Noob School - Episode 62: The Power of Kindness with Nilly Barr

Episode Date: April 24, 2023

On this episode of Noob School, John sits down with professional councilor Nilly Barr to talk about the benefits of therapy, not only applying to everyday life, but to your sales career as well. Nilly gives some great advice, from communication, to not letting your "head trash" get in your way, and things even lead to a live therapy session with John. If you'd like to find out more about Nilly and her services, click the link here: https://www.associatesatparkavenue.net/n-illy-bar-rms-lpc-parenting-coach I'm going to be sharing my secrets on all my social channels, but if you want them all at your fingertips, start with my book, Sales for Noobs: https://amzn.to/3tiaxsL Subscribe to our newsletter today: https://bit.ly/3Ned5kL

All right, well, welcome back to Noob School. Today I've got Neely Barr. Neely's a good friend of mine, and she's a professional life coach and therapist. And I thought I would bring Neely in today. I know her quite well as someone just to introduce the Noob Schoolers to the idea of having a life coach or a therapist in their life to help them solve some problems that will help them really have a business. better life and actually be better in your job, which is kind of what we're trying to do at Noob School. So, so welcome aboard, Nile. Thank you, John. Appreciate it. It's good to be here. Yeah. So when I first heard about you, it was, gosh, maybe three or four years ago. And, you know,

like I recommended people, I was hanging out with really good folks, you know, some folks that are really successful, have built real nice lives and nice businesses and got together with this this fellow and said, what's the best thing you did to improve yourself last year? And he thought for a second, and he said, I'm working with Nilly as a life coach to help me, you know, build a better life. And my first thought was, you know, hold on, you know, this sounds like a therapist to me, you know. And my idea, in my 50s, of course, this was a couple years ago, was, you know, you know,

You know, that's laying on a couch and, you know, crying about something that happened when you're eight years old or, you know, things that just in my brain that aren't necessarily true. Or maybe a sign of weakness. Or maybe what I saw on the Bob Newhart show, you know, as a kid. And only because he told me about it, did I say, okay, I'll try it. And it's been one of the best things I've ever done. Cool. So thank you for being here with us today. And I'd love for you to start by just describing just in general what are the services you provide as a life coach and therapist to folks.

Okay. Let's see. Where to start? So my particular practice is all adults, so I don't work with kids. Okay. You have to be more patient than I am to work with kids. So with adults, it can be individual, it can be couples, it can be any relationship dynamics that people have. We're trying to figure out how to make the connections more meaningful, more skillful, and more effective.

Okay. Yeah. So in terms of what the topics are, it really is a wide range. It's what life holds. It's what all of our lives. include, which is sometimes it is about goals we have, sometimes it is about conflicts we have, sometimes it is about, I mean, there is certainly the level

of trauma, past history work, but a lot of the level that we're gonna be talking about is about noticing when something is not quite what we want it to be, quite as optimal as it can be, how do we get there? Where are we? How did we get here? And more importantly, how are we going to get there?

Right. Yeah, so really that gap between where we are and where we'd like to be in just about any situation. Yeah. And that's a far cry from, you know, I mean, certainly like you said, there are some things about things that might have happened in the past. But most of what I've seen is like, here's where we are, here's the situation, how can we fix it? what do you know based on your body of work and your studies that's happened like to other people that I could learn from, right? Yeah.

So you've helped with things like I've had troubling customers before that you've advised on how we might resolve a situation or a partner, you know, any of those things that I think without someone smart that knows what they're doing in between those. those two entities might just, you know, just fight. I think they're both right. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so often we get stuck in the who's right and who's wrong. Right. We get stuck in the blame game of, you know, whose fault it is. Right.

In my house, it's an ongoing joke when something happens, we go as long as we know whose fault it is. As if that gets us anywhere, you know. Right, right, right, right. Yeah, so we do, we get stuck in that right, wrong mentality. And really, that's about protecting ourselves. Because it feels bad to have made a mistake. It feels bad to have missed the mark. Okay.

