Nobody Panic - How to Understand the Coil

Episode Date: November 8, 2022

Tessa has been on both coils, Stevie thought IUDs were massive coils of metal until she was 25 and still doesn’t know how they work so grills Tessa on her experiences. Neither are medical professionals, so this is just a starting point for your own research!Subscribe to the Nobody Panic Patreon at patreon.com/nobodypanicWant to support Nobody Panic? You can make a one-off donation at https://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanicRecorded and edited by Naomi Parnell for Plosive.Photos by Marco Vittur, jingle by David Dobson.Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/nobodypanic. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, I'm Carriad. I'm Sarah. And we are the Weirdo's Book Club podcast. We are doing a very special live show as part of the London Podcast Festival. The date is Thursday, 11th of September. The date is 7pm and our special guest is the brilliant Alan Davies. Tickets from kingsplace. It's coming to London. True on Saturday the 13th of September. At the London Podcast Festival. The rumours are true. Saturday the 13th of September at King's Place. Oh, that sounds like a date to me, Harriet. offulating. I don't think so. I don't. I don't. I don't think so. Since having the Fantastic India Rackerson of the Fantastic podcast, 28-ish days later on, we've been getting into understanding our mental cycle, our hormones cycle, our bod-bods.

We've been learning if we're ovulating. And a very interesting question that came out of that podcast episode, and you don't have to listen it, but as a precursor to this one, but it is fascinating, is that we discussed that both India and I had the coil and, as Stevie said, I've never, I've never understood it, I don't know what it is, I'm frightened, please can be do an episode on it so I can ask you questions like, what is coil. What is coil? So, welcome to what is coil. I think we should actually call it, what is coil. Well, how to understand what the coil is. How to understand what is coil? Because it's such a...

As with so many of these things like this, you know, you... Maybe you find somebody at a party who quietly reveals this, like, later on and then you're like, okay, sorry, but what is it? You know, and otherwise, the information just like isn't out there. I honestly, I was going to say

because this is going to be mainly me asking you questions about it. But, um, so, you know, your, your kind of coiled journey. But my, my coil journey is so quick, I could say it now. Please. Which is, um, at school, at the sex education thing where we got separated from the boys. Of course.

And we had to be told, essentially everything about, I suppose, really penises. I'm not really anything to do with myself. Fine. There was a bit of an attempt later on in that year nine to kind of be like,

be a bit more interested about it. But it like, it kind of, nothing stuck and it wasn't enough. But I remember being like, here of the options, you've got your, yeah, you've got your condoms, condoms, condoms, condoms. And you've got femidoms.

I was like, what's that? I still don't know. A little hat that goes, that's a little fess that goes up your badge. Then you've got... For a million pounds, I wouldn't be able to successfully identify or use a Femadon.

If you had one on the table now, I'd be like, I don't know what that is. Is it a drinks coaster for a very small shot glass? I could draw one. I couldn't... If we were in Squid games and they were like,

put the... I would be dead. No. I would draw, I think, a swimming cap for a mouse. That's what I'm thinking. Like, it's got... Anyway, it's like,

we don't know? We don't know. Okay, so then there's that. And then the other one was like, a pill, which you just take it. It's like, well, obviously that one, because I'll say it's even, no one told you about it would maybe make you go a bit bonko. And then the one that was like, well, obviously not, which is like, it's essentially like the drawing of it because it was not in proportion to the rest of the thing. It looked like the size of your entire uterus. And it was like, it's a copper coil that irritates the lining of your womb or whatever uterus.

And so that you just, your body's like, well, I can't put an egg there because it's absolutely hell. Yeah. So, like, well, obviously not that one. And then as I've got older, that I've not changed my opinion because no one has changed my opinion for me. Haven't heard anything about it. No one really talks about the call unless very occasionally they'll be like, oh, I've had it removed and it was bad. So, and then I've been like, hang on, why did you quietly be like, why have you gone for that? And then India on the podcast episode revealed that like pretty, after when we were talking.

revealed that pretty much every gynecologist she's spoken to has something called the marina coil and I was like, what, is that for like people of the sea? Like, boatman? Like, I have no idea. So this episode is, we're not experts, but Tessa is, I mean, an expert in so much as you've had the coil yourself, both types.

