Nuanced. - 149. Mike Malott: Inside the Heart of a UFC Fighter, Grit, and the Pursuit of a Dream

Episode Date: March 19, 2024

Discover the relentless spirit of UFC welterweight Mike Malott in our latest episode, where he reveals his journey from a hopeful youth to a seasoned fighter, emphasizing perseverance, support, and the art of rising after a fall, in a conversation with host Aaron Pete.Mike Malott, who initiated his martial arts training at the young age of 12, has risen through the ranks to establish himself as a prominent contender in the UFC welterweight division. Since embarking on his professional career in 2012, Malott has distinguished himself with a series of notable victories, showcasing a dynamic fighting style that has captivated fans and analysts alike.Send us a textThe "What's Going On?" PodcastThink casual, relatable discussions like you'd overhear in a barbershop....Listen on: Apple Podcasts   SpotifySupport the shownuancedmedia.ca

Welcome back to another episode of The Bigger Than Me podcast. Here is your host, Aaron P. This episode is motivational. I'm speaking with a UFC fighter that I had the privilege of watching perform at UFC 289 in Vancouver. I find him to be motivational, and I think there's a lot we can take away from fighters' journeys. My guest today is proper Mike Malotte. Mike, I'm one of your biggest fans. It's such an honor to sit down with you.

would you mind please telling a little bit about yourself for people who might not be acquainted with your work? Yeah, so I'm Mike Millott. I'm a UFC welterweight. I've been with the UFC for made my debut almost two years ago and I got signed off Dana White's Contender Series. So I had the main event on Contender Series with Dana White and won that one in about, went that one in 39 seconds by submission with a guillotine, got into the UFC, made my debut at UFC 273, I believe, where I fought Mickey Gall, and I ended up TKOing him in the first round, knocking him out. And then my second fight, I fought at an apex fight. I can't remember which UFC Apex show was, to be honest, but I fought Johann Lainess,

the only other Canadian, I'm Canadian, so the only other Canadian on the roster at Welterweight, I fought him. We both had a couple of opponents fall through, I think, and it just ended up making the most sense, like to keep us both on the card. And so I fought him, and I submitted him in the first round with an arm triangle. And then my third fight in the UFC,

I fought Adam Fuget in Vancouver at UFC 289. And I submitted him with a guillotine choke. And then my last outing out, I fought Neil Magny. and was winning that fight and had a bad basically last minute of you know, was winning 13 and a half minutes of the fight and had a bad, you know, last 45 seconds

made a couple inexperienced choices and ended up losing that one to Neil Magny by TKO in the third, the end of the third, at UFC 297 in Toronto at the beginning of this year, first pay-per-view card of the year. So, yeah. Beautiful. summary, I'm going to ask you to first take us back to the beginning. When did MMA become a passion of

yours? I became obsessed with MMA almost immediately after seeing it. I remember being probably 12 years old and seeing it on TV for the first time. I don't remember, I remember basically the first two fights I ever saw. I don't remember which one was first, but I remember seeing Nate Corey versus Lodenson Cade and Vitor Belfort versus Marvin Eastman and Nate Corey T-K-O'd Lodenson-Kade with like standing strikes and I think the fight still might have been on the feet when there was a stoppage and Vitor Belfort need Marvin Eastman in the face and gave him like a new eyebrow over the top and I just remember watching that fight in particular and thinking like you can you can do this ton of like this is something you can do like legally you're allowed

to do this it blew me away i i had always been interested in combat in some form or another it was mostly through like just being a little kid and loving like cartoons and superheroes and stuff like that but as it got older it got into like combat sports and martial arts and it was almost like a love at first sight for me with with with m mc and ufc in particular i just I couldn't get enough of it, and the internet was just kind of, you know, viewing things on the internet wasn't really a thing at the time, right? So you'd have to go to Blockbuster and buy DVDs or rent DVDs in order to watch that stuff, or you'd have to find the one time that it was on TV, you know, be home at 9 p.m. on a Saturday or whatever, right? Like, you couldn't just go online and watch every fight you've ever wanted. So I really like valued getting some access to fight.

So I remember being at like HMV and finding like a Pride video set. It was like a DVD set and it was like five different Pride DVDs. I was like, oh my God, that's amazing. Like I absolutely loved Pride back in the day and, you know, buy whatever UFC DVD I could and just try and absorb everything I could. But I had two textbooks in high school. I had one Ken Shamrock biography slash move textbook and just studied everything I could through that. And then later on through a friend that actually met Eddie Bravo. I got an Eddie Bravo 10th Planet textbook.

