Off Air... with Jane and Fi - Popped her prediction cherry (with Carol Kirkwood)

Episode Date: July 22, 2024

Mystic Garv is on her high horse today but can she stay on this roll? We predict not... Jane and Fi also chat Robert Dyas loyalty cards, cheese vending machines and Pointless. Plus, presenter and writer Carol Kirkwood pops in to discuss her latest novel 'Once Upon a Time in Venice'. Our next book club pick has been announced! 'Missing, Presumed' is by Susie Steiner. If you want to contact the show to ask a question and get involved in the conversation then please email us: [e-mail] us on Instagram! @janeandfiPodcast Producer: Eve SalusburyExecutive Producer: Rosie Cutler Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

We've got two Weetabix packets. Oh, I've got a lot of Weetabix. And the Shreddies and some disastrous granola. I've also got some of that really dusty granola. Where will they be eaten? They won't. settings so you can navigate it just by listening books contacts calendar double tap to open breakfast with anna from 10 to 11 and get on with your day accessibility there's more to iphone Right, are we on?

So welcome to what we hope will be a restorative and informative week here on Off Air. And our colleague Eve is back from holiday with a tip. I think we should let her tell her own tip. Do you think you'd be able to? Can you put a microphone up, please, Eve? Put your microphone up. And also because Eve's got the most beautiful voice. Yes, she has. Here is Eve's travel tip.

So my top tip for travel is on the last few days, if your Airbnb has a washing machine, do all your washing whilst you're away and then just bring back a full suitcase of clean clothes and you don't have to bother doing a wash when you get home thanks eve i think it's a wonderful tip have you ever done that no do you want sometimes i used to do it with the kids clothes because yeah wash doing the loads and loads of washing in somebody else's house is much easier isn't it it's much nicer we used to do these home swaps so you could try out other people's detergent and stuff quite like that.

Oh, yes, I like a foreign fabric conditioner. It dries much quicker in the sun. Yeah, we know that. I mean, you know. And also you've got time on holiday, haven't you? Oh, yeah. You've got time once you get back. The hours you can fill by doing the washing, which you'd be doing at home, but do it in a hotter place.

Yeah, but it is more fun, isn't it? Yeah. In Italy, was it Italy? The fabric conditioner just gets... I mean, some of the bottle, the designs on the bottle, it's so camp. They've got like winged angels and all sorts of peculiarities going on there.

But there's something about the exotic, the heady scent of a foreign fabric conditioner. Oh, yeah. They just do them better than we do. Sorry. Sorry, everybody. It's probably out of the same vat, isn't it? Yeah, they probably think our, you know,

statutory Lenore and others have a nice scent. There's a really, really lovely one in the very, very posh supermarket at the moment which smells of cedarwood. And honestly, Jane, it's really lovely. And that's fabric conditioner? Fabric conditioner and just laundry liquid I did encounter a bickering middle aged

American couple in my local boots yesterday who were arguing about what shower cream to get he didn't like coconut when he was telling her I can work to the accent but he just doesn't like coconut scented products I'm with him

well she was holding her own well I do I hope they're having a better day today products. I'm with him. Well, she was holding her own. She said, well, I do. Right, gosh. So, I hope they're having a better day today because yesterday didn't sound great. And honestly, our high street is a fabulous place to be. So, I was very sorry to hear that there was a little bit

of discord in the shower cream. Couldn't they have gone for a remarkable three-for-two offer? And then she could have her coconut, he could have his ylang-ylangang and they could remain together he had uh very short shorts but with a pocket i noticed yeah now don't you start because when you're up in yorkshire and your mind was whirring uh with the infinitesimal attractions of democracy i.e you were covering the counter which is the next thing me jiggy what's it uh you cast your

gaze out of the window the walkers coming andgy what's it uh you cast your gaze out of the window the walkers coming and you spy the way and you confess that you very much liked a man in a in a fleecy gilet with those sawn off at the knee combat trousers multi-pocketed combat this is a bit like doing a washing abroad and enjoying it more you you like the look of that short when you're out of town. In situ. Yeah, but you don't like it in your locality. Yeah, that's it.