And so we're going to do our adult things in a bit, but then we're going to, basically, I'm going to ask Tessa all about it. Tess is going to tell me about it and you can learn with me. And there'll be lots of things that we don't know, but like we'll talk about it later, but doing your research is so crucial about these things. And this can be your little starting point. Starting point.

If you're like me and you're like, well, what is coil? Now you at least know what is coil. And you can take that through it. Yeah, absolutely. I think I can only obviously bring my own personal experience to the table. Some of it is quite common. This happened to me, but you will have your own personal journey. But I can only just, but I didn't know even anybody who'd had one when I started.

No one talks about it. And here you are, Stevie. So we're trying to help the people. Just trying to help the people. We were separated. When we had sex education in year, even year five was the beginning of my progressive feminism journey. We were separated.

And I was like, why have we been separated? And they were like, it's shush. And I still to this day believe, like, I think everybody should learn everything. Where was it just becoming like a common thing to be all okay to talk about and not being this like extreme shame? I actually, I went into my school.

Would you believe? I went into my school a couple of weeks ago to talk to the year tens and I did, I talked about lots of stuff, but I did like 10 things I wish someone had said to us when we were in year 10. And number one was chill out. Number two was your body is amazing. And it was about like, you know, all this stuff about like, it doesn't matter what it looks like, look what it can do.

You know, it blinks without you telling it to, you know, all of this shit. Number three, your body is insane. Yeah. Like the quicker that you can learn to laugh about it and being like, Every person with each other you know has bled through their clothes onto a cushion. You know? And I told them like an embarrassing story about time it happened at a friend's house and we had to throw the cushion in the fridge.

And then her dad came in and we were like, don't get in the fridge. Like the quicker that you can like learn. Because I was like, I didn't laugh about having a period for like, until I was like 25. I was like, this is such a place of shame. Yeah. Anyway. Right.

Anyway, as we attempt to quietly chip away at that and make. everybody a bit more informed. What's your adult thing this week? Oh, so for ages, I've been like, I've felt the concept of a purse slash wallet just disintegrating before my eyes. I didn't need one, and suddenly it was like a burden for me

because of Apple pay and things like that. And so now it was like, it's just another, it felt like it's just another thing to lose, and all it had was loads of compartments that sadly I didn't use and like a credit card in it and that was it, and that was it. And it felt,

too chunky and it felt like from a bygone era. And I kept seeing people with things attached to the back of their phones. Oh, me. Yes, you. And to be honest, actually, like, loads of people. And then when I saw you had, I was like, right, if Tess has got it, well, if Tess has got one, I've got to get one. So I finally, my thing is I've just finally got one,

a little thing on the back of my phone that's got all my cards in. Brilliant. And now if my phone's lost, my, everything I have ever owned is gone. That's wonderful, Stevie. Mine is also iPhone-related. Oh, yeah. You'll, of course, listeners will remember I'm building a bit. And this is my adult thing.

I was so chuff with it, is my house is absolutely riddled with iPhone chargers from the market. I bought from the Apple store the correct iPhone charger. I'm so happy. With the lightning cable, with that stupid little USB thing,

that is thing. Then... We're talking a decade of me wanting you to do this. A decade. Then when I built the bed with the good bed leg, I built it in such a way that that plug is inaccessible and therefore I can't.

cannot take that plug out of the house. Oh, that's good. Yeah. Oh, great. Oh, no, you thought. I thought you couldn't get it in. No, no, no, the opposite way. I put it in on purpose.

Then I put the leg on. This is so good. Yeah, always there. Anyway, I'm so I'm feeling, I'm buzzing. Congratulations. Okay, may I ask first, how did you come to choose the coil? Thank you so much, Stevie. And it's a pleasure to be on your panel today.

Thank you. The panel of one, me and a coil. I'm a sailor who does know why I say about I booked him because I got confused. Hello. Okay, so my own own journey begins at university. Yes, late in the game, sure, when I eventually become sexually active. And off I pop down to the local university GP who puts me on microguynon. Oh, my God.

Yes, oh, boy. And a number of my listeners will be going. Oh, God. I know someone who loves it. Really? So also you might be as going as expected. Our Lord and Savior, microguine on. So about...

The contraceptive pill. The concept of my... It's green. And about three months in my... And I was like, oh, look at me. What a progressive woman. I'm on the pill. Oh, and now we're just having sex.

