Nobody Panic - How to Understand ADHD - Part 1

Episode Date: July 18, 2023

As a surprise to absolutely no one, turns out Tessa has ADHD! Who'd have thought it! Well some of you as it turns out, and god bless everyone who has messaged her over the years to say 'hello, not to intrude, but do you think you might have ADHD?' She does! You were completely right! The first part of this two part episode is a look at what ADHD is, what the diagnosis process looked like for Tessa, a lovely little 12 question quiz you can play along at home and a really long story about a moose. Subscribe to the Nobody Panic Patreon at patreon.com/nobodypanicWant to support Nobody Panic? You can make a one-off donation at https://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanicRecorded and edited by Aniya Das for Plosive.Photos by Marco Vittur, jingle by David Dobson.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanic. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Carriad. I'm Sarah. And we are the Weirdo's Book Club podcast. We are doing a very special live show as part of the London Podcast Festival. The date is Thursday, 11th of September. The date is 7pm and our special guest is the brilliant Alan Davies. Tickets from kingsplace. It's coming to London. True on Saturday the 13th of September. At the London Podcast Festival. The rumours are true. Saturday the 13th of September at King's Place. Oh, that sounds like a date to me, Harriet. Nobody Panic at How To Podcast. Hello, I'm Stevie. And I'm Tessa. And I've forgotten what we're supposed to be doing. Very good. Very good. I mean, I sometimes do as well, but I know there's a difference between myself forgetting and you forgetting.

And I'm interested to explore it. I'm just want to introduce the top. I mean, they know what the topic is because it says it on the title. It's how to understand ADHD part one and two. Part one will be, what is it? Oh, yeah. And have I. got it? And number two will be, I have. And how to understand yourself better at both living

with it in yourself or living with it with a partner or a work colleague or a friend. Yeah, because that's the thing like, it would be good, yeah, to talk about how you can, like, I don't know anything about it. But then weirdly when you said, I've got ADHD, I was like, oh, that makes so much so. Yes. I wish we did know that when we were writing this book that we wrote. So, spoiler, spoiler up top. I've got ADHD. I've got ADHD. and some of you listening will be like, oh, yes. Yes. In fact, some of you have written to me about it.

Telling you that you've got ADHD. Telling you I've got ADHD. I appreciate all of you. Thank you so much. I discovered it last year. And then my Edinburgh show in August of last year was, it wasn't about it, but did touch on it. So I talked about it on stage then. But separately, people have messaged me.

Very recently, we talked on the, my adult thing was about putting up the curtain rail. Yeah. Doing it correctly, not abandoning it halfway. through, but also that I had been meaning to put up the curtain rail for a year. And then several people messaged to be like, hello friend. Do you think you might have ADHD? And one of the things is being like completely unable to do a task and then doing it and it taking such an incredibly short amount of time and learning nothing from that. So my sister hasn't been diagnosed, but probably does have ADHD and it's just like, I'm happy not to really deep, deep that.

You know, like I just, yeah. And I'm somebody who has the stuff. but as a personality trait, I don't have ADHD. So, like, I do, like, procrastinate and forget things and I'm scatty. But I also can put things in place and solve that and not be like that. Whereas Gina doesn't have, like, and that's the difference I've found. So maybe that it's tricky talking about it because you get in your, well, in your head, you might have, like, people just going like, well, that's just, you know, being lazy. Yeah, I think the just is a big part of it.

of like, we'll just be on time. Yeah. We'll just put a timer on. We'll just use an alarm. We'll just do it. Just do it. And you can't. If the word justice coming out of your mouth, this isn't helpful advice.

It's like someone being like, I've got stage fright and me being like, we'll just go. I mean, I do, be like, I'll just go on. Unfortunately, a lot of your advice is that. We'll just do it. So that makes it very, the intersection of you having ADHD, you makes it very interesting. Yeah. But then when people tell me to do you thing, I'm like, what's insane? Yeah.

What you're suggesting is insane. It's like being like, well, just pop up Everest. Just pop up. I'm like, I can't. Yes. I think with so much stuff that is, and this is, it comes under the category of being neurodiverse, would you believe. But I think there's so much stuff that is about, that's stuff in your head. The language is so far behind and we're so bad at it that when people have things that have gone awry in their head, they're expressing stuff that is something that happens to everybody.

It's just happening at more of extreme. So someone says they have depression and people were like, well, I was once sad. And you're like, it's not the same. And so it can feel very difficult to be like, yeah, I've experienced the same thing that you're experiencing. And here are my tricks. You're like, they're not the same thing. But the point is the tricks don't work. And that's the difference between if you're somebody who's just like a personality type that leans towards that sort of stuff. Or if you're somebody who has ADHD, like the difference is marked. And also I suppose as well, it's a spectrum too. And people will be much more so than others and all of that. So it's like, you can understand why you'd be like, oh, because there's a lot of discourse about it. When I found out I had it, and I sort of googled it, the book, the main book is called, it's not a particularly good book, unfortunately. I'm sorry to trash talk the book, but it is called I'm not a lazy, crazy, stupid girl.