They were like, I don't actually know what this is, but I thought it was cool. I met. I'm like, do you want, like, I know you like MMA and Jiu-Jitsu, do you want this? I was like, yes, please. Like, give me that. I want to steal as much as I can. So I just remember like trying to, trying to learn as much as I could and ended up going to a local like karate traditional martial arts gym and they had some kickboxing there. I did some kickboxing training and a couple of fights out of that gym. And then the guy who ran the kickboxing practices, he wanted to do a little bit of MMA training as well, but didn't have, you know, the experience he had like, you know, a BJ pen book and I had those two textbooks and we had a judo coach for a couple months.

And we just basically took anything we could and tried to train it and drill it and just mostly rolled and tried to figure things out. But it was a really fun time. What do you think stood out to you about it? Was it the resilience that a fighter could show? Was it the aggressiveness? What do you think pulled you in specifically about it? Well, I was a tiny kid for my age. I was always like this lowest percentile as far as like weight and height.

So whenever I, you know, whenever I was in a grade growing up, I was always like the second or third smallest kid in my year. So I think eventually that kind of led to some small man syndrome a little bit and feeling like I had to prove myself. And I think MMA stood out to me as like what I thought strength was and what I thought like toughness was. So I thought like, man, if I, I bet if I mastered that, I'd be strong and I'd be strong and I'd be. tough and, you know, I'd feel more confident or whatever. And I think that was partially the initial allure of MMA. And then just through going and wanting to get stronger and wanting to get tougher, I ended up just falling in love with the sport and pursue it for, in some ways, that same reason, but different reasons now, just more through my actual passion rather than,

like, wanting to be someone I am not. there's a huge hockey culture in canada was there any temptation was there anything pulling you off this path or was it always mma oh no it was hockey first for sure every you know pretty well every canadian kid wants to to play in the n hl like that was the dream man to play for the toronto maple leaps that was that was the dream as like a kid and it became pretty apparent pretty quickly that i sucked at hockey and like i never i never compete at any any major level Like, I played a little, I played like basically the lowest level of travel competitive hockey you can, like single A hockey basically. It's like single A, double A, triple A. And so I played I played single A. Again, I was just, I was too small and I was too much of a space cadet, man. I just couldn't wrap my head around like being part of a team and being like one unit. I think I've always thrived a little bit better when, you know, it's all on me. Like I like, as much like I do definitely have a team now. teams in Canada and California

and a bunch of friends and training partners throughout Canada and whatever but at the end of the day like it all comes down to me and when I win it's because I performed and when I fall short it's because I didn't you know and I feel like that's easier for me to wrap my head around than team sports in some ways

I definitely sympathize with that one of the reasons you're my favorite fighter is when we talk about the welterweight division and what's going on is we look back at your pro debut in 2011 and a first round submission over James Saunders then six weeks later you forfeit your own purse to fly another opponent in to fight you

and you gave up your own pay for that fight and you pulled off the upset. Would you mind taking us back to those early days? Yeah, man, those were some cool days. So I didn't know what I was doing at all. I had my first basically actual MMA coaches kind of running me through everything and they're like yeah we're going to get you a fight we're getting you a fight at a catchweight at 140 and I was like I don't know if I can make

140 like I was supposed to fight at 145 I was much smaller at the time I was 19 and it was my pro debut amateur MMA was illegal at the time it might still be in Nova Scotia um but if you wanted to have an MMA fights you had to go pro like all right my coach runs a promotion let's just go pro and i'm like guys i don't know if i can make 140 and they're like oh don't worry we'll teach you how we'll help you make weight i was like oh okay cool and like they gave me a couple diet a little bit of dieting advice but most of will help you make weight was just like we'll put you back in the sauna when you you can't stand up on your own like it was horrible man i weighed in at like actually the catch rate was 141 and i and we got like a one pound allowance

So I was like 142 like carried onto the scale type thing. I had no idea what I was doing. I remember I was like already kind of feeling drawn out the night before Wayans and I was 157 the night before. I was like, okay, I have 16 pounds to go and I've never cut weight before. And like I'm already like drawn out and I haven't eaten in a couple days. Like I was so bad. It was just like so old school.

Just like we'll just get in the sauna and the weight will come on. It's like, dude, that was not the way to do it. But so I ended up having that fight and I won that. That was actually in our gym, Paluka's Boxing Club at the time. It was an old movie theater that had been turned into a nonprofit boxing and an MMA gym. It was super cool. And so that was awesome.

