciate the altruistic, I need to put myself out there to grow the game type of sentiment from Rory, but I don't know what upside there is for Rory psyche to have, uh, I don't know if I'm good enough to win a major out there for everybody to, to see. Didn't go well for Sergio.

So, uh, I would say I had talked to Rory a little bit about what he thought of it. And he, I walked away from that episode thinking like that was a pretty darn good portrayal of everything he's been going through. And it just, that did not feel like creative editing on, on the Rory story. Right. And he, I totally agree. No, I'm saying like, that's kind of the exception, uh, to, to a lot of the story lines within this.

And it felt like he felt, I think he felt like it was well represented as well. And dude, he does wear it on his sleeve. And I don't think like he's made, he is like the entertainer of this, of this group of people, like understanding exactly what his need to met the fan, meet the fans needs, right? And so I don't think it bothers him to have that real raw moment, you know, captured on camera. The line, the whole, the whole sequence goes, I shit myself to left pins. My technique is nowhere as good as it used to be. I almost feel like I want to do a complete reboot. It's the only way I feel like I'm going to break through. It feels so far away. I'm not at the stage in my life where I feel like I can do these two week boot camps.

I feel good enough to fucking top 10 in my head, but not good enough to win. That's combining a lot. Obviously it's edited into that. It's not all consecutive, but that was just, that was good shit. That was like, yeah, man, that's what it feels like when we watch. Like it does not feel like you're about to win one of these. You know, he does come back much stronger at the U S open, the, the very next major after,

after Oak Hill, but that, that right there is what like the series should be about that moment capturing that shit. They've got a lot of really good locker room stuff, but dudes need to make themselves available For stuff like that without it feeling forced. That's really really hard to capture I give them a lot of credit for like How a lot of video stuff works if for people that don't work in this industry is like it's a lot of setup It's alright. Let's make sure the cameras are rolling sound ready. Okay, go be authentic Go and it's really really really hard to do that

And it's why a lot of the camera interactions like feel really forced, but having enough trust to be like trusted to go in the locker room and just kind of capture it almost kind of in a spy way was really, really, really good stuff and stuff that has not existed in golf to this, this date. And that's like the best advantage that this series has. I also think Rory might be the one guy on tour who's going to see that and be like, oh yeah, that was a pretty accurate portrayal of, I didn't know you're filming me, but like, yeah, that's really good to have that out there.

I think everybody else would be like, what the fuck? I don't want it. I don't want anybody to hear me saying that stuff. Because that's where I like, listen, if it was me, it's like, yeah, it could be as accurate a portrayal as you want. It doesn't mean I want everybody to see it. You know, and I'd be very curious how the other top players start to start to feel about the camera.

Well, there's, it's like, you know, I mean, not to put myself in Rory's shoes, but sometimes like with strapped, you go through this. It's like, you live it. You have to live it like three times. It's like, when it happened, when I, when I fucking blow up and it's like, Oh man, that's going to look tough in about four months. Then when like you get the rough cut and you're like, okay, like three weeks before it goes out. Okay. And then when it goes out and everyone's just like, Oh my God, how did you do that? Like what's wrong with you? And so it's like,

you know, I worry it's not done with that, uh, you know, caterpillar to butterfly situation just yet. And to the other players, I would say this exact shit is what we're talking about with this SSG and changing the entertainment value of golf. Like you, you got to make yourself available for that. Like that's like the bare minimum. You got to, you got to participate in that, in that exact part. And their instinct is going to want to control that messaging.

And like it just, that's exactly what can happen. So yeah, I would say, so to boil it down, like I agree with you, Sally, that the Rory stuff is probably the most interesting to me. Yeah, but I can't say that he wins the season, right? So it's like, as a fan, it's like, Oh, that was probably the episode one was like my favorite episode. But also like, I wouldn't say like paints. But that's reality, right? I think that's fair. Because that was that was Rory season. If we're looking at it from a yearbook perspective, that's exactly, that's exactly right. Tanner Iskra Itskra How would you guys, I think they're related,

but like how would you compare or contrast the Joel and Gino version of that? Because to me, it starts to feel, I felt really weird watching that episode and I can't really explain it all that, all that great other than it starts to feel very self-aware and it starts to feel very like we are the Netflix guys and we should have a couple of pops and maybe have one of those patented Netflix conversations as long as everybody's set up. And I, you know, both of those guys are nothing but like awesome, genuine dudes. And all I can think is how much of, I don't know, kind of a mind fuck maybe the last couple of years have been. You hear a lot in that episode about like

fame and we're famous now and all of this stuff. And it's just one of the things that like, I don't know, just really tweaks me out is when people start to, I don't know, like again, like it's all, I keep saying flattening, but you kind of flatten that word fame into like, yeah, like we are famous and like Taylor Swift is famous. And it's like the same thing. And it's like, no, it's, I don't think it's that. Maybe you're building up a little bit more of this in your head.

I know it feels that way at a golf tournament, but like, are we losing perspective on the fame here just a little bit? And are we turning into reality stars? And the whole thing just, the whole thing felt very, very weird, especially juxtaposed with like, you brought up Ricky earlier, like the role that, that Ricky's wife plays in this series and the role that Joel's wife plays in the series are just like very, very different.

And one of them is being very honest and supportive, like in, in favor of the fans. Like, I think Joel's wife says that in there, like, hey, I need to be honest about what's going on. And I feel like Allison, Ricky's wife is very like, yeah, I mean, we have those conversations like behind closed doors. And that to me is just like, I know which one I'd rather watch as a fan, but putting myself in either of their shoes,

it's just a very weird situation. D, that's a, I love this point again, not to not to make it about us, but we've talked about this in relation to the pot a little bit like, you know, I'm going to give you an example. So sometimes people fall into roles when the when we hit record. And like, so let's let's Randy's a good example, like, well, he's so negative. He's so negative. Sometimes we in the passive egg that on from him of like, Oh, he's so negative, he's so negative. Sometimes we in the past have egged that on from him of like, oh, Randy, good of you to show up tonight.

And oh, Randy, I know you're gonna love that. And what's his reaction? His odd reaction is like, oh, let me do my, like the bit becomes the reality a little bit, even if it's like, I don't really wanna do that. But I'm guessing there's a lot of like the, yeah, man, this is what this is what they want from me. This is what I'm known for. Let me go here. And I, but I can't believe that they must have gotten so much other stuff from Joel, but it's very

easy to cut down into 50 minutes, just like him slamming his club and him playing bad at the U. S. Open. And, and then, you know, all the confessional interviews start to go to that. Like if those are the questions you're asked, you're kind of, you know, for a guy like Gino, for instance, it's like, if that's all you're going to ask me about, I'm going to give you an honest answer on it, but like it's going to make it look like that's the only thing we talk about. And that's probably not the case. Yeah.

It's honestly like it's good storytelling, right? I mean, it kind of delivers that thing to the viewer of here's a character arc. Like, is it the most accurate portrayal of the year and Joel Damon's life from what I've gathered? No, it is, you know, kind of honing in on again, when you put all the clips in there of fuck you and hitting all these bad shots and building that story. Like again, that's good, good storytelling, but I don't know if it's like telling the full story. From what I've gathered, it was a shortish period of his year

where he was feeling a lot of these things and really struggling with things and all that. And it kind of gets painted. If you give him a whole year's worth of stuff, they're going to hone in on the stuff that's the most interesting. I did find a lot of the stuff with Geno and Lana really interesting. It was just a textual afterwards. I was like, dude, you got some good people in your life. Like seriously, you do in terms of how much Gino actually cares about Joel.

And I thought that was really on display. And I thought one of the again, one of the highlight moments of the of the season. I hate to call it like a highlight, but when, you know, Gino's talking, doing in his interview and his wife chimes in from like off screen to say, like, no, this is about like him having trauma and like never having dealt with it. Like having childhood trauma and not having fully like comprehended at all. And, and dealt with, with the stuff that weighs on him. And I just found that to be really real and authentic and does fit the, the story arc a little bit.

