Nobody Panic - How to Go Freelance

Episode Date: March 26, 2024

Wanting to take the plunge? Stevie went freelance and Tessa’s never technically been employed - they look at the pitfalls and difficulties of being your own boss, as well as how you can make the transition from PAYE as pain free as possible (get an accountant).Subscribe to the Nobody Panic Patreon at patreon.com/nobodypanicWant to support Nobody Panic? You can make a one-off donation at https://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanicRecorded and edited by Aniya Das for Plosive.Photos by Marco Vittur, jingle by David Dobson.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanic. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Carriad. I'm Sarah. And we are the Weirdo's Book Club podcast. We are doing a very special live show as part of the London Podcast Festival. The date is Thursday, 11th of September. The time is 7pm and our special guest is the brilliant Alan Davies. Tickets from kingsplace.com. Single ladies, it's coming to London.

True on Saturday, the 13th of September. At the London Podcast Festival. The rumours are true. Saturday the 13th of September. At King's Place. Oh, that sounds like a date to me, Harriet. It's a podcast. Certainly a podcast.

You can't say it's not. It's 100% a podcast. We do how-toes. I'm Stevie Martin. Tessa Coates. Hello. Coming to you live from the studio. Crucially, not live.

Not live. Who's in the studio? Piper. Piper's in the studio. Piper's the dog. Because we do multiple recordings of this podcast in one day. And the last podcast episode we recorded was about massaging. And I got so stressed about a,

that she came and sat on my lap. Yeah, to protect you, like an ancient wolf. Like an ancient wolf. I was greeted by both Piper and the other office dog toast this morning. And they were so delighted to see me that I almost wept. Yes, they were. They were like, it was so nice. It was such pure joy, even though I've got nothing for them

and they ultimately lost interest in me very quickly. It is joy. It's joy that you've joined the gang. I'm in the gang. Yeah, that's what it is. I'm in the gang. And I was like, yeah, this is the gang. You know what else feels like joining.

the gang. Yeah. When you join the freelance gang. Yeah. And you know what? It can feel so lonely. Like you've left the gang. Like you've left the gang.

Like you've left the gang. But you will find other people out there and you can all form a gang, much like dogs. Okay. Welcome to the podcast. Yes. We've been asked quite a few times to do this. Is there a specific email that you've read to read? There is not.

I think there's just a body of work, a collection over the years of people asking us about going freelance. It's a constant question. and I went freelance maybe in 2015. When did you go freelance for the first time when you weren't on P.A.Y. I've actually never been, never had a salary. Right, so how to go freelance from being a P.A. by E will be right up your alley.

Well, yeah. But I, and then I'll just offer the, like, yeah, I'll offer, I live here, I live here, welcome, this is my tavern. Absolutely, yeah. Never been anywhere else. You're very in deep. Don't know what the rest of the country looks like. I've never been here.

Right. No, I've done many, many jobs, always on a little short-term freelance. Like rolling contracts. Rolling contracts. Never been officially on anything. And I have just, yeah. Okay. But we have been freelance for a long time and we do have some thoughts.

Yeah. And if you're thinking of it, if you're just, because I remember when I has a P.A. Y.E job, I remember daydreaming about like, oh, imagine if I could go for it. Imagine if I could just, my time was my own. I could like decide. But then there's that the fear of it as well. like, but my time is my own. And what if no one hires me? And like, what happens? Because, you know, what if happens? I'm not working five days a week. But also I don't want to work five days a week.

And there's all there's this constant. It boils down to is the magic of being like, I'm my own boss. I mean, like, I'm my own employee. Yes. And low, that is the ying and yang of freelance. There are many highs. There are many lows. There's magic that comes to being the boss and there's deep sorrow. There is. But also, if you, if you ask somebody that it works. It works. for, like, I've never wanted to go back to having a normal job ever. And to the extent where I still did for five years after I, because I used to be a journalist, and when I left the media company I worked for, I still would go in and do cover for people who were on maternity leave.

