Not Skinny But Not Fat - Deactivated Thrice & Thriving w/ Jackie Schimmel

Episode Date: June 1, 2021

Queen of sarcasm, wit, big words and podcasting pioneeress, Jackie Schimmel talks Instagram shadowbanning, deactivation, and the one and probably only influencer trip she went on. I also share the most exciting news probably ever (you guys won’t believe it!) and Jackie helps me digest and come up with a plan of action. Produced by Dear MediaSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following podcast is a dear media production. This is Amanda Hirsch from the Not Skinny but Not Fat podcast. You might know me from Not Skinny Bonatha on Instagram where I spend my time talking about reality TV, celebrities, everything happening and pop culture. I also talk to some of our favorite celebs and reality TV stars. We talk about what's going on. Tune in every Tuesday and just feel like you're talking about your best friends in your living room. Okay, I promised I wouldn't do intros anymore because I suck at them.

So this is my first go and no intro. Jackie Schimmel and I were just mid-conversation when we started recording this podcast. Yes, we were. That was a beautiful intro, Amanda. Really well done. I like what you did there. I mean, came in for a hot landing. It was so funny.

We just were talking. I was like, let's record. But ever since you and I, I went on Jackie's podcast. We were talking about how even if your friends, podcasters have this annoying shit to just be like, save it in a pen and now I like can't not think it. I went on a podcast. I've been a podcast for lately. It's like disgusting.

And, um, you think? Yeah, I think it's good. I mean, I, I can't because I just can't, but I love you. So I'm like, of course we swap a rusky. But as to just be a guest, it's easy and it's hard. You know, you're a mother. You get shit to do. I do.

But actually for me to go on a podcast is so easy. Because, like, you don't have to stress. Like, I don't care. Yeah, fuck it. That's why I'm here. I'm just coasting. You're doing the heavy lifting. Don't you hate?

Wait, have you ever been invited on a podcast that asked you to do things before? Like, send in a bio. Like, send in a bio. Like, fucking, oh, you'll be asked. This is my trigger when I'm like, oh, can't make it. They're like, questions we might ask you. I'm like, why are you putting me to work? I'm helping you milk the clock. Don't give me a fucking assignment. I dropped out of college for a reason. Do your own fucking homework. I'm here for the ride, bitch. Yeah. No, but actually, like, even if they

asked me for a picture, I'm like, search my Instagram. Jackie Schimmel, it's an honor. I, when I went on your podcast, I didn't tell you my side of getting to how I know you. You were. saying you know me through M. Radha, which like, I know you from way back. So it's like I'm kind of the inferior in our relationship. And I think I feel inferior in our relationship in general for like a slew of reasons. We'll start with number one. Share. Delight me, Amanda. Number one, I know you from your first shadow ban. Oh, yeah. And subsequent deletion. A thrice deactivation. I really need to discuss it because this happened, what would you say?

2019, the first one? Yes, it was in September, not to be specific, September of 2019, I believe. Or was it 2018? Oh, the years they blend. I think it was 2019. Well, think about, because it happened, because I remember this, it happened when you were on some influencer trip, which like we know. Was it Revolve? Wait, was it Revolve? Oh my God, no. I would never be invited to one of those Revolve retreats. Honestly, I've never, I have never been invited back to any other influencer retreats since then. I went because it was a paid gig. It was a weekend in Malibu at the Nobu Hotel. I had friends going. I had Heather McMahon there and Morgan Stewart, who are my girls. So we were like, this is amazing. We get like paid to go on vacation together.

sign my ass up. Within, I'm not fucking joking, Amanda, I was shadow banned the first day. I had not even slept at the hotel. I had not even been there for three and a half hours. And I was shadow banned at the, at sunset. You were the first shadow ban on Instagram, I feel like. I didn't know what was happening. But by the way, I was barely fucking there. Okay. I mean, the fact that I was even invited was a fucking miracle. Wait, was it vital, vital proteins or something? It was a vital protein. It's like, it's in my, like, I felt it for you.

Like, I feel like I felt it for you. I told the story so many times to so many people. Because tell us what happened. Like what, okay, 2018 or 19, you're at a nobu thing. Matt Nobu, I'm totally out of place there from the jump. You know, I'm, like I said, very much so barely fucking invited. I think I was more, I was really only invited to get other people there. You know what I mean?

Like, I was like an emotional support. Like, it was like a make a wish foundation. They gave me the shittiest room in the whole fucking place. They're like, if we get this dumb bitch here, maybe Morgan will come. Maybe Heather will come. Like, that was it. Okay. I was like a tradeoff.

So I'm barely fucking there. So out of place. Within an hour, I start making jokes about the fucking plastic straws doesn't land. Like, you know, fuck the turtles. Totally. Like, everybody fucking hated me on that trip except the girls that I'm friends with. But it sounds like you, Morgan and Heather, like, you're a vibe. So was, were the other, like, it seemed like vital proteins had a vision for the type of

people. So were the other people there, like your vibe? Or were they more like bachelor nation? No, there was no bachelor. there was a lot of supermodels. Stop. Lots of models. Sports Illustrated.

