Nobody Should Believe Me - PRETEND: The Gypsy Rose Obsession, Part 1

Episode Date: August 13, 2026

Gypsy Rose Blanchard is the most beloved convicted murderer in America. Half the country sees a victim. The other half thinks she conned everyone, including her mother. Javier spent months trying to figure out which side is telling the truth. Then he emailed Gypsy. A few hours later, they were on a call. *** Listen to PRETEND: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/pretend/id1245307962 View our sponsors: https://www.nobodyshouldbelieveme.com/sponsors/ Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show!   For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit: https://www.munchausensupport.com/ The American Professional Society on the Abuse of Children’s MBP Practice Guidelines: https://apsac.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Munchausen-by-Proxy-Clinical-and-Case-Management-Guidance-.pdf Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

True Story Media. Hello, it's Andrea. Are you ready for a rabbit hole? Because I've got a big one for you. A few months ago, I aired a two-part interview with Gypsy Rose Blanchard. We received a lot of nice feedback from this interview from listeners who found Gypsy thoughtful and insightful, as I did. But there were also some of you who were really uneasy about me having her on the show. And upon releasing these episodes, I found myself at the center of a swarm of people online who actively hate Gypsy.

and have spent a lot, and I mean a lot, of time and energy trying to discredit her story of being abused. I'm generally trying to be much less online these days, so while I expected this response, I was surprised at the volume of it, and by just how robust the ecosystem of Gypsy Haters is. We're talking entire YouTube channels and podcasts devoted to picking apart everything she says and does. And while a lot of this content is pretty ugly, it's also fascinating. I was intrigued to know exactly what was driving this, and which, if any, of the critiques coming from this community might be valid. But I'm working on so many other stories that I just did not have the bandwidth to get into it. So I called for backup and asked my friend Javier Lava if he might want to look into this strange online world for his excellent show pretend.

Javier, who's covered all manner of cons, cults, schemes, and scams on his show was definitely the right person for the job. So if you've ever wondered about all the controversy around the world's most talked about Munchausen by proxy survivor, stay tuned because Javier is digging in to all of it, and I mean all of it. We will definitely have Javier on for a chat as the series continues to talk about what he's found. So if you have any questions about the Gypsyverse, let us know at hello at nobody should believe me.com. If you want more from me, as always, you can subscribe on our Patreon or on Apple Podcasts where you'll get ad-free listening. access to the show's full archive, and our twice-monthly subscriber-exclusive show,

Nobody Should Believe Meant After Hours. This month, I'm over there talking about the Love Trap Podcast and the Unhinged Memoir Book Club, aka our group chat, with past guests, Chalice Howard and Michelle Roberts. Later this month, we're covering Maternal Instinct on Netflix, which has been a very requested topic. As always, rating and reviewing the show are also great ways to help if monetary support is not an option, as is just listening to the show each week. We appreciate you. we will be right back with episode one of the Gypsy Rose obsession from Javier Leva.

I actually have no idea where we're going with this. I don't either. That's why I was like I wanted to hop on a call with you because I'm like, what is this about? You really can't mistake that voice. Gypsy Rose Blanchard somehow became the most beloved convicted murderer in America. Half of the country loves her. The other half never forgave her. Maybe you've watched the HBO documentary Mommy Dead and Dearest.

Gypsy was in a wheelchair. She had leukemia, and she was having seizures, and she had to be tube fit. And then gradually that story fell apart. Things are not always as they appear. Or maybe you discovered her story from the Hulu series The Act. My best friend. All she wants to do is Kim me see. Jipsey!

Or you could have been to. her reality TV show on Lifetime. I don't want people to look at you like, this is Gypsy Rose. She's famous for killing her mother. I shouldn't be famous for something like that. Exactly. I hate that F word, famous.

Chances are you just kept seeing her face pop up on your for you page. Gosh. I went to prison for eight and a half years because I, my own mom. Oh my God. Or maybe you've been living under Iraq, and don't know who the heck I'm talking about.

So here's the short version. Gypsy Rose Blanchard spent 23 years in a wheelchair, hooked up to a feeding tube, breathing machine, had her teeth yanked out, put under for surgeries that she never needed, told she had cancer, muscular dystrophy, epilepsy, leukemia, you name it.