That will be what the problem is. I didn't like it in East West Kensington. Absolutely fine in Kirby Fleetham. Okay. The location of our, can I say, and I've said it before, rather nice hotel. Look, I know no one likes to celebrate success, certainly not mine, but it is just worth noting,

and Lisa has noticed, and I'm so chuffed that you have, Lisa, that I've been right about something. Mystic Garb has finally, finally got something right. No, no, no, no, no. If I remember correctly, Jane said she didn't think it would be a Biden versus Trump presidential election. But you didn't think that. And I did.

And I said it. And there is evidence that I said it. I never get anything right. I have now. Thank you, Lisa. Is this the first time Jane Hasbury or Mystic Garb has been proved to be right? Now she's popped her prediction cherry and is on a roll. She doesn't happen to confidently believe Trump is going to decide he'd rather dedicate

100% of his time to playing golf for the next four and a half years and stand aside too, does she? Also, could she let me know what my son would like to do to mark his upcoming birthday? It would be a relief to us all. Regards to Pissing Barbara, Brian, Cool Cat, Nancy and Dora. Thank you, Lisa.

Everybody's mentioned that. I can't help you with your son's birthday, but I always think something with a bouncing facility is excellent for the young. How old is he? He's 63, her son. I don't know. As for, I don't know,

I think Donald Trump is going to, he's going to stick around, isn't he? Oh, he's so puffed up with his own self-importance. I thought his statement yesterday about Biden was so classless. He hasn't got any class at all. No, it was vindictive, nasty and, you know, punching down. And let's all bear in mind it came a week after his majestic calls for unity. So let's just remember that.

Didn't last long, did it? I tell you what, God has some strange favourites. As if you've got absolutely no stamina in all areas of your life. There's evidence, isn't there, on that front. We were both pointless answers on Pointless, Jane. Yes, it's not a compliment, that, is it? No, it's not. So Gail has emailed in to say that we were pointless answers

on the quiz show on Saturday the 20th of July because we were pointless BBC radio presenters. So that means... Well, we're not BBC radio presenters. Well, not anymore, no. But that was the category that they were asked to name people in i don't understand this at all so does that mean that we would have showed up because we wouldn't because we would only have one if nobody had named us at all oh i don't know i don't understand how it works that's

why i don't go on that didn't you go on pointless celebrities no i didn't go on point i don't understand the thing so no i went on the weakest Oh, goodbye. It didn't last very long. Was that with... Who was that with hosting? It wasn't Anne, was it? No, that was with Romesh Ranganathan. Oh. Yeah, and I think it was the 73rd show

that he'd done out of 243 that week. Was he in a good mood? You know... Was he in a good mood? As bored as the box of Shreddies that has lived on top of my fridge for four years. Look at that. Enlivened. But do hang on to those Shreddies.

I've got emergency cereal. I always think just in case that we'll finally have a house guest who likes whatever it is, usually shredded wheat. We've got two Weet-A-Bix packets. Oh, I've got a lot of shreddies and some disastrous granola i've also got some of that really dusty granola where will they be i'm actually i need to do a really sensible audit on my store cupboard of provisions because there's some right old shite in there there really is is, including the dodgy granola. The granola I bought on a whim because, frankly,

the packaging was quite alluring. It does. And it had the word luxury. Yep, it calls you in with its juicy raisins. And then there's two juicy raisins and just an awful lot of kind of crumb shavings from the granola factory carpet. Yeah.

Right, do you have another one what rosie says i'm 27 i feel you two are my long wished for wise aunties imparting your wit and wisdom i grew up in a very small family is as my mom is estranged from much of her family she grew up in children's care homes around manchester back in the 60s and 70s nobody really talks about what it's like to be a second generation child in care that is not to say i am in any way owning that identify identity but i have noticed the difference with my friends upbringings as i cannot have the same conversations about grandparents and relatives as they can and rosie i really want to thank you for

emailing in about this because this is something i could literally never thought about but i'm sure it is a real issue because so many of us i know i do drop in casual references to grandparents to wider family uh to the very important and close relationships i was able to have with them and and if you are rosie um you're not able to do that and it must be it must be irritating and perhaps more than that when other people do do it um she goes on to say a lot of my mum's upbringing is taboo but she has mentioned some snippets such as running away from the care home being separated from her two older sisters grim dinners and not being allowed hugs from the staff she also said the dumping ground in Tracy Beaker

seemed idyllic in comparison, but I found the books and the TV series comforting as a child, as I'd never heard anybody else talking about growing up in care. That was Jacqueline Wilson, wasn't it? Yeah. I'd be really interested to hear from other listeners whose parents are care-experienced. The stats are somewhat

stacked against us children as it's more likely that we'll also end up in care and even continue the cycle with our own children right um she does go on to say that she works for a charity supporting children and young people some of whom have been in care i do sometimes question why i've decided to do something so close to home both in terms of my mum's experience and my own sense of what home represented for me in childhood. Rosie thank you really thoughtful email and I wonder whether anybody else will have something to say about that someone else who has grown up with a parent's experience of care. Yeah it would be interesting wouldn't it because also there just must be so many triggers is an overused term, but markers throughout your life that you can't share with anybody else.

