North Korea News Podcast by NK News - Cathy Kang: Rethinking Korean unification from a global perspective

Episode Date: April 14, 2026

Korea Risk Group Executive Director Jeongmin Kim kicks off the podcast this week by discussing North Korea’s positive response after Seoul expressed regret for past civilian drone incursions, only to quickly undercut hopes for inter-Korean detente with more hardline messaging and a series of missile launches. In the second half, Dr. Cathy Kang of the […]

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Head to shop.nknews.org and make the most of this limited time offer. That's shop.nknews.org. Hello listeners and welcome to the NK News podcast. I'm your host, Jack O'Swezzled. And today, it is Monday the 13th of April, 26. I'm here in Leyden. Jong-min Kim is in the NK News studio in Seoul. Hi, Jong-Men.

Good afternoon from Seoul. Very jealous of your trip. Good morning from Leiden in the Netherlands where I'm on a bit of personal leave. So let's jump straight into it. What's the big news of the last week? I think it's in inter-Korean relations, right? Right. So there were a few moments where Seoul sort of got its hopes up because Kim Yo-jong said something nice, which is a very rare thing to happen. But then just a day later, they fired multiple missiles and they sort of shut down Seoul's hopes for inter-Korean thought with another statement referring to Kim Yo-Jong.

So it started with President Izaymeng expressing regret, which is something that close as close as it gets to an apology. related to the civilian drone incursions. Right. Now, why was he expressing regret for something he didn't do? Right. So this goes way back to December last year. When he did the press conference, marking one year anniversary of the martial law, he said he was asked by a foreign correspondence there,

whether he is willing to apologize to North Korea for whatever happened under Yunso Ghiar because it sort of provoked North Korea investigation found out. And so this was way before the... civilian drone stuff in January. And then at the time in December, regarding the drones that Yunso-Gyad administration sent, Lee was like, well, you read my mind. I would love to apologize if I could, but dot, dot, dot.

So at the time, he was still pondering about it, saying that it could be easily become target of red baiting, being called pro-North Korea, whatever, because it comes with historical baggage for South Korean presidents to apologize for anything because North Korea never apologize for Chennan's thinking and the death of the killing of the tourist who went to Mount Kimgang, right? So he didn't apologize at the time. The reason that President Kim wasn't sure about apologizing was because he was afraid of the domestic social capital that it would cost him.

Exactly. And then despite that, in I think late December and then January, the Unification Minister, as you remember, did express regrets, which is also quasi-similar to apologies talking about the... in January, I think, about the civilian drone incursion, but it wasn't state leader level, but Kim Yo-Jang at that time said something nice about the unification minister saying,

oh, that's a desirable move. But then what happened last week was, I Jiamen personally said he expresses regret because now NIS employee and military officials were indicted because of the involvement into the civilian drone incursion cases in January and before. And so he was saying that during cabinet meeting. And then I think less than a day later,

Kim Yo-Jong issued a statement calling him frank and bold or broad-minded, according to KCNA English. And Kim Jong-in was citing Kim Jong-in as well, saying that, oh, the head of state said that he's a very frank and bold man to be able to do that. It's surprising to see someone like that in South Korea. And then she ended the statement with the usual threat about, you know, but still don't provoke us. We won't stand it. And then after seeing the statement, a lot of, you know, hopeful statements came out from South Korea. Blue House saying that it's desirable to see the, you know, leader-to-leader quick communication, whatever that means. And then the unification minister, unification ministry also issued.

Yeah. Not himself, but the ministry issued a statement saying that, you know, we will work harder towards peaceful coexistence. And then came that evening, there was another statement. that sort of push back. Right. So let's talk about that statement there. That's from the Vice Minister of Foreign Affairs of North Korea. Mm-hmm.

Chang-Gem-Chal, and he used to run the United Front Department, which... In charge of inter-Korean relations, relations with South Korea and I guess diaspora Koreans as well? Exactly. He used to run that, but then after North Korea removed unification from its agenda and constitution, people were speculating what happened to UFD,

And it was confirmed for the first time from North Korean state media that he still heads inter-Korean affairs, but under the foreign ministry. So what's called Bureau 10 is now under ministry, or maybe it always was Ministry of Foreign Affairs handling foreign states. And so he issued under that name, referring to Kim Jong. And it had a lot of personal touches, which was interesting and quite new. He said that, oh, I talked to a department director, Miss Kim Yo-Jung. She asked me if I found her statement funny. And I responded to her, yes, it is quite funny to see South Koreans getting their hopes up, thanks to your statement.

