Nuanced. - Inside FortisBC: Reconciliation & Indigenous Partnerships

Episode Date: August 4, 2025

Community and Indigenous Relations Manager Samantha Singbeil from FortisBC to explore Indigenous partnerships, energy equity, economic development and how reconciliation is shaping the future of utilities across BC with host Aaron Pete. Send us a textThe "What's Going On?" PodcastThink casual, relatable discussions like you'd overhear in a barbershop....Listen on: Apple Podcasts   SpotifySupport the shownuancedmedia.ca

Energy is like full of aha moments. How does Fortis go about engaging First Nation communities and Indigenous community? Last year on our major projects, 24% of the contract spend went to Indigenous business. What do you think some of the misconceptions of Fortis are? Fortis is an energy provider. We provide natural gas, electricity, renewables to 58 Indigenous communities. indigenous communities. What inspires you to continue this world? I have both an ache and a joy. Like these projects, it's hard. Like you're talking about really deep subjects. How are we going

to address the safety of indigenous women and girls? Right now we're doing this thing called the long-term resource plan. And this plan is figuring out what does the future of energy look like in the province. Samantha, thank you so much for coming on today and being willing to share your time. I'm wondering if we can first start with an introduction. Oh, thanks, Aaron. I'm really happy to be here today, too. Well, I'll introduce myself first and then a little bit about the company I work for. So my name is Samantha Singbiel.

I'm a manager of Indigenous relations for Fortis, B.C., and I work with a team that works with indigenous communities and people and organizations from sort of the area up near Squamish, all the way out to Hope area. And, you know, I do define myself certainly by the work I do, but also a little bit about where I come from and the people I'm around. and, you know, I'm really grateful to have both grown up, and I currently live on the traditional territory of the Hulcaminum-speaking people. And so I live in North Delta, with my husband. I've got two young daughters and a giant dog named Eva. She turns 10 tomorrow. And so that's kind of a little bit about me.

But Fortis, Fortis is an energy provider, and Fortis provides energy to approximately sort of 1.3 million British Columbians, and we provide natural gas, electricity, renewables. And as I said, we provide it across BC and we provide it to 58 indigenous communities. And our infrastructure crosses over 150 traditional territories. And we work with those communities, both who we serve and those communities whose territories overlap with our infrastructure. Can I ask just what does that mean to you? When you talk to you, when you talk about some of 1.4 million people. What is, how do you take that, that in?

Yeah, like the 1.3, 1.4 million people, I take it that, um, we have a lot of connections with our, with our customers and with community. Like each, each one of those people, each one of those, um, customers is a relationship we have, which is really neat. So I, I think of ourselves as a really relationship-focused organization, too. So, yeah, holds a lot of weight. I just think about the fact that, like, there's so many people impacted by this service and have such a tertiary understanding of what goes into it and the responsibilities. And I spoke to Carol earlier about this idea of, like, we rely on these services and we somewhat take them for granted.

What has it, how has it impacted you to learn about the behind the scenes of a system and knowing so many people don't understand the system, but rely on it? so heavily. How did you take that in as you started with the organization and started to learn the importance of energy? Yeah, energy is like full of aha moments. Like that's the thing. I think it's such a really interesting field to be involved in and you learn more every day you're in it. Like I think to myself, when I first started in the energy space, it was, I've worked for Fortis for about 16 years and I worked for BC Hydro for a couple years before that. So it's coming up on 20 years. And at first I was learning just the fact of how much planning goes into meeting the needs long term of customers and how much scenario planning is going on.

That happens every day in a whole range of ways. So it's just such an interesting field to be in from the perspective of you're looking at the future and looking at the needs of your customers now, but also what you may or may not even be able to predict down the line. do you feel like you knew that you were going to go down this path at a younger age? And when did energy become something you became passionate about? Yeah, you know, I was lucky enough to go to university. And I had always thought, like, I want to be a lawyer. And I thought, I'm going to be a lawyer. And part of it was just exposure. Neither of my parents are lawyers. But it was something that I knew a lot of them did. I knew there was a big piece of justice and equality. And I really

like that. So I thought, I'm going to be a lawyer. Well, I went to university and studied political science and studied sociology like a good lawyer would do. And then I realized, oh, I don't actually like the idea of law necessarily. It's not that I don't like the practice or what it stands for. It's just going through the process of law school, really that detailed process of like of really focusing on the details of reading litigations and all of that. Like the real paperwork of it, that wasn't for me. I went into communications more than anything's, and communications and education. So with that, at Hydro, when I started there, it was around education of internal employees,

