Off Menu with Ed Gamble and James Acaster - Jacqueline Novak

Episode Date: September 9, 2026

US stand-up, Netflix star and Emmy-nominee Jacqueline Novak dines in the Dream Restaurant this week. Pizza or bread, Jacqueline Novak, pizza or bread?TW: there is some chat about body image. Jacqueline Novak’s special ‘Get On Your Knees’ is on Netflix. Watch it now.For Jacqueline’s latest shows and tour dates, keep an eye on her website www.jokesnovak.comFollow Jacqueline on Instagram @jacnovListen to Jacqueline’s podcast ‘POOG’ with Kate Bertlant: https://poog.kit.com/Watch the video version of this episode on the Off Menu YouTube.Off Menu is now on YouTube: @offmenupodcastFollow Off Menu on Instagram and TikTok: @offmenuofficial.And go to our website www.offmenupodcast.co.uk for a list of restaurants recommended on the show.Off Menu is a comedy podcast hosted by Ed Gamble and James Acaster.Produced, recorded and edited by Ben Williams for Plosive.Video production by Ben Williams and Megan McCarthy for Plosive.Artwork by Paul Gilbey (photography and design). Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the off-menu podcast, taking the slightly inflated bag of plain snacks, bursting it open and inhaling the flavour dust of content. That's a gamble. My name is James A. Castor. Together we own a dream restaurant. Every single week, we invite a guest to us the favourite ever start, a make-old dessert, side dish, and drink. Not in that order. And this week, our guest is Jacqueline Novak. Brilliant comedian, James, Jacqueline Novak, over from the US of A. Oh, exciting. And you can watch Jacqueline's... Comedy special, Get On Your Knees on Netflix.

Yes, you can't, and Jacqueline is very funny indeed, but if she says an ingredient that we have pre-agreed upon, a secret ingredient, no less, we will remove her from the restaurant. It won't be get on your knees, it'll be get out of town. Yeah. That's how I have to say it, so she understands. And this week, the secret ingredient is knees. Get on your knees.

So if she picks, like, chicken knees or something. Yeah. Chicken knees, pork knees, anything like that. Yeah. Then out. Yeah. I guess if she chooses some legs, we've got to just inquire. Yeah, and their knees.

What bit? What bit? If you're the whole leg. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are there knees on it? Yeah. If yes, out. Out. You want knees, do you?

See you later. See you later. But hopefully that won't happen. Get out of here. As fast as your knees can carry you. The old English saying, Jacqueline won't be familiar with that. Yeah, she won't be familiar with it.

Which says to a mover. But, yeah, we will say that if it needs to be. I'm on tour at gambled.combe. Fresh Hell is the name of the show. Would love you to come. But enough of all that. Let's get on with this episode with the brilliant Jacqueline Novak. Welcome, Jacqueline, to the dream restaurant.

Welcome, Jackie and Novak to the dream restaurant, but it's funny you for some time. Thank you. Thank you. I'm so glad to be here. How are you enjoying our country? Let's see. I'm jet-lagged. I've been on a weird schedule. I haven't been to a proper restaurant. I've only been ordering past midnight. Oh, wow. And it's not, you know, I mean, everywhere.

Stuff is less. Even, like, New York, I feel like is less. Stuff's not as... It's not the good stuff past midnight. It's not what it once was. It's not the fantasy of all night. No. So I've been getting a lot of falafel.

Okay, that's not a bad option for past midnight. Yeah. Flossil, hummus. Not the... I don't know. Now I'm just doing my meal from the other night, but sort of relevant, I think. Midnight. It's a new section to the podcast.

Midnight snack. Midnight snack. Do you believe in a midnight snack? I always feel like midnight meal. Oh, yeah. Right? Like, what are we doing kind of? Like, let's get into it and do a proper.

To it properly. If we're going to eat. Midnight feast. Yes. That was the thing, wasn't it? Yes. And I was obsessed when I was a kid. Oh, man.

I was obsessed with midnight feast. I wanted to have a midnight feast so much. Wait, is that a term? That was a thing. Now, here? Yeah. I didn't realize it was, it was specifically. I didn't know.

I didn't know it was just here. It really sounds like a medieval British thing, isn't it? Yeah, medieval-faced. Medieval, midnight-faced. Candles. Yeah. I guess they would have to eat by candlelight anyway at night. Yeah, chicken leg, that sort of stuff.

And here you guys eat by candlelight always. We do. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Wet stony walls. Yeah. Ghosts. We chuck the bones on a big pile in the corner. Yeah.

There's a skinny dog that licks the bones. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's what you should be doing. Yeah. I do get a lot of things when I don't know if it's, which will, I'm planning on utilizes. using the lamp for options even.

I mean, if I'm allowed, I guess that's the question. You're allowed. It's your dream. I like to over-order massively. Like, that's probably my core, particularly with dining with other people. That's your one requirement is, you don't care what it is, just too much of it. Yes, fair minimum. Quantity, if nothing else, because, and if you're dining with other people, you just don't,

well, it depends on who you're, like who you feel safe to dine. with, you know, like people that don't order enough are a huge problem for me, like, even for themselves, because then they come for your food, you know? Yeah. Or they are like sort of, you know, prim about, I don't know. They, they, just like, I'm very, I'm a hungry, I'm a voracious woman. Spiritually, physically. Yeah, it's safety with the people you're eating with is important, I think.

Yeah. Like, we have a lot of meals together, me and James. Yeah. And we know that we're overordering. Yes. And that's going to happen. And there's like the judging eyes of maybe the waiter or something being like you're ordering too much. But you've got each other.

You're like, I don't think we do over-order because we eat it all. No, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but it's too much food. Yeah, it's too much food. Yeah, it's too much for other people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I went to Italy once. And so I'd say that because it's like adds an extra level.

Like I'm there for, well, actually, I stayed quite a while. It doesn't matter. Point is I remember just like doing the ordering at the, and looking at the waiter and like trying to get a sense and whatever. He was like, got to a point. point where I was like, do you think I should order something else? He was like, it's enough. Like, he just, he just, he gave me, he slapped his hand, you know, and I was like, because I also feel like you can't always trust them. Like, a lot of times they'll do this thing to me where it's like, you know, that's a lot of food. And I'm like, I should hope so, for one. You know, they're like,

you better be hungry. It's like, that's why I came here. I'm at a restaurant. I'm at a restaurant. Obviously, I'm hungry. And like, even if I wasn't, you know, I like to take something home. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So. And also, I'm paying for the food. I'm not going to give you back one of the dishes and say, I was too hungry. I know. I wasn't hungry enough for that. Give me my money back.

