Nuanced. - Taste of Abby: MLA Pam Alexis on the BC Floods, Food Security & Farmers

Episode Date: September 19, 2023

Prepare for an insightful chat with Pam Alexis, Minister of Agriculture and Food, as we delve into her transition from Mayor of Mission to an influential Member of the Legislative Assembly (MLA), explore her dedication to BC's diverse farming community, and discuss her commitment to ensuring food security.Welcome to the Taste of Abby podcast mini-series! In this series, we'll explore Canada's largest farming community, connecting with farmers, creators, and restaurant owners. We'll dive into how they harvest from the land, strive towards sustainability, and strengthen our region. Join Aaron Pete as we deepen our connection to these lands and explore the tastes of Abby.Learn more about MLA Pam Alexis: https://pamalexis.ca/Send us a textThe "What's Going On?" PodcastThink casual, relatable discussions like you'd overhear in a barbershop....Listen on: Apple Podcasts   SpotifySupport the shownuancedmedia.ca

Welcome to Taste of Abbey. I'm Aaron Pete from Chihuathal First Nation, and I host the Bigger Than Me podcast. In this series, we'll explore Canada's largest farming community, connect you with local farmers, creators, and restaurant owners. We'll dive into how they harvest from the land, strive toward sustainability, and strengthen the social fabric of our region. Join me as we deepen our connection to these lands and explore the Taste of Abbey. It is such a pleasure to be sitting down with you. Would you mind introducing yourself for individuals who might not have heard of you? I'm happy to do that. My name's Pam Alexis.

I have lived in the Fraser Valley since 1996, moved to Mission because of the West Coast Express and the options that were available, which I think Mission was one of the first communities to have that opportunity to access the downtown core for jobs, for all kinds of. of things. And it really changed the, I'd say, the demographics of Mission in 96 when the train started because there were all sorts of people that moved to mission as a result. And so I'm one of those sort of pioneers that came in 96 and had a great opportunity to work in a lot of nonprofits when I moved there, worked at the Clark Theater, was on the Chamber of Commerce, did a whole lot of nonprofit kind of work and then ran for school trustee, served two terms as a school trustee. Then I ran as a

counselor. I served one term as a counselor. Then I ran for mayor and won that seat. And then I was asked by Premier John, former Premier John Horgan, to run as an MLA. And it was a tough decision. But I ended up running and won. And now I'm the Minister of Agriculture and Food. So, I have a long history of serving the community since 2005, but now I've served a much bigger community. I'm fascinated by the idea of choosing to go into public service, because it seems like when people are considering putting their name in, there's so many barriers, there's so many fears of being judged, of being attacked, of being treated a certain way, and so it causes people not to want to put their foot forward. It causes them to go, you know what, I don't need that drama. I just want to live my simple life. What pushed you to put your name forward?

As a school trustee, I was very passionate about fine arts. And I wanted to make sure that all children in mission had an opportunity to study music or drama or art. And so those values were really important to me, and I felt just compelled to try and ensure that opportunity for other children. children as well. And so that's what kind of drew me into it. And I kind of fell in love with agendas. And I know that sounds strange, but not agenda like I have a personal agenda. I mean physical agenda and agenda setting and meetings and process and governance and all those things that are absolutely necessary for actually running. public entities like school districts, like city halls.

So I'm really attracted to the process part and really enjoy policy, really enjoy seeing policy, come to fruition, and making really positive changes so that life can be different for people. As a mayor, it's one of the first opportunities you have, to highlight a community, to showcase the brilliant individuals within it. And sometimes you go, oh, mission's known for this one thing, or this community is known for that one thing.

And you don't always know the side stories or the people who are really making a difference behind the scenes. You don't always get to know that. But as a mayor, it's your role sometimes to showcase those people to highlight the great people of your community. Can you talk about what that's left? And, you know, I had the lucky, I think, experience of working, with the BC Winter Games.

