No Such Thing As A Fish - 504: No Such Thing As Captive Willy

Episode Date: November 9, 2023

Dan, James, Anna and Andrew discuss bingeing, beeping, recording and re-introducing. Visit nosuchthingasafish.com for news about live shows, merchandise and more episodes. Join Club Fish for ad-free episodes and exclusive bonus content at apple.co/nosuchthingasafish or nosuchthingasafish.com/patreon

Hello and welcome to another episode of No Such Thing as a Fish, a weekly podcast coming to you from the QI offices in Hobern. My name is Dan Schreiber, I am sitting here with Andrew Hunter Murray, James Harkin, and Anna Toshinsky. And once again, we have gathered around the microphones with our four favorite facts from the last seven days, and in no particular order, here we go. Starting with fact number one, and that is Andy, the beep was invented in 1957. Was it? No, well. So I got this from an article which I won't name because it turns out now to be incorrect. But basically it's about the beep that happened on the Sputnik satellite, launched in 1957. And really annoyingly Anna has

found about 58 examples with beats dating back to the mid-40th century. And it's just like, welcome back in. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. We didn't get this from Mazee Adam, I was telling you that much. He's listened politely to the fact that he didn't question it. But it certainly, when the beep became popular, and the big thing about Sputnik was the fact that it beeped.

And in fact, I think, I think, that's all Sputnik could do. It basically, yeah. It was the size of a big pumpkin, and it was a ball of aluminium or metal and it just, I would say the main thing it could do was go around the earth in orbit. Like the beep was secondary almost. Yeah, you're right, you're right. The main thing was it could fly around the world, that's true. But no one would have known if it wasn't beeping because it was broadcasting radio pulses.

It was, it was, it was, allited the Earth every hour and a half roughly. It beeped for 21 days only. But the beep was seen as quite spooky. Because you could hear it. How many radio people could tune in and listen to Sputnik. It's amazing. And Life magazine said it was an eerie,

intermittent croak. And for a fan of a beep. Does it sound like a beep actually? Does it? No. I guess if you don't know what a beep is, it's only been mentioned 5 million times in history. I guess for a few people it would have been the first electronic beep there.

It's pretty good. Yeah, and it was the beep that changed the world, right? Because suddenly the Americans were like, oh shit, rushes in space. This is evidence because we can hear it beeping, we're going to have to do something about that and then they decided to create NASA and go to the moon. Yeah, there's a theory that if the Soviets hadn't launched Sputnik or America had launched the first satellite, then you wouldn't have had the moon program in the same way. I'm sure that I might not have had a poll. Yeah, because it really frightened America. Oh, definitely.

Literally a ball that webbed. But the other thing is the reason it was so shiny is because they also, the idea was the guy Karelov who created it or who designed it He decided that he wanted it shiny so that people will be able to see it in space But actually it was way too small and no one could see it's all right I mean if you had a really good telescope you could but I think it could it like a dawn and dusk Although you'd have to know where to be pointing. It would probably be very hard to spot really He wanted it to be quite a lot bigger as well So that people be able to see it.

But it really did freak people out at the time. Even Krzysztof said, now we not only have a rocket that can fly to other countries, but we have a satellite that flies around the world. I don't have to point to this with my finger, any idiot can see it. They might as well put bombers and fighters in the museum. You know, he was just like alluding to like,

we're now the superpower. It's new, it's new, because isn't it? Is what he's referring to? We can put that course there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, our technology is sophisticated. And the Americans is not long after trying to send up their satellite.

That didn't work. It was called Kaputnik. I think they called it, not the Americans, the Russians making fun of it. Yes, that was, it was called the Vanguard. Yeah. The Vanguard one, yeah. And they that was, it was called the Vanguard. Yeah. And they sort of panicked after Sputnik.

And it was a month, two months later. Yeah, yeah, and I was so embarrassing. It exploded on the launch pad. Then it fired into a nearby swamp. But unfortunately, the firing into a swamp had made the sensors on board think, oh great, we're in orbit. So then it just started beeping from the swamp. So embarrassing.

Just mortified. As well as Cupputnik was also known as Flopnik, Puffnik, or Stay Putnik. Oh, Stay Putnik, I love that. That's great. It's not often you think that Soviet Russia was a really fun place to be, but I think for that week, it would have been a really fun place to be hanging out.

Oh, it was a lot of hilarious. Just comedy gold. Well, do you know why it didn't? They didn't choose the other project, called Project Orbiter, which had more advanced technology within it, and it was run by someone, and here's your clue. It was run by Werner von Braun, who was, what do you in Germany

say, Brown, not Braun? Oh, I thought Braun. You say, in English, he's known as Horne Brown. Well, I know him as von Braun. That's how I know him. So it was managed by Werner von Braun, who was an artsy. you in English he's known as Bob Brown. Well I know him as Von Braun. That's how I look at him. Yeah. So it was managed by Werner von Braun who was an Nazi and the Americans thought might be a bit awkward if our first satellite that we get into space was built by an Nazi.

So a Nazi who was at the end of the war as were quite a few Nazi scientists, he was taken on by America so they could get an Nazi technology. And so they started using his brain and then... That is wrong. And his brain. Well, okay. That's it. We can all go home now. I like one of the cultural things that happened with this is that in the way that

everything after Watergate gate became gate. Nick became popularized in Western culture. So there was peace, Nick, there was beat, Nick, neat, Nick, or all different words, but beat, Nick is one that's really stuck out for us. So it came from Mudnick, which is a Yiddish word, me, a bit of a... It did. Nick was already used as a... Nick was already used, yes, for the popular.

It was popularized, right? Yeah, it was popularized. And by... No, Nick is going to be... was popular, right? Yeah, the popular one. The big one. The Russian Nick is just, it means a person like cousin, you know, someone called Nick. Podcast Nick would be someone who makes podcasts. Oh, that's cool, yeah.

You know what we're saying? It was a massive deal. And you know, Chris Shov made this huge speech saying, we've conquered the world now, et cetera. Yeah. Well, they launched Sputnik. And then no one really got that it was a big deal. Kristoff announced it to the cocktail party he was at, and everyone politely clapped and

didn't understand it. Prafter, the next day, it was like a little thing way down on the front page. It was almost not on the front page. It was almost not on the front page. It got less prominence than Marshall's Zookov visiting Hugo Slavier, which arguably in historical terms turns out to have been a smaller story. How interesting. So why did they do that?

Because of how the world reacted. The West reacted to it a few times. The West reacted to the West's humans, taking off its superiority. The next day in Profter, it was all over the headlines. Because the US had suddenly, you know, the New York Times had done was, oh my god, they've beaten us, we're flattened, we're ruined, and Russia went, oh, maybe this is a huge deal that we've done this, well done, us. And then they got really excited about it. I did read a report saying, Christoph announced it, like he got the news

from the launch pad, whatever it was in orbit, and smiled, was happy, and announced it to the room, and then went to sleep that night. But the alternative, that is him remaining permanently away, so the rest of his life. In America, there were lots of restaurants that released merch. There were Sputnik lollipops. There was a toy manufacturer, did a scooter, which was just the same scooter, but they called it PEDNIC. There were spherical containers that held ice creams. They would put antennas on top so that you would have the straw

as the Sputnik kind of look as they had antennae that were coming out. Yeah, the lollipops have multiple, um, I reckon the poll is, uh, yeah, yeah. Exactly. It had multiple antennae, right? I have two or four. Four, I think four. Yeah, that's true. That's really hard to eat a lollipop, which has got four sticks sticking in. Yeah. Four people can eat it at the same time. Oh, one stick. Oh, no.