And I just burst into tears. I was like, that's the name of the book. That, like, I was so moved that, like, that's what they'd called the title. And it wasn't called, like, just getting things done. I was like, I think, yeah, to get into the discourse, obviously, there's been very recently this panorama documentary. They've gone undercutter both to a GP, who, who said they did not have ADHD, and then they went to a private clinic who said they did have

ADHD. And the story has been like, ADHD is being overdiagnosed at these private clinics. And I feel very strongly about it that I think it's a slightly odd use of an investigative journalist to go and do this. But the thing is about when you go to your GP, if you go on the NHS, you'll do the quiz that we'll get to, a fun quiz. And then they say, yes, I suspect you have ADHD and then they say, like they said to me, they said, I think you're pretty, oh, I'm going to move you to urgent care. And I said, thank God. And they said, the waiting list is 18 months. So this investigative journalist, rather than waiting the 18 months to continue on the NHS path, just said, I actually haven't got it. And the doctor was like, okay. And then they went.

And then they paid to go to a private clinic and then filled out the quiz as though they did have ADHD and then went through the process with the psychiatrist answering the questions as though they did have it. And then being like, prank. Like, you're like, what did we prove here? And then they're like, it's such a high percentage of people who go to the private clinics get diagnosed. And you're like, well, yeah, like it costs like 500 pounds to go.

And you don't pay 500 pounds unless you're absolutely desperate and also pretty convinced you've got it. Yeah. Like I'm not going. Like casually. I'm not casually popping in, you know, for something else because I don't think I've got it. Yeah, and also as well, for the exact same reason that people may say,

or private clinics are doing that to get money out of you, well, the NHS are probably under-diagnosing because they can't afford to treat people. So everything is biased and what are you doing, journalists? What are you doing? No, and again, like it being like, why is everyone suddenly think they've got it now? It's like, well, because when we grew up in some early 2000, ADHD was very much naughty, hyperactive boys. So that was a thing like at your school, it was like, oh, so-and-so's got ADHD.

And then we don't have it in this country. It was very clear they did because they were like throwing a chair around screaming. Screaming. And so then Ritalin became heavily prescribed and then became phased out and we don't have it in this country. We only have it in America. But ADHD in girls or ADD without the H for hyperactivity. It was so clear like ADHD is for little boys. And then it's completely undiagnosed in daydreaming little girls who are just completely off their own fantasy imagination.

And the amount of times people will say like, what's it like in your head? And I'll be like, I'll probably the same as this is like in your head. Of course. And then I'm like, and I'm literally, if I did an impression on my head, it's like, da-da-da-da-da-da. But also things that I could. But I could do that impression of my head. Yeah. But it was only when you said something, which you probably remember to me, that really made me be like, yeah, that diagnosis was bang on.

Yeah. Where you said that you realized you'd never listened to music around the house because you never felt like it was quite. quiet. Yeah. And I think that is the most clear. Because I could go like my head's like, look at that. Because it is. I'm often looking at things.

Yeah. I'm saying look at that. But that was a real difference of like, oh yeah, that's like a completely different wiring of a, I don't understand that. So like, yeah. And I think because we're all like, yeah, if my head's also like da da da. And we just lack the language to like, have you seen that thing about the Apple on Twitter?

Have you seen the, um. Oh, some people hear the word Apple. Some people can visualize an apple. Yeah. And it's like, which one of you are the seven. different pictures and one is just completely nothing. One is the word apple is like imagine an apple if you could all imagine an apple in your head right now and are you literally can see nothing, can see the word apple, can see like the outline of an apple, can see a cartoon of an apple,

can see a grey apple or can see like a full red, snow white. All green. All green or whatever. Mine's Granny Smith. So that's what I've got. A full apple. Yeah. And honestly, when I saw the tweet, I was like, what are you talking about? Like, everybody has an apple, a whole apple. Right, yeah. And I was like, an apple, obviously. And then in the comments below, everybody was saying a version of, what are you talking about?

Everyone can just see the word apple. And I was like, what? Yeah, well, similar to the, do you have a commentary in your running commentary that you can hear, like almost like a little voice in your head that you can hear, or do you just sort of feel vibes, or do you see it in pictures, or do you have nothing? And I was like, obviously you have a combination of a running commentary and also pictures. Yeah. And everyone was like exactly the same thing.

We are opening up in our neuro understanding. We are in this era of being like, oh, we really did not understand how different everybody could be. And I think it's an exciting time, but we are definitely in the leech era of medicine. Like we're not that, you know, we're drilling into the head to release the ghosts. Treffening. We're treffining. Thank you. And it's got to pee in it.

So I would have said it was tree panning, but it's clearly treffining and it's a pleasure to do this podcast with you. So up until now, so I haven't really, again, like understanding that there are now seven plus different types of learner that like you're a kinetic or a visual or an oral or an audio learner. And understanding that just because you're like, oh, maths isn't for me. It's like, no, the way that you were taught at school wasn't for you. And that isn't because you're thick or a lazy, crazy, stupid girl. That's because it was presented to it in a way that your brain can't comprehend. Anyway, so when we were children, like, ADHD definitely wasn't a thing. And then in the pandemic, I guess with like so little else to do,

eventually your mind just sort of turned inwards of being like, hmm. And I saw, it was Twitter really that like I'd seen several tweets. I was like, yes, very funny tweet. That's something we all do. And then underneath it, various people had written like, heads up, you've got ADHD. And then writing the book, several things in the book, our editor had underlined and been like, this is not as human universal as you think it is. And I was like, yes, it is.