And I'm kind of talking about both sides of my mouth, but it, I don't know. There was something there. With like, I have no right to do this, but if I'm in Joel's situation there, I'm probably like, you know what? I do want to deal with this stuff. I just don't want to do it on fucking camera right now. That's, that's, that was the sense I got from him of like, they framed it as like, always being stubborn and he doesn't want to talk about it.

It's like, no, I just don't wanna talk about it when Netflix is in my house. Yeah. You know, and trying to be like, hey, can we just change the subject guys? Like, and so that's where I think it gets a little like unfair of like, well, I just, I'm not gonna say anything about it.

So you guys can, so then the vacuum allows them to kind of make up the story form is that was the, my takeaway from that, which I think is again, good TV, good storytelling, but like as somebody watching this, I'm trying to watch it with like a bit of a critical eye of like, ah, that's just like, he just doesn't want to talk about it like in front of you guys. Period.

I think what is was is so like unsettling or weird is when I talk about how like, you know, they start to use some of this like reality show kind of like language and mannerisms and it feels like everybody in his life is kind of like, okay, cameras are around. It's time to like, it's time to do the thing again. And I feel like on those reality shows, everybody goes in and it's just like, all right, listen, this is fake, right? Like this is, you know, we're not actually talking, all this is like kind of made up bullshit. Whereas like, this isn't this, this really does feel like exactly what you're saying, Neil. It's like he's not working out like childhood trauma as a bit.

That's like, no, that's what I'm actually going through. And I would prefer not to do it in front of millions of people if possible. And that's where I think this show is in such a weird, kind of like knife's edge between, that's exactly what you're trying to get to. But like for the sake of the golfers, like why would any golfer ever do that publicly is so, and I feel like golfers are going to like wake up to that idea

and notion very quickly, which is where I keep like circling back to my original point of like what I think would ultimately be better is just like a really souped up yearbook highlight of kind of like all the, you know, yes, sprinkle in some personal profile stuff to, to juice these up. But like, I kind of rather see ROMs putt from the front of the green at the Ryder cup than I would like some kind of half-assed, like we kind of sort of got there with a profile sort of thing. You know what I mean? All right. Let's dive in a little bit of episodes. We've talked a lot of episode one. I got a lot of notes and whatnot. We've kind of gotten through, um, a lot of these. I think the PGA champions dinner,

uh, was interesting footage to get. Uh, I feel like they could have built up how awkward that was all going to be, right? With the, uh, Phil and, and, and all that. And they've kind of ignored Phil so far, uh, in this series, but that was, that was bizarre. JT was a weird drive by of Mito Pereira, uh, taunting him for, you know, without, without Mito, none of this would have all been possible cameras in the room. I don't know if I would have gone for that one. That just seems very like not, uh, how, how golfers usually treat each other.

I don't know exactly why. I don't think there's a history between JT and Mito, but that seemed like an unnecessary drive by sick though. Yeah. Uh, especially as, you know, I'm sure that dinner was just full of like, it was probably a three and a half hour dinner. And I got, we got the one clip. We're using for this thing. Yeah.

Also, why was Brooke speaking at the dinner? That was so, but that's, that's what DJ is saying. There's probably a whole, you know, discussion for three hours. And it was probably just like on, there's probably like 15 other guys like, Hey guys, it was great to be here. Maybe they go around the room and it's like, Hey, everybody past champions get to make a little toast. And that's what they pulled. So, I believe that I wish in this episode again, they're going, I Brooks wins another major and season one stuff on Brooks was some

of the best stuff they got. Again, maybe a little heavily edited, but he had a season one quote that stuck with me so hard. He said, like he'd give everything back just to have that major championship feeling back for just an hour. Right. I really thought they could have used a call back to that in kind of building up this story of him going back.

He like that looked like it was not coming back at all in season one. And a little drop in of footage you already have there to kind of hammer home, you know, some of these big moments. I thought that would have played really, really well. That might be nitpicky, but that in like somebody shining a light on what kind of company you're in with five majors, uh, in terms of the history of the game for casual viewers would have really driven home like this is what this is the due to the generation. That's why I feel like we haven't

even done that enough. You know, I know we tried to kind of shout it from the rooftops, but like again, it's in this season, it's kind of like Rory Rory Rory Rory Rory Rory, which is which is great. But also like Brooks past him, man. It's crazy how like, I still don't think that has even gotten enough do and a lot of that's cause of the live stuff and whatever, but it's five is so many. Can I, one thing I want to zoom out just for a second on is how do we feel about the, the, it felt like a lot more interaction with the wags this year from Sims, Paulina, Alex Fitzpatrick's girlfriend. I think had a little, maybe a little too much

burn. I don't know. There's, for me, it's just kind of like, I guess the perspective, I kind of know what we're doing and we're trying to get my wife to perk up like, Oh, who's that? Yeah. But it feels a little bit, I don't know, unnecessary and it puts them in a tough situation to kind of comment on like, I feel like they were providing more commentary than the golf experts than Dylan and Rappaport and like the people that were supposed to be the experts were just like

sidelined so that Jenna Sims could tell me about the state of golf, which honestly, I don't really want to hear about from any of them. No offense to them. You know, it's like nothing against them. I just think it's putting them in a bad position, but maybe you guys feel differently. I was stunned at this. Paulina. I thought was awesome. I thought she was really good, real and I don't know. It is additive in some way. I think golf is such a, I don't know. I feel like we, at least people out there, pretend to care of like, I want to, I want to see off the course of these guys. I want to see them with their families.

And like that's kind of delivering on that to say like, eh, I mean, they're pretty normal family interactions. And, um, I get it. You're trying to make like people care about them on a personal level and, uh, really capture like what the family support looks like and things like that. So I don't know. I didn't have, I guess I just, I almost bring it up more as a, like it didn't do a ton for me.

I think I agree. Paulina was, was good. And, and so like Joel's wife was good. There were some, there was good and bad, I almost bring it up more as a, like it didn't do a ton for me. I think I agree. Paulino was, was good. And, and so like Joel's wife was good. There were some, there was good and bad, I guess, but I guess what I'm calling out is it was a massive ramp up from season one. Like if we're talking about like the difference in season one and season two, I thought the interaction of spouses or the interviews of spouses was like double or triple what it was in season one.

So that was like a conscious decision by the production to do that. Yeah. Yeah. I think there's only so much guys are going to say about themselves. So trying to get just other people in their lives to kind of say those things for them, hopefully is, yeah, is added. If I don't know, the more, the more voices, the better I was into it. Yeah.

Last nitpick I had from episode one, the closing comment from Dan Rapopore said about Brooks's win. It said, it means that live isn't going away. I, the league's survival is not dependent on players, performances and majors. That's, that's very disingenuous. It's dependent on the foreign policy and global interests of this kingdom of Saudi Arabia. And it didn't change.

Like it live is obviously not going away anytime in the near future, but like, it is not because Brooks water majors. That was a, again, part of the whole like live, how live was painted in all that episode, which made it seem like it was way more successful than it actually is in terms of fan interest. So I think that's the kind of stuff that can make all of us like feel like we've been taking crazy pills for the last three years, right? Is, is all this stuff just like it's so distilled down into like

the narrative rather than the reality. It's like, well, I mean, Brooks, I, Brooks winning the PGA, I mean, that's, this changes everything for live. Like, no, I mean, I don't think it does, man. I, I, I, if anybody's texting you about the live tournament next week, like, I think, and I think if you ask Brooks, I think, you know, off the record, he'd probably say, no, it changes everything for me. Right. Exactly. off the record, he'd probably say, no, it changes everything for me. Right. Exactly.

Even on record. That really changed shit for the league. Yeah. No, it's just it for me. I'm, that means I'm qualified. I'm in baby. I'm not going anywhere. Like that's kind of the, the.

I think that would be my guess on his perspective of it. One thing I love about full swing is it's a lot of talented people working together to create the most entertaining product. I bet you didn't think I could pull this one off. But if you're hiring, you want the most talented people on your team to help your business go to the next level. How do you find them? Zip recruiter.

