Not Skinny But Not Fat - Olivia Munn: Surviving Cancer & Her Comeback

Episode Date: June 17, 2025

Olivia Munn is here!!! We talk about surviving breast cancer, sharing her story, battling postpartum anxiety (which she says was harder than cancer), toddler tantrums, and finding her way back to herself. She opens up about how John Mulaney supported her through the hardest year of her life, what it’s like returning to Hollywood with her new iconic role in Apple TV’s Your Friends and Neighbors and what we can expect from season 2 that’s already filming.Take the Breast Cancer Lifetime Risk Assessment: https://magview.com/ibis-risk-calculator/This episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct, or indirect financial interest in products, or services referred to in this episode.Venmo everything with Venmo Debit Card. Visit Venmo.me/debit to learn more and sign up today.Use the code “AMANDA” on Rhoback.com for a generous 20% off.Upgrade your space with the most stylish, customizable, and elevated sofa bed available. To get up to $250 off your new sofa, plus fast shipping, go to us.koala.com/amanda. Koala—comfy, easy, sustainable.Visit CleanSimpleEats.com and use code NOTSKINNY20 at checkout for 20% off your FIRST order.This year, skip breaking a sweat AND breaking the bank. Get your summer savings and shop premium wireless plans at mintmobile.com/notskinny.Find your new summer uniform at Jenni Kayne. And our listeners get 15% off your first order when you use code NOTSKINNY15 at checkout. That’s 15% off your first order at jennikayne.com, promo code NOTSKINNY15. Let getting dressed be one less thing to worry about.Go to shopminnow.com and enter code MEETMINNOW15 at checkout to receive 15% off your first order.Produced by Dear MediaSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Okay, you guys. So you're not living under a rock. You've heard about a little thing called Venmo. I'm sure you use it every day. I'm sure you have a list of friends on there. But did you know that Venmo can be used for more than just paying your friends back? Yep. It is true. Allow me to introduce you to the Venmo debit card, which allows you to spend your Venmo balance in so many ways. Yep, you can Venmo this, that, and everything. No, seriously, everything. If you can shop for it, you can pay for it with a Venmo debit card. I can Venmo this mic that I'm speaking into, these headphones, this coffee that I'm drinking,

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Venmo purchase restrictions apply. The Venmo Mastercard is issued by the Bank Corp Bank N.A. pursuant to license by MasterCard International Incorporated. Card might be used everywhere. MasterCard is accepted. The following podcast is a dear media production. Welcome back to the not skinny but not fat podcast. I'm your host, Amanda Hirsch, and I still can't believe that I get to chat with some of my favorite stars on my very own podcast where you'll feel like you're just talking shit with your best friends in your living room. You guys, me and my guest today,

Wooden S the F up. Okay, so I'm not going to do a long intro today. I'm so excited about this guest. I've wanted her to come on the show for such a long time. I'm such a huge fan. I think she's just great. I think her story has helped a shit ton of women out there. there and she's so brave and she's so powerful and she's such a powerhouse and she's smart and

she's glad. And she came on my pod. So Avi, we love her even more than we have ever before. She's also amazing in your friends and neighbors obsessed with that show. Go binge it right now. If you haven't, they're already working on season two. She's also a mom of two and she's also the wife of a hilarious comedian. Yes, it is the one. The only Olivia Munn is here. and listen, there's just some people that you, for me personally, like I've wandered on for such a long time. She's finally here. And we went over in time and then we spent two hours at night chatting away

about all the stuff that we didn't get to on the pod. So enjoy my conversation with Olivia Munn. I'm fucking lover. And I love you too. Okay, bye. Okay, I'm ready. Let's start. Let's start talking.

Okay. You're way too pretty for this pod. You're so pretty. Oh, stop. You know you're pretty. No, I do. Yes, you do. Your face is so pretty. Your body is amazing. Your kids are so cute. I can't wait to do a play date. Oh my God, I know. Well, you're here now. Yeah. I'm so excited. You're not like

showing a lot of New York content in your like stories. Because I've been working nonstop. That is true. But I had that one with my kid. I don't know if you saw that one where he was like walking through the streets. No, no, no. I saw that and I. Yeah, we can talk about that. My family's so loud. I'm so loud. You're not loud. You're soft spoken. I've become softer in my speaking only over the last few years, truly, with everything going on. I just kind of, well, just because you have to go through cancer, I think, to be like, oh, nothing is really that serious anymore, truly. But I used to talk like this all the time. And I still have moments like that, and I'll think, like, I'll turn to John and want to say something that's like secretive,

but I'll be talking to him like this. Olivia, they can hear you. I'm like, no, they're not, they don't even care. They're listening. And then, but then sure enough, like, they heard. Yeah. But I'm always thinking, are people just, I mean, I'm not listening to other people's conversations. I'm doing my own thing. I do that, which my husband hates, because he's the most shy, anxious, like, whole thing that people are looking at him when they're not. And I'm, like, talking loud, like, no, they're not, no one's listening. So I need you to teach me your ways because my dream in life is to be soft-spoken and mysterious

like you. Oh, I don't know if I'm, I'm mysterious. Do you think I'm mysterious? A little mystery. Oh, what do you think is mysterious? Like, we see you. Uh-huh. But, like, I feel like you're not like one of those front face to camera.

hey guys, you know. But when you give it, it's like just a little. Like, here's a taste. Okay. Here's a taste. I appreciate that. Of me and my glasses at home being all perfect, you know, like, you know when people are in the middle of crying and then they turn on their camera and they make a video in the middle of them crying, like those always make me feel so uncomfortable. Yeah. You can't do it. Well, no, I would never do that. But then there was one time back in December and John had just started on Broadway. And he was, was doing all these rehearsals and it was nonstop work for him. And I had our brand new baby girl and then our son who just turned three and now also has a new baby into the mix. And then daddy's not around and he

spends so much time with him. And then it was like one of the hardest moments of my life. Those two week, that two week period was so difficult. And then I broke down crying one night and I literally turned my phone camera on. But I only did video messages to my other. or two girlfriends who have children, like one was about to have a child and had a son the same age as mine. And then another one was like, just had theirs. And so I was like, this is what's to come. And I'm just telling you like, it's okay. And I just, it felt so cathartic to send that to my friends. But that's not something I would ever post. But you know how much engagement it would get? Fucking crazy. I'm just telling you. And then you realize because I see like mommy bloggers,

like the straight up ones. Yeah. The ones that only post like things about. kids. And you would, you know, like, kids and family are such a hot topic and everyone's interested in how everyone's doing things. Like, what baby carrier? I remember you posted that, by the way, because I related to that so much where you were like, I always pictured myself, like, being cute with my baby. Oh, with the, with the rap? Correct. That is so difficult. May is eight months old, but she weighs more than 12-month-old. How much does she weigh? She's 22, 23 right now, pounds. Damn. I know. I'm wondering what's Lenny. Well, the last time I weighed him, he was 20 pounds.

How old does he know? He just turned one. She's eight months, yeah. I know. Chubby was so squishy. Was Malcolm this chubby? I can't remember. Yeah, he was very chubby.

He looked like he was going to explode. He was like so shiny. She's got more of a squishy kind of chunk to her. But they're both very easy, very happy babies. That's amazing. So Malcolm started going through like the toddler phase because we talked about you posted that video of him walking barefoot in New York. But I gave that as an example because I think that day like my kid was being difficult. And it was like, what do you do, like, in that moment?

And then you flash back to all these reels that you've watched of, like, what to do gentle parenting style, what to do more aggressively, like, what your mom did probably was like, shut the fuck up, you know? Yeah. And then you don't know what to do, but there was a moment where Noah was throwing a tantrum when I remember that. I was like, literally Olivia Munn led her child to walk barefoot in New York because he was throwing a tantrum and like, pick your battles.

He was happy. It's not dangerous, even though maybe he's, yeah. So what, did you get any messages that were like, how did you let him? I mean, it was socks. I didn't see any of those until there was a, I saw some news article that came up that was like, fans are mom shaming Olivia. And I, and I, it took so long to find that comment. Like, what are people?