That's going to be included in our lives, right? There's no way to not do that. So when we put our heads together, it becomes more about understanding it rather than putting the labels of bad good, right, wrong. Understanding the elements. And then we can figure out how do we work these elements in a slightly or majorly different way that is congruent with our goal,

what we're trying to get to. Right. Yeah. And it does. You're absolutely right. It's really, we don't have to remit the wheel. Right. These are things that have been studied for a long time.

Right. What I bring to the table is certainly my own experience, but it's not just my experience. It is all that... Somebody asked me the other day what model I use. And I thought about, I thought, I do whatever is going to work. Because I have 30-some years of data in my head. And I can't tell you, like I'm mainly. I'd be able to spell out the data where I got it and what it was.

Right. But it's all available, these massive files in here. So when you and I are talking about something, I'm searching, which file might be useful, which file might be applicable, which one might be helpful. And there are all the stories of the ways that we tried it with different people, different situations, and all that I learned. and I just bring that to you. So together we can learn.

Right. Yeah. Well, I think it follows right along with general advice. I give people about all parts of their life. Like if you want to get a really good shape, you'd hire a personal trainer that knows what they're doing. This is kind of life management. And same for sales.

That's how I make my living is going into businesses that need help with sales. Same thing. I've got the 30 years of sales. experience to say, oh, we're going to, let's try this, let's try this. So I think it's, part of the reason we're doing this is to show the noob schoolers there's another resource that will help them manage their life because I've seen otherwise very good business talent not do as well as they could because their life was messed up, you know, and this is a place you have to have your life, you know, fairly well taken care of to be long-term successful.

So, well, let's back up for a second before we get any more details. I assume you studied psychology or... Yeah, it's a matter of fact, the other day I wrote an email to the professor who helped me find my way because I had... My dad had always been very clear. My mom, too, both had been very clear, you know, you got to stand on your own feet. You're not going to grow up to be dependent on, you know, some guy. So I was clear that I was going to be independent, but I couldn't figure out how because all I wanted to do was help people. I knew that way early on.

So at UT I was taking broadcasting, I test taking computer science, trying all those, you know, what I thought were practical things. And none were clicking. So I finally went to philosophy, professor. a friend of my sisters, who said, okay, I know who you need to talk to. So he sent me over to someone else. And I just wrote that person an email the other day thanking him because I was lost. And he listened to me and he said, here's what we're going to do. Signed a paper, gave it to me, and that cleared my way. He pointed in the direction that I needed to go in. And I think that that has really registered with me about.

what you were talking about earlier, standing with people who help you find your way, standing with people who know themselves, who are respectful, who are wise, that makes a difference in where we end up. You know, had he not guided me, I don't know. I mean, it's not like I was in trouble or anything, but I didn't know where I was going. And he was the arrow I needed. So he basically put me in human services, and then from there went on to grad school. Okay.

Yeah. Interesting. So you found, you were trying things, and you finally found this person, this guiding light to help you get to your right spot. Yeah. And, you know, it's interesting. I hear that story a lot where it doesn't work out that way, where someone met someone, and they said, you know, my dad's hiring and pretty soon using that business and 20 years later they're like, I don't know how I got here.

I don't really like this. You know, so I think it's so important when people are starting out is to take the time, you know, take the time to figure it out. And you did that. You were looking around a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And so from grad school, it was grad school at Tennessee also? And from there, was it right to Greenville or were any? Yeah, from there to Greenville. That's where I met Terry and we became friends and then we got married and he got his job angry in PC. So that's what brought us to South Carolina. That's great. We're glad you're here. Thank you.

Well, let's talk more, if you would, about some of the areas that you see. Like, for example, some of the areas to help, let's say, I work mostly with salespeople that are, let's say over 20, 20 to 30, 30 to 40. The type of things you've helped those folks with before, and I'll give you one example, is you've helped me deal with some 23 and 24-year-olds where it was like I wasn't speaking in the right language or seeing things with their eyes well enough.