And then he went on to say, you know, let me offer my own analysis of what Ms. Kim Yo-Jong said. What she really meant was, he says, just don't irritate us if you want to live safely. There's no way we are changing the hostile two states policy. we do find it surprising and interesting that there is one frank and bold man among the, you know, U.S. puppet state a sort of bunch of riffrabs, but that doesn't mean your country is, you know, someone we will engage with. And then he started mentioning UN security, a UN resolution that South Korea backed on human rights. And then sort of hinted that him, Zhang Kemchal, and Kim Jong privately talked about it. and then Kim Jojong privately called South Koreans a bunch of dogs

who would just bark along if neighborhood dogs would bark. So just usual stuff, but through Changchumchev voice, which is interesting. Yeah, it does seem that we have, I mean, it's a very consistent message. We're getting out of North Korea all the time, every time that they're talking about or talking to South Korea. The message is the same. It's just leave us alone and we'll leave you alone. Exactly.

But that message doesn't seem to get through in South Korea, does it? So yeah, I think what Kim Yo-Jong was trying, it's my take. When Kim Yo-jong issued that statement, I said, Don't Get Too Excited was my section break title. Because she is basically what I thought was she is basically hinting that South Korea passed her test of someone who has a leader who is good enough to coexist with, you know, not to provoke each other. But it didn't really mean that North Korea is ready to go back to inter-Korean engagement

because inter-Korea is not something that North Korea considers as something existing anymore, right? And then Tam-Kang-Char's statement, it was also paired with three different North Korean missile launches at the same time with the, you know, the Apocheon, the range targeting largely South Korea, basically, which I count as a signal, and that they are not really anywhere near changing the foundational shift that happened recently, is seeing South Korea as the primary enemy, basically. Yeah, it sounds like Zhang Kemchall read your analysis and kind of used that as the rough draft free script. Yeah, it was kind of funny because it's Kim Yo-jong whisperer is sort of my favorite beat in the past few years since inter-Korean relations was basically gone. And Chang Kemchar's statement was like, here is my analysis of what she said.

It was very similar in format as well, so I found it quite funny. Yeah, and we do know that there are people working for the North Korean government who do monitor NK News. So I'm not sure if I listen to the podcast, but hello, if you're out there, if you're listening to the podcast, we do welcome a spokesperson from the North Korean government to come on the podcast at some time. Oh, exactly. We would very much welcome that. And actually, here, your personal thoughts on what you think of South Korean Unification Ministry, perhaps. Right, right. So tell us a little bit more about these missiles. Has North Korea been busy with missile launches lately?

Not really consistently lately, but there were other weapons testing. But this was quite interesting. It was back to back. So it happened April 8th and then April 9th. And then April 7th and then the April 8th one. And then the South Korean Joint Chief of Staff was late in responding to or more like announcing that the first one happened. So only after there was a media outlet.

coverage of the first day one, they belatedly acknowledged that there were ballistic missile tests, and then they explained, oh, we just needed additional analysis. And later, there were reports and we confirmed that they required U.S. early warning satellite intel because they couldn't really find the trails because they were, they disappeared too quickly. And it was difficult for South Korean to sort of track them. Anyways, that was the first one. And then the second day, Shortly after a few hours after Chan Gumptra statement was out, there were two other ballistic missile launches, one longer than the other.