And then weirdly, like, how bad I was at, like, remembering what we were supposed to be doing with the book. And then when the deadline was approaching, I suddenly was like, do-da-da-da-da. We had a weekly deadline for about four months. And I don't think you ever hit it once. But also, as well, what I wanted to say was you mask it. You know, you just said then about people being like, well, maths is like this. And lots of people will go, oh, I can't, I'm thick. But then lots of people will be really good at pretending that they can do it and they're not freaking out.

but we'll just do, it's like duck swimming with their little legs. Yeah. And on the surface, they look fine. And that takes up so much brain power and so much stress to try to pretend you're not a crazy, stupid, lazy girl. And I think with the book, it was quite interesting working with you because you never once acknowledged you'd missed a deadline ever. And I thought I was going insane.

And so then afterwards when you were like, I've got a ditch year, I was like, oh, God, I felt really bad because I was like, I should have known that. but actually when you said that, I was like, oh, that makes so much sense. And if you'd have been diagnosed before the book, I wouldn't have given a shit because it would have been like, well, of course, like, fine, absolutely you're doing it. Because we didn't know, it was like, I don't know what's happening

because you're so good at masking that you're not able to do the thing or you're not able to, you know. And you've gone like, okay. And then just quietly not done it because you can't cope with it. But then you've not said I can't cope with it. So I'm like, I guess she's just not doing it because she's busy or she just doesn't want to. up until the two days before the deadline, when Tesla stayed up for about two nights,

I just wrote like 80,000 words. And I sort of like, was like, okay, I'm done. I've done all I can do. And you're like, I'm coming in! And I remember saying Tesla's really come into our own here in the last 72 hours of this year-long process. But it was really interesting seeing up close how you actually do work in the sense that you were struggling. I was struggling. discovering the word masking has been very big.

The psychiatrist asked me various questions and was like, how do you feel about doing this? And I was like, I was like, I know I'm not allowed to do that. I think it was about getting up in the theatre. One of the questions is like, would you want to get up? And I was like, yes, I want to get up all the time. But I know you're not allowed to get up, so I don't get up. And I really was like, and I said it very proudly.

I was like, I know you're not allowed to, so I don't. And he was like, that's called masking. And he was like, it takes an enormous effort for you to behave in the correct manner because that's what you've learned. And I was like, oh, God. And he was like, very tired because you have to do so much the duck paddling, whereas you're just like, everybody needs to sit on their hands in the theatre, right, to stop them getting up. And you're like, no. And I'm like, oh, well, that's a huge surprise. Yeah.

And so I think it is that understanding just like and knowing for yourself when you're like, this isn't working as opposed to just like, this is everybody feels like this, but everyone else is just pushing through. and being like, no, everyone else is thriving in this environment. And equally, like, I just did everything at the last minute and stayed up all night and did stuff because that was the only time anything, like, kicked into gear for me. I thought I physically couldn't do it otherwise. And then it was like, everybody likes that, don't they? Everybody likes it.

And people do talk about it, yeah. People are like, oh, yeah, I stayed up all night. But they're just because they were like out or whatever. Like, you're doing it because you have to do that. I have to do that. And you're like, it's not very healthy or good, is it? I mean, I would have just had a such an easy. time at school as a child in my entire life as a working colleague. The whole thing would have

been so much easier had everyone known. But like, well, I suppose, no, no, it's right. It's only for me. Like I started working on a project somebody the other day and they were like, well, take your time. And I was like, heads up. That's sort of the worst thing you can possibly say. I need you to say, this needs to be in by Thursday. And that's crucial. You need to be like 10 a.m. on Thursday. This has to be on my desk. And they're like, but it doesn't. I was like, I really need you. Stop doing that. to really pretend that there are deadlines and then don't wink afterwards because if you say like soft deadline that does that to me means that's not a deadline. No, of course. I need you to be saying

the gate is coming down. This is when we're getting there. So what from you reading those tweets and doing that so the book was a thing and then you make the tweets? So the only person who's really at fault is the therapist I saw for three years who didn't at any point, which is I hadn't gone about any of this stuff, but obviously a lot of it was coming up. And at no point did she say. do you know what you might have? So she's probably the only person to really be at fault. But she did fix plenty of other stuff. But she should have, let me tell you, she should have guessed that.

And the other thing is we had a book as a child called him, if you give a moose a muffin. And so seriously. If you give a moose a muffin. About ADHD, of course. Well, this is the thing. So the book is called, it's a picture book of a kid and a moose comes in. He's got trousers on.

He's a moose. He's not scary. But the moose comes around and the boy gives him a muffin. It's not scary. It's a Canadian connection, isn't it? Obviously, growing up in the Ingle, I'm like, what are you talking? And I reference it all the time and everyone's like, what the hell? Who's this moose?

Anyway, so the moose comes around, the boy gives him a muffin. And the moose says, you give a moose a muffin, he'll want some jam to go with it. Of course. After he's finished the jam, he'll want to make more jam. So you'll go out into the woods to pick berries. If you go to pick the berries, he'll get a thorn in his jumper. When he gets a hole in his jumper, he'll want to fix it. When you go to the sewing box to get the sewing equipment out, he'll sew up to sew up his jumper.