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the smartest way to hire back to the podcast. One thing I really wanted to call out and how, like the future, I think it's really important for the future of this entire series. They did not have a sit down, as far as I could tell, with Brooks Kepke this season. They did not interview him one on one. And they told Brooks's story. I thought in season and this season, right? Which is, I think they're, they, in season one, and for the rest of season two, like they are too afraid of diving into someone's story. If they don't get a sit down with that person.

And this was evidence that you can do that, right? Like a big thing lacking in season two, just jumping off the page to where the hell are you not even talking about his decision to go to live is John Rom. Like there needed to be some kind of profile of John Rom in some way, even if it's other players talking about him and just ignoring basically that he wins the wins the masters is just a that's like one of my biggest issues with the season. But this is to say, like you do not have to have a direct interview with a person to be able to profile them. Um, it's something that I think is important going for. Well, that kind of comes from the F one stuff of like early seasons of that, like

Mercedes Ferrari don't want to take part and it's still in gate. Like they kind of ignored them in season one in that right. This is like, they didn't want, Brooks didn't want to take part for whatever reason. Jenna obviously did, but maybe he did. And they just didn't end up using any of his footage. But like you can still tell the story even if they don't want to take part. I agree with you on the on the ROM stuff. He was and any type of ROM acknowledgement was kind of was light, which if we're looking at this as a yearbook thing, that's and I would say the same with Scotty, right? Like he's, you know, there's some passing stuff from from Schaeffler, but he's not like, you know, it's tough when you just don't acknowledge even for a casual fan, like those, those guys are like the dudes, like that we need to the

up and comers or the guys in their prime. Like, yeah, we got a lot from Rory, but like those two missing feels like a disservice if this is supposed to be kind of a living record of what happened last year. On to episode two, if you guys are ready to move on to this is supposed to be kind of a living record of what happened last year. On to episode two, if you guys are ready to move on to that one. Again, kind of working hand in hand with episode one. It just felt like a really good transition and a great start with the shock of the merger. Um, I look inside a PGA tour meeting that looks like it's on June 6th. Like I, I know those things can be very easily faked. So I'm not positive.

Not a lot there other than, you know, kind of corporate speak and Jay anticipating that everyone's going to be pissed, but it felt like that could have been faked also. But I just thought that was somewhat interesting that they, that they got a little bit inside PJ tour HQ, even if it was nothing really there of authentic, of any authentic nature. Yeah. Another one of those like reality show, but it's actually reality type of, type of moments. I feel like if I was anybody in that meeting, I feel like all my, uh, platitudes about like, we gotta, we gotta bring the fans in would just be out

the window so fast. Like get the fuck out of here. We talking about, no, you're not filming this. Right. It's like, what the fuck are these cameras? I already close your Minoa folders right now. Yeah. So I, I don't know.

I continue to be shocked and, and I applaud them getting into some of the places they got into. And again, it's hard to tell like what the timing is on a lot of these, but I got some pretty raw reactions from like guys like JT and Rory and Colin. Looks like they were in the car with Rory on that day, kind of just saying, fuck it, do whatever you want. Again, that could have been in any moment, but, um, Colin stuff also might have been fake timing, but I don't know that was, that was good profiling.

And also like contrasting the stress from all the PGA tour guys, just cutting straight to DJ out on his boat, cranking up the tunes was that was good. That was well done. That was very well done. Absolutely. The concept is kind of introduced of like this merger going through, which means a lot of tour guys are going to wish they signed as if the guy, you know,

the criticism of the guys leaving wasn't valued and, you know, it wasn't valid. And the only thing that matters is money kind of bothered me a little bit. It's like, Oh, see, they're the big winners here. They got the most money is like, it's not really what we're talking about here. That's not what the contest is to get the most money. Uh, a lot of us just like want to watch entertaining competitive golf. And that, that part was just again, a little bit of, uh, gosh, could use a voice or two in the room saying something like that.

But Claude Harmon coming in hot again with this false narrative that, you know, Brooks made Brooks's major win is going to change how things get worked out. Uh, and then that's when he dropped his pioneer line, which I thought was just, that was some chef's kiss stuff. DJ family profile, I thought was really good. I thought they kind of captured the total like truly DJ does not care about any of this shit and cares only about his family and how it affects them and his golf, um, was, was really good. I did find it interesting that he did kind of end it with like, you know, all, despite all this stuff that's being said about the live guys,

said the live guys couldn't win. They wouldn't be competitive. He basically admits like, yeah, maybe I haven't been working hard enough after the US open was like, oh, shit. Well, okay. That kind of flies in the face of some of the book. Claude Harbin is saying here and I've not heard one of the live guys say that out loud.

That was, I still, I flipped on whatever live event he won. Did he win? I don't know, whatever. Las Vegas, maybe. And that was what he said in the post round. Wasn't it? Like, oh yeah, I hadn't really touched a club for like five weeks. Like, oh, well, yeah, you're probably not like super sharp then, man.

I, maybe that might be some of what people are implying. I don't know. I thought one of the best scenes, I think it was this episode was Ricky and Butch working together. Yeah. So like that's kind of where I'm, and again, maybe I'm the wrong guy to ask like he should do more of this stuff, but like getting guys out on the course while they're practicing and working with like working on their game.

I felt like some good combo between him and Butch and Butch being a good resource for like what Ricky's trying to do here and like what happened was good TV. It's gonna be interesting when, not that it seems like the drama is gonna necessarily like dry up anytime super soon, but it is interesting to kind of like build the identity of the show around

everybody stabbing each other in the back. Everybody's leaving all this shit's going on off the course because eventually that's kind of what I keep coming back to you. Like you're going to have to get back to like what the actual product is. And that's I'm with you where I wouldn't say with a straight face that like to draw in more casual fans, you need to show more like range sessions with Ricky and butch. But I'm like, well, that's what I want to see. That's that's awesome. You know, it feels like eventually if the dust settles, like you're going to have to do some more of that stuff or find some more of those types of

storylines to make it interesting. I did enjoy kind of the profile of Ricky breathing fresh energy into golf, cutting straight to him with the golf boys video. That was that was that was some, some pre-boss stuff. Garcin looked at me. She's like, is this real? I was like, yeah, that was a long time ago, but it is very real. That happened. It's an experimental phase. Yeah. The little nuggets of them lighting up the USGA for darkness as they're finishing again, kind of like, it's kind of weirdly mixed into this, you know, highly edited, you know,

story arc thing with all these like really raw, great golf nuggets in there. I almost feel like they can make a separate series of just like, dude, just the uncut stuff of, of, of casual conversations that are picked up and whatnot. Cause that was, that was, that was really good stuff. Him and Rory bitching about it together. And I feel like I would rather see chronicles of these individual tournaments, like the stories told like that way. And that stuff really plays in well there. Great locker room nuggets after the U S open, like Rory slamming something in there and say, we're going to fucking get one of these things after finishing one shot short.

Was really good. And then I don't know. Could he use 20 minutes on that wedge shot into 14? Could have used 20 minutes on that wedge shot into a 14. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a sucker for this stuff as a newly minted girl dad, but Ricky walking off and seeing his daughter and saying like, you're pissed off, you're bummed and you see her and you're like, okay, I thought that was a great little nugget. So we've talked a little bit about episode three, Joel Damon, Wyndham Clark. You know, you kind of talked a little bit about this stage, but I thought it was kind of a little self-congratulatory on, you know, the full swing. I don't know if you needed to spend time in season two talking about the great success of season one of full swing. It just felt like I really hammered that home as to how big, big of a success all this was and what it's done to Joel and Gino since then.

