Nobody Panic - How To Stop Feeling Guilty

Episode Date: April 23, 2019

Where does guilt come from? Is there an evolutionary reason we feel it? How can we stop? Tessa and Stevie delve into the realms of guilt to work out how you can feel lighter about not going to Jonathan's birthday. Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanic. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Carriad. I'm Sarah. And we are the Weirdo's Book Club podcast. We are doing a very special live show as part of the London Podcast Festival. The date is Thursday, 11th of September. The time is 7pm and our special guest is the brilliant Alan Davies. Tickets from kingsplace.com. Single ladies, it's coming to London.

True on Saturday the 13th of September. At the London Podcast Festival. The rumours are true. Saturday the 13th of September. At King's Place. Oh, that sounds like a date to me, Harriet. Oh and welcome to Nobody Panic. I'm Stevie Martin.

I'm Tessa. Coates. Trying full names. I'm Tessa Coates. I'm Tessa Coates. And this episode is all about how to not feel guilty or how to not feel guilty about being guilty. Because we're all going to feel guilty.

I feel guilty because I forgot to press record the last time we recorded this. So we're re-recording it. And I'm feeling great about it. There's a lot to unpack about my emotions. There's some of going on. My feet are sweating. That's how bad.

There's a lot going on. This is the thought process. Stevie was telling me a fantastic fact. I was. I was like really engaged and I thought to myself, this is a fantastic episode. And I, and then my brain went, Babber check. And I leaned forward to look and the numbers were not moving. Yeah.

So, but it's all right. This is absolutely fun. We're going to knock out of the park again for you. It's going to be great. I'm quite hungover. I should say that now. And I was actually very blithely saying earlier, like, I don't get guilty when I'm hung over.

Like, I feel guilty. Yeah, that is exactly where this end was we were both saying, people were saying a lot of people suffer from morning after guilt. Yeah. And we were both like, I don't know. I've never had that. Right. Absolute sledgehammer into my heart.

Now I do. Now I do. I wish I hadn't drunk anything. I did drink a lot of prosceco and a lot of vodka, which maybe isn't a good mix. Maybe it's that. Maybe it was that. What's your adult thing?

for this week before we go into guilt and I talk more about how guilty I am. Oh yes. My adult thing is that I've just been in McElspield this week with my small cousins and they're not small. They're teenagers. Hello Will and Dan. Do they listen? No. One of them is very fair and has got this just like the 18 year olds just started growing this like very sort of white whiskery beard and someone at school started calling him Julianne. Assange. Oh, lovely. Lovely.

Very funny. It's really been making me laugh. Anyway, the 15-year-old is doing his GCSEs, and so I've been going to help him learn about, you know, understand exams because it's so horribly overwhelming doing a GCSEs. It's terrifying. I thought it was like life or death than I did mine. And it's not.

And it's absolutely not. It's one of life's great lies, they tell you. It's a terrible lie. And also you get it in your head that you have to know, like, everything that's ever, every piece of information ever in the world. but you don't, you just need to know how to get through the exam. Yeah. Which makes me really, really sad.

It's not very creative. It's just like, this is going to come up, so know this. So you don't really learn anything. Yeah, you just, all you know is how to answer that question, which is not the same as having, being interested in a subject or knowing anything. I mean, also, I'd like to pop in here and say that you say that's your adult thing, but I just got an email on the Nobody Panic Gmail saying, hey, Tessa, welcome to NowTV.

So I say that's pretty adult. You've subscribed to Now TV. Oh, right, yeah. Did that just come right in a second? Oh, it did yet. Hey Tessa, thanks to subscribing to NowTV. Oh, yeah. I use the Nobody Panic email to get a free subscription. There we go. To Now TV so I could watch Game of Thrones.