So I do, like, I don't know, like, how many weeks, months that is, or I'd do, like, someone's on a holiday for, like, two weeks. So in the summer, I'd basically be in all the time. but that still I would never ever want that feeling of like oh I have to I'm in this building from nine until six for the rest of time until I decided to leave

like I needed that like it's only for two weeks, it's only for two months absolutely and some people though genuinely love to be like this is my where I work this is my routine I love to come in every day this is a structure that I love I do my job this is when I know

that I clock out. I don't even think about the job. I go home. This is this is ideal for me. Yeah. And so I think a big part of everything growing up is simply realizing that like how things feel to you is not the how things feel to other people. And so if you're like, how can you bear it in there? And they're like, how can you bear it out there? Never knowing when the money is coming from. Or you might die, you might simply wither. Yeah, of course. You might wither and starve and start. There are things that you can need to safeguard yourself. Absolutely. And yeah. Yeah. But I think if you're thinking, oh God, is it, should I go freelance? You're like, no. If that doesn't, if your heart doesn't beat, I mean, like, for people who are like, wait, is it more magical over there?

Well, if you're unhappy in your job and you don't like it. I just don't want people to think that it's a better, it's a better life. It's is if that's who you are. I don't want to bang the gong in either direction. I want to help you do it if it's what you already know you want to do. But I don't want to encourage anybody to leave who's like, I actually love my 9 to 5. Why did you insist I came here? Well, no one's insisting.

But what we should do then is we should start and just like break down what it's, what it's like. Absolutely. And then we can do how you can safeguard against the things that, for example, I was frightened of. I'm kind of an odd person to enjoy. You wouldn't expect me to enjoy freelancing more than having a job because I'm incredibly, like I need financial security. I plan like months in advance. Like if I can see in three months time,

I'm not earning anything that month, then I'm like, okay, we're in an emergency situation. Like I also like desperately need structure in my life and I'm really about self-motivating. And yet I enjoy freelancing. So it might be,

yeah, even if it feels too frightening for you, there are still ways that you can do it that are better. especially now that the entire world since the pandemic is set up for working from home. Exactly. In a way it wasn't when I went freelance anyway. It was still kind of an, oh, okay, wow. So you're just going to stay at home?

How would you do that? I think it's a real interesting shift since the pandemic of people being like, huh, okay, maybe what we had set up are being like, these are the things that you must do when I was approved for my mortgage right before in the beginning of 2020. And they could not have taken me less seriously as a freelancer, understandably. And they were obsessed with being like, but you need a salary. Even if your salary was less than you actually make, we would be happier that you had a salary.

And they kept saying to me like, but you might never work again. And I was like, yes, we're all worried about that. But I was like, they were like, but seeing that you have a salary, that's proof to the bank that, you know, you have some structure. And then the pandemic happens. And people with salaries, people who'd made all those sensible smart choices for exactly this, everybody all jobs are up in flames you're like there isn't actually a sensible smart way to do it and I think we're really pivoting being like oh the internet and has meant that maybe we can really rethink what a job looks like and you know and then we shouldn't be shitting on anybody who's like wait you

make all your money from I don't know influencing or gaming or selling or crypto or any of those things like if the purpose of the job is simply that it pays the bills and puts food on the table then you can do whatever you like to do that thing anyway What is your adult thing this week? I booked and then couldn't do and then rebooked my cervical smear test. Good for you. Yeah, I just knew that if I didn't, that's the thing that you just put off and put off and put off because you don't really want to do it.

And you're like, well, I will. Of course I will. Of course I will. How important. And then you're looking like, oh God, it's been two years. And now I'm actually due my next one and I forgot to go for the first one. I had just listened to, in the car was listening to a radio two thing about a woman who, forgot to go to her smear and was saying she was like, oh, the letter came through the post.

And of course you're like, yes, of course I must. And then you moved it back. And then I forgot. And then we moved house. And then I did this and blah, blah, blah. And then I was thinking to myself, fuck, I wonder where mine is. And then, but the next day my letter came through the post. And I was like, how serendipitous? And I thought to myself, my instinct was simply like, yes. And let that float down the river. But I stuck it onto the door. And then I thought, fine, I'll do it. So mine is also booked, but not for ages. But it's booked. It's booked.

Listen, we're doing it. My adult thing is much less brave. I bought some new gloves. That is good. It's not brave. Every adult thing has to be brave. Everything has to be brave. Thank you.

I was cycling with two socks on my hands. Oh, for God's sake. That is just, okay, yeah. And then I found some gloves under the bed, not the highest quality of glove. Understood. Bicycled with those too small, if I may, and too cold.

