NPR Music - The music of 'Sinners,' hyper-pop and more: The Contenders, Vol. 9

Episode Date: April 29, 2025

We update our running list of the year's best songs with a staggering cut from the new 'Sinners' film, hyperpop from Jane Remover, the return of Foxwarren and more.Featured artists and songs:1. Miles Caton: "I Lied to You," from 'Sinners'2. Foxwarren: "Yvonne," from '2'3. Jane Remover: "Dancing with your eyes closed," from 'Revengeseekerz'4. Mal Blum: "I'm So Bored," from 'The Villain'5. Men I Trust: "The Landkeeper," from 'Equus Asinus'All Songs Considered 25th anniversary segment: Our number one songs from 2010Weekly reset: Dinner and dance performance, Chiang Mai, ThailandEnjoy the show? Share it with a friend and leave us a review on Apple or wherever you listen to podcasts. Questions, comments, suggestions or feedback of any kind always welcome: [e-mail] Hear new songs from past episodes in the All Songs Considered playlists in Apple Music and Spotify.See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences.NPR Privacy Policy

Sheldon Pierce, can we just get right to the big question that I think is on everyone's mind? Let's get to it. Why are there so many horror movies out right now? Have you seen this? It's a great question. They are popping. Normally, you would have thought of them as a sort of Halloween tradition. Right.

You settle into the darkness of fall, daylight savings time. Exactly. And then, boom, you get a bunch of horror movies. Now we're seeing... You've got Woman in the Yard, which the trailer for that, I know because a lot of these trailers, We're showing during the NCAA tournament, and I was watching them with my kids. So all I know is their screams and them running from the room every time all these trailers would come on or putting, you know, had their hands over their eyes.

Got ugly step sister, something called it feeds, the movie Sinners. There's a new Megan movie coming. Did you know there's a horror movie out now called Robin? I didn't. Are we living it right now on this podcast? Robin. A horror movie out now, it's called Robin, and it's all about some like, he's. evil robot doll.

I mean, that seems to be the newest craze, right? How can technology terrorize us? I'm sure we could do an entire episode on why we're getting all these scary movies in the spring. There's such a disconnect. But there's one in particular that actually has a music angle and it's sinners. And I know you've seen that movie. Yeah, sinners. The new sort of blockbuster feature from the writer-director,

Ryan Coogler, which features the actor Michael B. Jordan in two roles playing twins. Yeah. Takes place in the 1930s. It's a bit of a historical drama that also doubles as a vampire horror story. But music really is at the center of the whole thing. It introduces the singer and actor Miles Caiton, who sort of came out of nowhere for this role. Who is this guy? He was a backup singer for her.

He got the script for this movie and sent in an audition tape on a whim, and he got the job. And I think you can hear in his musical performances why he got the job. This movie centers blues music very heavily, and he has a very, very soulful voice. There is one particular song that he does that is sort of the turning point of the entire movie. And no spoilers. No spoilers. No spoilers. but you sort of cross the threshold with this song.

It's called I Lied to You. Something I've been going to tell you for a long time. It might hurt you. Hope you don't lose your mind. Well, I was just a boy. About eight years old. You threw me a Bible on that Mississippi rope. See, I love your papa.

You did all you can. do And they say the truth hurts So I lied to you Yes I lied to you I love the Are you kidding me

I mean Like This guy's cooking Like the first minute And a half or so This song And you're like All right

I'm totally down with this This is some great classic old school blues And then those 808s kick in And you're like Wait a minute Where are we going with this? And it's not just like

okay, we're going to add a little electric slide or something like that. Right. I mean, it is... Once it takes off, it just really takes off. And it is moving in so many directions. Really thinking of blues as, like, a source code for so much soul music all the way up through rap. I mean, that's it. Electrofunk, breakbeat DJing, Hendrix era rock.

Right. Just like manipulated, talk box, voice. from like Roger Troutman. It is moving in so many directions, but the thing that is so cool about it is Miles' vocal performance is at the center of that thing as it churns outward in all directions.

He is anchoring it right there, and you can feel the soul of it through all of its transformations. This totally stands on its own, right? I mean, it is such a powerful performance. And so, you know, often with movies, there's the score, the original score, and there's the soundtrack,

and in this case, this is from the soundtrack, the score, which is the more instrumental, like, orchestrated stuff. That's by Ludwig Gorinson, who just won the Oscar for Oppenheimer. Right. In this case, they got someone else, though, to write all these songs.

