NPR Music - Alt.Latino: Melissa Aldana and Gonzalo Rubalcaba talk jazz

Episode Date: September 30, 2026

Jazz has often been called America's musical gift to the world. This week's guests remind us not only of the well-documented ways that Cuba revolutionized that gift, but also how it blossomed in South America.Chilean tenor saxophonist Melissa Aldana and Cuban pianist Gonzalo Rubalcaba stopped by after their recent Tiny Desk performance to chat about their own personal histories with jazz and its lineage in their respective countries. The memories Rubalcaba shares about Havana's jazz scene in the 1980s adds another layer to a story we've talked a lot about on Alt.Latino. And Aldana looks back on her youth learning music from her father and grandfather, both of whom were Chilean jazz pioneers.The conversation also covers the music they played at the Tiny Desk, which comes from their recent album, 'Filin,' a reexamination of a Cuban musical movement that lasted from the 1940s through the '60s. Ultimately, this week's episode is time spent with two master musicians to hear how their lives and experiences contribute to their mutual appreciation and love of jazz.Check out Melissa Aldana and Gonzalo Rubalcaba's Tiny Desk Concert here.This podcast episode was produced by Noah Caldwell. Suraya Mohamed is the executive producer of NPR Music.Support public media with NPR+ and enjoy perks for over 25 podcasts like this one. This show’s perks include bonus episodes and sponsor-free listening. Learn more at plus.npr.org.See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences.NPR Privacy Policy

From NPR Music, this is Alt Latino. I'm Felix Contreras. Okay, we're in the middle of Latin Music Month, which means we're featuring 10 artists from different countries, different cultures, different styles from throughout Latin America at the tiny desk. We call it El Tiny. And after the shows, what we've been doing is pulling a few of the artists aside to talk to them about their music, a little bit of history, and maybe even a little bit of life.

This week, we're talking jazz. Surprise, surprise, with tenor saxophonist Melissa Aldana, and pianist Gonzalo Rualcama. They came in to play some songs from their recently released album, Feeling, a re-examination of a Cuban music style that was popular in the 1940s through the 1960s. Melissa Aldana is originally from Chile, which, honestly, we rarely chat about in jazz circles. It's always fascinating to me to hear how much impact jazz has had in Latin America for decades. And Gonzalo Rubacaba is an icon of Cuban piano.

From his earliest days in Cuba back in the 1980s, through his time here in the U.S. He has played with so many well-known jazz masters, he himself has become one of those A-list names. We started a conversation talking about Cuba's relationship with jazz. Gonzalo, let's start with you. Let's talk a little bit about the history of jazz and jazz. in Cuba and the relationship. Because they're, if not son

brothers, are primos, no? Like, what was your exposure to jazz? When did you first hear it? I was a little kid when I heard jazz music in Cuba.

I think we had to say that Cuba has a large jazz tradition and has been involved in many different ways to vinculate jazz to our own style of music. It comes, well, books said it come from the beginning of the 20th century,

but I think it's coming even before. Some of the Cuban composers of classical music, they were aware of jazz, and they include some codes coming from jazz music and their music. harmonies and especially harmonies and probably some melodies, a form of melodies that came from North America, because there was a very intense traffic or transit between Hugh and America and United States at that time. So my father had some very old recordings at home, I mean, Tommy, Dorsey, Bar Power, also, Erogartner.

Wow. Benny Goodman, Stan Kenton, Big Band, Dizzy Gillespie. And I heard that when I was probably five or four or five years old, it was not the only music that we used to hear at home. I think the most valuable guide that I have from my. My family was don't be close to any bad conception about music, but the only thing you have to find is a good level of art and music. It could be classical, it could be jazz, it could be Cuban, any kind.

And this is exactly what happened at home. I was able to hear every kind of music, but jazz was really strong. not only at home, but among the musicians that used to visit my family at home. So Peruchin, Frank Emilio. Two very, very well-known pianists. Legendary.