How many kids have you got them? Three kids. Yeah, if you could have a one mollipop that you buy them. No. Ah! How many kids have you got then? Three kids. Yeah, if you could have a one-mole pop that you buy them, and I'll be your friend. For a fairytale film could be there. You contain them. If you've been in one location, I should know. Sorry, but if they're all looking at one lollipop at the same time, people are gonna think they're snogging.

So just say I'm sitting in the pool, getting the bomb. Yeah, that's true. And then the next thing that happened, so obviously America's smashed back on its heels, it's reeling, the next thing happens, Sputnik II, and this one's big, and it's got a dog on it. Yeah, and that's, you know, like that. And that was when they invented the bark, wasn't it?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that was poor bloody Liker, who had a pretty rotten time in space and then sort of conked out. Which means Barker, in fact, like us. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But what all this was leading up to was the 40th anniversary of the Soviet Union being founded, right? Because it's 1957, October, you know, October Revolution, all of that stuff, or November, depending on the calendar. Anyway, there was a theory in the West that the Soviet Union was launching a third Sputnik, which was going to go to the moon

with a hydrogen bomb on it. And an elephant. And there was a lunar eclipse coming up, so the moon was going to be completely bottomed out, you know, in the shadow of the sun, or shadow of the Earth, sorry. So the theory was that they were going to detonate the bomb against the moon and create a kind of super full moon, because it would be even brighter than a normal full moon. Yeah. You know. And anyway, they won't do that. Well, they do lots of split, well, a split make just means satellite.

So anything that they send up is a split make basically. Right. But yeah, they've done 20 are they think now? But not, not of them have been the moon blowing up. No, no, no. Which was a stupid idea. I don't even think I'd know if I saw something that was a bit brighter and a bit bigger than the moon because you haven't got the actual moon to compare it to I

Yeah, man. Well, it will be a full moon for a second as the destination happened Do you know what every now and then like once every month or so? Do you not go outside to go up the moon's quite big tonight? Oh, yeah Yeah, it's a certain time of days, isn't it? Yeah, do you think that's always a spot? Nick I think that's it Days, isn't it? Yeah, do you think that's always a spot, Nick? I think that's it. I think the following, when the moon is near the horizon, that's the Russians blowing it up.

Wow! They're wasting a lot of resources on this. Yuri Gagarin. First man to all but the earth? Yep. Cosmonauts, man. It's first man in space. Was he? I thought someone had gone up a bit before that, but not. Gone past the carman line. He was the first. That space. You're easy. Yeah, I know.

OK, first. Now, the Mima carman waiting. He was the first. That space. You're easy. Yeah, I know. OK, first. Now, the Mimea car man waiting in the sky was originally written about that. Oh, I'm sorry. He was the first. He was five foot two, which means that he would only just qualify it to be an ass duodesk on Ryanair.

Right. But what was his dream? What's it? It's what he was trying to do all that time. He was trying to get the attention of McLeary here. That's really good. Because the first time he went in space, it was one thing, but he had to pay for his seat. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, at the space, dogs. The Soviet ones, like her. Yes, like her. Well, there's an argument that they preserved peace and stopped the world from imploding, exploding, due to new tech. And here is the argument.

So in 1960, the Soviets sent up some more dogs. They were called Belkhran Strelker. And they went into orbit with some rats in a rabbit and some flies. And they orbited the world 17 times. And they came back down. And they were big celebrities. They had chat shows and stuff.

Because there's a huge chat show. I don't know, they host to their own chat show. Sorry, I think they might just get to each other. They might be a small segment. But hosting is a good idea. Every week the guest has to feed Belkeren Strucker. I think that's a really nice idea. Lovely.

Let's pitch it. It's our next commission. Anyway, so they were the first dogs who survived, because some people were a bit sad that like it didn't. Anyway, soon after that, JFK and Christophe and their wives had a meeting a summit in Vienna And it was awkward as things were often worse at the time between America and the USSR And then Jackie Kennedy broke the tension by saying to Christophe, oh what happened to those two lovely dogs? He sent it to space by the way and Christophe said said, oh they actually had puppies, do you want to draw on? And he posted

her, so if you would like to... It arrived unfortunately, not quite as alive as it was in the Cuban Missile Crisis, that was sort of very rare. No, he put the bubble wrap in the envelope. Yes, my puppy arrived at the White House. Were they called, were they called pupnicks? I actually think. Were they called Pupnix? I actually think they might have called them Pupnix. That rings a bell, it would make sense.

They have the same sense of humor as you did in the White House at the time. I'm sponsored by Clik Spotler. Oh yeah, Spotnik. Yes, it's a whimmussing. Muttnik. There we go. Very good. Just edit it out of my one, you got three really good ones.

But keep that comment in so everyone will always want that. Yeah, just edit it out of mind when you got three really good ones Keep that comment in so everyone will always want that Write in with your speculations is to Andy's shit suggestion Anyway, he was a white house pet puppy pet and it really calm things down I mean obviously things didn't remain calm for the subsequent 30 years The Elkron Strelkkhod, the only ones that you learn about in Russian schools, really, they don't really mention Leica very much. I am so sad. After Leica went up, dog lovers worldwide protested.

There was a march at the UN with featuring dogs wearing protest signs. Wow. It was also a producer of a chat zone saying, what am I going to do now, please? Can we say a thing or two about beeps? I'm sure, I'm gonna do that with you. Can we say a thing or two about beeps? I'm sure, yeah. And we don't have time to list all the previous beeps. Try it though this one.

Let's see how far we go. So this is a really fun thing about beeps. Scoders, right, the cars. Oh yeah. The horns get tested, they can't horns get tested. And these days they're tested way more in the development process than they have been before. So the scoders in the 70s were tested 50,000 times to make sure they wouldn't run out of beeps after that Sorry, you beeped a horn 50,000 times before selling the car

I don't think I'm just going to be going, that doesn't happen. Fifty-two every car that's codeous sounds. It happens to have testing happens. This is a development process, I'm sorry. I have a scode on, I've got this big ham print. I live my cereal, I have one to buy. They're not crash tests that we can't before they sell it. That's right.

Just going to drive this into a wall before we send it to you, sir. So no. Sorry, yeah. Test it. But these days, these days electric scooters they get a hundred and fifty thousand But that that's regionally specific and when they sell cars in India They're tested five hundred thousand times because in India use of the car hall is way bigger like everyone Okay, so they have to test half a million honk Superfull wow Like they do honking the way you're supposed to honk.

As in the only time you're ever supposed to honk is if someone, to let someone know you're there to stop an accident. If you drive in India, they're doing that because they're about to drive into you and that honking and stuff. They don't do it in the UK like, honk honk, the traffic lights are gone.