I wasn't Ludwig who wrote these sort of bluesy songs. They got Raphael Sadiq for this one, yeah? Yeah, yeah. And there is a little bit of overlap between the work that Raphael Sadiq did on this project and the work that Ludwig did on this project, this project. But you can, Raphael Sadiq has the ultimate soul man's resume. Yeah. While my children were screaming with their hands over their faces during the center's trailer, all I was thinking is,

that looks awesome. I can't wait to see it. And then like hearing this music now, I'm even more all in. I can't wait to see that. Sheldon, do you feel like you're someone who is sort of dialed into the little things in life? You know, like the things that are. really, really small, but can be full of really deep meaning if you give them any kind of attention. I do consider myself a sort of detailed oriented person who is trying to like stop a little bit and observe what is happening around me. I do think we are losing a bit of that as a community. Yeah. I mean, I have like, I remember I used to work in grocery stores. I spent years working in grocery stores. And I remember this one time I was cleaning the floors of some mile. I was running a

buffing machine back and forth. And I stopped and I looked at the end of the aisle and our deli was down at the end of the aisle and there was this woman working behind the counter and she was like scooping or ladling some casserole slop into containers for people, you know. And I just stopped for a minute and there was something in that moment watching her do this and hand the food to people and stuff. I just had this moment where I thought, I love people. I love everybody. I love every stupid little moment of life like this. I mention all this because this song that I want to play from the band Fox Warren, I think gets at this idea a little bit. And I can tell you more about Fox Warren if you don't know them after we hear this song.

But Fox Warren has a new album coming out. It's called Two. This is a band fronted by Andy Schauff. He's just such an incredible storyteller. So give a listen to this. It's called Yvonne and see if you can kind of track the story that he is telling in this song. Telling me exactly what she means. Sharing her dreams with me or I don't know we find.

With her metallic case within the sand. Sharing her dreams with me. I don't know. So one of the things you hear right off for those harmonies, right? Yeah. I mean, that is a staple of Andy Schauff, Fox Warren. But this is one of those songs where I think, you know, it's lyrically pretty spare.

It's a very short song, but I think there's a lot going on in this sort of compact little moment. I'm curious what you tracked when you were listening to it because it's not hitting you over the head. It's not super obvious, but it's in there. Yeah, I like, you know, the field recording Siegel sounds sort of floating in the background. It's very clearly trying to set the scene. I think of it as the singer being at a remove from the subject. like seeing them at a distance, observing them, sort of taking them, and you feel the distance there, you feel the desire to sort of like not disrupt what they're doing.

Yeah. But like this sort of deep appreciation for what is happening. Yeah. You know, on the one hand, it seems like a simple little love song. What would I do without you, Yvonne? Right. But who is Yvonne? And what is she doing?

She's waving her metallic arm around and you're like, wait, was she a robot? What is it? And then you realize, I had to listen to it a couple times, Yvonne is on a beach. The sand. Yeah, she's got a metal detector. She's waving back and forth. She's looking for buried treasure, man. Looking for buried treasure, right?

And so, you know, let's say, Andy in this case, the singer, is observing her. I think you're right, from a distance. Yeah. And he's having one of those moments where he's watching this person look for something in the sand that's going to excite them, turn their life around something, some sort of treasure, right? And he's having a moment watching this person from a distance and telling them, I love you. What would I do without you, Yvonne? You have enriched my life in a very meaningful, maybe sort of fleeting, but not any less important way. So it's been a minute since Fox Warren had an album out.

So were you familiar with them? Are you a Foxxwar? I was not familiar with this one. Yeah. So their last album came out in 2018. It was their self-titled debut. That was my favorite album of 2018. but I had come to Andy Schafe as a solo artist

before coming to Fox Warren and so I thought Fox Warren was like his side project but it turns out he had been in Fox Warrant for years Fox Warrant just had never put out any music Yeah, they weren't doing anything and so he ended up just starting to put out his own stuff but it had been so long seven years since their last record not only did I think it was maybe a side project for Andy Schafe

I thought oh it's just a little one-off that he did and great to have that one record, but so excited to have them back. The album from Fox Warren, again, it's called Two, and it is out May 30th. All right, a reminder that if you like the show, share it with a friend. Leave us a glowing review on Apple or Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Also, coming up later, we'll continue our ongoing celebration of our 25th anniversary with a look at our number one songs from 2010. We've been doing a different year in each episode of the show this spring.