Exactly. Of course, Bevo Valdez, but also many others, before the generation that came up in the 60, the 50, in the 60s, like Chucho, Emiliano, there were many of the pianists already with very deep relationship with jazz. My experience has been that most people, music fans, like if they're thinking about Cuba,

they're thinking about drums, percussion, conga, batati, but it's the pianist, man. It's the piano that it's like the, the carillon and the heartbeat of the Cuban jazz scene. Piano resumes many aspects of the music, which is not only the one of the part, heart, but also the harmony, but also the rhythm. So something that

the instrument itself allows you to convince the people that they are listening the whole orchestra in one instrument, which is not true. But you can find a way to trick that to the people listen to you playing, especially when you play piano solo. It is true. You can hear the tombau, what we call tombau or Montuno, And that already contained all the possible elements that you can hear in a big band, an orchestra coming, out of a trumpet section, out of a saxophone section, or out of a rhythm section.

So you are able to provoke that illusion that everything is in there. So probably that's the reason why you say that. It is classified as a percussion instrument in the orchestra. It is. piano. Okay, I'm going to put you on the spot. Can you think of a pianist that you think represents what you're talking about, the rhythmic and the melodic sense? Someone from the past, someone, one of the guys you mentioned, Perucin, or can you think of a track we could play right now? Well, I had to say my father was one of them that really was a big reference for me.

And I think he had a lot coming from Perichin too. So Perichin has that, I don't know how to translate that word in English. We used to say waperia. Waperia is an actitude. Addit to. But at the same time, he was really elegant in his style. I mean, clean, he got everything. He was able to play around the instrument,

but at the same time he was able to develop a very deep harmonies. Yeah, Berichin was probably one of the guy. There was a Wahira, and there was an amazing band behind him with Guillermo Barreto on percussion. Oh. I think it was Cachau on bass.

Oh, my God. All stars, man. Yeah, many of them. But really impressive. Really impressive. He is a lot of. actually was also very into the concept

to bring some American songs and play that in the very Cuban way. So that we're talking about the 40s, the 50s. Right. Those guys were already doing that. Mario Wausa did

it before in the 30s. Yeah, in the 30s. And between the 30s and the 40s. So many people that we never mentioned that they create that basement to do what we're doing right now. So we talked about the idea of, like I said, like if they weren't,

their menos, they were primos, jazz and Cuban music, for a long, long time. But Melissa, there is probably not as much of a connection or a tradition with jazz in Chile. But what's fascinated to me is that your dad was a musician, right? A jazz musician. So that's how you heard it.

What was that like? I mean, talk to us about that. Yeah, well, my father and my grandfather. And your grandfather? Yeah, he was one of the first jazz musicians in Chile during the 50s. He used to play baritone and tenor. And used to have like an orchestra where they play like LeMiller's arrangements, his own arrangements.

It was very famous back then. It was called La Wambalie. and then my father is one of the well-known jazz musicians in Chile. He was actually part of the Monk Competition when Joshua Redmond won in the early 90s. Wow. The Thelonious Monk competition. A jazz competition here in the United States. Yeah, yeah.

Wow. And yeah, he was one of the first South Americans that got into the semifinals. So I grew up listening to my grandfather doing less than. on the son sat home and my father practicing at home all day long. He was really into transcribing. So he will, well, he loved Michael Breaker. That was his main guy. The tenor saxophonist. Yeah. Yeah. And he had like boxes and boxes of hand-gritting transcriptions. So he will memorize them and then write them down and just spend hours doing that at home. So I grew up around that since I was very young.

So now what about La Musica de Chile? Like, what was, were you listening to that as well? Well, later on, I kind of grabbed in a bubble. A jazz bubble? A jazz bubble, yeah. Thinking that, like, Charlie Parker was the hippest musician and the only thing going on. And that was all what my father heard. A lot of Charlie Parker, cannon balladerly.

He loved Phil Woods. And then Breaker, Michael Breaker. the Brecker Brothers, Step Ahead. Yeah. I remember being a kid, and every Sunday watching the live concert, they did at the Barcelona Jazz Festival. Yeah, it's a great video. Yeah. So that was my main education.

