Not As We Planned - 22. Shelley J Whitehead: Healing your Heartbreak

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

We talk all about fixing relationships, how to leave bad ones and learning more about yourself in order to make your relationship successful. Shelly's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shelleyjwhitehead/ Shelly's Website: https://shelleyjwhitehead.com Producer: Tristan Hehir City Lights by Ghostrifter Official | https://soundcloud.com/ghostrifter-officialMusic promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.comCreative Commons / Attribution-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported (CC BY-ND 3.0)https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nd/3.0/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You'll flip for $4 pancakes at A&W. Wake up to a stack of three light and fluffy pancakes topped with syrup. Only $4 on now. Dine-in only until 11 a.m. at A&W's in Ontario. This episode is brought to you by CIBC. From closing that first sale to opening a second store, as a business owner, you've hustled to accomplish a lot. But the rewards don't stop there. When you earn two times more points on things that matter to you and your

business, easily track those business expenses, and experience flexible Aventura rewards, you'll realize how much more rewarding your hustle can be. Get up to $1,800 in value when you apply for the CIBC Aventura Visa for Business at cibc.com slash Aventura Business. Terms and conditions apply. Hey, hi, it's Tash and Carly and you're listening to Motherhood Not As We Planned. So get comfy, grab a cup of tea or a glass of wine, and let's start talking about all the things too many of us avoid discussing. Hi guys, and welcome to this week's episode of Motherhood Not As We Planned. It's another really exciting week. We have got another very special guest on. Yes, I have been looking forward

to this one. I feel like literally from the day that we started our podcast, I was like this person has to come on the podcast because I feel like I wouldn't be, well, where I am mentally and everything without this person. So I'm so happy to introduce Shelley Whitehead. She is a specialist relationship coach. She is literally my queen. I see her almost every week. And I have been seeing you now on and off for, we couldn't work it out, could we? It was like over five years.

I'm not too sure. I think it's a little longer Tish um I obviously haven't pulled out the old notes because it's quite a big file but yeah so thank you so so much for coming on today's episode we are so excited to have you we thought maybe you could give your intro and just let people know what it is you do um I mean I have mentioned you in previous episodes people know that I have seen someone um yeah especially since the divorce and going through a separation but yeah over to you Shelley well my passion is all about relationships. So everything to do with relationships, endings, new beginnings, dealing with the conflict parts that show up,

who are we in relation to another, how to find the right relationship, how to exit the wrong relationship, and how to pick up the pieces when we don't know who we are anymore. So I work with couples to get them back into connection, whatever the outcome is. Because when couples are in connection, clearly seeing and hearing one another without an agenda, I create that space for them to be seen and heard.

Magic happens. Even if the couple decides that they're not staying together because there's often that part about co-parenting or how do they say goodbye. Goodbyes are very important. That's interesting because I feel like, I mean, obviously everything that you're saying I'm like yep yep done that one done that one haven't done that one yet but I feel like there's nothing more important when you're in a relationship for me now anyway looking back and seeing what I didn't have and what I will always make sure I have moving forward is having that place to like feel like you're heard yeah I I completely agree that's

like one thing that I I do you know what even when I was in my relationship I didn't know that's what I was so desperately seeking although it's apparent now I'm at the other side but I wasn't seen and I wasn't heard and I think that was a massive underlying problem in our relationship but I completely agree it's like that that is the fundamentals of it oh there's always going to be things that crop up but it's being seen and being heard and having that support system isn't it also knowing how to navigate conflict in a relationship because there are times where we actually can't go into being seen and heard, and that's generally when we are flooded with cortisol and the stress hormones.

Interestingly, as one person goes into a cortisol situation, automatically so does the other. That stays in the bloodstream for about 20 minutes. And in those 20 minutes, we've exited our rational brain, the prefrontal cortex, and we've gone to flat and pre's. So we're not rational. That's not the time to be seen and heard. But thereafter, if we've got someone who is willing to show up to hear how we feel, I think probably this is the most important thing, my definition of love. If we've got someone who is willing to show up to hear how we feel, I think probably this is the most important thing, my definition of love, is that your needs and your happiness are as important as my needs and my happiness.