Turns out that was the cure because when police found her, she had walked out of the house on her own and all those health issues, poof, they were gone. I've been incarcerated for eight and a half years. I will be released on Thursday. In December of 2003,

Gypsy Rose Blanchard walked out of a Missouri prison after serving less than 10 years for the murder of her mother. And America lost its mind. People were curious, like genuinely curious. Her TikTok and social media accounts blew up, up millions of followers just within days of her release. So yeah, America's sweetheart is also a convicted murderer. And depending on who you ask, she's either the most sympathetic person alive

or the most dangerous woman on the internet. You know Gypsy Rose Blanchard, right? Yeah. Okay, it's all a lie. What do you mean what purpose will last? The fact that her mom did all that to her and like made her get these surgeries and like all of it. It was just a defense, but it's all a lie. How long do you guys think it'll take for everyone to turn on gypsy where I was blind shirt? Because you guys love her right now. Like, that's your sleight queen.

Have you guys seen all the backlash? She should have kept her locked up. No shit. Y'all were the ones that tried to make her famous for ending her mother's life. Someone else is going to do something horrible. and their excuse is going to be, well, she got away with it. We'll now look at all the money that she's making off of it.

The official story, the one that the media told us, is that Gypsy Rose Blanchard is a survivor, a victim of one of the most extreme cases of medical child abuse this country has ever seen. Gypsy says that she underwent approximately 30 different medical procedures forced upon her by her mother, D.D. Blanchard. Pick a disease. any disease, chances are that D.D. told a doctor the Gypsy had it. Rare diseases like

chronic conditions, terminal diagnosis. By the time Gypsy was eight years old, her mother had checked nearly every box on that list, and the doctors believed it. Because why wouldn't they? She showed up with a bald kid in a wheelchair who couldn't walk, couldn't eat, could barely function without her mother right there. And I've combed through Gypsy's medical records, which were posted publicly on a true crime content creator's Patreon page. Her mother, D.D., claimed that Gypsy had already been through four eye surgeries to correct across the eye that kept coming back. A feeding tube inserted directly into her stomach because D.D. said the gypsy couldn't swallow properly.

A procedure to remove her saliva glands in her neck because D.D. said that gypsy drooled too much. and a surgery where surgeons literally wrap part of your stomach around your esophagus to stop acid reflux. All of this on a little kid. The medication list and these same records run over a page. Anti-seizure drugs as she's been on since she was three months old. Volume for pain delivered through her feeding tube. Asthma inhalers, steroids, allergy medications. And then there's this one.

Someone documented in her allergy list that Gypsy, had an anaphylactic reaction to processed sugar. Anaphylactic reaction to process sugar, as in sugar, the thing that's in basically every food on earth, a life-threatening allergic reaction to sugar is not a real medical condition. It doesn't exist. But somehow, it made it into her medical chart because D.D. said so, and nobody questioned it.

And the teeth. By the time Gypsy was a teenager, her teeth had rotted out and had to be removed. A young girl wearing false teeth, riding around with a shaved head in a wheelchair, that's the official story. But an entire community online decided that that was a lie. They flipped the whole narrative around.

Suddenly, it was Gypsy who was the manipulator. Gypsy who fooled the doctors. Gypsy who used her voice, her looks, her tears to con everyone around her, including her mother. And let me tell you, this community is not small. They're very loud. I've spent the last few months trying to figure out which side was telling the truth. And spoiler alert, it's a lot more complicated than either side wants to admit.

You are listening to the Gypsy Rose Obsession. I'm Javier Leva, and this is a lot more complicated. pretend stories about real people pretending to be someone else we just got back from a lovely week of family vacation and while i am bummed it's over i am so happy to get back to my own bed and my own bedding which recently got a major upgrade with a new set of bowling branches signature organic cotton sheets i do not mess around with my sleep and these sheets are incredible it feels so good to crawl in there after a long day my husband who is a very hot sleeper also loves these sheets because they are extremely breathable and they get softer after every