I think it just kind of speaks to like the, how different like a tournament environment is from real life. Right. You guys, I'm sure have felt it. You go to a turn it like life at a golf tournament is very different than like life at the grocery store. I guess it was kind of my, my larger point. And I get that he spends a lot of time at, at golf tournaments and there's probably a lot more people shouting his name and whatever. But it seems like there probably is an escape where I feel like Joel can probably still walk through the grocery store. Okay. Without, without just being accosted by rabid golf fans all the time. And Gina, we, we, uh, we mentioned this, but just the, the parallel of two golfers, both living in Scottsdale, both losing their mothers at young ages and both with like two very,

very different approaches to their golf games and lives at the, at the moment. I would, but I would push back a little bit on this. I think that Wyndham was a lot like they kind of set this up. Like he's just farther along in his, you know, kind of psychology journey a little bit. And so you kind of, and good on him for, you know, kind of opening up and showing like, here's what I'm doing. Here's how I'm working with my coach. You guys full access to you. But again, like that's in some way, I think it's unfair to Joel of like, if he wants to do that behind closed doors, like by all means. And so that's where I,

I, you know, again, wait, I'm not going to say the same thing. I'm going to say the same thing again. Good story, good TV, but I think doing Joel a little dirty for that story. There's, that's really interesting to put it that way, because I think there's a big, big difference between Wyndham talking about stuff in somewhat past tense and Joel going through it in the moment is like such a different thing. Like if they profiled Wyndham two years ago,

I think it looks a lot like Joel. Yeah, I agree. And that's, you know, and but then yeah, like the results show themselves like he's blowing up. He's won three times in the last 12 months and all of them are big time events and it's working. So it's like, it does serve the story and there is, there like there is an episode here. I just think that it's

it needs to be evaluated kind of fairly is how I watched it. Dr. Justin Marchegiani Yeah. And it, I think a line or two and there would have done a lot of work of like, dude, there's a lot of Wyndham Clarks out in the PGA tour, like a lot of them. There's literally hundreds of them in professional golf. And like, he kind of toiled around in that group for a long time until emerging out of it, right? And I feel like that could have been told a little bit of like, dude, how hard it is to break free of that. But I just thought the psychology, you know, stuff was truly interesting in terms of, there was a great, great line that that windham had in there He said up until this year

I felt in fear the bad things that are gonna happen more than believing the good things are but now I truly have the belief that good Things are gonna happen is like that's that's it for golf right there That's like I in my most recent tournament I stood over and pictured all the bad things that could happen before I hit the shot. And like, I truly believe the bad things were going to happen. And holy shit, does that actually have an effect on your golf shots? And if you can channel that other thing, it's so much easier said than done. If you can actually put it into practice, like you're going to win major championships.

If you have that level of talent, it is a little bit portrayed as like, dude, you just got like, think your way through it. And, and you know, the talent thing is just whatever it's like, ah, it's a combination of the two. And, uh, it's a lot. Yeah. There's a lot of people doing that already as well. Yeah. But you know, I, I do think like the Joel Gino relationship is really, really rare on tour. Like Gino is the dude you want in your Foxhole. I think he is just genuinely invested in, he's said it before too, he's like Joel's life caddy, right? He is more than just his golf caddy

and to have caddies be a caddy player in relationship, be best friends and be put on display like that, I, that doesn't really exist in the golf world, both like from a availability standpoint and just that fact existing. And, uh, I dunno, I appreciate them at least putting this all in display for us. One unsolicited, uh, suggestion for season three would be following Gino on one of his travel days. It was like, they, they did, you know, just flicker,

like, Oh, by the way, he lives in like Idaho. Think about what that means for like life on the PGA tour. He detailed it on the podcast, whenever that was last summer, maybe, but crazy amounts of travel that, that have to go into like actually living where he lives and doing the job that he does. It's, it's psychotic, psychotic behavior. Yeah. From Gino. And yeah, again, then talking with Joel, it made it sound like he was, had

a drinking problem and was depressed for a year when in reality had like a tough four week stretch, probably that was not necessarily representative of how he acted and behaved for the entire year. But I do like the only thing I'll say on that is like, I do really enjoy and it's so hard to find guys who are willing to chronicle this for all the reasons we've discussed, but you do need a player that's like going the opposite way for this series to work. Right. It can't just be all of Scotty and Victor and Rom and Brooks and look at how great everybody's doing. Like you do, it does make it so much

better to have somebody who's ranking is, is going the other way and just kind of see what it looks like. Yeah. Episode four, Tom Kim. This is where I think things take a little turn for the worse for season two of full swing. The teaser for this episode says Tom Kim is a global superstar and that he's a generational talent. I just was written by you. Yeah, I think you're a best learner man. I actually going to blame TC for this for, uh, for misuse of the term generational talent. I just want to say for the record, this means that is a player you see once in a generation. Like that's the definition of a generational talent, which is what you've been saying for

years. Yeah. Defense. Welcome to the resistance, my man. I know you're trying to bait me into be like, no, I didn't say that. I didn't say that guys. I didn't say that. I'm not going to fall for it. Okay. Yeah. I totally said that. Good job, guys. Good job. A second commenter comes on and says he's a literal global superstar. Like they're just going way, way, way, way out of their way to, to paint Tom Kim. And let me start by saying I like Tom Kim a lot. I'm a big fan. I'm in, I'm rooting for him. I think he's a great story. I think he's a ton of fun I hated this episode. I thought it was it could have been a 10 minute part of one of the episodes or something it did not need to be an entire episode

I it makes me wonder about like availability of guys. I guess this kind of all they were, you know, able to get and I just was Contrasting this against the first three episodes of the season, just I thought four and five really lost a lot of steam. And I rewatched everything twice to kind of prepare for this. And I just did not even want to rewatch four and five. Yeah. I, not my favorite. I think it's, you got to cast a wide net when you're doing this kind of stuff.

And obviously it involves a lot of luck. Wyndham Clark goes out and wins a major and you have all this great stuff with him. Like that's, that's the good version of this episode. And, you know, if Tom Kim goes out and wins three times during the summer and becomes, you know, this 20 year old five time winner, like it becomes, you know, it becomes a different episode. So I think maybe they just probably didn't get a couple, a couple bounces and then they need all the-course stuff to really kind of carry the episode. And it just kind of seemed like bad luck to me, but not my favorite.

Yeah. This did not pass the Chris Ryan test. Like what if I told you, you know, a golfer is maybe having a little bit of trouble managing his schedule. It's like, yeah, it's, that's not going to pass the 30 for 30 test. But, um, I don't know, there's, it didn't seem to be a whole lot of a story there. I think you can show his personality and his like jolliness kind of within, you know, a segment of it that did not need to be this long.

It did not do this much of a focus. Some of the, uh, what was rapid ports a lot in there about how Tom Kim was playing a practice, like they tried to paint the practice round is like this nefarious thing. Like I think rapboardsort said he swung with the big boys. He swung on with the sharks, uh, playing with the JT and, and speed is if they're trying to do like some Psyop like, you know, take down, I'm like, I mean, I think he, what it was, Thanksgiving. I think he went to the

Spees house for Thanksgiving. Spees kids. Yeah. I don't know if there's any like nefarious behavior going on, but that was, you know, listen, we're on, we're onto the Fitzpatrick. No, I think, uh, Sally, it was probably them with a poor setup. Like you said to the episode, like, I think the storyline is there's a line in this episode where Tom Kim's like, I want people to stop treating me like I'm 13. And then he's like riding like a, you know, a car around the truck around. It's like, well, then stop fucking acting like you're 13, dude. Like I think it's more of like, here's a kid that this is what happened. Like some,

you know, he's broke broken into the PJ toward a young age. And it's like he probably struggling with just growing up. And that's, that's a story. Like that's kind of where I think there is some interest here of like, you know, when you get a lot of success at a young age, like some people handle that differently, but to, to brand him as a global superstar and then have him ride the Tonka truck around the house is like, that's where I was just like, yeah, this is stupid. I'm, I'm good. God, I don't know if TC's seen it yet, but he is going to absolutely hate the ankle storyline of the championship, which look, I think we all have a tendency to roll our eyes and athlete

injuries. Like if you have a grade three, what is a grade three tear or whatever the ankle, like you've, you've seriously hurt your ankle. I don't think he's playing it up or faking any of that that Tisi would like to lob that accusation on, but I don't know. The limp does come and go though. I will, we'll give that editing. I mean, that could be, that could be anything. Look, I'm always injured and I'm so I will give that editing. I mean, that could be, that could be anything. Uh, look, I'm always injured and I'm so I have a lot of sympathy for guys that are playing injured and playing around. So sometimes it hurts. Sometimes it doesn't. It's really hard to predict golf. Listen, golfers not being athletes. That's a story. There's your story

right there for this episode. What if I told you somebody tried to compete for one of the oldest championships in the sport, rolled his ankle standing on a patio last night. for one of the oldest championships in the sport, rolled his ankle standing on a patio last night. I got a great kick out of using a, come on, Tommy lad. Cheer for Tom Kim, which I that probably was probably was one of our own. It probably directed at somebody else that was in contention of that open championship. I have five at five, Matt and Alex Fitzpatrick. I again, do you want to start this stage? Yeah. Let me start with some positivity. I actually really, I liked this one a lot more than I thought I was going to.