Has anyone been like, that was too big? Why did you let me order? I mean, I bet they have, but that's crazy. Yeah, there will be people who have done. There's always, right. They were just like, you shouldn't have let me order all that food. You knew how big it was. Why did you do that?

What did you let me order all that? I'm not going to pay for that, all that food. That's unreasonable. You can't make me pay for that. And it's like, well, you can take it home and feed people. Yeah. Do you, okay, wait, when people go out with you guys, like, what is it like? You know, like him knowing, like, are they just like, what do they expect kind of, I don't know, do you feel comfortable?

Like, or I guess it depends on the person. Yeah. Are they trying to show off? No, I mean, no one's showing off for us, are they? No, no one's showing off for us. Everyone feels comfortable. There's no intimidation. Right.

I mean, it's either, we're going out for meals with people who've known us for ages anyway. And if they haven't, they either, I don't know, the people who do know more about food than us will probably go, right, I want to take you to this place. Yeah. I'll order for us this stuff, you know, because they enjoy showing the boys who love food, you know. Do you have any restrictions that just so frustrating that, like I have a nut allergy since childhood? and it's like, it's not who I am to have a restriction, you know what I mean, on the food. And so it's like, I feel like people think you're doing it on purpose. It's very weird.

And then I've recently gone plant-based, which I thought about the gene lamp today. I was like, well, I'm going to assume I'm going to be free, right? I'm going to assume that somehow, if I'm saying a pizza, it's some vegan cheese that's not made of nuts that is somehow miraculous. I don't know. I've got to make it all work in my fantasy. In the dream restaurant, all your restrictions are either catered for or they don't exist for the course of this meal. Wouldn't be sick if I was just like, because like there's no joy in a pistachia for me because any time I've ever accidentally tasted, even that, it's immediate, like, living hell, right? So there's no, like, I would love.

Yeah. Although I do like when they should like, when there would be like pistachio ice cream and it was green. Yeah. And like, or I'd think it was mint and want to get, should you talk about ice cream? I want to talk about all the food. I'm going meta because I just have questions and I'm like... We can talk about ice cream. Yeah.

But we shouldn't... Just trying to think. What are your favorites? Favorite ice creams? Yeah, yeah, let's see. I mean, this is so many. I've talked about ice cream so much on the podcast and I still haven't covered all the ice creams that I like. Yeah.

You had to have one right now. And I mean, like, in this situation, any flavor is coming in. I'm playing your own game on you. I've shouted it out before, but I haven't had it in a very long time, and it was so, so good is the marmalade on toast ice cream that I had. This is probably in like 2015 now or something. Are there ribbons of marmalade in it? I think so, but mainly is like the, so I've had it twice,

and one was at a friend's house and they made it, and they had toasted breadcrumbs and then stirred that into the ice cream. So that's kind of in there, the toast flavor. And my head, obviously. Oh my God. And was just insane. And then is the ice cream itself, is that flavor, what's the flavor of the ice cream itself? Do you know what I mean?

Oh, yeah. I guess it's like a vanilla. Okay, so right. Or a milk, you know, it's like a pretty plain ice cream. Because I can recreate this is my point. Yeah, I think. Because I can even go, I can do a vegan vanilla or something. Yeah, you could do it.

I'll stop talking about the plant basis. I know it's joyless. I'll leave it out now. You just know. No, it's good. There's a lot of listeners who listen to this who have a plant-based diet. And they don't feel represented on this podcast at most episodes

when we're just talking about, you know, eating things raw and killing things and whatever. Well, I was, I was, this is fairly recent. So I still identify with all eaters. Yeah. Get on your knees.

Yes. Should we talk about it? Please. Yeah. I'm very excited. It's come to Netflix. It's a show that, um,

heard loads about before it came to Netflix. Which is always irritating, right? Like, doubting. Aren't you just like, but like when you hear like, when you hear that something, I don't know. Hype is like the worst.

Oh, but yeah, I bet. You're like, I'm happy for people. I like it. I like it with, weirdly, I thought, hype, I like with stand-up comedians and comedy shows because it's more word of mouth and the people that I can believe it because it's more of a comedian saying, you got to see, Jack the Novak show. Yeah. And like, and so like, that is usually quite an exciting thing.

And I like when someone, a show has a moment, you know, in the comedy, like, and becomes, and just is part of that. you know, history of comedy. That was when everyone was talking about that show and that was important. And when you hear it from other comics as well, you're like, and you know that the comic's done loads of stuff before and they've been

working at it for ages and then there's this one moment where it's all come together perfectly. It's nice. It's nice for people. It's not like, no, it's good. You're like, oh, she's been out of a while. That really does help. Yeah, yeah.

She's been ignored for years. Were you ignored for years? Well, I mean, yeah. I mean, you know, you're always scraping little bits at a time. You know what I mean? But yeah, it was kind of just like everyone, I don't know, New York, like, I mean, the industry is like such a vague concept, but the vague feeling of like they've seen me

around forever. There's no new excitement. So it felt like I had to just do something like really intense and hardcore and, like, big and I don't know, just to try to be like, I'm doing it. And so, you know, that was, I like, there's something I do, I do enjoy a kind of, like, triumph. Like, I like kind of being, you know, like I like kind of bringing, yeah, it's classic, like, comedian stuff, right? But it's like, kind of can't, like, kind of love being, like, digging yourself out of a hole. Can't, like, help but pull yourself into one and then, like, try to get out.

And it's kind of like, more satisfying than going out there, like, they're like, they're going to love this. And then doing that, like, I can't. The second thing, like, no, it's going to work. I'm, like, bored of it. So, you know. Did you have those with those early shows when you knew like, I mean, for the listener, this and the, I won't know what the show's about. Yeah. Do you want to explain it before we go into questions about it?

I think it's better you explain it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I'd love to hear. Yeah, it's like kind of a blowjob and three acts kind of thing. Like, or like three blow jobs across. I don't know. It's basically my evolving thinking about, and I say like the blow job versus like,

Well jobs because it's kind of abstract and it's very, like I would try to sell it. I would like put these billboards up like these digital billboards I buy online like 2 a.m. for Minneapolis or something. I was just like, you know, like I was just the same gearhead like doing all myself, whatever. But I was like it's a highbrow, you know, the most highbrow show about blowjobs, you know, you'll see or whatever, like stuff like that. But it's kind of like cerebral. And I did it, a version of it at Edinburgh. and they were like, I say it in the show, but someone from, like, I don't know, The Times or something, while praising someone else's show managed to, like, sneak in a dig at mine.