That's very adult. You're on the black. I am on the black and I will cancel it after seven days. I don't mind. It doesn't cost me anything to use the... No, I know. I'm not. I feel nothing. My adult thing is I bought a wooden hand to hold... my bubbles. They go on the fingers, they go upon the digits, and it's like a hand, it doesn't look like an actual, like, it's not a hard, it's like a stylised wooden, like very clearly not a hand, and then they sort of pop on like the thumb and the forefinger and the thing. So, um, I just think that

that's, because I just basically obviously lose bubbles all the time. So I don't wear my, my bobs around. No one does. No. The next thing is I have to get something for those little Kirby grip, um, bobby pin things. Do they call my bobbins? I need to get like a dish. or something for those or just continue to pick them up off the floor. I think about that episode we did about how to stop using plastic and how that woman, her instructions were like instead of makeup, dry flour.

And she just was living this insane life out in like Michigan in the wilderness or something. And her instructions were like, instead of buying a hair grip, just find one on the floor. Yet that can't be your instructions for good living. That can't be like that's that true of her top tips. So every time I pick one off the floor I do think of her. I do think of her. I do it. It was a great tip.

She had a blog called like, you know, raisins and God or like... Glidgen. That's excellent. That's what all the blogs are like. Yeah, it's also what the Bible teaches. What? Raisins. Raisins and pick up bubbles off the floor.

That's what the Lord says. That is what the Lord says. So, guilt, I wanted to just pop in because I'd learned some science about why we feel guilty. Because I think when you're in the middle of like a guilt attack and you're like, oh God, it helps to know that you're a human being. and perhaps why you feel like I see Although, go on I was just going to say that this episode is going to be about The, like, minor constant guilt

I haven't done enough stuff I'm not a good enough friend As opposed to, you know, I've done a crime I committed genocide I've done a genocide If you are a warlord You know This might not help

This is not for you I just want you to own up to your crime And take the guilt But thanks for listening But thank you so much Mugabe Jesus Christ Anyway

So proper crimes You've embezzled You're cheating You've buried a body in the back garden You should feel some guilt I think you should feel some guilt Especially if you've not had any actual punishment Yes

If you've escaped corporal punnant Not corporate punishment If you've escaped Corporal punishment You should feel guilty I wonder if anyone listens to Who is a prisoner I don't think they do

Oh my God If you're listening in jail I'd be thrilled Tweet us They obviously don't get Smart phones in prison Do they? doing all your emails. Write to us.

Right to us. Imagine if we're in like Broadmoor going like, so if you feel a little bit guilty, then you just have to have a nice bath. Wow. Shut up, guys. Yeah. But anyway, interestingly...

I'll just be spiraling thinking about that for a while. You can have a spiral. So apparently, as I think we all know, women feel it more than men. This is what I learned. I learned. There's a lot of studies about that. But really interestingly, they did studies about different cultures.

And different cultures feel guilt in different ways. So there was a study in 2014 that compared the brains of people from Germany with the brains of people from Japan. And they found that the people from Japan showed more activity in the brain region linked to perspective, while Germans were more likely to show activity in the parts related to emotion and memory. So there's also this whole thing about guilt culture. So like it depends where you grew up, what the family dynamic was like in that area traditionally

so like in America there's definitely like a guilt culture where moral conscience is supposed to control your behaviour whereas in Japan which I found very interesting it's like a shame culture on the whole which is where basically the difference is is that what you do behind closed doors is

one thing but you are very focused on what other people see so you're not guilty about the same things you're just guilty if someone's seen the thing that you did rather than the thing that you did but also I'd imagine you would hold a lot of like oh behind closed doors I'm not like I appear sort of darkness almost in you

whereas I think now like especially this kind of millennial vibe that we're all a lot of us a peddle and we all like chat a lot about the things that we feel guilty about and we're very open about it and that can be helpful because it can mean that like you know if I hear someone's done something I'm like oh my god I do that as well and I thought that was gross or weird then you can be like oh I don't have to feel guilty I can let that go yes yes yes yes you just feel it like disappear and a lot of studies have also found that that weighing down

of guilt is a thing. Like every, you do feel physically heavier when you are guilty because you just have too much going on in your brain. And the other thing that I found out, they haven't really agreed on as to why we actually feel guilt, but they've got two thoughts. One is that they being just the world of science. One of them is, it's to stop us destroying each other. The idea being, there's a really great quote by the American psychotherapist, Peter Breggin. Hello, Peter. He wrote in, and to explain the theory of social cooperation and guilt. So his quote is, this is a great quote. The existence of violent impulses would have made it difficult or impossible for humans to live in close-knit families and clans without destroying each other.