And I want to see you. I want to hear you. And I need to be seen. I need to be heard. That's what being valued and feeling respected and feeling loved looks like and would you say that if you don't have that from a partner then really there is no longevity in your relationship not necessarily because some partners just don't know how remember we go into relationships no one's gone to relationship school and learned how to do relationships. There should be a relationship school.

I feel like don't do history and geography. Do relationships. Oh, if we could get a curriculum into starting from preschool, from right up to module one,, module one, 101 at university. Unrelationship skills, how to navigate conflict, how to repair, reconnect with your partner after conflict, how to see them and hear them, listening skills. It would be utterly amazing.

So going back to your question, is there no hope? No, because if we've got a partner who is willing to learn, to grow, that's it. I've been asked many times, and I say this so very often, the key ingredients for a successful relationship. I started off this morning at 7 a. in Australia with a 22 year old who has never seriously dated because she's been very career focused and she's ready and this is amazing to actually work with someone who's about to embark on dating so I said to these are the key ingredients that you're going to look for in a relationship. Someone who's able to emotionally moderate. Someone who's willing to self-reflect, to take responsibility

and who's open for growth. If you are with somebody who is into the criticism, that defensiveness, you know, that blame all the time, they emotionally shut you out and shut down. And then the name-calling and the contemptuous behavior, I will not do this for you and I will not do that for you. Why should I? There's no hope.

If they refuse to work on themselves and refuse to work on the relationship, remember the relationship's its own energy. What we put into that space is what everybody lives in, including the dog and the cat. That energy is what we call the relationship. And if you are with someone who's willing to look at themselves and to get help, it's not over. Yeah, I suppose. That's a big growth stance. No one's going to come perfect and everyone's going to have to learn as they are in relationships.

But it is about that willingness, isn't it? It's about that willingness to grow and learn and be open to understand each other. And yeah. and learn and be open to like understand each other and yeah I think also I think that and I don't know if this is maybe like social media and just generally like the way that we live now but I feel like people have this like expectation of what that perfect relationship should be like or you know like always be happy like always in love like it shouldn't be difficult and then the minute something happens that isn't perfect or is hard I think nowadays a lot of people leave a lot sooner than they should because they don't really understand how they got to that point. I'm not talking about things like infidelity or something that's really caused a lack of trust and respect. I'm just talking general, arguing a lot,

nothing really being resolved, pushing a lot under the carpet I feel like it's it's relationships like that that probably are really able to be resolved with the guidance of someone like you or really understanding yeah having but they need to have the willingness to be open to growth and yeah I think it is these days just a lot easier to be like I'm done like this is just too difficult that's also because I also think like the whole dating thing is so much more accessible like it's more accessible to go meet other people or to you know get a quick fix of whatever it is they're looking for be it intimacy or whatever it is you're very it's so different to like the world

our parents grew up in yeah just everything's there at a touch of a button yeah you have touched on some vital points right there number one let's go back to social media and what's being portrayed you know my life's perfect from my nails to my and well maybe not influence the right hand and because i work with so many of these individuals you know i work all over the world and some very high profile personalities and influences where everything seems to be perfect obviously i, I'm working with them and their relationships and their partners, so it's not, but it doesn't have to be perfect. We need those four key ingredients, the qualities of an individual. Conflict is normal, and a lot of the things that we argue about,

we will not always resolve. that we argue about, we will not always resolve. When we have huge ruptures, infidelity, abuse, illness, all those kinds of things that really impact relationships, including pregnancy and then babies. You've heard me say, Tash, kids are relationship wreckers. Not that we don't want to have children. It's the best thing I've ever done in my life, being a mom.

It puts a lot of strain on a relationship. And then we end up in a lot of conflict because we are not in connection. A lot of unrealistic expectations. People run away with a fantasy of what life should look like. And social media feeds that fantasy we don't see who has to unload that dishwasher who deals with the kids who are throwing up at five o'clock in the morning sorry wrong subject but you know what there's nothing there's no way i don't go i had that the other day so so that was fun. And finances that can become really strained, problems with family, intimacy issues.