You need to move like, oh yeah, that's true. They do proper honking and stuff. They don't do it in the UK like, honk honk, the traffic lights gone, you need to move like, oh yeah that's true. They do proper honking and into your shirt. I think you're also encouraged to honk as a way of saying goodbye to someone you're not going to see for a few minutes. That's actually, yeah, that's the only other time. Is that the highway car? It's the highway car, is it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also honk if you love blah, whatever's all the sign at the side of the road.

That's a part of the two. So we're buying a car as well as asking for mileage, you should ask for honk if you love blah, whatever's all the sign at the side of the world. That's a positive thing. So we're buying a car as well as asking for mileage. You should ask for honkage, just have a way to say. I mean honk is a car. How many honks are impacted for this bad boy? Stop the podcast. Stop the podcast. Hi everybody, we wanted to let you know that this week's episode is sponsored by Aero. That's right, Aero is an extraordinary water bottle, but it's not your regular water bottle.

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keep performance indicators. They are designed to give you consistently excellent performance absolutely for free and you can get it by going to NetSweet.com slash fish. That's NetSweet.com slash fish to get your own KPI checklist. OK, on with the show. On with the bookers. MUSIC OK, it is time for fact number two, and that is James. OK, my fact this week is that William Gladstone once cancelled an evening engagement

so he could binge on the latest popular drama series. So this is William Gladstone who was a British Prime Minister and quite famously quite doour and serious and whatever. So I quite like the idea of him, you know, watching Breaking Bad Or or whatever. But obviously this wasn't that. This was the Woman in White, which was a story by Wilkie Collins, which was originally done in... Sirials. It was originally sold in breakfast cereals. So it was a free gift at the bottom of a puff legs boxes.

And it's originally done in cereals in magazines. And then the entire book came out in 1860, I think 1859, 1860. And he got it and he wanted to read it. So he just cancelled his. I love it. I love it. I love it.

Imagine. What if he was taking a date though? Do you still love it? Oh. What if the date went to the theatre? I was like, where's Willie? He's with Willie. He's with Willie and Wilkie.

You don't get, was he called Wilkie? Well, that is nice. He was his middle name, so he was Willie and Wilkie Collins. I'm just saying you don't get Wilkie's anymore. Actually, he wanted to be called Wilkie. So he insisted that you never call him Mr Collins or you never call him Mr. Collins or you never call him William Collins or whatever. He insisted that everyone just called him like Cher or Madonna. He was just Wilkie.

Really? Because it's dad and his grandfather, I think, were both Williams as well. So I think it was one of those cases where the middle name suddenly became the first name and it was an honorary first. But I think he wanted us to drop the surname as well. We should just be saying Wilkie. Well, that's what he wanted. But I think we should do what shows in respect for the guy. Yeah. The Oxford Dictionary of National Biograph, he says it was typical of his dislike of formality because he was quite an odd cookie who was a wrong cove. He was wrong. Can we talk about the book quickly? Just so quick. Yeah, because the book is

really good. It's, it's, it's, it's, I haven't read it. I've read it. I mean, years and years ago. Yeah, I haven't. I'm really excited to. I've read it. I've read the woman in white and the moonstone.

And he wrote, I think about 20 novels. And those are the two sort of big hits. I've read the first 50 pages, because I bought it on Tuesday. And it's really good. It's really big. It's really big. It's huge.

But they got a writing a chapter of time. So you would, you would, you just, and so it came out in this magazine. It was a Dickens own magazine called All the Year Round. And when it was first published in chapter four, chapter four, chapter four, chapter sales went from 40,000 to 300,000. Oh, it's mega. Yeah.

I'm so excited. But it's weird that he caused Dickens' publication to become so popular because he actually kind of hear a worship Dickens. Didn't he? Whereas really, Dickens. Didn't he? Whereas really, Dickens should have been thanking him for making his magazine all year round, or whatever, go through the room.

Well, he was younger, he was a prodigy of Dickens, and then Dickens quickly fell in love with him and sort of the roles slightly reversed, where he sort of inspired by Wilkie's writing. But he did do this weird, like, Dickens' tribute tour, because we've talked about Dickens traveling around the world and giving lectures, and then he immediately traveled around the world world giving public readings and going to the same locations that Dickens had. I think he took holidays at Dickens' favourite holiday resorts. And then they fell out, didn't they?

Did they? Yeah, they fell out because Charles Dickens' daughter Kate married Wilkie Collins' brother, Charles. And they really properly fell out, and then Collins started really slagging off all of his books. He called Barraby Roach the weakest book that Dickens ever wrote. To be fair, that's true, and I don't think that's necessarily slagging off his books, is it? He was ranking them. He was ranking them.

Imagine if I had ranked all the episodes of this podcast in order, which I definitely haven't. Well, he then went on to say that Dumbian's son's no intelligent person kind of read it without astonishment of the badness of it. Oh yeah, that's a really good thing. Critic. He called Edwin Trude the melancholy work of a worn out brain. Oh god, well that was fun.

Finish, that's unfair. Yeah, he must have said it after Dickens died as well. Yeah, there's stories that he was asked to finish Trude because they thought that he knew Dickens so well in the writing star. Well, that's weird, because Collins, when he was writing a book called No Name, he got really ill and Dickens offered to take over. He said, I know you don't need the help, but if just in case you do want that finished, I can do it for you. So they both were involved in that kind of project. That thing of them, so Dickens' daughter, Mary and Brother Collins' brother,

I guess they would have been the same age because Collins was a much younger man. But part of the reason that Dickens really didn't like the situation was that Wilkie Collins' brother Charles was apparently a complete, just like milk toast, wet blanket. Well he wasn't very wet because he refused to have bats, because he almost drowned when he was five years old, and he was petrified by water for the rest of his life and wouldn't even get into a bath. Wow, right. Okay, that might have been part of it. But it's so weird, because they looked apparently both

sibling and child, Dickens' daughter Katie, they both looked the most like, like Wilkie Collins' brother looked just like him and Katie Dickens looked just like Charles Dickens. Oh really? She had their little goatee beard and she had that. Yeah. That's very funny.

They met through a bloke called Augustus Egg. That was the little friend. I really don't know. Who did Wilkie and Dickens and Collins? Yeah, yeah. And they went on holiday with Egg and Collins lectured Egg on art and hummed opera heirs incorrectly and intermentably to the report. The meeting of those two, they actually met because they were acting

in the same play at the time, right? So Dickens brought him onto a production. The play that they met in was by Edward Bull Willitten, who wrote, it was a dark and stormy night. He was the guy who wrote that sentence. Yes. And this is the great thing. Okay, so this looks back to the woman of white, because Bull Willitten hated the woman of white. He said it was great trash. I think he meant big trash, rather than like, oh, it's great trash, you know. And the point is that Bull will listen

had had his wife, Rosina, committed to an asylum a couple of years before. And that plotline is in the woman in white. And all of Collins's works, in some way, loads of them are about women being mistreated by men or being, you know, like. There's very much point of you haven't read the woman in white, by the way. Oh, yeah, the way. Oh yeah, we'll start from the end at this

stage. Can I just say I don't think we should be giving spoilers to classic lessons. Yeah and Collins dedicated the book to the the man who the Commissioner for Lunacy was his title who had helped release Rosina from the asylum. Really? So obviously Paul would have hated the book because it was such a such a slam on him. And the other turns out. And yeah have hated the book because it was such a slam on him. And it turns out, and yeah, that makes sense because I was reading in a bit tree of Wilkie Collins and just after he died and this friend of his was writing it said that when he wrote the woman in white, Collins had told him he received a letter from Rosina