around energy efficiency and conservation. So I started from a place of communication and education in the energy space, and it just evolved over time because I found it so interesting and so much I can lean into there. And that eventually, through a few, channels took me to indigenous relations, which kind of leans into both the political science, sociology, purpose of sort of my education. I did a little bit of work. I did a master's in intercultural communication, so that kind of fits in there as well from the education side. And yeah, over time, I've had just wonderful managers and bosses, and it's been a great organization. I want to ask about some of those aha moments. One of them for me that I've already described

is this moment where I realized we're so reliant on Fortis BC during the winter and that that system was vulnerable at one point in time. It sounds like in 2023 during an extreme cold weather event. And it was like, oh, like I don't understand the system. And yet I'm completely reliant on it. What were some of those aha moments for you? Yeah. I mean, when I think of aha moments for me and the reliance on the system,

I think what a big one was for me was around, like, why would we even do energy efficiency and conservation? Like, why are we asking beyond the fact that it is important to reduce our emissions, but why are we asking people to use less? And the important, and just sort of that basic, like, why would a corporation ask you? But it's extremely important because the aha moment there is that you ask people to use less. You don't need to build a bigger system then to provide that energy to those individuals. So you're using that current system you have in the ground as efficiently as possible.

So you think of it as sort of a big pipe. You have 500 customers, and you ask them all to use a little bit less. There's the potential, though, you can put more customers, or if there's population growth, you can have those additional customers, so you fill up that space. don't need to build a bigger pipeline. So it's really using the infrastructure we have in an efficient manner. And that, to me, is something I just think is so interesting, so valuable to know. It's like we're an infrastructure company as much as an energy company.

And using it efficiently was a huge, a hot moment for me. That's really interesting to me because, and like you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I just feel like the U.S. maybe wouldn't be interested in that model. There's an incentive built in to just want to be as big as possible without wanting to do it in a conservative way. And like, I don't know if that's the case, but when I think about the U.S.,

it's always expanding beyond the need. To want to be the biggest as possible, and that's just maybe that's just like my understanding of, like, what you hear from them, and maybe that's not how they operationalize. But just when I think about that, having an incentive to do what you just described is having an effective system that only serves the people that it needs to serve and doesn't go beyond that. I mean, there's indigenous values in that idea of not taking more than you need and to make it as effective as possible. So you're not creating large-scale waste.

And when you think about a company, you think, and like people often think of companies as just wanting to be as big as possible, caring about the individuals they're serving. And the model here, it sounds like it's a hybrid of wanting to be as big as it needs to be, but not bigger, and making sure that it's getting the best use for the individuals, which to your point, not all McDonald's is not thinking, how do we serve the most amount of people and not cause the most. Like, you know, their business model is as many locations, sell as much food as possible and not worrying about the customers they're serving to that extent.

And so it seems like there's a balance there. Yeah, yeah, it's, you know, the heart of it, we're a regulated utility. So we're regulated, and the BC Utilities Commission, the piece there is like serve your customers, serve them well. And so as a company, though, we're addressing that, like, we want to address, and this is sort of a kind of a term of like the energy trilemma. We want to serve our customers sustainably, reliably, and affordably. And that perspective there, that aligns with the BC Utilities Commission and what they're saying and what they're directing us to do. So as a regulated utility and those sort of the idea of serving our customers,

sustainably, reliably, and affordably, like, I think that's a really neat place to be as an organization. I agree. I also think about, as I work with Chihuahua, when we started to cry and come up with, like, value statements and mission statements, some of those can start to seem surface level not meaningful. But when you describe yours, I mean, those make logical sense to the goals of British Colombians and to the goals of the business is to do all of those things because it's good for you, it's good for the community, and it's good for the individuals using the system.

Yeah, it's like language is, language is imbued with meaning. And sometimes these big ideas and these big topics are so hard. to figure out, well, what's the meaning? Like, what words do you use? We're still always trying to figure that out. Energy for a stronger future is certainly where we're at right now. But again, what does that mean? So, and I, yeah, I like, and you don't want to be performative either. So you want the words to have that meaning, and you want it to be action-based, too. So there's a lot of conversations internally that we have to make sure what we're saying is real and actionable. What does that mean to you, energy for a better future?