And then I was like, I'm afraid. So then I went, walking past a very fancy looking glove shop. And I went in, just gloves. Imagine that. What is this, the Victorian era? Just gloves. Just gloves. Just because they're practical.

They can't be lovely. Leather. A dark blue because black leather was a bit much. Yes. I can't see you in black leather. No. Felt like crimes. Just felt like crimes.

Crimes might be happening at any moment. But a dark midnight blue really took the edge off that. Yes. Yes. And they're very soft. And then not real fur, but they have their faux fur and like cashmere inside all the way through. And I was like, yes, they're expensive. But I'll take really, really good care of them.

And she was like, they will last you for the rest of your life. And I was like, okay. Amazing. Okay. So that's my thing. Gloves. Congratulations. Gloves.

You know, what else is your thing? Freelancing. There's no link there. There's no link. How did I make sure I could afford the gloves? I checked in my budget for this month to know that it was available. Did I do that, Stevie? Of course not.

Of course not. Never. No. So some people like, yeah, so what we'll do is, we'll say things about what freelancing is like. And then if those things kind of appeal to you or disappeal to you, then you can make up your own decision as to whether it sounds like something you're into. And I would say, we'll call this section like, so you're thinking of going freelance.

And it's a little pamphlet you've received at the doctors. Okay, yeah, great. And it might have a list of things. And I would suggest that if you've been dwelling on this for a while and thinking like, oh, could I? then I think it's about making a list of like what are the things that are most important to you in your life and what is it you feel it's currently lacking

and what when you imagine going freelance something like the grass will be greener and better they're like what is it you imagine and what are those things that are super important to you so for me I well actually mostly it was just like I never ever got a job I was going to say yeah it wasn't a decision it less a decision and more like nobody wanted me

no that's not true you just doesn't really that doesn't it doesn't really fit with your lifestyle your person personality. You're not going to really be going for jobs. You were doing a temping agency. I went loads of places and I happily would have taken anything that anybody, but no one ever, they were like, get out. So mostly it was just like, was not very well set up for a structure. Regularly. But I, okay, well, I did. And the reason that I left was because it became, I for about,

I got my, my dream job. I had a normal, I had a normal, I had. a P.A.Y. job for four years. And the first two years was just a novelty that I was getting paid every month. And I was only on 15 grand. But it was like, oh my God. And also just like learning how an office worked and what to do. And there was like a going to Pratt on like a lunch break. It was electric.

The first job. Walking around London with a coffee being like, I'm just walking around London with a coffee. It was a lot of that. I'm going to work. I'm in the movie Working Girl. Yeah. This is my binder of ideas. A lot of that.

That's my satchel on my briefings. Oh God, I've got to get my ideas down for the Monday morning meeting. Just, you know. And I was working for like a startup careers website where I would like write jobs articles. Go on. No, no, sorry. Sorry. I'm just thinking about how exciting being like, there's a stationary cupboard is in the office

and being like, oh my God, we're doing business and we all sit on these chairs. And here's your login for the computer. And then so I was just thinking about how we needed a franking machine. And you were like, there's definitely a. franking machine in the office. You come in and use the franking machine. Because a franking machine is how you get free stamps, not free, the company's paying for it. Still don't know when you said that. It's like, what is franking? It's the machine. No, I know now. For loads of posts. And so you get, but it means you could,

you could be sneaky and send your own personal post through the franking machine. And then you're being like, yeah, here it is. And you led me to it so proudly. And it was one of those machines. It was a binding machine. And it was a bound, laminated presentations. I just what the franking was. So, yeah, I was having a great time. And then, and then I, and then I I got a job, but I was like, you know, it wasn't like my dream job working in a career for a career's website, even though it was fun. And then I got a job which was at a new publication that was launched. And it was like on online women's magazine. It was launched by the people to do Grazie. And also I was going to, at that time, I'd started freelancing for Gratia and Heat and Empire magazine at the same time. So it's like, oh my God, I've got, not only do I get to walk around with my coffee, I've also be like, I'm at the new cool London like publication. Like I lost my mind. And after six months, I went to the Edinburgh for Interestful with Tessa and Liz. And when I came back, I was finding, like, getting up in the morning to go to work and really hard. And also just getting angry in my head at the concept of just, like, having to be here, like, for eight hours.