listens wife who said, I really enjoyed your book, but I thought the villain, I thought the villain was a really poor villain, not realistic at all You know next time if you want a villain come to me. I have my eyes upon a villain every minute of the day It is my husband So one of those things that happened when the book came out is it was one of those things we've spoken about where When things take off the merch just starts rolling. You know, there was a waltz that was named after it. There were cloaks, so hats, perfumes were made that were sort of like meant to be the woman in white's perfume. It was just full of merch around London. Walter became a fashionable name for babies,

because there's a character that's called Walter. Yeah, that was a thing. Yeah, Walter's the hero, isn't he? The book kind of slightly boring hero, and the heroine is slightly boring as well. Wow, so I'm not allowed to spoil the ending but you're allowed to spoil the fact that people in it are slightly boring. Is that a spoiler? I think that's more of an opinion. Do you know what really annoys me about basically all adaptations and this applies to lots of stuff but I'm going to use the woman in white to vent. There have been loads of films and TV series of it over the years and the most recent was 2018. I saw with Jesse Buckley in it,

who's a attractive actress. And the thing that I remember from the woman in white is that there are these two quite extreme characters who are the real good characters. There's Count Fosco, who's this hugely fat Italian villain. And then there's Marion, who is sharp very bright very bold and very ugly She's like got a moustache. She's got a huge masculine jaw She's ugly enough that it was almost repulsed by her when because she looks really attractive from behind

It's one of those Sort of 90s rom-com reveals who turns around and he's like I just shallow how 90s romcom reveals she turns around and he's like Oh face I just shallow howl. A shallow howl I think I'm a center of shallow howl. If you thought she looked attractive from behind And yeah every single adaptation she's not ugly. How interesting Do you think that the actors are taking away jobs from ugly actors? I genuinely do Because they are quite incredibly annoying.

No, they sort of make themselves look a bit tomboyish. And I think it's bullshit in entertainment today. You don't do it with men. No, they do fit people up a lot. Yeah. Well, they just pick a fit actress to play an ugly role, because they think that people can't handle watching an unattractive woman.

OK, yeah. Do they mention it in the dialogue like as people go up to her in the movie and go, you're an ugly person. She's just there looking stunning. Oh yes, I know this face. Oh, stop, it's a complete dog. It does happen.

So the Jack Reacher books, those were adapted and they put Tom Cruise in the role. And that was the biggest uproar about the whole thing. That he's meant to be six foot but 10, he's meant to be, hulkingly massive, and then he got this. That's not like, that's just drastic miscasting, as in obviously, he's not crazy, brilliant, but he doesn't look like Jack Reacher,

who I think at one point stops a bullet with his chest. That is, what? I think at one point in the books, Jack, anyway, can we talk a bit about working collins? Yeah. And so his health situation was quite interesting because it was bad. Yeah.

He had bad health. If he had good health, it wouldn't be nearly as interesting. Unless it was really good. Or if it was so good, he was still alive. Then he'd be a sick, yeah. As it was, he had neurodramatism, spasm suffocation. I don't think we know what that was. Gout in the eyes, a boil on his groin

At one point his partner Caroline had to mesmerize his feet to try and cure them. Oh wow. Yeah But don't forget mesmerism before but how do you know when you sit down on your leg for too long and it goes to sleep? Yeah Yeah, it's something like that. You just sat on them. I don't know. Because yeah, Gauti's, so you couldn't do it through mesmerising his eyes. They were really bunged up. You don't get Gaut in your eyes. That's what I know. I know, but when you read the descriptions of what happened to his eyes, they were bleeding, they were pussy, they were... I believe, again, this is based on this o-bit written by his friend. He said that he went around to his house when he was older and he couldn't stop looking at his

eyes because they looked so weird and you couldn't really meet your eye properly. And eventually Colin said, I see all of you in my eyes, I noticed distracting, I've got Gowtie and the friend implies and we know it's the fact that it's probably all the Lord and him who was taking. Yeah, yeah, I need to go cry. It wasn't a disease of the eye, he was just off his face. It's going to be great in his biopic when Tom Cruise is playing here. But they're saying, your eyes, they're horrible at this. Apparently, he was taking enough to kill six people every day.

Yeah. And he was also taking poppers in about the same amount for his heart. Did it see a student in the other two thousands? Wait, did poppers, I didn't think poppers existed. I didn't really. Well, I'm ill nitrate. All right. So, yeah, that's...

They didn't come in this fun, colorful package that they do. Now. I wouldn't think poppers existed. I didn't really. Well, I'm ill nitrate. All right. So, yeah, that's... They didn't come in this fun, colorful package that they do now. I wouldn't know, actually. And he was taking arsenic as well as a whole my entire... Oh, Wilkie. All that meant that he saw ghosts all the time. Yeah. Yeah, he thought he had a doppelganger, a ghost Wilkie that was with him. And it was just a mirror, wasn't it?

How did he come up with that amazing name, the ghost. He's one of the best. Yeah, he would like Dan says, the doppelganger would be around, there would be ghosts pushing down the stairs when he's trying to go up to bed, so he couldn't kind of... You know that dream that people have, what you just can't get up a hill, and it would kind of be quick,

and that kind of thing, but it was ghosts pushing him down. And then when he got to the top of the the stairs you would be met by a green woman with tusks. Do you think maybe only taking enough to kill five people that take my good idea, will you? No, no. And his love life as well was absolutely, it was just really interesting.

It was kind of the time, I guess it was. Interesting because he was selfish, otherwise. He's very healthy. No, interesting even for today, I would say, damn. Someone these days had this love life. I would be interested. I want to know more. He didn't want to marry. Fine. And he was in a relationship with a woman called Caroline Graves. She was a widow. She had a child from a radio relationship. And then he started an affair with a woman called Caroline Graves. She was a widow, she had a child from a radio relationship. And then he started an affair with a woman

called Martha Brut, right? And she was, I think, about 20 when they met. And they had three children together. Caroline Graves didn't love this. She went off to marry someone else. Fair enough? Fair enough. And he actually went to the wedding.

So it might have been all... I think it was quite friendly. I got the impression there wasn't too much resentment. So that's good. So then Wokey Collins is in a relationship with his new one with Martha Rudd. They have three children together. He sort of keeps them in a flat away from his house. And he sort of, he only wants to be known as Dawson when he goes over, I think. He just sort of hasn't assumed name for the landlady. He doesn't want any publicity, all of that. But then Caroline, his previous partner,

her marriage doesn't work out, so she comes back, she lives with him, and he's just rattling between two families back and forth, and then sometimes he takes them all on holiday together to Ramsgate and puts them in boarding houses next to each other, and all the kids play together, and they have a great time. I think the kids play together, but the women never meet.

Yeah, it's really nice. It's so weird. And he's at one, I presume, at one house or the together, but the women never meet. Yeah, it's women. It's so weird. And he's at one, I presume, at one house or the other, all the time. Wow. And they just have to kind of, that's the situation. It sounds like a sort of amateur play, where the women are both played by the same person. Yeah. It's so impossible.