Victoria. Yeah. All like photo shoots on the beach nonstop. Okay. Lots of like wellness types. There was like a professional surfer. I didn't speak to anyone except the people that I already knew. Claudia Oshry was there.

She was really fun. And like Lauren Elizabeth. Like some girls that I kind of peripherally knew. But then most of them not a clue. They were just, you know, the ring. lights were assembled. Isn't it like, isn't it like when you're on a trip like that,

is it not like actually just an influencers in the wild photo? Like everyone's trying to get photographed probably all the time. Oh, it was insane. I mean, it was the funniest shit. We, at the end of the night, I had no idea what to expect.

We like gotten our pajamas, put robes on, poured herself like stiff, stiff cocktails and then sat on the patio with the lights off. and we're just listening to people's conversations. I don't even know, Jackie. I'm trying to think of me. Like, I've never been invited, but like, like, really waiting to revolve around the world. And I don't understand where my invite is the law.

Where is it? I need to know. I don't know. I mean, same. Well, I would love to put on like a fucking cute little love shack fancy dress and a fucking wide-brimmed hat and be skipping in fucking the Maldives. Like revolve. I feel like people.

don't get me, but it's fine. But sometimes I'll, like, just hashtag revolve around the world. And I just wonder. I just want them to. Oh, you do that too? I do that too. Stop. I tag Revolve in so much shit. I'm like, it's so weird because I can't believe they wouldn't invite us. But you like, oh, but you actually

feel like in order shit from Revolve secretly. I secretly do. I'm more of an Elise Walker kind of hoe, but like, I'll fuck with Revolve. It gets delivered in 24 hours in L.A. So I'll leave it. Listen, the Revolvvv chicks are hot. I have to give that like you know you're super hot when you're invited on a revolved trip oh you're the hottest i mean i get that i know where i stand aesthetically i'm not getting invited especially post vital

proteins gate but um you know so your ed vital protein i even remember jack it's an etched in my brain but like tell the people who might not know so you're sitting there you're like i'm hilarious Yes, and you tell a joke on your story. I, yes. I, we're at the dinner at Nobu Malibu, okay? We're having like, you know, a full chef's dinner by the water. It's all very glamorous, whatever. Nobody's really eating.

Nobody's really drinking. I was like, listen, I'm going to hit this shit hard because I'm pretty sure I'm never going to be invited back. So I'm like eating all the food and drinking all the drinks and like making up for everybody else who's like having ice chips and cigarettes. And I was very much so in the mindset, like, this is just a girl's trip for me and my friends. So I posted a video at the dinner and I put Morgan and Heather on screen and I said, look at these stupid fucking whores.

Something like that. You did. I did that. And didn't think anything of it started getting, I got like a notification that Instagram does not. tolerate bullying or sexual harassment or something like that. And I kind of just glazed over it. I was like, what the fuck is that? I don't know. And then as the night progressed, some of the girls who were like pretending to like me just because they were afraid of me and what I was going to say about them, we're like, what's your Instagram account?

Like, give me your handle. And I was like, it's at Jackie Schimmel with two M's. And they start typing it in. And they're like, is this? And it was. It was. You couldn't search it. And I started getting really, really self-conscious because I'm like, oh, my God, like, A, I am definitely the least successful person here. Like, I don't really, I should not be on a trip like this. And it was just, it was becoming more and more evident when the girl's like, oh, that's weird. I can't find you. I can't tag you in this. And I'm like, huh, that's weird. Oh, my God, I can't. And then I got an email from Instagram support, basically saying that I had violated the guidelines, and I don't know what the fuck happened.

From that point on, for about two weeks, not only was I getting all of these policy guideline notifications, they deleted like 30,000 or maybe it was less, maybe like 20,000 of my followers. It was the craziest shit. Wait, so the horror thing, that was one. And then another one, which, like, I, again, this is engraved in my brain forever. there was you put up a text message thing with you and your husband and you wrote like I'm going to beat you up or like I'm going to kill you or like something. I'm going to I think I said something like I'm going to stab you or something like that and that got removed. But did you realize at that point that like for it to be removed Instagram isn't like noticing it? It means people are like reporting it. Right. Yeah. I believe so. I had a lot of caption issues that I had to go in. Why? I have an email from Instagram support that was sent to Dear Media that is I literally just got framed by Framebridge. I don't do free plugs. But I have a huge portrait of it coming, framed portrait, that said something about like me promoting beastiality, terrorist activity.

I'm dead. No, I can't. Violence and, you know, calling people whores and sluts and stuff like that. You freaking guys, thank you, Olive and June, for choosing me to partner with you for your amazing product. They have a manny system, an at-home manny system to create the perfect nail, the perfect at-home mani. Because like, you guys, how many times have I told you? I can't go get a manning girl because I don't have time. And like, I don't even enjoy it sometimes at the salon because I'm just thinking of all the ish I have to do. I can't even be in my freaking phone. So it's not like I'm like, can get things done. So Olive and June, liver is legit exactly what you need, nothing less, nothing more, which is what I love.