So I was vice president of the games in 2012, and I needed to find 2,000 volunteers to help run the games. That was my task, in addition to a number of other tasks. And so I, again, because I had all this experience in nonprofit sector and that kind of thing, I was connected deeply to the community, and I was able to bring in all the best folks from all the different entities that I sat on and sat with and did events and all kinds of things. So in that way, I was able to, because I knew who the players were, I was able to showcase what we were capable of because I've always believed, and I'm just going to talk about mission specifically, I've always believed in mission that people are,

greatest resource. They are remarkable and hardworking and resilient. And so it was not difficult to highlight those folks while I was mayor at all. It seems like there are different styles when you talk about politics, different leadership styles, different processes people like to follow, different philosophies. Some people are very charismatic and willing to fill up a room with energy and others are more delivering the agenda, the goals that they kind of set when they were heading into it. What would you say your leadership style is? It's a little different than I'd say what you would encounter in some mares. I believe in doing good, doing positive things, and not necessarily dwelling on it, but there's a saying in Greek, because I'm Greek, my family's Greek,

that you do something good, but you put it into the water and let the water take it away. And don't dwell on it. You just do it. Don't think about it. Just do it. And that always resonated with me. And the other part, and I'm going to go back to the Greek thing, again, is there's a word called Philoptico. And Philoptoco is the love of honor. That's the direct translation. But it actually is about, again, doing the right thing, doing good things, and not gaining from it personally, but just so that you can effect change. And so, you know, being attracted to process and governance and all the things that belong to that,

that is part of it, in my opinion. And so I am not a leader that is sort of on top trying to tell people what to do, but rather I want to encourage leadership skills in others. And so I'm always looking to bring people up and raise them from where they are and provide opportunity. So it's a different style.

Fair to say that this is a challenge to message out to people because so many people have a cynical mindset when it comes to politics, regardless of the level that you're talking about, there's the sense that, oh, like, things don't get done or they're not done the way I want them to done or they're not done the way I would do them. There's kind of this sense of lack of confidence sometimes with some people. And so saying, like, hey, we're here to lift the community

up and open doors and opportunities is not something people are always used to hearing. It is very challenging, certainly. And being a female is very different. I'm the very first female MLA in my riding. I'm the very first. So that's significant. And so consequently, I have a lot of women followers who want inspiration. They want, I've sort of let them know it's achievable. and that you don't have to be a certain way in order to get elected. I've made it okay. And some people find it difficult, and I don't want to generalize, but I think men may look at me differently than women.

And other women would, many of them, have come to me to say, I need you to stay where you are. In fact, you know, one day I was really, troubled as a mayor. There was some very difficult and challenging things on the agenda. And, you know, you wear this. When you go out in public, people know that you've got something on your mind. And I was in the supermarket, in the checkout, and I was going through in my head how I was going to respond to this particular issue. And this woman came up to me and she said, oh, she said, are you okay?

And I said, oh, yeah, I'm fine. I said, I'm just trying to figure out how I'm going to respond to such and such. And so she said, you hang in there. She said, my 15-year-old daughter needs you to be where you are. And that, at that moment, I realized how important it was that I was where I was. And this has happened many times. So I'm there and here, I believe, to make it possible for others to follow. I ran for counsel for my First Nation community, and I faced this challenge of wanting to deliver things that I told the community I wanted to work on and feeling this onus.

And I think of how many people voted for me, and it's not anywhere near running for MLA where you're getting thousands of votes and feedback from the community. but I do live with the sense of I've been given an opportunity and a responsibility by these individuals who voted for me and inevitably by the people who didn't to deliver and make sure that they can hold me accountable as well. And that's a weight that we put on our shoulders. Sometimes we get lost in the you got 30% or 35%. You think of every person who went to the ballot box to put their X on who they wanted it to be, and it was you. What does that mean to you to be given this opportunity, this responsibility to deliver for the community, that they entrusted you with this responsibility?

That's a huge thing. And the moment I became mayor, I felt such deep responsibility. And I lived that for every moment. And that's why when the Premier called, I said no. When he asked me to be MLA, I said, no, my responsibility is as mayor, with the people, and I need to be here. and he called again and again and I said find somebody else

and so they had already what they called drop the writ and that means that government kind of ceases while there's an election campaign coming and I got called again and they said let me think about it one more time I phoned a few of my key sort of people in my life that support me

and I said what do you think think, and every one of them said, you know what has to be done. Now you can do it. You will represent us at the next level, and you'll make sure that stuff happens. What is it like to know who in your phone you want to call, to have those individuals that you trust somewhat with your future? Because if one says, don't do it, stay where you are, you're going to weigh that into your decision making. And I think it's very important that we're careful about who we choose when we're making those phone calls, because we know some people aren't going to be supportive. Some people are going to have really thoughtful answers

where they're like, well, have you considered this? Have you thought about that? Maybe you ponder this. Give some time to this. And you're like, wow, that's very insightful. I appreciate you taking the time. And then other people are sort of short-sighted. What's it like to go through your phone

