Not Another D&D Podcast - Behind the Screens: Pathfinder 2e

Episode Date: January 19, 2023

This week, the 2 crew delves into the world of Pathfinder 2e.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Just enter offer code PAPA at checkout. That's P-A-W-P-A-W at Adamineve.com. This is an exclusive offer specific to the podcast so be sure to use the code PAPA to get your discount 100% free shipping and get it fast with brush processing. Code P-A-W-P-A-W. Goodbye, sweeties. Welcome to a little segment we're calling Behind the Screens. Behind the Screens. Behind the Screens.

A sneaky little peek behind the screens of RPG systems that we've yet to play. I'm kind of your host, Emily Axmer. You're the full host. Join by my co-host, Brian Murphy. Hi. My other co-host, Carl Wilton. Please debuting the whole host. Special guest. And the real host. Hi, my other co-host call well, Taylor. Please to be what am I gonna be?

special guest and the real host no co You should call me the post the most those are the most those okay today We are actually going to be talking about pathfinder second edition. Yes, okay my friends I have spent the past week and a half immersing myself in the world of Pathfinder, the ways in which it resonates and differs from D&D, and it was very fun. This is my favorite type of book club, by the way,

which is for one person reads the entire book and tells everyone else. That's kind of like when they turn the books into movie. Yeah, and thank you again for this cheese plate you prepared. You really put a lot of work into this. I will say this weekend, M was like freaking Sephiroth in the Shinra mansion just going mad pacing

with books walking around. Oh my god. So hot. I enjoyed it because it reminded me of when long ago, we were asked to learn Star Wars 5E. Yeah, you really dove in there. I loved that system. Star Wars 5E, shout out. I miss your pages and pages of grenades.

Yes. Okay, so before we start, I'm going to have to ask the patients of anyone who plays Pathfinder. I've only had the benefit of research as Murph has noted, and not the luxury of play or experience. So I will undoubtedly get things wrong here or there. We've only begun the path. Be kind. We're finding the path. Okay

Pathfinder finders. Oh Another title I Also need to shout out some resources. I've been tapping into because the core rulebook is an intimidating because the core rule book is an intimidating 637 pages. Yeah, I'm looking at it over there. But thanks to Rise of the Rule Lords, no net ones and the Rules Lawyer YouTube channel, my foray into this thrilling system

was actually easier than I originally thought. And some of those are podcasts, right? Yes, so Rise of the Rule Lords was a podcast, no net ones and the Rules Lawyer YouTube are both YouTube channels. But I listen to them like podcasts, because I'm a woman on the go. Yes.

You're just because you're pacing. That was what I should be. Yeah, you're just at the grocery store with your laptop. Because I'm cramming for an exam on Pathfinder, and I still have to do dishes. Okay, so that's basically the preamble, are we already? I'm ready, so ready. Jacob Rweamble are we already I'm ready so ready Jacob Or it teach me Brian Murphy you call Guilton

Are you three ready to be inducted into the world of pathfinder 2e? That's fine. Your speech is really hard to my full name. I think I've never heard that come out of your mouth I will also warn you guys this is kind of a soft pitch for some one shots in the future because I really enjoy learning it and I'm so curious about a lot of the stuff. And obviously that would be dependent on if our audience will endure, or maybe even enjoy. They're gonna enjoy it.

Fuck them, we'll walk this path alone. Okay, so I'm gonna give you a little background on the system but I'm gonna keep it really light. I'm not gonna do a history lesson. Right out. I'm not gonna do a history lesson. Right on. I'm not gonna do a history lesson here. If you want a history lesson, Rise of the Rule Lords does a very good history of it.

But basically, Pathfinder was born as a reaction to the Luke Warm Reception to D&D for E. For E came out, Pathfinder said, actually we kind of missed 3.5 E, but also we have some ideas on how to improve it, and that's when Pathfinder really became its own very unique system. First edition came out in March 2008. One of the main things that the lead designer wanted to fix was that he thought the basic classes in 3.5e were lackluster and didn't incentivize staying with a single class for 20 levels. That makes sense. So this entire system was created to make character creation

and character progression more personal and more impactful. And let me tell you, freaking works. I like the sound of that. Character creation and leveling up is a fucking feast of feats. And I came hungry. Ooh, I love that, because yeah, sometimes you level up and you're like, oh, what do I get next?

And then it kinda like, 3.5 was the little bit worse. 3.5 was, there was times I leveled up as a paladin and it would literally just be an HP bump and it would be nothing. And I had to, I had to do all this custom stuff of essentially becoming a cavalier. And at that point, I was able to completely break

my character and be awesome. But that point, I was able to completely break my character and be awesome. But before that, I was just leveling up and getting nothing for a long time. So Emily, are you saying that in Pathfinder, leveling up kind of gives you the opportunity to stick with a class, but maybe get a little bit of that like, multi-classing flavor?

Yes, when I read this, I think, oh, I don't have to ever multi-class again if I play this because a lot of times ever multi-class again if I play this, because a lot of times I multi-class to capture a vibe. Yeah. In Pathfinder, you're literally getting one to two feets every single level up. Yeah, it reminds me of a little bit of like, so it's also not like choosing a feat over the ability to run.

Over the ability to run. Over the ability to run. The ability score improvements are separate. They're happening along the way. Your skill improvements are happening along the way. Oh, that's sick. It's like the ultimate custom character. So it feels like you have skill trees

in game's a little bit where it's just like you can go down different paths and make your character completely different. There's no better feeling than when you fire up a video game and you see that big tree, you see that sphere grid unfurl before you, love it. I've never seen that before before you, love it. So basically that was the intent behind one e, they make it in 2018 Pathfinder started working on second edition, which is what we're going to be talking about. And the final rule set was published in August 2019.

So this is actually kind of a recent, obviously Pathfinder has been around forever, but this edition was only finalized in 2019. Yeah, I refresh. I've never played one e but second edition the one that M has done much more research on than I have at this point, but second edition is the one I looked at and it's like very clean, like character building. It's clean and it's like internally very consistent. Yeah.

Like when I'm reading through it, and I get the thought of, oh, well, maybe I could try something else. I'm like, no, this system is made to work within itself. Totally. So after a week and a half of diving for pearls in this system, here's what I found. I've made a subjective little list of my top four favorite differences.

Ooh. You know how the number four people are drawn to? Yeah, yeah, top four. Very mystical You know, have them number four, people are drawn to. Yeah, yeah, top four. Very mystical. Letterman did them. It doesn't have the divinity of the Holy Three, nor does it have the neatness of the top five. Listen, we can all say it.

The thumb isn't a finger. We hate it. Yep. Yeah. Fuck those hot dogs who say we're thumbs are a finger. You're right. This is kind of its own little limb, really. Yeah.

The way it articulates, it's really in some of these. Yeah, it's not fun to say. Don't group it in with fingers. It's better. I love this and I wish we could keep talking about it but unfortunately I do have a couple of purports to deliver. Okay, so I've divided into four, my four favorite differences. One, character creation, a feast of feets.

Two, critical success, a feast of feats. Two, critical success is a spectrum. I actually don't know if I'm using that word right. Whoa. Number three, the three action economy, A.K.A. An action so nice, you can do it thrice. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh.

Number four, feeling partial to the marshals. Woo! Yes! I don't say I wrote just like I really drive version of it. And then last night, right before I went to bed, I'm like, let me change these titles as if I were Jay Curly. She did a Jay pass.

I did a Jay take. You got to do a Jay take. That's like an old trick that I had at school. My papers would be lackluster, but you do the binder. You do the clear cover. I spice it all up. Everybody did a transverse binder. I came the clear cover. You spice it all up. Everybody, you do the trance. We did a lot more binder.