Nature's answer was the development of guilt, shame and anxiety, internal emotional inhibitions or restraints, specifically against aggressive self-assertion within the family and other close relationships. So basically, if you like, my sister's sleeping with my boyfriend. you might want to kill her, but you would not kill her, because you'd be like, well, I don't want the guilt and the shame of having killed. So then you just scream a lot, or you know, I don't know, do other things. But then obviously that is not foolproof because that's why people, a lot of people do murder crimes of passion.

Crimes of Paschuan. That's why they happen. And then the other one is it's to stop us from breaking smaller rules so that in the social group, we're not ostracized. Because as you've taught me, when you're ostracized from a group, you will be eaten by a tiger. or you're more likely to starve, you can't be the hunter-gatherer for yourself and whatever, so its community is very important

and the guilt stops us from like, yeah, not being part of that community. Which I think is really interesting. It's fascinating. It's fascinating. And the thing you were saying about, oh no, the humans are a really weird one because they are neither the like lone wolf

of the wolf pack nor the extreme social of like ants, insects, various like moles that like live in extreme social groups most of the insects and yet individual humans are capable of being both like

a solitary wolf and living in like understanding civilisation on like a mass level and doing stuff like for the greater good the idea of charity of like helping someone

we've never met and we'll never meet just because we can understand the idea of like empathy and how it feels it's pretty staggering as an idea and so it's a similar

like brain process that stops those like doing terrible stuff. Yeah. Because you could, you know, as many murderers regularly do if you listen to as much true crime as me. Various serial killers confessed to crimes many years later that no one even knew were crimes. And they're like, oh, who? Like they weren't even looking. Why are you told us that?

Yeah. It's like a feeling of like, well, I have to. Well, I'm like, yeah, exactly. Maybe like. Yeah. Also like, I suppose then if you are in confinement for that amount of time, you'll start, you probably will start to think, well, maybe their parents would like to know where they are, you know?

Like, that sort of thing. So the guilt, but also, like, on a much lower level, it stops me personally doing stuff all the time. Like, you know, when that whole thing, like, what would you do if you found, like, £100 in cash? And then, like, keep it. And they're like, I'm just going to think about this all the time. And be like, whenever I spend that, that money out,

I'm going to be like, it's not mine. It's someone else's. And what if it was for a family and, like, they don't get much food money. And that was their food money for the week. now there's a child who start, like, you kind of spiral a little bit. And that means that you will then do something that is good for the social group, rather than being like, fuck you, you know.

Whereas really the like, um, evolutionary answer to finding a hundred pounds is like, obviously keep it. Yes, yeah. Look after yourself. Obviously, number one. So our ability are the same process that like keeps the human community safe and means that we don't just kill each other all the time and steal from each other is the same process that works too strongly in the opposite direction that makes us like too worried and too

pathetic and too guilty all the time about like tiny misdemeanors. Yeah. And so I think the whole thing is about sort of finding the line between like, is this the right amount of guilt or too much? Too much guilt. Yeah. Because I have a period of time where I feel really guilty about stuff. And then I have a period of time where I'm like, I can let it go.

And it always, I think it's always linked to like how I'm feeling with other things. I think it's just depending on. So if I'm a little bit more like, oh, this week is not a nice week. Then I'll be more likely to be like, and I didn't go to Jonathan's birthday. Whereas if I'm like, I'm smashing it like, fuck Jonathan and his birthday. I don't feel like that. Are you every day?

You do every day? I don't. What do you feel guilty about? Nothing. That can't be true. You're in way for confidence, can't. I feel guilty constantly. I feel guilty about not being a good enough friend to people.

Oh yeah. Not just in a general way and also like specifically like, oh, I should have, I should be better with them. Yeah, like that specific thing. I did not do that thing. I did not do that thing. I feel guilty about not. being on time with my work and like how many things I'm supposed to have done.