Because everybody else was like, I get it, I get it. And then there's somebody that was like, oh, like she has help and who's taking that photo. And, you know, yes, we have people who help us. But the way that our parenting style is, is that. if we are there, we spend the time with our child. Yeah. We take the walks with them.

We, you know, in this particular situation, I was by myself with Malcolm in a stroller with May strapped to me. And he's usually so easy going. He loves going out. And I tempted him with all the things he loves. Let's go to CVS, which is his Disney World. I know. You told me that once.

And like, you keep coming back to it. I'm like, wow, that stuff. You know, because so many parents will say, like, have you taken them to Disneyland, Disney World? I go, why? Why would I do that to myself? when CVS is on every corner. What does he like there? Is he going to the toy out?

He likes makeup sponges. He likes the car. They have this big car rack of like different like, like, that's so funny. It's a, it's like, it's the best. Wait, so what are you doing in LA, drive to one? Yeah, I've gone to CVS so much in my life. And then I'm there, I, you know, pick up some makeup for myself. Yeah, yeah, there's always something to buy.

Yeah, yeah. But that day I was outside the CVS and he had just thrown the biggest tantrum. And the other thing I didn't put in was that. He needed to go to the bathroom as soon as we get there. And I go into this really big CVS, and they said there's no bathroom. Yeah. There's no bathroom in here. You're like, where do you pee?

It was insane. Yeah, where do you pee? I mean, there has to be an employee bathroom. Yeah, right. So then I'm... For a kid, a lot of times I feel like they make the exception, but they didn't. No. Okay.

And then I had to take him into, like, a deli that was right on the corner and buy a sandwich and then, you know, and then put it away. But then when I came out, one of my girlfriends had called me. And I was like, this is so difficult right now. And I'm thinking I'm going to break down. And she's like, where are you? And I was like, I'm on the corner of whatever it was. And she jumped into Uber, came, got me. And then he didn't want to look at her.

He was like, only my mommy. She's like, well, how can I help? And then she's like, what about can I carry May for you? And then Malcolm is like, no, only mommy. And like, I know that you're not supposed to let your kids like dictate everything. But it was so hard that day. And so at first he let her push the stroller, and then that's when she got that photo of me and him. But she had to stay behind us and couldn't interact with us, he said. Now, I'm making him think, but he's a three-year-old. He's a three-year-old

a tyrant emperor. By the way, like, if you have kids, you know. Like, it's one of those things that may be to people. And by the way, I, and I wondered this about you because I admit this, like, before I had kids, I was so judgmental. I did. did the like I would never do that and like I will do this with them or like I would see my sister doing things and be like how does she let her kid tell her what to do like I will and then you are in the situation and it's like survival mode like we left my sister's house yesterday with a plate I walked home with a plate because that was the only way to get no it to leave and it's like they fuck with you because he didn't really want the plate he was just like I'm not going to make

this easy you know yeah it's like let's go and he's like only if I can take the plate right I'm like, what do I want? A screaming, crying tantrum, or a let's go. So I like literally walk on with a plate. I called my pediatrician when I got back, and I was like, hey, this is what happened. We walked through the streets of New York for a very long time, for over a mile. And I stupidly thought that those little rubber things in the bottom of socks would be enough to protect his feet. And when we got there, I went to go take off his socks.

And then I saw that there was like gritty. like a honeycomb grid mark, like in black on his heel. And I thought, oh, my God. And then I called her and she said, did you walk around in the streets? Without shoes? I was like, yes, I was born in the 80s. I grew up in Tokyo. We literally were in the streets of Tokyo, like crossing busy intersections with no shoes, no parents, just literally like eight-year-olds walking around. And she's like, he's fine. He's fine. And that's why I didn't see any negative feedback until, like, there's one place that wanted to make it into something. But I don't think I've ever had the judgment for other mothers like that because my mom

was, she was a mother of five by the time she was 27. And she was raising two stepchildren. And of course, when you're younger, I'm like, my mom is a tiger mom. And she's so scary. And she's yelling all the time. But as you get older, you're like, man, you were only 27 when you had to deal with like. Wait, it was you have four brothers and sisters, including two of them were a step or plus two step.

Like, so it's a stepbrother, step sister. and then two blood siblings, sister and brother. That's crazy. I know. Can you imagine being 27 and going through that? And so I think I have a harder time with the friends who want to offer advice as if their life is so perfect. Like I was going through this tantrum face with Malcolm. And I called one of my friends who has three children and around the same ages.

And I said, what did you, what do you do? What am I supposed to do? And then it's like on the verge of tears. And she says, oh, I'm, we didn't really have that problem. Bye. I was so mad. I was like, you, so you don't, you know, she's like, no, they never really, none of my kids have really thrown tantrums.

Like, what are you talking about? Yeah, it's crazy. But you know what I think you should do? If you really come up with like a more structured schedule, like they really need to know what's happening, they need to like anticipate things. So like when you keep their structure really solid and they know what's They're scheduled. And there's no more anxiety. And I was like, I am. There is a, there's a nap time. There's structure. There are alarms on my phone that tells me what to do. But then you try to like tell an

emperor what to do. Wait, so, but I'm trying to. Okay. So you said both of them were like chill, easygoing babies. Then now he's an emperor or like he has an emperor's side to him. No, no. So here's the problem. So John and him are, you know. That's funny. It is. We're under the ruling of an emperor. And John, so. a lot of time with Malcolm. We both do, but there's this special bond that they have. And when John started going on to Broadway, it was the first two weeks where it's just rehearsals all the time and then like previews and all that. And then I think it was hard for Malcolm to like not have as much time with his dad. Even if it's just for two weeks, it was too much. And then I started filming

the second season of my show at the same time John is filming his Netflix show, which was this live show that he was doing once a week for three months. And I had Malcolm and the kids come with me and John would come in and out. Then Malcolm would just be throwing so many tantrums when John was gone. And it was all directed at me. And then when John would come back the first two days, it would be Malcolm still throwing the biggest fits. And then after the second day, I think he realized like, oh, dad's here. And then he felt calm before. So then I was like, okay, For some reason, Malcolm needs to see you every single day. And I love that for both of them.

And so I'm going to be the one flying in and out from New York. So I'll fly in and work for two days and then fly home and be there for like a day and a half and fly back. But it was, I'm telling you, it was exhausting by the end. You did that for the, all for the emperor. That's crazy. That is so much. Like, that's because you're working, you know. So second season of your show, we're talking your friends and neighbors.

Yeah. So already filming or already done? filming right now, still filming, through the end of summer. I'll be here through the end of September in New York, where we get to be friends and hang out finally. Could you imagine May, May and Lenny on, like, I'm at? Oh, my gosh. How cute. Her name means plum and Chinese, and if you take the accent off the E and you say, May, it means little sister.

So we call her May, too. I love that name. Thank you so much. Yeah, it was one of my names, like, spelled the American way. May? Yeah, all the girls that I thought I was having. You think you're done, you're not going to go again for a girl. You know, when you said that, we talked about this already,

but when you said the thing about you hope your son's marry orphans, it was so spot on. You know, I told John before I was like, there's this fear that any of your children will want to literally leave and not spend any of the significant moments with you anymore, which is understandable because look at us. We all grow up and we have our own families. and so I said to John, okay, we need to have the most epic vacations and do the best holidays so that our kids will always want to come home. It'll feel so nostalgic. And we have to let all

their friends come whenever they want. Like you want to bring them on vacation, let's go. You want to come over for Thanksgiving, Christmas, we don't care. No, we were talking about this, like have the best snack cabinets at your house. Like all the fucking things. It is something to think about. No, we don't want to have the home where there's no structure. Yeah. You know, because we like John is the heavy and I am like it's okay you can do this Oh yeah okay I would see it the other way

I know probably most people think that Because he was a drug addict He's chill he's like whatever It's John's house You know he his family He's a wonderful family And his dad was a lawyer And his mom was a law professor

And they were just like really structured And there was like more Now we had discipline in our household But it was just it's a different We were wild, but disciplined. Yeah. Like, my mom didn't care if we all fought each other. We were put into karate really early on, and it was just like...