And, like, it's the most efficient use of my time. Like, I was freelancing on the side more and more and more. and I ended up kind of like being able to do my job in the day, but also freelancing on my lunch breaks. And then the freelancing was like then taking up a bit more time than the actual job. And I also just turned into a bit of a grump. Like I wasn't, I remember my editor saying like, you've been really quiet over the last few months.

Like, are you okay? I'm being like, yeah, and me thinking, yeah, I am okay. I just don't want to be here. I wanted to have more freedom. I wanted to be able to get up at nine, for example, and like structure my day. how I want it. And I didn't necessarily want to go to prayer every day.

And actually all of the things that were novelties were starting to kind of bug me. I really liked the people I worked with. But I wasn't making the most of it because I was unhappy and I didn't know why. And the thing that stopped me for about the next six months was I was frightened. I was like, well, I'm on so much money. I was on like 18 grand. And I was like, oh, but like what I can't just, I've got to pay my rent. So I suppose this is just what happens.

So I made this conscious decision because I read an article. in, actually on the publication that we were actually working for, someone had done like a freelancing, like self-employed thing. And I remember being like, oh, okay, I'm going to freelance. And once I've had three months in a row where I freelanced my rent enough to pay my rent, then I'm going to leave because I can prove if I've got more time than I have now, I could freelance more than that. Like there is a demand for my services that I need to prove to myself before I can make the jump.

So I'm not making a jump into nothing. I think that is my number one tip is don't go freelance unless you've started being able to prove to yourself that there is a demand that you will actually be able to get some work. If you quit your job and then try and start something from scratch, unless you have your savings, which absolutely do that, but I couldn't save. But if you've got like six months of rent saved and you're like, right, well, that's fine. So now I've got six months to kind of build something up. How exhilarating, how exciting you could do that. but try to make a transition for yourself, like almost like a little transition package.

The first thing to begin with is demand for service. Yeah. And I think whatever your personal version of freelance is, either because you're like, I feel very passionate and I want to do this, I want to bring my tables that I make from scratch and I want to sell them to the world and this is what I want to do for a living.

Or you're simply just, or you're simply in my case, being like, I must eat. Or you want to make more money because you can do, normally being a freelance consultant for the job that you already do or whatever. Yes, absolutely. I think it's being like, okay, what do you, what are your services? And what is, and is there that demand and what do people need?

And I think, so for me, what got me through freelancing was that I always had like eight different jobs on the go at any one time. And I was lowly qualified in a high number of trades. Yeah. So occasionally I would get some writing work or I would do, learn how to do advertorial copy for things. I used to do copywriting. I taught English as a foreign language.

So I catered constantly And these are all bit part jobs That none of them are providing you any constant stability But they're coming around But together they're making up something And it's a constant and varied lifestyle Which for me is what I want and need And then somebody at the catering job

Had a job Who's Russian was her first language And she would do the Was doing subtitles for films But into English And then I was cross-checking them And being I was the second part of the, so we were making subtitles for rude movies.

Right. So I was doing like lots and lots of different things all the time and there's something nice about being like, it's sort of to use an old expression about like get yourself a fallback trade, like learn to be a typist. You know, so I'm not suggesting you be a typist because there's simply no call for it. No. But just having something you're like, okay, even if it all goes to shit, I know I've always got this. My plan B, have a plan B.

And I have my plan B is something like being a plumber or an electrician or something that's like there will never not be a demand for my second job or like. Like I always know that if all goes to hell, I can always teach English as a foreign language. I've always got my qualification. I can always, there's these things that you can always fall back on. Yeah. And I think that just gives you this a parachute or a safety net or a thing that's with you. So you're like, okay, are there demands for the service that I want to do as the job?

But are there also demands for my secondary thing that I've got in my back pocket? Yeah. Always ready to go. Yes, but you're saying maybe you've got like a whole bunch of savings saved up. You've been working a very well paid but very boring job. And you're like, fuck it, I'm out of here. And I'm going to spend six months starting this startup. sounds incredible

please do it I would say is there an option where you in the last couple of months of the job start beginning that has to be crossover

just in even though you're like but I don't need the money money is simply no object to me fantastic but what if you don't actually like it when you start the new job and or the demand

for service situation and you're like but I'm making these these hats for frogs and you're like no one's buying them baby and you're like but I'm so happy

like I'm sorry to say it doesn't matter like if you want to make this as a job somebody has has to buy the hats. Yes. You should basically always cross over.