I clicked into it and was like, I had not, not interested. And I don't know that super casual fans are going to be interested, but I, for whatever reason, I mean, I thought they laid it on a little thick, the like, you know, I'm, I'm just Matt's brother and you know, the inferiority complex. A little thick. Yeah, sure. They did. But like, going into that episode and like totally forgetting how, I said this earlier, but how great Alex played at the British Open and having that almost

kind of be like a surprise reminder. Again, I think that speaks to the yearbook type of setup. I actually really liked this episode. It was a character I didn't know anything about. It could have probably been, you know, they could have caught 10, 15 minutes off of it. But I thought the dynamic between the two brothers and Alex's good play and I don't know, it felt, it felt worth an episode to me. So if, if you guys felt differently, I could certainly see that as well, but I kind of enjoyed this one. I definitely felt differently. And again, let me preface it by saying I love Matt Fitzpatrick. I don't know, Alex seems like a delightful chap rooting for the guy. Just kind of wild sandwich between all this other really interesting

stuff that this was, uh, I mean, if I had to rank like the top stories of the 2023 season, I'm not sure the Fitzpatrick's are ranking anywhere in the top hundred. Right. And I know it's not that simple as like filming the stuff is hard and all this stuff. I just was like, I, this one was just a tough one to get through. And it felt like it could have been again, like maybe Tom Kim and Fitzpatrick are like to take the best parts of both of those and weave them into a story in some way. That did not feel like enough stuff for two whole whole episodes.

That's my shirt. I think in a vacuum, I, I think they flipped it at the bottom. Alex playing well at the British oven really helps the episode. So like when you talk about the ball bouncing your way, Deige, that's, I would say an example here without that, this is doesn't do much for me. But in, so I agree with Salian that with all the other things they could have. Done or other players they could have followed. That's where I'm a little like perplexed at like, oh yeah, let's just throw this

in right before we spend three episodes on the Ryder cup. Let me, I guess, and then that's where the Tom Kim one also stands out to me. It's like they, a lot of the formats of these are like juxtaposing a player that's having success versus a player that's not. So Wyndham and Joel being an example for like the Tom Kim one, I think there was an opportunity to say like Tom Kim's broken out and he's had this big year and he's really young and immature juxtaposed that with somebody like probably like Max, who's like breaking out late, having a big year.

What does that look like? Someone that's a little bit more equipped, maybe mentally to like, to, to handle it. I don't know. I'm just now I'm thinking out loud, but this is, this was almost like maybe before they filmed this or like, oh, this will be a great juxtaposition of like brother that's had a lot of success with, brother that's you know in his shadow I just don't think it just feels like at the expense of other stories that could be told is a miss for me. But if we can kind of attempt to bring this all together of kind of why we've talked

about some of the things we've talked about over the last hour and hour plus is like some of the kind of creative editing and storytelling reality TV kind of storytelling is likely to sow some distrust amongst players. Like it makes it's going to make guys less willing to like partake in this knowing you don't really have much full edit. You don't have any editorial control and they can kind of choose pick and choose. They're going to pick and choose whatever the most dramatic part of your life is or whatever you've given up to make part of into a storyline, whether the story is really there or not. Like that's what's going to, and you have to place so much trust in that they're going to nail all that.

Right. And I've talked to one player who thought they nailed it this season. I've talked to one that thought they did not. Right. So that is kind of, you know, maybe they are kind of stuck with the Tom Kims and the Fitzpatrick's that are willing to participate and let the story be told and Instead of getting like obviously like a Bryson one would be super interesting But I doubt Bryson is down with all this stuff like that's kind of like where like their process is potentially gonna eat themselves And like what the future of this Series is is kind of where again where I keep emphasizing of I think it should be more about the events and how the characters weave into the events. Uh, that's again, my golf nut maybe coming out of this, but that's to say,

like, I don't know how long your trails are going to be, uh, with guys to participate because that's frankly, we've heard that from guys of like that, that maybe that trust level is not there. And that's kind of how you end up with these two episodes is how I viewed that. Uh, I think that's spot on. Yeah, that's well said. I agree. I just don't, if we're talking about this as an introduction to casual fans,

like I don't know if spending a whole episode on the Fitzpatrick brothers is a, is a great use of, of limited real estate. And then I think Matt comes off great. I just think it's like, it's almost putting Alex in a position not to succeed. Like in, in a way. Well, it says, you know, it's like, I think it's off grade. I just think it's like, it's almost putting Alex in a position not to succeed. Like in, in a way. Um, well, it says, you know, it's like, I think it's cool that Matt picked Alex to play in the Zerg, but like, I don't think that's a, like, it just doesn't feel like a storyline of the year.

It just feels like pointless. Like I lost interest basically. I was like, yeah, these, they didn't play good. It's just keeps coming back. I'm ready. The rallying cry of this podcast. It's like golf's not that cool. And this was kind of like my whole point is like, yeah, like when, you know,

governments and, uh, you know, like tours are warring and there's all these like political and geopolitical intrigue. Like, yeah, sure. That's awesome. But like most of it looks like this episode. Yeah. Most of it's like, But like most of it looks like this episode. Yeah. Most of it's like looks like dessert classic. Most of it looks like, you know, a guy finishing 12th at a, at a major is like

a career achievement. And that's where I keep coming back to like, man, unless you can like make that stuff interesting, it's, it's going to be really hard, really, really hard to like consistently do this series every year. They're leaning a ton in this episode on like Fitzpatrick, the Fitzpatrick brothers in the front seat of their courtesy car with their parents in the back, not saying anything. It's like some of it was just like, yeah, like juxtaposed this with the Wyndham and the, in the Joel stuff, like good storytelling. I thought this was like not good storytelling.

But it's also one of those, you can't kind of do like, oh, you picked a great year to follow professional golf. And then like, what if, what if all this drama didn't happen? And like this is kind of the stories that you're, you're, you're kind of stuck with. It just seems, I don't know. I keep coming back to you. If you, I don't know, Neil, I know you guys did your hoop dreams podcast last week. And I just, I had never seen hoop dreams, watched it last night for the first time. Amazing. Can't believe I'd never seen it.

Fantastic movie. But like what a, an example, and I guess a lot of this is because you have so much of that offscreen story or off court storytelling and, you know, you learn so much about them at home and whatever. But I can't tell you how fucking into every dribble I was of a 1991 super sectional basketball game. Like I think if you can, if you can lay the, the right groundwork, like I think you can make the, you know, the Zurich interesting, or you can make some of these golf tournaments, uh, compelling, it's just, it requires so much on the front end. And solid to your point, it's like the, the people who are willing to go there just seem like they're going to be so few and far between. So like, I, they're not, the people making this are not stupid. Like, of course, they would say like, yeah,

I wish we would have just been with Scotty all year. I wish Max would have led us into his whole process. I wish like all of these things would have happened, but like, it's just going to be really hard to convince guys to do that. Yeah. Again, that's what that's kind of where I left off with, after season one was like, is this character piece, uh, you know, the only way forward anyways, but this is where it one was like, is this character piece, you know, the only way forward anyways. But this is where it's also like they just kind of beat us over the head

with this shadow thing in this episode. And that's not on Alex, but they made, like, you don't need Alex on there, saying it five different times, right? Even if I was watching it with my wife and she even said, like, I think we've got the, we've gotten the point across with the shadow thing. I think we're good on that, on that metaphor. But anyways, moving on. Episode six, I think we were kind of bottoming out and then on our way back up here with, uh, JT Keegan and Ryder cup, uh, run up my top

note here is like, I hate to say it, but man, Keegan came across great here. It was fantastic. Yeah. I don't hate to say it. I think he's like, he seems like a genuine dude. Like he's grown up. He's, he's kind of an elder statesman now. And I thought he, he did himself a good service here, you know, and was very authentic throughout these last three episodes. more than the seven and eight. Like when we saw it, when you and KVV go back to do your, you know, 20, 40, uh, deep dive into the 2023 Ryder Cup, going back and watching this episode again is going to be a pretty cringy ass time capsule to watch, to watch Zach and watch the boys club and watch them having dinner together. And all of that stuff is just not going to age well even, and for whatever reason was still like really good. I don't know. You almost can like look around the corner at how this is going to age. And that made it really enjoyable to me.