You have a black belt I saw. Yeah. Do you still know how to karate? I've never called it like that, but yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I do. Yeah. And it's important for my son to do it and my daughter to do it. I want all my children to do.

I started doing it at four years old. Like, is that the only thing that you did? Because I saw like you wanted to fight, like you wanted to show your skills. Would you want to do something like that again? Yeah. Yeah. It's so much fun. Yeah. It's like, it's such, you know, the week, the week after I was diagnosed with breast

cancer, I already had a ticket to flight at Germany to film this action movie, this independent film that I've been trying to film since COVID happened. We were ready to go and then COVID happened. Then 2020, I was pregnant. And then 2022, I had a horrible postpartum anxiety that lasted almost the whole year. Then 2023, I was like, okay, we had everything set. The TPs, the cost of everybody was there. And then I get called into my doctor's office and she's like, yeah, breast cancer. And I was like, well, I'm supposed to go film. Like, is this something I can put off?

And she's like, no, not this kind. So anyways, I was like, I took a very circuitous way to get back to. Yeah, it would be fun to do fight scenes. Yeah. We'll be right back after the break. Okay, you guys, you know, I've been super unrelatable lately and I've been working out a bit. Not a lot. Don't worry.

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like electrolytes or something just so good you just mix it with water and you get the 20 grams of protein so you guys it's delicious it's the best clean simple eats you guys is the protein powder you should be going for visit clean simple eats.com use my code not skinny 20 a checkout for 20% off your first order. That's clean, simpleeats.com. Code is not skinny 20 for 20% off your first order. Link is also in the show notes. You guys, I'm Gabby Wendy, your host of Longwinded. You may or may not know me emphasis on may not, but I did have 26 boyfriends not too long ago

and tragically lost dancing with the stars. And now I'm back with the more freeing and liberating platform than ever, which honestly might make you sorry. With all of this under my belt, naturally I do have some shit to say. In my very sweet, soft voice and public school education, I'll discuss girly topics with a bit of cheek. Topics like gaslighting. Die for it. Internalized misogyny.

One of my faves, honestly, in the depths of the dark dating world. I will beg you again and again to come and listen, but most of all, I hope you enjoy. And we're back. You're so fucking busy. Can we talk about that for a second? You've had a few crazy years already. I mean, you shared your cancer diagnosis, which was just so helpful. I mean, you posted the stats.

How many people did you, you got so many people into, like, testing into doing that? I've heard, it's gotten back to me that it was like a 4,000 increase in people taking the lifetime risk assessment test. And that, I can't. It was like a 300% increase in people requesting mammograms. But that's all I wanted was for women to know about this test. and start to be more forceful with their doctors about getting the test they need. I mean, we have to really advocate for ourselves. And thankfully, I had a doctor who is so amazing, Dr. Alibati, who was the advocate for me.

She advocates for all of her patients. Without her, I don't know how far it would have gotten before I found it, because I had a clear mammogram just at that moment, so I wasn't due for another year. You were doing them since turning 40. Like, that's what you do. I did it. So I was pregnant at 40. And so I did it, I did my first one at 41 after I had the baby.

Oh, that was the first, okay. My first, at 40, when I was pregnant, I did the ultrasound. She, because you wanted to check. And then when I was able to do a mammogram after having my baby, then we got the mammogram, that was clear. And then I had another clear mammogram and another clear ultrasound. And then it was right around that same time when she sent me in for an MRI. And then I found out I had breast cancer.

So it was a clear mammogram. And then she did this thing called the Lifetime Risk Assessment Test. Uh-huh. And this is the reason why I wanted to talk about what's happened in my journey publicly is because so many women don't know about this lifetime risk as has been test. It's a free online test. It takes minutes. You don't even have to put your email in or a subscribe or do anything like that.

You answer questions like, how old were you when you got your period for the first time? Have you had any children? How old were you when you had your first child? Things like that. And it gives you a score. Anything above 20% is considered high risk and high risk for your chance of getting breast cancer in your lifetime. And then you should ask your doctor to go do an MRI. And mine was 37.3%.

So I had the clear mammogram. I had the clear ultrasound. Dr. Ali Body is doing the Lifetime Risk Assessment test in her office right there. She says, you have a really high score. I want you to do an MRI. I said, okay. I thought nothing of. I said, okay, just another thing you check off and it's going to be clear.

And then I went in for that MRI. And by the time I got home, I got a call from the radiologist saying we found something. and we need you to do an ultrasound now to double check it. I was in our dining room at that time. I remember just exactly where I was. And then John walks in from outside and you just sees this look on my face. And I'm usually pretty, I stay calm with my emotions, you know, I think because I've had so many times in my life where I haven't been able to control my anxiety or depression or

anger. And so I've really, like having children, you're like, okay, you have to really be like a baseline. Right. So all of a sudden, I'm just feeling really afraid. and I just kind of knew that there's something. I guess, you know, hey, you have that pit in your stomach. You're like, I just feel like something. And then when I got the ultrasound, the radiologist found two more tumors.

And then they discover there was an actual tumor in my left breast as well. And so, like, as they explained it to me, like bilateral, both breast is unusual. Multi-quadrant, meaning in multiple quadrants of your breast. Multifocal meaning multiple tumors and even in one quadrant. of your breast. So I had multifocal, multi-quadrant bilateral breast cancer with an aggressive type of cancer. And so it just floored me. And once I kind of got to a place where I'm like, okay, I think I'm past a lot of the hardest moments. It was like women need to know about this lifetime risk assessment test. Because without that, I would not have known. Yeah. It's not like you

went in because something was bothering you. You felt something. It was like a preventative. Yeah. And then now, since I've talked about it, the amount of of people I have heard and come up to me or send messages through like my agents or my publicist or through another friend through my doctor has sent me messages from patients who come in have taken the lifetime risk assessment test and discovered that they had a high risk and then found out they had cancer. That means early treatment, right? Yeah, that can be the difference between having to do chemo or not.

It can be the difference between having a path to fight this. It can mean the difference between living or counting your days. I mean, you just don't know. Like, there's certain kind of cancers that can double in size every six weeks. My cancer is a fast-moving, fast-growing, very aggressive cancer. And you can't, even the doctors, like, they're looking at this. Like, we can't really predict? Because I said, well, can I go just do this movie?

I'll be back in a couple months. And they were like, no, we don't know how far it's going to go. And after they did my double mastectomy, they found an area of tangerine-sized section of more cancer. Where in my right breast? So that they couldn't even see. Yeah, because I don't know why. All the other tumors were stage one. So the genesis is a stage zero.

And it starts from stage zero, then stage zero turns into stage one. And then stage one can turn into stage two, et cetera. And then they depend on if it makes to your lymph nodes and it's a whole other ballgame. but I was stage one, but all over my breast, and then this one tangerine size section was stage zero. I believe they can still find it because there's a CBS reporter, Allison Hall, who I recently got to know, she was sent off by her boss to take this lifetime risk assessment test based off of my story and was like, hey, just go. Can you, we film you doing this? And she's like, yeah, she's like in her early 30s. And they said, you have a high risk. And then she did a mammogram. And they found

that she has stage zero breast cancer. And she had a double mastectomy. And she told this whole story, which is amazing because I know personally, like, how many lives it saves by getting the message out. And she's so young. But so that's like she had stage zero. So she caught it so early. Yeah. But when they were doing my, they called the margins after they take out, when they take out a tumor, they take out the healthy tissue around it, and they look for margins. And that's where they like, kind of, they keep testing to see, is there cancer here? Is there cancer there? And it basically took them out to like another tangerine-sized section of my breast before we got to like clear margins. Wow. And does that mean you didn't have to go through any chemo or anything?