And they were like, they were like, she talked, versus Jacqueline Novak who talks about blowjobs to the point of tedium. And, like, so I mentioned it at the top of my show. Such a good quote, though. I know. I know. I'm like, thank you. And I like it. And I like telling people about it because it is kind of the vibe.

Like, it is kind of like. I'm going to talk about this and I'm going to keep talking about it to a point where it is absolutely not like there's almost nothing sexy about the show, you know, like it's just like not salacious anymore because once you're 40 minutes in

Yeah, exactly. People are, yeah, they're over the fact it's about blowjohners. I was like, tell them it's 85 and it was like 92. You know, it's like a no interval. At what point in the writing process were you like, this whole show is going to be about blow jobs? No, it's interesting. I sort of knew, that was sort of the idea was, because I had this essay I wrote in college, like in a creative nonfiction class, you know, similar vibe, almost like, almost like, I don't know, like young kind of writer like, like, yeah, like, yeah, I'm going to talk about it, you know, like, but I'm going to be sort of poetic about it and like, oh, it's just a vibe. It was really college vibe. And so in which I sort of traced this, like, oh, the first time I heard about the blowjob when I was like 13 and my initial thoughts of like, what, you know?

you're talking about. And then later, you know, this like anxiety about how I would as this overthinker approach something like that and kind of like this quest to to triumph over the fear of it and then and then triumphing and then like suddenly going the other way and being like, oh God, like, you know, like feeling me like I then try to argue back for my like like basically being ashamed of having triumphed for it, you know, and then whatever. It's like just long mental quest. And so, yeah, it was kind of, it was the blowjob from the beginning. I was just like, that's what this is. All in. Yeah, that's what this is. And then there's other things that come along the way. It's just like, I was like, it's a good organizing principle for me. It's,

it's like, it's like a rich enough concept. It's like, it's almost like it bothers me. It's like, it's like this kind of thing I like would stew on like, it's like, it's like so weird. Like, what the fuck is the blowjob? You know what I mean? Like, it's just a weird thing. It like, you can analyze it forever, kind of. So is, is that a sort of framework that, that you're carrying through to your, because you're here doing work in progress, right, for your next show. And very work in progress. Like,

it's not like, you know, here's a bumpy script that I'm kind of like working my way through and tweaking, which is a fantasy that I imagine, like, I don't know, other acts do or something. I'm just like,

it's so much more chaotic and I'm doing different things each night. Yeah. I am kind of trying to figure out, you know, if there is something. Because it's like, at the same time, it almost feels weird for there to be,

like, this topic that's like, okay, so this one, like if there's too narrow a topic, it almost feels like, okay, so last time was the blowjob. This time is the blah, blah, blah, right? It almost can't be like, I don't want it to be something you can, like, slot in as this time you're approaching.

So, I don't know, I might have to, not sure what form exactly it's going to take. There's a lot of ghost stuff right now. Of course, yeah. Yeah, which is, I planted a little bit of ghost material in the last show, in part to make it so no one would be shocked when I started talking about ghosts like a lot later. they wouldn't be like this is a departure I'd be like actually see minute five

I talk about a ghost giving a ghost giving a book Yeah not even No In that first Ghostbusters film Dan Akwood gets a blowed off Of course Floats up right

Yeah And then Yeah that is how that goes right It's like I think so He's in bed He's lying there Yeah

The covers go Incredible movie I mean Right Like there's just nothing Oh it's good Yeah There's nothing like that

Yeah But that That bit Yeah Phosen Empire We were start with still a sparkling water. Jack? Did you have a preference? I know I was thinking about it. I think it is, it's still, but when I want to kind of feel special, I get sparkling. So I'm going,

let's start with a still. Okay. So you don't want to feel special yet. No, because here's the thing. If a big meal is coming, I'm like, I don't want those bubbles mostly filling me. Yeah. You feel more full after the bubbles? So let's start with the still, and later I'll bother you for sparkling. You're not bothering. You're not bothering us. Yeah. It's no bother. It's no bother. Yeah, I like to, okay, so we'll say still. We'll say still.

Yeah, start with still. Build your way up to the sparking. Exactly. And do you live in, do you live in New York? Is that where you live? Los Angeles now. Ah, so you don't, so I was going to ask a question about the tap water. Well, that's the thing is, um, there is a little bit of luxury to ordering still, flat, whatever, in a bottle.

Mm-hmm. When you know that the tap is sufficient. That's where it's almost like in New York. you're like, oh, bottled still, what? Like, it's just, I feel like there's a point of pride in New York just being like, tap's fine. Like, these people are fools. Like, they don't realize the tap is primo.

It's funny to me that the New York tap water's supposed to be so good. Yeah, because you didn't find it that way. No, no, not necessarily. But it's just like, you go to New York and my first thought wouldn't be, I bet the tap water's good here. My first thought would be, I'm not fucking drinking the tap water in this, don't you see? Yeah, like, is it so obvious, but like, do you experience New York? as dirty when you're walking around.

No, just like big metropolis, like cities, like, yeah, it doesn't feel like the sort of squeaky, clean tap water city, do you know what I mean? I think it's... It's... It's time of year as well. Does it? In the summer, off around New York, you smell the hot trash. I was like, I thought, well, yeah, I used to be like,

let's refrigerate it, like the worst, the least eco thing ever. Yeah. You need refrigerators on the street, keeping our trash from spoiling. I was like, I think I'd run for mayor on that. That's a great idea. Because that is, that is, trash is, hot trash is tough.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you want still water, bottled tap? Oh, right, sorry, got all over the place. Bottled, let's do bottled, but it depends. What kind of you want? What's a dream? You know what I've been into recently? I've been enjoying Aquapana.

The color of the bottle I find very pleasing. The peach, I mean, it's clear, but, you know, then the peach and the, it's like, the bottle is such a huge part of it when you're... It feels very fancy that one, isn't it? It feels like you're like in a, White Lotus property or something. Like Voss or something is a little, like, too modern.

That feels too L.A. to me as well. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. You want something with a bit of history to it. Yeah, shape. Yeah, yeah. Like the old days where they're trying to get us to drink the water because it was like shaped like a woman's hips or whatever.