Yeah. I feel guilty about the planet. Oh, see, I think that's a massive thing, isn't it? Because now I think anyone with the brain cell should be quite guilty all the time about the planet. And it's too much guilt. Yeah, and so I have to sort of, I can't, don't know what to do with it. I can't read stuff about it anymore because it's just like, just, I mean, that sounds so, oh, I don't like it's not, I don't like it's not going to read about it. But you're only like, I can't think about it.

So how do you like approach the guilt? Because, for example, if you take the world, you can, there are little things that you can do to make yourself like, well, I'm trying, like, for example, not using as many plastic bags. Yeah, the world thing I just sort of don't do anything. Like, I just... You have like a reusable water bottle. Thank you.

You do do stuff. Like, it's just like, you know, you're not protesting at the moment, for example. No, but I do think they're doing a great job. So do I, yeah, no. Great job. I'm more for that sort of a million people doing an important. perfect job than a handful doing you know recycling perfectly like I'm giving it a go but I just like you know like eating meat for example which I don't do a lot but then when I every time I do I'm I just feel

dreadful about um and I yes uh going on holiday that's another one like taking a vacation I spend the whole time just thinking I shouldn't be on holiday in this idea of a whole range of age groups millennials felt the most guilty about taking vacation um so sad which is so so tragic and I think was we all live in a time where you have to be, you know, 24-7. You have to be on. And also you have to monetise everything that you do. We're in this weird time where it's like, if you wanted to, for example, a podcast, you know, we have adverts in our podcast.

I wouldn't say it's my job. It doesn't feel like a job. But we've certainly, like, monetised it and it's a thing. And that's just us talking to each other. But like, also like social media, like, when you go on holiday, a lot of people are like, well, this will be a great chance to really up my social game. Maybe I'll get some good engagement. And then you're like, oh, my God.

You know, even if you don't do that, it's in the back of your mind that, like, you're never quite off. Like, there's always a possibility of being able to harness the power of something and make it into a job. And if you aren't, then you're not doing Instagram properly, for example. Or you're, I'm always like, well, I don't do Instagram properly and I don't do Twitter properly. What is properly? Like, I don't have to do it like a job. No. I'm just doing it like how I like it.

I don't feel any guilt about Instagram, but I also don't really know how it works. Yes, that's true. I just feel guilty when people message me because I tried to go off it and then people are like messaged about you know things about the podcast or like whatever and when I look and I see loads of unreplied messages I feel really guilty because I just feel like

oh you've reached out and all I have to do with you've been back yes yes not replying to emails as well which I'm very bad at oh god I just think like when you're with your family and oh sorry cars just pulled up outside and they're just blasting music out so really sorry if you hear weird noises in the background But look, it's an...

They look like they're having a good time. It's an organic fun podcast. We're on location. Okay? Continue. Exactly. You know, the arrival of the smartphone. And the fact that, like, your work is literally never done.

Yeah. You know, you've... There's always stuff to do. You know, you're never... If you say you're sat with your family, you're never truly, like, present with them. No. Like, here I am experiencing the fleeting moments of my children's life. Because you're like, I've got to get back to Susan!

But then, like, you're not really with Susan either, because you're like, I was with my children. And then you're just giving yourself, you're giving us like 30% of yourself to everything. And therefore you're never 100%. Some people genuinely don't have the same levels of guilt. They don't feel, and I think that is cultural. I think that is like, well, what was the guilt like when you were growing up?

You hear about people who are from, like, for example, Jewish families will often have a different experience for someone who grew up in, like, a British Hindu family or a Catholic family. or a Protestant family or like I'm an atheist family so like I will have a very different view of what guilt is from maybe like you know a really um orthodox Catholic I mean orthodox Catholic but you know what I mean quite heavy Catholic upbringing OG Catholic Catholic Catholic

Catholic yeah committed Catholic they're really into the guilt they really into the guilt I think that's why religion was sort of created to that thing of like to design to stop us from breaking the rules 100% because it was supposed to be terrifying that's why like churches and cathedrals look so imposing because it's like, you know what you've done and God knows as well. It's the same thing as like the idea of like the elf on the shelf, you know. Oh yeah, what's that?