So all of these things can cause huge ruptures if we don't address it, if we do not make time for connection. And I think that's one of the questions that popped up that you're actually saying to me. I'm someone who's getting ready for baby number two. I'll show you. I'm well aware of what baby number one does. It causes a huge rupture and a disconnect because we're so focused on this little person

and there's so much love that the person that we actually do love, we fall out of connection with. It's been interesting to see someone I coached in New York who had a terrible heartbreak and then helping her to get into the right relationship. And she really has. She's just an amazing human being. And their baby boy is six months old. But from almost week one or two,

because she has a lot of support around her and that's what we want to find in our lives when we have a baby is support. They were out on their date night and they work hard to keep connection. It doesn't just happen. It's like going to the gym and scheduling time to eat and order the groceries or whatever it is that's important in our life. We do those things.

But generally, connection doesn't happen because we've run out of time or we're too tired or we need to prioritize time for connection. Yeah, it needs to be seen as like one of those tasks like scheduling eating and you know i remember we we did an episode about kind of like becoming a mother and how that does impact your relationship and i think it's very easy to look back and be like oh on hindsight i should have done this and this with my partner we didn't schedule any time no and also when Theo was born it was when he was 10 months old we went into lockdown and so you didn't have any support from anyone else and there was no time for you and we yeah but we yeah we've definitely said that like looking back I definitely would have done more things and maybe been also more understanding to your partner like just because you're tired

with the baby doesn't mean that they're not also entitled to be tired because they've been at work all day it's not like I feel like it used to be like no no you can't be tired because I'm more tired like no you're you're you're tired and so am I so let's maybe like have a nap together and like you know I feel like it was more like a battle as to like who was going to, it was like a one-upmanship. Yeah. Rather than people. Yeah, I agree. Yeah.

So it goes back to the age old. Do you want to be right or do you want to be kind? Yeah. And, you know, there's only one person's needs who can be met at a time. When two people are needing something, we need to attend to one person's needs. Of course, when the kids are there, it's always their needs first. But one person needs to be seen and heard. We need to understand what they really want and need underneath all of that.

And then we go on to the next one. Should we go through some of the questions? Let me find them. What would your advice be for someone that's trying to heal whilst co-parenting with that person that they're healing from? I shouldn't care. Co-parenting is a different issue. So we've got to agree on a defined set of how do we do this.

The ending of a relationship is the ending of the physical, the emotional, the financial. I'll call it the spiritual, the energetic stuff. And then obviously we can't end being parents. Get help for your stuff in separating what happened in that relationship if it hasn't been processed yet. And agree on how you're co-parenting.

You may not like this person. There may be so much resentment and so much hurt over what's happened. There may be no closure. Closure doesn't come from someone else. Because remember, when a relationship ends, what we're wanting possibly, you know, if they've ended it with us or we've ended it with them, is one person doesn't want connection and the other one is still wanting connection and closeness and understanding. You're two different points. It's impossible to get closure from someone who doesn't want that connection anymore. Closure comes from inside

you. Processing what happened is your individual work. How did we get into it? Why did it happen? What do I want that's different? How do I heal from this? There's a big part of letting go and understanding what a healthy relationship looks like in being able to let go. One of the big exercises I have in working with someone who is heartbroken are the 25 benefits of not being with my ex. Some people go on to get 67, some people can find 12. with my eggs. Some people go out and get 67, some people can find 12. But looking at the benefits of not being with the person is very helpful. Early in 2024, I'm publishing the book on heartbreak, Healing Your Heartbreak. We are typesetting right now. The reviews are coming through. They're really fab. And it's a 28-day process where I will hold your hand through that,

addressing a lot of these issues. So being very boundaried and clearly defined as to how you're going to co-parent and then treating your ex like a work colleague, a business associate. There's no space for emotion and emotional negotiation in that process. Just a very clearly defined process of how we co-parent. What are the child's needs? What are you doing? What am I doing? Not using the child as a pawn to get back and get even with them. And sometimes exes can be terribly unreasonable. Not getting drawn into the immersion. I mean we're human and it does happen. But really

stepping back. We feel ourselves being triggered. That's that release of cortisol and all the stress hormones. Quiet. Create some space. Find a Quiet. Create some space. Find a structure. Get some support. And navigate that with art immersion. That's speaking to my soul right now. Of course.