Won that one. And then my weight ballooned back up and I just, I think I ate cake for dinner like the next three nights and just like was so bloated and wanted to help a friend's bar. who had a fight a couple weeks later and I remember him like warming up touching me to the body and me being like, oh my God, my body's like so swollen. But yeah, then I had that other fight like five or six weeks later. And that kid at the time was, so I was one and oh, he was three and oh, and I knew who he was. He was like a hot prospect in Canada. He had a few teammates that were doing really well. One of them ended up going on, well, I'm going on to be he is Misha Serkenoff,

right so i ended up having a bunch of fights in the ufc and being like a high level fighter but they had a few really good grapplers from their team um fight uh you know they had a few good fighters on their team and i knew who this guy was and he was wrestling coach i had heard a lot of hype around him and that was another like change in weight i was supposed to fight at one 55 for that fight against some guy who was like it was just who they could find me He was like two and seven or something. That guy pulled out and I was like, okay, I guess I'm not fighting. And then the week before the fight, the promoter who is like a friend and training partner

mine, he's like, hey, man, I found you a new fight. It's actually at 145. It's next weekend. I'm like, oh, crap, like my weight ballooned up after doing that horrible weight cut. So this is going to be hard as is. And he's like, and I'm having to fly him in from Toronto and I can't afford to fly him in and pay you. So you're not getting paid for this one.

I was like, okay. He's like, well, do you want or not? like, are you scared? He was like one of the, like, one of the bigger guys on the team, like had a bunch of fights. I'm like, oh, no, I'm not scared. And I was like, dude, I'm so scared. But I took the fight anyway. And the guy was like, the guy that I fought was, was honestly a prick.

And like, not a good guy. But he's a solid fighter. He's still fighting now. I think he's actually on content. I think he actually might have like a big fight coming up this summer. I don't actually if I'm allowed to say this. that but yeah he uh he's still watching yeah he's still fighting and doing well um but yeah he was a really good jitsu guy and i was like okay i can knock this guy out and i had some good jihitsu had a couple

things that i was good at the time like one closed guard arm bar specifically and like this is you know back when m vay was a lot more basic and uh he ended up taking me down a couple minutes into the first round but i ended up armbarring him and submitting him and it was like a huge upset that i I submitted this, like, jihitsu guy. I think he was like a Purple Belt World Champion or something like that. And so I caught him in the arm bar. And just like, that was the one of the most Rocky Balboa moments of my life where I like stood up in the ring and looked to who I thought was my corner.

It was actually his corner and they looked like really somber. And then I turned around and it was in a ring instead of a cage. And like my coaches and teammates all jumped over the ring. And like the commission was trying to like keep my team back and like 30 guys jumped over into the ring and like picked me up and carried. me around. It was like the fourth part of the night. So there's still like four more fight. So it wasn't like it was even the main events. Like all these dudes in like running shoes like dormant in and people hugging each other like, oh, that was amazing. I remember feeling like

just the man that night is a really cool experience. Grit and strength and passion are all things that kind of under underlie your career. Where did that come from for you? I grew up playing a lot of sports and then honestly just have kind of like a think of the people that I was surrounded by like just a good hardworking family like my parents are just super hard workers and we're both like fairly athletic growing up but encouraged us athletically but we weren't like pushed heavily into athletics um grew up playing hockey there was I felt I always felt like sports were really important to me. And I felt like I wasn't the most academic kid,

but as long as I wanted to do better in school, but I always felt like, okay, as long as I'm doing well in sports, like I'm doing okay. And, you know, hockey's a gritty sport and being a small kid, like trying to keep up with bigger, stronger kids, like, you just kind of had to adapt or you were going to quit. Like, you know, I remember being, I played football for one year in gray i was going into grade seven and uh i had to lie and tell them i was 80 pounds to play football because it was like it had to be minimum 80 pounds and i was like 74 or something like that like i wasn't quite 80 and i was like oh yeah i'm i'm 80 pounds and uh nobody checked but like yeah i remember just like trying to play football and like most of the kids on our

on our offensive line other than our center all those kids were over 200 pounds or we just like train wrecked the the division like I barely played at all, but our team was sick, and I'm just, like, trying to keep up with these way bigger kids. So I think a little bit of the grittiness kind of kind of comes from that. And then just through training, man, like, you just learn quickly that this isn't an easy sport. If you want to make it far, like, you're going to have to train when you don't want to and you're going to have to train through injuries. Like, if you wait to be completely injured to start training, like, you're barely going to train, man. Like, you're always a lot. You're always a

