Noble Blood - The King for a Day

Episode Date: July 21, 2026

In December of 1586, the King of Poland died suddenly and without an obvious successor. King was an elected position, and the noblemen bickered and tried to advance their own agendas, to no avail. It was a complete standsill. They needed an unbiased third party to be a temporary king. It's a romantic story of a non-royal ascending to a temporary throne, but is it true? Support Noble Blood:—ORDER 'THE ARCANE ARTS'— Bonus episodes, stickers, and scripts on Patreon— Order Dana's book, 'Anatomy: A Love Story' and its sequel 'Immortality: A Love Story'See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hey, Portlandia fans. Carrie Brownstein and Fred Armisen here. The Dream of the 90s is alive in podcast form. We're launching Podlandia, AEO rewatch, our brand new podcast where we revisit every episode of Portlandia together, breaking down sketches, going deep on our iconic characters, and pulling back the curtain on how it all got made.

And we'll also be joined by the people who helped bring it all to life. Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysler, the mayor himself, Kyle McLaughlin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. Kyle is going for it here. You fully improvised, not just words, but a song. Well, I thought you were all going to write a song. I remember you thinking that.

Listen to Podlandia. A.O. Rewatch on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Jake Brennan. And on the Disgraceland Podcast, I explore the wild lives of rock stars and unbelievable true crime stories from music history. These are the stories you haven't heard,

the kind you'll end up telling someone else. Like the time Paul McCartney spent in a notorious prison or the bizarre crime Lady Gaga is accused of where that time Blondie's Debbie Harry escaped Ted Bunny. Listen to Disgraceland on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Chelsea Handler from Dear Chelsea. Every week the news gets worse.

The world gets crazier, and Yamanika is here to tell whoever's responsible, you're the problem. Do you know I just found out who Sidney Sweeney was? If he got a bunch of women, then I should have a bunch of men.

Do better or do less, so I don't have to do so much. I'm Yamanika, and I'm out. Listen to You're the Problem with Yamanika on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Welcome to Noble Blood, a production of IHeart Radio,

and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Manky. Listener discretion advised. The King of Poland had been dead for eight months and six days. The death itself had been sudden. The king, Stephen Bathory, had hidden his ill health from even his closest advisors for several years before finally succumbing to his illness on December 12, 1586. The country's nobles had spent the following eight months and six days doing one thing, trying to figure out who would be king next. Poland, in fact, the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, as it had been known since 1572,

was not a hereditary monarchy, but an elected one. Whenever a king died, the entire nobility of Poland and Lithuania, would come together for an elaborate process to select the next monarch. As you might expect, this led to several long protracted interregna in which various factions fought, sometimes with weapons and armies, to have their families or interests represented on the throne. This time, after eight months and six days,

there was a complete stalemate. the nobles had all exhausted every avenue they had to exert their influence, and still there was no front-runner in sight. In situations like this, the law called for the selection of a Rex pro tempore, a temporary king, an outsider who would then use his powerful but unbiased position to select his successor. To put it simply, they needed a tiebreaker. But no one could agree on who should fill that role. Every contender put forth was rejected by one side or the other, said to be too close to either side to choose a new king fairly,

or too power-hungry to give up the throne when the time came. They bickered and shouted, each jockeying over the other to be heard, but then all of a sudden one nobleman rose to his feet. He had an idea. Years ago, this nobleman, Nicholas Radzwell, the Grand Marshal of Lithuania, had found himself stranded in Padua. He had been en route to Jerusalem for a religious pilgrimage when his entourage was robbed, leaving him with no possessions, no money, and no way home. He had begged and begged on the streets for help, spending days trying to convince passers by that, yes, he really was a prince, and yes, he really could pay them back

handsomely if they only helped him home. Finally, desperate, he appealed to the rabbi of Padua, Samuel, Judah, Katznellenbogan, the leader of the Jewish people in the area. The rabbi believed Radzwell and agreed to help him get home on one condition that, that he fined his son Saul, whom he had sent to Poland to be educated at a yeshiva, but whom he hadn't heard from since. Now, standing before the Polish nobility, Radzwell told the story of how he had scoured every yeshiva in Poland before finally finding Saul like he promised.