No, I decided to do a double mastectomy so I didn't have to do radiation. Yeah. And because it hadn't made it into my lymph nodes, I, it's a really aggressive cancer. So they basically were saying like, there is a form of chemo that we can give you. That's the option. Or you can do this full double mastectomy. plus hormone suppressant medicine for five years. But either way, chemo or not, you have to do these hormone suppressants. So we talked about a lot, John and I talked about, like, the pros and cons of it. Like, you know, when you feel like you're being really aggressive and really fighting something, you're like, okay, let me just, let me get all the weapons. And I'll fight it with everything I have. But doing chemo is, it wreaks havoc on your body. And it can shorten your life

in times that you don't even realize it can, it's really hard on your heart, on your body, in every part of you. And so I was like, well, I put that into my back pocket, like, if I ever need it in the future. God forbid. God forbid for sure. So you got the clean bill of health, how long after that, after this? How many, you had five surgeries? Yeah, the last one was an ophrectomy and a partial hysterectomy.

So I took out my ovaries, my fallopian tubes, and my uterus. Is that preventative? Yes. Essentially, it was preventative because I couldn't take the medication that they were giving me. It was so debilitating. I'm still really exhausted. Like, I spend a lot of time in bed or on the couch when I'm not out and about. And I'm really trying really hard to get myself out there and play.

And all of my time is spent with my children if it's not working. Yeah. And I should make more time for my friends and going on girls trips and stuff like that. But do they try to get you to go? Yeah. Yeah. And I'm always like, I always feel so bad because I want to be able to coordinate it and do it and show up. But, you know, when your kids are going through emotional change.

and stuff like that. You just really want to, I mean, for me, I wanted to, like, help them through it and not just disappear for, like, a week, you know, and it could be just a weekend, but I don't know, that's a whole other story, but. Do you think that having Malcolm at that time made you handle it the way you did? Yes. Yeah. I, like, it narrowed everything from me. I was like, I have to stay alive. I have to be here. I have to, I have to fight as hard as I can fight. And, like, stay strong in front of him, too. Yeah. Yeah. And he was so little, he wouldn't have known, but there was, when I came back for my double mastectomy, he said, Mama up, Mama Up, he wanted me to pick him up. So I couldn't, so I kneeled down or I squatted down and have my, like, my, you know, your leg where he can like, like, use it kind of as a little bench.

And I was like, come sit here. And he goes, no, mama, up, up. It's like he really just wanted to be. And that was hard. But then that's when we broke our iPad rule. And I was like, come in bed. Yeah. Yeah. And hang out with me. And, you know, what was really hard was every time I found out more news, it just sounded worse and worse, you know? Yeah. It was like, there's breast cancer stage one. It's in three spots, but it's good. Wait, there's another one. Oh, wait. It's a really aggressive, fast moving kind. We got to move fast. We don't know if it's in your lymph nodes. We got to go check. Okay, you're clear. Oh, wait. No, there's a tangerine size section of more. And when I had my delmastectomy, it went from being what was supposed to be like a few hour surgery to a 10-hour surgery because I started bleeding out.

Yeah. Bleeding out is the wrong. I was bleeding a lot. Hemorrhaging. No, it's bleeding. John tried explained to me. He's like, when you say the words, bleeding out. I think that means that you've died. So, hemorrhaging. Just losing a lot of blood. Yeah. A lot of blood. So that went on for like a while. Yeah. You're so strong. And you sharing your story, I feel like, first of all, and this is, don't be me, but I did immediately click the test when you posted it. You did. I did. Something distracted me because I get distracted very easily nowadays. Yeah.

But immediately it was like, it's a no-brainer to do it. And now that you're reminding me and you're reminding all of us, we need to fucking do it. And that's what's so I love that you shared your story in general, but there's like a specific call to action here that's. That is my mission. That is really all I, like, I want to be a good mother and a good wife and a good friend and sister and daughter. And I want to get this message out to as many women as possible so that every woman is just incorporating it into their. Like, you get your pap smear, you find out your lifetime risk assessment score, you get your mammograms, you get your mammograms, you know, just like it's just to be the thing that. That you do.

Yeah. And I feel like more and more women have been coming out with their stories as well, like public figures and influencers, which scares me for a minute because I'm like, wait, are more people being diagnosed? But then I was reminded, because I said something like that, that as, like, more people are finding out early, you know, and knowing because of information that you shared. So thank you for that. Like, you're truly amazing. And everyone's recognizing that. You were named one of the Time Magazine's Women of the Year this year. Yeah.

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No, we don't condone stealing. I told the friend's mom and then I looked at where it was from and I saw that it was from Minow. And I was like, okay, we need to get these for Noah. They just have such cute stuff. It's a family lifestyle brand, but they have clean lines, simple details, and just like a really beachy, breezy vibe. I absolutely love the boy boardies that I got for Noah, the gingham design. But they have also girls rash guard one pieces and unisex rash guard shirts. Every suit is super thoughtfully designed with comfort performance and protection.

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Yeah. Your friends and neighbors, by the way, you guys, if you haven't watched, sorry. We're going to spoil it. Spoiler alert. We can spoil it, right? Yeah. It's been weeks. It's already out.

So season one, something drew me to, I mean, you, probably, from the beginning. Because it was, like, it's hard for me to, like, start watching a show and get into it. It really, I have like the few shows. I know, I'm with you. And this immediately was like, Olivia Munn, John Hamm, Amanda Peet that I loved in all the movies in the earlier 2000s. She's back. 90s, yeah, something like that. She's so good.

Yes. Ugh, and you became friends with her, right? Uh-huh. Yeah, fast friends. So getting this opportunity or this role, what did that, were you excited about it? What time did this meet you at? It met me at, I had not yet gone public about. having cancer and I had another big surgery coming up and I had already made this decision that I

was done with acting and I was never going to be like posting about like this I'm retired I'm no longer because I was always like when people do that I'm like you're not like a baseball player you know like no you know no one's expecting to show up to the game like yeah you're fine like you know go live your life so I would never have done that but you thought about that I told my agents and managers I said do not put me up for anything I don't want to act anymore like just take it off the table. And this was before the diagnosis? No, this was after the diagnosis. Oh, the after and because of that. Yeah. I mean, I had such horrible postpartum anxiety. Like on a scale of one to ten, I put it at a hundred. And it's something that I didn't hear about. I was ready for

postpartum depression, but I had no idea what was happening to me. And I have so much compassion and love for the moms you hear about in the news who are going through postpartum anxiety. and do some of the most horrific things. And thank God I didn't have any thoughts of self-harm or harming anyone else. But there is just not enough understanding and compassion for what women go through after having a baby. Like our hormones just drop out of control. I couldn't make any breast milk. And I tried because everybody was like breast is best, Olivia, and I had friends who were really pushing me.

You've got to keep trying. You've got to keep trying. You know what, give him nothing else. You're giving him formula? Well, yeah, to supplement, like, I want him to eat. Nope. You can't do that. He will learn to eat. He will not let himself starve. I'm like, he is a newborn. Like, this is crazy. And I tried. And I was like, no. So there was this two-day period. And I had tried everybody. I tried every lactation nurse that my friends, I mean, like three different lactation nurses. I tried the gum. He was latching, but it wasn't coming out. Latching, but there's no milk. So they get so frustrated with that, too. Well, he got lethargic and tired. Because he was probably dehydrated. Yeah. And then I told John, I go, hey, for the next two days, we're just going to power through this and he's going to, you know. And then he was like really supportive. And I was after the first day, he started noticing something but didn't say anything to me. And then finally the second day, he was like, hey, you know, I know that you've got this thing. And I don't want to. He's really thoughtful about it. He's like, I don't want you to feel bad. But we're doing tummy time and he seems more cranky. And he's not really, he seems really tired. It's like, do you think it could possibly be this? And so then my pediatrician said like, we had a scale. So she's like, you. weigh him before you feed him. And then after you feed, still with the same diaper and everything,

like, you know, if he's peed or anything, just weigh the whole thing again. Weigh the whole thing. The whole way, the whole baby again. And he literally like had like fractions of ounces more. So I stopped at that moment. I was like, fuck this. Everybody who's telling me that I need to do this, every mother should be able to feed their child in whatever way they know is best for that child and not feel guilty at all. Yeah. And people need to stop having opinions about how people feed their children. It's insane. Well, people have so many opinions about, that's what I was saying before, about things that have to do with children. It's like people go insane too. Like, their opinion is right. If they use this formula, that's the best one. If you use this,

like, the minute you share a mom-related thing, that's when you'll get like blown up. That's when people really go crazy. So I can't imagine. And going through that when you're going through postpartum anxiety, how did you, did you notice it? Were you clocking it? Like, okay, something's wrong. I should talk to someone. Well, you know, when I decided to stop breastfeeding, my hormones dropped. And I didn't know this for like a very long time for like almost a year. Like after I'd even gone through my postpartum anxiety and got to the other side, I hadn't told my doctor that I stopped breastfeeding a while ago. And they're like, oh, that's a lot of times that your hormones drop and people go through depression and anxiety. And with a lot of other women who are breastfeeding,

they start to taper off. And I went from like, from breastfeeding to not immediately. And it was pretty soon after that I woke up at like four in the morning and my eyes pop open and I start gasping for air. And I feel this tightness in my chest. And it's like that every day for all Almost a year. Like panic attacks then. Every day my eyes would pop open at four. And I would just be gasping for air. And there'd be sometimes when I have to death grip John's arm walking room to room.