and try and figure out who you can trust with this tough decision? Yeah, that's an interesting question. And I picked individuals that have been supportive but have good insight into next. steps and the future and all of that. And the best advice I got was, are you going to regret this decision on Wednesday when you have to make your decision by Monday night kind of thing? Are you going to regret that you said no? Are you going to regret that when somebody else has elected that you didn't do this? And it was like, yeah, I think I might. And I said, well, then for heaven's

sakes, do it. So, yeah, and that is a thing, right? I mean, you want to figure out who's best to give you advice. And it also seems like there's something unique about it because a non-decision is still a decision, right? When you think about whether or not you're going to run for me or again, or you're going to run for a position, you know inevitably other people will be wearing that hat if you choose not to put your name forward that the consequences potentially across a province if you choose not to put your name forward that can have vast impact if you choose not to even though it feels like I'm saying no to it so like I'm not involved you're somewhat still involved because it's going to have cascading effects absolutely and you don't want to see good work destroyed at all you want to make

sure that those good moves that you made that you you know got the city where it needs to be kind of you don't want to see that tampered with or destroyed. And so, yeah, your heart is in it for sure until you're dead, I expect. Is there any change as mayor as the leader? You're somewhat at the top of the line. You're the one kind of guiding things to go into a position where it is a large team. When you're mayor, you maybe have six other people. You're communicating with discussing things with.

You obviously have a team behind you. Now you're moving into this world. where everybody's got a voice, everybody's got a seat at the table, and people are coming with vast different experiences depending on where they're located across the province. How much of a change was that for you? Huge, absolutely huge. So the transition wasn't easy because don't forget we were in COVID.

And so I was basically creating Rome and I was wearing bedroom slippers in front of my computer and not talking to anybody face to face. I was just dealing with people on the laptop. So it was a bizarre transition because I certainly had a team that I was with, but it was extremely difficult. And I remember, because we went into session on the computer,

so we were just all on a screen in the legislature, bizarre experience. And I remember trying to keep the household quiet, and I taped a note on my door to say, house is in session. You have to be quiet. So it was bananas. Who goes through this?

So when we finally were able to get together, we were only allowed to have a third of our caucus together at one time, and we weren't permitted to have lunch together or meet together. So it was so isolating. So the experience was so difficult because I'm a real people person and I found it really challenging. And I didn't know more than a third of my caucus.

I'd never met them. And we had already put a year in. Like how crazy is that? In fact, Minister Callon was in the same elevator as I was in the hotel in Victoria. When we were there in session, he was wearing a baseball cap. and he looked over and even though we'd been in countless meetings together and he said do I know you and it was like oh my gosh you're the minister Cowan like I'm Pam like when we had never met so strange after a year in so as a mayor you obviously have certain understandings of how the province plays a role in the work you do

and maybe you're not an expert on how they do things and there's this inevitable challenge because the municipality the province and the federal government all have different roles and you kind of have a cursory understanding of what they're doing over there and you go well that's kind of more of a province issue what was it like to start to see issues from the other side and be able to go oh wow like i thought maybe it was this way and it's actually this way and these are way more challenging or what was that kind of transition like from thinking you understand somewhat of what the province does to actually getting in there and doing it yourself i think the first thing that i marveled at is the number the sheer number of people that are working in various ministries

or working in government and admin of some sort, the numbers are staggering. And so just going from a small little staff, you know, and just a small team to this massive team. And so I think about my role in agriculture now as minister, there are hundreds and hundreds of people that work in different sections of agriculture. And so this is an element that you realize, man, this is much more complex.

You're absolutely right. And there's experts and expertise in all of those ministries that have been at it for years and years. And so I just feel in some ways, not necessarily as minister, but as MLA, I kind of felt like I was just a small sort of cog in the wheel kind of thing because it's so complicated and so vast and so yes huge transition between the mayor being mayor and um being an mLA but i would i think i think it was probably excellent groundwork to to have that experience behind me so that i understood governance i i felt sorry in a way for the MLAs that came from the private sector because it's so incredibly different than government.

It's just night and day. You trust and reliance is something that seems like a cornerstone. You're leading a community. You've been given the trust by them. John Horgan's calling you. You're getting his trust, which is hugely when you think of the premier and their role. And then you run, you end up getting put into this position again by the community. but then to move into the position as minister,

you're selected for that, and that's a very few people ever know what it's like to sit in that seat and to play that role. What was it like to be invited to that position? I was in shock, to be honest. It's so incredibly intense, and the learning curve absolutely was steep, but I believe I was given the opportunity

because of the atmospheric river and being the MLA on the ground, because I'm Abbotsford Mission certainly allowed me to understand the plight of the farmer and the food producer because, of course, we're so abundant

in the Fraser Valley. And that experience and that understanding, I think, led to this position. And so I can tell you that my appointment has gone down very well in the Fraser Valley,

because I think the farmers and food producers are very optimistic that they've got somebody in their midst that's right there, that understands, that knows the worst that has happened or can happen and can work to make it better or make them more whole. So it's gone over, I would say, quite well. I have work to do. There's no question.

