Not Skinny But Not Fat - Sarah Shahi on Divorce and Sex Life

Episode Date: April 4, 2023

Sarah Shahi from Sex Life and The L Word talks how she got into acting, similarities with her character Billie, divorce from ex-husband Steve Howey, romance with her co-star, and Sex Life season 2. Produced by Dear Media This episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct, or indirect financial interest in products, or services referred to in this episode.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Hey, I'm Molly Sims. And I'm Emma Shigormley. We are two best friends with one common obsession. Beauty. And by that, we mean everything that makes you look and feel beautiful. We've tried it all and we've got your back. We'll be calling on all our favorite health experts, industry insiders, and friends to answer all your beauty questions.

Consider us your beauty 411. And sometimes, you're 9-1-1. From how to fix brassy hair to the pros and cons of laser facials. and always with a cocktail in hand. Always. So be prepared to be obsessed. Check out lipstick on the rim wherever you get your podcast. This is Amanda Hirsch from the Not Skinny but Not Fat podcast.

You might know me from Not Skinny Bonifut on Instagram where I spend my time talking about reality TV, celebrities, everything happening, and pop culture. I also talk to some of our favorite celebs and reality TV. stars. We talk about what's going on. Tune in every Tuesday and just feel like you're talking with your best friends in your living room. You guys, hello. Welcome to today's podcast. Sarah Shahi is here. This podcast came about from like literally Instagram DMs where she was just like, the chillest and so I just wanted to give you that introduction that you're super chill and cool so thank you for coming on my my show oh thanks for having me yeah no I really like your stuff and I like

your content and your mom and you're funny and I was just like yeah like it was I don't know it was just really easy and I like thank you and so it's not weird for you that your ex-husband was on a few weeks ago no it was not weird he's an actor you know yeah he's got to do his thing so I know yeah it's all good okay Cool. So I wanted to, first of all, introduce you. Your born name is Ahu. Mm-hmm. Did I say good? Yeah, you said right. Most people don't. But yeah, my real name is Ahu. And when I was like, you know, I'm from Texas. And when I was little, I got made fun of so much. It was like, Youhoo, Wahoo, Achoo, like all the time. And kids are so awful. So I was in the car with my mom. And I was like, I really want to change my name.

And as we're having this talk, that song by Jefferson Starship, Sarah, that was on. So my mom was like, oh, what about Sarah? That's like a nice, normal name. And I was like, I'll take it. I'll take it anything but Ahoo. So if it were like, come on, I lean, you know, I could have been Eileen. Wait, so Sarah, so how did that transition into acting? So I was at Southern Methodist University.

I was in Texas. And I always thought I was going to be like an English major. I was a real big bookworm and loved to write. And, you know, I just thought acting was something like you, like it was impossible to do. It was like going to the moon, you know, like one in a million got an opportunity to act. And I was always on stage, though, because I also did like show fire. I was like Rachel Berry, but less country, you know. I was always like the Star Stolest, but I was nice.

And so I really liked it. And I was in a production of a musical called Chicago at SMU. And one day, I think me and some of the other, you know, actors were talking. And I was just like, oh, you know, I want to be an actress. I just don't know how to do it out here. And they were like, well, why don't you try out for the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders? Because back in 1995, they were on S&L. And I was like, oh, I was like, well, maybe that's my way in.

I'd never been a cheerleader before. I always had like this disdain for cheerleaders because they were always the most popular. They got to wear the shortest skirts, they had the best legs. And here I am with my like muscular athletic legs. It's like, and I just never, the guys never liked me that I like. And, you know, and so I was like, great. I'm going to go be one of them. I'm like, this is awful.

But I tried out and they're more of a dance team than they were like a cheerleading team. And it was one of the hardest auditions of my life to this day because it was so long. And there were so many girls that wanted to do it. And so, yeah, like over 500 people showed up and tried out. and even the veterans had to retry out. And they got it down. They took like 27 people to their training camp. And then from that point, they still made cuts and they reduced it down to 24.

And you made it. I made it. So I made it. And Robert Altman, I don't know if that is, he's like the godfather of film, like Scorsese, Spielberg, like all of those. And I didn't know who he was. Like it didn't, it didn't click. I was 19. I didn't click that, oh, this is a Hollywood director. I was just like, oh, so we

started talking to each other one day. And we just kind of never stopped. Like, he was so, he was like a grandpa to me. And like, we got along and we actually talked about everything but acting. And we just had so much of common. And he had a nephew who was my age and so we were just talking about school. And, and it was there for two weeks. Right before he left, he was like, what do you want to do? And I was like, I don't know. I was like, I want to be an actor. I was like, but I don't know how to do it out here. And he goes, well, I think you have something. And he's like, so he gave me his office number and his cell number. And he said, if you ever come out to L.A., I want to help you. Give me a call. And I was like, okay,

I still, it still didn't click. Like, this is this huge legendary Oscar Award winning director who people have written books on his films. I still had no idea. I was like, What is this going to know? So then I go home that night and I Googled him and I didn't recognize any of his movies. But I recognized one, which was Popeye with Robin Williams. Like the movie that almost kept Robin Williams from ever working again was such a disaster. So I tell my mom, like, Ma, the guy drank to Popeye says I got a shot. So then that was it.

So, yeah, I packed up my truck and I moved to L.A. So wait, did you call Robert, though? I did call. He was still in Texas shooting. And we were playing phone tag with one another for a few months. And every time I'd go into a room, I mean, I was so green. I mean, if there was like a producer session and they had like, you know, snacks and hors d'oeuvres or whatever for the producers, like in the back of the room,

I hit that place first because I thought that was for me. So I was like snacking on the carrots and stuff in the audition and people would look at me and they're like, how long have you been here? How long have you been acting? And I'm like, I don't know, since T.K. I'm like, that's a pretty great. You all have more people?