Stephen Thompson and I were up to 2010. So we're going to have that for you a little later on, plus your weekly reset. So keep listening for all of that. Sheldon, I want to talk about a piece that you just wrote that's up on our site right now, all about Hyperpop. The headline for anyone who wants to search for it, anatomy of a microgenre Hyperpop's Next Evolution. So I have to be honest, Hyperpop, it's one of those genres that I've had,

a really hard time with. Like, I have a hard time connecting with it beyond sort of the surface of it. You know, a lot of it's pretty abrasive. Yeah. Pretty chaotic. And whatever emotional heart there is to it is often lost in all of that noise for me. But I thought your piece is excellent. And I thought you offered maybe some ways into it. Yeah. I am on the opposite end of the spectrum. Hyperpop is super for me. Yeah. I love almost all Hyperpop. but I do also understand the resistance to it, how it can be inaccessible for most people. A lot of it is sort of throwing everything in a blender

and not putting the lid on. That's exactly what it is. And at the end, it's all over you. It's all over the room. It's everywhere. A big mess has been made and you don't know what to do. Right. But I felt like even though it is sort of blown out and excessive and throwing everything at the wall, it had this core DIY ethic.

It was all about the music itself and not necessarily the stardom that surrounds a lot of pop music. It's about the sounds and aesthetics of a time, maybe bygone, maybe across eras sometimes. They're trying to pull all of this internet history through a point. But I think the artist that we're going to listen to on the show is sort of the pinnacle of what hyperpop can be. Their name is Jane Remover. And the stuff on their new album, Revenge Seekers, is sort of a return to the Digi Chorus sound that they pioneered as a teenager. Well, so what do you want to hear? Yeah, I want to hear one of the sort of revenge seekers standouts.

It's called Dancing with Your Eyes Closed. Is that not just how you baby, we are going outside. Sucking our own dreams I have. Let's turn off. I'll take all my back. Is that not just scramble your brain? I mean, when you listen to it? I mean, how is there anything left?

It's absolutely insane. I mean, the music sounds like it's glitching out, but there's also something earwormy about it. And I think that's the hyphen between the hyper and the pop. It's like, it's obviously high. hyperactive. And I mean, the song breaks down like four different times. But there is something super hooky about so much of those sections. I think every time it breaks down, it transforms into something interesting and worth following. I think in a lot of ways, hyperpop is the most

now sounding music being made. I mean, it's sort of how the world feels. And it's not just the chaos and the noise, but I don't know, check me on this. And I'm curious what you think. To me, it feels like there's this sort of detached quality to it where there's almost a kind of boredom or something behind the music. Does that, you know, like a disassociation or something behind it. Do you feel that? Absolutely. And I think that's representative in a lot of ways of what it's like to be online. Yeah. There is a dissociation that is happening. You are at a natural remove from a lot of what you are experiencing. I think that is sort of the irony bouncing back and forth

between a lot of what is going on in this music because I do think there is a very real sense of community online that built these songs. It's in this song too. Actually, I wrote down one of my notes is like as icy as this is and synthetic. There is a feeling of unity in it. Yeah, yeah.

Well, you go a lot deeper in your piece about hyperpop, what exactly it even is, how we got here and everything. So people should definitely check that up. Again, it's called Anatomy of a microgenre Hyperpop's Next Evolution. Well, I'm super excited about something that couldn't be more different from that. It's from the artist Mal Blum, who very often will perform just their voice in the guitar. They are an artist that I have loved and played on the show for a number of years now. Their songs have so much personality and light. They're a little quirky, a little playful, but there's always just a little bit hint of darkness, I think, kind of lurking around in some of these songs. I think they're a lot more nuanced than they might sound to people when, you know, maybe when you first listen.

And I think all of that is definitely true of this new song that I want to play from Mal Blum. They've got a new album coming out called The Villain. And the first single that we've got from it is called, well, appropriately for our previous discussion, it's called I'm So Bored. What I'm embarrassing I can't believe You made a fool of me You sold me on a pretty light A baited life

I booked a flight And promise not to leave Please don't say you'd be okay If I should have relief for you When they asked me I say It's complicated What a great last line That is killer

You know because they've been singing the whole time About you know they're just so bored You know they didn't even notice this person they were with is gone, but then they closed with, did you leave already? I didn't, I didn't notice. Yeah, I love this, like, little fourth wall break just before that, too. Like, I can't keep the lie going through the chorus. Like, the whole time, the whole time you feel like you're, like, an outsider, like, witnessing this one-v-one dialogue, right? Between somebody in a relationship with somebody else who just will not sustain the feeling for whatever reason.

and then you have this pivot outward where it's like, is that person even here? Am I in dialogue with myself, actually? Right. I mean, they even say, like, let's just get to the part where you're gone. Right. Can we just, I really want to use that sometime when I'm talking to someone I don't want to have a conversation with anymore. Like, can we just skip to the part where you're not here anymore?