I just wasn't thinking about anything. Yeah, it was just your body doing it. Yeah. But then eventually. And then eventually I start to come up with stuff in my head. Like what am I nervous about? What am I anxious about? And then just start creating scenarios.

Were you like the breathing, the like the cysts? Like, what were you thinking? What was I worried about? Yeah. Like things about the baby. It was the strangest thing. I just started worrying that I'm like, how can we afford to take care of him? And John was like, Olivia.

Sorry, I don't mean to laugh. No, no, no. Even his mother was like, you have some good investments, right? I was like, yeah. She goes, did you invest in Uber? I said, yes. She goes, so your money's good. I go, yes, I know it's good.

But I don't think that we can support this baby. Like, I would hear what she'd say. So it was kind of not rational at that point. It was not rational, but I could hear that it wasn't rational, but it didn't matter. I was still like, here's the thing. As I reached out to my business manager, I said, can you give me the total of everything I have? Like, how much do I have? And when I saw it, my heart dropped.

I was like, oh, my God. I thought I had so much more, and I freaked out. And it wasn't until, like, a year and a half later, truly, when I was like past this and then on into breast cancer. I asked him, like, off the cuff, like, how much do I have, like, now? And it was, like, double what I thought it was. And he was like, wait, why did you think that? I go, because you sent this.

He goes, no. And I just, my brain made me look at it differently. Oh, wow. And I was like, wait, and he was like, yeah. I remember being so panicked and having John in those early postpartum days when you're like, I can go out for dinner, and then you never do. You're like, that was dumb. Why did I go out to dinner?

And it's like, so you're like, I'm sitting there, I'd rather be home. Right. And I was like at this, we're at this like Japanese restaurant. I was just like, and I just can't, I can't breathe. And I was like, I just don't think that I have the money to support this child. And he was like, you know, and I couldn't hear anything that he was, I could hear it, but it didn't matter. Right.

Yeah. How did he handle the anxiety, anxiety part? He was really sweet. He was like, okay, so what you're focusing on is money. He was like, because at this point, you know, we're not engaged. We're raising this child together. and we're attempting to have a relationship, you know, for the first time in this whole dynamic. So I had my bills and I had, you know, I have my credit card and he has his and he's very, very, very generous.

And he loves to take care of people that he loves. And in fact, when one time we were talking and he was like, one of my dreams has always been to be able to take care of my parents. He's like, and it's just so frustrating. He said, why? He's like, well, because, you know, they're very successful. His dad is a partner of his law firm. He's very successful. And he was like, it's just, and I was like, okay, well, that bums you out. He's like, I just want to be able to, you know, like tell my dad, hey, I got your, I got your electricity bill this month. I go, you want to get their electricity bill this month? He goes, I mean, just anything. I go, well, you're about to have a full Chinese Vietnamese family coming in and they, you can pay for everything and they will accept it. Yeah. He's a problem solver. So he said, so your issue right now is that you think that you're not going to have any money to take care of our baby. And I said, yes. And he said, I'm getting you a credit card and everything that you want to get for the baby, put it on this. And he called the business manager and he was like, every bill, like put it on in my bill.

Wow. Did that help? It did. It just made me go, because I think I also felt alone. Yeah. Well, now that I'm like playing therapist, right? Yeah. It's like maybe you felt like, okay, we're together, but we're not like together money wise yet.

Or even the mom. I'm supporting this child. Like, you know, maybe you were. And at the time, he was. Because you know what a therapist once told me that is important? Because I'm an anxious person, like I'm on medication. I swear by it. It's good.

Before, when I was dealing with my anxiety and going to therapy really did help because I would say, I just get panic attacks. But it's not about anything. It's just like, and she said to me something like, I forget the number, but she would say, our brain is so fast that you can have like, let's say, 3,000 thoughts that you didn't even process that you thought yet. So when you're standing somewhere, you get a panic attack, you can't. you wake up 4 a.m. can't breathe. Don't know why. You haven't even thought about anything. You don't know it's like registered. You don't even have enough time. Your body is already doing the thing. Yeah. So it's a weird way of like it's all connected, but it's all playing catch up with each other.

Yeah. Like your body's already responding to what your brain thought, but like you're not even registering that your brain like. Well, you know, to that point. So I was having these thoughts, right? Or like a million thoughts at once. But at the same time that I was feeling this, John had this huge stadium tour. And he's like selling at Madison Square Garden three nights in a row. And the United Center, he's doing, it's like everywhere. And I'm so happy for him because him doing well is great for our family. But that meant I was keeping the family together. So we travel together.

So the more I'm there with him, it means that I'm not working, making money. So I'm watching him get this confidence in like supporting his family and, you know, and his career being so successful. And I'm like, what am I supposed to do? because my whole life, I wanted to be an actor. And my mom married, you know, my father and her divorce when I was six months old. She married my first stepfather, who's a horrible person, and he was in my life for 14 years, and he's really abusive.

And then my stepfather now is amazing. But my mom used to always say to me when I was a kid, because she married my first stepfather, and he just kind of swallowed up any kind of independence that she had. And she'd always say to me, never just marry. a man and become his wife, always make a name for yourself. She would always say that phrase. So I worked really hard to, by the way, just because your mom says something doesn't mean that's what you do, because there have been relationships or I had really good relationships. And then all of a sudden, you find yourself in this scenario in a relationship where you're like, whoa, how am I

back in this thing that I grew up in that I really tried not to be in? Because my mom told me not to do this, but here I am. So I had to work through that. But I'm there now. My identity is completely changed. I'm like, I'm a mother now and I'm... You're not fighting that. First of all, you had a name for yourself before. You did. And you do. But you're not letting that like take up space anymore. What? The, like the don't be somebody's wife kind of vibe. And that I think that that's just what when you're talking about the million thoughts at once. It was like, oh my God, I can't take your my kid. Oh, wait, who am I now? Oh, wait, what are we doing? Oh, now I'm supporting him. And what he's doing. I mean, is that what I want to do?

I mean, he makes so much money. So if we're going to be... pick one, if somebody has to work. Oh, I saw you say that. I saw you say that if somebody has to, well, you said that in an interview, I believe, like, that you were okay with kind of, because one of you wants to be with the kids, or that was kind of your goal. Well, there's a couple things. One is that between the two of us, like, we're both in front of the camera, but John, like, loves to be on stage. Like, that is in his soul. Yeah. And I love what I do, and it's so much fun, but I don't, like, need it. Really? And he, yeah, he just, he's so good at it. And he's like, it's just something that he, he just, there's so much electricity if you ever see him. Have you seen him? I haven't. You and her husband should come. He's going on tour again starting in July. We're there. Oh, my gosh, come on tour with me. Don't leave me. When I said come on tour, I mean, come on tour. Wait, but you said you're here till September. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he'll start, he'll fly in and out places, then come back here. But you're going to join him on tour when you're done filming? We were here through the end of September. And then we start.