I came in, I made some spicy headers. Okay. I hope everyone is picturing Emily like on a stage wearing a pant suit. Like doing a keynote address. I made my Ted talk. Yeah. Here's a Ted talk about an RPG system.

I haven't even played yet. You're teaching us, we know even less. I'm essentially pitching it to you guys again, to gonna get things right. Starting with number one, character creation. Okay, both creating and leveling up your character is riddled with ways to customize. Your PC is less beholden to the subclass of the class

that you choose and more to use up with feats. We've kind of talked about this. Right. The entire time you're leveling up, you're choosing feats along the way. You're never choosing between an ability score improvement and feats every level you're getting one to two, ancestry, class, and or general feats.

That is wild. Yeah, the amount of feats in this game is insane. If you go onto archives of Nethis, that's a really good resource for exploring the Pathfinder system. And if you look up feats, there's over 3,000. And also the feats aren't quite, if you're coming at it with a D&D 5E brain,

which like I am, the feats aren't exactly one-to-one with feats in D&D. It's more like the feats are what you would get in your character class stuff and everything. Like you don't get oath of the ancients. You're just like, I'm a champion. And now when I'm level one, I get to choose between these four different things.

It's like at first level, you're getting kind of skill proficiencies, weapon proficiencies, extra hit points, maybe cantrips. There's even one that you get a pet hyena at first level for your first level hyena. That's an ancestry feat for an all. That's very so rare. So cute. At middle level you start to get things like you can get quickened casting, monks get something called sleeper hold, you can get electrified armor. At the highest levels, you're getting wings, you're getting teleportation, you're getting

demons here that can attack people, you're getting the ability to turn into a cloud dragon. This is a grocery store full of options, kind of like choosing level per level, like what sort of character you want to be. That's such a good, because like, I don't know, sometimes I find like, oh, I want a multi-class so that I can add a little flavor. Or like, I wish I had like a different ability because of like how I'm feeling. And it seems like you can really kind of like

customize your character to like the mood you're in level to level. What it feels like is that Pathfinder is saying, hey, you know your character better than your subclass does. And that's pretty cool, Yeah, I like that. You had to compliment to me. Oh, finally, a book that respects me. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

I'm just making sure you're reading books and then closing on your finger and it hurting. Ow! With police, call me. What does that word mean? I guess I gotta look up an addictionary now. Ow! Covered in cuts and not knowing any of the words.

I'm going back to video games. Speaking of classes, I also wanted to shout out that there are some really cool classes that are unique to Pathfinder. On pathbuilder2e.com, they're under the expanded list. So there's 10 new classes that I, a shameless novelty junkie, have never seen before and it felt so good. The first one actually isn't that different because there is something like that in D&D, so just like, okay, fine, whatever. It was a taste. It was a taste.

Gunslinger, inventor, investigator, magus, oracle, psychic, summoner, swashbuckler, Thomaturge, and Witch. Sign me up for one of each. Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to play a game of Pathfinder and I'm going to die a lot. I know. It's so sick. Yeah, Summoner is like, it's basically you get this little, almost like a familiar that

you fight with in battle. They're called like an idol on or something. But obviously you can call them whenever you want. So that is like very final fantasy summoner style. Yeah, it's awesome. Oracle also sounds like very intense. Like that's, you could eventually like predict the future, isn't that? Yeah, Oracle was one of the ones that I looked at

that I was like, I'm desperate to play this. It's basically like a cleric adjacent charisma caster who is cursed and you derive your power from the mystery of things like time and love and flame and bones. Oh, yeah. Bones? Yeah, I wanna be a thug of bones or something.

One of those is a little more conscious than the other ones. I'd love to contemplate the nature of time and also bones. And bones. Those are all like separate, like a separate. I just want to be a character that stares off pens and thinking about bones. Teacher, I'm ready. Tell me what are bones. I also really like the Thometerge, which is a martial class that's obsessed with the collection of esoteric and mystic implements.

What? So it's like a very heavy arcane, esoteric flavored like martial arts. So they're like an arcane and teaker? Yeah, that's right. I am from my impression, yeah. Just going to like, Curio shops. Yeah. Just like getting as many monkey pauses as they can get their hands on.

Amazing. Love it. We're going to get into more of the nitty gritty of character creation minus archetype, which is something that's a whole other way to get more shit for your character that I haven't looked into yet. Yeah. But we're going to do that probably for the Patreon. I had you guys each write little paragraphs of hypothetical characters you wanted to play,

but let's move on. Yeah, hatred.com slash an ad pod, by the way. Yeah, that's the end of the, that's the end of the, that's the end of the, thank you. Okay, number two on Emily's list of top four favorite things. Top four faith. We've got critical success drum, AKA success is a spectrum, AKA let's get critical, AKA degrees are the bees, bees.

Very good. Oh, that's me doing a Jake impression. Let's go. All equally good. We gotta collapse sometime. This is really good stuff. So critical success works differently in Pathfinder. That does.

And D&D, I know it's scary. I hear you shouting, I felt that way for you. Do you use the 20 side to die? You use the 20 side to die, right? Yes, Jakey. You use a 40 side to die. What? Thank God.

I'm using the animal bones. You use triple disadvantage, but also advantage. Every role is a coin flip. Yeah, no. Pathfinder. Okay, I'm calling my lift. Thanks, guys. This was fun. Can I take this cheese?

Yeah, we got it. It's a simple 17-sided die. You too can learn how to create. Okay, these are all jokes. Yeah, these are all jokes. You're talking about an actual system. But success in Pathfinder isn't a pass-fail binary. Like it is in D&D. It's not like, here's's the DC the DC is 15. If you get 15 or higher you succeed. If you get 15 or lower you fail

You can critically succeed regular succeed fail or critically fail. So if you roll 10 points or more higher than a DC it's a critical success So you don't have to roll in at 20 if the DC is 15 and you roll at 25 10 points or more, higher than a DC, it's a critical success. So you don't have to roll in at 20. If the DC is 15 and you roll at 25, that's a critical success. If you roll 10 points or more, lower than a DC, it's a critical failure.

So how does this play out? Okay, this might sound like a lot right now. Let's just use a basic spell with a standard saving throw like burning hands. Okay. I'm actually gonna throw to you. Would you please roleplay me the climactic scene of a bad guy using a first level

burning hands on an adventuring party? Yeah, you got it. You guys came into a tavern and you became fast friends. You'll never be able to defeat me. I'm a living snowman and I'm here to save the world. And I'm his carrot nose and you're not gonna, you're not gonna do anything to hurt us. You think that, but a snowman killed my father and I'm here to take revenge on all snowmen. Oh shit!

Yeah, that's right. It's me, John. Oh dude, it's John! The council, the council fought against the decision to kill your father I'm the mage John and I remember everything did to the human do snow hand pieces we regret that decision it weighs on our icy hearts I cast score he's on to his run frosty I can't have a leak up you right it change your name I cast burning hands on Frosty John okay, okay to first off I just want to say that like if that if that role-play scene you guys just watch I get you into pathfinder. I don't know well Because actually that is all from the path under Laura. I'm getting

So let's say the DC is 15, everyone rolls their save. A 25 or higher is a critical success, which means you take no damage from the burning hands. Yeah. Which is pretty great, because how many times have you crit on a save, on a scale, and you still take half,

like a fireball. What a waste of a crit. Yeah. Yeah. If you pass, in D&D, if you pass on like a fireball deck save, then you would still take half, even if you crit or something like that.