But, you know, but here's the thing. You hear what I'm talking about. Like, it's a little playful, a little quirky, super melodic. super hooky, but there are some real hints of some darker things going on in this song. Like at one point, Mal Blum sings about, you know, whoever they're singing about, they sing, you don't want to have to ask me twice and I better respond nice. Yeah. That's quite a line.

They're clearly in some sort of threatening relationship, right? Right. Like, you don't want to have to ask me twice and I better be nice or what. You know, it's like there's almost hints of violence. You know, at one point they say, we've reached this point where we only speak through intermediaries. I'm getting hints of a restraining order or something, right? I mean, there's some really, like, the more you sit with this, you realize this is not the super bubbly pop song that it sounds like. I mean, the lyric, I don't think anyone really knows what you're like when you're alone.

Tells you that this person has, there's something malicious happening within this relationship. That's it. And I think the voice is really selling a lot of the duality of this song. There is sort of like a dejection that can be read as apathetic, as waving off this thing that has withered on the vine and is sort of already dead on arrival, essentially. And yet the feeling that they arrive at is boredom. Right. So in conversation with the Jane Remover song, you think? Like some of those themes, do you think?

Yeah, yeah. Definitely the idea of sort of settling on detachment as a coping mechanism for the sort of horrors of the world. Well, that's funny. I never thought of boredom as a survival mechanism. Yeah. But yeah, for sure. Well, this album from Mal Blum is called The Villain and it is out July 11th. Okay, we've got that look at the show's number one songs from 2010 coming up along with your weekly reset.

But Sheldon, I know you've got one more that you want to play for us before we go. And let me say that I did not know this song or this artist before you shared this with me. And it almost immediately became one of my favorite songs of the year. Yeah, I mean, the stars have aligned. I get to talk about my two favorite artists of the moment. We did Jane Remover. And now we get to talk about my favorite band of the moment, the Canadian indie group, Men I Trust. I've been keyed into Men I Trust since their album Uncle Jazz was long listed for the 2020 Polaris Prize.

The song Show Me How sort of went viral on TikTok a few years after. They've built a small little fan base in the wake of that, but they are like a truly independent band. Their album was released into the ether in the middle of the week. It's called Equis Asinus, which is, Is that donkey? Yes. Yes. Yeah.

Okay. The technical term for a domesticated donkey. All of their titles are like that. Their previous album from 2021 was called Untourable album. So there's a bit of a... There's a bit of a wink and a nudge in, like, everything that they do. But this new record is one of my favorites. And I want to listen to, I think, the standout song from this.

that record. It's called the landkeeper. feels like the dream of the pop like three layers deep. Like I'm so sucked into it. And also it's like there are lyrics and they do have meaning, but they also feel like sort of. Well, I was going to ask you if you had any clue what this is about. Like I couldn't, I really, I sat with the lyrics for a while. Yeah.

I didn't get very far. Yeah. It's like individual phrases. I mean, they have meaning in the sense of I feel like I understand. understand their energy, but I can't follow the story. I can't follow the characters if there are any. But, I mean, her voice just like is so, so powerful. It's enchanting.

You know, when the song first starts off, I thought for sure I was going to hear some sort of, sort of resonant, dreamy, sort of speak, singing voice like Jarvis Cocker. Yeah. You know, kind of come in like, uh, I'm Jarvis Crocker. Candy corn, whiskey sour, daydreams, and unholy hours. I like smoking. Doesn't it just sound like that? It's totally.

And so I was blindsided in a way by her voice when it comes in. Because it is just so enchanting. Yeah. It is also radiant. It's like incandescent. There's something like lit up about it. It feels like seeing a light off in the distance. and you can see the slight in the darkness,

there is like something so warm and drawing about it, even in its delicacy. Well, you know what it is, Sheldon? It's the kind of day where you could go with shorts or jeans. You know, it's like, you know, a hoodie or just a straight t-shirt. You know, it's that perfect in between, you know. It's kind of a little overcast, a rainy day, but the sun's peeking through every now and then. Yeah.