Have you had much experience with that kind of thing? Say your question again. I'm not sure. Well, just the way, let's just say, a more senior business person like myself, older, dealing with the newer generation, you know, talking to each other and how that works.

Well, what I see happening with that is, certainly language is an element in that, but what I see more is that folks get too busy talking and not listening. And I think that's where a lot of the people, the pieces that fall and the cross-communication that happens is because whether it's the younger folks or the wiser folks or the older folks, not really listening and not really paying attention to what the other person is saying.

So for when we think about examples that we were just talking about where someone was guided well or someone who was not guided well, I would bet you that that's the key. if the person doing the guiding was really listening to what the young person was asking for, or what they were envisioning for themselves, or what they know about themselves, I think that listening is really key in so many ways. Whether it is trying to reach a business contract that you're negotiating, whether it is about conflict with an employee or, or couples relationship, whatever it is, if we don't get that part down and we don't truly

listen to what the person is saying to us, we're just, you know, Mars and Venus, we're not really. I'm talking, she's talking, you know, yeah, yeah. I totally agree. That's interesting. So, I mean, I'm still learning how to do that. You would think that I would know by now. It's so hard, particularly when you know what the answer is already. And of course I'm right. You know what your answer is. I'm right again. Right.

Yeah. It's a, you know, when we coach salespeople about moving through the sales process, you know, of course, we get excited and we want to go to the end and say, here's the proposal. Well, you know, will you sign it? And I see time and time again that the patient salesperson who just will not move. move on to the proposal where they say, I don't quite understand yet. Why are we doing this? How is it going to help you? Why, you know, and they really, they, you know, like, to use like a rom-com example, you know, he gets me. You know, if you get to that point where the person actually, I get them. He gets me.

I think that's when you win. That's what you're talking about. Oh, absolutely, absolutely. I imagine, like, if a salesperson meeting me as a, customer and they start with trying to understand what my needs are, what my wants are. Why even I have those needs and wants, that would just empower them so much. I mean, that would be the best sale and an ongoing sale because there's now a relationship. I don't just have this fixed pat thing. Just thing. Okay, I'm just going to stick it to you.

That's not the point. The point is to see, what is it? that this person is really seeking, what is it they're needing, what is it they're wanting. And if, I guess, honesty comes in here, you know, honestly, I have something that matches that need, well, isn't that awesome? Isn't that the way to do it? Right. Yeah. Right. I agree. I totally agree. It's hard to do. So we get in a hurry. Yeah. And we want to force an answer. Yeah. Like, that's an old sales manager. interesting is I'm making a call on Neely this afternoon to sell her something. Did you sell her?

Yeah. You know, like, well, you know, it wasn't there. She didn't need it. Go back there and overcome that objection. Yeah. You know, that's just old-fashioned, doesn't work anymore sales. Yeah. Do you remember a good salesperson that sold you something?

Well, I mean, I don't remember many. I mean, I don't remember many. I'm sure they have been. I just can't think I'm in right now. I don't remember many. Yeah, I remember, I've told the story before, the guy who used to be in charge of the Hyatt in Greenville, Tom Voss. He was the new manager. They called me and said, you know, come meet Tom because we did a lot of business with him. So I sit down for lunch, and I immediately start saying, well, listen, we did 300 rooms like, and he goes, hey, hey, hey, let's don't worry about that.

He goes, let's just get to know each other. Yeah. We'll worry about the rooms later. And at that moment, we had a great relationship. It was over. I knew we were, so for 10 years, we had trust and all he had to do is just be patient. That makes sense. Yeah.