Unprotected. Well, about three months in, my housemate came home. This is when I'm in first year or second year of university. And found me just face down on the living room carpet like a starfish hysterical. Like I was just crying. I crawled under a table and cried so hot. I gagged. Yeah.

And she was like, what the fuck is going? on and I was like I honestly don't know and this is my amazing friend Sarah who was like so cool and on it and lived in London and like really knew her shit she knows the pill my god she used to party all night um come home have a shower and go to her 6 a.m shift where she was the manager of top shop have you heard anything cool in your life oh god okay right wow wow wow that woman is not on micro girl I know no fucking way and she was like what's going on so she sat beside me and I was I don't know it was so sad and I guess nothing's happening to happen even bad blah blah blah and she was like well what you know what's there must be something that's

changed in your life and then she was like oh my fucking god have you gone on the pill and I was like yes she's like not fucking microgyne on is it I was like yes she was like right and like frog march me back down to the doctors it's the cheapest one and they will always try it in case it works sometimes it does but nine times out of ten that it's not an actual statistic that is not a statistic it's an anecdotal statistic yeah we'll stick to it because most of the time they're like oh fine here you of course of course you're back for something more expensive So if microgonaut is working for you, fantastic, God bless, live your life. If however you're like, oh, wow, I too am under the table.

Is it microgynon? And it's a shame because it's the thing they put teenage girls on. It's like this and you're like, off you go now and best of luck with your life. Anyway, so back we went, we now, me and Sarah are invested in this. And then I went on something different. I'm sorry to say, I can't remember the name of it. And then I only last on a couple of months for that. on this one as well. I'm like, I still don't feel great. And then this advert,

this American advert, Kate, because I was coming out. Oh, that's your absolute kryptonite. Cryptonite. American people telling you to do things. Was it an American woman's voice and she was quite balsy? Absolutely. And she was baldsy talking to me and what was I watching, a very happy woman running through a meadow. Oh, that's what you wanted. And I wanted to be her so badly. And then she looked at the camera and she said, Yasmin. Like that. Great. Yasmine. I was on Yasmin for about 45,000. thousand years. Yeah.

So then I was like, I want Yasmin, please. Can I want to run through the magic? So I went back, got on Yasmin. I was like, oh great, feel much better,

everything mellowed out. Then, a little, I was on Yasmin for years. And then I came off it and had nothing and had no contraception whatsoever actively trying for a baby.

No, I just was using, I was with a partner, I was using condoms if I, when I was being liberal. Sure. Et cetera.

Anyway, and I felt so, unbelievably much better. I was off it for several years and I was like oh my god I ain't going on no birth control ever again. That's where I'm at now. I came off it a year ago and I'm like oh my god this is what it's like what was I doing? Yeah right. But yeah so I'm sort of where you were then. So now I'm like am I going for the coil. Yeah. Okay great. So now we're in this point you've been like I've been like I've seen what life is like away from the pills. Don't take that away from me again. Don't take that away from me again, mother. And but you're also like oh it does feel like I would.

like to be, make sure I'm safe and I would like to be, you know, and it's this like toss up between being like, ah, this feels very nice, but also the anxiety, if I do, when I do have sex. Yeah. Morning after pill every month. Yeah, it's that, you're like, oh my God, okay, I maybe there's some medium ground here. So I was like, okay, I went to explore some options at the sexual health clinic and the woman recommended the coil. And I was like, okay, and what is coil? Yes, here we go. And now we begin our journey. So, first, first, The first fascinating thing, why is it called the coil? Like, I really thought it was a coil.

It ain't no coil. It is more commonly known as an interuterine device or IUD. So she was like, there are two types of the coil. There is the copper interuterine device. There's the copper coil and there's the hormonal coil. And immediately I was like, no hormones. No way. No fucking way.

I've been starfishing on the carpet. I've been on that carpet. I ain't going back there. Don't take me back. literally what I felt like. Yeah, I am going back, bitch. And then she was like, hey, stop calling me a bitch. Stop calling me a bitch, please.

This is a workplace. And she rolled her eyes and she was like, listen, it was not as bad. And I was like, no, I'm not even hearing it. I'm not hearing a medical professional tell me it's not as bad as I think. I'm not hearing it. I don't want it. She was like, okay, let's get the copper coil. It's a plastic T shape.

So to describe your cervix, if you have one, it is, you've got your opening, classically called the vulva. The valve. The classic valve, that's the outdoor world. The door, if you will. It's the porch. The porch. And you pop up.