Yeah, it is a vibe. You know, I am happy to camp out in. Forever. So the song Landkeeper again from Men I Trust in that album is Equis Asinus, Latin for donkey, horse donkey, donkey. But thanks, Sheldon, as always, for hanging out and sharing such great music. Always a great time. All right, it's all songs considered it's 25th anniversary, and we're looking back at the music that defined the show over the years. Stephen Thompson back to talk about the year 2010. Hey, Stephen. Hello, Robin. So we're up to 2000.

and we're looking at the number one songs from across the past 25 years of all songs considered. And maybe it's worth reminding people that these are not the number one billboard songs or the 100 or whatever. These are songs that, you know, matter to us, matter to the show that take us back to that time when we were working on all songs considered. What do you think of when you think of 2010? I mean, 2010 is such a fascinating year just for me and my life. It was a year of massive, massive title shifts in my life. And when I think of the music that stood out, it only makes sense that what has bubbled to the top is songs that reflect a state of pure euphoria. Kishi.

No. Oh, no, no. Yonzi. Yonzi. I was thinking, 150. Is it 150? You were thinking of like bright whites by Kishi Bashi. That's not until 2012.

Yeah. So I remember it's called. go-do, but I can't remember the album. The album is just called go. Okay, go, right. Not okay go, that's a whole different band. Right, right. If you want the sonic equivalent of euphoria, it's hard to do better than this song.

That whole record is so glorious. And I remember being so endlessly surprised by it, because Yonzi had made, you know, by that point, a very long string of these languid, beautiful. kind of lugubrious records with Sigur-Ros, that had a sweep to them, had beauty and grandeur to them, but they moved much more slowly. And so it's like, oh, he's gone solo, he's going to move inward. Like, he's going to find some inner spot that he hasn't found working with Sigur-Rose. And instead, this record that just bloomed like a sunflower

and was full of optimism and possibility, I cannot tell you how much this was the record I exactly needed in the exact moment that I found it, where, you know, I was coming out of hardship. I got divorced, okay? And I don't want to talk about it. I don't want to talk about it, but listen. There's every intimate detail of what I did wrong. I will say that this is not the direction I thought you were going when you set

this up because I thought you were going to say, so of course the songs I picked for 2010 were, you know, very melancholy and sad. Yeah, I mean, I remember sending a mix, because I, you know, used to make mix CDs of my favorite songs of a given year, and I sent it to my friend Margaret, and her response was, oh, thank you for sending me, now that's what I call divorce, volumes one and two. Why hasn't anybody made that mix? Tape professionally. Now that's what I call divorce.

Well, that's brilliant. It's full of songs by Don Henley. Well, this is a great pick, and this is going to be the second week in a row, which means the second year in a row, where I pick something completely opposite of that. Because last time when we talked about 2009, I picked Kettering, the Antler song, which was from the album Hospice. And this one isn't that sad, but it is... Not as sad as the song from Hops. from hospice. But it is a decidedly different vibe than what you picked.

Great. I know you like this band when they were putting out music, but maybe this is too... Well, are there vocals? There are here. Let's scoge ahead here. Is this lower dance? Oh, Stephen Thompson, A-plus.

Yes! This song is called I Get Nervous from their debut album, Twin Hand Movement. This is one of those bands sort of like the antlers who, you know, they come up, they just devastate you in all the best ways. They have this huge impact in your life. And their imprint on you is forever. But then they kind of go on and they don't continue to make music anymore. And Lower Dins, not together.

It was a band fronted by Jana Hunter. Yeah. And they put out their last album in 2019, the competition. And then that was it. But yeah, this was, I thought about going with something like AB Machines by Sleighbells. That was such a big song from that year. Completely different vibe from this. But I wanted to pick something that I know people loved at the time and probably haven't reached for in a while.

It's one that I have not reached for in probably 15 years. Looking over the track list for, no, that's what I call divorce, volume one. It's such a mixture of euphoria and miserableness. Not only did you have Yonzi, but CloudCult, put out that song. song You'll Be Bright, Invocation of a one that year, which I know I've talked about on this show before. But Bloodbos, Ohio by The National. Oh, yeah, yeah. Really one of their greatest songs, Sharon Van Etton put out Lovemore in 2010.

Yeah. Was that from Epic? That's from Epic. Yeah. Well, that was also the year that Sufion Stevens put out The Age of Odds, which was a huge record. Not my favorite of his records. Oh, but it was so wild, though. It really, like, he was so clearly stretching everything.

his music in the most wild ways. Yeah, that's true. Totally brilliant. I mentioned Slay Bell's. Their Treats album came out that year. And then also the tallest man on Earth. Oh, sure. Yeah.

So we'll go out on this. Thanks as always, Stephen. Thank you, Robin. At 4 NPR Music, I'm Robin Hilton. It's All Songs Considered.