Also just psychologically so that you know you're going, you kind of like tricking your brain but it's not tricking because it is real. It's like you would often not leave a job unless you've got another job. Yeah. So you're doing the same thing. You're doing exactly that. And it's simply even if, I mean, financially or just emotionally or like, you know, just is all this the right thing to be doing.

So that's the demand. And the second thing is the money, which obviously is what am I in field? What a nightmare. And so then you've had this three months where you've like, okay, just for the money that's coming in the last three months, that was enough to pay my bills. And you do have to be really clear with yourself about being like, this is my actual budget. Like, these are the bills that have to be paid. This is the rent. This is the electricity.

This is everything. This is the amount of money. This is the food. So here, even if I don't have any new party dresses or any new holidays, this is the amount of money it costs me to live each month. How much then can I bring in? And if that number starts, if the second number exceeds the first, hey, Job's a good and here we go. If it does not be like, okay, let's bring it,

not to say this isn't going to work, but let's bring in second income stream, what else can you do? What is the not very exciting, but can you do bookkeeping? Can you do a thing on the side for people? Like what is the extra bit that you can also start doing here? Can you do a thing at your company where your hours go down but you do that on a

freelance basis? There are things that come up that I didn't realise. So for mine and maybe immediately in the first few months ago, this is, I made a bad mistake. Like I'm making money, but I cannot structure my day. I feel lonely.

I also feel scared that I'm not going to be able, that I'm like, when you're part of the system of like, everyone, we all get up at seven and everyone goes to work and you're part of the rush hour, I know it's horrible, but you kind of feel part of the world. And when you freelance for the first time,

I don't know, I felt like, oh God, I'm not part of the world anymore. I'm sort of like cast off from it and I don't know if what I'm doing is the right thing or the wrong thing or like if I'm good at this or if I'm bad at this or you kind of always feel like you're kind of a bit of a student, a bit of like a in the village you're kind of like the one on the house on the end being like,

hello! And everyone's like what did you, what he's wrong with you? Have you had a shower today? There's a lot of that. So you have to also, when you've put everything in place, you have to give yourself a few months to identify what actually the other problems are that you haven't foreseen and really give yourself a shot at learning how to deal with them because now I'm so good at structuring my day. I feel so like happy being freelance and if I'd have panicked and taken, I got offered a job about six months after I went freelance and I was like,

I should because I haven't washed my hair and I'm, I don't know, man. I'm in my pyjamas, the same pyjamas, like three days. I feel like I'm actually mad, but I didn't, and I'm really glad I didn't, because it turned out that it pushed me to be, to just up my game, to be better. I think there's definitely a moment when you leave the house for the first time that day, and you haven't really achieved anything, and the children all coming home from school. Oh my God, I feel that so deeply. And you just like, see them on the street, be like, where are they going? And then you're like, oh my God, they're coming home. They've had a full day. and I'm just venturing out for a mini-egg.

Like this is, oh, no. Also, you can test out the lifestyle of freelancing in a lot of industries now that you weren't able to before the pandemic, where you can ask if you can have Fridays and Mondays off. Or you're going to ask if you go down to three days a week. And then you get to see how you are working from home. And if it's an absolute nightmare, and by the time you've finished your last day of working for home, you're desperate to go back into the office. You do have your answer that you're.

your difficulty is going to be the actual practicalities of you getting up and completing your job. Like, that's going to be difficult. Whereas I always enjoyed that way more, like, than being in the office. And I think that maybe if you're listening and you're kind of still not sure and you are able to do that, that could be your first port of call. See if you can have some days working from home, see how it feels. And if it doesn't feel great, go back into the office. Like, we're all different.

And this is kind of, it's odd because it's kind of switched. sometimes. It was switches, I don't know. It used to be like kind of cool to be like, yeah, I do my own hours and I work my hand. Whereas now I don't know, there's a lot of like, get back into the office like propaganda. There is. And you just don't judge, like there's no right answer to any of it. I would say whether it's cool or not, like it's very nice that like we're moving in a different direction so you don't feel less like the town idiot at the corner of the village, you know, wearing their pajamas back to front. But I think, I think, I think you get in a dangerous territory if you start being like, but it's cool, you know?