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with code believe. That's bowl and branch, B-O-L-L-L-A-N-D-B-R-A-N-C-H.com slash believe code-believe to unlock 15% off. Exclusions apply. And remember that shopping are sponsors is a great way to support the show. Summer is the perfect time to change up your routine, or if you're the parent of school-aged children like I am, just throw it out the window entirely. Bedtime routine, morning routine, who needs them? Why not? Just embrace the chaos and refresh your makeup routine instead, with 100% vegan, cruelty-free makeup essentials from Thrive cosmetics. Okay, so you know I love this brand. I am a die-hard fan of their vegan tubing mascara, which comes in six shades and has over 40,000 five-star reviews. It makes your lashes

look extra long by wrapping around each lash from root to tip, and it comes off with just warm water, so no scrubbing and trashing your lashes. Another great product I'm reaching for this summer is Thrive's sheer strength hydrating lip tint, which I wear in muted rose, which is one of their most popular shades. This moisturizes your lips and gives them a pop of color without any stickiness. Another reason to Love Thrive, with over $150 million in product and cash donations to 600 plus giving partners, your purchase directly fuels real impact. And that's beauty with a purpose. We love it. So amplify your summer look with Thrive Cosmetics. Go to ThriveCosmetics.com slash nobody for an exclusive offer of 20% off your first order. That's Thrive Cosmetics, C-A-U-S-E-M-E-T-I-C-S dot com slash

nobody. And remember that shopping our sponsors is a great way to support the show. I was completely oblivious to the outcry against Gypsy Rose Blanchard. To me, I have always considered her a victim of Munchausen by proxy. That poor girl. I can't even imagine what her childhood was like. I mean, I didn't agree with her decision to murder her mother because no one deserves to be murdered, but I can't imagine why she resorted to violence. I just assumed everyone felt that way about her. A boy, was I wrong.

Hello, it's Andrew Dunlop, and today on Nobody Should Believe, me. We have a very special episode that is a full circle moment for me by conversation with Gypsy Rose Blanchard. Andrea Dunlop released a two-part interview with Gypsy on her podcast, Nobody Should Believe Me. If you've never listened to Nobody Should Believe Me, go check it out because Andrea has seven powerful series bringing Munchausen victims stories to light. I remember a lot of people asking me, are you going to interview her? Like, why hasn't she been on your show? Honestly, I couldn't believe that it took seven seasons for Andrea to interview Gypsy

because Gypsy Rose Blanchard put Munchausen by proxy on the map. I didn't even know Munchausen by proxy was a thing until I heard about Jipsy's case. Gypsy's case has brought a lot of awareness. I think that she is actually a very articulate representative of it and is very thoughtful in the way that she sort of explains it and explains her healing process and the after effects. When people think about medical child abuse, they think of Gypsy Rose Blanchard.

She's the poster child. This should not be on Gypsy's shoulder. She is a person. We should not put the onus on one person to be a representative or an advocate for a form of abuse just because they've experienced it. You know, I was curious about Andrea's interview with Gypsy, so I listened.

And then I started reading the comments and, oh boy, I cannot believe the backlash. Let me read some of these comments to you. Are you kidding me? You call yourself an advocate, but decide to bring a murderer on your podcast? I can't sit by as we make martyrs out of murderers. As a longtime listener, I'm extremely disappointed by the lack of real research on Gypsy Rose Blanchard. Andrea, all your credibility has done shot out the window. You just ruined your career by not doing your research.

She lied about everything. Hundreds of comments just like this. This was my first exposure to the anti-Gy community. So I started going down that rabbit hole. What research were these people talking about? What were Andrea and I missing from this conversation? And before I knew it, I found myself in the deep end. Every single thing you've ever heard out of their mouths about this is a lie.

Okay. all these years we've been told this story of just massive abuse, she didn't need any of the things that were done to her, she has no long-lasting effects, all of that, correct? Right. That's a lie. That's all a lie. Suddenly I started seeing some questionable things online and asking myself the same questions. Inconsistencies in her stories, home videos that nobody was supposed to see, a version of Gypsy Rose Blanchard that looked nothing like the girl that I thought I knew. It was enough for me to pump

the brakes. Did we all get the Gypsy story wrong? Was everything I knew about this case a lie? So I had to go straight to the source, Gypsy Rose Blanchard. Gypsy and I exchanged a few emails, and within a few hours, I'm not kidding, we were on a call. I was unprepared for this conversation, and it took place very early on in my research. I have to be honest, I thought she was lovely. All I know about you is the HBO doc, right? And so I was like, I had no idea that there was just like other world. Oh, it's insane. Like you're living in it, but I had no idea, you know?

