Off Air... with Jane and Fi - It certainly sealed your bowels...

Episode Date: December 7, 2023

It's another email special and this one is all over the place. Jane and Fi chat different tube lines, wipe-clean book covers and Madonna's wedding. Plus, Jane shares her nugget of wisdom for life. You don't want to miss it. There's no big guest today or on Monday as we have been taking the Covid Inquiry live. Tune into Times Radio to get the latest. And make sure to get all of your emails in for Monday's email special: [e-mail] Follow us on Instagram! @janeandfi Assistant Producer: Eve Salusbury Times Radio Producer: Rosie Cutler Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

VoiceOver describes what's happening on your iPhone screen. VoiceOver on. Settings. So you can navigate it just by listening. Books. Contacts. Calendar. Double tap to open. Breakfast with Anna from 10 to 11. And get on with your day. Accessibility. There's more to iPhone. Got home in record time last night. Oh, did you? How long?

Well, I left here, because I always clock it when I'm going down the escalator, at 5.41 and I was back at Dalston Towers by 16.14. That's very good isn't it? That's excellent. Yeah no it was good it was an impressive run last night. If anyone can beat that. Yeah and I don't really understand the ebb and flow of pre-Christmas London at the moment because I thought it would just get... Beg your pardon, Eve? Is that the burger? It's a big weekend. It's already underway over there.

Oh, lordy. What it is to be young. We've both had the burger. Yes. It was quite nice. Mexican burger. It was not... I didn't really understand the Mexican connection, but it was nice.

Anyway, I just can't work out which days are horrendously busy. It was so, so busy on the Tube last night. Why would that be just on a random Wednesday evening? But then coming in today, it was just completely empty. Where did all those people go? I was quite... The other night, was it last week? I got a district line train home. This is so boring, but the driver was a woman who...

And occasionally the drivers really communicate with the passengers. Did you sit in the driver's cab? A bit like you sitting on the pilot's knee yesterday i'm still getting over that i don't i tried not to get in with the driver they have warned me about this tfl it's just a wonderful view um god i bet it's not no i don't think it is either anyway this woman was probably quite legitimately just losing her fruit so it was was a district line train, and at every single station we were being held for a circle line train to go through. And in the end she just said, I am sick of this.

There's just no love for the district. And we were all thinking, well, it's just a train. It's just one big giant train set, and I don't think it's a like, a really vindictive decision to keep district lines in stations while circles ease on through. I just don't think it's that simple. I'm not sure, Joan.

I think there must be an enormous amount of line envy... Well, perhaps there is. ..on the Tube circuit. Because also imagine if you are just clackety old... What do you think the worst other northern no bakerloo okay bakerloo going out west i got a train out there the other day and i genuinely thought they must have put an emergency train on the line because all the other trains were off being cleaned but the person i was visiting said no they're always like that

i mean it properly it screeches i mean worryches. Yeah, the screeches are notable on certain lines. But if you work the Bakerloo line, and along comes the Lizzie line with its air-conditioned splendour. It's like entering the 21st century, isn't it? Yep, and also its different facing seats. Right, well, people will be enjoying this all over the world, and if you want to tell us about your public transport system, one that delights you, tickles your fancy, or gets on your wick you know what to do i'd like to hear from a

tube driver if we could find a tube driver that's such a weird job because sometimes those tubes going so fast you're in a dark tunnel you know your sense of perspective must be so strange i'd like to hear about that job yeah you mean we're just peering into the darkness yeah yeah but then there comes light coming towards you yes let there be light every time you approach a station you must think i hope everyone's standing back well yes you do hope that yeah yes no i think it would be a job i'd like to hear more about we are yes i agree actually you could ask some questions do you want to mention this because this is your big thing in your book of nuggets yes your questions well could i just say if anyone is looking for i can do this because it's for

charity if anyone is looking for a christmas gift you know the kind of book that uh you get honestly there's no shame in keeping books in the loo is there let's be honest um i can still see the quite distinguished bbc broadcaster used to used to head off to the facilities every single day at around 2pm with a copy of the Daily Star. Well Matt Chorley's book is written entirely I think to be kept on a loose show. It's almost got a wipe clean cover. With that sort of market in mind and as we say we all go to the facilities there's no shame. Some of us spend longer in there than others. And a sweeping generalisation alert, it hasn't been unknown for men to occupy facilities for a quite extraordinary amount of time. But perhaps they're reading. Who knows? I'm

sure they are. Anyway, this is a book that would fit the bill. And it's raising money for Kidney Research UK. And it's called The Book of Nuggets, compiled by a lady called Juliet Solomon. And she's just asked lots and lots of people to contribute just a nugget of wisdom. And what is your nugget of wisdom? I wasn't going to go first to mine although I am in it Let's hear first from Jasper Carrot

