North Korea News Podcast by NK News - North Korea’s plenum, new Kim Jong Un pins and rumors of DPRK troops in Ukraine

Episode Date: July 2, 2024

North Korea held a major plenary session of the Workers’ Party of Korea this week, with leader Kim Jong Un presiding over the meeting. Photos published in the Rodong Sinmun of the plenum showed North Korean officials delivering speeches while wearing badges with Kim Jong Un’s portrait on them, the first confirmed use of such […]

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Plus seize the chance to cultivate valuable connections within the vibrant North Korea watching community. Whether you're a scholar, a journalist or simply a curious soul, the North Korea from a Distance Tour is your gateway to understanding one of the most enigmatic countries on the globe. Spaces are limited for this unique educational journey. Don't miss your chance to be part of this exceptional experience. Visit NK News or contact Corio Tours to reserve your spot today. Hello, listeners, and welcome to the NK News podcast. I'm your host, Jacko's Wedsuit, and today's short interview is recorded on Monday, the 1st of July, the last day of my vacation.

And joining me via StreamYard is my colleague, Anton Sokolin. Anton, welcome back on the show. Thank you very much for having me. I can't wait to have you back here. I'm sure. Okay, tell me what's been going on in North Korea. What are the big stories this week? Well, of course, there is plenty of stories. It's pretty much like every week. Our listeners know it very well. But this time, I think it's worth going over a few key developments. So for example, we have this new party planning that is ongoing right now. It started over the weekend and there's not many details particularly about what the planning was about, but we can see that...

Wait, hold on, just briefly, so remind our listeners what actually is a planning? What does that mean? Right, sorry, to be precise, absolutely precise, is the 10th enlarged plenary meeting of the 8th Central Committee. So it's a party meeting, the Central Committee of the party, and it's one of the highest decision-making bodies in North Korea. Apart from the party congress, it's another thing, another convention where North Korea decides on its key policies and key developments or decides certain reforms. And right now we are having this plenum in session. Is that the same as the kind of meeting they had last December when Kim Jong-un

announced his new stance on unification? Was that also a plenary meeting of the Central Committee? That's a very good question because yes indeed. As of recently, North Korea has been having these plenary meetings twice a year and one usually it takes place around the end of the year so let's say December and the other one usually mid-summer so here we are we are having it in the end of June early July that's pretty much standard right now and, if we are going to cover what exactly is being done there, there's not much information at this point, but we know that probably they're going to review their economic reforms. And the focus will be mostly on economic development,

because previously, during the previous plenum, Kim Jong-un unveiled his 2010 policy. And the 2010 policy, it's a policy that aims to develop backward regions of North Korea by building production facilities, improving infrastructure, etc. So most likely, this plenum is also going to touch upon these points. But while we're still awaiting for more details, it's also worth looking at what kind of imagery or symbolism that was unveiled during this meeting. And we are seeing reports that for the first time since Kim Jong-un took power in 2011-2012, actually North Korea released Kim Jong-un badges. So as you know, typically all North Koreans are supposed to wear pins, right? Badges with Kim Il-sung originally. And then after the death of Kim Jong-il, his successor, they added Kim Jong-il as well. And about 10 years ago, exactly when Kim

Jong-un just took power, we had this report and there was a speculation going on that trying to boost his cult of personality, Kim Jong-un might also want to release his own badges with his own portrait on it. And over this, so it's been about 12 years right now, but there were no many confirmed reports. And now we're seeing this again with officials during the party meeting. Yes, indeed, they have a little portrait there that kind of looks like Kim Jong-un and it makes you think that maybe they are really going to unveil these badges now, but still we need to probably wait a little bit.

So you're saying we're not sure yet. Well, I think we are sure sort of 60%, but I wouldn't speculate much. So what I want to advise our listeners to do is let's check out and can use coverage of these badges and let's keep an eye on the analysis that is coming in few days, which will settle the whole issue. Definitely it's a new development. And if it's really the case, if those badges are indeed worn by those officials, then it's a very big development that will definitely mean that Kim Jong-un is trying to enhance, strengthen his cult of personality, which comes on top of another interesting development, if you let me.