They never meet. They live basically on the same street. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. They walk out of the dog. They're like, oh, you just miss the dog. She's going to drive it out of breath. they're like oh you just miss

Mrs. Do you know where Martha was born? No, she was born in Martha That sounds like you just conjugated her name Yeah, I'm afraid unimaginative parents. Martha Minnorthford. I was gonna say where the heck is Martha? I think it's a village. A village in Norfolk.

That's so good. So did they name her after the village? Not clear. I did try to find out. Funnily enough, it wasn't one of those facts that's been recorded to history. I was like, I think she wasn't born in peniston. That's right.

If you are in Martha listening to this now, please write in. Yeah. Just tell us what it's like. Yeah. Send us a photo. I know a bit unsure about that, but you don't do the emails anymore, I don't. Oh, yeah, sorry.

Of course, inundators with events. If you want from Martha. If you've ever been to Martha, I already did any place to get in with that. No, it's not. It's the last time him with that. Right? It was the last time I said that. I said something like, if you are eating particular foods in America right now, and it was thanks to that bloke David Fairchild who imported them all,

and we got a lot of emails of people eating avocado, people eating rice, I can't remember what it was, but it was a lot. Martha tended, so Martha said she could have married Wilkie Collins whenever she wanted. That was a bit of a lady-dath for just too much thing. But she didn't go to his funeral nor did their kids weirdly. But then she did. She was there, but she was called Caroline Drey. What's Martha?

Oh, she did go to the blue. After Caroline died, she took over Tending Wookie Collins' grave. So it just seems like there's so much happening below herself, isn't it? Where's that from? Caroline was also buried in that grave. Yes, Caroline was buried in the same plot. Wastper, she tended Caroline's grave as well, but... She'd greatly dug herself into the coffin for a while.

Oh, thanks for looking up to my grave. Clives out of the coffin. No problem. Okay, it is time for fact number three, and that is my fact. My fact this week is that 15th century Korean royals had their lives so thoroughly documented that the records include King's complaining about their recorders recording them. So this was sent to me by my friend Mark Vent, I've never heard of it, it's called the Annals of the Joe's and Dynasty, where basically they recorded literally everything. Included in these accounts, in 1404 for example, there was a king who fell off a horse by accident

he was really embarrassed and he went up to the guy recording it saying can you not put in the whole horse falling thing and the guy put it in so we've got an account of the king then bitching about the guy going I bet he's put in the horse thing. Stop writing, stop writing, stop writing, don't break that, I knew BUS! Like you know the never ending story there's a character sitting on the top of a mountain, transcribing everything. This is basically how they treated their entire dynasty. And as a result, we've got 500 years worth

of complete records of the king and all of the kings, administrators, and yeah, it's incredible. It's such a good idea. Like, unlike now, literally this week, we're here in the people are deleting WhatsApp's, you know, they're doing government business and they're deleting the WhatsApp's every seven days.

So you never know what they said. And you were like, if we'd had this system, they couldn't have done it. Because the king wasn't even allowed to see it. We'll see it a lot. You were allowed to see it. You weren't allowed to look at the recordings of what you'd done and said.

Yeah, exactly. The rules were very strict about who couldn't look in the animals. But they were broken sometimes. Absolutely. So there was, I read an account of a tyrant king who looked in the annals and then six people were executed because of what he found written in there. So I think after that they probably had to tighten up the rules. Maybe he was the reason the kings then weren't allowed to look in the annals. So what it was, I mean, I don't know if this is the specific account you're talking about,

but the, the people who were writing the histories often went back in to change what they've written, because the king wasn't allowed to look at what happened, you know, he'd have to die, and then people could look at what was said about him, but politicians would get word that maybe something was written down. So the historiophers would go back into it and kind of change it, and the king found out about that, and he got really pissed off that they were more petrified of the politicians than the king himself of what the king would do. And then that got banned. You weren't allowed to then go in and change your own story. And known as the literati purges weren't they?

And the one Andy's talking about who was Yon Sangun, who was the um, tyrant king. He closed down the university and turned it into his personal pleasure grounds where he would import young girls from around the provinces. He also demolished a huge area where people were living in the capital and turned it into his own hunting grounds. And then when everyone complained, he told his ministers they weren't allowed to speak and they had to wear a sign saying, a mouth is a door that brings in disaster, a tongue is a sword that cuts off ahead. I really thought it was going to rhyme. It probably was in the Korean.

It's like a Korean, yeah. It's like a tongue. It feels like you could have said plaster at some point, a tongue is a sword that... A clueless from plaster, yeah? A clueless from plaster. Wait, what's the mouth? A mouth is a door that brings in disaster, a tongue is a sword that calls for a plaster. It's not amazing, but it's not worth it.

I think it's good. What are the teeth? Something knocked out by your master. Oh, very good. Lovely. Anyway, he sounds like a rosa. Yeah, it's really straight. There were eventually about 2000 volumes of this stuff.

2000 volumes. And it was all sorts of, it was all sorts of clobber as well. It was the weather, it was diplomatic affairs and it was all sorts of it was all sorts of Cobra as well. It was the weather, it was diplomatic affairs, it was the economy, it was you know probably quite a boring job to actually do it Day in day out, it's dribbling away and you must have had this constantly say excuse me slow down please Yeah, and I have to write that down And then I wrote down can you slow down please sorry can you fall off the horse again but slower And then I wrote down, can you slow down please? Sorry, can you fall off the hall again, but slower? Yeah.

Yeah, it's 1,967 books in total as well. They have, they say, if you stacked it, it would be taller than a 10 story building. Is the height we're talking of these books, which just a fight means nothing, but that's quite fun as a visual. Yeah. Thank you. It's a participating way you've mentioned it.

But the point that they make in this thing is until it's been digitized, it was an intensely hard history to get your head around because... Because you got to climb nine stars to get to the level you want. Yeah, exactly. Well, there's not a history book. It's not written, like here's the story of the king. You've got a bit of the king,

and then you've suddenly got the weather report. It's a, you have to hunt through 1,900 volumes to find the thing you're looking for. Yeah, obviously there's you know when there's periods. Yeah, exactly. But now it has been digitized right. It has. Yeah. And it's the plan is to translate them into English by the year 2033. Okay. This dynasty was a, it was an interesting one. It was very long-lasting dynasty. Yeah 500 years. Yeah, 592 until well accounts vary, but I'm going with 1910, which is quite controversial. Well, um, Japan invaded Korea

at that point. So that's probably the only way. That was, yeah, yeah. In the 14th century, when it started, it was, you know, the big deal was that they were moving from an old aristocracy to state-trained bureaucrats who were running the show. And that was, you know. It was very much in the Eastern tradition of meritocracy having preceded us. Well, they were just much more organised than we were. It was meritocracy as long as you weren't a woman. Oh, God, yeah, we're in that absolute whale of a time, of course. There was a ruling from behind the bamboo screen was a thing in the Chosun dynasty,

which was when, if you were a regent, so, so obviously if a male royal hadn't come of age yet and you were the mother, then you could rule, but you had to sit behind the bamboo screen at the time when he sat on the throne acting like he was saying stuff. Oh, I thought it was the boss. Do you have your hand up his butt, but that's it. Oh, I got it. I got it. I got it.