There was a note in there that was kind of like, again, kind of when you're, when you're crafting a story, I get that, but it was also ZJ and Keegan played on Ryder cups together. Right. Which is like a, okay, well, why haven't you guys formed a bond? Right? Like, why is ZJ's bond with JT a story yet? Why can't we maybe dive in a little bit on why ZJ and Keegan, why is Keegan on the outside looking in for this group? Uh, when he was literally on teams with the captain, right? I, that was, that was a takeaway I had in that of like, yeah, we can do the boys club storyline and it, it, it, look, the dinner scene from them all at the open championship was, was stuff. I did think they made it more JT Keegan for that final pick when really it was probably Sam Burns and Keegan for that final pick.

And they kind of left it at JT played really well at the Ratter Cup when really he was like a little mediocre He was better than Jordan was definitely But kind of made it look like he was it was valid and I guess they kind of went with the angle of from an energy perspective Like yeah, JT did what he was supposed to do as a part of this team But man that it is heartbreaking those details have come out in a lot of places since that like the Netflix guys came to Keegan's house And that made Keegan think he was getting the call to be on the team. Like that's part of the reason why he let them in to, you know, film that and like capturing that raw moment was again, like a million thumbs up of like that. Shit has not existed in golf up until this

series. And that was, that was one of the best moments of the season. It's heartbreaking as it was again, for somebody like a person and player I don't care for in particular. It's like feel absolutely gutted for like that's some pretty powerful storytelling. Yeah. Uh, you kind of had some notes in the agenda here too that I would echo and just wish I had more hands so I could give CJ's captaincy four thumbs down. Oh my God.

Seeing that coming from a mile away of just like, God, I really don't want to play for. I don't want to make these picks. I don't want to upset anybody. I can't believe I have to do this. The whole thing was just like, fuck this man. Yeah. It sounds plain with that like weird Rubik's cube in the kitchen and I don't know that the whole like I just like, if you take it to a different sport, it's like, kitchen and I don't know that the whole like, I just like, if you take it to a different sport, it's like, yeah, I wouldn't, you know, it's horrible to play football.

I'm like, yeah, I think I'm going to go somewhere else, man. I'm sorry. Like just overwhelmed with the burden of these picks versus like coming up with a plan for how you're going to attack the rider cup. Like that's what you're responsible for, man. You got all these great assets to choose from, figure out a way, you know, to, and again, maybe I can get left on the cutting room floor, but like figure out a way to tell the story. And like, again, you're in charge of what you're saying in front of the camera. Let's just be like, you know, give off some air

of confidence in the decisions you're making instead of just this internal turmoil you're having over. I get that you're going gonna hate to make that call, but shit. Get been ahead to like episode seven, like the scene of him in the getting driven home after day one. Oh my God, man. I'm just too tired. I only want to think about it. It's like, fuck that, man. Like you need to be like, you should be ripping asses right now. What are you doing? You're just going to go crawl into a rock. Like this is this is bad, man. I'm, I'm not having a good time watching this. The literal line is, uh, you know, uh, I think it's, uh, Julius,

what's his last name, uh, from the PGA America, Julius Mason's in the backseat and they're writing home. Uh, and he's talking to him about pairings. And he goes, ZJ goes, I can't talk right now. I'm exhausted. My brain's fried. I'm just not going to speak. Don't serve me. What, what a leader you guys have chosen. This is Dave. That was a tough, tough scene for our captain, my captain. It just, and of course I'm sure there was a little bit more. If I'm being charitable, maybe there was a little more that went into this. Maybe not, but it really just feels like all the two years of prep was just like, you know,

it's all about who wants it more. You know, that's, that's it. That's, it's just going to be a, it's a battle of wheels out there where meanwhile Luke Dottles just like, here's all the things we're doing. Here's all the ways we're having these guys get to know each other. Here's all the ways we're bringing the team together. It was just, uh, it was the, um, kind of the cherry on top of, of the shit sandwich, uh, of, of the 2023 US Ryder Cup team. This deserved, really deserved to be captured

in the way that it was and preserved for future generations. I'm just like, watch this shit, man. Watch that. You want to know why you keep losing? Like here you go. It's captured in beautiful striking HD right here. But counter to that was when they're all having dinner at the open championship. Deej was when ZJ dropped this bomb on them. It said, I would love for this team to win

as like a motivational thing that he was dropping on the table, uh, which why is he just saying you can print? Yeah. Why is DJ staying or having dinner with Ricky and JT and Jordan? Or I don't know. That was just a, that, that felt a little made for TV, uh, that scene. Um, yeah. Again, all this stuff, like it could have saved me so much embarrassment of the things I would have said. If I'd had just known that ZJ says things like J Tizzle, I would have never picked that. I would have never said 99% of the things I said leading up to the toy 23 writer cup. It would have been so crystal clear. Like, oh, this seems so fucked. They are so fucked.

Got big winner of this season. It might be TC. You see having all this, having all this preserved. Uh, again, just like not giving off any air of confidence. Like he, you know, the, the, the plan that Europe had in place of having guys play together along over the course of a year. And then juxtaposing that was DJ being like, yeah, he might be playing. He might not be playing. Like we don't know about JT is like, no, dude, just tell him, like there was,

tell him in August, like we're taking you no matter what. Like don't stress about this. Like prepare yourself to play. And it was a good, like TV cut at the end of this episode of like making it look like they were cutting JT and taking Keegan. That was a little, uh, Cliff, a TV cliffhanger there. That was, that was some good stuff, but some great moments from, again, when they did go to the PJ tour golf, but Keegan,

when the travelers and having that moment afterwards about like, I think we're going to Rome. Yeah. All that stuff was great. The way they built up JT at, at Wyndham was really fun. I don't know. It was, it was a good, I thought this one was a very well made episode. There was a lot to really like. Yeah. Like I said, I think it, it, it was made out to be that JT versus Keegan thing when in reality, uh, it was the Sam Burns pick that kind of came out of left field and they didn't talk about Cameron young, obviously at all. Again, you're kind of just making a, making a story for TV, but, um, it, man, yeah,

they, they really profile Keegan well and dude, the clips of him in, in, in, in future episodes are, uh, I think it's the final episodes of him watching the Ryder cup and like rooting on JT. Where is USA hat? Yeah. Like I, I gave him a ton of credit, man. Like, and that all feels authentic. Like it doesn't feel like he was faking that of like, I, I, yeah.

Credit to Keegan for handling that. like, I, I, yeah. Credit to Keegan for handling that like, uh, like a man, Jay Tizzle's house is new house is dope. This looks really cool. Um, I just had that great place. Great place to play fetch. Exactly. Episode seven, Ryder cup part one. The phone calls. That was good stuff. Uh, both sides of the players getting their bids and all that Brooks was so on brand. Just like, yeah, sounds good. Sounds good. The quiver and Rick's voice talking back at like the, the, the emotion that came with getting that pick for him. That was, that was really good. ZJ saying, I don't envy this part of

this job, not how that phrase works at all. Um, you like, you would say that about if somebody else is in the position, but you are in the position. I hope somebody else was. Yeah. Why were we at ZJ sun's football game? Like again, they just kind of lingered. What a unit. Oh yeah. For real in all of the size of that lad. I get, I get there going for a lot of buildup, but just a lot of time spent on some things that could have been set in a couple of lines of, of, you know, Oh yeah, that was a complaint I had with, with this episode. I kind of just wanted more golf.