And I just was so naive. You know, I just didn't know. And then people would tell me, though, they're like, you know, I tell the Robert Alton story and they'd be like, do you know who that is? And I'm like, yeah, he's a guy, you know, he's doing that movie. And they're like, no, do more homework on him. And I was like, okay. And little by little, I did start reading about him.

And I was like, oh, my God, this guy's actually a really big deal. And I just got so intimidated. And then I just didn't know what to say to him anymore. So I never, so his last call to me, I never called back. And then I found that he died a couple months later. So it really broke my heart. And I was just like, wow, he was like my acting angel. Like he was the one who started it all for me.

And then he left. Wow. Yeah. So you were doing, he gave you like the, the motivation to actually. pack up and move 100% and it was blind confidence like I had no idea what I was doing and why my mom but and she said because I was like you know how did you just let me go I'd never done this I'd never told you I wanted to do this and all of a sudden I'm like I'm moving and she just said she was like because from a child I had a track record of whatever I put my mind to I did and she was like I knew

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three or four books on acting that i always kept with me at all times and is it always just like reading them, you know, when I wasn't, when I had five minutes, it's like I'd instantly pick it up and I'd read. And I wrote his number down, it was like four books. And I wrote his number down in three of those four books. I was like, it's not going to lose it. Didn't have a cell phone or anything. And so I went on the USO tour with the cheerleaders. And I remember right before I left, I looked in my cheerleading bag. And those three books that I had his number in were gone. And I was like, what the fuck? So this is so, this is so scandalous. I can't believe I'm sharing this with you. Okay, I've never told anybody. I've never told anybody this. So we were told

not to fraternize with Hollywood. We were told they are coming to us. We do not fraternize with them. And I definitely have a bit of that rebellion. As soon as somebody tells me not to do something, I want to know, I do it because, not because I'm trying to be rebellious, but I want to know why. why did you tell me not to do that? So I'm going to go find out for myself. So I was so angry that those three books were taken. And my bag was always at the cheerleading Texas Stadium or the ranch. It's called the ranch. And I go on the tour. I hated it. I was so angry. And Al Franken, I remember, was on the tour. And we had like chaperones and we weren't like allowed to leave. But yet we were in Italy and all these beautiful locations. And we had to like stay in our room and concentrate on the next

day's performance. And I was like, this is bullshit. And they stole my bags. Like, I'm sneaking out of my room. So I'd sneak out of my room. And Al Franken, he would slip a little note on my door. And he was there with his wife and stuff. So it was not like that. But like, he'd be like, hey, we're going to go to this restaurant. Do you want to come out? And I'm like, fuck yeah, I do. I'll meet you there. And so I snuck out a couple of times. And they found me. And they were like, we'll send you back. And I was like, send me back. Like, send me back. I don't care. You they fucking stole from me. So then they didn't. I got back. I got back on December, I think 30th. And there was a big game. There's always a big New Year's Eve game that the Cowboys do.

And it was the Cowboys versus the Giants. And there was like a huge half-time show. And we had been rehearsing for months for this halftime show. There was a big performer that was coming in. And when I got back, the head of the organization, she calls me in her office. As soon as we get back from the tour, Like, we landed and I got pulled into the office. And she was like, you must be looking for these, the three books. And I was like, yeah. And she was like, what was that about? And I was like, I don't know.

I was just, we really got along. And, you know, he was like a grandpa, wasn't anything weird. And that's all that was. And then she was like, okay, you can leave. And she gave me the books back. And the next day was the big game. And I didn't go. I just didn't go.

I got so, I mean, the phone was ringing a hundred times in a minute, you know, just everything from whoever the, like, leader of the group was, like, wanting to know where I was, you know, and other other rookies that were there, the veterans, Kelly was calling me, Kelly McGonigle, that's her, that's the name, that's her. And she's still there. And, yeah, I just didn't go. I shouldn't show up. You didn't go because you were angry at them for, like, betraying you? I was super angry. I felt, I felt like they really invaded my, space. I felt like it was so manipulative of them to like try to keep me down. And I was just like, and I'm not a vengeful person. I'm not, you know, but I was so angry. I was like, there's no way I'm going. Yeah. And it really messed up there for me. Like it just kind of messed up everything for that big game. And then she called me. I didn't answer. And then she called my mother and my mom. She knew what was going on. And she was like, oh, she already left. She's in L.A. And she then she came and she like stalked me outside my house like the next day. She like came and she like waited.

I saw her and I was like, oh my God. I can't believe she's outside my house like just on the street waiting to see if I come in around. So she pulled around the corner one time and I ran out to check the mail and then she came. Oh my God. What did you want? Do you think she just wanted to talk to you? I think she wanted to catch me. I think she wanted, you know, she wanted the uniforms back.

And so my mom. Did you give it back? my mom took them out to her. I like didn't want to see her. And so my mom took her, took the uniforms back, gave the uniforms back. And yeah, they told the girls, though, I remember because I had a couple friends that were on the team. And I was like, what are they saying about me? And they're like, they said that they let you go because you were like going to pose for Playboy with the pom-poms or something. And I was like, that's such a crap of shit. Such a crap of shit. wait so but don't you think sarah now i'm like maybe that kelly woman was also your acting angel in a way you know what you are so right i mean i i already decided that i was going to go but what that did is it just it put this determination in me that you know maybe that's where that blind confidence came from or i was like fuck this i'm out yeah and you know and there was no turning back there was no I had no plan right like you burned the bridge like you're in the movie like you burn

the bridge everything's burning up you got ahead you got to head out to hollywood okay so you did you did a bunch of auditions and you started working yeah you started working i started working and i you know i'm not a studied after or anything i get a little you know sometimes people aren't set and they they cite shagall or wait shagall's an artist And what's the Strasbourg, Strasbourg. Sigal. I said Shigal, that's a fucking painter. I was like, oh, I don't know what you're talking about.