He was impressed with the young man's intellect and good character, and Radzwell had invited him to continue his education at his. his palace. In the years since, Saul had become a central character at court and had garnered a reputation for his intelligence and trustworthiness. This was an obvious choice, Radzwell insisted. Here was a candidate everyone already knew and trusted, and who, due to his Jewish heritage, was not beholden to the politics of the powerful Polish and Lithuanian families. Saul Katznell and Bogan was the perfect temporary king. And so it was decided.

On August 18, 1587, for one day only, a Jewish king would rule Poland. Or would he? If any part of this story sounds a little fishy or too good to be true, that's because, well, it is. There is no historical evidence that Saul Katznell and Bogan was actually elected a temporary king, but the story of the king for a day, as he would come to be known, has endured in Jewish folklore and family history. How did this fictional tale become so entrenched that some people still believe it actually happened? Well, as with most good legends, it begins with an act.

actual kernel of truth. I'm Dana Schwartz, and this is Noble Blood. Although he was not born noble, and alas, never even temporarily would be, Saul Katzen-Ellen-Bogan came from an illustrious lineage. His grandfather, Mayor Ben Isaac Katzen-Ellen-Bogan, generally known by his Hebrew acronym Maharam of Padua, was the chief rabbi of Padua in the early to mid-16th century. He had migrated to Padua, a city in the mainland territories of the Venetian Republic, from Germany, for his education, and married the daughter of the then-rabi of Padua before then taking up his father-in-law's position upon his death. The chief rabbinette of Padua was a powerful position in and of itself, not least because it also made him a rabbinic authority in

nearby Venice, but the Maharam's influence was also compounded by his deep scholarly knowledge. Other rabbis regularly sought him out to weigh in on Talmudic and rabbinical debates, and he wrote over 90 responses in doing so, which continue to be influential among rabbinical scholars and historians alike. The Maharam's son, Samuel Judah, or Mahashiks, followed in his father's footsteps as the chief rabbi of Padua in 1565. His own father's reputation had played a large role in his election, but he was also considered a distinguished scholar and leader in his community. He also gained esteem among non-Jews,

and this is where we see the beginnings of the story that would morph into that of the Jewish king of Poland. there is little to no evidence that Mahashiks ever actually crossed paths with the Lithuanian noble Nicholas Radzwell. What is true is that Radzwell undertook a rather eventful pilgrimage to the Holy Land, to Syria, and Egypt between 1582 and 1584. And along the way, he got himself into several situations where he ran low on funds and needed to ask for a situation. assistance from locals. We know about Radswell's travels from a 1601 travelogue he published in Latin, in which he described his journey and the many people he met along the way. The closest thing we have to a story resembling that of the legendary encounter with the rabbi in Radswell's account is that he

was truly robbed by bandits on his way to Venice, but in Ancona, not Padua. He was then aided by a merchant who lent him money to continue his journey, but only after proving his identity to the papal authorities nearby. The similarities in the accounts are striking, the doubt about his identity, a loan that helped him on his way, but so are the differences. So how did we get one story from the other? The 19th century literary historian Gustav Carpalus asserted that the merchant in the account was Jewish, seemingly without evidence, as Radzwell never mentions the merchant's faith, and in fact recalls his name as Quintillo, a distinctly Italian Christian name. It's possible that Carpellus or one of the many people before him to tell this story, both orally and in writing,

conflated the merchant with one of several Jewish people, whom Radzwell did encounter, and discussed in his account, including an interpreter who accompanied him in Jerusalem, and the famed 12th-century Jewish traveler Benjamin of Tudela. There were also certainly many Jewish merchants in this period, especially in and around Venice, where the general acceptance of Jews' presence and the economic role they served was tempered by strict segregation. most famously in the ghetto, from which the modern English word is derived. It's possible that later historians like Harpalis assumed that the merchant was Jewish because of that, or more specifically because the merchant in this story loaned money to Radswell.