Oh, it's insane. It's called the Jipverse. Oh, like the verse, like the Marvel verse. Yeah, like me, yes, like the Marvelverse. So it's, it's two communities and one is pro gypsy and one is anti-gypsy. Which one's louder? I mean, I would say that the anti-Gypsy side is probably the loudest. And I think that goes for any sort of hater community.

So a lot of times if someone posts a video in support or just having a neutral opinion, you can't even have a neutral opinion about me because you will get death threats. You're walking into the crosshairs, right? Yes. you're walking into literally a war zone between these two communities. And without even knowing it, right? Without even knowing it. Because like if you're a pro, if you're in the pro gypsyverse, you're, you know,

you're sympathetic to like the abuse that you face and all that stuff. And like, it would never even cross your mind that there's this other universe that will just pounce on you. Right. The internet did what the internet does. Her nose was too big. Gypsy Rose has been spotted for the first time since her nose job. And it turns out she didn't just get a nose job.

And her teeth, the same teeth that her mother had yanked out when she was a kid, became content, too. I'm going to Children's Mercy Hospital to see my dentist for my teeth. She can't even post pictures with her in a swimsuit without getting comments. Gypsy Rose is up early around 6.30 a.m. this morning posting herself in a two-piece bikini. Content creators mocked her voice. Hey, babe, can you do your gypsy rose compression for me? The D is... ...to get the frog to meet the prince.

I'm on a high right now. You can't bring me down. Right now he's eating a brownie and later he will be... In fact, people impersonating her became a trend on TikTok. Can't bring... I just I was wearing a wig in a lot of my videos because last year and the year before that, like, I bleached my hair so much because I was so excited to try new things with my hair that I didn't, you know, realize that bleaching and bleaching and bleaching was going to fry it

as bad as it was. So unfortunately, you know, my hair was down to almost my butt when I got out of prison and I had to shave it all off. And, you know, the anti-side, was like, well, wouldn't that be a trigger for you? And the logical side of me is, of course, wanting to defend myself and being like, do you want to walk around with fried hair? It's kind of a necessity. So I used a wig for a couple of months. And I'm just starting to kind of like be okay with this being my authentic self.

For those of you listening on the podcast feed, Gypsy is sporting a pixie cut. more mature, you know? Yeah. How old are you now? I know you're not supposed to ask a woman. Okay. I'm getting old. You're not supposed to ask a woman that, but I was curious.

A lot has changed since being released from prison two years ago. She's been married. Then she got divorced. And now she's a mother. She has this whole new life. And her only career really is being Gypsy Rose. One of the main criticisms against her is that she figured, out a way to monetize and profit off of her mother's murder.

She has a cameo account, a book deal, multiple TV shows. Gypsy is everywhere. And if you ask the Internet, they will tell you that Gypsy is rich. It's so much easier to just hide and make it go away. You know what I mean? Do you ever think about that? I've tried. I've tried getting offline, deleting my social media.

when I first came out of prison, I gained millions of followers on my TikTok and Instagram. Well, in the process of me, you know, going through my parole time, there was just so much harassment on my parole officer that he said, you know, it would probably be best to, you know, maybe get off of social media. So I deleted my Instagram with like 9 million followers. So I made a new Instagram, quickly gained a lot of followers on that. approaching one million now, and I still maintain my 9.3 mil on TikTok. And I've had a love-hate relationship with this account.

I've deactivated and reactivated. At this point, my followers just know it's part of my behavior. But when at a time where I was not on social media for like a month. It turns out that deleting your account doesn't really make you anonymous when your face has been on every screen in America. You have a very distinctive voice. Do you ever get, like, spotted? Or, like, how do you deal with that?