One flew 700 kilometers and the other one 240 kilometers, and likely Hua Song 11A SRBM. Were those missiles launched from the east coast of North Korea? So one was from one's one and one was from Pyongyang. So it looks like they use multiple places to try out different, you know, similar ranges, basically. Right. Now this week, today is Monday, yesterday was to have been the day of the Pyongyang International Marathon, which you recall was cancelled about a month or so ago. So all those people who had had their hopes set up, set high to be running to the streets of Pyongyang. That didn't happen. I imagine that they might have had a local marathon with just North Korean runners instead, maybe some Russians and Chinese. Maybe, but instead, the focus right now really is the arts festival in North Korea. Korea. There were, you know, it's like a spring,

Pome Yesurzuchat, Spring Arts Festival to mark the Day of the Sun, which is the day after tomorrow. The day after tomorrow, that's right, April 15th. It's the 114th birthday of the birth of Kim Il-sung. To mark that, and to mark that there are Russian, Chinese, Vietnamese, and other artists who are visiting North Korea at the moment, but no marathon. And of course, it's always interesting to see, you know, this process, of Kim Il-sung and Kim Jong-il being relatively de-escalate,

you know, sort of moved down the ranking order in North Korea and Kim Jong-un being moved up. So it'll be interesting to see if there's any speeches or any messages this week that move Kim Il-sung down in terms of importance and Kim Jong-un up. Right, and there were interesting moves with North Korea and changes in the murals and the statues in recent months, right? And what stood out to me as well was last week,

Or was it the week before last week? State media did like an interesting feature of KCNA reporters visiting Russia, China and Vietnam to see the artists prepare for the Pyongyang visit. And it was like a foreign correspondent sort of feature on the page 6 of Rojong Shimon three days in a row. And in the Russian version, which came out first, because they are, you know, putting more highlight on, you know, Russian artists rather than the Chinese, which came on the second day, They were mentioning something like the artists were preparing this and that song,

and this and that songs were Kim Ril Song song and Kim Jong-un song, but not Kim Jong-il song, interestingly. Okay, and so the name, the name of the Sun, that's still being mentioned, right? So that's still, it's still a holiday in North Korea, it's still an important day. I think it's just that more subtly and, like, party regulations a couple years back and like little, you know, little artistic, you know, domestic stuff, they are slowly increasing the personality cult for Kim Jong-un, like the statue recently, but not at the stage of completely removing Kim Il-Nong-year-name altogether.

Right. So it is subtle. There is a, it's about a relative rebalancing of the order of importance of leaders, right? Right. Just subtly, like when you look at the, for instance, if you look at the recent military parade, the order of the songs that come out, Kim Jong-un-un-related, you know, general Kim Jong-un song, it comes out first, rather than older ones, right? Or the international, it comes up first because that's the new ideology, you know, focus that they are sort of, you know, pushing towards in line with what the Chinese party is doing. So stuff like that little subtle stuff, like the order of the songs are like which parade is bigger,

but not altogether removal. Great. Okay, well, thank you, Jong-in. That's fantastic. On my holiday here, hearing some of the great news from the Korean Peninsula. And listeners, stay tuned because after this, we've got an interview that I recorded before my leave with Kathy Gung from the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council. And just a heads up, that the ideas or the opinions that she expressed in this interview are her own and are not the official thoughts of the President, a peaceful unification advisory council, the PUC. Thanks very much. And I'll talk to you again soon, Jong-Men.

Thanks for having me. So for today's interview listeners, I am interviewing Dr. Kathy Gung, who is chief. advisor at the National Unification Advisory Council and a representative of that council in Bulgaria. She's also a member of the Central and Eastern European Regional Council on the same topic of unification. And she's an assistant professor at Plobdiv University in Bulgaria. So welcome Dr. Kati Gang. Thank you so much, J. Cole, for having me. You're born and raised in Bulgaria. And now you're an advisor in the constitutional advisory body of the Republic of Korea, part of the presidential unification advisory council, the PUC,

how has growing up in Europe shaped the way that you think about Korean unification and even a peaceful coexistence between North and South Korea? Yes, that is a very interesting question to start with. So, yeah, to share a bit about myself. So the journey of growing in Bulgaria in times when people didn't really know that Korea existed at all and asked me, are you from China? Are you from Japan? And then when they heard my answer, the second question was from which Korea are you? Are you from South Korea or North Korea? So back then in Bulgaria, up until now, there is a big North Korean embassy. So many people were not

that alienated from the thought that I might be either from North or South Korea. So for me, this was like something that like this question of whether I am from South or North Korea has been with me throughout my upbringing. And coming back to 2006, when you can hear like BTS songs and Black Pink songs or even like other K-pop songs in ordinary Bulgarian supermarkets or cafes or even in IKEA. Yeah, has been a very impactful journey for me as a Korean living overseas, but also to see how both South and North Korea have like shaped the way people think in Bulgaria as well. Yeah, the Korean community in Bulgaria is not that big, comparatively small. It's around 200 people in total.