I thought I'd have a really challenging week with it and I do sometimes. It's literally what you've just said. I felt myself going through those motions this week of that cortisol release and rather than me stepping back and getting the space i feel like sometimes i respond in that high cortisol state which obviously isn't always beneficial so and then i'm always like no yeah do do this. And I'm like, I've already done it. That's normally the reaction, not the response. Response is when you step back, sort about it.

What do I think? What do I want? What do I feel? Just kidding. I feel so frustrated. What do I really want? What's best for the child? Sometimes they're just not going to see us or hear us. they're on their own paths they have their own agenda we've got to think of what's best for this little person

yeah i think it is obviously very hard when you are co-parenting with someone that doesn't necessarily view things for the child it's more well actually I'm not going to do that because that's helping you but actually it's not about me it's the child I remember you saying that exact thing to me like treat it as a business transaction and a lot of the time like I did other times I didn't but then you realize that when you get angry and you get emotional, and I've said it to you, the only person that ends up getting really affected is yourself because they probably don't care.

And also I feel like they know things that are going to trigger you. Yeah. And that's sometimes what they want. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's obviously frustrating when you feel like they're not really seeing like putting the children's needs. Like we said before, you can't choose who you co-parent with.

No. And if you probably didn't get on with them when you were married, the likelihood of you getting on with them when you're not, initially, is probably not going to be the case. So you can only, you know, work on what you do, how you react, how you parent. And then you've just got to let them get on with it. This week, I've had a challenging week with it all. And my thing, I keep, because I do feel like it massively impacts my mood. And then I feel like that has like a spiraling impact on everything. I feel like then everything bothers me.

I feel like a big difference in my mood. My mood feels low. And then I feel like I become this person that I don't want to be. I don't want to be a miserable person. I want to be happy. So my thing this week is I've just tried to focus on the things that are within my control and the things that I can impact and trying to protect my energy as much as I can. Yep.

It's like a little ritual. You know that song from Frozen, Let It Go. Elsa knows her share. Elsa knows her stuff so well. And it might just be, you know, pick up on the song and sing it. Got stuck in everyone's head. Can you imagine every time you feel that way just break into song because what you've touched on is an absolute reality

we have no control over anything in life other than our own emotional response how we show up in every single relationship we can't control anyone else that's what and Tash I've said this so many times before,

makes the wise men, the masters, the gurus and the sages who they are because they know that. They work with that. They're also human and we allow for humanness. But we can never control anything outside of ourselves. Just when we think we've got it taped, life comes through and goes, I'll show you. What do you do if you have trauma bonds to get rid of from a narcissistic ex who just won't go away? Okay.

If someone's an ex, they should go away. It means that there's something wrong with our boundaries if someone's not going away, if we keep engaging. It can be hard to let go. Let's just define narcissist. There are about 36 traits that define a narcissist. Something that really jumps out is there's zero compassion, zero empathy. Because someone's selfish doesn't make them a narcissist so we need to be really careful if we use the word narcissist that needs to be diagnosed by someone

i don't even diagnose i mean i can see the traits and i can see when someone really is because you know it's a psychiatrist or medical person's job um but we find ourselves caught up in crazy sometimes. If our ex is not going away, it's more to do with us. And why are we letting them have access to us emotionally, physically, or whatever way it is? Trauma bond? That's after when it's very hard to let go of someone. We don't distance ourselves from them. We kind of get sucked into it again and again because we haven't developed those clearly defined boundaries where we know what's good for us and what's bad for us. We will often excuse the bad behavior, bad treatment, or we'll distance ourselves from other people because friends and family will call it and say it for what it is our sense of self-worth and our confidence will probably be

at an all-time low but this is where our own work really comes in and very often it's necessary to work with a professional who understands this and can help us through it in developing clearly defined boundaries, looking at what a healthy relationship is, working on our self-worth and confidence. I promise you, as soon as those boundaries go in, confidence and self-worth starts to rise and how to make healthier choices. I've watched individuals. I have a friend who for many years has been caught up in crazy in a relationship and it's not a good relationship. And I can see that this friend is getting to the point of I'm done. And it has taken many years.