We go. You're going to go with him to all the cities? Yeah, we have another home base in Chicago, and that becomes like the middle of the country. So we were able to like... How are you with travel and like airplanes and jet lag and all that? It's really hard with the kids. It's really hard. Without the kids, you're chilling.

You know the hardest part is like when you have timed everything and you get the flight that you're like, oh, this is the perfect because it's enough time for now. And then it's delayed. Yeah. It's delayed. Because you're like type A a little bit, right? What is it actually is type A when people say that? that's like, like that, like, times everything out if one thing goes, like, like a perfectionist

kind of on top of everything. I will tell you, I wish I was more of that. I'm, like, half that and half the other. Okay. So I can be like, you got to do this. Type B. Type B is a thing. What's that? Type B is like doesn't care about schedule.

Like, like, is late, it comes 30 minutes before a flight, like. No, I care about a schedule, but I, I'm not always successful at achieving it or completing it. Well, the thing about flights for me, because I don't like to travel. Like, I don't enjoy it. I mean, to the traveling part, not the vacation part, if it's fun or the work part. But it's like, even if you're like, oh, it's a three-hour flight. Okay, is it? Because I have to fucking pack for whatever amount of days, wake up that morning super early, take a car there and it's like an hour or whatever.

Wait the like two out. It's a day. It's a full day, even if it's a short flight. So I don't know how people. Most of my time as a parent is spent carrying things. Literally, I'm like, yeah. Like, we want to go out for the day. You're like, well, just you have a backpack of, like, how are you with that, by the way?

Because I'm the type B mom when it comes to that. Like, my sister will always have the snacks and, oh, you want this game? This toy. I brought three because I knew Noah would be here, you know? And I'm like, oh, my gosh. No one doesn't have a water bottle. Like, I forget. So with that, like, I'm trying to get better.

And I'm so proud of myself if I pack, like, an apple. But I'm just not that mom. John's that mom. Oh, yeah? Yeah. Like, there's so many times, I'm like, oh, my gosh. We got to get the water. Wait, where's this water ball?

He goes, Olivia, it's already in the backpack. I'm like, okay, well, what about the apple slots? Because my son is in that phase where he'll only eat, like, you know, the 10 things and nothing else. So if we don't have those things. And so he does all of that. So, look, I have watched many in Instagram where those meals come out. They're so cute. Triggering as fuck those Instagram.

They make a little work on me, note. Oh, that's cool. And I. And the fucking star-shaped bread shit. And I'll tell you this, I love those parents. I wish they were my parents. Yeah. Those moms are spectacular.

Truly. Look, I'm not saying that I don't think I'm a great mom, but that is another level of me. Because I have friends who do that, and I know the kind of moms they are. They think about everything. Yeah. Like, the other day, it was Mother's Day, John was like, you know, there's cupcakes with mom, is what it's called. And so I thought that meant we're all baking together. But I get there to the school.

And I had... Oh, it's cool. Yeah, yeah. Sorry. It was like his Mother's Day thing. Thank you. I came really proud that I had brought all my ingredients, flour and sugar and eggs. And one of those little, one of those little, like, I cut my, you know, carton of eggs and did like a four spot.

So I'm like, I was like this. I honestly was like, I'm so cute. Yeah. Like, look at my little, I knew how to cut the carton. I thought it was cute. Cutting the carton and being proud would so be me. Yeah. And then I get there and I literally see one mom walks over and she's got like this thing of cupcakes.

And I was like, oh, God. And then I look and then somebody else brings, like... Oh, you were supposed to bring the cupcakes you already made. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh-huh. Is that what it was? Cupcakes? See, I can't even remember.

I'm pretty sure it was cupcakes. Yeah? It was now, Olivia, if you can't remember. That's how I am. Like, I cannot... I can't... So anyways, I'm there, and I have to, like, hide my angry... It was, I was actually true.

I felt truly dangerous. So did you pretend you just didn't bring anything? No. When somebody put their dish down, I kind of pushed it. in case anybody was seeing me. But I'll tell you, I know that it's funny now, and I can tell the joke. And I told John, like, oh, this is funny. But I will tell you're upset in the moment.

In the moment right now, I felt like, damn. Yeah. Like, oh, like, what is wrong with me? Why can't I just even know what this is? Yeah. Because I'm there. I'm there with them all the time. I'm there with my kids all the time.

But that's what matters. Like, honestly, I grew up with a single mom who couldn't probably make it to have my shit because she was working. And but like the thing she did that I try to do with my kids and I don't know if the emperor is feeling it or if it's working, but it's just like unconditional love, you know, that's what she always told me to. So he had been having a lot of tantrums, right, throwing a lot of fits. And so it started to subside when I had him to stay home and I would fly in it out so we could see John every day. But there was still a little bit of pushback. And then he had this field trip to Legoland.

Is a chaperone? No, they didn't ask for chaperones. The teachers went as chaperones, but every parent can go. And, you know, I grew up with, you know, my mom was, you know, five kids. And so my mom was at everything, but I always knew my mom loved me. And I always kind of knew that my mom was like, like, she went to the stuff. But she's like, I mean, we would draw her a picture and bring it home.

And she goes, oh, that's nice and throw it away. Like, I don't know how many, like everything that I drew. But do you remember that? That she threw it away. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So.

And I find it. But at the time, I kind of knew, I kind of like, I got a sense for my mom that, because she loved me, but she was like, okay, great. Like, this isn't, this isn't matter. And like, okay, but I didn't really hit me as much in a negative way. And so, like, John was like, hey, it was his, the finale of his show. And he's like, I think you should go to Leg Alam with Malcolm. And I was like, would he even know? Can I, can I take him to CVS? And he was, because I was like, it's more just that, like, would he even love it? Because sometimes we've taken him places. what we think he'd love and you know how it is and they don't care. Oh, it's like people taking their kids at Disneyland. I'm like, until Noah's begging, when he is, when he comes to me and says, my dream is to go to Disneyland. Yeah. I heard it so great. I saw pictures. I'm not going to willingly. I have friends going to do this in August, by the way. I'm like, are you okay? You're going to fucking, to me, that's like you're going to die. Like, that's how I look at it dramatically.

I feel like you're literally going into like, do you want to get into the ring with your child? Are you ready to like UFC style this vacation? Is it? Because like I have taken Malcolm places or to like a kid's birthday party. We think everyone's going to like it. And he literally is over at like bending. Like if we're at like a roller skating rink or like a trampoline park

and there's like a bending machine, he spends his time pushing those buttons. Yeah. So I took him to Legoland. I go, Malcolm, do you want to go to Legoland? And he said, yes. I was like, oh, okay. Because sometimes he's just like, no, I don't want to.

I don't want to. So he said, yes. He said, okay. And I took him there. And he spent 99% of the time jumping in puddles. That's it. Well, that's lucky because the lines are what makes it the worst ever. Yeah.

You're like, I can't remember if there are lines. No, no, no, there were. It was just a, he didn't want to do the rides. Yeah. So, yeah, I guess you're like, but no, there was one. We got to the one boat when we got in this. is it. There was a one little boat ride, like, around this, like, little river they made. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know and we get there. We wait in line. We get to the front and he goes, I don't want to get in the

boat. And I go, Malcolm, he's like, I don't want to get in the boat. And then I'm holding, I go, Malcolm, you do want to get in the boat. And now his arm is outstressed because he's running away. So it looks like I'm just like in this battle. And parents are looking at me. And I'm like, but then I don't know. I'm like, do I look like I'm a bad mom because I'm letting him overtake me right now? Like, are you supposed to force him because he secretly wants to. Yeah. Or I'm supposed to be like, no, no. no, no, I am the parent and you are the child, or do I look bad because I'm like, no, no, you have to come and I am the parent, you're the child. I looked back and the parents all were like, I got that approval for them going like, yeah, we get it. And so then all he wanted to do was there's that ramp going down to the line, you know, and there's like a little curb that holds like the bars. He just wanted to walk on that in between everybody. Did you go alone? Uh-huh. Yeah. You and Malcolm Day of Fun at Legoland. But that's an undertaking. But guess what?