And then when I started growing up, I started getting into some different kind of music. But it was, I never had like a very profound connection with Chile music, but it was mostly with Argentinian, like rock from the 90s. with Spinetta, you know, Charlie Garcia, and that was the music that I listened to it when I was growing up. So I think we were all teenagers, we all want to fit in, we want to be cool with everybody else. But so you were a teenager, and you're listening to the jazz all the time. What were your friends listening to?

Back then I remember it was techno music. That was kind of like the music of their times when I was growing up. I never had a deep connection, So I don't know any bands or anything from that. And like I said, for me, it was like a bubble. You know, I will wake up. My dad loved practicing. And he was also very, I don't know what is the right way to say it.

But yeah, he made me practice a lot when I was a kid. So that my whole day was surrounded by waking up, transcribing. Oh, my gosh. I'm going to high school, like a normal high school. I always felt like an outsider. Uh-huh. And then going back home and then we will spend hours just practicing together. So for the people that are listening, let's give a point of reference of the age difference.

We don't have to say exact ages, but I know, Gosella, you were born in the 60s. And Melissa, when were you born? 88. 88. Yeah. Okay. So that's the different musical references, just for people who are listening because they can't tell who's who. So you're living in this jazz bubble, but people were listening to techno, and you just kept going straight through.

At what point were you able to look back and say, well, you know, I need to learn more about music from Chile. Well, as a growing up, I mean, still trying to figure out my identity. As a Latina playing this music, of course, I always knew about, you know, the big references, Nicarov-Para, Violeta Parra, you know, but for me it's been more going into like the South American songbook, you know, specifically, well, the Argentinian rock that I've been, to this days, I feel a very deep connection with Spinetta and all the frame of work that he has done is the beauty of their lyrics and how he, how he interpreted. But later on, I feel in love with Ginga, you know, Metto Pascual, Katano Velasual. Catano Veloso So my musical reference are more

from those kind of places than actually Chile. Do you want to pick Hermeto Pasquale's song? Yeah. So we can play a little bit so people can hear what you were listening to.

Do you have one in particular? Well, I think the Litter Church, which is one that we recently recorded, but it's a song that has been in my heart for a long time. I was a kid. Which version? From the Live Evil album?

Yeah. Like old album. Okay. So this is a version from the Miles Davis live evil album. It's called Little Church. We need to point out that there's Miles Davis on trumpet and Hermito Pascual whistling. Yeah. Right?

I think at one point, I think I read somewhere that Miles Davis called Hermito Pascar, the greatest living musician ever or something like that. He had a lot of respect for him, which is very interesting. cross-reference or cross-cultural reference given that Miles Davis was really into like electronic instruments and doing rock and doing all the other stuff and funk and everything but listening to Brazilian music,

a Brazilian musician like Armento Pasquale. Yeah, it's a huge reference for me growing up. Okay, we're coming back with our conversation with Gonzalo Ruvalcaba and Melissa Aldana right after this break. And now let's get back to our conversation with Melissa Aldana and Gonzalo Rubacaba. Gonzalo, as you started to develop your career,

I know we talked to you earlier today about this amazing band that you had in Cuba in the 80s Group of Projecto. When you started putting together your own bands, did you have an objective? Did you have a goal? Did you have a meta? Did you have a Dichu?

Did you have a... Like, what was the idea? What did you want to do? The beauty of that time for... musicians were to create the own sound, their own way to make music and see that and listen to the people to recognize, I mean, that the people could recognize you as something original, something specific, because there were a lot of bands in Cuba, many bands in Cuba. And there was a rich moment because all of them had their own way to make music.