Yeah. The Coca-Balanderson. Yeah. We've talked about that on this podcast before. The PAMI, the PAMI. Was it Pepsi? Was it literally based on her? Yeah.

They released a version of it called the PAMI. Yeah. Well, you've seen like, because recently she's been making a lot of headlines because she's been just going very natural and it's stunning and we're all just like very excited about it because... I don't know how you put the new Pami in a bottle formation. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But they should try. Yeah, they should try.

Yeah, they should try. Shout out. I mean, we should all really, I mean, maybe one day in the future, who knows what technology will happen, but we'll all be given bottles in the shape of our own body. I know. They want it. Yeah. They want it. It's like, no, like, you know, like everything.

Because don't you feel like there's so much where they're like, don't worry, like, it's about you now. And it's like, you're like, I don't want that. You know, like they're like, you can make, it could be your face on the doll, you know? And it's like, I mean, like the American girl dolls, you know, like, I don't, I'm like, are they global? I don't know. But they have a, it was a catalog in like, you know, the 90s. And then now it's like huge store at Times Square. But it was like, they had these like historical dolls and they had characters and books that went along with them.

And then suddenly it was like, you know. know, factory of choose the hair and, you know, and it was like sort of like options again, option fatigue. I don't want my face on a doll. I'd like your face on a doll. Yeah. Yeah, but no, but we're saying that the companies want your own, yeah, friends faces. Yeah.

The body is pretty disturbing because I once did this thing. I don't know if you ever had the pleasure of doing this, but they sent it. It was like, whatever, it doesn't matter, but it's a suit you put on. And it uses your camera to basically, like, create a model of your body. Right. And I guess the idea was like sizing. Like you could send this to someone and they could create your perfect genes. But then the fitness community took it up and they're like, you know, they're like, oh, a centimeter's come off my waist and, you know, oh, my ass, I've grown it and like whatever, you know, it's lifted.

But there's something about seeing faceless, like you just as a prism of a shape. Yeah. It's pretty haunting. You know what you mean? Like almost no matter like what, you know what? You know what I mean? But you're just like, there's a lot of... Yeah. Yeah, because there's like bits of your body that you don't ever see from an angle, right?

And then when you, for some reason, there's a mirror in a weird place, you're like, the fuck, that's what people have been seeing the whole time. It's shocking. Yeah. It's shocking. And then just like, there's no clothes, there's no expression. Like, you almost feel like, I feel like in life you're sort of constantly contextual, or believe you're contextualizing yourself, right?

Like, you know, you're leaning in with a certain... You've got an idea of... You're doing something. with your body, just stock still. I mean, how do you find that when you're like watching stuff back to edit? Because I've just, I've literally just had to watch my special back to edit. No, no, no, no. And I'm like, is that how I walk around?

Do I walk around? I mean, the posture stuff, like right now, the posture stuff is insane. Yeah. Like, it's like creating a serious crisis. I was like, wow. Like, I was just like, okay, so that's, that's interesting. Also, you know how you kind of think, you kind of know internally, like you have a model. of what faces you're making.

Just like faces you make all the time. You kind of just assume, look a certain way. And then I feel like if you're watching back footage, you're like, whoa, like did not know that that was that face. Yeah. I know what it feels like to make that face because I know that moment in the show or whatever. Yeah. And that is not what I think I'm doing.

I've had that so much. And especially like I'll be on the stage doing something. I must have done the show like a hundred times. And there's like a bit where, you know, I think I'm really selling something. and I'm doing a great face to sell the bit. And then I watch you back and I'm doing nothing. There's zero. Nothing.

This is why, like, okay, photo shoots, like, not that I've done a million, okay, but there's this like purest idea, it seems like, where you're really not supposed to have a mirror around, okay? They're like, it's very much like the photographer and you are engaged in a conversation, right? You know, and they're capturing you. But I go, I'm so afraid of making like some ridiculous face that I almost go so neutral that I'm doing literally nothing and it's like the same photo

over and over again. If I actually have a mirror, I do more because I'm like I could see that I'm doing nothing so then I adjust. So I'm starting to just be like if I'd get photographed like I need a huge mirror

right in front of me like a teenage girl like posing. It's the only way. Poplums or bread! Popolum's or bread! Wait, what's the first thing you're saying? Poplums or bread.

What is that? Pablo's over bread. Pablo's O'Obris? Pablo's O'Bet. Okay. well, the second thing is bread. Yeah, the second thing is bread. I almost always choose bread over almost anything else.

But truly, what is this word you're saying? Papa Dom's. And what is that? Pizza? No. You understand why I'd think that, right? Because Papa John's and Domino's pizza. So I was like, Papa John's.

Poppa John's is clearly. Papa Domes is the British. And Papa John's. Yeah. I mean, has that not come up on the, I genuinely don't know that has gone. Even from an American? They all come up.

All the Americans get confused at this bit, but in different ways. Yeah. And that's the first time we've had, is it, a pizza? Yeah. I can't believe it's not a pizza. Papa Dombs. But will you, do you tell us ever the Americans or no? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's okay if you don't. If you're having an Indian meal, they'll bring out these round, very crispy things, which are Popper Dom's. Oh, wait. But it's not non. It's not none. It's very, like, thin. Does it have air in the center? No, because they're so thin.

They're just like big crisps basically. It's a single, embarrassing. But wait, I mean, for me, but are they called that in an Indian restaurant in America even? Yeah, yeah, surely, yeah. Are you sure? Well, I don't know. Or Pappard as well. Papad, yeah.

So like, it depends. Okay, I'm going to check on this. Are you worried that the Americans would be confused because of the pizza thing? No, I'm worried, I'm going, this is embarrassing. This is like I've never been in it. What have I never eaten Indian? food. Although I actually had to seriously pull back because so many of the dishes

begin with nuts. It's like, you know, almost like olive oil in Italian food or something. Like where even if they're like, yeah, it was like I would go, it would be like, this dish doesn't have nuts and then instant allergic reaction. Yeah. It's devastating. What sort of reaction

do you get, is it? Oh, it's like mouth and throat, it's never closed where I can't breathe, but you're always right on the edge of that, like wondering is this the time? Yes. And then so it's just like the itchy, you know, unpleasant sensation and then just like, you know, violent vomiting. Cool. It sucks.