I'm sorry for the rant, but I think it's very interesting to add this point to. Recently, North Korea also unveiled Kim Jong-un's portrait right next to his predecessor. So next to Kim Jong-un's father, Kim Jong-il, and his grandfather Kim Il-sung at this party cater school. Another interesting development there was that right before that, they were actually keeping it very secret, in secret till the very moment, but before that they also unveiled the portraits of Karl Marx and Vladimir Lenin, which was also very interesting development, because it was for the first time in a decade, I would say, that they decided to show them publicly like that. So it's definitely worth taking a look at. On the badge of Kim Jong-un, it'll be interesting to see whether Kim Jong-un will be worn

alongside the badge of his father and grandfather or if he will be worn alone without the legacy of his father and grandfather? Is he trying to elevate himself to the same level or is he in a way kind of replacing them? That's a very good remark and I really appreciate this thought because that's what's puzzling pretty much all the NK North Korea watchers because whether he's going to elevate or whether he's going to show that he's actually now dominating over their cult. It's a very interesting point. Well, we are going to see this situation unfold probably in the coming weeks, months. And I hope to see more photos of officials wearing those badges in state media coverage. That would be awesome. Yes, yes. Now also at the plenum, can we expect to see some talk about a constitutional revision

now that there are two Korean countries recognized on the Korean Peninsula? Well, last time they scrapped the policy of reunification, right? North Korea did. And of course, there could be certain reforms, there could be certain revisions discussed. But at this point, it's very hard, very hard to tell because the reports that we have seen so far are very scant, unfortunately, speculate. But I don't think that it's entirely impossible. Okay, yes, indeed. So it's still ongoing. Let's keep an eye on it. Okay.

What's the next story you'd like to talk about Anton? Another story, probably, I think it's been a little bit overlooked while everyone, pretty much all journalists covering Putin's visit to North Korea, sort of maybe overlooked a little is the fact that Russia announced plans to help North Korea build a new hospital, our medical center, and we know that North Korea has been struggling with medical issues for quite a while, and there's a whole complexity of factors, right? It's a variety of them. So international sanctions is one thing, right? That you cannot obtain certain goods or medical equipment because they may

contain certain components that can be considered prohibited according to sanctions and could prevent you from importing it or there could be financial reasons, it's expensive to buy this equipment etc. etc. And the problem is that Korea has also been trying to build this several actually hospitals in Pyongyang and not only in Pyongyang, it's actually the state policy to revive the medical system and build as many hospitals or at least clinics in not only in Pyongyang but in other cities as well and this news comes very important because with Russia's help seems like North Korea could achieve at least partially its goals of reviving the medical field. Yeah, to mention a few as just for example, in North Korea,

they have this unfinished hospital, it's called the Pyongyang General Hospital, that has been under construction for many years now. Before COVID, I think. Before COVID, that's right. But I think the plans for this hospital, they emerged even before a few years before that, because we saw some prototypes of the hospital during some parades. So even in 2018, if I'm not wrong. So this hospital has been in the works for very long now. And unfortunately, so far, it hasn't been finished. So my colleague Colin has been tracking the developments around this hospital.

We've seen how the hospital was being built and etc. But we are seeing that it's not finished yet. Well, so one potential speculation is that Russia may help finish that hospital at least. Because it would be quite interesting if they try to build an entirely new one when the other one is unfinished. So it just makes more sense to finish the already existing one. And yeah, the hope is that somehow it will contribute to North Korea's healthcare. But the problem is also, it's always the same story. We have this military cooperation between North Korea and Russia. And at the same time, we're having this humanitarian field, right? And it's very hard to reconcile those two. When there is a humanitarian motives, there is financial motives, and then there is also military cooperation that might be of concern to certain countries. And yeah, it's a very interesting avoid the stories that have been flying around the global media, suggesting that North Korea has announced that it will send troops to fight with Russian troops, alongside Russian troops, in its war against Ukraine.