You could recognize easily in the first part of the music, this is this band, this is this guy, this guy. And you're talking about the 1980s. Yeah, exactly. And this is probably one of the most difficult things to get it. I mean, to create your own voice. And this is what we're looking for. I mean, they had a lot of reference and people that will love.

and people that we follow, but at the same time it was clear that the target was to find an space that everybody could recognize that band, that sound, that music, the way we play, the way we create arrangements. It's not

something that you get it from one day to another one, to the next one day, but it takes time. But I believe that's the process. That's the way it should be. And from there, as you started working on your music in the 80s and then moving forward and you come to the United States,

I think in the 90s maybe, since then you have more of a reputation of more of the straight-ahead player and playing a little bit of Cuban music a little bit. But you played with, like you mentioned, you play with Charlie Hayden, you play with Jack DeGene, you play with all of these really top-notch jazz musicians what took your music in that direction? I don't know how to explain that.

I mean, more than playing with them, I've been learning from them. Wow. And the same way I learned doing this recording with Melissa and the musicians involved in this project. So it is always like that. I mean, believing that you are the only one

that are able to give something is a confused idea. is a mistake. I mean, to me, I see it in a way that I can get something from that. Even if I'm in charge of arrangement, of music or production, whatever, at the end,

the most important is what I get from there. And I'd be very blessed having the opportunity to play with many great musicians. Not only American, Americans, but also people from Europe, from Asia, from Africa, from South America, including many of them Brazilians. But the Cuban elements are there in one and another way.

Some of the recordings that just impressed me and moved me so much was your work with Charlie Hayden, the bass player of Charlie Hayden. Let's hear a track from that album. Do you have one in particular you want to hear? No, true. That record had some of the most popular boleros or Cuban. ballads from the 50s and the 60s, and my concert was not telling anybody how to play that. But let the people go through and play this music the way they feel it.

Yeah. And I think this is at the end what made the sound and the results we have in those records. Do you have a particular track you want to play? In La Orilla del Mundo. I think it's a beautiful tear. This Nocturn album was, don't you think, believe? It was such a major moment. Oh, yeah. It's beautiful.

It's one of my favorites. Where were you when you first heard it? Yeah, I heard when I was very young. But I remember more recently, probably like before the pandemic, we were on tour. And we were with Lagaloon, Pablo and Cush. And we were doing like a listening session of our favorite albums. And we heard like in La Oriole de Mundo. And then it kind of hit me.

Yeah. It was recorded in Miami. this record. Charlie wanted to record this record in Miami because he said that he wanted to be closer to the Latin way to have that mood in Miami and Cuban people around. And we didn't mention

Brito's, which is the violin played in the record. We spent three days in Miami recording that in the criteria Yeah. Which is a place with a lot of history. The BG is recorded. Oh, BG, Jackson,

yeah, all of them. Eric Leila, Eric Clapton, very famous studio. Melissa, for the record that you have out, what was your intention in reaching out to Gonzalo to be part of this record? Is it all the history that he carries with him, in addition to the sound

and just obviously just being a very nice guy but I mean like what was your intention when you were thinking to this record why did you think you wanted Gonzalo as part of the record? Well it was kind of a selfish move because I just wanted to have the experience

of flying with Gonzalo but also because I because of Nocturn really? I felt I felt like it was the moment to do a ballad's record. And I were thinking to do music from the American Song book. And then when I reached out to Gonzalo, it became, well, he talked to me about the

feeling movement. And as I started checking out the music, we were some things I heard before, but I wasn't really familiar with the movement. I just fell in love with the music. But yeah, I mean, it was just daydreaming. I was like, with who would I love to record and, get a chance to do something and likely everything worked out. But yeah, I just knew that Gonzalo was the perfect person to be part of the project.

How would you explain or define the Philly movement in Cuba in the 60s? The feeling was, I always said, that was a refined way to, of the Bolero tradition. All the players, the composers, singers, that make possible that movement that we know as a feeling, they were very connected with the popular flavor or taste of people. But at the same time, they were very connected with the intellectual elite. I mean, poet and painters and filmmaker. and they used to make those things we call Descargas, which is a giant.

Like a jam session. And everyone used to show the new song or the new music they were developing. So it's an elevated vision of the slow ballad, Cuban ballad music, what we call before Boleros. And they're trying to raise the level. of lyrics, but also of the harmonies and the melodies and even the form of the music, the structure of the music.

