North Korea News Podcast by NK News - Rowan Beard and Greg Vaczi: The return of Western tourism to North Korea

Episode Date: February 20, 2025

Representatives from Young Pioneer Tours and Koryo Tours crossed over the Chinese border to the Rason Special Economic Zone last week as part of preparatory efforts to resume full-fledged tours to the DPRK in the near future, marking a first since before the pandemic. Rowan Beard and Greg Vaczi join the podcast shortly upon their […]

You're listening to an exclusive episode of the NK News podcast available only to subscribers. You can listen to this and other episodes from your preferred podcast player by accessing the Private Podcast feed. For more detailed instructions, please see the step-by-step guide on the NK News website the It's Jacko here with a quick note before this episode begins. I'm recording this note after recording the actual episode because when I did the episode, I wasn't sure that it was going to be successful. So here's what I mean. In this episode, I'm doing something different.

I'm actually interviewing two people, one after the other, both men, Rowan Beard from Young Pioneer Tours and Greg Vachi from Koryo Tours. Both are from companies that lead tourists to North Korea. And of course, they haven't done that for five years. But this week, they've both just come out of North Korea after a five day trip that the first representatives of Western tour companies, as far as I know, to enter North Korea since early 2020. So I thought it was a good time to get their stories about what they saw in there. Both men, when I interviewed them, were at Yangji Airport in Northeast China, transitioning out of North Korea and back to where they came from.

And at the time, given the wifi and the audio, I wasn't sure that I was going to be able to talk to both of them, but I was. And so that's why I didn't introduce this episode properly at the beginning of my first interview with Ramon B, because I wasn't sure that I was gonna be able to get Gregor Varchi on as well. So here we go, you've got two episodes back to back,

both about the exact same thing. What's it like to visit North Korea for the first time in five years and they didn't go to Pyongyang they went to Rason or formerly known as Rajin Sonbong twin cities up in the the far north the northeast of Korea So we hope you enjoy this very special episode this very special episode. Hello, podcast listeners. Welcome to the NK News podcast. I'm your host, Jacko's Wedsuit.

And this episode was recorded in a rush on the afternoon of Monday, the 17th of February, 2025. And I'm talking to Rowan Beard from Young Pioneer Tours, who has just come out of North Korea, one of the first people from non-Russia and non-China to visit North Korea since the beginning of the pandemic. Rowan, welcome on the show. And you've spent how many of the last week, what, four days, five days in Rason? week, what, four days, five days in Rason? Okay, well, let's start from the start. When was the last time you were in North Korea? Because of course, you ran many, many tours over the years

into North Korea. Goodness me. Okay, so it's been five years and a month, and when did you find out that you'd be able to go back there? Mm-hmm. Did it seem clear to you from your partners in Beijing that although they might have been on board with everybody going into Rason, that it wasn't really up to them to decide? That it's kind of out of their hands a little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Did you get any sense from them why it's taken two years since covert finished.

Hmm. Hmm. I do I want to get into that very very soon. Yeah. Yeah. Uh huh. Mm hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Boy. you hmm Mm-hmm. Yep. Right. Yep.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Now, YPT, of course, is, I mean, it's one of several companies that have done business with North Korea over the years, tourism. So was yours the only group that went into RAS on last week or were there others too? Yeah. And I mean, presumably you were all part of that negotiation together with the Chinese and the North Koreans and Yanji. Do you know what it was that made the tipping point that sort of convinced them that, yeah,

we should go ahead with this. Mm-hmm. Wow. Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. Now, Rowan, did you get the feeling at any stage that you were talking to or negotiating with people from the North Korean security apparatus? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. I'm itching to ask you about Rasslin, but before we do, I've got two quick questions for you. First one is, did you get a sense from them why Russians were allowed in first for so long with no Westerners? And the second question, do you know why Rasson is only open and not Pyongyang? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. you you mm-hmm Mm hmm. Yeah. Right. Well, tell us about Raston. What did you see? What was new? What was the same? How was the vibe?

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