No, I'd say that's actually the door. And then you've got the porch, which is your, the actual vagina. Yeah, you're right. I'm thinking of a stoop. I'm so embarrassed. I would just say the stoop is the butt cheeks, you know? Wow. Okay, I'm absolutely like, that's your backyard.

Yeah, absolutely. You're right. I'm so confused. Where's the stoop? Anyway, it's not important. It's not important. It's up that. The channel.

the vaginal canal. Yeah. Then you've got, because you've gone like in the door, in your porch, then you've got the door to the house. Yes. Because,

you know, sometimes you can go to somebody's house and they've got like a little porch. A little porch, yes. But then you're like, this isn't very secure, but then the actual door to the house,

that's secure. And that's the issue because with the call and things like that, I think I thought for ages, it was just in your... In the porch? Yeah, in the vaginal canal bit. Which is where the penis

and the tampons live. And I was like, I guess it must be quite far up so you don't feel it. Exactly. And when I'd realised it obviously couldn't be as big as I thought it was because that wouldn't make sense. And then it was when someone was like, oh no, it's in

the living room. It's in the living room. I was like, how does it go in? How does it get in the living room? Yeah. Okay, so to describe your body to you, you go in the door, up the vaginal canal. So then you've got your cervix and the cervix is a very like small opening and that is a very secure, locked front door. Ain't no penis getting through that. No, thank you.

Feels like a dead end, but if you, it's like a diagonal alley, there's a little... Yeah, if you know where to press, you can go further. And then you're into the living room. And the living room is your womb, is your uterus. Then you're in there in that nice warm triangle space. Lovely. What a nice place to be.

The penis can never go in there. No. Never. And it mustn't. And that's where this little tea shape things, it lives. The bottom of the tea, it's got two very long, thin wires. Oh, yeah. Like a tampon.

Exactly. It's the ultimate tampon. So may I ask, so you've got the little strings. dangling out, I guess. They're so thin. They are like even thin than like an invisible fishing wire. They're like,

they're so thin. Fine. So I was going to set that bar as going to give me my question. What if it tickles the penis? Great question. And a genuine concern for people. People are like,

what if that tickles the penis? Yes. But it's that the ends are so fine. And so when it comes out, you just pull on those strings, the top of the tee up, like an umbrella going backwards, sort of,

yeah, an umbrella that's blown up. Yeah, that's blown up in the wind, like that. And now it's just one long, thin, thin, and up, out it comes. Yeah. So no problem. How it works, the copper one, is it's literally covered in copper. Okay. Oh, it's physically made of copper and it's constantly releasing more copper.

You know, it's not a machine, it's not doing anything, but it's like the copper is like constantly sort of coming off. The copper does absolutely no damage to you. It does nothing. But having it in there is making that area an inhospitable area. And so it's constant, every time the egg and the sperm come in, no, thank you. Everything's like, ah, we've got, we're dealing with this, which you absolutely cannot feel. Like that's not something. If you can feel it, something's gone awry. Like, you don't know it's there. It's not something you're aware of.

You certainly can't like press and feel it. Like, that is simply in there. It's very small and it just sits there. But it makes your womb be like, we can't be having an egg. Okay. I've got this T shape in here. Big question. Ready.

When you get it fitted. Yes. You're going to have to tell me what that's like. Okay. So the fitting process. I was like, they've explained this to me. I was like, great. Saddle up.

Let's bloody go. They were like, and then people had said to me like, this is bad. Yes. And it absolutely is bad. Right. It is bad for like... Is it bad for... Do some people...

Maybe some people are like, oh, it was actually great. But nobody will say this is actually great. Okay, cool, good to know. It will always be bad. So for some people then once it's bad, and then we truly are done. So it's really interesting.

Like, it's exactly like the smear test. It's like up on the thing, popping the legs. Up, we got the camera up. Off we go. Betty the chaperone has to come in. Love that. Two chaperones for me,

both holding my hands. Me very upset. And then it's a... our friend Becca described it as like somebody tickling inside your cheek and I was like what an insane description but it was like what weird thing to say but it isn't a pain you can really describe

and then when you feel it you are like huh yeah that is like somebody it's like because it's inside your body it's a place that you didn't really know you had like nerve endings or any you not felt anything there before so it's a very interesting feeling and it is just like a sharp little

a sharp something inside your cheek and you do think like oh god but most it's a sort of overblown pain because your body is like holy shit that shouldn't be there yes but then once it is once you're over that bit it is just supposed to you know yeah then it is fine then it is fine so that definitely was extremely bad if you're like oh my god that sounds like hell it's like yes it is but if you can just sort of the moment you've realized oh god it's then over yeah once you're over that the anxiety is so much worse and once you're over that like here we go and so that was it was it was for me and that is what a lot of a lot of people a lot of people however find the experience much worse than that and the aftermath much worse.