And then Cissé and Ashley John-Baptiste both have incredibly interesting things to say about how you're feeling as you grow older after a childhood spent in care and there is an assumption isn't there that if you get on your feet somewhere in life then you've kind of um you know the arc has been okay in the end that you're you've succeeded in adult life against all odds we like that story don't we well that's the only one we hear, really. It is. Well, no, I don't know whether it is. I mean, the other story is that your childhood in care

cast such a huge shadow... Well, we don't hear from those people. ...over your adult life, you know, that... Well, actually, we do have, because we've just had Rosie's really interesting email. So, yeah, I'm contradicting myself there. But underneath that arc, you know, underneath that lid of I've made a success in my adult life

must lie so many things that perhaps people who've had that experience feel uncomfortable bringing to the table. Maybe, you know, people just don't want to listen enough because they want to believe that story of hope over adversity and kind of leave it at that. Yeah, because the rest is too painful and we'd rather not go there. Yeah. Actually, just thinking slightly tangentially.

Tangentially. Yeah, I think you were better. You did order. Yeah. You ordered J.D. Vance's book, didn't you? Yes, I'm about 70 pages in. Oh, you're right. And I've ordered one now.

I've just given up and ordered one. And I watched the Netflix version of his life as well. Oh, I see. I can't watch that because it's been so panned. I want to read his own words. Yes, I think it really was panned. Oh, okay. Well, I tell you what, it was only about an hour and 40 minutes. Yeah. So I didn't feel I was giving up too much of my life. And Glenn Close is astonishing as his grandma. And I was going to say to people,

if they, you know, if you've got Netflix and you don't really want to read the book or you haven't got the time, you could watch this in chunks and it gives you an idea I mean I'm sure it's a slightly sanitised, glossified J.D. Vance approved version of his life but I thought the young lad who played him as a boy was astonishing The book's good, I'm enjoying reading it and especially because we have a luxury over here, don't we of thinking, well, what a terribly difficult problem lies in the heartland of America with its opioid addictions

and the Rust Belt and poverty. There's a sheen of something about it as well for us, isn't there? Because we've seen it dramatised and fictionalised. Well, I don't know what the book... And heroes walk out of it. But it's a very, very well-written, thoughtful book so far. Well, it's highly intelligent. The only thing I take away from the film, and this is the film,

so I need to be honest, my own ignorance, I haven't read the book, is that the property, the properties that the family were living in, by British standards, looked rather large. So I'm not sure whether that was just the film or whether... I mean, they were detached, relatively substantial houses. So, yes, they certainly were detached, relatively substantial houses. So, yes, they certainly lived. I mean, there was abuse of one sort or another, drug problems. But the houses, just from watching the Netflix version,

the houses were things that you would aspire to in the UK, definitely. But isn't that just about space? I mean, maybe exactly that. So I'm really at the edge of my property knowledge here, but building materials as well, because the clapboard houses of American suburbs, we simply don't have. The picket fence type.

Yeah, and literally made of wood. We don't have that kind of building i think we're really as you may be able to gather now there are some things we do know about sturdy bin bags is one this may not be but you out there you will know more yeah so let us know sometimes i'm just i'm taken back to you know university i mean let's just put it way back in our youth, when you're just, somebody had bought a really, really cheap bottle of spirits. You were attempting to all have a conversation after a very cheap bottle of spirits. It's that level.

It's that level, Jane. It's dangerous. I'll never forget the night when the son of a Tory MP said to me, the thing about the Middle East is it's like a big brown nut. And I thought, is it though? I mean, I don't think I'd had enough. I haven't imbibed enough. No, no. Okay. Happy days.