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olive and June.com and if you use my promo code not skinny, you get 20% off your first manny system. Your new nail life is here, you guys. We're done with expensive bad manis. This is the new us. Okay. Go to olive and June.com. check out their manny system use code not skinny to get 20% off so for people that don't know like I've experienced it a bunch of times and the way you like know because I feel like so many people when they were hearing that it was a thing we're like I'm totally shadow banned I'm like no bitch you're not you're just like no one sees your shit no one cares yeah no one literally like you get like my little sister being like I think I'm shadow band I only have 200 followers it's like no

actually just no one is on your page but there was a way to check And that's how I check. I'm a fucking loser is that like if people remember like people used to use hashtags like insta photo of the day like whatever. So if you could that's how I would check. It's like you would hashtag something that like there wouldn't be a lot of things under. So let's say like Amanda Hirsch. I love you. You're so hot. There are a lot of those. I put that on every single one of my photos. So yeah. That's not a good example of something that. So I would do that like a hashtag that nothing would almost come up. up. And if you're not shadow banned, it would be in that group of tags. And if you are, it wouldn't. So that's like one of the, one of the, uh, test. And also obviously people typing in your name and you actually not showing up. Yeah. Which, which is scary. And again, the scariest part of it, that it's like a black hole. Like every, it's a gaslighting. Before it was gaslighting. Like Instagram would be like literally like, nope, that's your sweet. But are you crazy? Because like that like, like, and you're like, no, it's actually a thing.

Like it's actually, but then you got deleted. Three times. Three times I was deleted. And I have to tell you, if I was like a different kind of a bitch, people are like, are you okay? Oh my God. I'm so sorry. And I'm like, it's not the biggest deal in the fuck world.

I've never looked at Instagram as like my primary business model. I've always thought it was a bit ridiculous. And like I told you earlier this week, my dream is to be like successful enough to not have one. Unfortunately, that was not the case. in 2019 September, but I, it didn't like rattle me. I didn't, I mean, it was annoying as fuck because I was trying to sell live show tickets and stuff.

But other than that, like, I was off. I was deactivated for over like a while. I think like maybe close to two months. But weren't you like, I would just spin about the fact that like, why me? Like literally that's what would drive me. crazy because, like, you're not, like, crazy active on Instagram. It's that you're not even, like, posting a post a day or, like, you know, or even, like, and mind you, like, there are pages, you guys that are, like, actual nudity.

Like, you could find porn on Instagram, like, or close to it if you wanted to. And there are actual bully accounts and actual people that bully that tell you to go die. And it's funny how many of those I've reported. It's like, sorry, they don't meet your policy or, like, like, literally there's an account that was like, die Amanda and Noah. And they're like, sorry, this doesn't go against our Instagram policy. That was my problem. The fact that the enforcement was so selective, like, listen, I'm not Pollyanna Pure Bread.

Shadow ban me, deactivate me. But then keep it consistent across the fucking board. And the problem is, like, you know, robots can't depict humor. So I'm being penalized for, by the way, I'm not actually fucking my dog. Hot tip. Like, that's a joke. is, do I think he's fucking stunning and sexy? Yeah, he looks like Jude Law.

We all know this. However, like, that's a joke. But Michael Vic, who like was killing dogs for sport, allegedly, I don't really know the whole story. He has an Instagram account. So what's, what's the deal? You know what I'm saying? Or like, I'm such an idiot self-proclaimed.

And like, after the first time I got Shadow Band, I can't remember why. The second time was Chelsea Handler, you know how she loves to show her tits? Yeah. So Chelsea Handler can do that. that, like, they're not deleting her Instagram. You know what I mean? I'm an idiot. I'm like, Chelsea Anler is so funny.

And I legit post her bare-ass nipples on my story as if I'm invincible, right? Right. I get shadow banned, reported, like, the thing deleted. Her thing is still up. And it was just so wild to me. Like, A, I'm an idiot. And, like, why, like, today I obviously wouldn't post, like, a woman's nipples on my story. I get that that's, like, not okay.

But then, like, do you know that I'm, even so scared. And if I'll post like a shirtless man, I'll be like, should I emoji his nipples? Like I don't, I don't know the rules. Like, because I heard like children's nipples are also a problem. It's so crazy. And then when you talk about like, you know, things that are debilitating on the internet, me making a joke about to my husband who married me by choice and that's our fucking banter. I'm not like, it's a fucking joke. That's not okay. But you can get, you know, people warping their faces and their bodies and their realities. And that's not more destructive than me saying that I want to make out with my dog.

First of all, I love when you make out with your dog. First of all, we both have shih Tzu's named Leo. I will say, Oh my God. I thought that. And I couldn't, I didn't know if I was hallucinating that you also have a Shih Tzu named Leo. You know why it's so sad because, like, I legit had a baby and forgot about Leo. Like he's somewhere here, I think.