Some people just take a lot longer. But working on self-care and really identifying what healthy looks like and taking those steps, being accountable. That's why I love coaching more than therapy. Therapy is amazing. I see a therapist. I also have supervision as a coach. And you'll know, Tash, I'm quite prescriptive as a coach at times

because when there's some crazy behavior going on, it's like not that you've had crazy behavior but we know because i also speak about stories um names never mentioned where we go no no no no no this needs to stop we need to choose something different and i have on occasion actually twice this year said to individuals you have to leave this relationship it's dangerous all the signs were there controlling abusive and you know almost 36 traits are in terms of the definitely 36 traits of someone who is it you know really unhealthy to be with this and do you think that you know when someone is in a relationship that isn't good that looks like it doesn't have a future like you know I know that

you know this I feel like I stayed in a in a marriage a lot longer than I probably should have but do you think it just sometimes you need to wait until that person gets to that point where they are strong enough to now be like do you know what now I sort of see it because I feel like had I attempted to leave before I think I just would have constantly gone back because I just and it probably is like that self-worth and like really, really understanding the difference between like thinking I was in love with this person, but he actually wasn't really that person anymore. So I was holding on to like this relationship that wasn't really, you know, looking back, it wasn't a good relationship. But I think it's so hard to kind of like when you're in it be like actually no i like the idea of it he's not actually good for me well very often fear

is where we are working from not self-love the unknown as well isn't it it's scary that's what i was terrified of like the unknown how I going to do all this on my own? Like, is it better to just ride it out? Stay? Yeah. Yeah, it's definitely the fear. is very scary. I had to face that when my husband had cancer and was dying. And I was working with the most amazing therapist. She was an angel. And we did a lot of pre-grief work, but a preparation for death,

how I was going to manage my three children, because that was the biggest concern for me, to keep my children stable, that they could be safe and that we could stay really strong, which we still are. So we worked through all of that so we could cope with life on our own. And Easter is the father or the mother who's there. I work with same-sex couples and individuals who are navigating these difficult paths. But we've got to make sure we're not making decisions based on fear. It starts with self-love, what that looks like, and then putting into place the physical, the emotional,

and the financial, getting that support. I always come back to that structure, and I mention it so often, taking some space to work it out, creating a daily structure, getting support, and then sunshine, the four S's, metaphorical sunshine, the little bit of something that lifts our state from here to there. So they're all practices and things that we do for ourselves, the self-care. But having that structure and the support starts with having space to really look at it and work the plan. Yeah, another good question that's jumped out. How can I stop

having anxious attachments when newly dating? I find casual really hard. It is difficult if we are anxiously attached. It's changing our behavior because an anxious attachment style wants to get really, really close. First thing we need to determine is we're not finding an avoidant, someone who has an avoidant attachment style, because that's the match made in initially heaven and then hell. We want to find someone who's securely attached, who's physically and emotionally available and going back to those four things. Emotionally moderates, takes responsibility, can self-reflect and is willing to work on our relationship.

Don't run away with the future if you are anxiously attached because we project onto this person we don't know from Adam our whole future. There's a qualifying process for dating, and I'm very big on this. Tash knows I'm the queen of take it slowly, go slow. This world is too fast and we approach everything far too fast without qualifying. And we take our time to qualify whether this person we can commit to dating, but we don't commit to a future until we've qualified them. In months one to three we're qualifying,

do they share the same highest values? Months three to six we are qualifying behavior. Everybody has a shadow side. Everybody has stuff that we don't like. It is a downright dark and impossible to live with. Run six to 12, we're looking at commitment and investment. Are we spending more time together? Have we met their friends?