What? It changed so many dynamics in his temperament. He literally has been so happy since. So it did really good for you. I think that what I didn't realize was how, like, I'm a very stay-at-home mom. Like activities at home, stay-at-home, almost all of it's because I've been so exhausted with the medication. And the surrogies have exhausted me. There's a lot.

And I really spend a lot of time on the couch with him or in bed and watching TV. And, you know, he really likes Tom. Hall in Spider-Man loves it. You watched it? That makes me feel better that you're letting him watch it because Noah watches that stuff too. But you know, we think about what we, I mean, how old are you? 38, you just turned? 37, I just turned. Yeah. I was watching. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, we, but look, I was watching dirty dancing at like five, like doing the lift, you know what I mean? And all of his gyrating. Oh my God. I was like this. It's seven, okay? That's so cute right now. During the back, I'm like, why aren't my muscle?

I was like fucking, yeah. That is so funny. It is true. But I think that you should protect children's, you know, innocence a lot as much as you can. But I really like those Spider-Man's. I enjoy it wearing the costumes because Noah went through such a vase. I'll show you a photo after this. He said, Mama, I want my whole family to wear Spider-Man costume.

So I have a photo of him and John and May-May all wearing Spider-Man. And he's so happy. We went to Legoland and there's this like, inclined wall. And he's like, I want to climb up. And then he just laid his whole body against and he goes, I don't have sticky hands. John introduced the Spider-Man, the animated. And John's the one of like, let's get out of the house. Yeah. In fact, one time it was like really rainy. And then there's like a few days back last year when we're living up in Bedford. And and Malcolm just really wanted to stay at home. And so it was like a couple days where John, I was like, but he wants to stay at home.

let's be cozy. And I want to stay at home. Yeah. And then John finally said to me the second day, he was like, I know what it is that I don't like. He was like, I don't want him to get bored. And I think that he's getting bored. And I was like, I was like, is he? Because I was so cozy on the couch. By the way, that's really good for them. I'm just saying, to be bored. Yes. And I saw a psychologist say this. Like, them learning to deal with boredom is so important. He was dealing with it by watching TV on the couch with me. Yeah. And so I think that's, So John, he's like, I don't want him to just kind of like experience life. And he's like, he's a kid.

He should be out. And so he's the one who takes him out. Yeah. Are you a homebody and spirit too before all of this happened? Yes. Okay. So that's like add some exhaustion and you're leaning into the couch. Yeah.

I mean, when I get home, I'm very happy when I'm home. Yeah. And like I like I like being home. I like, but I didn't, I don't like being home and not having energy. Yeah. Like I like my friends to come over. like hang out and talk and yeah and I just didn't have even energy for that I don't it's been really hard to even have energy for my children but I've changed my mindset I was like

because I had this past year I had to do this certain medication and the first one the first version of it made me really exhausted the second one made me really angry like just another level it's such a short fuse and then the third one gave me so much anxiety and it was between the second and third where I confess to John that, I mean, he could tell because I was getting angry a lot, but I just, I broke down crying. It was like on the plane back, a couple days after my daughter was born, we're going back to California, and I'd just been holding it in for months. And I just said, like, I'm struggling. And I just, I said, I need help. And I don't know if I can do this anymore. And then we, you know, we went to the oncologist together. And he's like,

we got to figure this out. He was really, really sweet because it. he's like, I can see that you have a shorter views, but you're happy. Like, you were happy when May was born and you're happy a lot. I'm like, I am happy, but I had my hand on a door holding back a monster the entire time. That's what it felt like. Like, I could be sitting here and be talking to you and, you know, and I'm like, and I'm like, but in, like, physically felt like there was like a monster trying to break down that door and I had to like hold my hand to it because at any point's going to come in. And that's why I was like, I never was really living it super happy during that period because it was like so vigilant. And then when it come out,

I'd feel like so frustrated that it came out. Then the next one gave me anxiety in really bad hives. So I've had to go back and pick one of those three. Like which, which, oh my God, lesser evil. Yeah, yeah. Anxiety, anger, exhaustion. Which one did you pick? Exhaustion. Picked exhaustion. So now you're learning to like, okay, what can I do to make this better? I just changed my frame of mind. Like, it's not. good for Malcolm and I to sit on the couch and watch TV all day. I mean, like, it's okay. We're not like a no springtime feeling. He's in school. He's in school. But now it's summer. Is he going to do like a camp or something? Yeah, he's going to get into different camps.

Your kids go to go to camp? Oh my God. Not soon enough. Like, well, not Lenny is a baby. When I was a kid, we didn't go to, like, now you can put your kids in everything year around. I know. The thing is like, this is what makes me feel better because I do feel the guilt sometimes of saying, like, what do I sign him up for? Like, so he's out of the house, right? But it's not for me. Like, like, if Noah, the type of kid he is, was down to, like, be bored a little or come with me on my errands. Like, I fucking did with my mom, picking up her dry cleaning. Like, she wasn't taking me to Legoland. She says, now she's like, we went. I'm like, okay. I was like, I was at Blooming deals with you. And then I would drive with you to here. And I would just drive with you to the

different things you had to do. That's exactly. Noah, are you kidding me? And it's our fault, right? Because it's what you do with your kids that kind of, but anyway, it's not because I'm like, get out of the house so I can chill. It's like, I wish we could be together all day and for that to satisfy you, but he needs more at this point in his life. Like, he needs to be outside. He needs to run.

He needs to play. He needs to be with other kids. So I'm like, oh, he has a week between the end of school and camp. He's going to like a mid camp. He's going to like a week thing. But it's good for, listen, at 8 a.m., he'll be doing.

Where are we going? He's like on the floor being like, I'm bored. I'm my cousin's up. I'm like, oh, my God. That's why I'm saying. if Malcolm, like, knows a little bit to be bored, even if it's, like, sitting on the couch, like... I mean, that's great advice because I do remember being a kid.

I remember being in church, this kid, and being like, it's taking so long. Yeah, that's the thing we've stopped with things. Oh, every Sunday. Yeah. And it was like, I remember just that we're waiting for, like, at the end where they give you donuts and apple juice. And you're like, and after a while, you don't care about, like, it's not like this, it's not like Pavlov's dog. You're not like, I don't care about the goddamn donut. in apple juice. I don't want to sit in church.

But think about how many times you went with, like, your mom to an event or saw, like, great aunts and uncles or family friends where you were like, ugh, but you sat through and I feel like, that's what I know how to do now. Like, there are events where I'm just like, I can't believe that these people are in Hollywood because this is some, this is some poorly produced, not entertaining shit. And be to sit there and you, and you can. I have the constitution to be bored. Right.

And hold on to it. Exactly. Yeah, and to be quietly annoyed. And they need to go through, like, some of the shit we went through, you know, where I'm always so worried for him, like, but he's going to be bored. There are no other kids' age there. They're not going to have anything funny to talk about. Yeah.

It's like, no, they can go through it. Well, I want to talk for a second about your friends and neighbors because you're filming for season two. Yes. And I'm so excited. Thank you. Well, you know, my character, when I was approached by Jonathan Trapper to come out of the show, I had told him privately that I was going through breast cancer and that I didn't know how much I could really take on or what my energy levels would be. And he was like, you only have to sign on

for one season. And so most actors have to sign on for multiple seasons like five or six because if it's a big hit, they want to lock you in so you can't like go somewhere else and then make them pay a million more dollars for you just to keep you on the show. So I only had to sign on for one season. And it was like halfway through where he was like, will you stay on again for a little bit longer? And I was like, yes, it's such a fun show. But then we always had the ending being what it is of this first season. So I was like, how does she get out of jail? Did she go to prison? And then what's the storyline going to be? But he and Jamie Rosengarde co-writer are like really talented writers. And we're just filming now. So I'm getting the scripts as a

So I actually don't really kind of understand what's happened. So I actually had a call him the other day. I go, can you tell me a little bit about what's going to happen? And he was like, you can't see it. I'm like, no, I can't. It's a mystery to me. I don't understand what's happening. Well, I was shocked by the ending.