Oh, yeah. I mean, thankfully, nobody in person has ever came up to me or my family and been mean in any type of way. In fact, it's the opposite reaction. It's like, oh, my God, there's such a selfie. And what's crazy is, and I don't understand it. But a lot of my fans are, you know, 95% is women. Five percent are male. And that's even from analytics from my socials.

But, like, teens, some as even young as 10 will stop me at the mall or the grocery store. And I'm kind of like, are you old enough to? What is your parents telling you watch? But isn't that kind of weird, though, like, that you have? Like, just the fact that you have fans. Isn't that kind of weird? What are they a fan of? I'm just saying, like, you're not a performer.

You know what I mean? Like, you're not a singer. Exactly. And I thought that to myself, too. I mean, I've always kind of just been appreciative that they've been nice, but even I don't really understand it. Because, yes, I can understand, you know, watching my story and feeling, you know, a compassion, but a fandom, I don't get.

And maybe it's a social media thing. Oh, my goodness, this girl has, you know, almost 10 million followers. I don't know. I don't, I don't. I think the answer is a lot simpler. It's just this parasycial relationship, right? You don't know them, but they know you.

And maybe they are sympathetic to your story. And so it's like you're famous. You know what I mean? Like, and so they... Infamous, I guess. Because I never call myself famous. I don't call myself a celebrity. I call myself, like, well-known.

If I'm addressing it, I'll say I am well-known in the public eye. Because that's the facts of it. You know, you get the recognition, you get media coverage, you have the following. What is that? You know what I'm saying? You're well-known in the public. And with that comes a lot of responsibility. and burdens too.

After the break, anti-Gypsy protesters take to the streets of New Orleans and blast gypsy and her child. That's after the break. Summer is going by so fast, but not too fast for a wardrobe refresh. And I have two fun quince, out in the wild stories for you. I was emailing with a doctor friend who's been on the show, and while we were not primarily discussing fashion, he told me that he was looking for some linen pants for his upcoming travel

and did I sincerely recommend the brand Quince that I was always talking about on the show? And I told him, yes, I do, Dr. Booze. I love Quince. I love their linen pants in particular. My producer Mariah loves their linen pants. Quince linen for everyone. Also, I have talked about how much I love Quince's Italian leather handbags. And I saw one of my neighbors wearing the quince sling bag in Cognac out at our town's Fourth of July parade and it looked so chic and cool that I went and bought one for myself. Seriously, so many people I know love this brand. a good reason. Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. They work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middleman so that you're paying for quality, not brand

markup. And they have so much to choose from. So whether you're looking for last minute summer essentials like swimmer or sunglasses, or if you're already looking at fall with their cashmere sweaters and outerwear, accessories, home goods, they've got you. So upgrade your every day. Go to quince.com slash believe for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash believe for free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash believe. And remember that shopping our sponsors is a great way to support the show. Summer is the perfect time to change up your routine. Or if you're the parent of school-aged children like I am, just throw it out the window entirely. Bedtime routine, morning routine, who needs them?

Why not just embrace the chaos and refresh your makeup routine instead with 100% vegan cruelty-free makeup essentials from Thrive Cosmetics. Okay, so you know I love this brand. I am a die-hard fan of their vegan tubing mascara, which comes in six shades and has over 40,000 five-star reviews. It makes your lashes look extra long by wrapping around each lash from root to tip, and it comes off with just warm water, so no scrubbing and trashing your lashes. Another great product I'm reaching for this summer is Thrive's sheer strength hydrating lip tint, which I wear in muted rose, which is one of their most popular shades. This moisturizes your lips and gives them a pop of color without any stickiness.

Another reason to love Thrive, with over $150 million in product and cash donations to 600-plus giving partners, your purchase directly fuels real impact. And that's beauty with the purpose. We love it. So amplify your summer look with Thrive Cosmetics. Go to ThriveCosmetics.com slash nobody for an exclusive offer of 20% off your first order. That's Thrive Cosmetics, C-A-U-S-E-M-E-T-I-I-E-E-T-I. And I-c-c-S.com slash nobody.