No, just to yours Jasper Carrot. Oh we've got Anthony Seldon as well Okay. Some cracking names in here but yes what people really want to know is what have I said? And slightly, slightly to my, you never know

which page you're going to end up on or in whose company you're going to find yourself. Stig Abel's in the book as well. Oh, brilliant. I think you must be the only person in Britain who hasn't been asked. Michael Ball, Shirley Bassey. Are you appearing on The Weakest Link this Christmas, Jane? No, I'm not and you won't tell us when you are. Right, I'm on page

171. My ear's actually problem. Yeah, when are you on The Weakest Link? It'll be sometime between... You've forgotten again? Between Christmas and New Year. Okay, right. Well, I'm just going to record everything that's on the telly between Christmas and New Year. Yes,

unfortunately, I'm squashed between two other contributors. Who are? Well, it's not brilliant for me. What is it? John Motsen and Russ Abbott. Gosh. Page 171. Well, I mean, I don't know what to say, Jen. No, Russ Abbott is right on the money.. Well, I mean, Russ Abbott...

I mean, I don't know what to say, Jen. No, Russ Abbott is right on the money. He says, above all, believe in yourself. Well, he has, hasn't he? And it's got him a long way. What does John Motsen say? Well, he's got a... I think it's the late John Motsen, isn't it?

So we can say what we like about John. Well, we can. And I think it's fair to say that... Yeah, I wish we could, yeah. Well, that's it, isn't it? Yeah, anyway. fair to say that um yeah i wish i wish we could yeah well that's it isn't it yeah anyway he um the um late lamented ish football commentator john watson says uh that he's got a quote from marcus aurelius gosh yeah always bear this in mind that very little indeed is necessary

for living a happy life well i think i think think Marcus is on the money there. Yeah, I think it's a bit of a cop-out to include a quote from someone else. I think you should have, like I've done, come up with something. Right, come on, read yours because it's quite funny. Jane Garvey, radio presenter, says, I wish it hadn't taken me so long to realise

that everyone has a story. I still have my teenage diaries and they are certainly a source of entertainment, but they do embarrass me. I was utterly self-involved, so devoted navel gazing that i miss so much how i wish i'd ask more questions of the people around me my own grandmother lived with us and she was born in 1900 and we did talk but not enough i should have asked her a thousand questions about what she'd seen and what she'd lived through but i was too busy and too important or so i thought

well never too late to change i think it is too late to change unfortunately and as it's turned out talking about myself has proved to be quite really annoying really annoying but if only my old nan was alive today to say to see and hear me still chatting shit but this time getting paid for it yeah do you think it's a nice book that genuinely it's called the book of nuggets if your grandmother had been born in different times would she be a youtube star oh gosh no because i think that probably would have got in her got in the way of her very tight daily schedule of reading the liverpool daily post and then reading the echo in the evening. Or maybe just a TikTok star. She honestly didn't have a lot of spare time, really, between reading.

I think somebody is missing a great opportunity to look back through the annals of history and work out who would succeed in the modern world and who would fail. I mean, Henry VIII, you sense, would have been a powerful voice on the socials. Oh, my God. A complete pain in the arse. He'd be in the jungle, wouldn't he?

Oh, probably. He'd be in the jungle about series three and people would be fascinated by him. The Daily Mail would devote a lot of column inches to Henry VIII. And lady columnists would write lots and lots of words about how it was only the nasty, hairy, armpitted feminists who didn't like him. Yeah. And that's because he wouldn't fancy them anyway.