But like, maybe not. I wonder what's going to happen to you because like I thought I was literally, okay, I wasn't like you. You're a bit like if there was like a spectrum. You're on like the extreme side of like I love my dog. But I was also like making out with my dog every day.

Like love my dog. Like I can't believe people have babies and like done. And then legit you have a baby and you're like, Leo stop like legit. But your Leo looks way cuter than my Leo. I mean, I'm biased. I mean, I have coasters with his fucking face on it. Like, this is what we're dealing with here.

There's, like, portraits everywhere. I love him so much that I would be afraid to love a human as much as I love him because I don't want to know what that looks like. Wait, what? How old is he? He is a sexy seven. I am going to get him cloned. Is that for real? I think I'm going to get him cloned.

I don't think that's a thing. No, it's the thing. You can ask Barbara Streisand. She's done it twice. I think it's probably severely frowned upon and I should be rescuing dogs from the shelter, which I will also do. But it, for my mental stability, I think I need to get him cloned. I feel like it would be a tax write off. Do you love his looks or also his personality? I love everything about him. I think he is stunningly sexy. I think, like, I even love his yeast infection. Like, he has a yeast infection in the left year. And sometimes I don't want to put the ointment in because I'm so aroused by the scent. I can't. You even can't finish the sentence. But like, I have to tell you guys,

like my husband has said weird shit about Leo. Like, he'll hear Leo drink and be like, is it weird that I love the sound of him gulping water? No, it's so cute. It's so cute. And he'll just be like, you know, his farts don't. don't bother me. And I'm like, then why do my farts bother you? Like, it's slightly offensive. Like, Leo can fart up a storm. But I don't know. I feel like my Leo is aggressive. Is your Leo aggressive? I feel like he's not. No, I wish he was more aggressive, actually. He's like lifeless. Is your husband as obsessed with him? Yeah, he totally is. I mean, when we got him, he was really like, I don't want a small dog, you know, I want him golden or something like that. And now he's so in

love with him. And we, the way that we talk to him and about him is disgraceful. Oh my God. So when you leave for like a trip or something, does your heart break? Yeah. We like spend probably 45% of the trip, like looking at photos of him and then talking about him and we're like, yeah, I'm a midi, like we have like a whole weird voice. And like we make these weird sounds. And it's really, really disgusting. And you've had him since he was a BB, like, since he was a boy, like a puppy. Yeah, I birthed him vaginally. No, I know, obviously.

He looks more like you. No, I literally can't. No, he's really cute. You have a highlight. It's like so funny. You had like one story where you put your eyeball back in. And that's like legit. The shih Tzu's and they're fucking patrooting eye eyeballs.

It's crazy. It's, I mean, his eyeballs, I really think could fall out of his head. They're bulging. And I just. can't get enough of them. You guys, I love that we're living in a day that people are talking about things they didn't use to talk about. And one of those things is fertility. People are sharing their individual process and what they had to go through. And it's just, you know, I feel like it's important

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They'll take it back for a full refund. Okay? You're welcome. Well, I can't get enough of you, Jackie Jemel. Let me tell you, I was telling you why I feel inferior to you. Number one was that I knew about you before you knew about me. Number two is like, your vocabulary is like for me and I'm like half Israeli, half Americans. Like I've spent childhood in both, I'm making excuses for myself.

So everyone just pay attention. It's like, I feel like I've lost some years here and there. I'm like, what's that? Like I've just missed out on that few cultural things. a few like just grammatical things. And your like way with language is like, Jackie, stop. You know it. You say big words every other sentence.

No, I know. But I have to tell you a secret. I overcompensate because I have felt inherently stupid my entire life. Like I barely graduated high school. So I feel like I lean into using a lot of big words that I don't necessarily know what they mean. And then they just try them out. And maybe 70% of the time they kind of work in a sentence or nobody knows, no one else knows what they mean either. Yeah. So they're just like, oh my God,

like, wow, big word. But I don't know if I'm using it correctly. I just lean in with it. My grandpa always used to say, yeah, if you can't dazzle them with your brilliance, baffle them with your bullshit. And that is my business model. That's actually amazing. I love. love it. Yeah. I love it. I also love that you have like different things that you say, even though you think you're like not like social media E or like influencer E, but like you have your things that your people know and like it's a thing. So deal with that. So like you have your Brenda. I do have Brenda. Yeah. Is Jenna new for Brenda? I feel like I address people by their for their actual name. So Brenda is a real person, like one of the first people that slid into

my DMs and said something stupid. So like I know who Brendan is. Jenna is the, I do feel like Jenna is the new wave of Brenda. There is an obscene amount of women named Jenna who DM me, like the most like trivial dumb fuck shit of all time. And I feel like I'm doing my due diligence and a service to humanity by addressing them by first name. I think that's polite. Secondly, I think that it's important to tell people when they're being stupid. You know what I mean? Like, it's okay. Help me.