But the role we have is very impactful in the Bulgarian society overall, which includes educational or cultural exchanges, and we all act as bridges between Bulgarian and Korean people. Yeah, so going back to how it has influenced, how my upbringing has influenced my views on Korean unification and coexistence. So it's really interesting that I'm actually part of a bigger picture, so to say. So as a member of one of the seven million overseas Koreans living abroad, my views on Korean unification and coexistence have been shaped based both on my Korean

experience in Korea but also abroad. So I have graduated University in Korea at Zol National University, which has helped me to understand the way the Koreans think about Korea, the Korean unification. But also my upbringing abroad has helped me to understand Korean from a more objective perspective abroad. So for me, both these views on Korea as Korean, but also as an overseas Korean, yeah, have helped me to have a rather, so to say, unique perspective on the Korean unification and peaceful coexistence. Do you think you're more realistic than Korean people who live in Korea? On this topic, on the topic of unification and coexistence? I would like to say I'm more objective on this topic because, as I'm not currently living in South Korea,

I'm not into the everyday atmosphere of how South Koreans feel about North Korea, but at the same time as an overseas Korean, seeing Korea from a much broader perspective, I would like to say I do have a more positive, maybe more optimistic view, but at the same time, it is also more realistic because I have an input from, let's say, the European point of view or the US point of view. So I think it's balanced, a balanced perspective. Now, we live in a time where North Korea leadership, has openly stated that peaceful unification is no longer the objective of the North Korean government and that the South Koreans are not a brother nation anymore.

Does that fundamentally change how you approach your work in this space? Yes, as you mentioned, actually for decades since the July 4th South North Joint Statements, there was no rejection of peaceful unification by North Korea. But recently, at the end of 2023 and the early 2024, Kim Jong-un has defined South Korea as a hostile states. And also recently, just a few weeks ago in February, this was also embedded in the 9th Workers' Party of Korea Congress as two hostile states framework. So for me, like, abandoning the one-Korea identity by North Korea as a person who is depressive. invested into this topic. This is a huge shift, but at the same time, it does, and also it does challenge the South Korean perspective as well. But personally for me, I do really sympathize and I do

really align with the current South Korean president's policy on diplomacy overall, which is a pragmatic diplomatic approach towards North Korea and also towards different states who are involvement is. So for me, it is challenging, but at the same time, I think this is what diplomacy is all about. Now, let's talk about the presidential unification advisory council, the PUC. A lot of listeners may not be familiar with it. So what is it exactly? And how does it differ from a ministry or an executive agency of the government? Yes. So the peaceful unification advisory council or in Detroit PUC, which is like the basic translation into English is the Presidential Peaceful Unification Advisory Council. It is advisory council under the direct leadership of the president of South Korea since 1981

and is also established as a constitutional body under Article 92 of the Constitution of the Republic of Korea. As to how many advisors are there, we have, as of our 22nd term, we have about 22,000 advisors who are, yes, this is a huge body. So we have about 18,000 domestic advisors and about 4,000 overseas advisors from 137 countries, which does make it a huge, so to say, global or international network. Yeah, the structure is, it's rather not that complicated. So just I will share the gist of the structure. So our chair is the president of the Republic of Korea.

And he has a senior vice chairperson and a secretary general who support the overall coordination and operations. And as I mentioned, I'm part of the overseas advisors. And we have five continental regional councils. And also within Korea, there are 18 local regional councils. So that is how we are built. Sorry to interrupt. I'm just wondering, how does your advice actually reach the Korean president? Is there a formal mechanism or is it more sort of consultative in spirit?

Yeah, so also on the question, how does the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council differ from a government ministry? I think it's also related. So we do not have a legislative or an executive power. And as you mentioned, yeah, we have more of an advisory function, advisory of framework. So the main routes or the main tracks through which we collect, so to say, advice from all the advisors from all over the world or locally. There are three tracks. So the first track is the first track is the formal track, which consists of official surveys that are made.