little bit injured. You're always beat up. You're always sore. Like, it's a tough sport. I pretty well, like, fought Aaron Jeffrey yesterday, like one of the best. He was fighting in the title Eliminator for Bellator in a couple weeks and helping him get ready. And we just, you know, basically fought in the gym yesterday, like three fives and like, all right, man, that's just like a Thursday with me. I'm like, all right, just fighting one of the best games in the world in the gym. We're beating the hell out of each other. Like, well, yeah. And now it's Friday. Go to jujitsu and go do your other stuff like you have other stuff to do and whatever man no one cares one of my favorite parts is your social media because i love the parts that you put in about the grind about the

hard work that's required i find that so admirable and somebody who works in an office somebody who's not out there grinding on the paved stone and and working out in a gym every day it reminds us that we need to be grateful and that like you're someone to aspire to be like in the sense of your mental toughness because I hear so much about like burnout at work and long hours and the lights that you get. And I just find some of that so disconnected from the reality that some people are willing to push when they have no energy. They're willing to try harder when they have nothing left to give. They're willing to try and find a way when there's no other opportunities left. And I find that we as regular people who don't do the work you do, we need to take in that

inspiration and be reminded that when we have a long day in the office, it's nothing in comparison to what other people are grinding out in the real world. And so we need to appreciate that. And I think it gives us a little bit more humility. But I'm just wondering any thoughts you have on people who are doing the nine to five and the work that goes into it and the mental toughness you've developed. What can we learn from the work that you put in every day? Well, thank you first.

I would say, of course, it's really tough. And there are some mornings when I wake up and I really don't want to do this, you know, for a day or two or for a couple of sessions and, like, man, this does not feel fun, like I'm not enjoying this right now, but I think it's just keeping in mind that you've made a commitment to yourself and, like, maintaining discipline is extremely important along a journey. Like, this is the journey I've chosen to do. I'm going to do it until I no longer can, or until, you know, I feel fulfilled or whatever. Like, for the foreseeable future, I'm in this journey. So...

Just because it's Wednesday and your body's sore and you're tired and you didn't sleep very well and you don't want to go in, like, it doesn't really matter. Like, you go in on Wednesdays, you go in on Thursdays, you go in on Fridays. Like, that's what you do. And I think sometimes it's just like, do the first thing. Just focus on the first thing. Like, just get your bagpack, get ready and get in the car and just like go to the gym. And once you're at the gym, you're like, well, I'm already here.

I'm going to start warming up. I'm already warm. as well do these drills, right? I've already done these drills. I might as well go live. Well, I'm already going to go live. I might as well try and win. Like, just, it's one thing after. Like, just, just be short-sighted at times where it almost makes it easier rather than like, you wake up first thing in the morning. You're like, dude, how am I going to spar with like some of the killers I have to spar with? Like, I got to spar with those guys today. It's like, yeah, don't even worry about that right now. Just get in the car, turn the car on. It makes a little

be easier. But at the same time, as many of those moments I have, I also have a lot of moments where I'm extremely grateful for this because I do genuinely love doing this. I love this sport. It's made me into a much stronger person than I probably would have been had I never gotten into this sport. It's made me a very happy person. It's introduced me to some of the most important people in my life and given me some absolutely incredible moments and experiences that I certainly would never have experienced had it not been for this sport. So, you know, there are definitely times that you have to grind through and whether there's motivation or not, you have to find a way to keep going. But at the same time, I think it's easier to maintain discipline

when you know it's something that you're passionate about. And it's easier to stay on that path knowing that it's something you love. Would you say that your experience is somewhat surreal? Because I imagine, like, anybody gets good at something, say they're good at knitting. They're never going to do that on a world stage in front of people in that way and share that. And I got to watch you live in Vancouver. I got to watch Amon's a hobby, live in Vancouver and sit there and admire the work that you've put in, all the things that we don't see as viewers, all the grinding, all the times where you fall down and you get back up.

And all the times you got up in the morning when you wanted to stay in bed. and hit the alarm clock. Like we get to watch you on that performance night, but so much goes into it. Is it ever surreal to get up on the stage? I remember you talking at the pre-fight press conference and saying like, you guys are in for a treat, like we're so happy to be back here.