Have we met their family? Are we planning next summer's holiday? So really take time. And I learned this personally from literally jumping into a relationship and getting married eight weeks later. If I'd qualified, I probably wouldn't have done it. I'm very glad I did because I would not be doing the level of work I do if I hadn't gone through tremendous heartbreak and gone through a divorce and learned so much about myself and relationships. So I'm very thankful for that. And I don't have anything negative to say about it, but I know that we don't jump into things. We take our time. Anxiously attached, you've got to understand that you don't want to over-function. When we say the anxious one

over-functions, they need to be and do and organize and just be so amazing. So this person is going to keep connected. It's holding ourself back, stepping back, taking space, assessing. Is this person in front of me also contributing? Are they showing up in the right way? Are they making time for me? Do they prioritize dating in the right way? Are they making time for me? Do they prioritize dating?

Do they listen? Do they ask questions? Are they interested in my life? Not just focusing on the other person. So learn as much as you can about anxious attachment and do it differently. Just do what's counterintuitive. If you want to give to stop, step back, wait for someone to also come towards you. That relationship bubble is like this.

We've got to keep that relational space between. If we're leaning forward too much and we've got to keep that space, this person's got to lean back. to lean back, but we want that lovely flow of backwards and forwards, give and take, and understanding that love is not enough for a relationship. Love is never enough. I have walked away from love really, really loving someone where it wasn't enough. They were stuck in their life. The behavior was stuck. Everything was stuck.

And if anybody knows me, there's one thing I can't do is stuck. I've got to be growing and contributing and making a difference. My work takes up a big part of my life. And sorry, what would you then say? You know, you say like love isn't enough. Yeah. What would you say are like the fundamental needs for a good relationship to work? That your partner sees your needs and your happiness as important as they are.

And you need to show the same highest values. You know, if you really value family, they need to value family. If you want to get married and have children, they must want to get married and have children. If you value the work that you do, they need to support that. If you value health, you can't be with someone. I use the example of wheatgrass cocaine. If you're a wheatgrass person and they're a cocaine person, it's clearly never going to work they're just different values you know if you

vend you home and garden and they want to go sailing um for six to eight months it's not going to work so i'll go back to what I mentioned and keep coming back to this. Emotional self-regulation, reflection, responsibility, growth. A relationship is like a tree that bears fruit and you plant it and it's little. You've got to water it. You've got to nurture it. And if your partner's not prepared to do this, if they're not prepared to work on it and they see conflict as dangerous, well, I'll tell you right now, no one is safe. Because conflict does happen.

I mean, you don't want to be arguing all the time. But there will be points of conflict in my relationship. We work at odds. Anyone who knows Ilan doesn't like conflict. Ilan wants to escape. Ilan has learned in the eight years to stay with it, to work through it. And nurturing the relationship

is vital. If somebody expects that it should always be peaceful, all needs should be met, then we're working with a fantasy. You can't be with him. If should be met. Then we work in with a fantasy. You can't be with him. If we have those ideas, we need to go and look at what a relationship really, really is. It's full growth.

And we've got to be prepared to put in the effort to connect and to keep it growing. Yep. to connect and to keep it growing. Yep. When I obviously got to a point where you felt like I was ready today, I remember I was definitely, I had an anxious attachment style and you told me that I needed

to go and read the book Attached. So I feel like anyone listening to this that maybe is struggling with that kind of like anxious attachment style I've read it twice now I've got it on audio as well I used to listen to it in the gym it is just a good one to sort of understand sometimes like your behaviors are due to that kind of like low self worth anxious feelings probably from a previous relationship. So I found that book really helpful.

It's a brilliant book. You'll know that there are a couple of books I keep recommending over and over again. You might want to put links into the podcast. There's another one, Why Women Talk and Men Walk. And the one that I recommend a lot, my couples and individuals who are in relationships or wanting to understand conflict is Jason Gaddis' book. And I remember Jason contacting me when he was about to launch the book and I downloaded it and I keep buying hard copies. It's called Getting to Zero. How to get a place of zero conflict in your high stakes relationships.

It's very practical. It's a lot of the work that I actually do with my couples, sort of a different methodology with the same outcome. And a lot of it is a crossover and the same stuff, getting people to really see and hear one another, but understanding what conflict's about. And then one more book, Marshall Rosenberg, wrote Nonviolent Communication, which is a brilliant book.