He'll want to start making sock puppets. When you start getting the sock puppets out, and then he wants to get a big sheet out and says, we should make scenery. When you get the paint out, he'll accidentally get paint on the sofa. He'll want to clean it up. And so it's like they're making this enormous mess in the house because everything they go to do, they get distracted by something else along the way. And we used to laugh about that when I was a kid. And my parents would call me the moose

or if I got distracted, they would reference the moose and the muffin. And somewhere in that book, it should have said, by the way, your child's got ADHD. This is a book about ADHD. And it's like, if the moose is really resonating, your child has ADHD. Your child is a moose. Your child is a moose.

Not scary, but he wears his trousers. So those were the clues. So what is ADHD? It stands for attention deficit hyperactivity disorder And would you believe the exact causes of ADHD is unknown? But the condition has been shown to run in families. Hello, mum. And to an extent, dad, both of them have it a bit.

Research has identified a number of the possible differences in the physical brain chemistry of people with ADHD compared to those without the condition. They truly don't know what causes it, but factors suggested as potentially having a role in ADHD include being born prematurely, having a low birth weight. You were massive. Exactly. Smoking during pregnancy. So I cannot stress enough, not one of those. I was enormous and came out two weeks late weighing £11 and I climbed out. And sat up. It's not and sat up immediately. So it's nothing to do. I don't believe it to be a thing especially. I just think it's such an unnecessary guilt thing to add to people to be like it happens in utero.

Of course, let's blame the woman to smoking a cigarette or being near secondhand smoke. Because that's saying we don't know what it causes it and we can identify different patterns that. can't be like, there it is. So the attention deficit part, it can express itself in the hyperactivity. It can express itself in attention deficit and that you forget almost immediately if somebody is giving you oral instructions with my personal trainer, for example, would give me an instruction. And it took us a little while for me. Then she would be like, okay, now you go. And I honestly would literally pick it up and be like, what about what that I've just said is what you're doing now? And it took us a little while for me to be like, I can't take in any oral

instructions. So I need you to show me. And ideally, I just start, ideally, because I'm not really taking it in. So if I just start and then you sort of correct me and then we can do it. You learn by doing. I learn by doing so I can't hear you. That's a great example of something that like sounds like, I can see the personal trainer just being like, well, just listen.

We'll just listen. Simply listen. An interesting aspect of it is that we're very good in a crisis because one clear goal and we can focus and a bit like the deadline it's like and it feels physically good to be like I'm doing the job and the thing that is in the book that again was one of the things that came up that I've thought about a lot is me I'm like seven or eight and I let out the nectar neighbor's guinea picks and I dwelt on it for a long time about being like why did I do that and part I think I was just like seven and a freak and everyone's a freak.

week when they're seven. But I think it was because they used to escape quite a bit the guinea pigs. And when they escaped, it was like the only time I felt physically good because we were looking for the guinea pigs. Oh, wow. And so it was like, everyone was united. We were doing it. We had a quest. We were looking for the guinea pig. Fuck, you love quests as well. I love a quest, right? So it's all this stuff of being like, ah, okay. She actually loves a quest and I feel physically panicky, like not to have a quest. What state to go through the world? We're physically panicky because there's not a quest.

Well, so few quests. When we started going out when we were teenagers, again, like people really just took this in their stride, but people would have to give me a treasure hunt in the club. Yeah. Because it felt too overwhelming and panicky of being like, what are we doing here? Yeah.

What are we doing in the club? Yeah, you like to do things and know things that are happening. Yeah. We're going to go, like, escape rooms. Great. Like activities. I love an activity. I like to be told what we're going to do.

we're doing. We don't really to hang out in bars. I don't like to just hang out in bars. And when I do, I bring my tarot cards. I wasn't expecting I was expecting that

for the sentence was going to end. But yeah, cool. Yeah, it feels way too overstimulating and I don't know what we're doing in here. But like I like, a one-on-one conversation or like tarot card or anything where I'm like, we're doing the quest. We're doing the quest now.

And that is very much your vibe of like, and you've lent into that and that's been your thing. Like, you don't know what Tess is going to be saying or doing. She's a lot of fun. And she's always got a funny. anecdote. Yes. So I think I lucked out as also getting of all the, like, cookie things, we pulled out of the genetic

bag, we got like, able to laugh at yourself. And I was able to be like, it's a cookie personality, but I do suspect I have overcompensated on cookie personality. I would agree. We'd all agree. Because people laughed so much at the things I was doing that I just had to be like,

like, even on stage sometimes, I'm not appreciate it, standard comedian, but the amount of times on stage I do say, why are you laughing? Like, which is mad. You say the thing that you think is a set up to a joke. Yeah. You're just telling the boring story and everyone's laughing

because what you've just said is not anything anyone would have to do. Yeah. The other really interesting part of it is, you won't believe this, the big font. Everything that is coming together. My God. The big font, my font. Tess has had a phone like my granddad had his phone. I mean, he's dead now.

And he still has his phone like that. Since I've known you, you've had the font big for grandma. Yeah. Talk me through that. My font is on the largest setting on the telephone. And I rarely show people because everybody laughs at it so much. It's like a Fisher Price telephone. Also about a menu and I'll be like, that's too much.