What was he alluding to? I think you may. I'm not suggesting he'd taken substances that might lead you in, you know, it's astonishing, isn't it, that he happened to know a Conservative MP. Good Lord. Good Lord. Maybe he'd had my peach schnapps. It's an unwise drink, and I just put it out there. Very unwise drink. Is there ever a good time to have a peach schnapps?

Answer no. Nope, nope, nope. Graduation and sad mothers. This one comes in from Diana. Thank you for all your great work in dodgy geography. Yeah, we're never going to be able to forget that, are we? Dungeness. We're still getting these emails. Dungeness is nowhere

near Southwold, says a woman who can't be named because she and her husband were having a bit of afternoon delight when they heard a noise outside the bedroom window and had to do a quick dive under the bed because the window cleaner was out there. Thank you, Anonymous. Back with Diana. Regarding how Jane felt at her daughter's graduation It's very different if you live in a rural village

My son graduated in Canterbury Cathedral in Classics What a guy, Diana Wonderful What a guy And I was astonished What a fantastic place as well Yeah, I know it is Is that where you graduated?

It is, yes Seriously, that must have been Although I'm thinking, have I been there? Well Because there was a murder there once i can't answer that question for you jane have you it's huge absolutely huge i think it's got the longest nave uh or the widest nave it's something to do with a nave uh cascio Ishiguro was doing our degree ceremony. Oh, that's quite impressive. Yeah, it was. Yeah, I like his stuff.

I was astonished by some mothers' behaviour, says Diana. When a student got a first, the congregation clapped. Several mothers stood up as their child was applauded to identify themselves. Sorry, is this recently? Yeah, and show how proud they were, which seems bizarre. For me, sitting there, I was overwhelmingly sad as I knew my son would soon be leaving home

and everything would be different for me forever. On that day, he had no plans. Later that month, the rest of the family were abroad on a holiday that he had chosen not to join. During that week, he was offered a job in London, sublet a spare room in a horrid flat, put his bed linen in a bin bag, his really hear you on that. And it must be so painful to feel that void.

I mean, especially, I mean, possibly your son didn't mean to do any of that in a way that suggested, see, you know, don't want to stay and enjoy the sentiment. Perhaps it was easier for him to do it that way. Yes. But I really, I feel the sadness in your email and also the absolutely daft kids who stood up when they're children. If it's them, it's not about them. And actually, there's somebody who's been really annoying me on the socials

for turning their child's graduation into something about them because they've got an honorary degree as well. It's just like, no, stop it. Just stop it. It is absolutely your kid's moment. Don't do it. Just sit there and clap. As I think back for you,

I shouldn't have worn that bikini. Just trying to imagine what happened. It was freezing. No. It was lovely. I just wanted to mention, actually, we have had a lovely email from Mia. I hope you're well, Mia. Mia is actually the Newcastle University Catholic chaplain. And I know you've emailed before, Mia, and I was very grateful to you when you last emailed, so thank you. She says that they are really hectic,

these weeks at universities where they're doing the graduations. There are actually five graduation ceremonies each day at Newcastle. 9.30, 11.30, 1.30, 3.30 and 5.30. I actually was at your daughter's graduation, says Mia. I was also, get this, in the academic procession for Lord Ed Vasey's honorary degree. Wowzers. Our colleague is much decorated.

Although the ceremonies can become a little tedious after doing so many, this summer I was at 14, says Mia. I love to see the smiles on the graduates and the often broader ones on the families. They are lovely and joyous events. And I always encourage families to get their one glass of bubbly and a cupcake. As for many, it's cost them thousands of pounds. Mia, thank you very much. That's lovely. And she had a great, my daughter had a fabulous time at Newcastle.

A tough start because I think a lot of people coming out of COVID to uni found it challenging. And in fact, a really brilliant young man made a speech at that graduation just to say he was a language student. So it was his fourth year and he started in the pandemic at uni and just said how tough that had been. And I think a lot of people in the room were suddenly reminded of that because, you know, I keep saying this, but we've sort of forgotten about the pandemic and the impact, particularly on young people. So I was really glad you mentioned that. about the pandemic and the impact, particularly on young people. So I was really glad you mentioned that.

Anyway, congratulations to everybody who's been at a lovely, lovely graduation ceremony over this last couple of weeks. I do think on that COVID point that we are about to be reminded, aren't we, because the inquiry is finally reporting. And so we've heard Baroness Hallett's report on one of the modules of the inquiry. I think there are still three or four more to come. I think there are eight more. There are eight more to come.