Because underneath any conflict is a need, an unmet need or a deep longing. And getting to understand that is very powerful on both sides. Another thing that I've spoken about with you, which I think is something that we have mentioned in previous episodes, is kind of understanding love languages, especially when you're dating and you're getting into a new relationship. I feel like a lot of people don't really know about love languages.

I don't really know what my own love language is. Have you not? Have you not done the questionnaire? I've done the questionnaire, but then I feel a bit like a black bitch and this and that. I feel like you... We need all of them. Imagine not getting a gift on your birthday or not getting a hug and not having quality time and somebody not picking up the dry cleaning or cooking dinner and not hearing, wow, you look amazing.

I love that dress on you. That's affirmation. So we need all of them, but particularly the one or two that are very close in school that are very important to us. And if we are in a relationship where the love languages are different, we'll have conflict. We have different love languages. He's physical touch, I'm quality time. And it can be a little contentious sometimes if i'm really busy and then i want quality time and he's happy with a hug it doesn't

work this is a love language issue and we go back to it so you must know what makes you feel loved primarily the other thing is we will give what we need yeah you know we always that quality time you need to understand the other person's love language you get them what they need in a relationship exactly i've always used the example like you just said like with gifts like if someone's love language is gifts and the other one is words of affirmation and you're feeling like you really want to let that person know that you love them you may go and buy them a gift but all they want is to be told like you look amazing I love you and if you're not getting that and you're that you're like why are they why they bought me this but they're doing it because they feel like this is going to show them I really love them

as you said it does cause that conflict so yeah I just wanted to bring that up because I feel like when I was at that early stage you were like go and find out what your love language is then the minute I started dating you were like find out what his is so you know I have to find out what my language is yeah you need to I think of it I'm gonna find out my love language yeah I'll send you the the link to the quiz after we yeah we'll put it we'll put it on the yeah so people can take it there's a book there's a book the five love languages by dr gary chapman interestingly you know this is about mums this podcast children also have love languages i never thought of that they do there's

a book for that too he's written that i can see with jacob already he's full and I know Jacob's primary love language is um affirmation I walked out and he what a beautiful dress he told me and so I'm starting to see what he's giving it is so impressive yeah oh god I hope none of my kids are gifts because I can't be bothered to constantly give them, all three of them, gifts every time they need a bit of, no. But that's really interesting. I never thought of that. So please, mums listening, you know, tune in to your children's,

you know, what makes them feel loved. Get the book, become aware of this. And it makes communication and them feeling loved so much easier. I have two children who are affirmation first. If they perceive criticism, uh-oh. It's literally like you're describing, Theo. Like even little things. There was this man making balloons and he called all the

children like snot face and stuff and he got so upset by it because it was like a negative word he didn't like it he is so and whenever I give him like positive reinforcement about anything or tell him like how proud I am or beautiful reading like the high he gets from that like you can see the change in him i've never thought of it as a love language before i just it's interesting yeah yeah so there's something to go and investigate and still really just have a different level of awareness that's the big thing awareness is the key to all change so we don't know what we don't know. And remember, the stuff that we've done in the past, we did the best we could with the knowledge we had

available at the time. Oh, somebody said something about guilt in one of those questions. And this comment really applies to that. Guilty about leaving a relationship and putting happiness ahead, their happiness ahead of that. Firstly, when we get into a relationship, we're also doing the very best with the knowledge we have at the time. And we do need to take care of our own happiness. No one is going to come into our lives and go, hey, I'm here to make you happy. Our happiness is our responsibility. And sometimes we are in a relationship that's going to lower the bar in our lives. It is going to detract from the path that we want to walk on because whatever it is that they're doing or who they are isn't a match

and we need to leave a relationship. I remember when I said I left a relationship, the guilt I felt for years was overwhelming and yet I know it was the right thing to do for me. I couldn't stay stuck and with someone with different values. It was never right thing to do for me. I couldn't stay stuck. End with someone with different values. It was never going to work. What advice would you give to someone that maybe feels like they are in a marriage with children, but they're not happy. They don't want to be with that person, but they feel like they need to stay for their children. Well, if it's a decision they're going to make,