Energy for a better or stronger future is, you know, when I look at it, it's a future where everybody has the energy they need to be able to either build what they want, to serve them in the way they want. So whether that, say, say, Tewathal or say a nation that's looking to embark on an economic development pathway that requires energy, we want to be able to serve those communities. So that's the way I look at it. It's a stronger, stronger future, a better future for BC. It's like an inclusive energy future is the way I really look at it. What is the energy used for? Which energy do you mean? When you say Chihuahawothal, say like, so we've got this example, Chihuahawawthal, and then it needs energy. Why does it need that energy and what can it be used for

to unlock economic development? Good question. So when I think of energy, I think it could be like a range of things. So it could be, for example, you want to build an ice rink? So you want to build an ice rink? It's serving to offer with, for example, energy to be able to have an ice rink that maybe has an event center that maybe has a hotel attack. You know, it could be a range of things.

Or it could be serving a nation that wants to be also an energy supplier. So if they want to be a renewable natural gas supplier, they have to be connected to our system. And so that's kind of what I look at. It's the connecting to our system really opens up this basket of opportunities for the communities and people we work with. I really like that because those are some of the challenges communities run into is like we're looking at a few plots of land and we go, okay, we want to develop here. Does it have phase three power? Does it have a sewage system? And those were things when, like, I had written my economic development paper in law school that I didn't really think about when you think about economic development as, like, an engine is like, you do need some foundational pieces and energy is one of those pieces.

Yeah, that's something you're right. I've learned that over time, too, because you need energy. You need access to water, to sewage systems. And for a long time, those systems didn't necessarily connect to everybody and didn't necessarily connect to everybody and didn't. necessarily connect to communities. Maybe they went through them or around them, but not to them. So I think it's a really interesting time now. Those are pieces that certainly big conversations are happening about that. And it's important. Can you walk us through your role at Fortis and how you've grown into it? Yeah. So I started with Fortis 16 years ago. I started doing energy efficiency

conservation, and then I moved into some policy work, government relations. And then I really, to an extent, I was brought in by a mentor of mine. His name's Bruce, Bruce Falstead, and he brought me in to work with First Nations along with, on a large project called the Eagle Mountain to Wood Fiber project. It's a project where we were serving a customer, and we are right in the middle of building that project, Wood Fiber LNG. So he brought me on that project and really started working with communities, indigenous communities, indigenous people. And it's, fit well. Like, it's something that felt very right. Like, it was something that it took my background in polysci, sociology. It also took a level, like, my family's been connected to

communities since I was born. It's a level of comfort I had just working in community. And so to an extent, you know, how do you get into it? Well, I somewhat was brought in, somewhat fell in, Someone just enjoyed it, and it's developed. And I have a wonderful team I work with, and we work with communities in a collaborative fashion, and that fashion is really focused, you know, on creating opportunities for partnerships. It's being solutions-oriented. That's a big part of it. Yeah.

I'm interested to understand what is unique about working with indigenous communities from your perspective? You know, the unique part is more the structures that are. and have been placed on communities. So the unique, and there's so many layers to this, too. Every individual you work with is different. But with communities, you're working from a place where, in many communities, the Indian Act is still ever present with respect to development of lands. You're working with communities where, you know, trauma and pain is very close.

and you're working with communities when, and we're working on the land. And land is so intertwined, not just with, it's intertwined with culture, is intertwined with rights and title, and Fortis has an impact on lands. So there's layers there that I think working with indigenous communities brings to the job that you need to be conscious of. It doesn't necessarily mean you treat it in a way that, like, you know, I'm human, you're a human, we're all humans. here and relationships matter, and that should be the case overall.

But there's a different lens and different complexities there because of those, I think, because of that. The other piece, I imagine, is also some communities need this much needed infrastructure. And so how do you get your information from, like, Fortis might have a reconciliation plan or a reconciliation vision? How does that shape the work you do? Yeah, good question. So we have, so over 25 years ago, we built what we call our statement of indigenous principles.

And there are a set of principles that really place a lens on how we work with communities. And it's a lens of respecting communities as individuals. It really outlines that we work with respect at the forefront. We work to ensure inclusion, whether it's contracts, jobs, training, the whole like. It's a set of principles that guides our organization. And they were developed, these principles in concert with leaders from—indigenous leaders from across Canada. So that kind of provides that framework for how we, as an organization, work with communities. And further to that, we are part of the Pair program, so Pair being progressive accreditation in indigenous relations.

A nice little—a nice little acronym there that gets you sometimes. But really what that is is it's a governance structure for actioning. those principles. So, and it's a governance structure where it moves, we have 27, 2,800 employees, and it's really moving the whole organization forward with actions. And so those two kind of provide a bit of that baseline framework, the baseline sort of principles, the framework, and we are embarking on an indigenous relations and reconciliation strategy.