I don't know if you know. Well, two things were like a huge plot to twist for me, like how he died, your husband. Yes. Your ex-husband. And Paul. And also what John Ham's character decides to do at the end, that picture. Mm-hmm. That pissed off some people. Did you guys, do you feel that in the, in the, in the general vibe of the viewers?

Tell me what they said. People were like, like, you know, when like a show like you're so into it's like, they're ending pissed me off. Like, yeah, yeah. Like, pissed off that he made that choice. Which, which, that he would like went, then instead of reuniting with his family and going back to the job or, you know, he got it all, but he decides to go back to ceiling. Yeah, I can see how that's, that's disappointing.

Yeah. Like, true, yeah. Yeah, people were disappointed. Yeah, I get that. Were you disappointed? No. Do you like that he went back to? Yeah. For me, it was like, damn. I was like, okay, he might not get on the plane with the, with the old boss. I get it. They wronged him. It's toxic. But I did expect to see like, I was like, is this going to end like him going back to Mel and like hugging and all the families together and the kids?

I was not at all expecting the him just being like, because it's basically got away with something instead of saying, thank God I got away with it going back to do it. I definitely understand that point of view on it. Because also, like, from the feedback I got, a lot of people were really intrigued by the personal dynamics between everybody and the relationship issues and how we all interact together and that there was a moment for him to, like,

can we just see where this goes? Like, you know, now you've gotten X, Y, and Z and then you've gotten yourself out of trouble. Yeah. Like, what happens? Like, can we just see what happens next? But I think that they will... I think, I mean, again, I haven't only read a couple episodes, but I think that there will be some of that.

I mean, I'm horrible about, I think there's some of that. What's some of what? Like, I think there's some of what they're asking for, but I actually don't know. Oh, okay. I actually don't know. Okay. What did people think about how my husband died and, like, because I know a lot of DMs about, like, who killed Paul, who killed Paul? Yeah, everyone wanted to know.

Yeah. Do you think they would have rather, like, I killed Paul or that he committed suicide and I staged it to look like a murderer? Oh, I don't know. What did you feel? I liked the way it was. I loved your, I know this is so fucking random, but here are two things I love about Olivia Munn before we go. One, the scene that you were walking in

and your friends and neighbors and Cooper sitting there, like I just love the way you, it was just so good. The way you jumped. The way you did that, like, how many takes did that take? Oh, that means a lot. When you walked in and he was sitting there, like the way you jumped back, like it even like startled me. Like your reaction, I was like, she's so good.

So much more to me than the big ones. Because, like, I think that, like, those little things make people, like, believable or not. Yes, but that was so good. And I think that you have been, but maybe now are coming out of that, have been underrated. And I'm so glad to see that you are getting the ratings. Oh, thank you so much. I know, because you're so good. Thank you.

And I'm so glad. I hope that you get less exhausted and more energy so you can keep on working. Giving me tea. But the other thing I love about you, because I said two things. Two, your teeth. My teeth? Yeah, I love your teeth. You have great teeth.

I do not. They're all like fucks up in some way. That means a lot because one, there was a time when people were like, oh, she's got veneers. And I was like, you know, some people go like, oh, it looks like you've got X, Y, or Z done. They go, thank you, but I haven't. I was like, binneers look crazy on people. So that's an insult to me.

I'm like, I don't find that. I get you. backhanded compliment. Even the richest, most famous people that you're like, you could go the best sentence in the world and you're like, how did they end up with them out like that? I've talked to a lot of people about this. And it's because people will say, oh, so-and-so went to this person. And then they just think, okay, I'll go there. Even if they see it's not good. And I'm like, what is going on? There's the same thing with them. Classic surgery, probably. Yes. There's this one person that. Oh, here's a tea. Of course, at the end, there's some tea. There's one. There is,

somebody in Hollywood who is on the public eye, but everybody, a lot of people, like big, big starts, listen to her about where to go. And you're like, why are you listening to her? Like, and they all go to the same person. And they say, well, so-and-so went there and so-and-so. And then what happens is they all go to the same and they end up all looking the same. And they have the bad veneers or they have the bad, you know, injections. They have all that. So, you know, the question is like, why wouldn't they find the best person? Well, they think it's the best. They all have been told.

I mean, but now Chris Jenner told everybody who it is. Yeah. Yeah. And that looks good. Yeah. But keep your teeth forever. I will always keep my teeth. Although I got them whitened the other day and he was like, you're getting to that age where you're losing enamel.

It was devastating. Wait, do you get the zingers from the teeth winding? Because I don't do it because of the zinger. What's a zinger? See, you're so strong. You don't even know it. It's like you get like electric shingers. shocking your teeth after the Zoom whitening.

You do? See, I'm such a fucking... Is your enamel thin and you hits your nerves? Probably all the things, the nerve, the this. Well, your teeth are very white. Ugh, they're really not. I looked today in the mirror and I was like, gross. Anyway. Do you fill your lips?

I don't. Have people asked you that? All the time. Yeah. But all you do is, like, look at a baby picture of Noah and it's like, you know? Or baby picture of me is like taking over my... Or me pregnant. Crazy.

Oh, yeah. When I got pregnant, it was like another level. It was crazy. Everything. I put on, I stopped counting at six. 60 pounds. Wait, it's your birthday coming up, too. Yes, July 3rd. 45. Yes. How are you feeling? Weird when you said that. I know. You don't realize. No, I don't realize. I feel I'm really, I'm just, I'm happy for every year that I'm here. I think of it as I've reached level 45.

Like on a game. Yeah, yeah. I'm like, isn't that cool? I mean like, oh, you're on level one. You're level 15. I'm like, I'm level 45 now. That's impressive. I'm just changing my mindset. But I, I'm the happiest I've ever been in my life, I took a lot of emotional weight off my shoulders. And I just, I love being a mom so much. Yeah. And I love the friendships I'm meeting with other moms. Like, it is just, it's a bond, you know, that we, we share. And it's really, like, you make, like, these friendships, like, as an adult. And it's so nice because it's like, immediately we can become friends. Right. And I like that, you know, I'm at the age, I'm like, do we have to, can we just be friends? Can we just like get to that and just be friends right now? Yeah. Yeah. When's your birthday? It was just the other day, right?

Yeah. Thanks for the message. I missed it. I'm just kidding. Did you go on a trip to CVS and then invite me? I did. I went to Turks and Kikos. Did you? I didn't see that. It was my first trip away from. No, it was my first time. Where did you stay in Turs and Kekos? We'll talk about it. She's so famous now. She can't even tell us, you guys. I love you. Can I tell you I love you and thank you for coming on. I'm like honored. And you know this, but everyone should know this. I've been wanting you to come on for so long. So I'm truly honored and grateful that you finally did. It means a lot. We started following each other. I don't know, back when I, I mean, I started following you back when I had my baby and you

started coming up on my feet and I just loved you so much, your whole energy. And then you reached out and you were so sweet and you're like, whenever you want to come do the podcast. Yeah. And I, when we were talking about the stuff we would do for the show, it has to be with Amanda. I got to see her. I'm so excited. I love you.

But you got to bring me back on. I will sit here and talk so much tea with you. I know. I know, we had so much to cover because your story is so important. So, you know. Thank you. But the next time she's going to come on, it's going to be like... I'll come tomorrow.

Or like pop culture, like talk shit, that kind of vibe. Because there's, I mean, it's a lot. I can't wait for season two of your friends and neighbors. If you haven't watched, go to Apple TV. Finish it in a week or less because you're going to be obsessed and binge it. And Olivia, you're so great in it. And we need to see more of you. Thank you.

And I can't wait to hang out with you in New York this summer. I know. Tomorrow. Tomorrow. We're going to CVS. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Not Skinny, but not fat. Follow me on Instagram at not skinny but not fat.

Subscribe to the podcast so you don't miss any episodes. Rate the podcast that you love so much on Apple podcast and write a little review. If you tell me you did, I'll give you a big virtual smoocheroo. Thank you guys so much for listening and I'll see you next Tuesday.

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