That would be it, wouldn't it? Yeah, probably. And then they'd say something, like, you know, for his seventh wife. Well, what did she expect? Somebody wrote that about me once. Someone not too far away from us now, actually. I didn't write that. No, no.

Oh, no. No, a lady columnist. Oh, one of those lady columnists. Yeah, and I did think, oh, sister. I'm not sure about that, actually. Well, do you know what? It remains a terrible, terrible thing that if you, back in the day, maybe slightly changed,

if you wanted to earn money as a female journalist, slag off other women for money, and you were doing really nicely. Just have a lady carp. Yeah, it's pathetic. Anyway, how are you keeping? You all right? Taking care of yourself?

I'm waiting. This is great. There's no more. Hello, says this correspondent, Glyn. These protestations that she hasn't been to the theatre since Noel Coward last trod the boards is making me snigger because whenever a play is subsequently mentioned on the show, it turns out to be the exception to Fee's rule. Oh, well, yes, we did actually go to see the show that goes wrong

and it was properly funny, etc. I know I did confess to this. I owned my own hypocrisy. He's got a good couple of lines here. It puts me in mind, says Glynn, of a great aunt, long since passed away, who swore she was teetotal. But then, well, Bailey's is more of a dessert than a drink, so I'll join you in a glass. Well, as it's a celebration, then I will have a glass of the fizzy stuff. Oh, just a small brandy, but just for my nerves. Nothing that colour can have alcohol in it. She said that of Advocar. that was the drink of choice of the 1970s suburban

sophisticate despite in glenn's view it looking like a bottle of phlegm or glenn called you advocar what was that thing i used to drink uh a snowball snowballs yep i think the worrying thing about advocar was the consistency you know when you poured it into a glass it was just like that really really really thick... No, but also that very chalky penicillin. Do you remember that? Oh, yes. Slightly foamy, chalky penicillin that you always had as a kid.

Yes, God. Yes, just very, very thick and very viscous. The medicines of my youth. So I had welfare orange from the clinic. Yeah. We all had that. And I'm not imagining this every child certainly of my vintage so born 64 was given this um extraordinarily potent

bright orange drink that you picked up from the clinic which I now see on call the midwife that one of those kind of clinics that catered for child health and maternity and we got welfare orange and then um what was that syrup that was the pink syrup that we all had what the hell was that called and then of course kaolin and morphine kaolin and morphine so that was vile well but it actually it actually had yeah it had um the it had the element of cocaine in it, didn't it? Did it? Yes. I'm pretty sure. I know you can't get it anymore because it used to warm you up an absolute treat

and certainly seal your bowels. Or was it just that it did have morphine in it? I don't know. It's not available anymore. The doctor's surgery, the hatch has gone right down. No, you can't have an appointment. And also, don't take your medical advice from either of us. Please, God.

Right, I'm sure I'm not the only one to write in, says Jin. The shopping centre on the outskirts of Bristol is Cribs Causeway. It never fills me with excitement either. But thank you for that. This one comes in from Sarah who says, Unable to sleep, it's almost 2am. I've been listening to you both from a couple of days ago discussing Russian babushkas. It took me back to 1975 when my friend Cathy and I, both paediatric student nurses in London,

took ourselves off on a Thompson's Two Centre tour of Moscow and Leningrad, as it was then, in January. So blooming cold and snowy. It cost us, have a guess, eight days half board in 1975. At £250, £250. £74 each. Wow. Yeah. £75, I suppose, yeah, I suppose that would be right.

Starting in Moscow, stayed at the Inn Tourist Hotel, then a long Dr Zhivago-like train journey up to Leningrad, where it was minus 15. A great holiday. We were taken round the sights, of course, in a group, but were also allowed free time to go off by ourselves. Took a taxi to Red Square, a bus somewhere else. I remember there being no sink plugs in our wash basins,

but I'd heard that we should take our own, which we duly did. And we woke up to the sound of the pavements being cleared of snow and looking out of the window, we're surprised to see women, old babushkas, they look like wielding heavy shovels.

Yeah, that's right. Get the women to do the pavement clearing. But what's with the plug, the sink things? I was just about to ask you that. Because I remember that, actually, in quite a few of the places that we visited on the travel show. And I think Simon Calder was always saying he never left home without a plug.