Right now, we're starting engagement with communities on that draft strategy, which is exciting over the next little while. But yeah, relationships are foundational trust and treating our interactions more than just kind of that like checkbox. It's like you want a foundation there. You want to be able to look someone in and they kind of know you more than just you're going there and it's transactional. So, yeah, that's key. Twenty-five years ago. Yeah. This is before the Truth and Reconciliation Commission. This is before the missing and murdered indigenous Women's Inquiry, this is before it's become important to a lot of organizations in the very recent history to want to start to build relationships.

And it sounds like that was happening previously. Do you think that that previous structure helped put you in a different, more unique, more trusted position? I think it helps. You can't rest on your laurels, but it certainly has helped that we have had that there and had those values ingrained and they're ingrained in our leadership and it's really important for us as an organization.

The need, though, to respond to the legislation, the policies, the huge advancement with respect to that space of, and really the reconciliation piece there, it's like we need to have that strategy to move our organization forward and speak to those advancements. And I think it's just really an exciting place

and time to be in right now. So what do you think your role, like, what does your role look like in the day-to-day? How are you actually actioning some of these things? Yeah. So when it comes to actioning, you know, I'll say starting off, it's internal. And my team focuses primarily externally, but we have an entire team that focuses on internal education of our employees. Because I think found it, it's really important there that we have employees understanding, um, understanding indigenous communities as it pertains to the history, the past, but also,

the present, you know, what's going on presently. So we have indigenous awareness training where we have it as a core competency or core requirement, so to speak, for a whole 2,700 employees. And then there's a lot of experiential learning on the land. And the team does a lot of work around leadership exchanges, leadership conversations, so bringing in chiefs internally. But then, you know, so that's internal. But external, like, it's so exciting because every day looks different, and every day looks different in a way that, you know, table stakes is ensuring that you are either co-developing or you're working with communities on impact mitigation plans when it comes to, say, it's archaeological.

Are you digging in a particular area? Do you have a cultural monitor on site? Are you gaining that knowledge about what might be in the area that's important to be aware of when it comes to the environment in something like a fish window? So the window where you can do work in and about a stream, I learned, and I think it's kind of neat, like, okay, well, maybe for this particular river or tributary, they have a slightly different fish window than you would, then sort of the books would say. But learning that and working with the communities to understand that, like, it makes our projects, it makes our work so much better. And then I think that sort of there's so much, but another area which I, which Carol talked about a little bit, which is there's a huge amount of work done with communities around energy. And whether it's serving community's energy, serving them energy when it comes to building out their projects, we have also a cool program called our Climate Action Partners program.

And this is a program where we either fund projects or individuals to be within organizations or communities to help sort of develop ways to reduce emissions, to work with the communities. on implementing conservation and energy efficiency rebates in the community. So my team really works with communities and I work with communities to find ways to work together. So find opportunities for partnership. That sounds like such a unique position when you think about it because so many people go to school to do like a job, a task, but to be able to work with communities to help them figure out what their goals are in terms of growth because a lot of the energy you need

to manage some of these buildings. You need that support in order to get to those things. And so it's very interesting to hear a role where you get to just work with others to help them reach their goals that are already in alignment. Yeah. And like, so right now we're, and it's kind of cool. Right now we're doing this thing called the long-term resource plan. It's this giant plan that goes, is a 10-year plan, I think it is, or rather, it's looking out 10 years into future. We do this every few years. And this plan is figuring out, well, what does the future of energy look like in the province? And what does FortisBC need to do to meet that future of energy?

And we're engaging with indigenous communities, organizations, and we're just starting it. So we're going to be engaging on figuring out, what do communities need? How does that fit into this energy picture? Do we have 10 communities that are looking to be energy suppliers for us? So it is a really great space and a really exciting sort of space now. But again, it's ever-changing. So I don't know what tomorrow looks like sometimes, which is both scary and exciting. And I don't always know sometimes what we're going to be able to do with all the feedback we're getting.