It's the worst. And I love to go out to eat and these dramatic exits, you know, from the restaurant. One place in it is amazing. One place in Los Angeles, basically, not just for me, but they basically pulled cashews off the menu because I was going there like nightly. I mean, I was spending a lot of money at this place. And I had like two reactions. and I don't know, less people have, whatever. They started subbing in other ways to make a cheese.

I get hooked on something. So you had an allergic reaction once and then you were back the next night? Absolutely. Okay. We need to make a good change around here. I did try to investigate what was going on, you know, figure it out, me and the manager. I was like, I had my ideas about what it was. I was like, well, both times.

Meeting with the manager. Yeah, yeah. We talked. Well, then she was, I mean, this was customer service. She was like, okay, when I order in, because I also order in from them, it's like, you have to call also. I will do a double kind of roam through the kitchen, really make sure we're not missing around. I was starting to think, I should just get them a set of my own pots. Because that was an issue, okay?

It should be my own pots. I mean, I'm there enough. Like, when you, when you, like, I don't know if you have any spots that you, like, I just get on something. And if I liked it yesterday, I want to repeat it. Like, I'm just like, hey, remember how great yesterday was? Should we do it again? And then that goes until, I don't know, I become absolutely sick of it or something. Yeah.

But I don't always. I mean... I like the idea of you're having your own pots in a restaurant. I know. It's cool, right? It's cool, right? It's cool, right? Where the regulars have their own bottle of whiskey with their name on a label attached to it behind the bar, and it's only their whiskey.

Oh, my God. So if you had a kitchen in a restaurant where it was just your pans... Jacqueline's Pans. But I love a restaurant. Kept going. I want to be in a restaurant. Yeah, I risk it again and again. Do you want to shout that place out because you go there so often?

Crossroads. Crossroads. It's vegan. It's vegan. So that's how I am. So there's going to be loads of nuts flying around there. Exactly. Yeah.

But because that's part of it and then there's so many people in that allergies, they're kind of like expanding or doing some of the nuts that have less people, I guess less people are allergic to almonds. I'm not allergic to almonds. So like the almond feta. They got to expand, right? They can't keep knocking things off the menu. So they're already vegan and now they're taking cashies off.

Every time someone gets allergic to something, otherwise it's just going to be an imaginary restaurant. What are they? Well, I have, of course, fantasized about the truly nut-free restaurant. Yeah. And it's like, I know that other people have other allergies, but we should get restaurant for them too. Yeah. L.A. is very, in theory, food restriction conscious between the diets and the, you know what I mean, between it all. but people still want a restaurant experience

they still be in community here's my fear though like let's just say we did it right nut free restaurant okay all those people we go there I feel like like someone would sort of like bomb the place with nuts you know like there's that thing in people

that just use something and wants to destroy it you're all so vulnerable in there once that because everyone knows your weakness right yeah yeah yeah sneaking a nut bomb you just need to yeah or just throw a cashew in like a grenade. Yes, it's like the terrorism would be so easy.

Yeah. So you just, yeah, what do you do? So you're saying bread. Bread? Yeah, yeah. Last night I ate I'm staying in this apartment where like kind of like a service department thing connected to a hotel. So they put a few like snacks in there for you and I just like

ate them all like it was like, she's like ate plain bread like lying on my back watching TV, watching adolescence for the second time. You're familiar? I was like, time to watch it again. What a laugh you had yesterday. How much fun? Eating plain bread watching the saddest TV show available. I know, I know. Is that Stephen Graham?

It's phenomenal. It's so good. Oh, good. So you've seen it, yeah. Oh, God. You're familiar with Stephen Graham. Yeah. It's, yeah, yeah.

So I was like eating the bread. I was like, you know, because this is another pleasure I get when the food, when the food is sort of not good or not right. Like, in theory, plain bread, unless we're fragrant, hot, whatever. It's not ideal, right? In theory, I'd want something with it. But the limitation of, like, all I had is late, all I have is this bread, we're just going to eat it. It makes it like you're starving and you just found a loaf of bread.

And so, you know, like the toughing it version, that's actually my view. I talk about this sometime. I talk about food a lot when I'm not, like, not in my last show, but maybe in this one. We'll see. Hungry Ghost or something. I don't know. Some theme about that. But I talk a lot about, like, these food fantasies that are kind of like,

roughing it. There's something, that kind of restaurant, okay, where you're like brought in or you're like put in a room and you never know, like sometimes they,

they hold you for three hours. Yeah. And then, you like drop a loaf in the center, but not quite enough. And everyone has to fight over it. Like, I don't know,

like just like, where they hide it. Well, I'm fantasizing. Like, to keep things interesting. Like, not fighting,

just the people you're with, okay? Like, you're in a room. A loaf of bread comes in. There's like, the sounds of, rainstorm and you're like

oh god I get sometimes I the little food fantasy for me is like it's medieval times and I'm like and I get given I'm working in like a field this is exactly a roll a lump of cheese and then like a

jug of ale this is exactly it yeah yeah and it's like nothing's ever tastes it's so good yeah yeah yeah just incredible and you're so thankful yeah yeah yeah and my hands are dirty but I don't care this is it's precisely that And it's like kind of this.

Well, do you get any pleasure from like secret eating? Like, you know, like kind of like, I don't even know. Yeah, my favorite restaurant is like hiding in a shed, you know? Stolen food. Yeah, yeah, stolen food. Can you imagine? This is your dream meal. We can put you in a shed by yourself.

I know. I'm realizing. Yeah. I know. It's like it's so much easier to. Yeah. It's like, it doesn't matter. Yeah, bread.

But dropped in maybe a little ruin. and the path of it got like rained on. It's been on the floor, you have to fight for it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Have you killed anyone for it or is anyone dead? No, no. You know, I don't think I want to fight anyone for it.

That's too stressful. Because I already, I experienced that. No, exactly. Yeah, exactly. You're in charge of splitting it. Well, lame is food is, yeah. Is that part of it. I'd love to go to Tenardier's pub.

Yeah. Where the food is, where it's like stews are made of something questionable, but times are tough. Yeah. Your dream starter? Only one. Because to me, like, a salad is its own thing that I do like, right? But then I am lured by a soup.

Okay. Like, it's hard to resist. It's hard to resist a soup because also it goes down easy, so I feel like you're not too full for whatever's coming next. I'm trying to think I like a personal. It's very on, like, what you've been talking about so far, soup is very much. in that kind of world, isn't it? Freezing, you're wearing fingerless gloves. Yeah, it's very...