So like some people have absolutely terrible experiences in the aftermath. Like people have to, you know, take themselves to hospital. Like it's all, it can be, so it can be, I say this much, it can be like, oh, and we're done. And it can be like, this was actually very bad. Right. So go into that. Eyes open. Legs open.

Eyes open. Sure. And, you know, you could have any sort of reaction to it. Okay. So for me, very, you know, very, you know. very unpleasant having it in, but then I was like, okay, and we're off. And we're off and we're fine. But then they said, your periods might get heavier. She said, like, and it's like, like, way. And what she meant was like, get ready for like eight gallons of blood.

So, like, what she sort of hadn't described to me was that the copper makes it much, much heavier. So if you're somebody who, like, has heavy periods already, like, maybe, it might be, you might already be at capacity. And so you're like, fine, fuck it. We're all. We're already very heavy. But it does get extremely. The copper makes it, it changes a lot of things inside your body. And suddenly things get, like, it's much heavier. And it can be really bad.

And so I styled it out for three months. My parents were like unbelievably painful. And then unbelievably heavy. And then I fainted on the bus. And then I was like, okay. Do you have any pain to do with the coil at all? So it was what the coil was doing to you. what the coil was doing.

But again, some people have the physical reaction to the coil going in there, like all kinds of things. Because copper is the, what is the less common one, isn't it now? Now it is.

Because, so maybe if you are thinking about having it, maybe just want to go straight for the other one just in case. So I would say like, and again, we'll move to the other one. We'll reason.

So back I go, three, I saw this thing out for three months. I was like, this is untenable. Back I go to see the same lady. She was like, I told you,

you'd be back. But not enough as in to be like, why is putting it in people if it's, you know? Because I had insisted, you know, like I, and she was like, all I do is deal with people who are so afraid of the hormones that they say I don't want the hormonal one. They try the copper one out. It's so bad. They come back. And then they are like, fine, fuck it.

And that's actually the problem with that, I'm sorry, the source of the issues is microgynon being given to everybody. Exactly. You can trace it back to like, you don't care enough about people, like women. people's hormones to not realize that obviously this one nine times out of ten

makes everyone feel crazy like go straight to Yasmin it's the least I mean not everyone loves to Yasmin from various hormonal things that we're now like I don't ever want it and just a note on the fun bit on the fitting

that if you are considering it you can have this thing fitted immediately after birth you can have it and it starts working immediately and so if you are having any other kind of thing you can be like since we're here

could we? That's great. So if you are going for a smear test or a coposcopy or any of those sort of things, it's like, and now we're here, since I'm in this horrible experience, let's make it a bit more worse, and it's done. So you can have it immediately after birth. You can have it if you've suffered miscarriage or abortion or anything like that. If you're already in, you know, you can do it at any time and it doesn't affect anything

and it's, you know, so you can do it at any time. Just if you're like, maybe I have to, you know, wait a certain amount of time or whatever. So back I go. My lady's like, okay, let's try out the hormonal one. So the hormonal one is called Marina. It has something in it called progestin, which sounds a lot like progesterone that we've just been learning about in the hormone cycle. And so progesterone is the naturally occurring hormone in your body.

It comes out of your ovaries. And progestin is a synthetic lab-created hormone. And what it does is it mimics progesterone. And so it's in there on this exactly the same looking shape. Same thing. The upside-down umbrella, in it goes. The wires, it looks identical. But what's in there is now releasing this progestin, and it can last for, I think, five years.

Oh, wow. Okay. So it's in there for five years. You don't need to take it out. And what the progestin does is it mimics progesterone. So it constantly keeps you in this state of being like, well, we're not at our fertile state. And we're making it difficult for the sperm to get in. We're making it difficult for the egg to latch.