It's astonishing. But the next report isn't until sometime in 2025. But do you remember when the inquiry was opened, there was a lot of criticism. Why is ours going to take so long? Because other countries, especially neighbouring countries, had managed to do their inquiry and therefore their report and their findings within about a year.

And ours was knocked into the long grass. But if it turns out that it reminds us in a time where maybe we're concentrating more, we might be able to affect change more, we might be able to put better practice in more. Is that a good thing? Well, if it happens, great. But already too many people, I think, are saying,

I've had enough, I'm not interested in hearing any more about this. You see, I'm more interested in hearing about it now than I would have been if it had been immediate. Because when it was immediate, I would have wanted to just go, right, accelerator on, let's leave that in the rear view mirror, it's too painful, can't concentrate. And also, we do have a change of government now. Yeah, but as actually Baroness Hallett said, there's going to be another one.

And we live in a world that is better connected than ever before. And so we are likely to have another one, possibly in the next decade. Cheerful thought. And hopefully, because our inquiry is so very, very, very, very detailed, different systems will be put in place. Were you impacted by the IT outage? Was it violent? No, it didn't touch me at all.

So I listened to an awful lot of media who were just distraught. Just distraught. I don't think they had anything to work with, darling. Sky News went down. I don't know how on earth. It's the first time that Kay Burley's managed to have a kip in about 25 years. Yes. Well, how did the nation cope without her?

I don't know. We got through. Her workload is just exhausting. Every time I see her, I just think, I really, I hope sometimes you do just put your feet up in some tracky bottoms and eat a Snickers bar. Were you impacted by the outage? Thank you for asking. No.

Although it did make me think, not for the first time, about this crazed over-reliance on technology, which is clearly ungovernable and pretty much unreliable. And the whole world grinding to a halt, or a chunk of the world, it doesn't seem, this can't be allowed to keep on happening. So I carry cash. Yes, we know you carry cash. But the problem is that nobody will be able to get their electronic shutters up

on their shop in order to take your cash. Well, I just stick the cash. What would I do with it? Well, nobody will be there. They don't want your cash. In fact, most shops now don't want your cash. Well, I'd eat it then. At least I wouldn't starve. Okay. Well, come round,

because I've got that box of seven-year-old shreddies. So if you can manage the walk from East West Kensington to Dalston. Final one from me. Meanwhile in peaceful Switzerland. This one comes from Claire, whose sign-off is all the best slash kind regards slash best wishes slash love slash cheers.

Having heard about vending machines in America, I thought you'd like to see what Swiss vending machines sell. I cannot get to Switzerland fast enough. It's a cheese vending machine, Jane. Now, they're no slackers either. No. It's not like it's just got, you know, a couple of compartments. It is a full, swivelling round.

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. It's got nine shelves, nine layers. I think four different sections of cheese. Does the machine smell? I don't know. It's hard to tell from the email. But I'm sure it's all vacuum packed. I mean, when you go past the, you know, when you go past the cheese counter in your local supermarket, it doesn't smell. Not unless you've got the freshly slicing one.

Sometimes the supermarket smells. I always get very nervous when they make an announcement about, can the store cleaner come to aisle six? Someone's been sick. Do not go near that aisle under any circumstances. Did you do that, Eve? Weren't you Aunt Tannoy? You'd make the call.

Did you have a special code word for vomit? You never encountered vomit? Mostly just smashed glasses, smashed bottles. Mostly smashed glasses, smashed bottles? Oh, thank God you came here. So much more civilised. Thank you. Sorry.

I have actually, I've knocked a jar of pickle over in a supermarket. I bet you have. Must have been so annoying. Light pickle or cornishaw. I'm very new to cornishaw. Jane and Fee, I have searched far and wide for super strong

and decent sized black bin liners and beasts. Oh bugger, I'm sorry, I forgot them again. Yeah. Hang on,

I'm going to write it on my hand. Yeah, and beasts are the best. Even my handyman and the guy who came to sort my garden have asked me

what brand they are and where to get them. The answer is simple. Sainsbury's and Robert Dyer's. They also do indoor white ones which are just as strong from Jane.

Thank you, Jane. Lovely. I tell you what, it's almost worth an independent trip to Robert Dyer's. I've got a loyalty card at Robert Dyer's.