Because there's a, he taught you to build a relationship first. Yeah. Yeah. You build relationship. You build trust. Yeah. And he also found out that what I really needed wasn't rooms. what I needed was as I brought people to Greenville

to get them so happy to come here and get some special treatment from the Hyatt and a special place for their car and just we could give them that they would become bigger customers of mine. Yes, yes. I could get the rooms anywhere. But he took care of our special customers

and it helped our business. That's what I really needed. It wasn't even about the room rates. It wasn't like, the previous guy was, I was like talking about room rates and what did I care? Yeah. 165, 155. Yeah, right.

Doesn't matter. But he figured it out. And he went on after he left the Hyatt to run the whole West Coast of Hyatt's. Yeah. And then he went on to run some other specialty things, but it doesn't surprise me. That makes sense. Yeah. Because his vision was about the relationships.

Yeah. Not about the rooms. Right. And what did I need? Yeah. What did I really need? He got me. Yeah.

He got me. Yeah. He got me. Yeah. Well, that's cool. Well, let's talk about some other things that young salespeople or just young people in general have to deal with in life that a life coach like yourself could help them with. What are some of the top issues they're going through? I'll give you some.

Get married, having children, becoming a dad, you know, older parents, you know, those kinds of things. I think that the umbrella of those issues that come up has to do with balance. Young people can get caught in one side of the whole puzzle, and they can lose sight of the others. So, for example, a young salesperson who is trying to be successful. successful as a salesperson, they're trying to be a provider for their family and be, you know, successful. They can lose sight of the fact that showing up at the family dinner is part of their success. So they think that if the phone has to be constantly on them and they have to be constantly checking it, checking it, you know. So they lose sight that there's an important balance in life that when they have that, it will help them succeed with everything.

Right. Because we can't hyper focus on one part of our lives and expect to succeed. Right. Something will pay the price for that. Right, right. So unless we are paying attention to where our time and our energy is going, awareness around all of that. So awareness and balance are the two that keep coming to my mind as I'm talking about this.

I think about some of my, I call it head trash or things that I thought were true that aren't. When I was that age, was that you had to just constantly work. It almost as a right of passage, like not be around the house too much. you know, look at the phone all the time and not even exercise that much. The health is not as important, we've got to make these numbers, you know. And, you know, we did okay, but I wouldn't do it that way again. I mean, I think it would be much better to be more balanced and more kind of understanding. And what I wrote down here was the big picture.

You know, I think as I've gotten older, I see more of the big picture of the whole thing versus just one piece of it. And I would have liked to have had a life coach resource to help me with that in my 20s. Yeah. It's hard, though. It's hard to be young in this culture. Right. That is such a driven culture. Like you're supposed to, like even being driven in your way is a sign of success.

Right. I mean, there's a cost to that. Right. There's a lot of cost to that. Right. So it is hard. I see so many people who are, you know, either they're trying to build their own business or they're, you know, on a high potential track in their companies that they're working for.

And they are just on all the time. And it's not that they're not noticing the cost, whether it's in their marriage, whether it's with their relationship with their kids, whether it's in the relationship with their own families or sleep. It's a big one. Or alcohol or other substances that they're taking just to be able to keep going.

Because we can't. We're not designed to constantly go. We're designed night and day. We're designed to rest and be active. There's a balance of that. So it is hard. I just really have a lot of compassion for the young people who are trying to find their way.

And it does help to have someone who says, you know what, this is not sustainable. Here's another model. Here's another way. And the other piece with that, what I try to keep in mind is I can't expect, even when someone says to me, Neely, my life is out of balance, you know, help me figure it out, help me reset it. Even when they're coming with that as their mission, nobody does magic. You know, we can do 10% tweak, 10% tweak. You know, we can do little tiny shifts toward that ultimate goal. Right, right, right.

We're not going to haul the system. Right. Yeah, I mean, in my experience working with you is that it is a, you know, it's always a movement in the right direction with an occasional breakthrough. You know, something is like, oh, okay, and then you kind of check that one off the list. I'll just give you a simple example. is, you know, I've got a pretty big family now, my own family and my parents and brother and sister. And that's a pretty good group.