I know people were doing lots of like memes and like fun things. What do you think it is? Right, so I just saw there was like elf on a shelf. I didn't know what that was, but I did know people were like doing memes of like anything that rhymed or anything that rhymed. Tessacote's on a boat. So I'd superimpose you on a boat and it'd be like,

testicles on a boat, but it wouldn't say any words. It would just be a picture of you. Oh, I see. And then a picture of you on a boat, and that be it. And people would go, ah, does it go as it goes on a boat? Yeah. Isn't the internet a miracle? It is a miracle.

And I did love them, and I've not made it sound very fun at all. They sound great. What was the original elf on shelf? Rees with a spoon on the moon. See, like, perfect. Thank you. Just giving it a go. And you smashed it.

Yes. Elf on the shelf is an elf. Sorry, I'm still trying to think of, go on. Yeah. Could you want to do another one? No, because I still can't, I still can't think of one. Okay. Brad Pitt on a tit

Fantastic Stevie That's fantastic I was also thinking Brad Pitt But I was only working with Brad And I couldn't run anything

With Brad No it's hard Pit and tit though You've smashed it I've smashed it How do you feel? Elated Brilliant

Now explain what Elf on the Shelop is So Elf on the Shelp is a little wooden guy He's this big He sits on the shelf at Christmas He comes down on December 1st He's a very American tradition Okay right We don't really have him

He sits on the shelf And when kids are naughty parents are like, hmm? The wooden man's seen you. He's seeing you. Well, did you not have to have that thing of his father Christmas elves are listening? So to work out if you're naughty and nice. Yes.

And I was fucking terrified of those elves. Yeah. And I remember at one point, we were like in a supermarket. I must have been like maybe seven or eight. And I really remember it. I'd been naughty. I'd thrown a bit of a Benny because like I didn't get a thing that I wanted. And my mom was like, it's Christmas and we can't buy you this now.

And I'd be like, eh, or something like a horrible little girl. Anyway, the guilt of what I'd done, I couldn't speak. I couldn't stop crying. I was an absolutely mess for days. And then they found out that I was like, the elves will have heard that. So I've ruined everyone's Christmas. And all I could think was,

it's not just my Christmas I've ruined. Now, like, Gina is going to be like, oh, see, we didn't get any presents, and she's going to feel bad. She's going to try and give me presents, and I don't want it. I shouldn't know, oh, my God. And my parents are like, Jesus Christ.

We've overdone it. And all they've done has been like, the elves, listen, you know. because that's what you do. You're like, but when you tell that through a child, like the elves are listening. Yeah. That wooden man is staring at you. No wonder everyone's gone completely mad.

Everybody grew up in such an intense, because it's the perfect, Jesus or the elf are such a perfect example of like an ever-present thing that knows all the bad stuff that you've done and all the bad, that you've had bad thoughts, we didn't act on your action, so well done. And, you know, you were well-behaved as a sort of future reward concept. or a future punishment. And so we obviously like tie ourselves in complete knots about, you know, not going to Jonathan's birthday.

Yeah, the elves will see. And then God will see. But the, it's weird, isn't it? The reason that we've done it and the reason that parents do it and the reason that religion, you know, was kind of, it works. Like, it actually does work. So it's literally like... It works too well.

It's like in school. It's like, oh, we're just applying those same rules of like, whether you weren't get a good mark or like, you have to stand outside, you have, like, you have, like, punishments. And so it's like prison isn't it? Prison only like works if you're sort of a very specific type of person doing specific crimes. But like normal social things that aren't actually crimes. You need, there's nothing.

So we also... You have to punish yourself. Yeah. And making yourself feel physically sick. Yeah. Or getting someone else to be like, yeah, there's a man made of wood who's just heard you do that. And I think maybe that's... Maybe we've really come close to the issue.

You're like, here's this crimes, you go to go to prison. And these crimes, not going to... to Jonathan's party, being a shit friend, there's no clear punishment to make one up yourself, and it's not clear what the punishment is. So you just feel quite shit for a long time. You just crannily wake up being like, I'm shit, and you're like, I can't remember why, but I'm completely certain I'm shit.