Also, there are official collection of opinions from overseas Koreans, but also from foreign, also from foreigners as well. There is the demi-formal track, which is constructed of meetings or conferences. And also, there is the, so to say, not formal or people-to-people track, which is based on advocating and promoting the policies on North Korea and peaceful unification from the South Korean government to the local people. So that is like people to people in track. So we can see that there is like, oh sorry. With more than 22,000 advisors, including thousands like yourself who are overseas, is that scale a strength because of its diversity or does it risk polluting the effect, diluting the effectiveness of the council? Yeah, so in my opinion, it is a strength for sure. So there is a

strength in diversity of perspectives. And even though it's a very large network and I cannot meet all of the 22,000 advisors, at the same time, we have a very well-structured centralized secretariat, which connects all the advisors who are overseas, but also locally, so that we can have a very well-structured, we can have a networking not only between ourselves, but also networking within the countries we live in and also between, let's say, foreigners who are also interested in South and North Korean issues. I talked to one Korean about the PUC recently, and their response was, can a body that is so large produce sharp, actionable policy advice? How would you reply to that?

Yeah, so on that part about policy advice, that is actually only one part of what we do, which is, so to say, the results. But then the bigger picture is to be able to translate into clear and dynamic actions. What the current Zaltarian government's policy is towards North Korea to the foreign audience. Yeah, so I think that maybe we should start first from first. thinking of how we can be more transparent and clear in our actions for our foreign audience, and then how this can produce results, which can then be communicated into policies that can be collected and then communicated with the South Korean president. So the polls and the surveys that are conducted by the secretariat are done not only for the local Korean advisors, but also for the

oversea advisors. And that is done every four months. So every four months, the Secretariat collects those polls and surveys, which help to understand how the thinking process or how the thinking process and the opinion of advisors and not only advisors reflect the current geopolitical changes. So it sounds like it's a kind of a tool for public diplomacy? Is that a way to understand standard sort of a two-way tool of public diplomacy for the Korean government? Yes, yes, that is right. Now, what about 1.5 trap diplomacy where non-government or former government people on one side talk to sometimes the North Korean government on the other side?

What can that achieve in your mind and have you been involved in such efforts? Yeah, so currently, as we all know, the South and North Korean relations are not at its finest. and what the current North Korean government has as a strategy is called through the needle hole or in Korean it's called a panelgumong-turki, through which we're trying to re-engage into communication with North Korea, but not only with North Korea, but on North Korea overall. So this is the South Korean government, did you say? Yes, that is a strategy of the South Korean government, but at the same time, because we are

aligned with the policies and strategies of the South Korean government. That is one thing we are also trying to do within our activities. And currently, I am part of this project where we want to invite a very famous South Korean director who shot a documentary movie on Poland, but is related to North Korean children who lost their parents during the Korean War. So the background of these documentary movies from the 1950s, but at the same time, the movie was shot in 2019. Oh, yeah. I think I interviewed that director.

Yeah. Yeah. The director is called Chusong Mi and the movie is called The Children who went back to Poland. Yeah. So through such, and we are going to invite her to Poland. And we are going to have like a discussion like a Cynetalk with the director and Polish audience. And through this, we also want to convey a more in-depth dialogue on what is actually the meaning of war, the meaning of peace, and those universal values. And I think this is something through which we can start re-engaging with North Korea, but also on North Korea with international society.

As a person of Korean heritage living outside Korea, are you able to reach out directly to North Korean people and speak to them or to the North Korean government or to the North Korean embassy in Bulgaria that you mentioned? Yes, this is also a question I have always thought about. So firstly, according to the South Korean constitution, as a South Korean, if I have any contact with a North Korean person, I have to report. to the Ministry of Unification and to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Yeah, because that's like how it's stated in the Constitution out of safety measures. But at the same time, if a person is not a South Korean national, for example, there are a lot of ways through which people can actually communicate with North Koreans outside of North Korea. Really?

So, yes, I think living abroad does expand the opportunities to have touched, to being in touch, to being touched. or to keep in touch with North Koreans. But at the same time, also this has to be done in a very sensitive manner because we have to keep the laws as well. So hang on. So you are a citizen of South Korea. Is that correct? Yeah, actually, I have a Bulgarian citizenship as well.