What's the reality? Please verify or deny those rumors. Well, first things first, none of us has seen any official statements regarding this fact on state media or on government websites of North Korea. So it means that there was no such statement. North Korea never publicly admitted that, yes, we are sending troops to Ukraine, it never happened. And it is interesting to see how this rumor developed and my colleague Shreya's ready did a fantastic job tracking the source of the rumor and explaining how it developed and how it led to the

point that global media, many outlets picked up this story saying that claiming that North Korea is already dispatching its troops to the frontline in Ukraine. Well, engineer corps, but still troops. To start with, it all developed with a report in Choson Ilbo, the South Korean media, where it cited an unnamed government official saying that North Korea plans to dispatch these troops already this month, July. Again, unnamed official from which government? South Korean government. I think it was South Korean government, if I'm not wrong. But the problem was that it said that North Korea plans to dispatch next month. There are no confirmed plans. We don't of anything about it.

And the second thing was that there were details, right? So it's an engineering core. It's going to be in July. North Korea is planning it. And then during one of the Pentagon briefings, and I don't want to name this journalist, but this journalist asked a question to the representative of the Pentagon. Look, there is this statement by North Korean officials, which were partially indeed true

that North Korea supported once again Russia's invasion of Ukraine, that indeed happened. And tying this statement to the claimed fact that North Korea is dispatching troops, this journalist asked for comment. And of course, I understand the position of this regular government official. When you are hearing these unconfirmed reports, you don't really know the situation. Maybe you haven't seen them. Maybe they haven't reached you yet, right?

Maybe you don't know. Of course, you say it's worth keeping an eye on it, but I cannot confirm or verify, but it would be very important development and we are definitely on it. But I cannot confirm or verify, but it would be very important development and we're definitely tracking it. It's worth monitoring. And then the same journalist asked the exact same question at the briefing for the US State Department. And they received the exact same response. But because this was public, and because it was mentioned also this whole saga was mentioned as a background information and a different report by different media, the story started

gaining steam. And basically, we've seen a typical snowball effect when our broken phone situation when just one thing got fixed with another and it developed into a story that yeah, North Korea sending troops to Ukraine, which is not true yet. And we have to say that it's yet because we are still monitoring. It's a possibility. It potentially could happen, but we haven't seen signs of that yet. What about instead of troops or engineers, construction workers? Is there any verified account of North Korean construction workers going to the occupied areas of Ukraine? Multiple rumors, of course. Also a lot of speculations indeed.

And it still remains a possibility because even North Korea said that they could do that. As far as I remember, those occupied regions of Ukraine also mentioned that they would be interested in having those North Korean workers. And again, when we are talking about the situation, soldiers can be masked as engineers, engineers can be masked as construction workers. There's a whole array of opportunities to hide these activities or present them in a certain light. But of course, we have no confirmed information about this as of the moment. And we will definitely monitor it.

It will be interesting to see how far this military cooperation between North Korea and Russia can go. Once more, a reminder that slow, careful, methodical, responsible and rigorous news reporting is essential when talking about North Korea because otherwise it's very clear that a half report or an unconfirmed report can very quickly be picked up by the media and circulated around the world before anybody knows any better. It's a common problem we see almost every week in reporting on North Korea. So thank you to you and to Shreyas for doing the work on verifying and clarifying that. All credit goes to Shreyas. You did a fantastic

job. Excellent work, Shreyas. Okay, well, that's where we will finish for today. Thank you very much, Anton Sokolin, for joining me here on the NK News Podcast. Thank you very much. Dive deep into the heart of South Korea's most pressing stories with the weekly Korea Pro Podcast. Hosted by Jongmin Kim and John Lee, this weekly 15-minute podcast is your source for thorough analysis on all things ROK. From intricate politics to dynamic cultural shifts, we cover it all. Tune in every Friday on KoreaPro.org, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you listen to

podcasts. KoreaPro Podcast, Insight, not just information. Music Ladies and gentlemen, that brings us to the end of our podcast episode for today. Our thanks go to Brian Betts and Alana Hill for facilitating this episode and to our post-recording producer genius Gabby Magnuson who cuts out all the extraneous noises, awkward silences, bodily functions and fixes the audio levels. Thank you and listen again next time.