And remember that shopping our sponsors is a great way to support the show. The anti-jipsy side correlized a hate campaign against me and was raising money, fundraisers go-fund me, to put up billboard signs in my neighborhood, in the city that I live. Here's a clip of an anti-jipsy activist putting up wanted style posters around town. If you dislike shmurterers, send Tammy a gift. If you are here for some street justice, since the criminal justice system failed us, send Tammy some gifts. And even after I got off a parole, the day that I got off of parole, I wanted to celebrate with some friends of mine. So we were like, we're going to go to New Orleans. We're going to have a drink. We're going to have a good time.

So the anti side was busy for two days straight, putting up flyers at all the bars, a murderers in town warning. This is pathetic. Gipsey don't give a fuck. Now what? Oh, y'all waste of your job money. Because I had a great time in New Orleans. Anyway.

And then me and my friends are driving. We come across a mobile bill ward. And they have a picture. of me and my daughter and my partner from when my daughter was born. And I flipped out. Do we hear in a mobile billboards? They put minors on billboards. Binhard child.

Hindsight, I should not have even looked at it. I should have just let it be. But instead, I got out of the car, and I went on live stream, and I was flipping the haters off and just reacting to it. I'm like, this is my minor. child. Like my minor child should not be up on a billboard, especially when I'm not plastering her on social media. Gypsy Rose's baby's face has now been revealed. And I probably really shouldn't

because it's a baby, but everybody's going to see it anyway because it's out there. So here's the picture. Well, it feels like crossing the line, right? Like it's one thing, it's one thing to have issues with you and you've chosen to be public and whatever, blah, blah, blah, but but to like bring the kid, I just feel Like, yeah, now you're crossing a line. Gypsy told me that she doesn't have a safe space, not even her home. Every single residence, since I've been out of prison, has been doxed on the internet. There's currently a video of my house where somebody drove by my house and recorded it. And it's like, this is where they live.

I'm an average person. I'll go to Walmart. I'll go to the grocery store. Get what I need. Drive back home and not think two things about it. Obviously, someone must have followed me to know the street. Right. That's so scary.

These people are obsessed with her. And not in a good way. Her critics say that Gypsy didn't serve enough time. That she got away with murder while the man who actually did the stabbing Nick Godaghan is sitting in a Missouri prison serving life without parole. His appeals so far have been unsuccessful. Barring some kind of miracle, Nick will die and will die. prison, and Gypsy is out there living her life. To a lot of people, that math does not add up. I have to say, I'm fascinated by Gypsy Rose Blanchard. She is one of the most complicated people

I've ever reported on, but I'm not interested in doing another story about a fandom gone wrong. What caught my attention was the evidence, the videos, text messages, documents that have surfaced since the HBO documentary. Things that paint a very different picture, of Gypsy Rose Blanchard. It is your sexy slave demon. I can steal, I can torture, I could kill, just not those people. Gypsy Rose talking about how she plans to S.A. her own daughter when she turns 13. If we have a girl, the way it has to be is if we have a girl, she has to lose her virginity to you

because you are the master of the household. Now, before you go Spiral, let me give you some context. These clips were recorded years ago before Gypsy ever had a daughter. What you're hearing is a role-play game that Gypsy and Nick Gotajan played online. In this game, Gypsy played a character named Demona, a vampire slave, and Nick played her master. And in that fictional world, they said some very dark things, violent things, sexual things, that ripped out of context and posted on TikTok sound like a confession. In context, they raise

a whole different set of questions about the dynamics between Gypsy and Nick. And who's really in control of that relationship? That's the conversation we are going to have in detail, not just in this episode. But one thing's for sure. I can't do this series without Gypsy. She's talked about her story plenty, but as far as I know, she has never publicly addressed. the Demona videos, the home videos, the text messages, none of it, at least not in front of a reporter, until now. Once I started doing research, because I haven't even started, like, once I dive into the hellish waters of your haters, like, how comfortable are you with uncomfortable questions and stuff like that? I'm pretty open. Everybody has always known that I'm a pretty open book. Remember, you're listening to my pre-eastern.

interview with Gypsy. It's just a get-to-know-you session to see if she was even interested. So if we were to do this, because like you said, I think maybe the story is that the people that know you, like in the Gypsyverse, they know about this. And then obviously the haters know about you as well, if not more, because they just, they won't let it go, right? Like, this has been years and years and years. And it seems like every time you make some sort of public opinion or video or appearance, they jump on it. But like the outside world has no idea. So like I really do think that that's the story.