But why would that be? Somebody will know. I haven't got a clue. Because you'd waste much more water if you were a hotelier if you didn't give people a sink plug. Yes, that's strange. It's really, really odd odd so i didn't go to russia until the 1990s and i've only been that one time and i it's a place i would like to go back to it was a little bit um i went on a package tour with the late lamented independent on sunday i'd

seen an advert in the independent on sunday and i went on a coach tour with my sister we met some very interesting people thank you which part of the coach did you sit in uh oh well towards the back because there's a rebel streak in in both of us yeah but not actually back seat no it wasn't really that kind it was it was full of you know inquiring minds that holiday what's the independent on Sunday fee we were very very discerning folk I do remember there was a hotel in st petersburg i'm sure there probably still is called grand hotel europe uh where because of the exchange rate we had the most fantastic meal for about 30 pence uh but of course that was to on the backdrop of immense suffering of the of the actual locals but um we were laughing anyway

have a lovely christ, says Camilla. I felt compelled to join the conversation this week with two little comments on the smoking section in Plains. In the 80s, as a small child, I often travelled with my parents to visit family abroad and on holidays my parents both smoked and were booked the first non-smoking row and then go to stand behind our seats in the aisle to smoke.

I have no idea how they thought this was protecting me from the smoke, and I suspect they're both horrified now. No curtain to separate the smoking section from non-smokers. The memory of the smell has not left me. Oh, God. Yeah. And just on hair crimpers, these are alive and well in the ballroom and Latin dance community. They're often used to add texture and volume to hair before it's put in a complex updo for competitions.

My daughter has crimpers bought recently for this purpose. You sent some beautiful pictures and very good luck to your obviously very talented teenager who is definitely going through the no smiling camera phase. Let's have a quick look. Yeah, well, she can't be expected to smile. No, no. I mean, she'll smile again. It's probably at about, I don't know, 27, 28, something like that.

There's suddenly a hint of a smile. Yes, or you'll see lots and lots of pictures of her really smiling just when you're not around. It's funny, that, isn't it? Kay says, I really enjoy your fantastic podcasts. Thank you, that, isn't it? Kay says, I really enjoy your fantastic podcast. Thank you, Kay. More like it, Kay.

And I'm still eagerly awaiting the book club review of Boy Swallows Universe. I hope Fee is now fully recovered from her illness and we are able to have a discussion

on the book very soon. Kay, you are in luck because it's coming your way tomorrow. Tomorrow. Yeah. So thank you all for being so patient

and yeah you'll definitely be able to get it in your feed tomorrow so we'll we'll look forward to your suggestions for the next one

as well and I know people have got strong opinions about Boy Swallows Universe it is worth doing books that people have got opinions on there's no point

just doing a book that everybody really likes because that's just boring isn't it yes and we're not Richard and Judy if we were Richard and Judy. If we were Richard and Judy, would you be Richard?

Well, actually, is that the right answer? I'm just trying to think. I'm happy to be Judy. I think she's lovely. VoiceOver describes what's happening on your iPhone screen. VoiceOver on. Settings. So you can navigate it just iPhone screen. Voice over on settings. So you can navigate it just by listening. Books, contacts, calendar, double tap to open. Breakfast with Anna from 10 to 11.

And get on with your day. Accessibility. There's more to iPhone. Hello, lovely Jane and Fi. hello lovely jane and fee thanks for keeping me company through my menopausal insomnia and my husband's snoring now that is a double whammy claire palmer i'm so sorry to hear that one of those things will pass the other one might not i thought fee would enjoy the attached photo of my thermometer from 10 years ago yesterday we live in southern alberta in canada minus 32 jane minus 32 is so cold your nose freezes if you try to take a breath school stays open though and they still send the kids outside for recess until it gets to minus 22 and yesterday in claire's world it was plus 15 we have no snow and there's the threat of our first

ever brown Christmas and yes fellow Albertans I do know there was a Chinook but still a Chinook? yeah, a Chinook overhead I only ever think of a Chinook being a helicopter, it is, yes isn't it?

yeah, well it must come from something is it an animal? can we google that please Eve? she's going to use the google, we'll find out Yes, yes. Isn't it? Yeah. Well, it must come from something, though. Is it an animal? It must, it's... Yeah. Can we Google that, please, Eve? Yeah. She's going to use the Google. We'll find out. Child three is consequently in something of a decline

and is not even cheered by the fact that it snowed in the Rockies and our ski hill is open. It'll be odd, as we're now very used to those picture-perfect white Christmases with the sun shining and clear blue sky as far as the eye can see. And as Claire says, global warming, anyone? Any news? Specifically the Chinook who peaked today. Yeah, OK, so the Chinook are a people.