In this case, you can have a critical success where you take none, or you get a regular success, which is you take half, right? So if you get a regular success, so basically 25 or higher, critical success, you take no damage from Mage, Johns, Burning Hands. 15 to 24 is a regular success. You take half of 2D6, which is what the Burnet hands spell is.

6 to 14 is a regular fail, and you take the 2D6 damage. 5 or lower is a critical failure, and a critical failure on saving throws against spells means you take double damage. So you take 4D6. Now this goes for you as well as the monsters that are fighting you. What do you guys think of this? Well, I do have one question. Would Frosty be rolling with advantage

because he's with his carrot nose familiar? We are gonna actually have to talk about advantage. Yeah, there is a no. It basically lets you crit on spells, right? Like it's stuff with saves, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Like if someone you're casting a spell on, yes.

Critically fails their save. That's the equivalent of you critting on a spell. Exactly, exactly. That's tight. It's really tight. And does that count for attacks as well? If you're just doing a melee attack

and you're like, I rolled a 32. And somebody's AC is like 18, then crit. If you beat their AC by 10 or more, that's a critical no matter what you rolled on the die. Wow. However, I can't speak to what happens if you critically fail on attacking someone. There might be a consequence,

but I haven't looked into it yet. Interesting. And if you still roll in at 20, that still counts as a critical success. So that is a thing that I have not looked into yet. And I was gonna throw to you that, because I feel like maybe a lot of parties will be like, hey, we have an instinctual gutter old choice.

Yeah, that's right. I'm just wanting and seeing the one. I don't know if someone who plays, the Pathfinder system is so cohesive within itself that I would be cautious to change too much, but it's something that going into it, I would probably look in and be like, hey, is this some, can we keep the nat 20 and the nat one as crit? Yeah. Yeah. Or will that just. We're followers

of dice. Yeah. It was. Christ is. It has told you that you create a system agnostic. I would, I would hope. I believe that a $20 bill has more value than a 50 because of the 20 on it. Yeah. This is, um, you gave me all your cash. Yeah. And then I also have a out of combat example. There's a lot more actions in general that we're going to talk about in the, uh, three action economy section, but there's a thing called treat wounds. If you have a healer's tools and you spend 10 minutes treating an injured person, you can do a medicine check.

That's right. You can just do a medicine check to heal someone rather than potion or spell. So it's really nice. So like anybody can do a medicine check and heal someone? If you have healers tools, you might also need to be trained in medicine. Right. To make it worthwhile. That's great though. That seems like it feeds into the martial thing you were saving for us.

Yes. I believe agenda item four. Yes, I think that Pathfinder in general does a great, great job giving you non-magical tools and ways to interact with the world so that you're not just always being like, well, I'm a barbarian and there's nothing I can do in a social encounter. Okay, so if you were to do treat wounds, you do a medicine check and on a critical success, the injured person regains 4D8 hit points. On a regular success, 2D8, on a regular failure, nothing happens, on a critical failure,

the target takes one D8 damage. Just like your old malpractice. Yeah, truth, I mean, it happens. Yeah, it's what happens. And just like accidentally shoving your finger into someone's whoosh. I was gonna, like, dropping somebody that you're carrying. Yeah, you had to bring it into an extremely visceral way. Yeah, I'm like, maybe I'm like, that is not choking.

Yeah. You accidentally spill your coffee on the wound while you're working. Yeah, I think that's it. See, everything that we're saying right now, it's why the sort of degrees of success feel so fun for roleplay. Yeah. It really gives you an idea of what way they fail.

I will say I was inherently skeptical of it. I know. So it was like, this is a lot of math to do during every step. But I feel like once you kind of like have it internalized in your brain, it really does open up the possibilities. The system also does a really good job making DCs really clear for you. For example, we'll talk about it later, but there's a thing you can do in battle with one of your actions, which is called recall knowledge. You can basically look at a monster and try and do a recall knowledge check to try to remember like a weakness of theirs.

And every single monster comes with a recall knowledge DC. Every single monster that I looked at on archives of nethe. So depending on how rare they are and stuff like that So if you're a DM you don't have to make that DC. It's right there for you Mm-hmm, and so like there every monster does have kind of like a built-in like weakness that you can exploit a little bit They do do a good job giving things weaknesses and Immunities and I so I think I would I would have to look at it more again I was really trying to do a general overview, but it is like you can basically use the recall knowledge.

And if you critically succeed, you get like a weakness and like maybe what there one other piece of information about them. If you succeed, you get one piece of information. I think if you critically fail, you get something false. Oh, I love that. I like the idea of playing a new game and just being a little dumb again.

Like just not knowing all of the ins and outs. Yeah. Because we've all, well, most of us, we've all either DM'd or bailiff at this point. So we'll go so very bailiff with that. So much of never bailiff. That's true. Each of us has our own skill set.

The burden of bail. Only Jake and I know. But you just like kind of get exposed to so much of like the inherent knowledge and like to go in like fresh with fresh eyes and fresh brain. It's been a really fun system to look into. Yeah, it's cool. I think especially when somebody,

it happens a lot to us where it'll be like, I, that's a 29 to hit or something like that. And that shouldn't feel special. There is, it is a double-edged sword, right? Because it does kind of take away from the simplicity of just like, you crit and you do double damage, like you roll the net 20. That's a very fun, just everybody jumps up and is excited. But I do like, on the other hand, being like, you know, I got a 30 to hit.

That actually meaning something is cool. It's those moments when someone so exceed something that you're like, damn, I feel like I should reward that. Yeah. Yeah. It's built into that. Yeah. It's like a 30 persuasion check to like, you know, get somebody to give you a peanut. That should be a mask. Give you their house. They're fucking taking you on a tour of the farm. This turns into Balnor and joins the party. Yeah. To give me carders on your party, no. Okay.

My only concern is ever doing something to upset Dicecrest. Yeah. So as long as you're feeling like there's still space for the Nat 20. The Nat 20 and that one. I do like the window of like critical succeeding, critically. Yeah.

And as you look through the book, it's like a ton of spells and actions you can take, spell out what happens and critical successes and critical failures. So it's baked into the game. Yeah. It also does, it feels like it's rewarding for your character built to. If you build someone to be optimized at climbing something or investigating something, and you're consistently getting 10 over a DC, you want to be like, damn, you are kicking us every single time.

It's true. This really feels like when you go to your friends house for a sleepover and then like you go to church with them on Sunday and they go to a different church than you and it's just like, I know exactly what to talk about. You're real, yeah. I know what you're talking about, yeah.

Somebody who looks at a guitar and you're like, wait a minute, is this allowed? We're having a little fun at church. It's not gonna happen to be a bad guy. Okay, so Cobalt-Anner is saying that Pathfinder is when the guitar comes out at church. Wow. I have distinct memories of going to church with friends after sleepovers. God, why? So moving on to the piece de restance, I think I...

It's actually a piece that was a stonk. Piece de restance of the system, the three action economy. BK, three to be me! Three, do what I want! to be me. So the three action economy that's right pathfinder is done with action bonus action. You have not won but three actions and a reaction per turn in combat. I have to tell you don't get too excited. There are some caveats for what you're thinking right now. Okay, but let's focus on what it is designed to do before we bring those up. Yeah, Jake, calm the fuck down.

You're sitting down, dude. Bro, I want to hold my was pacing. I see. Anyone who's sitting there being like great, I can look at three times. I totally understand where your heart is at. I love that. I respect that.

We love that for you. I love that, but that's not what the system is designed to do, and we'll get to that. It's fair. Because, let's be honest, a lot of D&D combat is just hitting and getting hit, right? It's definitely fun. There's no shade.