Help me. If you ask something that is outrageously stupid that you have the resources to find out for yourself, I'm going to, I have to tell you. Like, I have to tell you you're being stupid. Because you're not going to hear it from me. You're not going to hear it from anyone else. No one is being honest with you. If you say to me, ooh, where'd you get that like a recipe for something that is so

Like, just fucking Google it. Why are you so comfortable burdening me with your non-resourcefulness? Yeah. No, it's really true and, like, good for you for like being, honestly, I love that. I know you don't think things are like your brand, whatever, but it is kind of. It is. And I think it's so funny, but I think it's so funny when you're like, and don't fucking ask me for the recipe, you know?

Just like, let me just. be annoying and post a picture of my dinner that I made. Like, does everything have to be so interactive? You know what I mean? Like, I give you a podcast every week for six years. Do I now also have to, at 6.30 p.m. while I'm taking a load off, having a teeny, type out a six-page play-by-play on how to make a fucking bolognaz? No. Call Ina Garden. I can't. And it's so true, Jackie. because I, okay, so if it's like my husband makes these like schnitzels, right? Like, very Israeli. So like, yeah, of course everyone's going to die for a recipe.

Half of them don't know what it is, you know? Like, and there are like, so I get it. I'm not going to ask him it because like he makes it. So that's not going to happen. But you are right when there are like certain things like, you know, I'll, I'll see Noah with like a toy. And it's like link it. And like I don't mind linking it because like I'll go into Amazon and link it.

but at the same time. Right. And then we get a kickback. You get a little. Get a little schneckel. Get a little schneckel. But like the amount of things I type into Amazon, like legit, Noah will be chewing on like my son like my case like my glasses case. And I'll just be like glasses case chew toy.

Like it's the easiest thing to just type in and shit comes up. But, um, but it's so funny when you do it. But the thing is, and I told you this, um, when we talked earlier this week is that like, But somehow, like, your swipe up to shop is, like, peepy. Like, I love when you're like, swipe up to shop. Like, love that. But then you actually sometimes swiped up to shop. So, like, how do you think it works and explain it?

Because, like, I've done it too. And, like, more people should have called me out where I'm like, influencers are so annoying. Hey, guys. Totally. But, like, that's, I get it. I'm there with it. But how do you think you pull it off?

I don't know that I am pulling it off. I will say that I think if you're just fully transparent, like I try to let people know what my agenda is and I'm not trying to bamboozle anyone. I literally photoshopped my face onto Julia Roberts as pretty woman post an ad this week, just so people know that I am whoring myself. You know what I mean? It's like I try to let people know. And if someone gives me shit, I literally will just DM them back.

and be like, what would you, like everyone can be bought. I have a price. Sometimes, you know, I'm willing to sacrifice my integrity and look like a hypocrite to hawk, you know, pantiliners so that I can go on a nice vacation. No, but you know what, Jackie, like, it's funny, but it's also like Brenda or Jenna, tap the fuck through. Just tap it. Tap it.

Yeah. This is what I always tell people. I don't encourage free labor across the board. I don't expect anyone to do anything for free. And let me tell you something. The steam would have run out of this kettle fucking years ago without some cashish so that I can cry into new purses. So whatever that looks like for me, it's just going to have, it's just part of the fucking gig. I mean, I try to make them funny at least.

Yeah. And I don't say yes to everything. But, you know, you lean in. You lean in. That's your new mantra, the leaning in. I love it. You know, you got to. And it's not great. I always say if there was something else I could do, if I had a bigger skill set that was more honorable, you know, like if I could be a fucking lawyer or a real estate tycoon or something cool and collegiate, I would have done that. But I don't, this is all I have. Jackie, important to say, you were a pioneer podcastress. How, like you say you're on an you say you're a dumb fuck, but you knew what a podcast was or how to start one before most people. I have to be honest. I really didn't. I didn't even know what a podcast was. I got kind of really lucky. I was a receptionist at an investment bank and I was trying to get fired for a severance package. I swear to God because the girl before me got fired and she got like paid for the whole

year and like it was amazing. And honestly, I was the only person to me off. I was the only person to the office. I was in charge of locking up. So I was kind of left alone in the office for hours. And I got so fucking bored. I started writing housewife recaps. Basically, somehow they watched what happens live. They wanted to book me as a bartender. No, don't say somehow. No, no, no, no. You're not going to skip over. Like, people are going to, like, what do you want people to kill themselves? No, God forbid. Like, we want to know, like, we're going to be like, wait, you could just, no, you were in the investment being trying to get a severance. You were writing recaps for housewives that ended up how and watch what happens live so basically i so i

started a really sad i hate this word blog which i like to call a digital collection of essays because that sounds cuter yeah and i would just like write about the housewives and i submitted one of them to like a lure dot com or something i don't know i submitted it to like an online magazine publication, and they published it. And then I somehow through like a family friend got this meeting with a guy at ESPN. And I was trying to get a job, like just a different job. I thought, oh, maybe I like, I could go husband hunting at ESPN and like work in the fucking mail room or something. I was just desperate. And every one of my family is in real estate or something really boring finance. So I was like, what am I going to do? And he was like,

actually I have a friend at a company called Embassy Row. They do watch what happens live. I was like, oh, my God, what's his email? And I sent him a PDF of like 12 or 13 articles that I had written about the housewives. And he called me and was like, come to New York. I want you to be the bartender. I'll watch what happens live. And then when I got there, he was like, I'm starting a podcast network.