And then you're like, oh, I didn't reply to this emo. There's no real, nobody really, nobody really minds. Yeah, no one, yeah, and that's the other thing as well. Like, often we're guilty for things that don't matter. Yeah. So if you are feeling really guilty, then I just think, like, there's no, there aren't any tips to stop feeling guilty because guilt is a thing that you will feel. Like, and if you're listening going, I don't feel guilt about anything, it's possible.

And I don't want to alarm you, but you may be like one of those sort of low-level sociopaths. And that's great. There are loads of them. You're probably non-violent. But if you don't feel any guilt, then, I mean, if anything, very liberating. Yeah, well done you. So you should be very, very happy with the brain that your body has been served. But most people listening will feel guilt.

and there's no point in going well here's what you should do to try and stop the guild there's no way anyone doesn't feel anything because there's no way anyone's like I am the best child to my parents I could be I have spent enough time with my grandparents I have given to my there is a proportion of people in the world that know that they're not the best they're like fuck you I don't need like

they just don't feel that feeling of until now I feel bad so that they're just like yeah I'm not but I'm human so you know oh that is much better yes and I think That's a lovely thing, but actually it doesn't work in a society because if you look at those sorts of people that don't feel any guilt, they are outside of society. They are also the sort of people that will break rules because we have this like constructed social thing where you don't do that and you don't.

So then those people feel frightened themselves. So they're just like, well, I'm obviously a monster, but they're not. They're just like doing things without guilt. They don't have often that feeling. But then sometimes with, obviously, that's not all of the antisocial personality disorders. was that's, I'm just really talking about, like, like, maybe in the past

when it was just like, balls to the wall, everyone's just stabbing everyone, you know, it's, it's a real, I don't know, like,

free for all. When was that time? I feel like the dark ages was like that. Right, okay. Because that was just literally like, sort of like Game of Thrones vibe, you know?

And it's like, honour! You're like, really? Yeah, yeah. Okay, well, his heads come off now,

but fine. In that time, that would have been great. But, like, now we see ourselves of being, like, civilised

in like real quotation marks. And I think it just doesn't work. So actually it feels like that would be freeing and liberating. But I think it will make you act in a way that is slightly odd in comparison to everybody else. Yes. So you may feel quite other. So what I'm trying to say in the most long way ever is that it's okay to be guilty. And you shouldn't not want to be guilty because the guilt is basically driving you to strive to be a better person or to.

Yes. But you do have to know that it's also struggling in a world of social media and in a world that is just not really created for human mental health, really, is it, at the moment? Especially in, like, the UK, obviously, in the developing countries, there's a whole lot of other stuff going on. So there's not really tips to stop. Well, I think that, so it's linked to the production of cortisol in your brain, which is similar to adrenaline and you're like a fight or flight or freeze. Everyone always forgets there's a third F you can do. Freeze, yeah.

You know, we always forget classic have a freeze. Have a lovely freeze. Anyway, linked to a fight or flight or flight. um is so therefore you can't live at this level you can't live at this like constant level of like ah what i'm supposed to have done something i'm a bad person what i'm a like it's not helpful it'll be ill so to channel it be like okay i feel it that's okay here i am a human being attempt to do the thing that you feel guilty about yes and if you're just every day being like i haven't replied that email it's like what a reply then for god's sake like if it's a fixable

thing to do it like if you're always like oh i haven't fixed that i never fixed that shelf when I'm such a bad person. If you're relating that to being like, and as a result, I'm this, you're like, just do the thing. Like, hush. And also, say sorry. If it's something that you've constantly felt

that you have this lingering guilt about something that you did to somebody, minor or otherwise, that's like, oh, I'm a bad friend or, oh, I did this terrible thing. And if the guilt is sitting with you, just say sorry. Yeah.

I apologize for it. Then, you know, even if the person doesn't accept your apology or whatever, you've done, you've offered that olive branch out. You've attempted to do that. So again, like fixing the practical things that you can fix. Fix the practical things. And then attempt to feel it, attempt to like put yourself in the other person's shoes.