We loved a bang. But it, we loved a bang. We love the stand-up bang. We love the stand-up bang. We love playing, love the bang. But it, love killing lizards. What can I say? But it does put pressure on the DM

and even the players to go out of their way to make fights memorable when the mechanics are repetitive and to roleplay when the mechanics don't even reward it, right? Right, woo. Like a lot of times you're like, well I'm gonna say something mean to him and you just do it. Right.

It's maybe your DM says, I guess give me an intimidate check, but often they don't. Right. And that would take, if you were going by rules as written, that would probably, it would take an action to do a check, usually.

Exactly. For example, a lot of times new players are actually more creative than the rules even support. Like they might be like, oh, I'm in my very first fight with my very first D&D game. This guy swinging a huge accent me. Can I just disarm him? Right.

D&D, the answer is usually like, yeah, I think you, yeah, you can. If you fail, there's your turn and that will suck. In Pathfinder, however, the answer is yes, there are clear parameters of success and consequences, and if you fail, you still have two actions left. Oh! So, for example, disarming becomes its own action in battle.

That's really cool. Yeah, so normally in 5e, it can be a little complicated in that, like, you can disarm somebody, but then you're like, okay, so then what happens? Do you, you can then maybe use a free action to grab the axe, and then you guys are just like, going back and forth, and that gets a little dirty. And in Pathfinder, it's very nice, because it's not as, you know, powerful as just like,

knocking a weapon out of somebody's hand, but it's nice to just have those parameters of just being like, you've succeeded, they get a minus out of somebody's hand, but it's nice to just have those parameters of just being like, you succeeded, they get a minus two to their attack now, because their grip is on the side. Oh! And, in general, Pathfinder's their action economy is filled with really cool, skill-based actions that change up the battlefield and can even

be an opportunity for a roleplay in some battle. So there's a lot of strategic combat actions, like trip, grapple, faint, which have mechanical implications, but there are also really fun things like demoralize recall knowledge, which we talked about or Create a diversion that can actually be role played and then you roll for it at the end and it has an actual consequence, right? you roll for it at the end and it has an actual consequence. Right. That's awesome.

So like, yes, it's fun to hit someone with a sword a bunch, but it's equally fun to use recall knowledge to learn the weakness of a succubus. Demoralize said succubus with your knowledge of their weakness and then for your third action, take out your cold iron sword which you know they are weak to and handily skewer that succubus. Yeah. That's sick. Oh, so say you're like battling a crocodile outside of a sunken keep or something like that. Uh-huh.

Never gonna be like, yeah. And the crocodile opens its mouth and like for your first action you want to like break a javelin and shove it inside the crocodile's mouth. So that'd be classified as one of these? I think the move that you're talking about is going gonna really come alive and a system like that. I would have known how to deal with Gautel Tanner for the first time. There's literally an action that's called force open. So you can use an action to force open and then interact with an object and put the javelin in the mouth.

Oh, she's an idiot. She's in built for shenanigans. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, from what I can tell the system is designed to make combat more dynamic and put more tools in your kits and even kind of weaponize your skills, which feels like the most fun part of it. So if I'm emphasizing that, it might just be because that's what speaks to me the most.

Both in and out of combat, Pathfinder seems to reward the skills that you invest in more. And I just think that's fun personally. Like you could- It's instinctual as when you start playing. I remember this when I started playing D&D too. You'd be like, okay, I want to stop on this guy's foot. And I want to say, I don't know,

create a distraction or something. That's not necessarily something you can do. You just have to make your move and commit to it. So I don't think we created distraction or something. Yeah, right. That's not necessarily something you can do. You just have to make your move and commit to it. So, I don't think we even talked about it. Demoralize is like a really powerful thing that you basically can be like, you don't want this fucking fight. And you can do that as an action,

roll an intimidation against their will save, and basically give them levels of fear. Well, right. And if you fail that and they're gonna fight you anyway, you still have actions to prepare. You still have two actions, exactly. Yeah, that's great. So it's nice, because yeah, you have to often make a choice

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Okay, that's it for me, go team pants, and enjoy the show. Yeah. So everybody has the space to try something out. Yeah. I like that There are also there are also love like you you mentioned it briefly that there's like levels of fear and things like that I haven't looked into this enough, but I know that I saw things with like stun one stun two And this is a this is a thing that we've constantly been talking about in d&d is like Stunning is too powerful and like a lot of

our D&D court case submissions are like, they stunned my bad guy and I couldn't do anything. Yeah. And with this, I think what they do with a lot of these conditions is they give them level. So the conditions get worse as you go. So essentially, it's good. So it almost lets you start to sun, yeah, sun, which seems cool. Yeah, that's, it's very cool.

I'm starting to see why the book is 600 pages. Well, actually the crazy thing is the book is 600 pages, but as I believe the rules lawyer, their YouTube channel pointed out, the section about playing the game is really only like 40 pages or something. Oh, that's tiny. Yeah, it's got a lot of options and things like that.

Like, there's a ton of spells, which I haven't even looked into yet. That's great. But I also think that like this combat system seems to also let you, I feel like from reading it, you could just go full charisma, put everything into intimidation, deception, and performance, literally never lift a weapon in battle and still contribute to the battle. Just go full little stinker. Or just go fully hot, right? Yeah, oh! Like literally you could be mechanically rewarded

for being hot in battle. Finally. Wow, that's fucking dream. Little stinker or a little steamer. You have options here. Okay, so what are people thinking about this significant expansion of your toolkit in battle? Does Pathfinder feel like you need more of a map or is it translate to theater the mind as well?

Truthfully, I do wonder how it will translate to theater of the mind. Yeah. I think you would just end up finding out which actions felt more impactful in theater of the mind. Right, yeah. There's certainly like abilities and like classes I would never take because like they don't feel good for theater of the mind. Right, yeah. There's certainly like abilities and like classes I would never take because like they don't feel good for theater of the mind. So yeah, I think it probably just like figuring out the play style that works for you. Because I think I think things like demoralized

created aversion, there's something called bond mod where you like basically just like say equip at someone. That's like a feat you can take. You just like say equip at someone and it like and they're like, yeah. And it's so like stuff like that actually does lend itself to theater the mind more. So I think I could see there being

pluses and minuses. And like on my, so on my character sheet, would I have like a will save too and a bad guy could demoralize me? Yes, yes, you absolutely can. And that's why, and I think that they will do that too. Because as I was looking through, there are things that like help buff you

against being frightened, buff you against being talked down to. Yeah, the pendulum swings both ways. Like, you can do, but there's definitely more shit that can happen to you that you have to like, which I think that that part excites me, because you're really trying to like optimize your character knowing all of this shit that can happen. Yeah I am so glad to hear that you're excited and I really want you to hang on to that excitement because we are later going to talk about

the multi-attack penalty Oh, and why at first it's horrifying, but if you like the system as much as I do you're just hoping you can learn to a lot of it. Okay, but first, let's wrap up. Like you're trying to sell us a condo. I'm trying to give you, like, I think it's probably gonna be the biggest hurdle for a lot of people getting into the system. I have, after my top four, my four faves, I have a list of like three kind of like these are the tougher pills. These are the things you're yeah. These are the things that you're if you're thinking about changing your party is going to be like, but what about yeah, right?