Would you be interested in posting a podcast? And I was like, what the fuck is a podcast? And I said yes. And then I called in sick to work a couple times so I could go do it. And they found out. And then they said, either you have to stop doing this or we're going to, you know, fire you. And I was like, fuck you. I'm out.

And then I had no income for like two years. Wait, was this Michael? Michael. No, a different Michael. A different Michael. I met Michael Bostic, who runs Deeruner. media probably like a year or two after I started podcasting. And I said to him, he was like, maybe we'll start a network. I'm like, well, when you do, I'm coming with you. Oh, so you moved

networks. You weren't at Dear Media from the very beginning. No, no, no. I was with a different company for the first three years. And they're a major television production company. So luckily, I had, you know, a producer. I had someone helping me from the beginning. I was able to get bookings. But I had no idea what I was doing. I mean, it was terrible. Don't ever listen. You'll want to die. Wait, it's the same. It's like the bitch Bible from the beginning. Yeah. Was that what you called like the collection of essays? Yep. Oh my God. Jackie, that's like, I mean, I know you want to laugh about it, but it's kind of amazing, you know? It's, it's crazy that it worked out because I got to tell you there were it was it was looking pretty dicey for the first couple years but because there

weren't that many podcasts I was kind of able to like get in there within like six months you know I was regularly charting and I I had ads and I was like what the fuck is going on you know because there wasn't it wasn't as saturated there wasn't as much competition so I did get really lucky in the sense that I got in you know almost seven years ago that's amazing that's amazing and do you feel like do you feel like today like it feels really different like the podcast space and the fact that like your dentist has one and like your you know hair dresser has one or whatever yeah i get in trouble all the time because people always ask like that's like i literally just did um i'm just name dropping here i did a article for Forbes a couple weeks ago where

I was asked to give advice about people wanting to start podcasts. And I literally, my first line, they were like, we're going to need you to be like a little bit more encouraging. I was like, honestly, I would say don't. I would say look for the next, the next big thing because it's fucking hard. You guys, listen, you know I have anxiety, but I also love, you know, a little pick me up. I need my morning coffee. But then throughout the day, I get slumpy. I need like a second, a third, a fourth, a fifth. But then that makes me kind of jittery and antsy plus. I love snacking. Thanks, Verb for existing. Verb is your new afternoon slump fix. It's a cute little snack bar that has 90 milligrams of caffeine. But what's so amazing, it's not the like coffee

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free and just pay 95 cents for shipping. It's so funny. I listen to your podcast or like the beginning of with Hannah burner and just the beginning you were like so I said

I wouldn't have any like more bravo people and here you are and she's like yeah and you were like yeah I don't know

you guys are like I don't even know and I was like oh my God I thought that I like you know I don't even know the word

like you know felt comfortable asking guest questions Or like being, but you literally like a, she came on and you were just like, I didn't watch your show at all. Who are you? And also, I don't usually ever want to have Bravo people. So like, I don't know why this is happening.

And like, she was graceful with you. But honestly, I would be so fucking offended. I would be like, really? Like for me, if someone invites me on their podcast, like, I'm like, are you following me? Are you in love with me? Would you die for me? Like, I'm not going to just come on your podcast. If you don't know who I am and you like, like, no.

You know, it wasn't my finest moment, but I was just being authentic. Because I had said so many times, I'm like, no more fucking bravo lebs on this podcast, okay? I flew too close to the sun. I got burned. Right. I like watching them from the convenience of my sofa. I, you know, I can't do the fucking thing. And honestly, even just like celebrities in general, it's difficult to have them on when you try to not edit and you don't want people saying, we can't talk about this.

You can't talk about that. And then you worry about people being affiliated and I, you know, it's a whole fucking thing. It is. It is a whole thing. It is a whole thing. And also, Bravo lately. And this is like inside scoop, you guys. Bravo lately has been very scared probably because of the whole too close to the sun situation.

So like I've done podcasts with Bravo people and like all of a sudden the fucking PR person is on the line in which I hate like makes my blood boil and like twice they like jumped in. So like imagine you're in a Zoom. The PR person is there which is already uncomfortable for everyone. Then they're like chatting me on the Zoom being like don't ask that next question. And I'm ignoring it. I'm like so. And then they jump the fuck on the line and are like can we? Jackie, when I tell you like my blood pressure. pressure like through the roof like into the sky and me being like so what the fuck do you want me to talk about if not the fucking storyline of this season you know what I mean like what oh my god when they say that like yeah they'll come on but they can't talk about anything about the real housewise I'm like do you think I care about their life like about their outside life like we're talking about the housewise I don't want to hear about their quarantine gardening habits like for fuck sake give me the goddamn, like, that's all I want to talk about. So fuck you.