I went yesterday. Actually, I thought of you because I went yesterday to get my SodaStream replacement canisters. Actually, I thought of you because I went yesterday to get my SodaStream replacement canisters. Oh, did you? Yes, I did. Excellent. Yes, and it does make such a difference, doesn't it,

as you hand them over and then you get some money off your new ones. I like it. It makes me feel good about the world. It does. It's a satisfying clank as you lurch along the high road with your canisters. I make friends wherever I go. Calendar, double tap to open. Breakfast with Anna from 10 to 11. And get on with your day. Accessibility. There's more to iPhone. Carol Kirkwood can turn her hand to many things.

She knows all about the weather. She's tripped the light fantastic on Strictly. And she has just published her latest novel. I think it's your fourth, isn't it? Yes. This one is set in Venice with its beautiful soft light, lapping waters and romantic, but sometimes dark heart. It is called Once Upon a Time in Venice. And actually, it does start with quite a dark scene. I was slightly taken by surprise because there's a meeting on a cliff that might not end well for one of the participants. I'm glad you were taken by surprise, V, because I don't want my boots to be predictable. And this one isn't. It will take you on a journey to coin that well-used phrase.

And let me tell you a wee bit about it, actually. So picture Venice, first of all. Venice is a beautiful fairy tale city. You think of romance. You think of canals winding down into hidden shadows, maybe whispered forbidden secrets behind masks. Now, the main character in my book is called Gina Bellini. She's a hugely successful hotel concierge. She's well respected, she's well loved, she will do anything to please her guests no matter how bizarre the request may be. But she's running away from something and if her secret is revealed it could ruin her. Now one of her guests is a world famous opera singer. She's a real diva in every sense of the word. She will stop at nothing to get what she wants. And amidst all of this, there's a movie, a Hollywood blockbuster being filmed in Venice.

But someone connected with that isn't all that they seem. So is their past going to catch up with them? And if it does, will it destroy her? So three very strong women in this book. I know, Jane. I know. A tortuous plot. Torturous. I'm in. Just how demanding have you ever been as a hotel guest?

Not too demanding, actually. But, you know, it's so nice. Do you ever get, I get so angry if I can't open the window. That's the way, I just go berserk if I can't open a hotel window. Well, yes, that's a good point. Thank you. But I would stick on the air con at the same time and be happy. But I do like a balcony, I have to say, Jane.

Yes, yeah. Very nice to sit there and watch the world go by. It is. That's another good thing, though, about writing fiction, because you just observe everybody around you, what they look like, how they sound, what they wear, and you give these real people a character. So it might be, looking at Jane,

their lovely green and white top, lovely hairdo. You might be a secret spy. Oh, yes. Well, I can't talk about it, unfortunately, can I, Sue? But funnily enough, quite often she does. Spy. Oh, yes. Well, I can't talk about it, unfortunately, can I, Sue? But funnily enough, quite often she does. So Jane would be the most hopeless keeper of secrets, actually, but... So Jane, you're not my book, then. No, I've often thought that Jane's actually been in witness protection

for the last 30 years, just in that very canny, quite kind of British comedic way, where she's in witness protection as a well-known public person so really nobody can get a true identity yes yeah love it there's a good plot fee well also because some of the anecdotes that come around again and it's always lovely to welcome an old friend they can we talk about Carol's book, please? From Character Assassination. They do get rather embellished. Is it really rather lovely to be able to sit down also

and write a book with very strong female characters who ultimately do take control of their own destiny and what life has thrown at them? Yes, because a lot of my female characters haven't started off with a privileged lifestyle. They make it in their own right. And to see them come good, but it's not an easy journey for any of them.

They go through twists and turns, be it romance, be it work, be it their past coming back to catch them. So that kind of thing. It's very liberating to do that. And what is so liberating is creating characters so they come from the figments of my imagination basically and you can take them anywhere you want they can be anything that you want them to be they become your friends if you've ever read a book that you've

thoroughly thoroughly enjoyed you don't want it to end but you want to get to the end to see what happens. And then when it finishes, you feel really sad. You've left your characters, your friends behind, and they become very real to you. And I very rarely continue to do a trilogy, for example. I tend to leave most of my characters behind. They may get passing mention in another book, but that's all. But do you find yourself ever thinking about them and just thinking, you know, I wonder what might happen to that person I created and, you know, Villa Ramore? Yes, I do to an extent, but by the time I've finished that book,