I felt like six and seven was a lot of off the course stuff. And that's where I kind of wanted to get back to the yearbook type of season, but that's not my decision. I would be very curious what the episode was that they like left on the cutting room floor, right? Because it kind of feels like they were stretching out rather than trying to right. Yes.

You know, rather than trying to cut stuff. Uh, cause six, seven and eight, like I think the rider cup as two episodes would have been great, but it as three episodes felt like too much to me. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Just kind of fully agree with that. Deige. I don't know. Just kind of agree with that. Deedge.

That's I, that kind of sums up my feelings to the back half of the season. Uh, it kind of felt like they could have weaved more Europe selection stuff in earlier too. It kind of becomes almost a footnote of, you know, yeah, you're not even going to know half these guys and it was a very much us story. Um, it's like, yeah, well, this team is about to go get their ass whooped. I don't know. Um, I could not get the, the, the opening ceremony stuff.

Just could not get that. I forget who tweeted this around the time that said that Luke Donald looked like a right wing European politician leading, leading a rally, uh, forza Europa. Really good. And you know what? If, if CJ ever complains about like getting a bad edit or anything like that, the fact that they didn't include his opening remarks just shows that they, they could have been so much worse.

They did a little bit. They got him speaking Italian in there. It could. Yeah. I don't know. Maybe it could have, maybe I blocked it out of my, my mind, but I feel like you could have, you could have made him look like even more of a cheeseball if you wanted. So all of this massive amount of buildup, massive of just all the picks. I thought they, I mean, they captured the, it is, it is like the story of the year. Ryder Cup permeates through everything, captured all that blow, blow, blow, leading up onto it. Coliseum, first tee, all this

noise, and then it all just goes dead silent. And oh my fucking God, how in this moment, this buildup, all the way to this moment, how do you use the wrong audio sound for Scottie Shephler's first drive? Like it's all this big dramatic, it gets deathly silent, hits the driver and they play an iron audio shot over that. How does that, I hope to God, we've only seen screeners.

I hope that was only in the screener and they got that fixed somehow in the final version. I don't know if that's how this stuff works But it immediately my wife was like what that was the wrong sound. How was that? I think oh, how does that get through multiple layers of editing and be that obvious? That was just a maddening maddening maddening moment of the series for a golf sicko God I'm sorry, I'm sorry for what you had to go through there selling. Did not bother you. I think maybe I was, I was watching it. I don't know. Maybe the dog was barking or something. I certainly didn't ruin my day.

I wasn't by this point. I wasn't as locked in as I was early in the season. Maybe shows. Maybe shows. I was waning a little interest. And I think some of that was just because it was like a little bit. Oh, and I know the Ryder Cup is the feature thing of last year, but it was a little bit of already like fatigue of like, oh man, I guess we're not going to hear about some other storylines. Like I'm guessing Victor didn't sit down for interviews or anything, but like I think there's a Victor story in there of him playing really well in all the majors and then balling out at the end of the year and then balling out in

the Ryder Cup. Like that's a yearbook story that didn't even get thought of in this whole season. So I'm at this point in episode seven, I'm like, oh, I know basically we're just going to go Ryder Cup from here on out. It almost maybe glaze over a little bit. It felt like there was probably like whatever four or five, six shots, especially if you're spreading these out over three episodes. I feel like you could have trimmed some of the, the buildup stuff and just

really sank into some of those moments. Like they, they covered the Victor chip in on, on number one a little bit, but also that was solid. You and I were, were there. That was like at the risk of overstating it and being dramatic as soon as that happens, like, Oh, this is over. Like that's, that's it. We're, we're done.

Like you could have really sank into just like him stalking that and him walking around and you know, he's struggled with his chipping and all you could have really milked that one. The wrong one I mentioned from, uh, from the front of the green on Saturday, that pot on 18 was just, could have really lived in that one for another five minutes. Uh, it kind of felt like they were both, I don't know, both like really dragging and then really whipping through stuff. It's just kind of a weird, a weird thing.

Again, give me some of those. So some of those super sectional moments, Neil. Yeah. Can the commandos make it make a run? Flashing back to drive to survive. I forget which season it is, but the season where they had the huge controversial ending where max like a shady ruling and max is able to come from behind on the last lap to win the championship. And they like captured that moment in a way that we had not seen before this, like the

reactions of everyone on the pit wall, the audio. And I was just like, Oh shit, man, like I watched that happen. And man, you just totally like elevated like this moment. And like that's like the reason we all watch sports for or like for the big moments. That's why I was so angry at the Schaeffler audio in that is like, you got to just deliver on the big moments. Like the Ryder Cup gave you a bunch of really big 18th hole moments, like the crowd going, ape shit, huge celebrations.

The Hovland putt and the rom putt on Friday, like to sink the U S was just like glazed over. Like they showed J like the JT chip up and down and they just showed him like make a putt to, you know, for the half. But they totally missed the romp. I forget which order it was, but the Hovland and the rom putt, they like shook the entire rider cup on that day. Like you gotta deliver on those moments. I know this isn't that much about the golf, but like you gotta have to give people like a little bit of what makes golf interesting and fun. It is those moments. Like that's the whole thing is like you go through a bunch of boring stuff for the exciting stuff to

finally happen. So that being said, the cantilever finish and the La Cava stuff and the audio they got on all that was great. Like the shade, our, and that was, that was really good. And um, did it make you guys view that situation any differently at all? For me, not being there and, and I was at a wedding. I wasn't really plugged into the rider cup watching it. Like I was catching what I could and stuff, but I think it helps the Kava a little bit and it makes it kind of makes Rory look like just kind of pissed that he got beat a little more. Like I think the Kava is still in the wrong. Like you don't insert yourself into the event, but like he's fired up like just kind of taking in the whole breadth of what can't lay did the last three holes. Like of course he's fired up, right? But then yeah, I think

Roy is just mad. He missed the putt. And then that kind of feeds what happens afterwards at the car with, with bones and stuff. It's just like, he's just pissed. And so I don't think it was quite as egregious if I'm not watching it back. What Lekava did is quite as egregious. I thought it was in real time. Yeah, you don't do, you don't do that. Sorry. That's the one big take. Well, you just don't do that. I will say, like credit to Rosie too.

He got in there and he's the best. And it was good. He's like, honestly, that was pretty funny. I was pretty good. Just lingered a little too long. He's like, I know I told Rory that I was like, okay, that, that like makes a lot more sense than the Lekava try to defend what he, like it looks like if you don't hear the audio, it looks like the Cava is aggressively yelling out like,

what the fuck did I do? What did I do? But in reality, he's like, yeah, yeah, I think you're too long. It's fine. It's fine. We're fine. I'm celebrating a little bit. Uh, I don't know. That was, that was what the writer comes all about. Shane Lowry was great and all that too.

Uh, Shane Lowry was everywhere. Thomas, I don't know if they showed any of his golf shots, but he's just involved in every, every single moment. He's too muscle for sure. For a scope. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thomas Bjor leave him the fuck alone. Leave him the fucking loan or whatever it was.

I really enjoyed ZJ getting absolutely bodied by Ricky walking off 15 green. Ricky makes a big putt and ZJ is like, you want anything up there? Meaning like, do you want any advice for 16? And Ricky just hits up with that. No. And we know he inserts himself into the seat on the speed right before speed hits it, the water, but I like that there was a little flicker of the should he have conceded the putt or not. I'm glad they at least, at least put that in the yearbook that, that feels like it, it did get kind of, I don't know if glazed past, but, uh, you know, where do you guys stand on that point? You gotta make them put it. I agree. Okay. Sozed past, but, uh, you know, where do you guys stand on that point? You got to make him put it.