And so particularly when I was working really hard, it was like, how often do you see your family? And do you see them, you go by every day and see them? Or do you just not see them until Thanksgiving? You know, there's a broad difference. And, you know, I didn't even have a plan. It was just kind of whatever happens happens. And so thinking about it together, It's like, well, at the very minimum, I'd love to see everyone once a week.

So why don't we just organize a weekly, everyone who can come, come, Sunday afternoon. We'll meet somewhere for lunch or dinner. And in addition to that, there might be a special thing here or there, someone's birthday, but a nice, steady, something on the maintenance schedule. And that's worked great. It's kind of solved, that little piece of life. And there's other pieces to solve. exercise. You know, I know people that

don't exercise at all, and, you know, they don't have the same energy level. They're headed towards a bad place eventually, right? They're not going to live as long or not as well. But also know people that are like always trying to do triathlons that are hurt all the time. And they spend a couple hours a day working on it. And so somewhere in the middle there, you know, that balance you're talking about. So I think, you know, I was so determined, you know, to be a successful business person at that age, that I almost didn't want to look at the rest of the stuff.

Yeah. And I think everyone should look at it. It doesn't mean you're not going to be successful. It means you just kind of do something in these other areas. Maybe not a triathlete. Right, right. Maybe not everyday family visit, but just something. Does that make sense?

Yeah. Yeah. And it really makes sense to, for one to, you know, I talk about awareness, a good bet. So for that to be personally chosen design balance, like I want to have, I want my 60% of my energy or on my work because it's my early stages. I have to build this. You know, I can't. I'm not in maintenance mode of my business yet, for example. So, okay.

So if I've got 60% of my time and energy. into my work, okay, where does the rest of the division go? You know, how much towards your family? How much towards your health? How much, including exercise, nutrition, all those things. How much nature, how much travel, right? So it really helps if one has a safe place where they can sort out what their vision is. Sometimes I use a pie chart as folks are trying to figure out, okay, how do you do things look now?

How would you like them to look? And then the gradual pathway there. It does. It's about intentionality of living. If we're aware and we're choosing, then we can decide what that looks like. Otherwise, it's 30 years later and we go, oops. What happened to? Well, also, just because you're not looking at it, I mean it's not there.

Yeah, right, right, right. So, you know, I remember talking to some of our European colleagues a while back and about what their year looked like. And this guy told me just like it was just normal. He goes, well, of course, four weeks, I go to the beach. You know, I go to the seaside in France. Okay. And he goes, and. I'm like, and, and.

He goes, yeah, and I do a week skiing, of course, in the Alps. I'm like, okay, well, that's a lot of vacation. And this was the fun part. that he does a week every year in a different country. Oh, nice. You think about that. If you start when you're 21 and all of a sudden you're 61, that's 40 countries you've been to on purpose.

Yeah. In addition to whatever else might have come along. Yeah. Isn't that cool? That is so nice. Yeah, and all of our noob schoolers could do that. Yeah. You know, they're going to get vacation.

They could take a week or two weeks and go somewhere different every year. Sure. So cool. Yeah. Or they could work toward that. They could. They could have that vision. Yes.

Build a pathway to it. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Yeah, that's interesting. And then what do you think about like goals versus systems? It's like me setting the goal of I want to be, you know, I want to be in this kind of shape. Or that I want to put this system to.

together that I'm going to exercise every day and eat this way and work towards being in the best shape I can be. I hear a whole lot of difference between those to myself. I mean, I think bottom line, we have a vision that is, if we have examined that vision, then hopefully it has some wisdom to it, has some moderation to it, has some... some room to grow, room to rest, you know. And then we try to figure out what that looks like. And what that looks like today may look different than it does next year.