And that's the tough part. And those are questions we ask ourselves every day, too. Like, how do we translate that into the action? Right. That was actually going to be one of my questions is, what is that impact to look like? What are some examples of the work you do and the impact it has? Yeah. You know, I think, for example, work we do, we do a lot of work also around inclusive contracting. And so inclusive contracting and inclusive socioeconomic benefits. You know, you can use all these big terms. That really is making sure our contractors are supply chain.

we're not just using who, for example, the company's always used. It's ensuring that we're providing pathways and supports to businesses that want to be part of that supply chain. So in our case, it means ensuring language, for example, in our contracts, is promoting or supporting the use of indigenous businesses, indigenous owned and affiliated businesses. And we've really focused on that a lot over the last five years on that inclusive contracting piece. And, you know, last year, it was neat to see the fruits of that because what we're doing, we're bringing in contractors. We're introducing them to our procurement managers. We're getting language in our contract. Like, that's what our team all does. We're supporting that. And last year on our major projects, 24% of the contract spend went to indigenous business. 24% indigenous and indigenous affiliated businesses. So it's not people go, well, are there?

indigenous business out there, absolutely, and they can do the work and they can do it well. That's really good news. What other projects are going on where you get to see that overlap with First Nation communities and indigenous communities? Yeah, I mean, I think that lately, so there's lots of ways, and it almost gets overwhelming how much there is. But in the fall, last fall, we did what we call an R-F-E-O-I. So request for expression of interest. And really, it was, is that we were looking for projects, electric projects at that time in the southern interior of BC, and electricity projects that we could really be buying energy, so electricity from. And we were looking for those projects to have an indigenous equity component or really,

really strong involvement from indigenous communities. So for the company, it was reaching out, making sure the community's new, sort of just setting that groundwork there, framing there, trying to bring them in. And I think it's looking positive. for having a number of projects, either suppliers or the like, that will have a very, very strong indigenous, either ownership or equity component. Why? Why is it important? It's a good question.

That, you know, it's to me, and this is to me and to our organization, the importance here of having indigenous communities as part of the energy picture is baseline. Like, why not? Like, why are we excluding? that's the system that was in place for a long time, that we've got to move forward past that. So there's, that's a big part of it. It's like, why, why not? Like, I don't, I don't have an answer other than like, well, why wouldn't you?

Yeah. So, yeah. Because you see the reserve system and it's almost like they've been put on islands. Yeah. In a lot of regards with the Indian Act and how it is. And so you're starting to see indigenous businesses come up, but I'm curious as to, indigenous businesses aren't, say, the reserve or something. So what's the impetus specifically for First Nation-owned businesses and indigenous-owned

businesses to get them involved on projects that might not be on reserve? Well, I mean, in that case, it's also community-owned businesses. So it says if an entire community wants to get involved, I think that economic inclusion is core. to where we need to go as a country and where we are at as a province, it just hasn't been there. Like, the inclusion of indigenous communities just hasn't been there for decades.

So I think it's really important that we do place a focus on that. And if it's on reserve or not, like, why should we say you should be on reserve doing that? Why shouldn't it be? Like, those are sort of artificially creative to it create it.

So I kind of look, I'm like, well, they should be, it should be everywhere. Yeah. I think about this because I wrote a paper in law school focused on economic development. And one of the comments that's been made by community members and by people over the past 100 years is indigenous people aren't entrepreneurs. And there's really no evidence of that. It's something that's said that I don't think is true because there's fur trading, there's fishing, there's building canoes. And so, like, those were all businesses that existed. So I wrote a paper kind of outlining the history of indigenous entrepreneurship and how that's faded away in recent in the last 100 years.

And so trying to revive that idea of sovereignty, of independence, of the ability to grow your own work. And I'm very excited to see that because I know different political parties have different perspectives on the importance of economic reconciliation. But I really like it because it creates independence for that person. Businesses often create relationships of individuals you need to work with in order for that business to grow. And just even within my own community, getting to see that, like, it's like 67% of our community is either open to starting their own business or committed to starting their own business. And so you have a lot of people who are coming from impovered circumstances that are very eager to share their gifts, their ideas, their passions. And you have partners like Fortess that are at the door going, like, we're ready to work with you when you reach that point. And I think that gives a lot of hope and optimism to people who want to do that because so often starting a business is a lonely endeavor where it sounds like a pipe dream when you say you want to create your own space or you want to do something yourself because you have to have capital infrastructure.

You have to have partners and you have to do all of these things that somebody coming alongside you and saying, like, we want to find a way to support you. I think that's important for entrepreneurship. I do too. And, I mean, I would push back. I mean, no, I shouldn't say I'd push back. Everybody has their opinions on sort of what people should be doing or not. It's not for me to say. But we, like, Fortis supports, and I believe strongly in, like, youth entrepreneur training, youth boot camps.