I'm well into the next one. So already I'm well into my fifth book. So I have to keep going back and reading the previous book to talk to you girls, for example. Well, it's always a pleasure to see you here. We've got so many other things we would like to talk about as well as the book, if that's okay. But before we leave a discussion about Venice,

we should talk about Venice. Did you go there to write the book in situ? No, I'd been to Venice on many occasions before. It's one of my favourite cities. It's beautiful. It's magical. It's romantic. I mean, Casanova lived there, for goodness sake. And things like Harry's Bar. I love the glamour of it. I love

the Cipriani Hotel. I've never stayed there, but I visited it and had a glass of wine on the poop deck, which was really nice. I just love that. And I can imagine what it looks like. I know what it smells like. It's really busy with lots of tourists there at different times of year. Perhaps a little bit quieter in the winter, but it still is quite busy. But it's fabulous. I love Venice. So it was an easy choice to write about. Do you think that we should carry on to going to places where some of the people who still live there don't want us to come? I think that's a still live there don't want us to come? I think that's a shame that they don't want us to come because tourism is a large part of what goes on in Venice. And, you know, a lot of the society is funded by tourism, be it you might be

a waiter, you might be a hotelier, you could be anything. And if tourists stop coming, then that will affect them and their industries so I think that would be a real shame plus there's a lot of culture there's a lot of art in Venice that is wonderful to see and it would be a shame to miss out on that as well. Obviously global warming affects tourism hugely and is going to really affect Venice one day and actually the fantastic writer Donna Leon who was on our programme about a year ago sets all of her novels in Venice. She truly believes that Venice just won't exist in 30, 40 years time because that rise in seawater will affect the buildings so much there's no way that

you'll be able to raise them at all. When we talk about the weather, do you sometimes find it frustrating that we are still quite stuck in an old fashioned way of regarding something like the English summer? We're constantly comparing it to a previous experience and not really recognising what's happening. It's really changing. I mean, in July 2022, with the highest temperature ever recorded in the UK. That was 40.3 Celsius in Coningsby in Lincolnshire. Never before in the UK have we had a temperature over 40 degrees. Now, the previous highest temperature before that was only a couple of years before, and that was in the high 30s. So things are changing, and with climate change, we will be seeing higher temperatures more frequently than we are at the moment.

Our climate is absolutely warming up. I remember when I was learning about meteorology many years ago and my lecturer saying at the time, in 50 years time, the climate that is in the south of France will have moved up to the south of England and here we'll be growing vines and making wine well that's already happening you know that was about 27 years ago but when someone like yourself is presenting us with the weather which is always just a deeply kind of um we're watching it for selfish reasons you know I don't if I'm going to be honest I sometimes don't really care what's happening in Dundee I'm looking for the weather in London you know and how it's going to affect how I travel to work and all that kind of stuff.

And do you think we need to just stop doing that? So when you're giving us a weather report, you should tell us what the temperature is in Doha. You should tell us what's happening around the world so we stop being so myopic about it, actually. That's a really good point, Fi. We are, like yourselves yourselves constrained by time so we may have one and a half minutes or two minutes to deliver the weather and most people research shows want

to know exactly what you've said. Do I need to take a coat? Do I need to take an umbrella? Is it going to be cold or wet? Because we are thinking about ourselves. So if we did another feature somewhere else in the programme about how climate change is affecting the rest of the world, as we do on BBC World, then, you know, we're laughing. We've got time to do that, or a little bit more time. We do things like this online as well, where you can see articles and, you know, videos and chats

about what is happening globally. But on television and radio, we really are restricted by the amount of time and we go with what the audience want, which is what's happening on their doorsteps. I think it's too easy to switch off from the conversations about climate change as well. And maybe sometimes I just need someone to go,

literally just point and go, that's hot, to stop complaining about last night. That is hot. We do need to ask you about Strictly as well because you appeared on Strictly and we could do this in a quickfire round because nearly everybody who has passed through the doors of Time's Towers...

One of our ambitions is to interview someone who's never been on Strictly. It's not happened, has it? It's genuinely not happened in the last three weeks. When were you on? 2015. Who did you dance with? The lovely Pasha Kovalev.. When were you on? 2015. Who did you dance with?