Jewish people frequently worked as money lenders in medieval and early modern Europe because the Catholic Church forbade Christians from usury, that is charging interest on a loan, while Jewish law only prevented the charging of interest to other Jews. While Radzwill's account made no mention of interest, one can see how the kernel of truth there, a simple loan from a merchant, might have morphed and taken on a new shape over time in service of a popular story or preconceived notions. So what about Saul himself, the rabbi's son? For many centuries, we had very little to go on beyond folklore and rumor. Between 1924 and 1925, however, the historian Mayor Balaban discovered a series of documents in the

archives of Breast-Listovsk that finally began to shed light on the real story of the would be Jewish king. Saul Katznanbogen was born around 1541 and traveled to Lithuania from his native Padua as a young man to study. He settled in Brest-Littovsk, a city now known as Brest in modern-day Belarus, and took up work as a merchant sometime in the mid-16th century. At some point he married a woman named Deborah Rivka Droker. They would go on to have 13 children. Like his father before him, Saul seems to have enjoyed a respected reputation among Jews and non-Jews alike. In 1578, King Stephen Bathory leased him the salt flats in the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, allowing him exclusive rights to sell salt, a highly valuable product at the time.

in the duchy. Two years later, he was similarly granted a lease to the salt mine at Villelitschka near Krakow in Poland. Six years later, Stephen Bathory died. We might be tempted to imagine a wealthy Jewish merchant so well-liked by the king himself that the nobles couldn't have picked a better temporary king. Saul's already unlikely reign is perhaps most thoroughly debunked, however, by the fact that we already know who served as temporary king after the death of Stephen Bathory. In fact, there was a very clear system in place in the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth for making sure the throne didn't remain empty during what were often very long into Regna. Again, the legend gets some things right. The nobility of Poland and Lithuania

needed to vote to elect a new king when a king died, and the interregna typically dragged on for months, as opposing factions sought to position their favorite candidates on the throne. That's all true, and this disagreement could vary in intensity, but it was very much an expected part of the process. As such, ever since the Kingdom of Poland and the Grand Duchy of Lithuania had merged into the Commonwealth in 1572, it had been custom that the Archbishop of Ganesno would serve as the Interrex or Between King. In 1586, that custom was followed,

and we know for a fact that Stanislav Karnkovsky of Yenoza, the very Catholic Archbishop of Gignesno, among other titles, served as Interrex until the end. end of the Interregnum in 1587. The Interregnum of 1586 and 87 was extraordinary, but unfortunately not for electing a surprise Jewish king. It ended in the election of Sigismund III Vasa,

who succeeded to the throne with the support of the former queen and the Interrex on August 18, 1587. However, three days later, Sigismund's opponents contested the election and propped up Maximilian I. Austria as their choice. The shocking move resulted in a year-long war, which came to be known as the War of the Polish Succession or the Habsburg Polish War. Eventually, Sigismund won out and became the uncontested ruler of the Commonwealth. For Saul's part, it does not seem as though he played any major role in the election or the subsequent war,

but he managed to remain in the very good graces of the Polish nobility, including King Sigismund. He would go on to serve as tax collector for the king. For his service in 1589, he was bestowed with the title of royal servant, which guaranteed royal protection of his possessions. and land holdings during his lifetime. Saul also, unsurprisingly, held a good deal of influence in the Jewish community of Lithuania. Beginning in the 1580s, he served as a Parnas or lay leader in the Council of the Lands, a newly formed central institution of Jewish self-government in Poland and Lithuania.

Jewish communities across Europe tended to be semi-autitiams, developing their own politico-religious institutions that governed the community in tandem, and occasionally in conflict, with Christian authorities. This was as much a product of Judaism's rich legal culture as it was a product of the frequent forced segregation and restriction of Jewish communities in Europe. The Council of the Lands would govern Polish and Lithuanian Jewish life until 7,000, Saul played an important role in the council's management of this often tense relationship with Christian authorities. In 1593, despite resistance from the Brest-Litovsk City Council, he helped to broker an agreement

that granted the Council of the Lands the right to adjudicate lawsuits between Jews, a major win for community autonomy. Saul also seems to have engaged in some patronage, a testament to the success of his business ventures and his high esteem in the Commonwealth. When his wife Deborah died, he chose to honor her by commissioning the construction of a women's gallery in the Breast-Litovsk Synagogue, a balcony space in the synagogue where women could attend services while remaining separate from the men. In the early 17th century, he founded a synagogue in Lublin, a Polish city some hundred miles southwest of Brest, where the Council of the Lands held its sessions. Both synagogues would stand until the 1940s, when they, like many others across Europe, were destroyed in the Holocaust. Unfortunately, we know very little about the end of Saul's life. It is generally believed that he did,