Right. You know, because we're different seasons, different times, different life comes with all kinds of different demands on us. So we can't have, we can't establish systems that are, systems. It's it's all it all has to be adjustable. Right, right. According to life. We're on this big old ocean. These waves are common, you know, so they're big ones, they're little ones. So we can't get rigid about anything. Right, right.

But it does make a difference to have some vision. Right. That we're striving toward. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we were joking earlier about the meaning of life. And that's kind of a, that's a big question. But just in general, I think, you know, we're all trying to make our lives as good as we can make them. Yeah. Right?

And that doesn't mean necessarily sitting on the beach with the Mai Tai. I mean, that would, maybe for somebody. But for me, that wouldn't last very long. Yeah. But in terms of, you know, who you like to hang out with and how you want to help your children and your community and I mean, since we don't quite know the meaning, you know, just making your life constantly tweaks how we can make it as good as we can.

I mean, that makes sense to kind of what we're talking about here? Yeah, it does, it does, yeah. Yeah, and I think we do, not all of us, but many of us do ask ourselves along the way, what is it about, what is my life about, what is the meaning of my life? And the wisest people I know who I see as wise talk about being of service to others somehow, somehow. Yeah. Somehow helping the world be a better place.

I've just along the way, the people who seem to be happiest to me are the ones who are doing that. doing that. Not necessarily that they're succeeding at that because that's a tall order. But that's what it's about for them. That's what gets them up every morning because they're going to be of service to somebody somehow. Right. Certainly, I mean, it's the business you're in. And to some degree with the Noob School, that's the business I'm in as I'm trying to help people.

Absolutely. You know, get their lives put together and be successful quicker than they would. be without someone helping them. That's exactly what you're doing. Yeah. You are wanting to invest in sharing what you have learned. Yeah. Which is, I think, one of the most beautiful things about that is, one, that it values

learning. It honors the process of learning in our lives. And that that's what we're all doing. Right. I'm learning from you. You're learning from me. We're all learning from each other. And you're investing on purpose.

to share what you have learned with young people coming. You've said this so many times to me. I've learned so much. I want to pass that on. If I were there, if I was 20 years old, I wish that I'd had this someone passing on to me. So I'm doing that. You're doing that.

Absolutely. It's beautiful. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, there's just back to what you do for a second, but I remember saying something to you kind of, I was kind of like, this is really bugging me, you know.

This is a person says this. And you thought about it, you go, why is that bothering you? Well, I don't know. I don't know why. And then later on, I wouldn't admit to it at the time, but later on, I'm like, hey, that doesn't bother me a bit. Why would it bother me? That's just what they think.

You know, they could think something different than me. And in fact, it would be unusual if the whole world agreed. That's right. So, well, that's wonderful. So let me ask you this. as we're wrapping up, can you share with us your favorite word? Trick question. I will have to go with kindness.

Kindness. I should have guessed that one. That's good. Yeah, life is hard. Just kindness goes a long way. Right. No matter what we're doing, whether we're selling, whether we're buying, whether we're just walking through the streets.

Right. Yeah. And you never know that small act of kindness, that will make someone feel. Absolutely. You may never even know. Yeah, yeah, because sometimes it's a very quiet kindness. Yeah.

But it makes a difference. I'm trying. I'm trying to be kind. I think I'm kinder since I met you. I think I'm kinder. And then what would you like to promote today? Anything in particular? I would like to promote the idea.

I think it's a fact and a truth that none of us get to do this life alone. There's nothing any of us can figure out or are supposed to figure out on our own. And there's help. There's always help. There's always somebody who knows something who can help us.

I want to promote that folks ask for that support, ask for that coaching, ask for that teaching, for the, what they need. Right. There is support. There is teaching. There is guidance. There's good stuff available.

Yes. Yeah. If you want a great life coach. Right there. But it's delightful having you on the podcast. It's nice to know you. Thank you. You too.

And I appreciate you being here. Thank you for having me. This was fun. Thank you. Thank you. Awesome.