We're just making life difficult. And so it's thickening the mucus in the cervix. So it's saying, rather than being like, come on, lads. It's saying like, no, thank you very much. and it's thinning the lining in your uterus and suppressing ovulation. And so this thing, this thinning the lining is what makes the marina coil mean that you have periods that are so light that often you don't know they're happening.

Right. And that isn't just like, because sometimes like a light period could just be like, you just need to use the yellow tampon. But it's like they truly are so light. And I remember I got mine done many years ago. I bought a moon cup on the way home, very excited to use it. it is still in its packaging. Wow.

So I haven't, like, used anything for however many years I've had this thing. Great, okay. How is the removal of the copper coil? The coming out, absolutely fine. She said, just cough. And I went, and then you sort of your cervix sort of opens a bit up as you cough. And also you're so focused on doing a really good cough to impress her that you are. And then out it came and I didn't really notice.

The going in was a very similar experience by a bit. I was a bit more ready for it this time. And so it was less of a shock. And I knew to ask for my two ladies. I also knew to take an enormous amount of painkillers in advance, you know, in preparation. And something I've been told is that you can also get gas and air. So if you're like, please, this sounds horrendous, you can just say, I need to relax.

Please can I have anything you've got. But also as well, those things that are difficult with like options that are new to ask for, sometimes they will be like, no. Absolutely. So it depends on the description of the person. And you just really have like advocate for yourself in this situation and be like I would like the highest level of anaesthetic. I would like the gas and air. I would like everything and just be clear that you're like, I am ready.

I've listened to this podcast. I'm ready for the scratch inside my cheek. I'm ready for this be a very weird sensation. But I'm also very, very scared. And I really, really need anything you can give me. And then removal as well, like I think just like with going with it going in, because I've got friends who have. had it removed and said it was just awful. So it feels like it's good to not plan important things for the same day in case. Yeah. And not in the way that we do it with, sometimes with like cervical

smears and stuff, that is fine because the actual smear test is actually physically isn't going to hurt you afterwards and it's not going to make you feel, you know, it's the thought of it rather than what actually happens. That is a sort of tickling kind of feeling. But you don't know how you're going to react, I suppose, to it coming out. I think it's like, it's very like, well, come on, the women birth the babies and then get back to business, as Beyonce famously said. But I think it needs to be like, I'm having this fitted today and I will need an entire day off work. I need to be ideally collected, taken home, you know, cared for. If you're doing this because you are sleeping with somebody who makes sperm, the sperm maker needs to be collecting you.

You're doing the, you know, if you've done this because, so that you two, who together don't get pregnant, like, you know, you come on, show up. But like, get a friend to come and get you, get a parent to come and get you, like, get something to come and... Don't just go on the bus home. Don't just go on the bus home like I did, just like, crouched on the chair, because I was like, I was so, I was like, oh, la, like, this. But like, as soon as it, like, for me, once the, the sort of 24 hours was past, I was like,

I am fine. I felt very sorry for myself and went to bed, but then it was over. But again, people can have all kinds of reaction to it. I think it's that sort of like being ready and not being like, oh great, I'm off on holiday. I'm on my way to the airport. I'll get a coil bit, you know, that'll be perfect. Yeah. Just be like, this is something I need to take very seriously.

I should take all areas of your health and be like, okay, I need, I need some time. Yeah, and I didn't know that you had the coil. I don't think I know about what, I just presume everybody is on the pill or not. And so speaking to, I think when you go on, online there'll just be loads of horror stories. Of course. People are not going to write about it if there was nothing to report. Absolutely.

But you ask around your friendship group, I think, to be like, just to start off to be like, if you know, because then you might find people who just like love the coils. You might find people who had a terrible time, but then you can ask them what they did, how they, because, sorry, I'm not really making sense. No, you've made it. People that don't like it or struggle with the, not don't like it, struggle with the insertion and the taking it out. but then choose to keep having it that's the thing that really like fascinates me

because I'm not going to get it just purely because I just don't want the insertion and the taking out and I'm also as well kind of fine with what I'm doing at the moment but like so many people do have it again and again and again and get it changed and then and keep going so there's clearly something very nice about it. Well that's the thing because like the change if this happens every month they'd be like

absolutely not but it's every five years. Like that's a huge long time. And like that's absolutely, you know, that's a, that's a fine, you know, one, one bad afternoon in exchange for five years is in bad. And especially if like you're somebody who really struggles with their peers and their peers are extremely heavy. Like even if you're like, I'm not looking for this for contraception, just be like,

I'd like to be in control of this enormous amount of blood or whatever. Like maybe this is an option. And I would say like if you're like, I can't bear the idea of the insertion, like, it's not, it's like, yes, it absolutely is bad, but if it shouldn't, don't, if you are desperate for the thing, like, don't let that be, it's not so bad as to be something that I'm saying, don't do it. Yeah, also, if you're having a terrible time with your periods, it really, every single month, that is worth it, like, of course it's worth it.