We're supporting one, and we have with Seabird for quite a number of years. They're running it again, I think, with Bears Lair, this summer, which is really exciting. But providing youth in particular sort of exposure to opportunities. what's possible, giving training on what you need to be an entrepreneur, the steps, just marketing plans. I'm lucky I've got a lady who's on my team who is an entrepreneur as well. We have a wonderful group of folks on my team, and she's been a satellite. She's been a coach on that youth boot camp in the past. So I think it's such a great area to focus on and say, and I do think, why not? So why not? Can you tell us more about that program?

Yeah. So, Seabird Island in particular, they've run, it's called YEI. I think it's the Youth Entrepreneurship Initiative. And Seabird, and it's really inviting many Stollown Nations to this youth boot camp. And they take a weekend. It was in the past. It was in October. And Florida supported it, and we've done it for a few years.

And it brought youth in to teach them, how do you build a business and how do you grow that business from the ground up? And they had, they have coaches talking about, say, yeah, whether it's marketing or financial planning, budgeting. And then this last year, what they've done is that Bears Lair has been really big in this space. They have these youth booth camps going across the province. And it's a two or three day session where it's training youth on how to build the business and how to accelerate that business. So I'm excited to see the possibility. on that one too. It's just huge collective opportunities. I agree because then people are following through on where they want to go where the previous model from my perspective is you graduated high

school, you went to university, you tried to fit into a box, try and take a program. Maybe your parents took that program, so you're taking the same program. And this really removes some of those barriers so people can start to think, like, what do I want to do? Like, who do I want to be? Where do I want to be? How do I want to go about living my life and then you have school that fits into that and careers that fit into that and then maybe neither of those properly fit so you create your own business or you go to school to create that business and so it really unlocks that door so because we've done the 40-hour work weeks where everybody does the job for 35 years and they don't move within the organization and they do that and then they retire but I think we're moving beyond that now people want to

contribute they want to know the work they're doing is meaningful and impactful and and that they're sharing their passion with the world. And I think that really unlocks that. Yeah, I agree. I think it's that idea of like, like, I think it's the idea of flexibility, not just the idea, but the opportunity for flexibility, the opportunity to lean into what you bring to the table. And having supporters there, like again, Fortis and others,

supporters there saying, yes, you are good at that. And that is a great idea. How huge is that for someone to say? that idea. I think we all need coaches and supporters in our corner. Absolutely. And I think the other piece that I wanted to get your perspective on is there's this relationship that I've been very interested in between Western culture and indigenous culture and how the two can complement each other. And the one area that stands out to me personally has been how indigenous people take care of our elders versus how Western culture takes care of their elders. Because we have

this growing amount of seniors care homes and those seniors are left alone. And then reports are coming out now that show that people with dementia do worse when they're in a senior's care home than when they're at home with the family because they have those touch points with their community and people remember and they're reminded of all the things that made them who they were. And when you put them in an environment where they're completely disconnected with who they were and where they lived, then they start to forget even faster. And that deterioration happens the faster. So I'm always interested in, like, what can both cultures learn from each other? Have you gone through that similar experience as well of being able to hear those stories

from indigenous communities and go, that's very useful and it helps solve this problem over here? Absolutely. I mean, I think about it personally, too, and I think about it. So, for example, my grandfather was part of a group of folks who started the Native Education College. It's an adult education center at the time, and he started it in around the 60s and 70s, and a big part of the reason for that, like a big facet and a really, or a key piece of that college was ensuring people didn't have to leave who they were at the doorstep when you go into school, bring your culture, bring even your baby, like bring who you are so you can participate in your full self. Furthermore, it was that idea of that you didn't have to enroll in September.

It was constant enrollment. So you could go. If you were just coming down, if you moved down from, say, Prince Rupert, down the city, you could start in November. And so it is the intersection. When I think of Western values, when I think of Indigenous values, I think there's, I think it's really important to look back at, like, family and family structures. and the importance of being together as a family and bringing your whole self to the table. Those, I think, are things that we can continue to learn from, and I think we're way better off when we bring our whole self and we really connect ourselves back to family as much as we can.

I couldn't agree more. The other piece I wanted to understand is many indigenous communities, particularly individuals living on reserve, the socioeconomic conditions they're under aren't always great. Many people living in poverty, relying on social assistance. And energy seems like one of those kind of pillars in order to be able to start to pay your bills and move out of poverty is you need to have that piece managed and in an affordable state. We had members come forward and they were like, I'm paying $600 a month in the middle of summer for my air conditioning and for the cooling of my system. So you think about how much that removes their ability to invest that in other things and to start to grow. what is your experience with that type of work been like?