That you're going to kind of like go in knowing. And it's just a different it's a different game. I think I get we're coming at this with D&D brain and I think a lot of other people, you know, if you're making the switch or if you're playing both, will as well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I think that there is like, some of the stuff is a hurdle because you just have to unlearn D&D

and then some of the stuff is maybe loosening your power gamer grip on D&D, exploring maybe a more narratively satisfying, maybe slightly less easy to power game system. Although it seems like there are opportunities to power game here certainly. I would say that there's opportunities, like if you want to just bang due damage,

I'm sure there are builds for that, but it feels like in combat, the things that are rewarded are teamwork, more than an individual standing there and doing a ton of damage. That's lovely. I like to do that. But yeah, okay.

So let's wrap up my fave four. Number four, cast aside the castors. We're feeling partial to the Marshall. Oh, that's my jake take. Yeah, exactly. It's almost jarring to come back to a jake take. So I have been lurking. This actually is a blending of a fave and a caveat.

I've been lurking on some feedback. A caveat. That definitely sounds like a fancy car. That's my bond mod. What do I get advantage now? Sorry, I've been lurking on some feedback and this one is quite literally a double edged sword. The general consensus I have read is that caster classes are less powerful to play in Pathfinder 2e.

I've read quite a few crestfallen castors who felt that resource management of two few spells meant that the most economical thing to do was to just kind of buff. And like, you know, we love to buff, but we also love to blast, right? Yeah. So maybe a little better for both thing than blasting. Yeah, maybe buffing is shining more than blasting. Maybe there's built, like obviously there's there's also so many options with Pathfinder that I'm sure that you can make options that blast. But if you're just going in and making a standard caster, you might find yourself buffing.

Right. And it's kind of it's inevitable in most games. Like at some point, a wizard can just like talk to gods and stuff or just, you know, just divine something into existence. Yeah. And the fighter or the melee class is just like, you can attack one more time. But that's great. What I've read is that they've kind of chilled out the casters in a way and expanded the toolkit of the marshals in a way. So that level 20 doesn't feel like, oh, the casters are the ones of God and the other ones of the marshals in a way, so that level 20 doesn't feel like, oh, the castors are powerful. The ones of God and the other ones of good fighters.

It's like they're both good at their stuff. So, I can go to other planets. I do 3D12. Yeah, I'm never gonna die. But with the sort of feet system, you do end up getting access to a lot of magical stuff if you want it. Sounds like there's a lot more Hercules and a lot less Zeus as opposed to there being

Zeus and regular humans. I don't know. This metaphor isn't working. But you know what I mean? You know what I mean? Um, so obviously like reading this was tough for me because I really like to cast and blast. Yeah.

Yeah. And a magical little person. But you were a Crestfallen caster that day. Yeah. I was, I was Crestfallen reading these other Crestfallen casters, but I thought about it. And Pathfinder, like I said before, it kind of reminds me of Star Wars 5E,

and that it's like really deeply lovingly attentive to- Yeah, because you played a melee character and we played Star Wars 5E. Yeah. What about for like half casters though? Like for a paladin or like even like an elder Schneider something like that. Does that exist? I don't know.

Again? Yes, it's Sumter. Fuck yes. Well, there's like, there's no paladin, instead of paladin, it's champion. But I don't know. I haven't looked into the champion to know if they, how magical they are. Like, for example, Rangers are half casters or quarter casters in D&D. Rangers don't have spells in Pathfinder. So I can't say what's going on with the champion slash Paladin.

But they have more tools in their kit in and out of battle. So like before I was kind of talking about a barbarian, in Pathfinder, you can pretty easily make a barbarian with good intimidation, because you are frequently training skills and your proficiency is tied to your level. So if you decide to be trained in something which is their way of saying proficient,

you're getting proficiency boosts every time you level up. So it doesn't go with? Ooh. Okay. Does it also go with the stat as well? Like would intimidation also go with charisma? Yes, but if you have a minus one to charisma, but then you train it, then as you go, that minus one doesn't hurt as much.

God, gotcha. So Pathfinder has out of combat actions you can do with sort of the degrees of success. So for example, there's something called coerce in which you spend a minute with someone trying to talk them into doing something. Let's say we're dealing the name of the boss they're working for or leaving the back door

to the thieves guild unlocked when they close up at night and at the end you roll your intimidation against their will save. If you critically succeed, they do what you're asking, as long as it doesn't harm them, and they won't try to get back at you right away. Whoa. Oh, that's really cool that they have, that they actually give you kind of how to DM these moments. Exactly.

Exactly. Man, that's helpful. Yeah, it seems like this is like Taylor made to have like less narrative breaking moments. Like, everything kind of supports the narrative a little more. Yeah, and I've read a lot of DMs saying that they think Pathfinder is easier because there is so much to borrow the phrase of the rules lawyer, rules support. I like that.

Um, so I think that that to me makes it feel like Marshalls have all this huge impact outside of combat too. Yeah, I think it's awesome. I think that's kind of the beauty of both systems, right? Is that I think that something like the three-action economy, when you're looking at it isn't as clean as just being like, here's your movement, here's your action, here's your bonus action.

So the one is better to kind of pick up and learn. And then I think once you're familiar with systems and familiar with like TTRPGs, then something like the three-action economy, you're like, oh, this kind of has more to it. Like there's more I can do here now that I know what I'm doing and now that I've experienced in things like this. And again, I'm suggesting this as someone who's never played,

but this is what I would do for my first game is like put out a little list of the different actions you wanna focus on. You don't even need to put all of them out there yet, right? Just put out a little list so that your players at the table have a little list to be like, it's my turn, I have three actions. What do I wanna do? Oh, there's the little list.

Yeah. You know, like maybe you have that out for a couple times and then people start finding out which ones they like doing the most. Yeah, like a card you'd get for a couple times and then people start finding out which ones they like doing the most. Yeah, like a card you'd get in a board game or something that just says like the rules to get people used to like the new actions and things like that.

Yeah, yeah. Put it next to the chips. Yeah, okay. So I think now it's time to, I kinda already talked about, this time I just saw all of some tough pedals. Okay. Before we do that, I did have one question.

Yeah. Which was about stats? Because it seems like stats are a little different. They're a little different in terms of, well, your ability scores are the same as D&D, but your saves, you only have three, reflex, fortitude, and will. Oh, okay.

So, and I can't give you too much context for how those are calculated, because that's just not one of the things I've been saying. It's pretty intuitive. Yeah, it's pretty intuitive. It seems nice, right? It's essentially combining them down. It's normally there are like six stats

so it's combining each one down by two. Yeah. To be fair, I've never really understood charisma saves. I get them for like a persuasion maybe, but getting banished because you failed a charisma save makes no sense to me. Yeah. And actually, it's a really good point. Yeah. You're just not very likable serving to be banished because you feel the charisma save makes no sense to me. Yeah, actually is a really good point.

Yeah, you're just not very likeable serving to be banished. You're not hot enough. He gone. To ugly hell. Okay, any other questions before we go swallow some tough pills? I'm down to swallow some tough pills. I'm ready for my medicine. They're tough, side ways pills.

Okay. So are you talked about the castors? Yeah. I'm ready for my metasol. My girl is wide open. My girl is wide open. Okay. So are you talked about the castors? Yeah. Advantage. Okay. Is everyone? I can handle it.

Everyone relaxes your throat muscles. What the fuck's happening to advantage? Wait a second. So. What the fuck is happening to advantage? So I get the impression. Again, maybe someone will say, Emily, you dunce. Pathfinder's lousy with advantage.