The space is too close together and can't like take in any of the information. Right. And it's about, it's like it's sort of like white noise like strobes. Like it's all too close. And so it has to be really big so we can like individually take in the piece of information. Otherwise it's all just like too much. Stevie would show me things on her computer and I'd say the phrase, make it big for grandma.

And I was like, I guess she can't really see well. So there's so many things that we just sort of went, oh yeah, Tessa likes to make it big for grandma. Yeah. We didn't really question it. That's the thing. And I just got a, I just masked my way through about being like,

she's a cook and like, got away with all this stuff. Everyone being like, she's a cook. She likes big font. She likes big, you know this, absolutely classic.

She's got some absolutely massive font. And then I think I'd be like, oh, well, don't you need, I think I thought you need glasses. You would take your glasses out and they would be like from four years ago, and they'd be like put together with cellotite together. It turns out it wasn't really an eye issue.

It's my brain can't take it in. And so I need everything to be very big. Similarly, you know, I'm obsessed with ambiance and fighting and where I sit in a restaurant and it's all to do with the same thing. It's just like a sensory overload. And I'm very like too aware of like the energy is the energy is off. God, all these things you're doing. It's really.

All this stuff coming off and being like, oh yeah, all these things that you're just like, I guess that's my personality. I'm like, no. No. You're missing a piece of the jigsaw up there. Is that the hyperactivity element? So hyperactivity can often sometimes be throwing... Because I had a friend who had ADHD at uni.

And he would just do things. Like he brought like a dead fish into the lecture and threw it at someone. And everyone was like, okay. What? Yeah. Because we all... He would have to do things to like make something happen. Why did he throw the fish at somebody?

Because he thought it would be a fun joke, a fun prank. Right. And he would often do these, have these outbursts of just like doing something to watch something happen and affect the energy of the room and it's like, but he was so physical that you go, yeah, hyperactivity. You've said quite a lot like you don't have hyperactivity, but then what you're saying about you're overstimulated. Is that part of the hyperactivity? It's not necessarily part of the deficit part of that you're just like, it's all just too much. Like you just can't take everything in. It sounds like he was very physical with his energy and couldn't control himself.

But the fish thing sounds like quest behavior of just being like, are the unfortunate part that sometimes comes with quest behavior is the hyper focus being like, oh, this is a good idea, and we can't pivot once we've decided it's a good idea. This is that the thing I've seen about hyper fixation. Hyper fixation, that's the correct word. Thank you. And it's not to do the podcast with you. So, like, you'll be like, I'm going to throw this fish and you'll be like, this is a good idea,

this will go down well. And you just haven't got any. So if you imagine like a control room in like Jason Bourne, they're looking for Jason born. There's all the people on the computers. There's people doing stuff. Imagine like you're like somebody in that room is like, we should throw that fish and people are like fun. And then someone else is like, what if it doesn't and people don't like that?

There's just nothing there. It's just like, we should throw this fish and then the entire team is like, throw the fish. Like everybody is just like, you're like, because I've always wondered about the confidence element that you have. I'm like, I'm going to just run a marathon. I haven't really, you know, I think I'm rehearsed, but I haven't rehearsed the marathon. I haven't trained. But like, it'll be fine. Yeah.

Yes, that was in your show, isn't it? But like, I'm sure. It shows about like the lack of risk assessment. Because there's nobody up there doing risk assessment. The entire team are just like, we're running the marathon. And there's actually nothing.

And I used to get in trouble. I remember like when we were primary school, you started doing science and you had to do, like the risk assessment thing. I got in trouble because I was always just like letting the stuff off. Like, Quest, I just need the stuff to happen. I want,

you know, I'm always like, I want to be part of someone's drama. Like, I stayed in the bank the other day because they said they were closing. And they were like, we're closing earlier because there's going to be a company team meeting and the lady was like,

I think everyone's going to get fired. And I said, I'd like to stay. I was just like, I want to be, I need to exist on this like constant level of stuff is happening. Stuff is happening. The narratives occurring. I need to be part of the drama. I want to be part of everything at all times. And so on this like sort of interesting chart that's like it's active and risk and it's passive and safe. And so I sit in active risk. That's such a bad one that I thought about was that like the phone charger, for example, People always like, why isn't your phone charged up? And I think it is because it feels physically nice for it to be on 3%.

Yeah, it's the train doors that I've still never got to the bottom of until you said you had 88 and I was like maybe that's something to do that you like, you actively like to be, to just get there. I don't just like it. I physically like it, which is the worst part is that like I'm, my body makes dopamine and adrenaline in the wrong way. And so it feels physically nice. A different way. A different way.

It makes things in a different way. And so it's understanding like, oh, you obviously shouldn't like. like that. And that's the thing like understanding yourself of being like, oh, no wonder these things happen to you. Like, you search them out and then you like like it. I know. It's great. It's really interesting. You're a little chaos goblin and you like you like. Yeah. And you might be listening and being like, I have the attention deficit part. I don't necessarily consider myself a chaos goblin. And like, I don't want to speak for anybody or diagnose anybody. I'm just telling you my own personal experience and understanding myself a bit better and being like, it's actually it is quite

naughty. Because all brains are different. So yeah, that is true. Like it. You might be thrown a fish. You might be actually outwardly completely presenting as somebody who doesn't have ADHD, but inside you're having all these thoughts or all these things. Yeah. A couple more things that have been made obvious. The time blindness, like completely can't understand what time it is. And so frustrating for other people to be in a working relationship with somebody who can't comprehend what time is.