died in Brest-Litov's in 1617 at the age of about 75, although some scholars have argued that he died later around 1622. His children carried on his respected legacy, in particular his son Mier, who became the chief rabbi of Brest-Litov's and helped found the Council of the Land of Lithuania in 1623, which broke off from the Council of the Land's Saul had helped found. At some point, whether during his lifetime or not is unclear, Saul began to be known by the alternative name, Saul Val, which in German means choice. The name would go on to be passed down to several generations of his descendants,

to the point that as recently as the 19th century, Valls, who purported to be descendant from Saul, were still living in Lublin. By then, the story they told of their ancestor was not one of a wealthy merchant and leader of his community, but a king, albeit a temporary one. Denise de Samuel wanted nothing more than to have a noble title. He had the trappings of nobility, wealth, status, but unfortunately, not the lineage. And this was 19th century London. Lineage was everything. Dennis dreamed of what true nobility could afford him, not just social privilege, but true political power, a seat in the House of Lords. For most other Jewish men in Britain, this might have seemed like a pipe dream,

but he had seen it happen before. In 1847, Anthony Nathan D' Rothschild, who, family had already been named as barons in Austria, was granted a baronetcy in the United Kingdom by Queen Victoria. Dennis had worked for Anthony's father, Nathan Meyer Rothschild, some 20 years earlier, as a corresponding agent overseeing his business interests in Brazil. Upon Dennis's return to London in 1825, he had become involved in securing large loans for the recently independent Brazilian government. In 1844, the emperor of Brazil, Don Pedro II, had appointed him to the Order of the Rose for his work. As nice as a chivalric order was, however, it didn't offer Dennis the aristocratic privileges he yearned for. In the early 1850s, Denny's decided to find out once and for all if he really didn't have any Yikis or high-born lineage that could help him get a leg up in British society.

He began by commissioning Hirsch Edelman, a Russian Jewish scholar who had been researching and publishing documents of Jewish history from the Bodleian Library in Oxford to explore his own family. history. He knew his family originally hailed from Poland, and so he also contacted the rabbi of Krotoshkin to do the same locally. The rabbi collected as much information as he could and reported back to Dennis that he had traced his lineage back to several generations of prominent Jews in Poland and Padua. Mayor Katznan-Bogan, Samuel Judah Katznan-Bogan, and Saul Val, Katznan-Bogan. Denny's spirits were surely somewhat raised by this esteemed rabbinic lineage, but it was Edelman who offered him the promise of what he had really been seeking. He had come upon an incredible document, dating back to the 1730s,

and written by Pinchas Katzen-Ellenbogan, another descendant of Saul's. In this document, Pinchas related the story he said was passed on to him by his father of how their illustrious ancestor, Saul Vahl, had once, very briefly ruled Poland and Lithuania. He had used his one-day reign, Pinhaz proudly reported, to pass laws protecting Polish and and Lithuanian Jews from discrimination and violence. Dennis was delighted. He commissioned Edelman to publish Hindchase's story, along with, of course,

a family history that connected Saul directly to Dennis himself. In 1853, Gedoulat Shaul, or The Greatness of Saul, was published in Hebrew. Jewish community newspapers at the time indicated plans, to translate the work into English, but a translation never materialized. A year later, Dennis was finally, finally, named a baron by the king of Portugal.

It wasn't a British noble title, and he couldn't get a seat in the House of Lords, but Dennis felt he had raised the profile of Jews in Britain, and that was good enough for him. He did, however, apply for a royal sanction in Britain, to add Deval to his name, just to make sure his yiks was a matter of public record. Pinchas's 18th century account of Saul, King for a Day, Val, Katznell and Bogan, as he would come to be known, was the first written record of Saul's extraordinary legend.