You know, and I just always felt, I just always felt, I was like, okay, you just have to be natural. You have to act like you're talking to your friend. And so I would just practice in the mirror, like, all the time. Like, I was talking to a friend. And, and then, yeah, I started working. And then Alias was kind of the first big job that I got. and through the you know like jj abrams was on that show that was his show and he was very supportive like of my sort of process i guess and very like don't study because i most of my scenes were with

bradley cooper what was on alias wasn't that jennifer garner yeah and bradley cooper was on it yeah Bradley was and it's funny because like we still keep in touch which i just think is so great because he's like this huge movie star you know and still keeping touch with like the TV actor from the day you know so it's so sweet but like he was in the newspaper office he played i think will tippin was this character's name and he and i and i was his assistant in the newspaper office and then he had like a huge crush on sydney who i think it was her name sydney was jennifer garner and then but i had a crush on him and i was always like you know why do you like her and and and he was great and lovely and such a such a you know beautiful performer

that that became my school. That became the opportunity where I really got to kind of, you know, work on acting as an actual instrument as an art performance. Did you not want to date him, though? No, I didn't want to date him.

Really? Yeah, I need to look back because I think Bradley had like a, not a glow up, but like there was a moment where all of a sudden you got like, maybe the hangover. We were like, whoa.

Yeah, I think. you're right. I mean, back then, you know, he, yeah, he had like, he hadn't grown into himself the way he did after he played that role in hangover. Damn men and they're aging. Wait, so I was obsessed with the L word, like, thought I might be a lesbian. And then all of a sudden, you know, watching sex life and everyone being like, oh my God, like Carmen. You know, so how is getting the L word job for you? Like, did you watch the show? Did you? You know, I didn't watch the show. I mean, I think me and my sheltered life, I didn't even know what a lesbian was, you know, so it's not that, you know, not that there was anything wrong with it, but I just don't think I had been introduced to even, you know, homosexuality, like in a relationship when I grew up in my, you know, small, you know, middle to low class in Texas. I was, we had, I, we had a lot of Samoans around us and, you know, that was my community. I didn't know anything. And. And so when I auditioned for the L word, I did, I thought Elwood. I thought. meant love and I got the role and I didn't I still didn't quite understand and the character

on paper it was like Carmen and then there was a character named Shane and so I just assumed it was like a boy and my mom when she I said mom I was like I got my first big job and and and I was like I had to go to Vancouver to shoot and I was like oh my God like I'm actually doing this like as a real like this is actually happening i'm a series regular and i'm getting checks like each week and i go up there and my and then i have the wardrobe fitting and then i see like the pictures of all the women and i'm like oh and i was like is this what does the l stand for and they were like lesbian and i went oh oh oh is that what i'm doing ah so i called my mom and i was like mom I'm playing a lesbian.

And she was like, what? And I was like, yeah, I thought Elstained for love, but it seems for like lesbian. And then she was just so, she was like, well, that's hot. Like, well, that's hot. And yeah, my mom was fucking, she was cool. She was cool. She was much more open-minded than her background, like, would allow her to be. And I think because she wanted, she hated where she came from so much that she just jumped

into everything that was like American and free and allowing of choice. You know what I mean? So she was like, well, that's, that's hot. She was like, and you're going to do great. And I was like, okay. And yeah, and then my first day on set, it was when I met Kate, Kate Menig. And they were like, you know, Sarah, this is Kate. Kate, this is Sarah.

Sarah in the scene, Kate's going to go down on you. And I was like, I didn't know. That's what we do. Wait, they didn't do like matching chemistry. Street test before. No, no. That's wild. None of that. And as, you know, as the stars would have it, Kate and I just genuinely liked each other. And her, Alicia and I, we still keep in touch. We still talk to this day. And yeah, and I only had two seasons with those girls. And I know. Were you sad when, when your character got ran off? No, because from the beginning, my contract was only two years.

And that was my choice because, you know, It's almost like I have a two-year track record with things. And I just, I have a hard time wrapping my head around doing one character for seven years. It's always from the beginning that I started my career. I just was like, I can't do that. Like, no, I want to go do other things. Like two, two years, two years. And they said, okay.

And that was it. We never, no one ever spoke to me about potentially coming back or anything. It was just always a two-year deal. And so I knew it was coming. But, but yeah, I really, like I said, I formed a really great sort of kinship with those girls with Kate and Leisha and Jennifer. And, yeah, we're still, we're still friends. I don't get why you wouldn't get Ibata.

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Billy and Sex Life. I mean, the first season was... Revolutionary. You know, we haven't seen a show like this, especially on Netflix. A show for everyone. It was top of the charts and it's lots of sex. There's even, you know,

there's full frontal nudity. So tell me about that for you. Tell me about getting the script and all your thoughts there. Yeah. So when I got the script, it was in 2019. And I read it.

And I was just like, holy shit, like this dialogue, it feels like it's ripped from the pages of my own heart. And, you know, I was going through a time where I was really sort of living in a state of unhappiness. And I was like, is this my life? Is this what everyone works so hard? And when you're a kid, you can't wait to grow up. I couldn't wait to grow up to feel like this. And it just really, I was just questioning everything and, you know, and then as a wife and as a mom and stuff, you're like, you get told, you know, like, well, but you have it good. You know, you have it good. And I just felt so unseen. And I just felt so like people don't get it. And, you know, yes, you interviewed my ex-husband a couple weeks ago. So we all know how that turned out.

Yeah. It really, it really truly was the best thing for the both of us. Because I, just think over time we had met we were very young when we met and we grew up together but i think as we grew up we also changed and to be able to acknowledge you know that like we've been trying to make the other person be versions of themselves that they're not and you know and you have to be brave enough to like let that go which is really hard yeah children especially if nothing dramatic happened right right right It's just a matter of two people were just different. It's really hard. So anyway, so yeah.