I agree. Okay. So I just wanted to like, definitely gotta make a put it, but it was also a really fucking short put. It was under two feet, right? I agree. You still make a put it, but it was wildly short. I, I don't, you gotta make a put it though. You gotta make him put it. And I'd also like, not to be a cheesedick, but it's like, Tommy probably like wants to put it. He probably wants to have the putt at them. You got to make him put it. And I'd also like, not to be a cheesedick, but it's like, Tommy probably like wants to put it. He probably wants to have the putt to win the Ryder Cup rather than just like, Oh, that's good. Pick it up. Yeah. I know. It's kind of like a disservice to like

everyone involved. Like, like you're, I mean, it's almost like scummy to your competitors. It's almost like unsportsmanlike not to let him put it. It's ripping the rip in the PlayStation out of the wall. If you're going to lose. Yeah, exactly. It's almost like unsportsman like not to let him put it. It's ripping the rip in the PlayStation out of the wall. If you're going to lose. Yeah, exactly. It's like, let me beat you. Yeah. I'm really finishing off.

No, let the game end. Come on. I said this afterwards, like my biggest regret of my process for the Ratter Cup was talking myself into Ricky and there was nothing in that, uh, this that made me think anything other than he walks off. It's like, yep, didn't have it. It's like, no, I needed you to like like want to be clawing down the stretch like no fucking way I'm letting this end on my watch and just have it casually be like, nope didn't have it. It's like God damn it, dude

I was rooting for you. We were all rooting for you. How dare you? He ruined my fantasy team. I thought I thought they did a really good job capturing like the family nature of the event, you know, the wives that come Rotary and just like the energy in the room and all this stuff. I could have used even more of that. I know they famously like didn't let cameras into the team room and things like that. But even some of the stuff on the bus of the US team talking about how you line up putts right edge and stuff like that, like that is great. More natural.

You can do that unless talking head stuff would be, uh, again, a, uh, a note I would have, because that's just way more engaging, I think, but, uh, can you imagine how bad the team room stuff must have been if they, if they did have that? Oh, they did. The good job with the hat stuff too. I mean, they introduced that concept and, and it's still obviously weird and confusing and a really weird storyline, but, uh, I thought they documented it well.

Pretty vulnerable moment in celebration, right? Rory, like hugs, rom and says like, honestly, John, you make me want to be better. Kind of out of left field kind of couple of superstars having a good cry. Yeah. I, you know, it's good stuff. God, they got to show that Rory chip shot on 17. It was maybe the best shot I've ever seen in my entire life. Just flashed one that just got it.

Nobody's ever flashed harder than that. So that brings us to the end of season two. Um, any, any concluding thoughts? I would say I'm glad this show exists. And, uh, I do think there's some question marks on like what, like, there's different ways to go about this show. So like how to do a season three. And I think we've kind of cataloged that but I'm, you know, yeah, I think it's good for for golf and and I got something out of it as a somebody who's pretty plugged in. And I think my, you know, my non

golf friends, I think they will watch it and they will be like, whoa, I didn't realize all that happened last year, right? And I'll say like, well, there's a lot more that happened that they didn't talk about. So yeah, it's a good sophomore effort. Yeah, here, here, I agree. I think people are gonna really, really like it. And I'm with you, I'm glad it exists. I think for his, you know, as skippables,

I think four and five are, the rest are like really good content and are going to absolutely slap. Um, I think people are going to really enjoy it. I think the highs are way higher in this one. Um, I think they, they really do capture a lot of really good stuff. And, uh, yeah, we're maybe a little heavy on the critiques, but, uh, just, of course, always just sharing our opinion and reaction. It's how you get better, man?

We're just trying to make things better. Uh, so you got a note in here. They need a masters just to make the episode. I agree with that. Do a masters episode. Like it's the most important event in golf and trying to, to help casual fans understand that of like, why does everything stop in the golf world and focus on this, you know, Augusta, Georgia, I think is would would be a service to everyone.

That's, that's a good point. Also, I mean, just got to do something on Tiger Woods, right? You just can't show him walking around Augusta and that's like the only reference we have to him for the entire season. You can get anyone in the world to talk about Tiger Woods. You can, you have all this archival footage. You can, you can profile what if I was a casual fan, I would not, I need like an update on what Tiger's up to. I don't know if I have all of the information that you know, you don't have to do a

deep dive into his extramarital affairs and all this stuff, but like do the health stuff do like what it was, what is Tiger Woods involvement look like going forward. He's on the board now. He's being in charge of, of kind of shaping the policy of the PGA tour going forward. Like I, I hope there's something on Tiger in season three. That's, you want to talk about what casual fans would want to see. It's that it gets absolutely that versus like, if it's Patrick profile again, I like those guys, but that, that, that jump, those are the two things that jump off the page to me for improvements. Um, look, a lot of things we said in our episode after season one, they did improve on in season two.

So I think they can continue to do that and continue to refine. And, you know, anyway, we talked a lot about this in season one of like, you know, is this change things for golf, the way it changes things for formula one and our, our takeaway was like, uh, no, uh, cannot fix until you fix the broadcast, like nothing's going to actually change. People are going to tune, turn this on back. Why the fuck am I actually watching this? Obviously, it's even worse now than it was a year ago in terms of what it's like to watch that product with a diminishing star

return. And so big, sure. Especially with things, you know, bifurcated or dispersed right now, I think having something like this, it is a bit of center of gravity of like taking in the whole picture of last year, what were the big, that's why I would encourage or if they were asking me more yearbook stuff and pick your spots on the profile stuff, pick, you know, make sure that profile stuff sings and focus more on just like big, what were the storylines last year? And, you know, but again, DHS we know that depends on what you got, right? Yeah. And I think what's interesting,

solid to your point is like, I think you could probably, I don't have the numbers to back this up, but I think you could make a pretty compelling argument that there probably are more people talking about pro golf and there are markedly less people watching pro golf. And that's just a very interesting like byproduct of this thing, you know, where it's like, yeah, I do think it's going to bring more casual fans into like being aware

of and talking about the game of golf and maybe even like check and scores. But like, I don't, I don't know how many people are watching. I was, I was listening to playoff this morning or whatever, you know, I was listening to that guy, Derek Thompson Bill Simmons' podcast a couple of weeks ago, and he had a point that it kind of summed up my NBA fandom. He was like, I am not. He's like, I've watched, until the playoffs, I'll watch like 10 minutes of the NBA. But I listened to, you know, Risillo, and he was like, telling like telling Bill like I listen to you and and we're solo. He's like, I will probably listen to 60 hours of NBA Podcast content. It like exists almost as a thing.

Like, and I think golf is in that vein as well. And I was like, man, I'm kind of the same way. Like I listen to those guys talk NBA and I don't really watch the NBA, but I just like kind of like knowing what's going on. And it's a lot easier to have someone else watch it for you. Yeah. And so there's something to that with golf, which, which might be, I think a positive for golf as all these things are so like, God, so exhausting and, and watching golf is exhausting. Just with the broadcast that it's nice to have something help you. All right. Let me check in here. What happened last year? Okay, cool. I'm ready for, I'm ready to watch the Masters this year. Great. Yeah. You know, it's, it's, I think

that is all only upside for, for golf and for Netflix. I think it, it's, we can definitively say though, like if, if the tour or pro golf and general thought Netflix was going to solve all of its problems, like we called that out last year, no, it's not going to. And a year's worth of data would say not even close, not even remotely close. Ratings did not jump because of full swing last year, despite the full swing being a great success and a lot of people watching it. So that's pointing the, I'm pointing the,

the blame and the aim here towards the organizers of pro golf to say, like pretty tough to have screwed it up this royally. And, uh, season two is not going to change your fortune towards as well told they did want to, they did want to win though. You know, I think this team really want, I really want this team to win. All right. Uh, for, I was going to say for D Gizzle, but I don't think that works. Uh, nearly as well as J as J Tizzle, but for the pie man and Mr. Icarito himself, uh, we are going to sign off

here. Thank you everyone for tuning in. We'll be back this weekend. We'll be back with them for the happy hour episode depending on when you listen to this. We back for Bayhill recap as well. Crack on. Be the right club today. Yes! Now, that's better than most. How about in? That is better than most. Better than most!