The story had likely been circulating for some time. Pinckas wrote that his father had framed the story, already as long-standing family lore, suggesting that the legend might have been formed not long after Saul's death a little over a century earlier. It was the Gedulat-Chaul, though, that really brought Saul's erroneous royal reputation into the mainstream.

Newspapers, particularly Jewish newspapers in both English and Yiddish, ran with the story, which featured details that were simultaneously, specific and unlikely. Saul was said to have founded a bath house in Brest-Litovsk. Could be true, but later historians have found no evidence of that. He was, in fact, an elector of Poland, that is, a noble eligible to vote in the royal election. No, he was not. And Saul was said to have established a banking fund that promised every male descendant 50 guilders,

and every female descendant, 100 guilders upon marriage. This, again, historians have not found any evidence for. Gadulat Chowel became the definitive version of Saul's legend, but as with all legends, it continued to take on many forms even after it was put to print. One version of the legend went further with the story, taking the story of a Jewish king to, perhaps its logical conclusion, a royal marriage. That's how all fairy tales end, don't they? In this version of the story, Saul seems to have continued to enjoy elevated status as a kind of

former king, even after the end of his short reign. According to the story, Saul's power had irritated some members of the Jewish community, and so they reported to the nobles, who, were at this time looking for a new wife for their newly widowed King Sigisman III, that Saul's beautiful daughter Hannah, who was technically a princess, was unwed. The nobles of the Commonwealth reportedly considered her an advantageous match and conspired to kidnap her in the middle of the night to marry her off to the Catholic King of Poland. One sympathetic noble, perhaps Radzwell, warned, Saul ahead of the planned abduction. And so in order to prevent the plot, Saul quickly married Hannah

off to the 60-year-old rabbi of Brest-Littogsk, Zalman Shore. Seeing that their plan to take Saul down a peg had failed, those jealous members of the Jewish community continued to attempt to slander Saul to no avail. Of course, that did not happen. Or if poor Hannah was indeed, married off to the aging rabbi, that wasn't how it happened. But it speaks to the depth and persistence of the myth-making surrounding Saul's story. Despite the lack of historical evidence for many of its claims and the bounty of historical evidence contradicting many others, the legend of Saul-Val's one-day reign has endured in Jewish folklore. Even as modern historians and genealogists have disproven it. Even Dennis De Samuel's claim to his lineage has been debunked.

What then has made this story so persistent? It's possible that, as it did for Dennis, the story of Saul, the one-day king, offered Jewish communities political leverage, a means to claim that they had ancestors as important and influential as their Christian counterparts. Some scholars have argued specifically that the legend of Saul Val may have taken root as a response to the increased intolerance towards Polish Jews. In particular, the Khmer-Nitsky uprisings of 1648 through 57, Kossack rebellion which saw mass atrocities committed against Jewish communities across Poland. In a time of destruction and death, it must have been deeply meaningful to not only remember a member of your community who was so devoted to building Jewish spaces and supporting Jewish life, but also perhaps to imagine that such a devoted person could become so protected and influential,

even as a Jew, that he got to be king, if only for one day. That's the story of the supposed king for a day, Saul, Vaughal, Katznell, and Bogan. But keep listening after a brief sponsor break to hear about what he has in common with Noble Blood. Eating well shouldn't be complicated, but somehow it turns into recipes, prep, clean up, and half your Sunday gone. Factors solves all that. These are fresh, ready-to-eat meals designed by dietitians, delivered to your door, and ready in just minutes. No prep, no cleanup, no excuses. And it's not just about convenience.

You're getting real food, balanced nutrition, and zero artificial stuff. Meals that help you stay on track for all of your goals, without the grind of doing it all yourself. Grilled chicken, roasted veggies, steak plates, postables. They taste like something you get in a restaurant, but they come out of your microwave in two minutes flat. If time, cost, or effort have been holding you back from eating better, Factor just took those off the table. Right now, get up to $90 off and free shipping. Hurry, this offer won't last long. Go to factormeals.ca and use code clean.

That's up to $90 off and free shipping, but only with the code clean at factormeals.ca. Factor, Canada's number one meal delivery service. Hey, I'm Ruby Carr, the host of the podcast, Encore. Check out our brand new episodes featuring music from the show that everyone is reheating as we speak. Heated rivalry. Join me as I go behind the songs that brought Shane and Elia together.