Yeah, I mean, it is interesting. But once you sort of like go, like, that didn't bother me because it was like, Tesla just is not going to be on time. And once you stop, like, expecting you to be on time, time, then you're like, okay, that's fine. It's not like you're like four hours late or you don't turn up. You always, the fact that you turn up to stuff and you know when stuff is and you, and up until last year didn't have a diary. Yeah. I actually don't understand how you're doing. Like, that's incredibly impressive, actually. Because like you say, you're paddling way quicker

than I am because I can tell the time. Yeah. I think it's just, but again, it's like, and then it means that people in your life they have to make these compensations for you that don't feel very fair. My family are quite good at it. like they don't, if I say I'm coming home on Tuesday, then they know that they can't really ask, like, when. And I'll just arrive at some point. At leisure, because I don't want to be late. Is that why you don't sort of ever when, like, I've, like, put, like, invites out to something and you won't say if you're coming or not, you'll just turn up or you won't? Correct.

Right. Okay. That does, that helps, actually. Because that is, that is the thing that, yeah, makes sense now because you don't want to commit in case you can't make it. I believe that to flake or to let them down is so much worse than... Not replying. Yeah. Yeah, I can't bear the idea of letting people down.

So I guess I let them down. I guess I can't bear the like them down on the day. So I let them down for the months leading up to it. Yes, understood. Yes, it is. But because it would be a constant state of panic for me to say I was coming. Yeah, that's very interesting. Okay, right.

So CVs invites me to her wedding party. I've seen it. I've written it in my diary, which is big. Yeah, fine. That's big for me. Also, I don't mind because I know that you do that. So it hasn't bothered me. But I've not said to you that I will or won't attend, which is not fair.

I think you don't need to because I feel like friends, I think you might need to be people that you don't know very well. But I imagine you can do that anyway. It's friends like me, for example, you don't actually need to do that with me because you've just explained. So like I now know, for example, like the other night when we went for drinks with like Freya and like a bunch of friends. And when I got there, I was like, oh, it's Jessica.

I was like, she hasn't replied at all. She's an enigma unto herself. But then you did turn up and it's fine. But now I know that. I think with friends, you don't have to do that. Maybe it's just like an emoji of like a trumpet or something. You know, just something silly or nothing. And I know that you will either be there or you won't be there.

But if I send you a trumpet, you'll be like, what the fuck does this trumpet mean? The trumpet means. I'll tell you what I'll get from the trumpet. Okay, please. Also, the trumpet is my emoji of choice. So don't feel you have to go with the trumpet. You know, there's many emoji. The red balloon floating away.

What does it mean? That is your emoji. Yes, that one. be that because that says to me like I either will or won't but I have acknowledged that's me and best wishes to us all. So I just reply and I say this has certainly been seen. Best wishes to us all, I will or I won't. Okay.

Yeah, okay. Yeah, you can do that. Okay, but I have got way better at putting things in. Normally the things would come in that were too far and I would just be like, oh, no. And I've just been like, four. yourself to put them in the diary and then they just come up the week before. I'm like, oh, thank you from me in the past. There's all the things. That is helpful actually. You've been living in a very chaotic way.

Yes. But I was one more thing. Oh, the school reports, nothing but if she only applied herself and chatting in class, naughty girl, I hated it being told I was naughty girl because I wasn't naughty. To naughty to me felt like, I've actively put a frog in everyone's locker, even though I would love that day. You know what I say, Classic quest behavior Ancythian quest You know when I say things like Don't cause the drama but be near the drama

You know like so I don't want to put the I know that's naughty to put the frogs in the lockers But so I never did And I considered to be actively naughty But I was constantly in trouble for it And I was like I'm really trying my best here And I was like good at a pop quiz or whatever Never handed a single piece of homework

Like but like didn't mind an exam Like I was like I can do it Just like please stop giving me homework I think how much should be illegal. And the last thing is the supermarket. The supermarket turns out to be a both sensory place of panic for me, a sensory overload. Yeah. But also, we struggle, what does it say here?

A deficiency in the two neurotransmitters, neuroephrine and dopamine, can lead to unregulated behaviour in eating. Because we can't think forward ahead in time to say that's what I'll want in the future. We can only be completely present. We were doing the, when we were in a sketch group, I mean, your lunch was always, you just like get some tangfastics and eat them and then like sort of go and get something like, it was never like, I brought something. I've never brought anything in my life. And sometimes you'll say, I'll be like, let's eat this, you know, monstrous thing for lunch or something. And then you'll be like, I'm going out for dinner tonight. So I'll just have something small for lunch.

And every time you do it, I think, wow. I've never in my life managed to think ahead enough to what dinner will be to. think through what lunch should be in my life. Because if you were like, do you want to eat like Henry the eighth right now? I'd be like, yeah. And then they'd be like dinner. Henry Oth again, I'm like, yeah. Okay.

So it can lead to, and it's something that's like, being really full. It can lead to be really full. If something who's like got just completely not, it can tip yourself very quickly to eating disorders, but it can also go to disordered eating, which I absolutely have very quickly. Like, Tang fast eat for breakfast, reasonable.