they need to make the best of it. Because some people do make that decision. A therapist's girlfriend wants to refer someone to me who has made the decision to stay in her marriage because of the benefits and because of the children. And remember, here's a big point to take note of. A relationship is part of our life. It's not our life. And if all the focus is going on to the unhappiness of the relationship,

there's a lot of stuff that we can do to change that dynamic, to make it even better, if we make a decision to stay. But there are another seven life areas that need our attention. And we want to make sure that we are giving all these other life areas our attention because it's not just about the relationship. And it's easy to get drawn into the pain and the unmetness and the negativity if we're only focusing on that so you know again if you're making a decision from fear to stay in it it's also not the right

decision that's what i feel like in general i feel like people that stay for their kids and not because they actually love that person and want to be with them. I can't see personally how that's ever the right decision because eventually your kids grow up and leave. They also feel like as well, if you're not happy in your marriage. One thing I've really noticed is like, I think kids absorb the atmosphere they're growing up in. kids absorb the atmospheres they're growing up in and I have noticed like the biggest shift in both both my kids behavior and just like general like happiness and I feel like I don't know for me if I was in a marriage that was unhappy and I decided to stay in it ultimately like that is more detrimental to my kids because surely that environment isn't positive like it's a really big thing for me for my children to grow up seeing what a loving relationship looks

like because all I'd ever want for my kids is for them to have a really positive loving relationship and I would never want them to feel like that's a certain and exaltable and I. Don't get me wrong, I know it's easier to sit here the other side of it or sit here and say it and I know how hard it can feel to leave but I also think there's a lot of other factors to take into account

rather than just staying because I would never want my kids to aspire to have a relationship like that. I agree with you. I to aspire to have a relationship like that. I agree with you. I wouldn't stay in a relationship where I was not happy with someone who was willing to work on it. At the same time, I would do everything it takes, not leave a stone unturned to make sure that I'd done everything

to create relationship success. And if then and only then, having done that and clearly seeing that there's just no hope, it's just too incompatible or so unmet or somebody isn't willing to do their part, then you've got to make different decisions. Because children do need to live in an environment where they're learning what love really looks like because it shapes all of us. A lot of our decisions that we've made

are based on what love looked like back there or not. And there is so much information available for your generation to make healthy decisions, to be successful, and it takes a lot of work. No, so they didn't say but. And it takes a lot of work. Yeah. Oh, sorry, not just your generation.

I'm just creating a difference between my generation and your generation. You know, when I got married, this information wasn't readily available. Well, that's a long time ago. But everything is at the push of a button, and we can Google anything today. And, you know, seeing seeing a coach seeing a therapist is the norm today nobody goes oh there's something wrong with you if you're doing that yeah i i feel like there's the taboo is getting less isn't it for like having a therapist or no i feel like whenever i've shared it on my instagram people have been like thank you so

much for being open about this because i want to see someone and I didn't know if it would be frowned upon. I think it literally should be a must. Yeah, when it comes to mental health, there is so much support out there. How do you know when you're ready to start dating? How do you tackle boundaries after toxicity? It's a big question. The first part, how do we know we're ready to start dating? We're not hung up on an ex.

We know what we want, we know who we are, we know what we're looking for, and we have clearly defined boundaries. We're able to say no and this is this is actually something we're creating right now this book number three although book number two will be published before book number three which is it's already done but it's about dating and before you get out there and start dating this is the book and defining who you are and what you're looking for. And it's a deeper dive into the issues like boundaries and attachment style and so much more. So if anyone does want to get hold of me, sign up for my newsletter.

It's on the website. Very often they're monthly meditations that go out at the same time follow me on youtube instagram um there's some amazing things coming up in courses that i'm releasing next year the book and they're going to be some you know great special offers and i'm going to be running some free workshops so amazing um yeah and we we should definitely yeah we'll share them all and obviously when the book is coming out

we will do that as well and definitely have you on here when the book is launched because I'm very excited for that but thank you so so much for your

time so welcome make sure you give Shelley a follow and we hope that you loved it make sure you have a listen

like it subscribe share yes and yeah we hope to you loved it. Make sure you have a listen, like it, subscribe. Yes, and yeah, we hope to see you all next week. Thank you so much. So lovely to be with you. Thank you. Bye.