The lovely Pasha Kovalev. Did you have any problems? None. Did you know of any other contestants who might not be having the same glorious time that you were having? No. Are you surprised at the revelations that have come out of Strictly more recently? Yes, and really disappointed as well.

And they're doing the right thing, investigating all these claims. And do you think that the show will continue? Yes, and really disappointed as well. And they're doing the right thing, investigating all these claims. And do you think that the show will continue? Yes, I do. But I wonder whether, I'm a bit of a fan. I mean, if I'm in on a Saturday night and it's on, I'll watch it. Will I watch it in quite the same way, Carol, is the question I'm now asking myself.

What about you? Since I've been on Strictly, i haven't watched it religiously anyway because you know too much i know too much i know what they're going through with the nerves i'm talking about here when you come down the stairs as the program opens obviously you're waiting behind the stairs to go up them that is nerve-wracking you're looking for the nearest fire escape to get out of there because you're consumed by nerves um so i haven't watched it for a long time but i'm sure a lot of people will be thinking just what you've said jane you know when you look at it differently what are things going on behind the scenes but they're they're introducing chaperones i believe

but it's a tricky one isn't it because once you're watching something whilst thinking oh i wonder whether something else has happened are they being entirely authentic what if what if I mean that's a whole jingle jangle in your head isn't it yeah it's really good that they are looking into that when I talk about my experiences I loved it I found the Saturday evening absolutely nerve-wracking but the experience especially the training with Pasha was my my favourite bit. He was so patient, so kind. I would say, I can't do this, and he'd say, tomorrow you'll be able to.

So he was lovely to me, so I've got absolutely no complaints whatsoever. I'll never forget it, and I don't regret doing it. Did you think you could win it? No! Did you not watch? Well, thank you for your honesty. It's always lovely to see you, Carol. You really brighten up our studio. Although the summer's been rubbish and I'm Damien Carroll.

We're playing Carol. Carol Kirkwood, and it was lovely to see her again. The book's out now. Does it make me want to go to Venice, I wonder? Why am I asking you that? I don't me want to go to Venice, I wonder? I don't think... Why am I asking you that? I don't think you should go to Venice. I don't think anybody should go to Venice unless you personally get an invitation from a Venetian.

I think maybe stop going to Venice. Laura has written in, and a couple of people have mentioned this, you're just about to get the credits on the podcast and they've changed. Oh, yeah, that's right. Yep. And Laura says, you used to reference henry tribe as a man and your former executive producer in a slightly withering way in the end credits of the podcast i'm going to assume he's moved upwards and onwards because i hope that he deserves to

and laura he he has so henry tribe is now the managing editor of times radio he just he just passed by we were lucky we were lucky to have him when we could. So he's become the managing editor, which means that he's not doing the kind of hands-on stuff on the podcast anymore, but he's still very much here. And Jane and I are very fond of the Henry tribe. And Laura has asked

if she can know more about the promotions of Rosie Cutler and Eve Salisbury to encourage other women in media careers. Is this written by a friend of yours? Is it your mum, Eve? Or just encourage women in general to apply for and then redefine the execution of jobs that have just not been traditionally done by women. So I'm only joking, Laura, because you're a teacher. And Laura says, I've often told my students that 80% of teachers are women, but 70% of school leaders are men.

Gosh, that's a terrible statistic, really, isn't it? So we need to rethink what a head teacher looks like if we are to achieve equality. And we will talk more, actually, about jobs in the media and how to get on in the media. And we will ask Eve along the way because her experience is very valuable and very telling and we really like working with her too so enjoy the new credits I think there's no better way to sign off today than with

this from Carol she writes regarding sign offs and says her favourite one is the one apparently used by Seamus Heaney and it cannot really be bettered, it was may you be dead and gone to heaven a fortnight before the devil finds out. Quite. And we'll see you tomorrow.

Joan and Fee at Times.Radio. Congratulations. You've staggered somehow to the end of another Off Air with Jane and Fee. Thank you. If you'd like to hear us do this live, and we do do it live every day, Monday to Thursday, 2 till 4 on Times Radio. The jeopardy is off the scale. And if you listen to this, you'll understand exactly why that's the case. So you can get the radio online on DAB or on the free Times Radio app. Off Air is produced by Eve Salisbury and the executive producer is Rosie Cutler. voiceover describes what's happening on your iphone screen voiceover on settings so you can navigate it just by listening books contacts, contacts, calendar, double tap to open. Breakfast with Anna

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