And I like, so when I get to Zipmark, all I do is ever eat crisps on my way around. And then I just take the crisps, I eat too many crisps, basically, so I can't. And is online internet online shopping better? Because you can, like, type in things. So it's like... I have found that much, much better. I have found the supermarket to be very overwhelming place.

And I was just very embarrassed by how genuinely, not scary is the wrong word, but just like too much. I found the supermarket. Because everyone would be like, yeah, no one likes going to the supermarket. I was like, yeah, but... Not like this. I don't know if it's quite like this. So, but doing an online shop for the first time I was like, oh, yeah. Yeah, this leisurely.

Yeah, because you do it in your own time. You can like take a break. Take a break on a little thing. But then you shouldn't have to take a, there's a thing like, you shouldn't have. You shouldn't, because the world is set up for people

who aren't oversimulated by a supermarket. Yeah. I mean, it's also set up for different things as well, but that's one of them. The world runs off. Yeah. People being not obviously an investment.

You won't, and this is the last one before, and I'm going to do the quiz. Oh my God, yeah. Sitting like this, one of the questions with the psychiatrist said, how do you feel about chairs? And I said,

I hate them. I said, I want to be up very high or very low. Like, I don't want to sit in a chair. And he's like that, I was often in the case. And we don't want to, like, sit. Like, I'd like to sit just, like, cross-legged or something. You know how I, like, always am sat like, angular. Sat, like, just crooked.

And so I find, like, chair sitting a bit much. Yeah, no. Okay. And I'd like to, like, tuck in up high or down low. Like you'd like to be sat up. Quite would, yeah. Yeah, like a bat. I would, yeah, like a bat.

I genuinely. When I see like a family of squirrels have made a nest in a very small space. I'm really jealous. I want to get in that space. Okay. Would you like to do the quiz? Yeah. You don't have to answer, I suppose.

No, I will. Why not? Is it a quiz that is the official quiz? It is actually, I'm calling it a quiz, but it is the official quiz. I don't think of the even though questionnaire. But no, it's a questionnaire. That's the correct one. Yeah, because quiz is like, which handbag are you?

Sorry, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so question one. Are you more of a leather or a metal scrap? No, you're right. It's a questionnaire. There's 12 questions here, and then I won't do them, but then there's 10 more questions about your childhood. And then if you continue on the path to diagnosis,

your friends and family have to fill out another questionnaire for you. That's good. And, yeah, which is interesting. And then there's like a written part, and then you'd have to go and speak to somebody. And when's in which they ask you about yourself. It's quite involved. It's not just...

Oh, it's relatively involved. That's the thing, I think the... That's the thing about this panorama thing. Like, it's all a bit mean that they... It's all a bit mean. And that's more involved, because I think I very flippantly said before, well, the anxiety thing,

you just get a questionnaire and they go, are you anxious? And you go, and they go, and they go, we've done some pills. But that also was a while ago. So maybe it's different now, but that seems much more involved. I think because it does feel like a quiz,

like it is all a bit, you know. Okay. And so they're all never to very often. So I'll just read them. We'll be swift. You don't have to answer. I will. Okay.

Never, rarely, sometimes, often, very often. I find it difficult finishing a task or project. Yeah, I don't really. Rarely. Honestly, when I did this quiz the first time, I don't know, I scored 100%. I was like, right, but this is just being a person. Yeah. And I gave them to other people and they did, like, they scored like three.

And I was like, okay. I find it difficult to organise myself or a task. Yeah, sometimes, yeah. I find it difficult to remember appointments. Sometimes. times. If a task or project requires a lot of thought, I will often delay in getting it started. No.

I'm just so anxious I'll do it immediately. This is why we're like, I wonder why you're both writing this book was hard. I'm like, I have a little thinking. And you're like, it's already done. I've written it. I've booked us on this train. I'll be like, but why? And you're like, well, it's done now.

But it's the wrong one. Oh yeah, I'm doing it correctly. Sure. I find it difficult to sit still and often fidget or squirm. I don't know. Do I don't think I do? Do I? No, I think you're quite still.

You're quite good at that. I'm quite a woman. Still, like you said I'm quite good at that. Because I don't have that as a problem. I wouldn't say that's like a good or a bad thing. I'd just be like, I'm just quite still. Whereas I consider non-squarming to be like, well done. Because you're like, from childhood.

Noisy, naughty, naughty, naughty. Yeah. You used to get like, be like, well, don't you didn't do any squirming today. Again, like, Don, you didn't do any squirming today. Fuck off. Fuck off. Like, if you're getting the stuff done, which sounds like you weren't either. but if you were

I wasn't, I wasn't. But maybe you weren't because all of your energy is focused on not squirming, for example. Like if you're allowed to just be and then do the stuff, like that you need to... It's so frustrating because, yeah. Yeah, so much effort was spent on not squirming, not talking out.

I would describe myself as on the go and feel compelled to do things that's driven by a motor. Absolutely not. Really? I'm quite lazy. I am stupid. I am stupid and lazy, just so we all know.

I find it hard to remain focused in a group setting. Um, no. See what I mean? I do relate to so many elements because my mum's, I think my mum probably has some sort of, she's like dyslexic. If Gina does then probably, yeah. And so I relate to it, but I've got them as personality traits. Like all of those things I'm saying like, yeah, sometimes I do.