And, yeah, it's just so, so few people talk about it. And the only time I've ever heard yet is when someone's gone, like, oh, God, I've had a terrible experience getting it, whatever, so I've been like, what? is everyone doing? But the fact that Indy said that like all the gynaecologists That was so interesting that they're all on Marina Which is to me a thing of being like, okay. Yeah, that's the best option.

If the people with the most expertise about this are doing this for themselves, like maybe this is an option. I'm in no way an advocate for it. I personally have found it fantastic and I truly apart from my one day with Betty all those years ago, I've been like, I don't have periods.

Like it's been marvellous for me. But I also have friends who have the copper one and swear by it and that's helped them and like, you know, people with all different kinds of experience. So you will have your own personal journey. I hope I've helped explain. Yes. You've started off now and go away and research and speak to people and just I think the bottom line is don't do anything that you don't know you're doing because like, like, I mean, sorry, like you don't know about. Like even with the pill, I only took the pill because I was like, well, that's the, that's not painful. Yeah. But then it's like, no, but it's emotionally painful. Yeah. for 10 years. Exactly. Oh my God. Exactly right. Like we're choosing this option.

Are you being like, I don't want five completely mentally fine and physically fine years in exchange for one afternoon of pain. Yeah. But I will take absolute emotional turmoil. A decade of emotional turmoil because there's no pain associated with that. But again, like it is also, how is that we got in a place where those are our two options? Well, that's the other thing. I get very angry.

I'm just like, well, fucking, like I don't want to have to make. that decision so I refuse. However, that decision practically, if you're sexually active, it's nice to... You know, there's like a completely pain-free, like, temporary vasectomy thing that you can do, and you can, like, do it in a lunchtime. And it's like, of course, of course they've managed to invent that for the gentleman. You're like, of course. And we're all here being like, okay, so it asks for the gas and air. Like, get yourself prepared as best you can. It's bad, but it's not worth, oh my fucking God, I'm furious. But is it what, you know, and it's like, you know, and it's like anyway, so it's such a, but I hope this like at least like opens the

conversation until science gets us to a place where we don't have to be having this conversation. I hope that this like starts the conversation for you all on your own personal journey with this. And then at least if you're like, I listen to this podcast today. What kind of thing are you on, you know, and get your friends sort of talking about it. Again, so it's not something we talk about enough except the people who are like, so sorry. So sorry, just tell you about my friend Sally, who had it done, fainted, woke up on, they, on the table, they had put it, sloped

it down for her so that the blood would go back to her head and then rolled her legs over. So she woke up a nude butt out. Legs over her head on the table. I do you think everybody has there like oh my God then this happened

and God I'm so sorry But in exchange for butt up on the table, you know, there is... Five years of not getting your butt up on a table. Unless you want to sexually. Exactly right. Or in other recreational, non-sexual ways. But like, yeah, so in exchange for your five years, butt up.

That was very helpful. And I speak for everybody when I say thank you very much, Tessa. Oh, you're so welcome. I'm so glad it was of some use. Thank you very much to the sailor. The silent sailor. He was like, sorry, when were we going to talk about boats? Okay, no, it wasn't.

And yeah, if you have any suggestions, any more things, you'd like to talk about us to talk about us to tackle. Nobody Panic Podcast at gmail.com or at Nobody Panic. Do you know our Patreon, please to support us and help us keep doing the podcast, which is patreon.com slash Nobody Panic. There's always some fun stuff as well. Yeah, there's around live things. Lovely bit.

The uneneted raw, live footage is on there. A lot of fun. Thank you so much. And I feel, I still don't know how I feel about the coil, but I do, personally, but I do now at least feel like I know what it is. It's like, like, I'm like, I'm going to form decision as to what I want to do, rather than being like, blah, I know what it is, no. Great. Goodbye, everybody. Bye. Bye.