I mean, energy poverty is one of those pieces where you don't like to hear, but you don't want to hear someone saying, well, I can either pay my, I can either get food for the week or I can pay my bill. Like, that's not something we want to hear about, but I know it does happen. And so I think it's a place, like for Fortis, it's one of those places where we can't, we can't solve all the, we can't solve certain things that I, I would love us to solve. But at the same time, that's where developing our infrastructure, providing energy in a way that's

affordable for the long term is really important. And that also means ensuring homes are safe, ensuring that they're using that energy efficiently, and that we are, like, that is something we do. We provide a huge amount of support and incentives there to make sure homes and the use of energy is as efficient as it can be and keep costs down. And so that, to me, is I think, one of those key areas and the roles that we can play is we can help support communities, homeowners in reducing their energy bills, keeping their homes safe, keeping it comfortable.

I'm also really interested to understand the process of engagement. I think that's a really important piece that I've become really passionate about myself when I ran for council, I didn't have a deep understanding of the role of community engagement, but there's something really important and unique about engagement so that you're bringing everyone alongside and you're making sure everything's adapted. How does Forrest go about engaging First Nation communities and indigenous communities? Yeah, engagement is certainly core to what we do every day. And the way we do it is it's every nation is different. And so when When we talk about engagement, sure, we'd certainly need to follow formal channels where you send out a letter and you see, okay, am I going to get a response?

But like that's baseline. What you're doing is you're going, I know this counselor really, I know this counselor, well, I know they're going to pick up the phone. We're going to chat about this. We're going to figure out, does it make sense to talk about this topic now or maybe it's something two months into the future? Should we have a community meeting? Should we support, you know, maybe it's an open house. It's tailoring it to the community, tailoring it to the time frame, doing it in a way that meets the needs of those communities. And also having the, like listening with purpose, like if someone says something to me that sort of gives me an inkling like they're not written, this is not a topic we can talk about now.

Maybe there's been deaths in the community. We've got to listen with purpose and listen to hear what is not being said that might affect that engagement timeline and that approach. People can handle the truth both internally and organization and externally. So that's our role, take back that truth or take back that knowledge and share it internally to help shape our processes for engagement. That's an interesting point, and I, maybe you just said something that sparked something in me, that a death in the community is perhaps different for indigenous communities than other communities. And of course the impact for individuals remains the same, but the understanding that it's a community experience, like that it's impacting more than just the immediate family.

Like these are the types of things when I think about the difference between Western, culture and like first nation's culture that you start to see there's values there and there's there is a community when you're in just a regular municipality you have just these different blocks of people who all are independent individuals that may not be connected to their neighborhood or something but for a first nation community on reserve they are all on the same wavelength in regards to that yeah i mean we go back to family like there are families there and family and there's connection, a deep connection. So I absolutely, like, I do think it's different, but also would it be so bad if we, you know, respect, like, why not? I agree. Like, this is why, why not? Like,

I wanted someone to respect if I've had really challenging time and, you know, maybe there's a loss in my family and the community, perhaps, that I'm with, I think that's good respectful practice across the board, but for sure. That's what I just think about, like, it seems, perhaps more stale the process when you think of you're working at an organization and they're like okay you had a loss in your family you get three days and it's like that approach versus just it's a more human approach maybe these are the types of things where I'm like is there something Western culture can learn from First Nations culture and there are things first nations culture that can learn and those those are always interesting to me because it feels like the first

hundred years, Western culture was like, this, this is in our way. And now we're much more in a place where we're more open to learning from each other. And I, I wish it was that way the whole time. But it is interesting to see where the two can kind of collaborate and where we can have a more meaningful, full life as a consequence. Yeah, absolutely. And I, and I think it's still hard. This goes back to the education piece. You scratch below the surface. People are still, there's still a lot of entrenched views and, and thoughts of like, well, why would we do it any other way that doesn't I don't want to change and people don't like change and this for this for some people would be seen as change but look at the world in a way of like how listen to that voice of like

what would be better like what would make us feel right here so yeah what do you think some of the misconceptions of fordus are some of the misunderstandings you hear what are some of those misunderstandings well I mean a lot of people think um we're being H.C. Hydro, which, hey, that's fine. So, we're not, but that's okay. Like, we were, long ago, BC Gas, BC Hydro were the same company. So my grandfather worked for BC Gas. It also, the same guy as a chemist long ago, I don't know, 50s, 60s. So, but yeah, so I think we're hydro. They think it's that, you know, we're really just focused on the gas system, which a huge part of it is. Right. But we have so much other that we serve. And I think a lot of people just,

just think the jobs in the company are trades. And we do have a large number of folks who work in the trades, but there's a huge number of others who are everything from designers to project managers, to communications folks, long-term, I don't know, long-term planning folks. How do you become a long-term planning folks? There's a whole range of things. But, yeah, we are a large organization with a broad range of skill sets and individuals. What inspires you to continue this work?