I got the impression from what I read that advantage is way less common. For example, if you wanna give someone the help action, that's called aiding someone. And you basically just give them a plus one or a plus two if you crit, and you might even subtract one if you're

like little skill check to help. Oh, so it's more like like bless. I don't know that there's like a good D&D equivalent for it. It's basically just like eight is something you can do in battle, less one of your actions, but it is less, it is not giving someone to help action. Right. Are DCs like generally lower like to the point where a plus one or plus two would help at all? The thing is that skills are way higher. So since your proficiency is your level, it means that your skills are going up every single level and you're training them to be trained to then expert. If you're level 10 and you're trained in something, you're 10 plus whatever the modifier

is. So the idea is like if you're building a character efficiently, you shouldn't need advantage on stuff because you're... I think that is what it is. That is the impression that I get. It seems to me that the system is less dependent on roles than 5 years, which is like, both... Again, there's room for both systems.

I think the one is a lot simpler. And I think it's also cool to just be like, no, you build your character for a particular thing. And thus you should succeed more if you're good at that. Yes. And stuff like help actions are, it's exciting because you get that gamut of like maybe a roll of one and a not 20. But at the same time, it is like kind of wildly consistent.

Yeah. And then on the other side, it's just like you're gonna get a little bit more consistency. You might not get those highs and lows, but your character does what they're built to do. Yeah. It's cool. There also is something built into Pathfinder

called Hero Points that allows you to reroll something. So the idea is that you start every session with one hero point and you can be given them by your GM during the game, almost like inspiration. From what I've read, GMs are encouraged to give out about one per hour. So these hero points are a part of the game for Pathfinder.

Like Gold Stars. It's like Gold Stars, well that's what when I read it, I was like, I don't really like the name hero points. Yeah. But I was like, oh, but it actually is a really fun system to heal or to specific characters. If, if Merv is playing a paladin, then it's like, oh, your god shines on you. It's like, you almost happened to your gods. You don't have to use the word hero point. Unless you like the word hero point,

in which case, fucking round, no, I love that for you. They're actually, D&D has in the alternative rules, because remember in campaign one, we did healing search and things like that. They do have something like hero points, and there is something cool about that. And there's inspiration, right? Which is apparently a D&D thing that we just don't use.

Yeah, it's true. But it is cool, because it is like, your players are special, right? Like they are kind of, you know, they're airborne in Lord of the Rings. And air-gorns roll in hero points all the time. Like, he's got a lot armor.

What do you talk to that ghost army? He burned through two hero points. Oh, yeah. See you. The rest of us party is jealous. I can get into this as long as I'm fetesteddy diet of hero points. Yes.

That's what I'm thinking is that, like, I think that advantage is going to be less frequent, but I think it might be more special. Yeah. And you pitch this as a bitter pill, but you've given us like a big bowl of honey to dip the pizza too. I really tried to, I really tried to sugarcoat these stuff. It's sliding down my throat so easy. So Jake, do you think you could be open to it?

Like let's say you sat down for a session, you would start with one that you could choose to use anytime, and you would probably throughout the session get another one. So you'd basically have, it's almost like getting a lot of points, really. Yeah, it is, it's a lot of play. The pill wasn't going down easy at first, but now that I know about the point, I heard you go silent, I heard me lose you.

Yeah. I was texting you on the side. I was like, Jake, you know, met D&D in high school. They got together. They've been together ever since. It would be like cheating if you left D&D at this point. I know. I know. It is truly the basis for all of Jake's like gaming knowledge,

because even when we were talking about video game skills chase before, Jake's like never seen it before. So this is, Erie Gorin had hero points and I was back then. Yeah. knowledge because even when we were talking about video game skills before, Jake's like never seen it before. So this is Errorgorn had hero points and I was back. All comes back to Errorgorn. Yeah. And look, it's possible someone would say actually we use advantage a lot. I could be wrong when I read it. The system feels like because especially if you're like at level 10 rolling like

plus 15 to certain or like plus 12, then you don't really need a hand. It would appear to me as an outsider that it's a system more built for consistency and 5E's built for simplicity. Oh my goodness. Both are great cities to be with this job. I heard that, that was good. Bond-Mott action right there.

Okay, so let's end this with the biggest toughest pill. Oh, it's so big, Emily. Jake, I'm looking at you. It's spiked. Jake, I'm cool with all of this. And you did a Jake and Emily thing. They love the big crits. Oh no, I'm cool with all of this.

I'm just aware that you could have an instinctual but advantage is how I've gotten by. Yeah, yeah. Okay, the multi-attack penalty. Let's talk about it. Penalty. Yeah, I know. We got a picky eater over here.

Basically, you have three actions each turn, right? We love that. We were richer with actions. But if you were to attack or strike, which is what they call it, each action. The second time you attack, you would have a minus five to hit, and the third time you attack, you would have a minus 10 to hit. That makes sense. But you can still try and hit three times. Yeah. You can if you want, but... No, I think gut reaction for me, I think I'm totally quelled by the fact that I have more, I can do more creative stuff with my turn.

That was awesome. Jake, you are smart. It's a penalty for being like boring. Yeah, totally. It's not, that's what you have to do to be strategic and D&D. There's not really other stuff that you can do. So I play those characters and I like to hit three times. I'll admit that I live with this. Okay, and this is validating for me because I literally structured this entire little book report

I've given so that we would end with... To get Jake with OK. To try and make the multi-penalty attack hurt the leaves. Everyone get this big boy around of a plaza. He swallowed that pill all by himself. Yay! He's so proud of you. He had a vitamin. So yes, you're right.

I really think that if you looked at like, why is it in there, maybe the idea is it's hard to swing it that many times? That's to me makes sense. Yeah, stamina. But if you look at it from a gameplay perspective, it's encouraging you to play interesting, not just hands. Yeah, but also, I think it occurs to get you enough to do

than it is worth attacking three times. And also, the game's a little bit different, right? So you're not gonna to do, then it is worth attacking three times. And also the other shit to do. The games are built different, right? So you're not gonna, if players are doing less damage, if they're attacking less, the monsters are gonna have less HP. It's just the game is built different. Also, I think that when I read this,

it's like when you play 5e, because there are less ways to interact with a bad guy, you kind of gotta kill him every time. In this, it feels like there are fights that just end with you disarming and demoralizing a guy. Yeah, like you're threatening your like getting there. You're a mechanics for Chesswick. That's cool.

Yeah, let's, let's, let's, clanging and banging more shaming and, uh, aiming and shaming. Yeah, aiming and shaming. Or even distracting or you can like, like, there's a feat that's like, fascinating performance that you basically, like, start to do a performance. I get like a kind of incapacitate someone by fascinating them. Yeah, they're seeing. But there are weapons and stuff.

Isn't there something called like the swift attribute that like lets you attack more without penalties? There are certain classes that reduce the multi-attack penalty. There are certain feats that reduce the multi-attack penalty. There are certain feats that reduce the multi-attack penalty. And then there are weapons that have the trade agile, which reduce the multi-attack penalty. I don't know if you can ever fully reduce it. But I think it might still remain in some capacity. Maybe there's a way to fully negate it, but that probably wouldn't be a tollway higher

level. But it does seem like if you just want to stand there and slash you can optimize your character to be able to do that. Yeah. God, this thing is balanced. This message is like bubble gum to me. Yeah. Yeah. This is validating. Okay, great. So let's start to wrap this up and then we'll go over and do our character creation. Rapping it up, I do feel like I should mention that Pathfinder also has its own world and lore and gods. So if you're someone who loves to take a system that has really cool lore, it's called Galorian people. I've only scratched the surface in it, but the pictures of maps of it look awesome.

I have also, I also haven't gone into any of the spells yet. This 637 page tome there's a big chunk that's just spells and a lot of them are different than I've seen before. I just haven't had a chance to dive into those yet. But I have also read that for DMs who prefer to kind of home brew a lot of anecdotal evidence that it is easier to home brew and pathfinder. Wow. I would think there's more systems in place. I think so. I don't know why.