So if you're feeling guilty about, you know, X, Y and Z, imagine how you would feel if you were on the receiving end of your behaviour. And if you're like, no, fine. Like, then maybe just let that go. Yeah, like the thing, like the low level sort of like not going to Jonathan's birthday. You're like, well, when it's my birth, then someone can't come. I'm not like, oh, well, they're dead to me. You just go, oh, that's a shame.

And then you just focus on all the people who are there. Yes, like it's fine. So it wasn't the biggest thing in the world. I remember always that I got an email once a few years ago from a friend who had come to my 21st, which was also my parents' 25th anniversary and my sister's 18th and my mom's 50th. So it was a big old do, multi-generational. It was in a circus tent. Of course.

And the theme was also circus. It wasn't. Anyway, got this very sweet email from a friend who was in AA, Alcoholics Anonymous, and said that as part of the 12-step program, you have to reach out to people that you've heard in the past and that they wanted to apologize for their behavior at the party. And I read it so many times. And I was like, I have no recollection of them doing anything at this party.

Oh wow, yeah, okay. It wasn't like, you know, we had... I've shot on you. Yeah, whereas there are a few people. They probably should have written a letter. Charlie Warner, who we could have had a sorry letter from, thank you so much. He threw up during the speeches. Oh, that's so dreadful.

No, well done, Charlie, live your life. But like this person, I was like, oh, you did nothing wrong. And obviously, this is, I said in like a long email back, being like, thank you so much, and I hope it's helping and thank you for reaching out to us. Please cross this one off the list. Like, you don't need to feel any guilt. you didn't do anything badly. I'm very sorry that this has weighed on you for all these years.

Yeah. And been a thing that you, that was on your, like on your, my name is Earl list of. Oh my God, I'm not thought about that TV show. I think about it most days. Okay, right. Yeah. Most of that. It's not going on that brain of yours.

It's so busy up here. If that email could knock me that much sideways and like so surprised, all the rest of you can email in as well. Like, imagine how there must be at least one other person who feels about something they did to me, that I'm like, oh, I don't even remember that. Yes. And so therefore, it's possible that something you are holding on to, the other person doesn't even recall. So you're carrying around this burden that's like,

no one else is worried about it. So if you can just reach out and like attempt to remove the burden to be like, maybe this thing is not as big a deal as you maybe think it is, and it's probably doing you so much more harm to carry it around because that guilt can't be channeled into anything good. You know, it can't do, there is no, you know, like the prison, there is no, there is no like, I've done my time,

I'm, like I paid my way, I paid my time back to the society, whatever. There is, that does not happen if you just enforce your own prison on yourself. Yeah, it's like, when do we decide that this ends? Like, how long is this sentence? And you're going to be way more hard on yourself than anyone else is. You're going to be your own worst jailer slash judge. Exactly, though possibly, as two ladies who've never been to jail, possibly jail is quite bad. I think also, yeah, I don't think they're called jailers anymore.

I think I was on like Robin Hood, the kind of Disney version. But yeah, I hope that helps in terms of people's feeling guilt. People's feeling guilt. That's how I'd like to say that sentence. Because it's just not something that you can really control. But yeah, like it says to saying, you can definitely like fix things that you can fix. And then the stuff that you can't fix, you have to be kinder to yourself. You have to know as well why it's there.

It's trying to help the guilt. It's trying to help you. And it's there for a reason. And it's possibly not a. bad thing that the guilt exists because if it didn't exist we'd probably all just shoot each other immediately. Yeah, it's compulsory that exists otherwise every time you got on the tube, you know, nobody would leave alive. Like that's literally why guilt exists. So say thank you for it. Just say thank you to your guilt guys. And yes. Yeah, it's there. Say thank you for the job.

It's done. They're like, we're good now. We're good now. Goodbye guilt. Um, please do tweet us at Nobody Panic Podcast. No. At Nobody Panic Pod. And tweet me at StoVM. The SOTZE.5. At me, Tessa Coates. And the Nobody Panic.

Gmail is Nobody Panic Podcast at gmail.com. Sweet ass. Thank you so much for listening. And we will see you next week. Layback vibe. Have a great week. Bye.