So I got that script and I was just like, oh, my God, this is the first time I feel seen. Like, holy shit. Wait, were you then already in the process of separating? No. No, but we had, I will say this. We, you know, from the time that our first child was born, our relationship suffered. And it was hard to get back on track. So for, for, for like those last 10 years, you know, and I'll say this, like, we were together

for a very long time. We were together for 18 years. That's not a failure. You know, that was a long time. And so, but the last 10 years, we really did struggle. And, you know, as everyone- Once a kid comes in, it's fucking, it really, it's so crazy. Yeah.

It really challenges a relationship. And any of, you know, the flaws and the relationship before you have kids, like if you don't settle those things, that was my experience of it only gets worse. It only gets worse. You have less time for each other. You have less patience. You have less desire because you're just so damn tired. Trying to make it work for 10 years is a long-ass time.

For 10 years. We tried to make it work for 10 years after the relationship took a nose dive. You know, it's like, that's what I'm saying. It's like, divorce is not a bad thing. It's not, doesn't mean a failure. You know, it's like, look at what we created and did with one another. And, you know, we grew up together and that's a beautiful thing. So, so yeah, so we had already separated, tried to file once before, didn't go through with it. So really, you know, it's like we were, we already were in trouble. We were already in trouble. So I auditioned for the show and living separately. And I had auditioned for the show, and I hanged to the audition. I didn't do well. It was the first time I, there were three scenes, and the last scene was her, I don't if you remember the episode where Billy is like with the moms and they're walking in Soho and she's pushing the cart.

And she flashes back to like when Brad got the tattoo of like the bees. And she's like, from Cupcake Store. She's like, what am I doing now? You know, that whole scene. that was the last scene and I just blinked and it was almost like I saw the I couldn't read like it was the weirdest thing that happened to me and I blanked and I couldn't do the scene and I couldn't get the emotion and I hate nothing more than an actor like trying to cry or pretend so it's like grosses me out like you wouldn't believe it's like watching somebody vomit I'm like ew so so I walked out

I was like I'm really sorry I can't do this and I I'm not going to sit here and bore you with a performance that doesn't feel real. I'm going to leave. And I went and I got like a bottle of tequila and a burrito from Chipotle and sat on the sidewalk. And I just drank it like a loser. And at that point, too, I hadn't worked in about a year. I had done this show called I always had this big, I'd always had a career in like network TV. And I was always struggling to get out.

And I was tired of talking about top things or law things or whatever. I was just like, I can do so much more. more than this. And so this felt that you wanted this like you went into this audition like wanting it. I wanted it. I wanted it so bad. It almost felt like it was like I was chasing it like my destiny or I was chasing my life or I was chasing was not a job for me. And maybe that's why I also. The pressure was too much and I couldn't do it for myself. And yeah. So I hadn't worked in over in almost a year. I had done city on a hill which kind of people started looking at looking at me a little differently.

They're like, oh, she's actually an actor. Like, she can do a character and a accent and being something that's a bit gritty. Wow. Like, all of a sudden, they were like, looking at me differently. So then I just turned everything down. I had no money. And, and like I said, we were living in separate homes. And yeah, and then I tanked the audition.

And I remember coming home crying. And I was like, maybe I'm not this acting thing. Maybe I'm not going to make it after all. I'm never going to succeed. I'm never going to achieve my dreams. And then I get a call a week later. They're like, they loved you and you're one of four. And I was like, what?

I was like, that doesn't make sense. I was like, I didn't even finish the audition. How was this possible? And they're like, they saw something that they're like, but this is so the character. So I was like, well, okay then if I still have a shot. So then I started retaping myself. And I went in with my coach and I started putting myself back on tape. And I did the three scenes, the way I wanted to do.

them and I submitted it. And they were really appreciative that I did that. And then I got a call on January, I'll never forget. It was like January 7th, 2000. And they were like, and my phone was just blowing up left and right. And it was my rep saying, you got it. And I was like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. And they were searching international. Like at the end of the day, it was between me and like this French girl, I remember. And I was just like, oh my God. So yeah. So to get it. I mean, I just, I don't know, like I said, like I chased it like I was chasing a lifeline. There was something about that show for me. Yeah. And I've written a couple things and I'm actually, I'm trying to write a book right now actually about Billy Mann and what that did to me. And the way

she kind of like seeped under my skin. And, and, you know, I am, I admired her courage so much. like the courage to ask those questions that we're kind of told not to ask. You know, the fact that she is a wife and she's a mother, but she was still hiding for the days where she felt free and she felt alive. But at the same time, she's allowed to be, but she's still a good mom. Like that doesn't make her a bad mom. You know what I mean? If she wants to feel sexy and she wants the nights out and she wants to relive those days,

like it doesn't mean, like you don't have to pick, you know, like you can be, a mom and have that other side to at the same time, you know, like you don't have to lose one of those. You know that I made merch, Sarah, that says you can be a mom and still be a dumb bitch. I love that. I'll send you a mug. I'll send you a mug. I'll send you a mug. But my, but the intention behind that was like what you're saying is like a lot of times, even not with sexual stuff, even just with being dumb, being, you know, stupid with your friends. being all these things, doesn't mean you can't be a mom. Doesn't mean you're not a mom.

Doesn't mean, because like our moms are such moms, you know? Yeah. It's hard to see them as those things, but maybe, you know, maybe they were those things. And they wanted to be those things. So you saw yourself and Billy Mann like from reading the script and like shelter. It pierced a hole in my heart. Like it, it rocked me like on a cellular level. Did it change your life?