I just saw multiple GMs say I switched over and what I noticed is it's easier to home brew. Yeah. So I hope that this has been interesting. And if you're someone who has been thinking of experimenting with it, I believe it is slightly more complex than D&D I will say that but again, I think a lot of it is deceptively so I think the three-action economy is different But you will get the hang of it quicker than you originally think you could even kind of go video game

Tutorial mode and slowly introduce these actions to your party slowly introduce these actions to your party. Get a whiteboard. Yeah. When we did 3.5 with Brennan, he would literally level up for us. So that's what I was going to say. I actually think that although the part of this I'm drawn to the most is character creation, I think that it is the more complex thing. But when me and Merff played 3.5, literally we played it for a couple years.

I didn't learn a thing about that system because our DM would just be like, you're leveling up. He wouldn't be like, here's all the feats you can choose from. He would be like, do you want to cast spells when you're in wild shape? Yeah, I want to do that. Okay, you're going to take natural spells. I will say though, 3.5 was more complicated than this. Yeah, definitely. Pathfinder 2E definitely stream lines a lot of stuff. And it's like a good balance. This seems perfect because for me, tabletop is an excuse to hang out with my friends. And if you're giving me an excuse on top of that, which is like little DM private sessions

where you discuss like what you're gonna do with your character next. Yeah. Wow. I think it was less about the system and it was the game had been out for so many years that there were so many supplemental books. You know what? It was also really difficult to find stuff online. Where there are a ton of online resources for Pathfinder specifically if you're curious. Like I said, this pathbuilder2e.com character creation website.

Obviously, change is always a little scary. At first when I got onto it, I was like, I'll never understand it. Within five minutes, I was like, okay, I'm getting it. Yeah. Nice. Yeah. So that was a really great way to start to explore the ancestries and heritages and classes and feats. And also, archive of nethys has just everything out there for free. Yeah.

We just walk into the archive of nethys. We don't need to like pass a trial. You do have to pass a trial, yeah. Okay, cool. I did notice that one of your hands was synced. Yeah, you had to fight a snowman. You got a synced with cool. Yeah, it was synced with the burning hand.

I saw someone to take out the snowman that killed my dad. Who goes there? So we're gonna actually look more at character creation on the short rest. Should we tease our characters? Yeah, why don't you, do you guys wanna read, I had you all write a paragraph? Do you want to read the paragraphs or do you want to just tease them with the name? Ooh, I think let's read our paragraph. Read the paragraph, so guys do it.

I'll get you pulled up. Okay, I got mine. Skarl, Cinderkeg. Skarl is a char-hide goblin gunslinger. He makes up for his lack of size with his ferocity and love of explosives. A virtuoso of crude inventions. Skarl is just as likely to exacerbate a problem as solvent. His fighting style requires juggling several lit fuses,

life or death calculations, and defawking the giant welder's goggles that take up half his face. He would be a genius if he sat down. It took his time, but he's quite literally a running powder keg. Yeah. I was really excited about this because when I first started doing my research,

I went into Merf's room and I said, Merf, I need to play a goblin. I love the pathfinder goblin. I love goblin. Goblin's a good, gob is good. Goblin? Wilmer Honeybucket, Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good.

Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good.

Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good.

Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Goblin's good. Three Gators Easy, but he's also rarely seen without a bundle of rope and his trusty hunting knife. When it comes to monster hunting, Wilmer generally prefers to practice catch and release, but a lifetime in the woods has taught him that survival comes first, and as such, he's not afraid to get his hands dirtier than they already are, Wilmer does not own soap. We love it! Still, despite his profession, Wilmer has a love for all animals big and small, but especially

the big ones, his dream is to onemer has a love for all animals big and small, but especially the big ones. His dream is to one day own a dog bigger than himself. I love it. Okay. And now Jake. Yes. Cask Nygarde is an artist from the North Country. He sings.

He writes poetry, and he does Jackson Pollock style splatter paint on his quaint cabin. But he's super intense about it. He thinks all the beauty of the world is urgent and inspiration should be punching you in the face every day. He's super zealous when every talks about his creative process to friends and strangers. Don't you get it? It's all fleeting. We have to take in every drop well we can. Oh man. God. Nothing gets cask more amped than talking about art, but nothing pisses him off more than people who would harm the very thing he draws inspiration from.

Perhaps more meaningful than creating beauty in this world is killing those who hope to destroy it. So these were the prompts I was given, and I will walk them through how I tried to bring their wonderful little men to life. And yeah, I also want to point out that Coglow had sent me like four different ones. And one of them was a painter.

And I was like, oh, Coglow, jacarity chose a painter. So I think we can't do this one. And he was like, what the fuck? That's kind of my big man. That's kind of my pain, dude. You don't really get art, dude. My guy loves to draw. You don't really. So anyway,'re rude. My guy loves to draw. You're rude.

So anyway, we're going to be doing some PVP on the short rest. We will not be playing, but we will be creating characters and talking about them. So if you want to hear that head on over to patreon.com slash nad pod. Don't sing yet. That's a pretty good song. Yes. Confession ad pod. We don't sing yet. That's a pretty good idea. We're dancing yet. Hi. Hi.

Yes, thank you all so much for listening. Thank you to M for putting this all together for walking us through it. Good work. Thank you. Thank you, Pathfinder people, to not be mad if I get things wrong. We're fresh to the path. We're all, we're just here chatting about it.

Make it a fun hobby that people can learn in. Yeah, again, we're coming at this with D&D brain, so forgive us for constantly comparing things. Don't add the path. Both systems are great, and I think they both serve different purposes. Yeah, I think there's room for all of this. Great. Do you, M, do you want to shout out your sources one more time? Yes, I will. Anybody who wants to learn more about the system. I will. The ones I use the most, obviously, were Rise of the Rule

Awards. That was my exposure. That was my, I'm freaking out. What is the system? This book is so big. I believe the man who runs it, his name is Pete. Really enjoyed spending some time with you, Pete. It was Pete. The rules lawyer on time with you, Pete. That's me.

The rules lawyer on YouTube, NoNet ones has really awesome breakdowns of all the classes. That was really, really helpful. And then archive of Neathis and pathbuilder2e.com. Those are the resources that I use the most. Shout out, dope. And then yeah, we got some live shows coming up. Mm-hmm.

Stuff in Australia. We still have some tickets for. We've got shows in Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Adelaide and Perth. Adelaide and Perth. Adelaide and Perth, so over the country. So be sure to check that out in adpod.com slash live. Doesn't matter where you are, as long as you're in Australia, you can come and see us.

And I would love to shout out some stuff from the PO box. If that's okay. Yeah, great. Lovely. I'll leave. Thank you. Alia and Kyle sent us a foster style rubber ducky us b drive continuing it's literally you can store digital files instead of potions in it it's great that's so funny but

also so confusing I'm featuring being like said look rubber ducky to have to take to the bath with you enjoy she just takes all of our episodes and all some of the while they on here the The USB drive does contain a video footage of the first wedding dance that they did to one big bed. Oh my God. I think it might have seen, or maybe I have seen some of them on Twitter and stuff. Videos when people send us.

It's awesome. It's a sacred duck. Yeah, this is a sacred vessel, you've sent. Thank you. Kay from New Zealand, some of the copy of their partner, Rims. Solar Punk, fantasy novel Fox Hunt, seems right up all of our collective alleys. Thank you both so so much for listening. Tim

Probert sent us a copy of their graphic novel, Lightfall, as well as the D&D middle grade novel that they illustrated. They are both so wonderful. Tim, your art is incredible. Tim, your art is so cool. I showed it to my nieces, and they were enraptured. Yeah, congratulations. You enraptured some children. Normally, it's not okay. It's not okay.