Oliver, like, please, sir, can I have some more? It's like my restaurant, you know? It's like... Yeah. Begging. Wooden spoon. Or, like, even, like, the spoon is too small. It's one...

Like, too small or too big, right? You are the first person on the podcast who's themed their menu around lack of availability. Or comfort or... Yeah. I know. It's like, yeah, suddenly it's all coming alive for me because I was, like, trying to imagine this perfect meal or something,

and then it was too, like, stressful. but a beautiful soup with a drizzle of something. You know, still. I want a soup. I kind of want some kind of salad. And then I was just thinking like, but I also like something that's a dip experience. Like,

very happy to get a, I mean a guacamole. I'm very happy to get some warm chips. I know we are very bread on the table, but we don't have to worry about appetite. We'll assume I'm endlessly hungry. Yeah, yeah. You're endlessly hungry.

Yeah. I mean, judging by the way, you're talking, endlessly hungry because you've been in the wilderness for a week. Yeah, yeah. Yes, exactly. Yeah.

I've been in the long way. Should I go more specific? Like, I think I want the soup to be a sort of creamy soup. You can go even more specific than that. Oh, you know what I love an oyster cracker? Is that what they call them here still? Now, are they the little, they come in little bags. Yes.

Yeah. But they're like a little circle, kind of, but they puff out, like what I thought the other thing was, but isn't, okay? And it's like, it's as if they hold cracker style air inside them. Do I'm saying? It's like they hold special air. They serve them with chowder quite a lot. Yes. Yes.

It's like one time I get to have them. And so it's like you bite into them and there's a little pop of air that has been living inside of a cracker. And in my mind is completely impenetrable. Yeah. Flavored air. Yeah. That's good. Yeah.

So you like some oyster crackers. Yeah. What sort of? What's like the finest thing? But also I'm letting go of, I mean, because it's like it would be easier if it would like, okay, we're at a table. Italian. What are you doing? Or rat, whatever, right? It's like to put together this meal of all these different things. It's not how I'd want it. It's like I wouldn't want the guacamole and the chowder. Yeah. But you can give me everything, so it's too hard. But you can put restrictions on yourself

if you want. You can say it's going to be, it's going to, it's an Italian meal. Oh, I'd have to come back. Next, we can do Mexican then. Yeah, sure. And the next we can do this is an issue. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Should we do Italian? No, no, I want to fly free. I want to fly free. Fly free? Oh, something tomato based. But a minute ago, you were complaining about having to fly free, Jacqueline. I know. I'm a contradiction. So what you're leading towards? I think I'll stick with some kind of like bisque.

Maybe it's because I'm here that I'm craving for a bisque. It's the first time we've heard the word bisque. I don't. It's really about what I'm feeling today, right? Right now, a bisque. Maybe it's because I had all that plain bread last night and yearning to dip it in something. Yeah, you just want any lay away through it. I'm craving a, it's like almost a little rainy. I don't know.

I think London's doing it to me. Yeah. I'm not like screaming about bisks at home. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. Like, are they a thing here? Like a chowder.

Yeah, like a chowder or like a lobster, a lobster bisque. Yeah. I mean, which is like notably heavy. Famously not vegan as well. I know, I know, but, you know. What flavor would you like this? They'll find our way. I don't mind a lobster bisque.

Yeah. I guess now I'm kind of putting together like a steak. This is like a steak meal, setting aside the steak. But like, oh, you know what I love? So I was saying tomato-based, basically anything tomato, I'm interested, right? Salsa. You know, any tomato sauce in an Italian setting. When they have an incredible, like, tomato and they would thickly sliced.

I feel like I haven't had a good tomato in a long time. But like, like, I'm just like a fantasy from childhood. Like at a steak restaurant, it would be like the big, the big slice tomato and just the salt and pepper on the tomato. Oh, yeah. Good tomatoes, hard to find. Got some heritage tomatoes at home in the fridge. I want to go and get home and eat them tonight. and chop them up in some olive oil and some salt.

You're crazy, man. You're crazy. I'm crazy. Yeah, something bread, something tomato. I like a wedge salad. Again, this is a very rich, there's a very rich meal. How do you feel out of wedge?

I don't think it's a rich meal. Well, if I do bisque, and then blue cheese-based, I haven't decided you're doing biscuit. I was trying to move on to the next phase without the true decision. You know what I mean? So, do you want to do a bisque?

Lobster bisque? This is getting really rich. I don't know. Well, it's not, we haven't even started. So far, you've had still water. You've got my still water. You've got still water. You've had some plain bread that you have to find over.

Here's an idea. Here's an idea. Here's an idea. I need an appetizer. Okay, a starter. Yeah. Okay. I need a starter.

I need a salad and I need a soup. That'll help me. I'm getting all those things. Okay. Right? Yeah. Okay. So I'm thinking like the salad, I want something, I think I want something light and sort of like

Ruggula kind of, do you even call it that here? Rocket. Yeah, rocket. That's so cool. Yeah, I love that. It's like shocking. I think a roguler sounds cool. Really? Rocket?

Hello? I mean, rocket. That's way cooler. I forgot you were five. Oh, I'll just go to space on this arugula. Let's rocket again? I'm always like, what's rocket? You know, I'm like, and then you hear for a couple weeks and you're like, I'll have the rocket.

But anyway, yeah, so something like tangy, kind of vinegary, kind of that kind of thing going. And like a soup, it can be small. You're even holding your hands out. out like Oliver. I know. Yeah. Yeah. I know, I know.

Because I'm traveling. I feel like there's also that, you know, I'm roaming. I'm a nomad. I have that feeling very much of like, like, please. Yeah, yeah. Like, you're ready for Tenardier to welcome me and like, and rip me off. Yeah. And then, okay.

So we've got soup in the salads. Yeah, I know. Lovely. So what, have we settled on the soup? It's the lobster bisque Sounds weird to me now Every time you hear lobster bisque Okay how about a cream of like

How about a puread kind of pumpkin-y That kind of soup Pumpkin soup? Yeah That sounds ridiculous when you say it Tomato What about a ever so slightly creamy tomato Okay lovely

That'll do Yeah Maybe I'm imagining like Kind of like a giant cruton That's like not crassly square Like not crassly a cube Kind of rough You know

Like that style Almost pulled apart Hand-torn, hand-torn, crouton. Hand-torn. Yeah, exactly, little olive-oil drizzle. Yeah, yeah. I think you want rustic. I think you're in a rustic mood.