I'll do it myself. No, it's literally, it's become hard, especially today because I think podcasts used to be more free for all. So that's where they would feel comfortable talking shit because they think that it's a safe place. But then podcast kind of came like, became like, you know, another media where shit goes out into the world. So people became really scared.

right can i discuss something important with you about me please yes okay i need to discuss this with you because like you are actually cool and i pretend to be so do you know my obsession with courtney cardassion yes i do i'm very very well versed in everything courtney cardassian and travis barker because i follow you on instagram i feel like i have a wealth of knowledge that I never needed to have or was even slightly interested in until I started following you on Instagram. And now I, like, am so up to speed that it makes me uncomfortable. So this is your fault.

First of all, you're welcome. Second of all, do you ship? Do you ship? Okay. I don't know what ship means. Does that mean like, so. I swear to God, I, that means like, like, um, like support. Support the relationship.

Yeah. Oh, ship is from relationship. Yeah. Oh, cute. Do I ship it? I think I ship it. Like, would you, okay, so Scort or Cravis? I got to tell you something. I would be very happy if Scort, like, made it official and got married. Like, I don't know why. And I should clarify, I don't actually, the only elegant thing about me is that I don't watch keeping up with the Kardashians. Like that's like my, I feel very cool saying that out loud because it's true and I watch everything else under the sun. But I do. I would like, I would like a scort wedding. First of all, you're missing out on life. Second of all, you would love it. Thirdly. So yeah. Listen, Scott. Thirdly. So yeah. I always do. Trilogy. See this is why I'm an idiot. I'm like one this. And then I stop. It's like I have one. Always just one thing. Um, but anyway, so, okay, listen, I'm just trying to give this a really good, like, advance just to tell you guys. And I can't post this on my Instagram because again, I'm really trying hard to not look like a loser because I post everything. And I've told my followers already when Courtney has watched my stories. I posted it. You must fucking die. Whatever. Like you say, I died. So wait. Wait, Jackie. Just fucking wait.

So, okay, I posted when I've seen her watching my stories, posted when I saw her watching my stories, posted when I saw her and Travis watching it. Like, you know how when you look at your views, like, I guess like the verified people are on top, like their faces are the first faces. So like, I'm like, Travis Courtney. I'm like, what? Now, you guys, I don't even know. I can't even breathe. I can't even breathe today. So I never ever, even though I'm a loser and I ship Courtney and everything.

I never, like, respond to her stories because I'm not, I don't respond to people that I'm not, like, friendly with, you know, and like, whatever. But I don't know how or why she posted that she went on Addison Ray's podcast and because it's like a podcast, whatever. So I responded. That's thrilling, a thrilling listen, Addison Ray's podcast. Everyone just go subscribe to that shit storm. I'm sure it's so good. So I responded, come on my podcast. I die.

Everyone, take a breath. She wrote, Courtney Kardashian responded. You heard it here first. She said, oh my God, should I?

exclamation, exclamation. Wade, Jackie Schimel, there's more. Oh, my God. Give it to me. Give it to me. When I tell you guys that I laid on the floor,

my husband's parents were here from Israel, I laid on the floor. And I'm like, I'm dead. like they think I'm such a freak like I can't so I literally I'm like what do I answer like dead dead dead so I answered which like you can't like don't shame me in retrospect because I can't take it back I wrote I am dead I wrote I am dead because like I told you then I have to give the RESP

CT you know like I'm not going to pretend like oh hey court like no you deserve your moment to know like you're better than me so I was like I am dead yes you should and it was in cap so I wrote sorry for yelling. I am very excited. And I.L. Why is that? You know what? Honestly, I think it's great. I think you did a really great job. You don't want to act too cool because that's like very off-putting. And you've already established the dynamic with your fandom and your Instagram stories. Like, you can't backpedal now and be like, hey, girl, cool. Like, what's your sketch like? That would make you seem like an actual psychopath. Wait, Jackie Shamel, when I said, there is more, there is more. She responds. Don't even tell me you got a contact info. No, don't, don't push it. So she, she responded.

And I wrote I L.Y, which like, I'm just saying. She wrote, I love you, exclamation. Hold. I feel like we're besties. Ha, ha, ha. What? Good. night. Wow. That is crazy. I did not know this was happening when we saddled up for this

podcast. I wanted to spring. Remember at the beginning? I was like, Jackie, you don't know what we're going to talk about. So I forgot about it until like the very end. But like, okay, you guys, I love you. Courtney said to me, I love you. I feel like we're besties. Ha ha. Wow. As a married woman, Jackie like both of us are married like we're not getting this kind of DM action you know we're not getting sliding and slithering we're not getting this is the excitement I need in my life you know what I mean I totally like totally totally totally totally understand that I it's so funny I was talking to my husband recently and it's like you know when you like make a new friend even if it's like an internet friend and it like feels so exciting I think that's what happens when you're married

because you're not out dating. You're not like meeting guys at bars or not yet. We'll give it another couple years and then see how I feel. And when you like meet a new friend that's like cool and like likes you and gives you the validation and then you're like planning things. Like it's so exciting. Wait, Jackie, is that me? Are we talking about me and you now?