We all do. And again, another transition that binders, that's all I can tell you, is that I receive binders, binders and binders of information to try and get up to speed and very thick binders. And so, yes, it was a. difficult, I would say, no question. I'm feeling a little better as far as, as far as understanding all the programs that are offered and understanding the people behind it. But really, I think being in this position is about relationships. It's about having good

relationships with people that are impacted, people that you need to speak to, to figure out how you can make it better for them and that kind of thing. And so BC's different than any other province. We have 200 different food products that are produced on land and 100 from the sea. so all of those different foods have associations behind them so when I the day after I was given the new appointment that was December 7th was the swearing in December 8th I had 200 meeting requests from all these different organizations that represent this incredibly diverse province and it was shocking like how am I ever going to do this?

Well, I think I'm halfway there because there's just so much to do and so much going on. So everybody wants to speak to me and get me up to speed, which I am really enjoying. But really deep down, it's not necessarily about the food. It's about the relationship you have with that organization and the people behind it. Coming on to council, hearing the stories

and the challenges that people face. I have members who talk about their home having mold for years and having asthma as a consequence and never having warm nights during the winter because the heating system wasn't put in properly in the 1980s and all of these problems. And it weighed on me throughout the winter of like, this is on me.

If I do my job properly, this will improve. And you don't get to leave that at the door. And I think the misunderstanding sometimes we have about political leaders is that, that they just either vote yes or no, that it's that simple, and then they walk away from it. But you've heard stories from farmers. You've heard what they've been through or through. Heat domes, atmospheric rivers, droughts, challenging times, and you don't get to just forget that when you go to bed at night.

It stays with you, and you keep that in mind when you're making these tough decisions. What has that been like? That is something that you don't shake easily. the atmospheric river experience, for example, still is with me. I can't go to the Barrowtown Pump Station without bringing it all back. There's a sign at the Baratown Pump Station that tells you the level that the water, I don't know if you've been visited there, but it tells you how far the water went up. And I remember taking a picture of the sign.

I was with Minister Blair, who was responsible at the water. that time for infrastructure, like the Barrettown pump station. And I thought, man, this, and I still do to this day when I go by and I look at that sign and I think, how the heck did we survive? And so, yeah, these situations are super impactful. How do you sleep at night, though? that's that's another story like I think over time I learned to put things sort of compartmentalize put things in boxes so that you can concentrate on the next subject because I don't when somebody says how was your day I say which 20 minutes are you talking about because I have a meeting every 30 minutes and Zoom

taught us, I don't know if you had this experience, but I sure did, where you were going so fast between meetings that you had to be almost a different person because you were dealing with such different subject matter. And so I was flipping, flipping, flipping, flipping, and so I had to figure out how not to show how upset I was from the previous 30 minutes to a joyous congratulatory, a Zoom call or whatever, with the next person. And so you do kind of figure out how to manage all of that, and I think Zoom taught us that. There are certain things that I carry with me, like how we're going to get through the next summer and how drought will likely be in the picture

and how water is going to likely be the main focal point of our discussions moving forward, like those kinds of things, don't leave. But the other things I can manage to put in boxes while I don't need them. There's certainly a heaviness to what's going on and the challenges that people face, but I imagine you've also gotten to see the resilience

and the innovation that takes place during these dark times. Are you able to talk about some of the things you've gotten to see of how people have risen to the occasion and overcome great adversity? Because that's when we find out who we really are during the floods. Absolutely. There are so many examples. My sort of go-to question for farmers is about succession and mental health. health. So there's a whole lot that I like to ask, but mental health is sort of a, something that I

like to talk about, because I realize this has been, the last five years have been off the charts and how much resilient, or how, you know, when does it end? Like, wow. So I, I'm a real proponent that if you need help, get help. But I do ask about succession. I say, who's, who's, who's going to to take over this farm? How are we going to make sure that this farm is going to be here next year and the year after and all of that? And I talk to the kids when I go visit farmers and I say, why are you here? Why did you stay with your dad? And often they'll say, well, my dad made it interesting because every day he woke up and he said, we're going to make it better today. We're going to be more efficient than we were yesterday. We're going to grow more