And that was so inspiring because it's a reminder that right next door could be somebody doing something incredibly amazing, shocking, something you couldn't even imagine doing. That we have amazing people within our country, within our provinces. We have aspirational people that you should wanna be like because they have a mental toughness

that you don't always tap into as a regular citizen. So what is it like to be able to get up on those stages and get people excited, get people motivated to start to take those steps in their own lives? It's pretty cool, man. It's still definitely not lost on me. Sorry, I'm losing you here a little bit. My camera's slipping.

It's definitely still not lost on me that this is special and that this is cool, like getting to get up in front of thousands of people at a press conference grab a microphone and be like, I'm going to kick this guy's ass on Saturday and have a make and cheer and, you know, ask for a picture with you and, and, you know, tell you kind things and nice things about the work that you put in. Like, it's really special to me. And I don't honestly care at all about being a famous person. That's not my intention in doing this. Like, Connor McGregor's the man and the sport wouldn't be the same without him, but I have like zero interest

and being like a mega superstar like that. I do love getting the respect and admiration for hard work I put in. Like that does feel good, you know, as much as it's like, I don't worry about people's opinions. Like, when I get messages from people telling me like, man, you're doing a great job. Like, I believe in you. I like what you're doing. Like, that makes me feel amazing. or if somebody stops me and asks me for a picture

or tells me like, yeah, man, I've seen your fights. Like, great job. Like, oh, you know, I just moved to a new town. So I've had a few times where people are like, dude, you live around here? Like, I had no idea. I'm like, yeah, I just moved out to this area. So that feels really cool.

Like, it's nice to be able to touch people's lives that you don't know because of something that you're passionate about. And like, I do put so much work into this. So to feel it pay off in that way that it kind of does inspire others at times, that makes me feel really good. It's so amazing to be able to sit down with you because I think back at that Vancouver moment, and you like have a snapshot in my mind of the moment that you won, when AIMON won, like you play a special role in people's lives that they'll carry into the future. And I imagine you have similar memories that you could compare it to with GSP.

And I'm wondering if you'd be able to talk about that because when you say you don't want, to be Connor McGregor, the kind of perfect person that's famous, but not crazy famous, not overwhelmingly where it's like uncomfortable to live is GSP. He's respected, he's admired, he's looked up to by people more than he's chased by paparazzi, I would say. I'm sure you get some of that, but like he's got more of the respect from people than the drama, I would say. Yeah, yeah, some moments like that in my mind watching fights as a kid is, you know, I saw him fight live once when he fought Jake Shields, but it was at such a distance, like it was such a big stadium that he was so far away that it didn't feel like that close. So most of those

moments are from watching on TV, but I remember him finally winning that belt, the rematch with Matt Hughes when he like faked low and went high and Matt Hughes went to catch the kick and he got kicked in the side of the head and George St. Pierre got on top and let some punches and elbows from close guard and the ref jumped in. And normally you'd see George same period of this like backflip and be all excited and you could just see the like melting of emotions like it finally happened like everything i put everything i've been putting into the sport came to fruition you saw him just like crumble in front of everyone like dropped to his knees like and it was such a raw emotional moment that that was that was incredibly powerful to see

as well as the uh the rematch with matt sarah so he lost his belt and then he fought Josh Koschik, I believe, and then came back and fought he might have come back and fought Matt Hughes a third time before then. I think actually, I think I think he was supposed to fight Matt Sarah and then Sarah pulled out and he fought Hughes

for the interim belt or something like that. But then yeah, when he fought Sarah and got that one back the like knees to the body in Montreal and just walking off from that. Like I'm a huge Matt Sarah fan too. He's the man. But George is our

guy, man. He's like, he's, he's, he's been carrying the flag for, he's been carrying the flag for Canada for like 20 years almost, man. So that was pretty incredible getting to watch him regain his title and, and go on that absolute, absolutely legendary tear, just like running through the division and lapping the division. He's, you know, he's definitely like the guy for me. Beautiful. We all have moments where we fall down, where we don't get the job, where we don't get the promotion where we don't have the door opened. And I do think that art imitates life and mixed martial arts is absolutely an art form. I'm wondering if you can share your reflections on your last fight and what people can take away from that in their own lives who may have

been knocked down, who are trying to find a way to get back up and to rebuild themselves. Yeah, man, there's a ton of emotions that go along with that. There's, you know, you, first of all, I want to make sure that never happens again, right? I want to make sure I can do everything I can to be successful and to fix the mistakes that occurred last time. So you look for like what went wrong, where, what can I fix? What, you know, you almost want to reinvent the wheel is like the first instinct, right? I'm like, look, man, we're going to completely reinvent the wheel.