Oh, yeah. And that was no secret. Yeah. But it definitely, it gave me the courage to say, like, I'm not happy. And I feel like we should, as individuals, have the right to be happy, you know? And it's like, and it's not to say, I mean, this is the most I've ever talked about my divorce, but it's not to say that, you know, again, like we didn't fail. we created something really beautiful for a very long time.

We both tried really hard, but we also both want each other to be versions that were not. That you're not anymore, too. That we're not anymore. Exactly. And it's like, you know, yes, we've changed and we should change. Like, we're not the 22-year-old kids that we met each other as. You know, we're now in our 40s and it's truly like this isn't serving us anymore.

yeah so but yeah and that you know it was just it was just tough but you know i saw this one quote when talking a long time ago i can't remember who said it but they said like speak up even if your voice shakes and i am very guilty of i don't like conflict i don't like to fight you know which is not a healthy thing sometimes you need that stuff and i was always putting somebody else first instead of myself and through playing billy man i really saw like it's almost like I started living vicariously through her and I just saw like speak up even if your voice shakes. It's like, okay, here I go. Like I may not know how to say this, but I have to. And so I just started operating under that umbrella in every area of my life, not just personally, but in my business relationships with my mother, with my brother and sister. And so it definitely had an impact on me. You guys, golf is so fun. Like have you played mini golf? before have you watched movies where first dates take their date to play many golf? I mean, golf is fun and you don't have to be Tiger Woods to play it.

And that's what I love about top golf. Their motto is, it's golf. It's not golf. It's top golf, okay? Because they have so much fun stuff more than just, you know, the clubs, the balls, the teas, the turf, the ballpickers, the carts, the whole thing. But they also have music, giant TVs, handcrafted food and beverage menu. know. I'm so bad at golf, by the way, and I still have fun at top golf, okay? It's all about the

vibe. It's all about the play. It's all about having fun. I have no idea what I'm doing. I do love keeping the score, though, because I do get competitive, but it's like, no, I'm so bad. Like, it's just, it's one of those sports, like it looks easy, but it's actually not. So, listen, at top golf, it doesn't matter if you play golf. Everyone can play top golf. Even if you can't swing a club, you can swing a club. Do you know what I mean? Literally, when you walk into a top golf. You just get that vibe, that good energy when you walk through the door and you know you're going to have the most amazing time and you're going to make the most amazing memories. And it's all the fun of outside, but with the comforts of inside, it's comfy, it's heated

in the winter and it's cold bays in the summer. You guys, there's such a vibe there. I would just say it's perfect for parties and bachelor and bachelorette parties. Download the app, And come play around. It's so crazy because the show does have that like, you know, edge of like nudity and, you know, fun and party and glitter. But it really does have that, you know, deep side, which is like questioning your life and and changing something that makes you not happy. But I do have to ask about the nudity a little bit because like I just know how your boobs

look like it like exactly in the nipple and the whole thing. How was that for you? Was it liberating? Was it, was it something you were comfortable with from, you know, forever? I was not. I, you know, I, for me, the idea of being naked in front of the world is not anything that I feel comfortable with. And you definitely do feel a pressure because you want to, you want to feel good. You want to, you want to feel good.

You know, you want to feel good about it. And, and that's hard. You know, I also think it was important because it's just real. And I just know from all the things that I've watched, you know, throughout my career, anytime I see a person on screen and they're allowing their flaws to be present, like how much as a viewer, I appreciated that and how much that made me tune in more in a way. And it made me more interested in the story because this person was fearless to do that thing, you know? And so, and I also just felt like it's, you know, Hollywood doesn't really depict mothers in their real skins.

You know, it's like everyone, whether it's fake tits or, you know, this is the perfect shaped ass or the perfect whatever. It's like that's the thing that's always put front and center. And that's not relatable to me. And so it's like when we did the flashback scenes with Brad, obviously that body had to be like a pre-baby bar. body. So we were, you know, hiding, you know, the little bits that are definitely post-baby. And then when- Oh, my God, Sarah, what little bits? Oh, I, well, you know, I've got hell of a, I've got like so many stretch marks. Wait, you had twins, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, twins. And then, you know, and then, yeah, those little fuckers gave me a little extra skin

around my stomach that I didn't have before. But, you know, I did this interview recently and I said, I was like as I got older and I got more comfortable with my body and just realizing like it doesn't matter how much I work out or don't work out. There are some things about my body that are just not going to change. And it's like, and that's fine. And if I sit here, you know, it's like the price I pay to create my favorite humans on the planet. Okay. So first season, first of all, you meet your now partner, love of your life, Adam Demo. Is it Demos or demos? Yeah, Demos. Demos. Demos. So you meet him. Yeah. Did you, did you click right away? No. No. We met each other and it was not instant. And, you know, it was a very, I was kind of like, oh, because I, I don't, I've never felt sort of like when I meet people and they're very good looking. I, it's not like it takes so much more than that to get my interest that it's like I instantly will write someone off as a pretty face and that's it. Right. Like it's more like. It's more like. they have more to prove if they're good looking yes yes yes yeah i've always been like that i'm a

i'm you know tough one to i'm a tough catch in that sense and so yeah i met him and he thought i was the pa at first because my we met in the makeup trailer and like my off-duty look always is like homeless lesbian you know it's like my kids call it gas station fashion like all my clothes look like they come from a gas station and i'm and i've always been like that drove my mother crazy but But I've always just loved comfort more than anything in the world. So yeah, so he thought I was a lesbian, like, yeah, and it was like, didn't realize I was like the actress playing this role of Billy. And anyway, so yeah, and it was not instant.

It was it was over time. It was getting to know him as a person and seeing like how aligned our values were and how, you know, I'm kind of a hippie-dippy weirdo spiritually and stuff. and he was able to have that too. And he was telling me about his past and his childhood, and he has a single mom. And I just also really respected how he talked about his mom and how we talked about women.