The focus was not only in the lyrics, but also in the way how to play that music too. That means that a lot of the tools of musicians came up as part of that movement. And they brought a lot of jazz music, but also about European music. You can hear a lot of melodies that can be also a French or a German melody coming from the opera or any specific classic music form. That's the way I see it.

Yeah. So let's kind of wrap this up a little bit. There were no saxophones in these original recordings are very little. They weren't the featured instrument. So how did you imagine, like, what did you do to place yourself in this? this music? Well, I went to a very, it was a deep process. The first thing was to go deeper into the lyrics, just to listen to it as much as I could. And then something that, which is a tool that my father taught me when I was a kid, and that is basically how I learned everything that I know

about music, about sound, time, feel, and ideas is transcribing. So I took each song and I transcribe the melodies. I slowed them down and and put attention to every single detail of how they were singing those melodies from the length of the notes, the accents, the, I don't know what is the melismas, the, you know, the vibratoes, how the sang, like the time field that they have, you know, which was a very specific way of singing them. And through the process, I could for the first time actually understand the importance of understanding the lyrics, you know, because it's my mother language. So I could memorize them and understanding in a much different way than when I learned a song from the American songbook. So it was that, just a lot of listening and then transcribing and trying to make it sound like, you know, trying to sound like Jose Antonio Mendez.

and be very detailed about every single aspect of how they were singing those songs. Can you think of a song, Melissa, from that era that influenced you in making this record? Yeah, one of the first ones that I heard after Gonzalo suggested to check out this time period was Dime Ceres-Deges-Doh from Jose Antonio Mendez. and I fell in love with the melody and later on with the lyrics and the whole story behind the song. If you're with the song,

to be sure of being to be medita and think that to be to be happy I guess the final thing I want to ask is, you know, Gonzalo just mentioned that he, you know, he chose or had an opportunity to work with Charlie Hayden

and some of the great jazz musicians because he wanted to learn. Is that part of what came out of this project with playing with Gonzalo? Are you able to, you know, absorb and learn and appreciate everything that he's been that he represents the way he does? Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's so many lessons that I learned in the later time

that we spent together playing that I will always carry the rest of my life, you know, and I think that that was my main, the main idea when I thought of calling Gonzalo is to really want to be able to have that experience to become a better musician, you know, and to be able to play next to him and understand how it feels, you know?

Yeah. I would like to add something. Melissa, I consider, is a master for many reasons, not only talent, which is obvious, but because the professionalism, how responsible she is taking care with every aspect, every detail. And we didn't have much time to rehearse.

The music, we did it a day before going to the studio for about two and a half hours or three hours maximum in New York. And it's a music that apparently sound not complicated, but it is in a way that you have to attend to many details, sound, the way harmonies walk. And I realized when I saw her playing and the rehearsing the music, that that, um, that that, that, you know, that, explained to me that she spent hours and hours looking very, very close to every moment, every aspect of this music. And then at the studio when we went already to record the music, we practically did very little amount of version of each son. So it is a privilege to be part of this record. And I'm very glad and very thankful to be invited by. by Melissa to do this project together.

Okay, let's go out on your version of that track, Dime C. Edis II, from the new album. Thank you both so very much in spending time with us here in the studio. It was really, it was an honor to talk to both of you. And congratulations on the tiny desk. It's really a fantastic performance. and we're very, very, we're very honored that you guys came to do this. So thank you. Thank you.

Thank you so much. Thanks so much to Melissa Aldana and Gonzalo Wu Alcaba. Their album Feeling came out earlier this year and their Tiny Desk Concert just published, so go out and check it out. You've been listening to Alt-Latino from NPR Music. Our audio producer is Noah Caldwell. Executive producer is Soraya Muhammad. Executive Director of NPR Music is Sonali Menta.

Are you a fan of? Anna Jazz, do you want to hear more? Don't tell Anna. Send me an email at Altlatino at npr.org. You have been listening to Out Latino. I'm Felix Contreras. Thanks for listening.