There are things that need to be altered and I've spent the last month kind of dissecting what we do where I think I fell short and how I can grow from that, went down to the UFC Performance Institute and had some testing done, get a little more information about what my body needs to perform and to be at the highest level. So I have some new things that I wasn't doing before. So we're already adding those in. So that's already going to be like number one a hole sealed from last time but also like it was it was I'm not completely upset with the performance right like I thought the fight was going well until it didn't um there's a little bit of inexperience that that cost me in that fight you know I went into that fight with like 14

minutes of UFC cage time and Neil Magny went in with almost seven hours of UFC cage time right So there was a massive disparity as far as experience is concerned. So I've been looking into ways and found some ways that I can close that gap with guys that are more experienced with me. I now, even though lost in the third round, feel a lot more comfortable with the idea of going later into fights. You know, that was uncharted territory for me. And while it didn't turn out the way that I wanted it to, I'm very confident that next time it'll turn out a lot better. And I'm more confident going into those later rounds now,

especially now that we've started working on sealing those holes that were obviously there last time. I think also just not being so married to a result. I oddly didn't feel. feel, I thought I'd feel more torn apart from a loss, to be honest. And as devastated as I was that I didn't get the results I wanted, I'm very proud of the work that I've put in. I'm very proud of how far I've come. And I'm very proud of my team and how much work we've put in and how we've gotten to this point. You know, I didn't just get to this point just to get to this point. I plan on going a lot further than I am right now. But I think there are a lot of positives

to take away from this fight and a lot of things to be really happy about and there are some things to fix so we're focused on the things that we should be proud about or focus on the things that we need to fix and it's just getting back on the horse, man, like sometimes MMA's a crazy sport,

sometimes it gets a little bit weird, goes off the rails a little more than you expect if they feel wild sport, man, like that's about as, you know, a minute and a half remaining in that fight, that's about as sure as you can be that a guy's about to win a fight. And I ended up not winning that one. But yeah, I don't even remember what the initial question was.

But I'm really just genuinely excited to get back on the horse, back on the grind, get back in the gym. Like I said, I'm helping my boy, Aaron, Jeffrey, get ready for his, you know, he's fighting the number one contender in the world in Belize. basically a title eliminator. He wins this fight. He's almost guaranteed a title fight. And Bellator, he's already one of the best middle weights on the planet. He's a weight class up for me. He's in his prime. He's as sharp as he's ever been. And I'm like getting back into training this week and going to war with this guy. Like, I don't even see, but like my face

is all dinged up from us just scrapping. And like, I'm excited to do it. It's like it feels rejuvenating to get back in there and have new things to focus on. where I'm not like, you know, everything was almost going so well where I'm like, okay, what's the thing that I don't know I need to improve? And, you know, when you lose, it's like, dude, there's some there's some pretty clear things that you need to improve on. So I'm really excited to run headfirst into these, these new styles of training that we're going to be adding in, these new drills, these new sessions. But also recognizing like it's, you know, don't reinvent the wheel. Most of the stuff we were doing.

obviously worked. I was winning the fight. I was up two rounds, two and a half rounds. And so it's like a bitter sweet thing where it's like, I think you watch that fight. And in my mind when I watch it, I'm clearly one of the best guys in the world. I was getting the better of a guy who's a super crafty veteran and who's fought the best guys in the world. And it's pretty hard to do that to him. But so, you know, I'm not too down on myself. Like, I don't feel, I don't feel dejected. I don't feel like, you know, I think some people after a loss, it really brings them down. And I don't, I don't feel that way at all.

I feel just really, like, excited about what's going to happen next. At first, I was thrown off by the amount of unbelievable hate I was getting for that fight for that performance. Like, my DMs were hilarious, man. I couldn't post a picture, I couldn't, you know, nothing, you know, I was getting everything. I was getting tagged in was just like, you suck, you know, you need to retire your piece of shit, blah, blah, dude, the amount of just hate that came my way. I'm like, man, some people are just like so excited to watch somebody fall. So I thought that was, at first it was, it was like, I wasn't prepared for that.