And there was just so much that I started seeing over time that made me go, oh, like, you're kind of everything I've ever wanted. And then that's when, you know, we started being together and stuff. but it was yeah a lot of people think it was instant i know i know i think i made the same mistake and by the way i wanted to clarify i made the same mistake back in the day thinking there was like you know some overlap but even if you read articles yeah and you do the the homework without you even saying that like the dates are you filed for divorce in may of 2020 yeah started filming in the fall of 2020 yeah so even even the the hard facts

Yes. You know, tell. No, it's one of those things where it's like, it's so funny because people, I hate social media and I hate it. Like, I love it and I hate it because I feel like people really, they, they all of a sudden they like grow a pair that they've never had before in their lives and they can comment and say things that if they were to see you face to face, they would never dare say it. But because they think they know you through this, you know, platform, they can just like pass so

much judgment and they can say such hurtful things. And there was a period in time where I just started blocking comments. I just started blocking things because now I've heard it all so much that I just don't care anymore. And it's, yeah, like people, they really do assume that they know things about you personally just based on what they see out there. And it's just not the truth at all. And it did kill me for a while because I so desperately wanted to say something. But I didn't. Like wanted people to know the truth. Well, that's why it is important me to say, even the hard facts, you guys, you know,

which I think I made the mistake, you know, when the show started or when you and Adam were made your relationship official. It's like, oh, wait, you know, you think because to the public, you guys, you know how somebody's pregnant and you're like, they're pregnant forever. Like time is just different when it's not you. But even the hard facts, I mean, are, you filed for divorce and may have 2020. And obviously you were saying like you were going through so much before in that relationship. Yeah. You only started filming in the fall of 2020. So it's not even.

Yeah. Yeah. There's no. Yeah. And so when you film the first season and first of all, in situations like that, Sarah, just think of like the Kardashians and, you know, people that really every day, you know, they're dealing with those. That makes me feel better.

And also, you know what other relationship? Think of Olivia Wilde. Oh, I know. Think of Olivia Wilde because, you know, in that situation, there's like Harry, which he has his, you know, fandom that's very protective. There's Jason Sadekis, which in the media, it's portrayed that he's like the, you know, she broke his heart. So, so it helps me. I know you're not a comparative. No, no, no, but you're right because I do, because sometimes it's like I read those things myself too.

And it's very easy to be like, oh, you know, but then again, I reflect on my own experience and how different my experience was from what the world thought it was. And I instantly go, unless you're one of those two people behind those closed doors, you don't know what the fuck people are doing. You don't know what people's lives are. And you don't have any right to pass judgment. I mean, sure, pass judgment all day long. But it's like, I don't, I don't judge. okay so second season you guys just i just finished it it's different first what why why do you say that because i know you have some feelings i want to know why you feel that way like it's quicker disappointed it was six episodes yeah but it did wrap up you know all the stories kind of wrapped up

in a way where is there for sure well you did say you're a two year kind of gals sarah i know i did say that but i realized that but i love i mean if we had an opportunity to do you know if i could be Billy Man for, you know, five seasons. I would. I, I, her, I feel her struggle so much in life and, and it's like therapy for me to play Billy. So, you know, that's the one thing I, I would, I would do. But yeah, but our order from the beginning before we even started filming was six episodes. They wanted a much quicker season. Why? I don't know. I really truly don't know. You guys, remember when TV was like 25 episodes? I know. And then streaming services got it down to like 10, but six is like a whole new.

Yeah. And I, and you know, Netflix, you know, it's like they started off. They were a tech company, you know. So I just feel like they are very much about their metrics. They are very much about like they can see where an audience like stop. This is engagement or something. Yeah, yeah. Exactly.

Like they have, they have all that research. And I know that they felt like they needed more things to happen. and they needed it to happen quicker. And they felt like the story could be best told in a six episode format. And, you know, I look, I mean, I, it's, it's funny. I was watching the show. I wanted to watch it. And I'm, I'm a fan of the show.

Even though I'm in the show, I totally fell for Brad and Billy too, you know. And I was just like, damn, I really like, you know, I like this dynamic on screen. And we didn't, yeah, people were upset. We didn't get, we didn't get a lot of B&B. Yeah, I was upset too. I was upset. But I will say there's something to me, and this is spoiler, you guys for season two, I would never have guessed the way that it started, you know?

Like I would have never have guessed that her coming out of the, you know, his elevator. Yeah. Everything that spiraled after that. But maybe it's in a good way that like we're left, you know, just wanting them together instead of getting them together from the beginning. I wanted to ask you. Did you feel that though? Did you did I'm trying to think that down maybe yeah maybe I did no of course I wanted them together but were you watching as an audience member were you watching like and like in like and thinking like are Braden like are Braden when are they going to come back on screen?

Oh my God, of course I was. You did. Okay. Interesting. No, of course. You think I wanted her to end up with Majid? No, no, no. But I just didn't know because there were so many other stories that took center stage.

I didn't know if you were along for those stories or if in the back of mind, if there was a part of either and you were still like, I just didn't know how. No, I think in the back, I, in the back of everyone's mind, I think I can speak for us all because that's what I like to do. But is we, we wanted Brad and Billy. So I'm now thinking instead of being disappointed, maybe that was a good move. Do you get what I mean?

Instead of being disappointed, there wasn't of Brad and Billy. maybe that was the point. Maybe it was, you know, you're kept wanting them together. Except, and then we get that, we get that way. Were you, was that a fantasy when you imagine the tip of his penis?