I got it. I got it. I mean, if we thought that that's three kids, like if you say Molly was going to get social services in, the rule from behind the screen, that's quite cool. Yeah, that's really cool. We spoke about that before, haven't we? What was spoken about it in Russia? With someone with behind literally the throat.

The chair. Yeah, just go. Oh, I just say. But here, you weren't't hit like they knew you were there because there's a big screen maybe with some nice pictures on it. But haven't found a lot of your grandmother or your mother ruled. That was one queen I think you ruled for about 25 years from behind the screen. What? With the same region. Yeah, it's kind of that you're not ready yet. Sorry. I thought they had a rule that when you turned 20 so it was if you were under 20. They did,

but you know lots of weird stuff always happens and she liked power And so it was a bit like oh actually you're not Qualified it turns out and she was machinating behind the scene But it was one of the good things about them recording all these details was that you got just a lot of blood and go Because everyone like royals were in the past almost everywhere. Everyone was quite blood thirsty So one of the stories that I like that was recorded in the past, almost everywhere. Everyone was quite bloodthirsty. So one of the stories that I like that was recorded was the story of Prince Saddo. You know what Saddo?

Sadd the English translation. It basically should be. Because he was a sad character. This was in the 1700s, and his dad was King Yongjo, who really wanted Saddo to be studious and clever. Sounds like he was. Well Saddo, he wasn't, he was actually a free spirit. He wanted to be a musician and an artist kind of type. Oh, classic. His dad was a super lame bully Tim.

He used to mock him in front of the unucks and the ladies. Not in front of the unucks. No, that's so unguide. It's the worst. And it drove Sadado a bit mad. Sado went mad. And he sort of, he went from being a really gentle sweet boy to murdering everyone.

And he used to walk into chambers holding seven heads of unix, in fact. Because what else I've cut off? Yeah, yeah, that kind of thing. Yeah. And so his father was then like, well, we can't have this. We can't have you inheriting. So you're going to have to die. but you're not allowed to defile the royal

body by actually killing someone so he asked his son to commit suicide Right and Saddo Saddo though he was was not saddo enough to commit suicide so his dad said okay well then can you climb into this rice chest and then he locked him in a rice chest and starved him to death. Wait did he know that that was gonna be locked? I guess maybe he thought really, I guess this has to happen. Was he put in the chest? He might have been, there might have been someone gently encouraging him

with a hat. Or though, the pistols, you know? Yeah, if it's in the anals, and it must have happened, otherwise it'd be like, you know, don't say that I'm shoving my son into this rice chest right now. Yeah, you're right.

He got involuntarily. Yeah. There was a place, I can't remember where it was. The tradition was that you couldn't kill the king But you could put them in a bag and hit the bag very hard with a club and I think that was the I'm sorry. Yeah, it's like rugs sometimes didn't you so that you didn't couldn't spill blood. You say I'm just beating this rug It actually contains the king or whatever Yeah, yeah, and that was the means of Executing very very posh people right. Yeah, wasn't there a tradition?

There's a pirate tradition as well, it was on there of chest, but putting people in chests. That's treasure. That's... Oh my god. Dad goes back to the beach. He's coming to pick up my treasure.

Oh! It's a sub-pult dedicated skeleton in there. No, it's hook. I'm picking the movie hook. That's what I took. Yeah. You're not really. Right at the beginning, yeah. But they put them in the boo box. The boo box, and he goes inside. The boo box. Yeah, and at the beginning, yeah, when they put them in the boob box, the boob box,

and he goes inside the box. Yeah, and you would have a slide and you'd put scorpions in and close it. We don't need to go into detail. I don't think it is historical facts. Interesting fact, it was Glenn Close, who played the male pirate. No one really knew that.

Uncredited, yeah. Right. Hook, who played hook? No, played the pirate put in the treasure chest. Right, yeah. Got it. Okay. Anyway, stop. One interesting thing about these annals is, like Andy said, they kind of will tell you the weather

and stuff like that. But it also will tell you whenever there was an aurora. And there was a time between 1645 and 1715, which we know sometimes called the mini ice age. And we've managed to use our not we guy called Jan and his team managed to use the records looking into the history books and have worked out the solar cycles that were happening around that time by the number of auroras that were recorded in the annals. That's so cool. That's amazing. And so we now

know that around that time the solar cycle was only about eight years Whereas it's normally a bit longer than that. That's incredible. It's just lovely stuff There's also UFO encounters in the show so in dynasty Which is very exciting so September 1609 There was a reported case of things shaped like a bowl in the sky and there's a few and there's a few paranormal things that make it in there as well. But what's really amazing, I'm so excited by this, I haven't seen it yet, but it's obviously immediately become one of my favorite TV shows, The Jocen X Files.

It's a real TV show, and it's a historical, and it uses accounts from The Jocen Annals as the basis for each episode. And there's an ancient investigator of the time who is assigned to go and investigate all of the weird paranormalities that we find in the annals. What kind of things are we talking about?

Oh, I just told you the UFO. A ball of the show. A ball of the show. A cross-moon sounds like. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's obviously not a UFO, but they recorded it as unidentified stuff. There's cursed items, all that sort of stuff.

And yeah, it's been turned into a... Good thing about the annals is that it's really easy to reenact so much of what happened. So you can make an incredibly accurate historical representation. And I think historical reenactments are much more popular and common in Korea now of this period. Because, you know, you know, exactly what people were wearing, exactly how they ate their meals. Like meals were described in such detail. And the order in which meals, like the

order in which different foods had to be placed on the table, it was all extremely ordered life, you know, everything was very ceremonial, and so, you know, you'd have to bring in the sausages first, and then the cabbage, five minutes later, and we know all of this, so we're in Atmonds, Peace of Cake. That's all. We've got the piece of cake company. Can you guess the seven sins for which you're allowed to divorce your wife under the Jo Son Dynasty?

So her sins, not mine. Yeah. Okay. I don't think. Why if one allowed to divorce the husband's wife? Adultery. Adultery is in there, yes. Fest.

Very good stealing is in there, yes. Inabilites you have children as usually one of them. Yes, theft. Very good stealing is in there, yes. Inability to have children is usually one of them. Yes, very good. Fendi to produce a male heir. You can have daughters if you want. I'll get divorced. Touching my stuff.

What about... Not actually on there, but a little bit of sight. Moving the remote control from where I like it. Where I like it next to where I sit on the sofa to apparently a better place next to the television. Why would you put it next to where I sit on the sofa to apparently a better place next to the television. Why would you put it next to the television? It's a remote control. It should be remote from the place that it's beeping to.

I don't know if I meant to unleash this. No, this is brilliant. No, that's really right. You do know I love my wife and it's all going to be right. I'm going to have to go to the toilet if I've been able to go to the toilet for so far. You've done a failure to bruise a male heir, adultery, stealing.

Or not maintaining the household properly. No, that's not all that. There's excessive jealousy towards other women in the household who I guess would often be concubines of. Oh, okay. So you can't, yeah, you can divorce your wife first. Bad mouthing with the friends they were ever heard. It's a spotted in the annals.

I'm gonna give you that talking excessively. Oh, no. Oh, no. So Danny, too much chat, you're gone. The last one is serious disease. Oh, right. So you've got to... I mean, I think that is irresponsible to get a bad disease when you're trying to produce a male ear.