Chris, see, send us a copy of their book, Tattered Ponds. It's about an in-mage named Whistler, undeniably a dope sentence. Thank you, Chris. Chris Corgan. Molly B sent us a collection of cute frog and mushroom pins, including one of a frog with a really plump ass. It is a Saul to a T. Thank you very much for that Molly.

Yeah, I haven't talked about Saul's ass a lot. But it's, it's cool. Mostly the washboard abs, but yeah, there's a wrong one. We focus on the first. Yeah, we've been focusing on the abs these days. These muscular all around. So, Teo, a first grade teacher in Japan sent us a postcard letting us know that they genuinely

have a short and boisterous student in their class named Hugo. No! That's so awesome. That's awesome. May Hugo both delight and destroy you. Uh-huh. I hope that you know there's at least one good Hugo in there. Yeah.

I hope that they don there's at least one good you go and yeah, I Hope that they don't total party kill anyone And then Jessica and Max and us a nice note and pictures from their wedding which also featured one big bed as the first dance There's also a great picture. Yeah, there's like a picture of them standing next to this like wooden plank with the lyrics painted on it. It is just delightful Yeah, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so,ball, at AX For assembly, and at your girl's is Jake, and you can tweet about the show using hashtag nadpod that's n-e-d-d-p-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o-n-e-o- It's time to thank our Benevolent Council of Elders, starting with Brad D. Jeffrey S. Hussie, later Mick Skater, Matt M. Jordan D.J. Cutter W. Feared Al, great name. Daniel G. D.J. Pod, Dylan B. here to tell you to crit on your homework kids and hashtag open D&D.

Dungeon Mama, not sexual. Danielle D. Dastardly Dame, Beard Man Dan, Danny P. Vincent W. Victor T. Boundor's boy. Dominic, person Justin I. Ragnar, Fared Wind, TJM, Trey Leigh, the cray-fay, Christopher B. Damial R, cyborg version of Josh the Cobalt, Murph being cucked by Sonic the Hedgehog Nice, Richard X Machina, Michael L, Jack L, Sam L. Nicholas C has starred in every single film ever made in Bohemia, tickets bought can't wait to see y'all down under in Perth Hellia as to Samuel B, Mike H, Matthew E, great value Gemma, Adam G, Tyler F, Panama James, Andrew the Bard. No, sorry, just Andrew the true ad

here. Heradrian Rex Daniel the white captain sigil Diana D L L C C Lulu. Hercule Poirot the rabbit-folk detective Timmy R. Lucas B. Raco its Kevin. Calder's cold-come hashtag ride my comrades spread Spread the cum, Rotary. Patrick O. Taylor B. The vengeful, one-winged angel. Cass, skateboard cast. Captain of the Stevens, Stephen C. Mike K. Lady Taco, Brian G. Joy T. Nara K. Jake L. Nick W. Brave, the Badger, Esme M. Foster, the boneless duck, thanking the two crew for coming down under.

We can't wait. William W. Aaron the asshole Ranger, big bad, Birod of the Mad, Eric McDee, Anna Ramma, Galad Rosel, the white rose of Galatoron, power shiver of Bohumia Quiver against the river of the P-shiver, Dominic Harvey, J. Moonunchine's twin, wow, amazing. J. Dragonborn, Joe Roe, the inner pro pro.

The San Drian, Ben A. Feldonis, John the Third, Dave H. Koala Bear, Catherine S. David K. Christian S. Dustin S. Conner F. Hawkeye Pierce, book bars assistant Izzy F. Gageo Jr. Britney A. Jillian B. Marky Mark the Marvelous Mining Engineer. Katzie Kelle Sleye, Missa of House in Zunza. Ariel the occasional mermaid.

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deriders. My first D&D party may all of our adventures be wondrous. Thank you for being my friends. Thank you for being my friends. Salliel, Jack M. Leviathan, Bioquart 7, Amber Dexterous, Sullivan, H. Trubhop, Dropper, Jack H. Crabsdor, Champion of Crod, Scuttling, Sideways, Towards Tomorrow. Fandre Re, Garbotha Moist, Lindsay, W. Juicy, Kiwi, and Jake's Fire Squire desire to aspire to Spire like Maguire. Okay, Vaelin, Carlin C, Emily S, Skrip Skipper, Harry Cox, Nice, No of the Bagel of all things. Everything Bego, the Eladron who just wants to hang out with his pet Badger Stripey, nice, no of the bagel of all things. Everything bego, the Aladdin who just wants to hang out with his pet badger, Stripey, Laura, Dandy, Eric B, Marcos P, Jordan P M. Pogos, betrothed, self-proclaimed, fake Prince, Tracy P. the Crick, Elf Librarian,

and E. Holly Hyena, Kristen Z. I will use what you love against you DM, Leah C. Page H. Helen of Brizz, may be Pixel Stars, Akash Thakar, Kristen with K. Cal, just Cal, Commodore Galaxy, Edison N, Russell H, a monk named Dilgo. Yes, the whole thing. Yes, every time. Nios and Simon, rolling Deathsaves in Dreamland, has anyone heard his story in the shout-outs can an elder find him before a Natt one? Keychains Pentium II processor. Oh my god! Laura Lai, the succubus and Kira, her busty queen,

Michael the Ezri Pop Idol, Morgan M. A Peeling Sticker, Steven E, your friendly neighborhood, Yant and Yunkl Andrew and Sid. John Adams, yes like the president, Meg the male carrier of Bohumia, James F. Cappin-Cappy, M4L, Wayfarer, now trapped in the Feywild, after not fully reading the terms and conditions

of their legal settlement with Mother Ship, Andrew B. Buzzing around, Sir Smut, Barpo Good, Barrel, Bard Barian, and Brewer, Emeritus of Water Deep, Mary B. C. Melora D. Voty, Pendergreens, Bodyguards, Moldy, Codpes, Welshlander, Garrett G, one big curd, Mr. D, Dana D, Sean J, Ethan B, Renee the Monster Captain, hopped the dancing rabbit, hopes dagger, the only dagger of hope, Olivia the enchanting bard who will be totally making money and a grand novel on the duck team tails with and on the go all the stops show. Winter slayed, Michaela R. Riley S. FICO angry wheat, the game itself that has finally found himself. Your boy Anthony, who moved positions and can't listen to the podcasts at work anymore.

Oh, man, well, sorry, and congratulations. Josh H. Jack the Jacks, Janking Rogue on the run with the Bahumias balls. All right. run with the Bahumias balls. Alright, mango empanadas James B. Trogdoer the Burninator Clementine T. Caleb L.S. This message has been brought to you by Ferries in support of hashtag CCC. Happy birthday, Pixie. Wonderful, the pink dragon Alex R. Cantrip, double door, the bear wearing one Z with a bad back, Papa-Wookie MJ the BFG drinking tea, by the sea, dogs of Babel, Calvius Silver Fang, Geno T, Mama Bell, the Silver Serpent herself, Fienier, Straumann, 18 wheels of rubber and steel, Dr. Tulkas, Tizzy the great Derrick D. Tristan G. Calddy, Rabbit, Runt, Jasmine, and Fam architects

of Pendergreens' sick plans. David N. Alpha, Fortress, Alex K. Corn Daddy, the starched Ruid, Joshua P. Joshua P.S. Martin T. Alec Sanday, and of course, Mandy K. Thank you all.