What was that for? Like, I need to understand that, like, did you, were there moments in the show where you were like, okay, like I get it. It's about the nudity. It's about the sex. But sometimes it's like, there was that, that one was a lot.

and the fake the the his friend's penis at the end yeah i yeah there were parts of the show i mean season one i really felt was so real you know i mean when when there's the the scene in the shower when you know adam has the prosthetic on and the scene in the shower and when that's revealed it's so unintentional it was so it was so smart it was so clever you know and you could absolutely imagine that situation happening in real life yeah dude's For sure, compare, you know. Exactly. And in a gym shower, like, it makes sense.

There's nothing about that that felt like a, what's the word I'm looking for? When something is done like intentionally, I can't think, anyway, whatever. So it's like, like, not kitchy. That's whatever. Who cares? So, like, yeah, gratuitous or I'm trying to think of, oh, whatever. So it was just real. And in season two, I felt like some of the.

things were like a ploy it was a ploy it was a way to become another tic-tok sensation it was like i felt like it was for that purpose you know like they wanted it was gimmicky gimmicky oh gotcha gimmicky like a gimmick and yeah too i felt like there were more moments that felt very gimmicky and it those kinds of things for me are always really hard to read and yeah Yeah, and like do and stuff like that, but I didn't have to do them. The boys did. But, you know, and I thought they did a great. And, you know, I thought Jonathan Sedowski did a great job with that, you know, just trying to make it as real as possible. And, you know, Adam, you know, he does a great job being Brad. But yeah, it felt a little bit more gimmicky for me and season. Yeah. What was it like acting with Adam and being Billy and Brad like when you're now fully together in love, doing all these, you know, scenes? well it was an interesting like observation for me because you know i love acting i love acting so much and i'm definitely an acting cunt like if i see a fake moment you know i'm like i saw you i saw that transition i saw the da da da you know it's like it's the only thing in my life i feel like

i'm really good at like in terms of not not to say i'm a good actor but it's like it's the like i care so much that i i watch almost like with a microscope i watch everything it's how i down my scripts and how I understand character and stuff like that. So I'm just obsessed with it. But I, it was an interesting observation that I had never done a character where I was in love with somebody and then in real life, I'm in love with somebody. And it was, and I think that's what made Brad and Billy so popular was because people really felt the real sparks between us and the real sparks and they just they just shot through the lens and it infiltrated the screen and so it was a real interesting observation that it was like oh wow so this is

what happens like if you see you know couples that are together in real life and then you see them on screen and why there just is a level of comfort that you can't fake like it's just there you know like if you had to say if you had to work with one of your children and you had to say like, oh my God, I love you, that's going to come from such a real place versus if you're working with a child actor and you have to say, I love you, even though you could do a great line reading. You know what I mean? It's just like there's just something that happens to your body that's different. And so, you know, season one, it was really beautiful to experience that. And, you know, we really enjoyed working with each other. And, you know, we met as actors.

So that actor dynamic in us, like, we're very good. I really like, I really like, the way how we're able to kind of almost like switch the relationship off and it becomes about two actors in a scene because he also really cares about acting. He's great. And so it just becomes about the scene and getting the scene to be good and moments. And, you know, so I like that I'm able to have almost like two different sides of myself with him and as does he. And in second season, it was a bummer. You know, I was bummed. I was bummed that I wasn't able to work with him as much because I really liked our stories and I liked working with him

and he was a brilliant scene partner and I was bummed. I was bummed for sure. And also what ended up happening is I was working so much and he was working so little. He's like in 60 seconds of the entire thing that I never saw him.

I just never saw him anymore. How long did it take you guys to shoot the season? Like a little less than four months maybe. Okay. Yeah. And then Canada again? Yeah.

Yeah, it was Toronto. And Toronto was a great, a great city. I don't know if you've been, but like, it's a beautiful city. I can do without the cold, you know, especially since I have to be like, I can't even wear clothes in it. Like, I always have to be naked and it was snowing in like the coldest day of the year, you know, like that kind of thing. So that's.

Yeah. But yeah, no, Toronto was a fun scene. So for, so doesn't sound like we're getting a season three. I mean, you know, I don't, I don't know. I don't know. know that Netflix, what they always say is that it's about the viewership. I know that's what they, you know, if it does astronomically high and like hugely successful, then it's in their interest to bring it back.

Right. Doesn't. Then it's not in their interest to bring it back. Right. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I know.

I know. It was, it was, it was, it was, it was, now you're making me think about it in a different way, you know? Really? Making me overthink it. Yeah, because I, first of all, by the way, at the, the last episode, I shared that I, I cried like a fucking loser. Oh my. You know, I can't believe I cry.

When, uh, Bill and Cooper say goodbye to each other. That one. Where did you cry in that? I think the whole ending, like the whole ending. Yeah. That's Billing can say goodbye. They say goodbye and he's happy. I think it was great that they made him happy, you know, because then we would have been.

maybe a little angry but I think we're like he's happy underneath it all he's a good guy you deserve that you made it back to the love of your life you know yeah it's it was it was a beautiful little there's still good vibes all around and it's just and again it's just it's so interesting I remember I mean I cry I had to I couldn't stop crying I mean I had to go and like record voiceover stuff for that scene where I say to Cooper you know he tells me he's going to marry Emily and I'm like oh my god, I'm so happy for you. And then, you know, he's like, what about you? Are you? And he, you know, and he says like, you know, what, Billy, you know, for the time that you were mine, like, I'm so grateful for the time that I did get to call you mine. Yeah. And it just, I mean, I could start crying

right now talking about it. It's so beautiful. And, you know, and then she has, and there's that voiceover where it's like in the end, we look back on our lives and we say one of two things, either I'm glad I did or I wish I had. And it's like, and I'm those voiceovers. Those voiceovers, those voiceover. Do you like doing them? You're really good at it. Those things. I did like doing it. I did like doing it. I've been trying to get like a voiceover for years, for 20 years. I've been I've been auditioning for voiceovers and I can't get a damn one. And I'm just like, somebody listen to sex life. But yeah, because I do love, I do love doing voiceover work and you know, stuff like that. So anyway, it's just an easy way to make money and I love it. So yeah, I love doing those. And I thought