Right, thank you. Yeah, well, does that clear that up? I tell you what, Claire Palmer, another email, please. More required. Sue in Sussex. I'm very grateful to you for this, please. More required. Sue in Sussex. I'm very grateful to you for this, Sue. She says, congratulations, Jane, on getting a head torch. Wonderful.

Oh, it's up on the Insta. It looks ridiculous, doesn't it? It turns out it's actually quite hard to take a selfie when you're wearing a head torch. And I'm not a good photographer in the best of circumstances. And although my elder child was at home this morning, she simply point blank refused to take a photograph of me wearing a head torch, so I had to do it myself.

Well, I think that's, I'm kind of with your child. Yes, I think she felt it was a step too far. And also it's just blinding looking at somebody with a head torch. Maybe that was what put her off. Yeah. Anyway, Sue says, A couple of years ago I bought a load of cheap head torches for my daughter's December birthday party that involved a spooky woodland walk from our rather remote house into the nearest town for pizza.

A few weeks later, we had a several day power cut that extended over Christmas Day. My sister and I prepared our Christmas dinner by head torchlight. We luckily have a gas fired cooker and the children and the husbands use them to wash up i now keep one hanging above the cooker for the power cuts we inevitably get after big storms but it's also do you hear my voice go there i've got a cold after big storms but also find it fabulous for fetching firewood alright, do you want to lie down? Finding misplaced packages and clipping herbs for dinner in the darker months. Hurrah for head torches.

Well, that's what you will be doing then. I mean, she's really properly told me there about the 101 uses of a head torch. So this weekend, in order to do something that you can then write about for your What I Do on Saturdays, you could spend a little bit of time clipping herbs.

Leslie says, don't give up on Shetland, Jane. Leslie has just watched the last three episodes. Well, you've given up too, haven't you? Well, I've given up, but I did graze across about 15 minutes of it last night. It was so disturbing. Oh. The twist, Leslie, you're a much, much braver woman than I am because Leslie says definitely worth watching until the end.

I had to walk away, Leslie, after one of those twists. I just couldn't quite believe that they'd gone there, actually. Well, it's not the detective, is it? Well, I don't know how don't know what how it ended because i'll tell you when the mics are off because people might be upset a little bit like with the bake-off oh yes no gosh so i wait because people might be saving i mean honestly i would leap to your defense there it was only bloody cake i mean honestly come on people so so and so one yeah well so what it's a cake show it's a show about cake

i didn't even stay right to the end to watch bake off i just googled it do you want to do the sting one it's from fee in edinburgh it's it's really good it's the follow-up i know and i've got there you go such a part by the way thank you so much for these emails obviously oh they're fantastic we'd be be sitting in silence if you didn't email one more or less. Jane and Fee at Times.Radio. Because of what's going on with the COVID inquiry, we're not doing guests in the podcast just at the moment. I don't think we're doing one on Monday either, are we?

Because Rishi Sunak's appearing in front of the COVID inquiry. I did think today, did you watch his press conference? So he had to come out in defence of the Rwanda policy, which is taking up so, so much time in this country. I can't remember a policy that has yet to become policy, creating quite so many fireworks all the time. It is endless. But he gave a very, very touchy press conference that definitely,

because Suela Bravman had come out and said some quite strong things about the implications of the rwanda policy not going ahead for the whole country uh and rishi's press conference it did have the tone of what she got that i haven't got about it you know that moment that that you know if you've if you've had a love affair that's not worked out... Well, we don't know that, do we? Oh, I see what you mean, yes, OK. It was quite... I'm this, I'm that.