Of course, yeah. But aren't we all drawn to things? But aren't we all? Because we're like, well, that's a great way to live. That drives what we buy, how we dress, everything. And the lifestyle of like, oh, wow, I wake up and I get my, on TikTok as well, like, day in the life and you're like, oh, and they sit down at their desk and it's like perfect. You're like, that's not what it looks like because also what happens is when you're at home,

you are more available. So, you know, like, the plumber will come in or, like, something will come up. And you're like, I've got to get to stuff for dinner, so I'll do that now. We're like, you are actually more available to be distracted. And that's, that becomes the new battle. Whereas when you're in the office, just being bored or being like,

I don't have any time to like do the things. Yeah, my laundry, for example. Like, I don't know, when do I have time to do that? Whereas when you're at home, you're like, God, I just doing laundry all the time. It's relentless laundry. Relentless laundry. blend as dishwasher, like, and loading and a loading.

And every time you sit down at your desk, you're like, oh, another thing that he's fixing in the house. Exactly. Maybe you need to be in a totally different environment to do your job. Yes. So I think as you begin this journey, there's, if you're going out on your own, whatever your services are and whatever you are selling, you do need to really suck it up vis-a-vis self-promotion and putting yourself out there. And, you know, you just cannot put your light under a bushel no matter how, like, gross that feels to you. And if you're like, I despise it, this is making me feel sick.

all I want to do is make my hats for frogs. Please don't make me do this. Then be like, okay, that's just, you need to know that that's something you need to employ someone else to do. Yes. Because the frogs aren't going to know you're making hats for them. No. You don't tell them.

Please. You might be making the most exquisite coffee tables in the whole world. But if they are just in your workshop, nobody knows about them. So when they're looking, searching to coffee table on the internet, they're not, you know, you've got to therefore, like, get in somebody who that is their passion. Yes. And it's really about being like, what are my, skills where what are my weaknesses what are the bits I hate and being like okay let's see

let's look at let's look at these numbers again I need to pay someone else to do my bookkeeping I need to pay someone else to do my self-promotion get an accountant get an accountant I need to be getting all these extra people in and and just knowing that about yourself about you know there's no point sort of forcing yourself to do all of the bits that you hate because you know there is a way that you're like okay we have this business has to be an entire the business of me has to be a fully we have have an entourage here. There has to be a whole gang going. And I think if you're like, no, the people will just find me if I'm making the good stuff. The people won't find you. The people will not find you. And I say this is somebody who is currently like looking. I'm planning a wedding at

the moment. And the self-promotion thing feels so important in the moment because I'm just Googling the word like banned question mark. And then I'm like, oh, this is a good website. This looks good. Here is their stuff. Fantastic. And if you're just going off things like that, like you just have to remember how many people are out there literally Googling the word band question mark and you've got to be like for them here's my good website here's my stuff here's everything like the amount of decisions I am making based on good photography good font on the on their website or just coming up or just being high at the search terms you know and being like it's not entirely on font but it mostly is but like just like just being there being available having an Instagram

presence having a thing that's being updated when somebody like hasn't posted anything since 2017 I'm like I've lost confidence absolutely yeah and obviously you're like but the Instagram isn't the job, the catering is the job. I'm making good stakes. It doesn't matter. It's all part of the whole thing and you just have to, there's, you cannot fight that. But if you hate it, you just have to get somebody else in who does that part for you. And you also, you can start, you can maybe try at the start when you're not sure if, you know, you're not sure that you're going to earn enough to be able to pay someone and then the moment you can. Yes. That's what you, you must do. I think I would make a list or even if the list is not apparent at the moment because you're like, I'm going to do

everything. I'm excited to learn bookkeeping. And then quickly be like, I don't like the bookkeeping. Yes. I think make a little list. and be like working in order of like the moment we can afford it, who we're getting first. Yeah. An assistant, a social media manager, a thing. And I'm saying we because it sometimes feels funer when you're just all unknown being a sole trader to pretend like, we. But like... Unless you're like, what I was doing, which was a freelance journalist, which would be deranged if you started going,

we will send the article by the decline. I don't think say it to anyone else, but just for yourself to be like, you know, you've still got, like, your accountant and you're actually naturally very talented at with. that you like it or not, Instagram and, you know, putting yourself out there. I think you talk about the accountant. No, no, no. But, I mean, yes, you're doing your best. I'd do my absolute level best.