Yeah, of course. I'm talking about you. And it's like it's just like a new fun. It's so true. So take that. Take a. take a Jackie Schimel or an Amanda and fucking Courtney Kardashian it up. For real.

For real. Jackie. Okay. So you guys. So that was a thing. It's like where do I go from here? And you're right. You made a very good point.

I can't make it cool at this point. You know, it's like I can't be like, that's so crazy. I'm right outside your house. You know? No, you can't be like, oh my God. It's so weird. I'm doing a trip to Calabasas next month. Like if you're around, here's my name.

number like you can't be cool about it you can't you can move you can transition from whatever you are now i'm not going to put a label on it i'm not going to insult you in your own home but whatever that relationship is super fandom you can transition that to like a cool normal person but you need to have face-to-face contact well first of all jacky you know what i am you're not giving me enough credit because I don't feel like she thinks of me as a fan account. I don't. I'm being honest with myself. I mean, I just, okay, she, okay, let's just call a spade a spade because I love you. You are reposting photos of her out to dinner with the children on vacation at Nobu, tattooing, more outfit. But why would she say? She could have said, thank you for the fan page. She didn't say

that she said and I'm gonna read it again I love you I feel like we're besties ha ha ha she's not saying that to planet Courtney K or I love you Courtney Kardashian you're right you're right because she thinks I'm cool she might think I'm cool you are cool I know that you're cool I'm just trying to help you nourish this relationship because that's why I need advice from you because I feel like you could do it I feel like you could like you could like okay this is my question for you as a cool person as a as a podcast dress do I backpedal to the podcast offer do I try to have her on my podcast is that going to ruin our friendship because it's going to be so bad I don't that the podcast ask is a weird one I will tell you

firsthand um I'm friends with Jennifer Garner and she she we were on a trip and she mentioned coming on the podcast. And obviously, it would be lovely, great for downloads to have that bitch on the podcast. But also, I was like, listen, you're kind of famous. If you say something that's fucked up. I don't want it to be on me. I don't want it to create a divide and be weird. And so I was like, eh, you know, let's not. Now, granted, she just grabbed a mic and and got on anyways. However, it was one, it was a situation that I, I kind of went back and forth on. I was like, is that weird? I would say, I would kind of lean into that and be like, listen, I don't want to ruin our friendship. But if you're down, I'm down. Mm-hmm. That's what I

would say. Very nonchalant. I think my caps are like not nonchalant. You mean you're literally speaking in all capitals? What would be your response to her? Okay. Her last thing I will repeat was I love you. I feel like we're besties. Ha ha. What should I answer? Should I answer? Should I like it? Should I emoji it? Oh, don't emoji it. That's too much. I would do a elegant, tasteful heart. When did she say this? Did this happen today? Yeah, right before a podcast. Oh my God. Okay. So, this is fresh. So you've also given it some time because you don't want to be like annoying, like instantly like typing, typing, typing. So I would hit it with a double tap and just be like, this is you're amazing, like something cool, but also flattering. Like,

you're amazing. If you ever want to come on my podcast, the door is wide fucking open. Let me know. I love it. I love it. Cool. Calm. I love it. Yeah. I think that the pot, you're right. And the only reason I'm backpedaling on the podcast is just because that's what connected us. By the way, you might need to fly out. You might need to business expense it and fly to fucking Calabasas. You can come stay with me. I live right down the street. But Jackie, she would be a bad guest.

Let's be honest. The worst of all time. I mean, like absolutely the worst. It would be one word answers. It would be whatever. But it would be incredible. Incredible. You would have to come in there with like a fucking 60 page script. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Well, I'm so glad I got to share it with you. And also it's really important for me to know scored or cravis.

Even though I feel like I could know with you that it's scored because I feel like you're old school. And like, although you're up to speed with like my shit, you're like, I don't think you're aware of like Scott's shit, you know? I know bits and pieces I just I don't know I like the nostalgia and the scent I'm a sucker

for regression you're a sucker for regression and okay I know you have a hair appointment and so I'm gonna let you go which I hate when people say let you go too

I'm like you're gonna let me go I'm not ready to wrap up letting me out of my cage thank you oh Jackie Shimmel where can everyone find you no I'm just kidding everyone can find me

at the Bitch Vival podcast that comes out on Tuesdays. Then on Mondays and Fridays, you can listen to my guided meditation podcast called My Body No Soul. If that doesn't work and I'm not Shadow Band, you can follow me at Jackie Schimmel on Instagram. And you guys, if you type in Jackie Schimmel and she doesn't pop up the first, scroll, scroll, scroll, you'll find her. She'll be at the bottom, but she'll be there.

She might be shadow banned for French kissing her dog, but do not judge her. That's the vibe. And we love it. Love wins. Thank you, Jackie, so much for being on. Thank you. You're the best. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Not Skinny but Not Fat. Follow me on Instagram at Not Skinny but Not Fat. Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple Podcast and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocharoo. Thank you guys so much for listening.

And I'll see you next Tuesday. Thank you.