Yeah, if you've got... If your wife's got gout eyes, I'm not going to... My hair, though. Exactly, get rid of them love. So, the remote control thing... You're stuck with? I think I might have just missed it out. Yeah, I think I might have made sense.

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making up a fake website for Anna when I mentioned that you could buy mugs. Obviously, it would sell wine glasses. Okay, on with the show. On with the poker. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ Okay, it is time for our final fact of the show, and that is Anna. My fact this week is that in real life, it was difficult to free Willy

because he couldn't hold his breath underwater for long enough. Hmm. This is about the film Free Willy. Which, if you haven't seen it, is a classic 90s kids movie as brilliant. Is it? 1993? It's so good. Yeah. It really is great. I know it's about a whale. Yep.

Who is freed. Yes. I feel like there is a scene where he jumps over a wall. Yes. Very good. And that is the comedy, that is his friend with a child who's working to free. And that is not a spoiler, because the climactic moment of the film is on not only the title,

it's also in the trailer and on the poster. It's the poster, it's the whole thing. That's the weirdest thing. I like Anna Karenina having a train on the front cover. No, it really is. Andi, it's called Free Willy. It's not called Free Willy question, Mark. We know that the Free Willy is going to happen, shall we?

No, because free willy is like an imperative. Like free willy, you don't know they're a bit. Oh, it's not. That's active. No, no. No, no. Well, actually, he starts the film as a free will before being captured by some rascally fisherman,

you know, some scoundrels. So he starts off as free willy. But yeah, most of the film, he's not free. So really, to be accurate, it should have been called captive willy, because that's the majority of the film, he's not free, so really, to be accurate, it should have been called captive Willie, because that's the majority of the film. LAUGHTER But captive Willie isn't another genre entirely in films.

And he was a real whale, he was called K-Co. Yeah. Yeah. And he was... So, yeah, there was this whale called K-Co, and after the film came out, basically, it was incredibly popular, anyone who was a child in the 90s, probably, remember seeing it, except James. And... of course.

Of course. I'll say it came out. There was this massive campaign and in fact the film at the end of it had a number to call if you wanted to save the whales, but it was an environmental agency that you got through to. But actually most people who called the number or many thousands just wanted that specific whale to be free. They were like, but what about the actor in the film, the actor who plays the whale? The kid. Oh, right. I don't know, I'm giving a shit about the kid,

he's still in captivity. So, yeah, there was this campaign to free Kiko. So, they had to train this whale that had been in captivity for 15 years to learn to live in the wild and it was an incredibly arduous, resource-intensive process. And one of the things about Kiko was that couldn't hold his breath underwater

and whales need to obviously, they can't breathe underwater. So killer whales, which he was, hold their breath, usually for about 15 minutes underwater. He couldn't even make sort of three. But they did manage to train him, and by the time they released him, he could hold his breath for 13 minutes. So very good. Oh, right. He had a pretty unhappy life in the wild. He was used to living with humans. He'd been living with humans almost all his life.

And he was taken to Iceland and then he made his way over to Norway. But he really was pretty dependent on humans for the rest of his life. He was. It's very interesting because there's a side of environmentalists and people look after animals who say this was the worst thing in the world to let him back out into the wild because of all these reasons. How could he attach himself to a pod? He's been fed frozen herring, you know, his last 13 years.

But the people who did it still maintain it was the best thing to do and that he was the second oldest orca to live in captivity ever in the time that he was in there as something like 13 other orcas died to just show how quickly the mortality rate was. Yeah, and he did, yeah, exactly. He might have died. Anyway, he just died of a disease shortly after managing

to be released, but yeah, and he hung around on the edge of a pod, but it was mostly tragic or silly at least, because there should have been a fund for a broad environmentally good reasons, rather than probably a fund to just release this one whale which was fine in captivity. The really sad thing is that in free willies certainly two and three, the willy is played completely by an animatronic whale. Isn't there, there's an early example of AI taking away

two jobs? Well largely in one, it was played by an animatronic whale. Well, I can't see G. CGI the for the bits where the child is putting his hand in the whale's mouth I think they did have to have no No, no, no, no, no, sorry to interrupt because I don't know this movie. Yeah in free willy 2 3 and 4 Yeah, you're saying it's the same willy as in the character is the same willy. He's freed But then then what? but then them one. Absolutely. If Rewealy too, he's gone home, he's found his pod, and he's found his mum, which is exciting.

I think there's an oil spill or something bad. That might be the film 3, and then it turns out, I look at me jumping in front of Dan, he's got the entire plot in his head, and film 3, he's started a family and he's got a pregnant wife while. So he is free throughout those extra films. They keep trying to capture him again and the kid from the first movie who appears in the second.

It's the same cast trying to make sure he remains free. Yes, that's the only thing. So by that point, the title is an adjective. He is free with it. God, the embarrassing. And it's sad because the character, you know, meets up with his part again and gets together with the lady well

and she's expecting a baby in the third film. film and yet K-code never experienced any of this. It's sad. Yes it is sad. That's really sad. And two and three has the same cast but four they sort of thought the story is now tolted. They had to entirely recast it and Bindi Urwin, the daughter of Steve Urwin, crocodile hunter, is the lead role.

Get out. You know I will stay in. It's free Bindi. And is it a different well? I can't I've seen it and I can't remember. Because we've seen the lead role. Get out. You know, I will stay in. Free Bindi. And is it a different whale? I can't, I've seen it. And I can't remember. Because we've seen George Faw. Yes.

Which is, I think the kid. It's the descendant. I might be that possibly. It's the kid of the original shark, which is attacking the family, but not family by blood, family by marriage of the original people. And it follows them across the world. It's like through telepathy. Yeah.

This shark knows about, sort of, social relationships as well as. No, I'm not describing it, please. Have you heard of the movie? Well, we're talking about the world, it's like through telepathy. This shark knows about social relationships as well as... No, I'm not describing it please. Have you heard of Orca the movie while we're talking about movies? I'm not saying that. So I wondered if there was a killer whale movie, which is a bit like Jaws. Oh, right. And it turns out there is. It's called Orca the movie from 1970, whenever it was.

And basically, someone had watched watched yours seen how popular it was Scaria that a shark a killer whale yeah, and In Brett, but okay, oh, yeah, oh killer whales literally eat sharks are breakfast Yeah, the animals don't harm humans They do in captivity Sorry two instances because we're really horrible to them killer whales do not eat humans I think Sharks don't speak in doubt. The general Sharks incidents look, we all like our ocean friends, okay? A few people a year do get, people do get attacked by

sharp killer whales do not attack humans. What are the boats they've been attacking in the last year? They attack boats, they're not killing humans. Who's going to go to boats? They're humans. You're giving them either too much or too little credit, right? You're right. Anyway, you've got an approval rating of 9%. Oh, really? You're right. Bob, Bob, that's not what you have seen the sequel,

and the sequel, and the sequel, and the sequel. Yeah. Bossaume, Steve Signing, is it Walker IV? So when they were auditioning for the movie, pretty willy, they auditioned lots of different whales. I don't know what the process was. Singing? I think it may be. But 21 of the 23 whales, they willy. They auditioned lots of different whales. I don't know what the process was. Singing? I think it may be.