it was really well written. I thought the whole point of like, I'm glad I did or I wish I had and be able to say like I had so many I'm glad I did with you. I wonder how many women divorced their husbands after sex life, you know? No, because no joke, but it makes, it did make people ask the questions, you know, and that's, that is real life. Okay. Yeah. I was going to call you Billy. Can you believe that? Hey, it's not a Billy. Like, I'm fine with it. Billy. Billy. Okay. You're currently in Atlanta, right? Yeah. Yeah. Are you working on the new because it just like recently came out that you're working on a new ABC pilot. Yes. Called judgment. Yes. Yes. It's a high stakes legal soap. And I read a little bit about it. I think it's like two hot guys fighting over you. So it's like that's the thing. It's like sex life. But I'm going to say it's like sex life and heavier. It's like heavy on the relationship aspect of it. There's a there's a thriller. aspect of it that's involved too. And it's not, it's not procedural. Like, I'm not sitting

there. Like, there's a couple legal jargons that I have to say, but it's not, I'm not in a courtroom. I'm not in a law office. I'm discussing relationships and I'm stuck between these two men and you see my relate. And the way it starts out is I'm interviewing to be a Supreme Court justice. And it's going to be the first Middle Eastern woman potentially ever put on the court. And you start to hear about all my skeletons. It flashed. back. It flashes back to the year 2022 when I was like this young buck lawyer and I was in this relationship. Already the dynamic is being set that like I start to fall against my own will for his brother who was also a lawyer and they're like rival lawyers, the two brothers. And I'm not

exactly sure, you know, what's going to happen. But but it's pretty juicy. It's almost like, you know, yeah, it's like sex life, but I just have to say like your honor a couple times, you know, Is it fun? Are you having fun shooting it? I'm having a great time shooting it. And I never thought that I would say that about a network show. But I'm so happy with the quality of work. And, you know, our DP, I mean, he just shot Queen's Gambit. He was like Steven Spielberg's camera operator for an incredibly long time.

He was Soderberg's DP for a while. Like, and he's never done network television before and he wanted to try it. So it's like, I'm getting all these incredibly artistic filmmakers to come and shoot the show. Paul McLean is our director who's done an immense amount of film work. And yeah, like it's just elevating everything. And I'm just very, very happy about that. What's next for Sarah? You're working on the show now. What's your next thing? I'm just trying to get on your next podcast. First of all, you're an amazing podcast guest. I mean, things. I hope I'm boring. No, you're amazing.

So thank you so much for coming on my show. Oh, I'm so glad we did this. And like, I know, like, I was following you. And I'm like, she's so cool. I was like, and she's so gorgeous. And I was like how I like her a lot. And, you know, so it's like, I hope I get to meet you one day. Me too.

Well, where is sparkly dresses? That bothered me, by the way. Oh, it bothered me too. Okay. I was wondering, I wanted to ask you, like, I was just like, I think I stopped complaining about it this season because I complained about a lot for a season. And some people answered me and were like, it's supposed to be like, people make up reasons why it's supposed to be. I don't remember what, but like, why always this? Couldn't she have been a little bit fashionable?

I agree with you. And, you know, it's, it was a, you know, the second season was challenging for me. Like, you know, I can tell. I'm not going to put it down, but I definitely did not have the support that I did the first season from the people involved in the show. It became a much different thing for me. And I'm not afraid to say that. And I didn't, you know, and also I really, I struggled. I struggled with the material. I struggled. I just felt the thing that it had the first season. I mean, I'm never going to work for Netflix again now after I'm saying all this. I just can't, I can't lie. and it was definitely a challenge. And, you know, I think a lot of the same, like some of the themes that were there,

I still really like, you know, I still like the themes of second chances. I liked the themes, like, I would have liked to have seen Billy as a single person a little bit more. But they had such a short, and also like Stacey had such a hard job with only six episodes and telling all these fast moving stories. Like, that's hard to do. And I get that. And so, but yeah, it's. Like, I just, I don't know, things just felt different for me this year.

And, and, and I had a hard time because of that. So. Well, I think you did such an amazing job because we didn't notice that. You know what I mean? Well, good. And like I said, I'm never working for Netflix again. There's always Hulu and like a gazillion other streamers. I know.

There's other things. So, Max might want me now. But yeah, but, but, but I still really love like, you know, the romantic themes. I still loved the music. I still loved, you know, like, boy, so. And like I said, those themes of second chances and, you know, divorce and co-parenting and, you know, all that stuff is so real for me. So it was so nice. And then, you know, dating somebody who doesn't have kids and like and what that looks like and how hard that is. Like so all things were so real and

really, really, really resonated with me. And like I said, then there were other things that I just felt I couldn't get behind and it was just challenging. But that's part of, it's part of what I do. you know it's like i'm not always going to get along or agree with a filmmaker i'm not always going to like what i have to do or say and it's but that's my job is to make it believable you know so it definitely definitely was i mean you made us cry at the end you know so like that's all you i love that at the end i cried too i really on a show where we got a tip of a dick you know we got just the tip they should have that were a penis pump oh my god i know i know i forgot about the pump part i think it blacked out the pump part i think it blacked out the pump part

Sarah, you are beyond lovely. It was so good to meet you. And when you're in New York, we're having a billy and Sasha sans the glitter. I love it. I love it. But it's going to be Amanda and Sarah, and it's going to be even better.

Yay. Thank you again. All right. Well, thank you. Thank you guys so much for listening to this episode of Not Skinny but Not Fat. Follow me on Instagram at Not Skinny but Not Fat. Subscribe to the podcast. We don't miss any episodes.

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