It was like getting to me for a few days. Once I started being able to get back into the gym and like exercise again, and start working and start moving in the right direction. I was like, oh, okay. Now, if anything, I almost view it as like, because 80, 90% of these accounts that, like, on Instagram that, like, comment that stuff on you. It's like no picture or just like some picture of like a famous person

or someone that isn't them. And it's like zero posts, eight followers, follows 2,000 people. It's like, oh, you're just a burner account. Like, all you do is you're just like not happy with yourself. and you see somebody else fail and it's probably what you're saying is more of like a reflection of yourself and you see that in someone who's successful

and if anything that probably brings you closer to someone who's having success which is pretty sad man like when you think about it so I do kind of pity those people where it's like man you know you can turn this around for yourself too you don't need to be like that

like that I'm almost like it's it sounds disingenuous and like corny to be like oh, I feel bad for those people. Like, they're just losers. Like, I don't mean it in like a mean way. I'm like, dude, like, if that's genuinely the only way you can feel good about yourself is to be like someone successful also failed and I feel like a failure and this is like

the only connection I have with them. So I'm going to dog on them for that because really like I don't like that about myself. I'm like, man, like that's really, that's really sad, man. Like you don't need to be like that. Not for me. Like at this point, I feel a lot better about it where I don't feel like when I see those things it's not like it doesn't really bother me anymore but when i see it i'm now i'm like when i when i really sit down and think about it i'm like man that really really sucks man

like there's a lot of opportunity in life man there's a lot of abundance in life like i know i'm a blessed person i know i have like my health and i have things that other people don't don't have you know not everyone's blessed with health and everyone's blessed with the same opportunities or whatever but like you can always improve your situation man like if that's really all you have is to be is to like dump on people and that's what makes you feel good it's like dude that's that's that's that really is sad like i do feel genuinely bad for you so yeah those people i hope man you find a way to to turn things around for yourself because that that's that's too bad man life's good and you can always be better agreed a few more quick questions one is around the

same topic i'm just when you when the night happened and you didn't win i wanted to to type up a response and so i'm hoping you can help me figure out how to be like a good friend if i continue to interview ufc fighters i'm just interested in your perspective it seems like it would be it came across the wrong way in my head to say like oh you were destroying him and like you had that fight like that wouldn't feel good to hear because then you're like well but i didn't get the result that i wanted and then on the other hand i'm like you'll get him next time that still felt like not hitting the note how did you find people kind of approached you afterwards and in your mind what's the best way to approach someone when they do fall down that's a great

question and if you find the right answer for that i'd love to hear it um one of the best exchanges i had with somebody after the fight is one of my m-ma canadian idols mark hominick came up to me in the hotel room after the fight and he just was like he gave me a big hug and they just like put his hand on my shoulder and he's like oh man and I'm like I know like I know like I know like I don't know what to say either like I don't know what to like do you know I kind of I like laugh because I've I've been around you know I was at alfmane for a long time so I've been around so many high level fighters that have big opportunities and have had wins and won those and I've been around guys where they've lost those opportunities and it's like

what do you say man and we kind of like both laughed about it you know I still even had like my shorts and my cup on I've got into the hotel a lot of you hadn't gotten changed yet and it was just this like super authentic moment of just like him being like yeah like we were just like we just kind of started laughing i'm like dude i don't know what to say either man i appreciate it though i i can feel your energy but uh but yeah man i don't know what the what the right thing is you know i when when guys i've been around have lost i just uh let them know i'm there for him i love them and i care about and I'm proud of them regardless of the outcome and that's honestly been one of the

biggest blessings from the loss is like everything's great when you're winning you know people want to be your friend who's there with you who's who's who's riding with you and you know who texts you back and stuff when you're winning and like when you lose you hear people talk about how you know I think it was Miguel Koto could be wrong but I think it was Miguel Koto the boxer is saying like you win a fight and you get 10,000 texts and calls by the time you get back to your phone and you lose a fight and you have four missed calls and three of them are from your mom and uh and i didn't really have that experience you know i i definitely got a lot of like hate on social media and stuff like that a lot of

negative energy but i got an insane amount of positive energy i had probably just almost as many messages after my loss as i did after my wins and uh it was a lot of positivity from people a lot of encouragement, a lot of support, a lot of people reassuring me and telling me they're behind me. And then the coming weeks after that, that continued, but even more so on a personal level, like the amount my family and my coaches were there for me after my fight just like my mental coach, my Muay Thai coach, my Jujunzuka, all these guys like called me every day to check in on me and were like setting up appointments for me. My massage therapist to one of my physio therapists, like my sister is one of them, but I got another couple that

are my, um, my, uh, physiomassage therapists and, and just gave me so much support, leading it like, do you need anything? Can we set anything up for you? Like, I can come to you. Like, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my, my physio massage therapist, chiropractor, he, he, he, he came to my house. Like, hey man, like, let me, you know, work on your neck. You probably had a lot of stress from that. That, that might be, you know, um, causing some symptoms for you. And, and just having bad amount of love and care from people who I'm close to. And we're just like, all right, it's all cool when you win, but really being there when things don't go well,

that's when it really matters. So to see that support from those guys was really cool. And I guess kind of to bring it back to your question, it's awesome to congratulate somebody when they win and send them a, man, great job, whatever. But I think like almost regardless of what you say, unless you're just like telling somebody what they should have done. That's like the most annoying like Iroll.