But 21 of the 23 whales they auditioned belonged to SeaWorld. And SeaWorld were apparently uncomfortable with the movie's message, which is basically, you're cageing whales, you monsters. This is an incredibly medieval barbaric thing to do. And they asked at one point for a new ending. But presumably it went with these days captain. He just... He jumps back over the wall. Yeah.

Yeah, and so I think they got KK for a Mexican sea life part. They did, which is quite odd because the Mexican park was in very poor condition and the whale, KK, wasn't very poor condition in it. But the Mexican owners, the Mexican park, were actually fine with the message. I mean, they were a bit like, yeah, no, it's a shit here for the whales, you should spread the word. That was weird.

That was weird for Kiko and that Mexican park, because the water, rather than porting sea water for it to live in, they just had water, which they added salt to. Like it was really bad. I mean, in theory, that sounds like the same, but I bet it's not. It's just kind of not going to be as it.

It probably tastes weird. Yeah. Seasoned water. Seasoned your water. And the altitude's quite high up for what Kiko would have been used to. Seats are level up because you're eating too much of the water. So what altitude do you normally live at, Kiko? Jesus. He didn't live in one of those really high seats.

Yeah, that's not high seats, the pirates go on it. That's it? Yeah, why do you think the whales are at our Alpine Seats periods? I'm not happy. Here's the thing, I watched a clip of it last night. And actually, it's amazing to James, not including this, but when you watch it back my memory of Willie going over as a phenomenal scene and watch it again

They use CGI and it's really obvious when it lands in on the other side You can see the splash would kind of compute a graphics early computer graphics You couldn't do water in those days could you in fact it's still hard to do water? Right sensible though because you haven't eight-year-old child actor. Firing 1300 kilo rubber weight over that. Take 12. We're going to see another cave. LAUGHTER

And there was a, as you said, there was a stunt double, which was coated in 1300 kilos. Oh, sorry, that's 1300 kilos of rubber just on the outside. On the outside, yeah. That's just the skin. And the special effects supervisor said that the dummy Sorry, that's 1,300 kilos of rubber just on the outside. On the outside, yeah. That's just the skin. And the special effect supervisor said that the dummy who looked so realistic to Kiko that he became aroused

when he saw it. Yeah. Didn't I happen to Kiko in the end? Obviously, he died. Is that free and died? Well, yes. But you don't have to, Ania? After he died.

Oh. Oh, OK. We're incarnated as a rabbit. Before that. Well, possibly. But he was buried. Okay. Really? That poor grave digger imagined if he told that he'll give this morning.

No, Porra. What they call the people he carry there. Paul Berris. 2000 Paul Berris. Yeah, they were so weird. There was because he died in Norway or off the fjords of Norway. The normally, you would just tow the way out to sea and then attach a deep weight to it and it would take.

That would be good for the impairment because I'm not so fond of it. That would be good for the impairment because I'm not so fond of it. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, they didn't do that. They dug an enormous grave and then just slid him in. And is it marked? As in, has it become a destination?

Yes, there's a little kind of stones which marks the grave. It's right next to the sea obviously. Yeah, inland. It's not in a church. It's not a Birmingham already. I'm already referring to it. On top of the mountain, oh he always loved the altitude. Yeah, but they got a special permission. There are seven people at the funeral, which I've very sad. How many whales? No, no. people at the funeral, which I've very sad. How many whales? No, no. No.

You know, we were saying earlier about how killer whales might slam into a boat. Yeah. And scientists aren't quite fully sure why that happens. And there's a theory that the reason it happens is because if a boat is out at sea and it's turned its engine off, they think it's possible that the killer whales

love going up to the back of the boat and feeling the water get propelled through the jet through its propeller And it's a bit like a fun kind of like a like if you're in a jacuzzi and you've got the machine Yeah, exactly like that. So if they see one and it's not on the thought is is that they're slamming into the boat and frustration to Make it start make that thing happen that they're going to no one no one knows that for sure Well, the thing is is if you look in the newspaper archives, you do see that every now and then there's a spike, like in 1953, there was a spike of,

if you search for Orca Ramming boat or Kilauele Ramming boat, you'll see one, there was another one in 2001. And it's just, I think it happens quite regularly. And once one of them gets in the news, a few more people are like, oh, that happened to me today, so let's get that idea. I don't know if that's true, but that's definitely. They have periods, Killer Whale, so one of the only other mammals to have periods. But, sorry, they have, they have menopause.

And they're one of the only other mammals to have thatopause is it? Yeah. They have menopause and you get postmenopausal females and we're not really sure why this is why they have menopause but it has been found that postmenopausal female orcas like to have sex with adolescent males. Okay. You have males and there's one particular direct- Because of the sea. Exactly. yes. And there's a woman called Deborah Giles,

who's director of research. Shhh, you do, you do. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. Very fans of research. So, in case you're listening, I'm sure you don't do that. You might do that.

It's fine if you do. Right in. Right in the middle of the start. Deborah has had nothing to do with any, but she's just director of research that the Centre for a Whale Research. And she explains the reason the old ladies are doing this to the young boys could be, so it could be to provide them a bit of sex ed, show them the ropes, show them some good moves. And also, it's because females who are looking for sexually

active male to copulate with, they reject ones that they don't think are quite up to scratch. And young males, when they get rejected by the female orcas get really upset and pissed off much like a young 15 year old boy, who has been embarrassed in front of his friends when he asked out a girl, and it causes tensions in the group because these young males act out and they get disruptive. So the older females who are postmen are poor so they can't, they don't have sex with them instead. A pity.

A pity sex, yeah. Yeah. Good. It's stifler's mom. Well, it's not so much. Another 90s for the reference boys. Um, killer whales. Yeah.

They like changes in altitude. They're crazy. They're crazy too. So if you get big ships that are trying to catch fish at the bottom of the sea, then it's an easy place to get some fish if you're a killer whale. Basically, you go down to where they're catching it if they're dredging and you might get some good

some good Patagonian toothfish and they found that quite recently there was an adult female killer whale who got to the depth of one thousand and eighty-seven meters in order to get these fish which is about as deep as Mount Snowden is high. Wow! So that's quite big. I'll see you in a while. It's way easier to go down than to go up. No, it does as I said in my life, bitch. Okay, let's see you either walk to the top of Snowden.

Well, by the way, there's a train or go all the way 1,000 meters to the bottom of the ocean. Oh, look, I may not have the whale anatomy that makes it as easy as it is, because it's nice. And it's easier to come up, it's easier to float to the surface than it's to sink down. You have to actively push against the force of all that water, think of the pressure down there. I'm finding it a bit hard though to visualize the Snowden reference. How many volumes of the animal are there?

Joking some dynasty, are we talking? Okay, that's it. That is all of our facts. Thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to get in contact with any of us about the things that we've said over the course of this podcast, we can be found on our Twitter accounts. I'm on at Shriberland, Andy, Andrew Hunter, James. At James Harkin. And Anna. You can email podcast.QI.com and Andy will reply. Yeah, where you can go to our group account, which is at no such thing or a website. No such thing as a fish.com, check out all of our previous episodes because they're up there. Also check out the little bits of merch that we have there and also get to Club Fish,

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