Okay. So that means that you are maybe less restricted than somebody carrying a South Korean passport. Does being a member of the peaceful unification advisory council, So does that empower you to speak with North Koreans? Are there any guidelines on what you can and cannot say or who you can and cannot talk to? Yeah. So because I'm a South Korean in my, how to say, yeah, in my original form of my South Korean. So actually it's not that the topic is so much sensitive for me,

then it is sensitive to a North Korean national because like what I know, some of the guidelines were that, actually, for me, it's not as dangerous to approach a North Korean national, but at the same time, if a North Korean national is seen to talk to a South Korean person, then for them, actually, that will be more endangering. So I think in that sense, I have to be careful into how I approach a North Korean if I get to have the chance, yes. So have you had that experience until now? I personally have not, but I have. have met a lot of Koreans who live in Bulgaria and they have shared with me that they have had

such encounters. And also in Bulgaria, because Bulgaria has some educational exchanges with North Korean students as well. So in my university during my PhD studies, one of my professors, they shared with me that they are doing a project with North Korean exchange students on English translations, yes. So there are such instances where I can meet North Koreans, but I personally have now, yes. Did you choose not to meet those exchange students at your university? No, actually, I was not informed, so I didn't know. And when my professor told me that, I was like, yes, yes, exactly. Yeah. So I didn't know that. Yeah, I was not in forums previously. Now, when we met in Seoul late last year, you were visiting Korea to attend one of the meetings of the Peace for Unification Advisory Council.

So tell us a little bit about that meeting. How large was it? Was it your first in-person meeting? And what do you think was achieved? And so when we met in December last year, 2025, I was in Korea to attend the main meeting, so to say, because we have once a year a main meeting, which is for all the advisors from. from Korea, but also from overseas. So we had around 20,000 participants on this meeting. And it was also chaired by our chair, who is the president of the Republic of Korea,

Y.J.M. And we were able to have a lot of networking with the Korean advisors, but also with the overseas advisors. And overall, we also had this time to share our views on the current South Korean policy. towards North Korea, but also share some personal views on how the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council in each continent or in each country is acting so that those policies can be translated to the people in those countries. For example, we had some advisors who joined from the Arab Emirates or even from Dubai, from Berlin, from Sweden, from Spain, but also from China, Japan. So we were

able to see how the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council is active in all those countries through different shapes because we have to adapt to the peoples of each country where we are active. I've lived in Korea for a long time over 20 years and I've been to a lot of different conferences and talk shops about unification and about North Korea. And people love to talk about about it. It's a topic that there's a lot of talking. But if you're to be completely candid with us, what part of the PUC, what needs reform? What area does the PUC still fall short in? What needs to be better? Yes. So, yeah, we always want to be better. And as you know, there's this really famous quotes from the President of Republic of Korea. Yizhemiang who said,

Wee Kyi is so, which means from a state of danger into a state of opportunity. So I think that we always take time to think about what could be improved. Personally, for me, I think what the core strengths of the Overseas Peaceful Unification Advisory Council are related to all the cultural public diplomacy events we do, because essentially abroad, not many people are that interested to be very. Blunt, not many people are that very interested on the peace on the Korean Peninsula. People are more interested in like Hailu or K-pop. So it is very essential to be able to communicate and translate into an understandable language

why this is so important and what the implication does the peace on Korean Peninsula have within the global peace order. So for me, I think one thing we can strengthen is maybe in this. area to have, we do have a lot of cultural academic events, but at the same time, also as you mentioned, when we met back in December last year, that you have not really heard that much about the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council. So I think that since 1981, when the Council was established until now, there have been a lot of public instances, especially within South Korea. But now is the time births to grow globally and have a more global voice overall.