I'm the Prime Minister! Yeah. Yeah. It's all quite febrile at the moment again, Jane. Oh, we've dragged febrile out of the adjective cupboard. But mind you, it's never been anywhere other than at the forefront of our minds, that adjective, because it's just been batty in Britain the last couple couple of years yeah arguably for longer than that i'm hoping for calmer waters in 2024 but i'm probably mad to say that well i yes i mean this is a conversation for another time and i'd be interested really interested to

hear thoughts from people who live in different countries about this but but there seems to be that there's always a politician who comes out and says i would be the person who would like to put politics uh back on the the you know a kind of a low level shelf in your life where you can reach for it when you need it but it's not right in front of you all of the time i'm the person who can do this and know, perhaps it's just with nostalgia that we think that there might have been a time when that's how governments actually operated. But I don't think that's an option anymore, because the sheer volume of noise about politics just creates a vacuum into which we might think we don't want the noise, but actually we're quite enjoying the noise. Well, I was going to say, I think you're absolutely right with that enjoyment thing, because I hate, I hate the fact that there will be a part of me

that if Donald Trump does win the election... You'll be mesmerised. Well, I will, won't I? And isn't that terrible? And that's the point, isn't it? Yeah, and that's why we're all to blame. Yeah. And the time that we genuinely do want politics

to very, very much be in the background of our lives, I think is gone. It's just gone, Jane. Let's talk about Sting. Dear Fee and Jane, I'm glad you enjoyed my Sting story, says Fee from Edinburgh. I cringed and laughed, I bet you did, as I listened to your observations and I'm delighted to fill in the gaps. I too was shocked when the by then extremely successful Sting not only accepted a drink from me

and then asked for that really bizarre combo. I did think he was showing off a bit as I sipped my small cider. I'm a major tequila fan now, but I'd never tasted such an exotic beverage at that point and still managed to resist trying it with champagne and have still managed to resist trying it with champagne. Yeah, I'm not surprised. It just sounds disgusting. We danced to Bob Marley, whom I also loved,

Sting in the style that he was famous for on stage, a kind of exaggerated walk, while I died a thousand deaths feeling more self-conscious than I've ever felt in my life while trying to dance in a similar cool fashion. With regard to the Sperry boyfriend, he lasted a few months while I guiltily fantasised about my life with Sting in a parallel universe.

He was a pain in the arse, no sense of humour about himself, which I've always found to be crucial, and a mean streak that manifested itself in obvious ways and not-so-obvious habits, such as only filling his petrol tank half full as the car was cheaper to run when lighter than with a full tank. Oh, God. I'm really glad you binned this fella, because that is joyless.

I mean, it might be right. I don't know whether it's right or not. But dear, dear. Anyway, I'm glad to say that my passion for sting did dim when he married trudy leading her into the chapel probably on their estate on a horse both of them bedecked in thousands of pounds worth of versace sting and trudy not the horses but i just thought the whole thing was a bit tasteless the tantric sex chat and having specially cooked organic soup flown to them by helicopter sealed their fates further whatever the truth and i'm glad to say i've moved on while still loving the police and most of sting's music not the loot quite so much she says

fee uh you can write any time with anything whatever's on on your mind, just tell us about it. Yeah, but I'm very glad that the spare turned into a don't bother at all. And if you do know about whether that petrol tank thing is real, let us know. Oh, I'm sure it is. Is it? Would that be logical? Yes, yeah, because the lighter your car, the less petrol it uses. But do you know what, the Sting and Trudy wedding, I'd forgotten that until Fee reminded us.

Yeah, I had too. It does remind me of one of the most fantastic radio moments I ever heard, which was courtesy of Sheila Fogarty, who was sent when we were at Five Live to go and cover the wedding of Madonna to Guy Ritchie, which was quite something. Now, that was over in Ireland, wasn't it? No, it's in Scotland, isn't it?

Scotland, you're right. And she was positioned, because nobody was really allowed near the church, so she was just behind a kind of barricade with lots of other press people. And the only opportunity she had across the whole day to actually do any commentary was just when Madonna and Guy Ritchie's car sped past. And she was so brilliant. She just paused and she basically went,

and I'm sorry, Sheila, if I'm paraphrasing your greatness. She basically just said, oh, two very rich people have just gone past me in a very fast car and they didn't even wave. Really? I mean, that was it. And it was just the most beautiful pause before and pause after and then some poor bugger in the studio had to pick up and tell everybody what was going on.