Like, yeah, no shit. Like thanks. Like, but just like even being there and sending somebody a message after they lose, I think is so much more important than sending someone a message after they win. Like sometimes I probably do forget to send my friends messages after they win. I see them on Instagram and like a like a post. I'm like, hell yeah, my buddy won. But like I almost never forget to send somebody a message after I see them lose just

because I think it's so much more important to be there for someone that you care about and just like even just a little reminder like hey man you know I know you put in a lot of work I know this is upsetting but you know results don't define you your character does it I love you appreciate you I'm here for you if you need to talk or call like just something you know something simple like that just to kind of be there for that person after after a loss I think is a lot more important beautiful do you you have any advice for others who fall down? Yeah, man, we all fall down, just get up and, you know, dust yourself up, keep going, but like reevaluate, right? Like, you know, it's the Einstein quarter, whatever, like the definition of insanity is doing something failing and doing it the exact same way again and expecting a different result, right? So, you know, you should fail.

You should fail at life, you know, there are there times. where like, you know, even guys who were undefeated, it's like, they're not, they haven't gotten through this without defeat at some points. They're just really good at figuring out what they've done wrong in the past and growing from that and making the necessary adjustments. So just, you know, get up, dust yourself off, realize why you fell, make the adjustments necessary to not fall when it matters. And maybe that means falling every day. You know, maybe that means facing those things every day and getting used to. of those things um to ensure that you don't fall when when the time matters in the future

but yeah man and don't like put so much pressure on yourself man life's fun enjoy yourself work hard work your ass off pour yourself into into what you love and and enjoy it but don't be so focused on the result man this is so motivational the comeback king is coming i'm wondering if you can leave a message not for your supporters but for the haters What would you say to the people who are messaging you, these terrible, terrible things? It sounds like you're on the rise again and you're coming back soon and we need to rub their faces in it. Man, I feel like a younger version of me would love to do. I'm a prove these guys wrong.

Like, dude, it's not about them for me at all. Like, it's a much more selfish journey, I guess. Like, it's for me. You know, I'm doing this for me. I'm not doing this for that. I'm going to give a shit with those people who think. You know, like, I'm doing this a lot more for me. I love this.

Like, I'd write way rather, I'm way more doing this for that kid who like stop me, you know, stops me outside the grocery store and is like, dude, I've seen you fight. Like that's sick. Like, you know, gets all excited and ask me for a picture. Like, dude, I spend the rest of my day thinking about that. Like, that makes me happy, man. I get like way more out of that and like representing the people I care about and like doing right by my community and my country and my people and my circle.

than like the people that I'm trying to prove wrong like all due respect fuck them like you know actually no due respect you know whatever fuck you like you like i'm here like you know i'm here to i'm here to back my people and to people who support me you know like the happy dad boys the elk boys all my gyms my team my training partners my you know in canada and california and halifax you know like all these people who've supported me along the way like i'm doing this for them not for the people that doubt me. I don't care. There's always going to be doubters, but I'm here for the people that ride with me, you know? That's the best answer. The name of this podcast is bigger than me, because it's all about the mindset of trying to lift others up and inspire others to follow in those

amazing footsteps. How can people follow along with your journey and the amazing work you're doing? Thank you, man. Just, yeah, most of my stuff is on my Instagram, Michael dot him a lot. I don't have a next fight planned or booked or, you know, really in negotiations or anything, but trust that I'm making the necessary adjustments to grow from last time and you're going to see a much better version of me moving forward. I'm going to grow from this and become a much better fighter. Like, I'll be a better version of me than I ever could have had I not lost this fight. Like, this will end up being the biggest blessing of my career. So just enjoy the journey, enjoy the show. And pity who's next. My favorite is inspirational quotes from

individuals like yourself. The philosophy that goes in behind it is so important. I highly recommend people go follow you on Instagram because that's the fuel when you're having a tough day at work, when you're not having a good day. You know somebody else is out there grinding three times as hard as you are trying to move forward. So thank you so much for being willing to share the time and such amazing insights. I appreciate you so much, Mike. Thanks for having me on there and appreciate it.