North Korea's leadership, as you mentioned, it's put forward this hostile two-state position on the inter-Korean relationship. Should South Korea adjust its own unification framework in response? Yes, this is a very interesting question. So, yeah, as North Korea's recent shift towards a two-state position, yeah, we see a very huge conceptual shift. And from seeing Korea as a one nation, North Korea is starting to treat Korea as a separate state, and that does have major implications for unification policy. South Korea's view on the two-state position, I think for the current government, one of the most important thing is the pragmatic diplomacy and also the new keyword that we are also

using at our peaceful unification advisory council, which is peaceful coexistence. So in the long term, unification is a long-term goal. That is unnegotiable. But for the short term, what we may aim to do at this point of time is to strive to strive for peaceful coexistence. So that is one of the things we are trying to do currently. I mean, it seems to me that there's a danger that North Korea is not interested in talking about unification.

and also people outside Korea are more interested in Halu than talking about the peace on the Korean Peninsula. And young Korean people who live in Korea who are younger than the age of 50, who have no direct relationship to North Korea, they're not particularly interested in this occasion. So it seems to me there's a danger that your organization, the PUC, could be speaking into an echo chamber. Yes, it could be viewed as such. But at the same time, what is really important is that in times of knowing, communication, we need to keep on doing what we are doing because when the opportunity strikes, we need to be prepared. So yes, in some way, especially in South Korea, there is less and

less interest in unification overall. But at the same time, what we need to do now is to focus more on the peace part, because peace is what connects us. Peace is what connects the people from all over the world, the global audience, especially in these times where peace is absent. So from going back to what you mentioned, yes, it could be viewed as such, but at the same time maintaining like these people-to-people exchange on peaceful coexistence and peace on the Korean Peninsula is very imperative so that when the opportunity comes, we can be prepared. As a member of the Korean diaspora, Do you experience the idea of one nation or Han Minchuk differently from Koreans who live on the peninsula? So here I would like to actually quote this quote from the director, Bong Juno, who won a few years ago.

So he said from parasite, exactly. And what he said in Korean was, which means that what is most Korean is most global or most international. And I think this also applies to the specificity of our inter-Korean relations and the Korean identity overall. So they may also be acquaintance with the different maybe Korean identities. We have South Korean-Koreans and also we have adoptees. We have Korya people, Koryo-in. We have also Kailbukmin.

We have also Joseon-Jok. We have Korean-Americans, European-Korean, German-Koreans, German-Americans. So we have actually a very dynamic and diverse overlook of how Korean identity can look like. And I would like to just share a short experience I had last year while preparing one of our seminars by the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council in Korea. We were able to invite some experts, international experts online who can talk to the Bulgarian audience and Bulgarian academia and media experts about the realities and perspectives on Koreanification and peace. And Jenny Town was very kind to join our seminar. And what she mentioned was that.

Jenny, John from the Stimson Center, 30 AdN North. Yep, she's been on this podcast. Yes. So she's actually also my mentor from another program. But what she mentioned was that now is the time to think about a new Korean unified identity. So what I think is that thinking Korean in some sense may be, translated into thinking global. And at the same time, thinking global can also be translated

into thinking Korean. So I think nowadays we're just living in this very interesting times for Korea, especially. So yeah, I think we have to see with time how concept evolves. Okay. Last question for you, Kathy. How do you react or how do you reflect on the recent events happening in Venezuela and Iran? Does this add a sense of urgency to the work of the Peaceful Unificationary Unification Advisory Council? The recent events that happened in Venezuela in Iran, do they actually have a direct implication on the Peaceful Unification Advisory Council? So they do have, but that is not in a political sense.

It's more of a sense that all the overseas advisors were active in those regions. Firstly, we're not able to conduct their meetings or to conduct all the activities they were trying to do on promoting peace and peaceful coexistence on the Korean Peninsula. So I think that is a huge setback for the activities of the Peace Renification Advisory Council there, especially the activities related to public diplomacy on peace. Yeah, so we have to wait. But I imagine in a broader sense, you're also concerned about avoiding a repetition of the same kind of attacks or regime change from the United States, right? Of course, yes, but that would be, again, if I had to answer your question, that will be more of, so to say, a very political concern.

But for the peace unification advisory council, since we are an advisory body, for us, yes, political concern is also part of, and it does influence our activities. But at the same time, as we do not have the legislative or executive power, for us, we have to be more. focused on our advisory part. So your work continues unchanged. Okay. Thank you very much for joining me today, Dr. Kathy Gung. Thank you so much, Jekyll. Ladies and gentlemen, that brings us to the end of our podcast episode for today. Our thanks go to Brian Betts and David Choi for facilitating this episode and to our post-recording producer Alana Hill, who cuts out all the extraneous noises, awkward silences, bodily functions, and fixes the audio. levels. Thank you for listening and listen again next time.