And those were the days. Oh, yes. When you were sent to cover events like that. Showbiz weddings. Yeah. Now, I've just found Stig Abel's nugget. Oh, yes, what is it? Would you like it?

This is from the Book of Nuggets, available now, raises money for charity, Kidney Research UK. Yeah, brilliant. And Stig is sandwiched between Dame Joanna Lumley and Debbie McGee. Well, he's done a lot better than me. So here we go.

The best piece of wisdom I ever read was by the screenwriter William Goldman. Nobody knows anything. He was talking about Hollywood, but it holds true for everywhere. It's an antidote to imposter syndrome. You should never feel down upon yourself or your abilities or your prospects because everybody is struggling. Everybody is making it up as they go along.

I've interviewed the most powerful people in the country and can tell you that they don't know much. They are as fallible as the rest of us. So if everybody is flawed, why shouldn't you succeed? If somebody has to come out on top, why shouldn't it be you? Nobody knows anything. It is reassuring when you think about it. Well, not really.

No, I rather like that. Do you? Yeah. Because it's about being on the level with everybody. If I'm being operated on by someone, I want to be reassured that they know exactly what they're doing. Well, you're the one who said at our afternoon tea you just like to wing it.

Well, that's true. But I wouldn't wing it in an operating theatre. I know, but you're not a doctor. Not yet. I'm 60 next year, and that Freedom Pass might allow me to fit in a few training sessions down at the hospital. Who knows?

Before we go, and we must, with a mention that indeed the Book Club podcast will be available tomorrow, so if you have, I was going to say put up with, if you've read Boy Swallows Universe, no, then the podcast is for you to enjoy tomorrow. I just want to say thank you to Mel for emailing about her great friend Beth. She wants us to give a shout out to her.

She's a fellow swimmer fee. She's based in the US. Beth does have things in common with Jane, though, because she is obsessed with the apocalypse. But she couldn't ever have imagined that she would be struck down with encephalitis in August. Despite the seriousness of the condition and the long road to recovery, I'm delighted to say she has never lost her sense of humour. She does enjoy your podcast. So please, could you just mention her? so Beth we're mentioning you and thank you so much for listening all the way over there in the States and get well soon

yeah and happy Christmas and a very happy Christmas to you so do you just want to give this book one last plug as it is for charity and it's got some great people in it this is your opportunity to say and you oh no I wasn't going to say that it's got some great people in it and it's called

The Book of Nuggets and it's compiled by Juliet Solomon and as Jane said perfect book just to keep handy perhaps when you pop to the smallest room in the house which is my happy place right enjoy have a lovely lovely couple of days uh and enjoy the

book club podcast tomorrow what happens if you have a really really big loo a big loo yeah so it's not as small as oh i see i think you mean actually the lavatory itself do they come in different sizes i I mean, don't be naive. They must. I don't think they do. I think we've hit upon something here. Are you a plumber? Help us out, because we've asked a couple of, I think,

quite searching questions. Do loos come in standard sizes? Yeah, and if we're all getting bigger... Yeah, then surely they must be too. And because there was a thing me jiggy out this week, wasn't there, saying that the average male is six kilograms heavier, the average female five kilograms heavier, but we're all sitting on the same pan.

Pan, yes. Right, we really better finish. What was your other question? What is it like to drive a tube train? Yes. That was it, yes, also a good question. All right, Jane O'Phee at Times.Radio. I really do think we'd better go.

You did it. Elite listener status for you for getting through another half hour or so of our whimsical ramblings. Otherwise known as the hugely successful podcast Off Air with Jane Garvey and Fee Glover. We missed the modesty class. Our Times Radio producer is Rosie Cutler, the podcast executive producer. It's a man. It's Henry Tribe. Yeah, he's an executive. Now, if you want even more, and let's face it, who wouldn't, then stick Times Radio on at three o'clock, Monday until Thursday, every week. And you can hear our take on the big news stories of the day,

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