I mean, yeah, this is not the time for, like, you know, a tower of, of tuna. You know what I'm talking about, where it's like a totem pole of tuna. Yeah, yeah, it's not tower of tuna. I mean, I don't mind those. No, no, I'm not doing the tower of tuna. I don't mind those, but, yeah, I don't, yeah, rustic, full, full plates. Yeah. Not a bunch of porcelain staring at me.

Yeah. Coldly. Maybe almost like tin plates. Oh. I don't know if I've really experienced that. There's metal plates. Yeah, metal plates. Yeah, I kind of see it.

I'm like, it's meeting a tavern. I'm thinking tavern or like the prison in late this time. Are you sober? Are you sober? Well, that's fantastic. Yeah, yeah. The wench kind of experience. Yeah, yeah.

But do you not include a cocktail for any reason? Are you sober? Well, we do, no, we do the dream drink later on. Okay. It's just coming later. Yeah, yeah. I like it on an empty stomach. What can I say?

If you want to kick off with a cocktail. Yeah, you can have it whenever you want. I think it's just like a maybe like a spicy sort of tequila type of drink. A spicy margarita? I mean, yeah, but I want it to be your restaurant to be your own take on that, you know? Like a fruit I'm not expecting. Okay. You know, like, well, we've got these very strange peaches.

This is getting a little precious, I know, but that we're like. Like very strange peaches. They're very small and they're very tart. It'd be something we've stolen from an orchid or something. Yeah. We've got chaste. Yeah, yeah. They're in a little sack.

You pull them out and only because of like glory, like you see like my excitement about the cocktail. You're like, she's got something special. We're going to tell her about the tiny peaches. Yeah. This, I wonder if they're out there. Like, did you think there's a tiny tart peach in the world? Probably. And then imagining it was like a margarita kind of thing.

Yeah. Yeah. But with a tiny tart peach. shaving it into there. So there's little threads of the actual, like, skin. Yeah. We have a little... We have a little...

This little... A kid who nicks them for us and comes around the back of the restaurant. And you give him... An urchin. Yeah, a little urchin. I love a street urchin. Oh, the peach boy's here! Yeah.

I love the peach boy. And then you give him a little... You give him like some scraps. Yeah, he loves scraps. Yeah. He eats shits. He eats shit loads of the peaches as well. He can... He got on his scran.

Yeah. A scrann. Some food? He got on his scran for old peaches? It's not a specific one. No. We give him one coin as well. Flip it to it.

He loves it. Yeah, yeah. I would love to be that little boy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That would be so great. But they make good margaritas, those tiny little peaches. Oh, yeah, yeah. You have that.

But I think I wanted in a, this is different. I wanted in a coop glass, not in a rock's glass. You know what I'm talking about, right? Mm-hmm. I love to drink a cocktail out of that. You want a glass that is, what the triangle is, what the triangle is, shape or the other... I like the rounder one.

The round one. Yeah, I get what you mean. Like you might have a gimlet in. Yes. I think so. Or champagne in, in Revolutionary France. Uh, where apparently, you know this. You know who you're talking to.

The glass was modeled on the shape of Mary Antoinette's breast. Wait. Are you serious now? Yes. Okay, I thought you were just like making a gag about. No, no, no. Apparently the glass was modeled on the shape of Marianne's breast. Yeah.

Listen. If you want to be on a podcast where the hosts know what glasses and bottles were modelled on different women's breasts, you came to the right one. The original pat-me bottle. This is a good. I'm going to start saying if I go to a fancy place where I feel like they know that kind of stuff. I'm going to go like, I'm going to be like, I hear that that's Tommy Lee Jones's shoulder. I said Tommy Lee, which sounds like I'm sorry.

I didn't. I literally meant Tommy Lee Jones's his shoulder. Also, if I want value for money and it's a Tommy Lee Jones body part, Tommy Lee Jones Sorry, I'm getting Tommy Lee Yeah But I meant Tommy Lee Jones

He's not bizarrely He visually came to mind It wasn't the name That got me there Anyway, but I'm going to be wrong And I'm always going to make it

Men's bodies Yeah Tommy Lee Jones And he'd be like That's Washington's Yeah That's Ben Franklin's ear And then I won't let them

Tell me otherwise Yeah Exactly Yeah you should You should say something Okay so wait We've got a simple tomato kind of thing going.

Yeah, cream of tomato, so with a big hand-pulled crout in it. We've got a rocket salad. And we've got the small tart peach margarita spicy in... It doesn't have to all come together. People understand, right? Sure. It doesn't have... No, I mean, like, you know, I wouldn't put this on someone else.

This would be my first... Okay, I come to the dream restaurant, right? I make all these mistakes. Yeah, yeah. Like I'm right now where I go like, and a peach margarita. Oh, but I love Mexican food. Oh, but... Right?

Yeah. Yeah. And then I go, okay, I go, I need to come back. And I need to come back several times. And, I mean, I'm just pitching myself for the podcast again. Sure. I guess. But what do you do the second time you come to this restaurant?

Serious question. What would you mean? Like, I would probably come in. I would probably force myself to choose a pathway. I mean, currently I would say, best way to play it, force yourself to choose a pathway the first time. No. Hell, hell, hell. It would be inauthentic. It'd be deeply inauthentic.

So all I'm saying is I know that this meal doesn't come together for someone else and I wouldn't serve it that way, but I want to go through each moment on its own, almost like that's the only thing I'm getting to eat. So I'm just explaining that I know that it, you know, I'm not standing by the menu for anyone else, but it's just what I want right now if I'm calling for things. So I go, yeah, let's get. Yeah, I'll have rocket salad. Actually, I'm over that now. I want the wedge again. I think now then, if that's what's going to happen and that's how we're working it,

I think the moment you order something, it's on the menu. It's on the menu and we can't go back. No, great, great. Hey, you guys, this is your restaurant. Yeah. So. It's on you. It's on you.

So what have you got so far? No, we don't need to recap every time. We've recapped about four or five times. Genius. Okay. I think we move on now. You guys are looking at each other like, like, this has never happened. Well, I guess three main course then.

Yeah. Impossible. All right. Why don't we do? I'll have a pasta tonight. That comforts me. This is what I have to do in a regular restaurant. I'm having anxiety, and I go, I can come back.

This isn't my last meal. Yeah, that's important to remember. And so, all right, all right, I'm letting go of everything. We're doing a rocket salad just to get things going. Yeah, we don't need to recap. We're doing a little soup. No, I'm changing it up a little bit. I'm trying to give it some order.