I love change. Like, I love seeing evolution for the better. Like, I like seeing systems where I'm like, that doesn't seem like that's a good idea. And just tweaking it a bit, trying something out and going, oh, that worked out. Like, we worked on the, ourselves in Wood Fiber, we're part of the two projects, like, we were two projects that work with Squamish Nation. on their first, on their environmental assessment process. So basically, as I said long ago, we were working to serve Wood Fibre LNG with natural gas. And we worked with some really astute leaders at the time that said the environmental,

BC environmental assessment process, that's not going to work for us. So Fortis and Wood Fiber, we would like you to move through the Squamish Nation environmental assessment process. that process really put Squamish forward as the regulator. And the regulator on that project, and yes, we worked with certainly other nations in a really deep, deep way in terms of engagement. But with Squamish Nation,

they wanted to ensure that they were also a regulator on that project. And so our company took that as an opportunity, sort of with Vibers, and we went through both the BCEA process, and the Scottish Nation EA process, achieving EA certificates at the end. Now, where I'm going with that is, like, that shifted the entire EA process for the province. So the BCEA process now has a ton more consensus building with nations embedded in it.

It's deeply collaborative between the nations. And so when I look at, like, wow, like, I want to keep doing that. Like, I want to keep being part of a company that supports change. in a way that evolves systems that support better decision-making and better outcomes. What does it mean to you to see a project go through like that? Because there's, like, in a regular job, you're done at the end of the day and you move on. But when you're part of a large-scale project that takes, I imagine, years to get through and there are so many little steps along the way, what is the gratification at the end of such a project?

And, you know, some communities and some members would say, like, it shouldn't go. Like, everybody has a diverse opinion on that. I think, and I think of this as reconciliation in general. I think I have both an ache and a joy. Like, these projects, it's hard. Like, you're talking about really deep subjects. It's the land impacts. It's, you're talking about sometimes, you know, you've got work camps on this.

Like, how are we going to address the safety of indigenous women and girls? So you're bringing up deep topics, and I ache when I'm sometimes going through these, because you're bringing these home, you're talking about with folks. It's ever-present. I don't turn off that easily. And the folks I work with are all very passionate. We don't turn off. Equally, there's a huge amount of joy about advancing work with community and collaboration with community that has made real meaningful change. You're seeing fish and fish habitat in spaces that are coming back. You're seeing herring spawning. You're seeing all these really interesting things happening because of the good work that you're doing around impact. planning, mitigation, and you're seeing a huge investment in terms of economic, or huge

economic empowerment from those contractors who maybe started out small car contractors, one truck or whatever, and now they're growing their business and really benefiting from these projects, not just for that project, but longer term growing their businesses. So, yeah. That was beautiful. Oh, thank you. That was beautiful. What does your role mean to you and the impact that it?

as on indigenous communities? What is your legacy? That's not a nice question. How old am? No, I'm kidding. So I don't have a legacy. I'm so proud to work with the people I've gotten to work with. So I hope my legacy is not, it's with the people I work with as like a reasonable person,

a nice person to work with, someone who's collaborative. I hope my legacy is around who I am as a person. I don't, I can't, I mean, but it's really my team has done a ton. It's, it's that I hope I've set a great foundation for and value system for us to move forward, all our work. So, yeah. I love that. How can people connect with Fortis and learn more about the work that you're doing? Well, you can certainly go to our website, so FortisBC.com, but you can always, we have indigenous relations, community indigenous relations, manners across the province, really wonderful people.

And folks can connect with them, too, whether it's folks in municipalities, whether folks indigenous communities. Certainly, you can connect with each of those managers who are pretty well known in amongst their communities because, as you said, relationships are key. So either through our website or specifically through our community indigenous relations managers. Beautiful. Thank you so much, Samantha, for being willing to join us today. Thanks for having me today.

I don't know. Thank you.