than we did last year because we're going to make this change. And it might be a technical sort of thing. It may be something small. It might be something, some change of some sort, but it kept it interesting for the young fellow in the family or the young woman, because I've been to farms that are all women run. So that, when we have to, disaster. Yes, we become creative. We've got to think about how are we going to get out of this. And it forces us, I think, to just to be, respond to the disaster and that we can figure out how to do things differently and do things better moving forward. So I believe in silver linings. And I think the atmospheric river was, in a way, exposed our gaps, exposed our weaknesses so that we could

fix them and move on. I think of individuals like manned farms with strawberries and trying to figure out how to proceed when they admit, like, we don't know when the season's going to start and we don't know when it's going to end. So in 2020, in the COVID days, they start going, how do we do vertical farming? How might we approach this? How do we become more efficient? Despite all of these like myriad of challenges, how do we come out of this better and stronger?

And it's just so fascinating to be able to look at this and see all of the thought that went in behind that. What is that like for you? That is so exciting. And so I've visited manned farms a few times. So I brought Premier John as well as Premier David. And so we saw the beginning of the structure and the concept and the sharing. and that was prior to me being minister. I was MLA and just delighted in the direction.

It takes such innovation. And there's high risks associated with this. This is not for the feigned of art. I mean, these people are resilient off the charts resilient. So very encouraged to see that. And then we got to, when David came out, the greenhouse had finished, was all completed. Strawberries were in place.

got to sample them, and it was just such a pleasure to be there at the beginning and to be there to see their finished product. So this is remarkable that there are options, that there are things in place that can provide a little bit more certainty for folks. And I visited quite a few vertical farms. I visited one just recently in pit meadows that is massive, that will feed thousands. And that's the name of the game. My mandate letter, when I, I don't know if you're aware, but when ministers become ministers, they receive basically the instructions from the Premier.

And so it's a formal letter, and it says, this is what I'd like you to accomplish. In my mandate letter from the Premier, it said food security was extremely important, and consequently, my job was to ensure that regardless of where you, lived in the province, that you would not experience a lack of food, that I would be able to deliver the tools to communities to make sure that they were indeed resilient and able

to satisfy their communities' needs for food. That's fascinating, especially when, like, I've gone to Restaurant 62 and visited numerous different places over this Taste of Abbey experience. and Restaurant 62 being a place where he's dedicated to only bringing in local food, only bringing in things made locally. And it seems like there's such a movement going on here where people are committed to local food. And it seems like people are really waking up post-COVID to this idea that things can be made in your own backyard, in your own area at least, and to be able to connect with that and understand where your food comes from

rather than someplace somewhere else. That's right. And so given my mandate, the letter from the Premier, We were lucky enough to receive a historic revenue or money from government to make sure that programs could be rolled out to ensure food security was achievable regardless of where you lived. So we've rolled out programs for, say, irrigation, for replanting, for example, when you realize the species might not be able to tolerate certain kinds of weather extremes or whatever. So you're looking for another species that's a bit more hardy. So those programs are highly successful.

Programs in the Fraser Valley, for example, to help mitigate any other flood disasters or whatever. So things like grants to move your electrical panels up higher so that they're not flooded out in case the barn is flooded out. So things like that to try and make the farm as efficient and as resilient to disasters, to certainly heat and flood and disease. So disease is another whole issue that. we are also dealing with. You obviously have people trying to get a hold of you, talk about different issues, what's personal to them,

the issues they want to address, different associations, different farmers, all want to speak with you. I'm just curious, is there anything you'd want to say to them that at least they know, so when they're trying to get a hold of you or when they've got some issue, that they know that from your perspective as minister

that's on your mind or anything? You know, I've been interviewed a few times, and I always do this. And I say, this is my role. And I form a circle with my arms. And I say, I want the farmer to know that I'm here to support them. Through thick and thin, that's my job.

And I want them to know that we're here, we're listening, and we're available, and that's really what the message that I want to communicate. Well, thank you so much for being willing to. do this today. How can people connect with you? Oh, they can certainly go to the website, which is absolutely incredible because it helps guide the prospective farmer or the working farmer or the food producer in a way that's step by step. I don't know of any other ministry that is there to assist than agriculture. It is remarkable. Take a look at the website, and you'll see the

a vast array of programs and help that's available to make you more successful. Well, it's been a pleasure speaking with you. I appreciate you so much for being willing to come out and do this and try some great food. And are we allowed a little bit more? Of course. Let's have some. Thank you so, so much. I appreciate the opportunity. And now I'm going to have a blueberry.

Thank you. It's been my pleasure.