I'll tell you the stories of Fice, My Moon, My Moon, My Moon, Man, wolf parades, I'll believe in anything, and tattoos all the things she said, and how they all became a part of this global phenomenon. Stream encore on IHeart Radio, crave, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, Portlandia fans. Carrie Brownstein and Fred Armisen here. You know us, or rather, you know them. Tony and Candace, Nina and Lance, Spike, and yes, The Chicken.

We've played a lot of iconic characters over the years, but today we're showing up as ourselves to tell you about Podlandia, A.O. rewatch, brand new podcast. Each week we'll revisit an episode of Portlandia from the very beginning, breaking down the sketches, exploring the backstories of our most iconic characters, revisiting the Portland locations you know and love, and opening up about our creative process. How did any of this get made? Why do we think that was a good idea? We're ready to talk about it. And we'll also be joined by the people who helped bring it all to life. Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysall, the mayor himself,

Kyle McLaughlin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and many more. Kyle is going for it here. You fully improvised, not just words, but a song, a melody. I thought he was going to write. I thought you were all going to write a song. I remember you thinking that. Listen to Podlandia. Ayo rewatch on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

As Saul-Val's unlikely story wove its way into legend, becoming a valued part of Jewish folklore, it became a point of pride among generations of Jewish people to trace their ancestry back to the supposed Jewish king of Poland. Over time, and especially with increased access to documents on the internet, the family tree did become more accurate, although, of course, apocryphal family connections lingered. Valle himself had 13 children, so you, You can imagine how quickly his lineage expanded, even without the help of people like Dennis De Samuel.

Now hundreds of years and many generations later, Valle's list of so-called heirs to the throne has grown vast. His descendants are said to include a variety of notable people, including Karl Marx, Sigmund Freud, and the composer Felix Mendelsohn. But there's also a noble blood connection. Our esteemed research coordinator, Hannah Johnston, is also a direct descendant of Saul Vahl. She promises not to let her royal lineage go to her head. Or maybe she will so she can end up the subject of a Noble Blood episode herself.

Only time will tell. Noble Blood is a production of IHeart Radio and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Manky. Noble Blood is hosted by me, Dana Schwartz. Writers for Noble Blood are Hannah Johnston, Hannah Zwick, Paul Jaffe, Natasha Lasky, and me, Dana Schwartz. The show is edited and produced by Jesse Funk and Nome's Gripen, with supervising producer Rima Il Kali, and executive producers Aaron Manke, Trevor Young, and Matt Frederick. For more podcasts from IHeartRadio, visit the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Hey, Portlandia fans.

Carrie Brownstein and Fred Armisen here. The Dream of the 90s is alive in podcast form. We're launching Podlandia, AEO rewatch, our brand new podcast where we revisit every episode of Portlandia together, breaking down sketches, going deep on our iconic characters, and pulling back the curtain on how it all got made. And we'll also be joined by the people who helped bring it all to life. Guest stars, collaborators, and friends, including director Jonathan Chrysler, the mayor himself, Kyle McLaughlin, legendary musician Amy Mann, and.

and many more. Kyle is going for it. You fully improvised, not just words, but a song. Well, I thought you were all going to write a song. I remember you thinking that. Listen to Podlandia. A.A.O. Rewatch on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is Chelsea Handler from Dear Chelsea.

Every week, the news gets worse. The world gets crazier. And Yamanika is here to tell whoever's responsible, you're the problem. Do you know I just found out who's Sidney Sweet? mean he was, if he got a bunch of women, then I should have a bunch of men. Do better or do less, so I don't have to do so much. I'm Yamanika, and I'm out. Listen to you're the problem with Yamanika on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

I'm Jake Brennan, and on my podcast, Disgraceland, I tell the stories behind music's biggest names. Like how the story of the foo fighters isn't just about music. It's about grief, shock, and the moment everything changed. Imagine that. You're in the biggest band on the planet, as Dave Grohl was in 1994 in Nirvana. And the phone rings. And you learn that your singer, your friend, the reluctant voice of a generation, Kurt Cobain, is dead. Listen to Disgraceland on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.