But like sometimes I don't. I can sort of, I can switch on and off. I'm sorry, I'm like, I'm gloating here. No, no, no. I can sit still on a chair as well, guys, just see you know. My mind feels very cluttered and it's hard for me to concede. concentrate on one thing at a time. That is true. Yes, I do have that often. I make decisions quickly and fail to think through the consequences. No. I am often irritable with a short fuse.

Yes. For me, actually, maybe. I think you have a short fuse about certain things. Like, you will, you sort of are impatient with like people or like, just do it. You're right. I do. I do. Like if I was going to do an impression of you, it would be good lord and don't come, just do it. Those are me, I think. I have mood swings, sometimes feeling quite high, other times low. Yes. Who doesn't feel that? I think that is every spot.

That's just a person, surely to God. I often miss what is being said to me in conversations. Yeah, yeah, I do. And I get the conversation wrong and then look stupid. That happens all the time. I do zone out all the time. You're not, no, not stupid. Sorry, and I look like I've not been listening because I haven't.

But I can't take in information in my ears. That's just a personality thing. But you said yes to all the others. I did, yeah, I did, yeah. But either way, maybe then, at least you're knowing, so we're going to transition to the, what to do if you've got, you know, how to understand yourself a bit better.

But maybe even if you don't have ADHD or you don't have all the things, being like, oh, okay, knowing that you're not good at taking in oral instructions, is a really good to know about yourself to be like, sorry, so sorry, I'm not very good at oral instructions. It's so nice, yeah, when you just be like, oh, sorry, I'm actually not the sort of person who can do that. So could you do it like this? And then someone go, okay, great.

Yes, I understand. I relate because I know that my brain can't do everything. Yeah. People just don't think, people just don't really think about their brain. So then they're like, why can't you do it like I can do it? The better we are all being like, I need this. Everyone's like, great. Yeah. Now I know how to give it to you.

No, I know how to give it to you. And it doesn't, anybody advocating for themselves or a specific thing, they need be like, wonderful. That's helped me so much know what you need to have. Yeah. It's like for Tess's for your surprise party, which was going to be, you know, a chair and you alone and no quests and just, you know, it's. In a supermarket. Now I know not to do that.

Don't put me in the supermarket. You won't, it's okay. Not the chair in the supermarket. Your classic birthday. Oh, I hate it. Oh, okay. Well, now I know. Yeah.

I would hate that. So, possibly you think all of those quiz things relate to you or you think maybe just a couple of them, but even if not, or if you know someone has got it or you've got it or whatever. In the next episode, I'd like to talk about things that have helped me since I've learned and I've got it. I definitely think I'm on a journey that is not at its completion, but I have learned some very interesting things along the way that I think are very helpful,

whether you have it or not, or if you live with somebody who does, I think it must be very hard to be the partner of somebody. I think it must be much more helpful for the partner or a friend or a flatmate of someone who has ADHD if they know they have ADHD. Like I think it's very hard maybe if you don't know and you're just like, why aren't you do? What?

Like that must be very difficult. Yeah, I think that's sort of a nightmarish place to live. That's the thing, like, you can get quite upset that you've got it or whatever, but it's like knowing you've got it doesn't make the things you're doing, you're doing them anyway. Like, you can't change that about yourself. Now you just have a name for it. And a relative had a, got very upset about somebody having autism and was like, they don't. And I was like, they do. And you being cross about that isn't making it any better.

We can't just pretend they don't. Like, let's just learn all the techniques and the things that we need to make life easy for everybody. Now we, it's actually quite a nice thing because it's like, now we know this person. Like that's what the part of the person. And to say no, you're just denying a huge part of that person. They are. Exactly. It's like, it's okay. These things aren't, don't have to be bad. You know, like I know somebody who, when they told their parent that they had ADHD, said, I don't think you need, oh, I don't want you to have a label.

Be like, the label is actually really helpful. Yeah. And means that you can be like, oh, okay, this is the thing I have. And you just deciding that you don't like the label isn't going to make me any better or. worse at it. Yeah, I'll still be doing the same things. I'll just be doing the same things, but you'll just be pretending that if I just got it together, then this would be okay. Like, you've got to be like, oh, okay, I get it. This is okay. Everyone's welcome. Let everyone be who they are. And I really do think, like saying about children squirming at school, like,

I think we're moving in an exciting direction in which children will just be allowed to squirm, or do their own thing or, you know, we'll be way better at being like, that's just who that child is. And no amount of putting them into the triangular-shaped box is going to stop them being a square peg, you know? Yes. And also, we're so much more, like, people are so layered and our brains are so complex and our personalities are so complex, you're so much more than, like, you have ADHD or, you know, it informs a lot of the things that you will do, sure, but just like, you know, who you sleep with, how you identify, like, all of these things are very big, important things, and part of you, and it's not like, that's not like what you are, you know, like, unless it helps you

to feel like that in which case, great. But like, you don't, you, you can decide how much you, how you respond to the, to the news of, of, like, you know. Yes. Yes. Yes. Exactly. You can write out she's how you respond and you respond positively. I found it to be a positive experience.

That's great. Yeah. So, join us next time. Can't wait for part two. Can't wait. Learn some tricks. Learn some magic tricks. Yes.

Great. Okay. See you there. See you there.