You have a natural aplomb for managing and you're very good at forcing yourself to, like, put yourself out there and being like, here's my work. I do hate it. Yes, correct. Yes, I do try. And so if you then brought in somebody else, you know, it is nice to say, to feel just probably in your head that like, we. So there are some people involved in the Stevie-Martin business endeavours here. If some people are helping, I'm not totally on my own. And you need to be honest about the things you're not good at.

And being honest about the things you're not good at comes with the lack of judgment. So it's like, sorry, on yourself. Good judgment in terms of judging what you're not good at. Yeah, numbers. So accountant. And I remember thinking an accountant is going to be a $1,000 to do my tax return. Of course it is. And it's not.

Like, you can get a great person to do it for $200, if you look, and get recommendations from other friends that do this, a similar sort of thing that you do. Which brings us to our final point vis-a-vis your taxes, which is you'll now be getting paid up front more money than you ever were before because no one's taking the tax at the point of sale. Or your national insurance contributions or your student loan. Nothing that is coming out of your salary.

So you're just getting a lovely, exquisite, upper, top-end check in the post. Mamma-mea. And it is checks these days. In the post these days. That's right. I said it. And you're thinking, I'm richer than I've ever been. This freelance life is working out so nice. No.

The freelance work is not working out so nice. I would be put... You need to be putting... Just listen to our... Most recent how to do tax... Don't listen to that. Just do... Listen to what I just say.

And her accountant called her immediately after him was like, we need to discuss things. That went out on air. My accountant called me like from the side of the road where she pulled over the car and was like, I can't listen to another word of this. You're never allowed to do your personal tax return ever again. Nobody panic is now she's looking after that as well.

I presume, yeah, good. So... My point is... is that money comes in, you move it immediately into a high interest, untouchable savings account. In it goes. No, not untouchable. Yeah, I've said it. No, not untouchable because you're going to need it in a bit.

Because you're going to need it. All right, just put it in a normal account. And just a normal account. Just move it. Please don't touch it. Yeah, I've got it in a little account. I've got a Nat West account and I've just got it in another account called tax. And it comes in and I go, yay, no, and then I put it in.

Put it in and it's gone. It's in there and it's ready for you. So when the thing comes, a call in, when the taxman comes knocking and he does, He knocks on the door. He's ready to say, ah, yes, sir, here it is. It's in an online market council. I can't give it to you in person. But I can show you.

I can show you these numbers. Here they are. I've prepared. Yes, that is a big practical thing. And look, like reach out, make friends with other freelance people. And the co-working space thing is great if you can afford it. Like my friend does for like 200 quid a month, which to me is hell for me. But for her, she loves it.

And she goes, I get more work because I am there from this time to this time. It makes me feel. And it's kind of, they kind of create it so it's like an office. Absolutely. And, you know, you've got, so they've got snacks. They've got the water cooler chats. They've got other people who are all working. So if you are thinking, but I can't sit alone at my desk.

Like I don't, but you can do that. There are other options that can make you feel like you have a job. There's a more regular job, you know. And it's all about tricking yourself. And at those moments when you feel really, really like, oh God, maybe this isn't for me. Ask yourself, like, because for me, for me, when I felt like that, I would go, okay, but do I want the alternative? And that is to get up at 7 in the morning,

going to an office, Monday to Friday. And it was like, oh, God, no. No, no, this is better. And I have to remind myself all the time, because it still work. So you're never going to be skipping around like a lamb, like crying with joy. Like, you're still doing work, and it's annoying because all work, even that thing where it's like, but live your dream.

And then you never feel like you're doing a day's work. And you're like, yeah, you will. You'll walk because it is. but is it better than the alternative? Is it worse than what you would be doing if you were going in with like an employee job? And if you're like, I long for that. I miss that.

Then you can re-enter the job market. You know, you haven't lost anything. It's scary, but you can. Plug yourself back into the Matrix, you know? That's okay. Absolutely. Take the blue slash red pill, whichever one is relevant to what I'm saying.

I forgot. Blue pill. I think it was blue pill, is it? Yeah. Put your money aside for taxes. Take the blue pill. Yeah, all Red Pill. Good luck out there.

Good luck out there. You can do it, pal.