Your whole childhood was robbed from you. And then now all of a sudden you're an adult and you have to figure out who is Gypsy Rose Blanchard. You know what I mean? And do you know who you are at this point? I'm learning. I'm learning a lot as with every new experience because I think that that's how we grow. It's just like experiencing things.

So I think that I've gotten. to where I'm comfortable. Yeah, but I mean, going back to like the uncomfortable questions and stuff like that. Yeah, I mean, I don't think that there's anything that I could find that you haven't seen already. Exactly, exactly. Yeah. I've had some tough ones come at me. That's what I figured.

That's what I figured. But I was thinking if you're up for it, I'm willing to like travel down there for a weekend and maybe like hang out for like a day and and do the interview in person. Would you be game for that? I'd be down for that. Next time I'm pretend, I fly to Louisiana to meet Gypsy Rose Blanchard in person. I sat with her for almost three hours and she answered every single question I threw at her. This is going to be a long one, guys. I don't know how many episodes yet, but get ready because I conducted dozens of interviews.

And we are also going to cover a recent discovery about Gypsy's health that puts everything in question. That's next time on pretend. Before we go, I want to update you on some recent developments. There's been a major development on this case. One of Chipsy's critics filed the public records request with the Missouri Department of Corrections and got a hold of eight years' worth of prison calls. And I'm going to play one of them for you right now. This is a prison call strategizing on how to make the biggest splash with her murder case.

Television appearances that they're going to throw. the HBO documentary off the table. So, you know, that comes out first. Right. Right, definitely. Yeah. And right now, that HBO one's a big one. Yeah, and there's an article that had came out on buzzfeed.com.

And it, like, tells my whole life story from beginning, you know, until now. It's a million people. Oh, yeah? Yeah. That's still a lot of people. Freaking me out. When you said that I was famous, I didn't think that I really was. But now I'm reconsidering that.

Yeah. Wow. I mean, I don't know what to say. Yeah. Like, you're going to be famous, right? I know. And then the lady that did the article said that there's been movie people that approached her and people for like books and stuff wanting to do my story so I can get royalty

from there I can get money from a book and a movie with actors it's not a documentary so I'm like whenever I get out I'm gonna be rich I'm gonna be driving a Mercedes Ben and I'm gonna have my own home they're slowly releasing one call at a time it's a daily trickle and some of these calls are explosive. Most of them are gossipy, but some of them give you this unfiltered view into Gypsy's mind and how she talks about the case when a reporter's not looking. Now, I've written the Missouri Department of Corrections asking them about the legalities of releasing such calls. After all, I've tried to obtain prison calls in the past for this show, and while these calls aren't meant to be private, they're not generally available for public record unless they're part of a court case.

These calls were recorded largely after Gypsy's plea deal. So here's what I'm going to do. Because these prison calls were released after my first three episodes were finished, I will include relevant snippets of these calls at the end of the first three episodes. And I will weave some of these calls in throughout episode four and beyond. But here's what I'm not going to do. I'm not going to play anything embarrassing for the sake of embarrassing Gypsy. Some of these calls include sexual content that was not meant to be shared.

And I know, I know, they knew that these calls were being recorded. So how could they be so stupid? I don't get it either. But as a journalist, I have to respect the privacy of individuals on the other end of the call. Some of what they're saying is personal, and these people are not public figures. And I would caution any other content creator to do the same. This story just got a whole lot trickier to produce. Let's roll the credits.

Hi, I'm Allie and a pretend Patreon supporter. Today's episode was written and produced by Javier Leva. It was edited by Puneith Shanoi with the podcast pundits and theme music by Joe Basile with the chicken.net. If you want to listen to the first three episodes right now, check it out on Patreon or Pretent Plus on Apple Podcast. You'll be able to listen to the episodes early and ad-free, and you'll get access to bonus episodes with full-length, lightly edited interviews.

And you're supporting local independent journalism. That's it for now. I want to hear what you guys think in the comments. So if you're on Spotify or YouTube, leave a comment at PretendPod is my handle. I want to know what you think. That's it for now. Take care.