No, no soup, now it's become Italian. All right, we've got the bread. The soup's in the kitchen, then the soup's coming out. All right, it's the soup's out on the way, but I think I still want a pasta. I want a tangy pasta, a lot of tomato sauce. This is my classic. Extra sauce. I don't want it, you know, even if the chef thinks it's crass, load me up, right?

Do you want an extra jug of sauce on the side that you can keep? I mean, I'll take it if they're offering. Yeah, yeah. We are. Like, you know, when they, like, I would order in and I have to be like, I would get these like zucchini sticks, these like fried, like, whatever, and they come a little marinera, but it was never enough. And I would have to be like, how many will you give me?

How many are you comfortable giving me? Because it was like, you would get like two dips. Yeah, yeah. It's not, it's not. And then they started giving me the really, so let's say like a pasta. I'm thinking like almost like a Bucatini, like an Amatriciana kind of thing. Like that's what the capers and the, right? On the olives. That kind of pasta.

Putanesca? Oh, no, maybe I am thinking of Putanesca. Wait, what's Amatrishiana? Oh, Amatricea. Similar, I think. Similar, but it's got the meat maybe in it. Yeah. Like it's got a sausage.

Oh, I love that. I love all that. Yeah. Salty. Vegan anchovies. vegan anchovy. Somebody's working on it. They just did vegan caviar.

I'm a genie. I can make for all these things that, like, they never were alive. Yes. It's just food. Yes. Straight away. My stomach growls.

And look, your hands are moving saying, you know. Antovies feel like the sort of thing that vegan should be able to eat, right? Let's not debate that. I mean, it's just because it's really your taste. Some vegans are eating oysters, right? Completely not.

Oh, I see what you're saying. They're so small and they're not, they're thick. Well, it's not necessarily for the moral. I cute. I mean, like, It's more a health thing related to whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, like, going down this pathway,

reading these books, deciding this is the way. But then ultimately, very happy. It's nice to be able to be like, you know, not have the animal thing, haunting the meal. Sure, but I don't you mean about the thick anchovy. Yeah, they're barely animals. I was wondering, I was thinking about vegetables earlier, like, you know, what's going on in there?

Like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Don't go down that past, Jacqueline. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Next time you come into the, dream restaurant. All I can have is a rock. I eat tiny stones. Then you think, oh, they're so tiny, those little guys.

No one thinks they're the saddest ones of all because no one even thinks they have consciousness. So your main course is the pasta dish. It's a pasta. It's a delicious pasta. There's still bread on the table that I'm dipping. Of course. At the end. Yeah, yeah.

So your dream side dish then to go with that. Yeah, what's going with it? Do you want to recap on what you've had so far? I mean, it's boring, but I, it's boring, but I, it's boring. You're all over the place. Well, my favorite side dish in life, arguably, is a French fry, but that's not happening here. I know it wouldn't be good with the pasta and I know that, okay? No.

But, so when I'm having pasta, I kind of like just a cruel vegetable on the side, you know? Cruel. Yeah, like just like a spinach, you know? Like, just like, yeah. Like, not even greased up. Like, I kind of just, like, kind of want. Almost like a punishment vegetable. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, just kind of offsetting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Bring back the rustic nature. Yeah. We still have, you know, there's something to move between, like, okay, the pasta's like, it's like so tasty. And then you go over and you have kind of like a punch of that,

like a little punch in the mouth of the spinach. Is it wilted? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Creamed? No. Not when I've got the other creams going on. It's too nice.

It's got to be like clear the palate almost to come back to the warm comfort. You just want iron. You want to feel like you're eating vitamins. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, pasta, pasta. I mean, come on.

At the end of the day, you got to admit a bowl of pasta. I mean, does it... It's good stuff. It is. Yeah. But I'm also so off of my, like, protein world. You don't have to get us to admit that you... That my meal is perfect.

But we're having a real issue. I know that our job here is to make you go, yeah, that's the right decision. Don't worry about it. Yeah. You've realized what I crave? Because when we move on to the next week's next one, you always roll back to the previous one and go hold on a second. I do?

I said pasta. Yeah. So when on main course, you were like, so hold on, the soup and the salad. No, right. And maybe I shouldn't have the soup. And we had to move you on to the pasta. No, you always have to move me on. I'll never move on.

And then we moved on to the side dish and you went, pasta. Yes. No, no, right, right, right. Because it's a narrative. Yeah. Yes. And me it tells us to wait, I have to break in with one idea. Yes.

Which is, I don't know if this has ever come up for you, okay? I'm going to say almost certainly not Okay, so my friend who, like this is a million years ago but she told me she would dine it all over the world all these amazing places and she was like, go to a really nice place what you want to do

and you got to make, it's got to be a nice place where it's irritating, okay? You go, they ask you want it, you go, build me a meal. Build me a meal. Like basically you let them, because they know, if you don't have any restrictions or if there's anything, you know,

they know the best. stuff. It's like, and it's not like, tell me what you like, and then you sit there and decide and go, oh, is it like this? It's just like, I trust you. I'm hungry. I trust you. Can you imagine the freedom, the relief? And then knowing you've chosen right. This is how Robert De Niro lives his life. Right. Robert De Niro just goes from restaurant to restaurant and just says, I have what's good. Wait, are you serious? I never heard this about him. He just says, I have what's good. Have what's good. And then they just bring in what's good. Oh my God. I bet they do. And I bet they over, serve.

Well, it depends. Unfortunately, he did take that approach when he was on this podcast and it sort of ruined the format. So I did less than that. I mean, I did more than that. You did more than that. You've gone the other way.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I've gone, right. I've over-ordered someone today. Anti-Denero. You're the anti-Denero right now. Your dream drink then. So we've had a cocktail. You've had the small peach.

Oh, you mean like pairing with a meal? Yeah. I'm a pig. I never yearn for like wine during the meal. I'm always like, bring me back to a cocktail menu? Because I want to try more things. I'm like you. Cocktails all the way?

Cocktails all the way. We had a New Year's Eve together once where it was an absolute disaster. Oh my God. Because a lot of us were doing the wine pairing. And every time we got a new little glass of wine brought us, by the way, so James would have a new cocktail. Of course. Absolutely.

What do you love? Do you love a martini? What do you love? Yeah, love a martini. Yeah. A vodka martini. Yeah. And like, at the minute, I used to have them very clean, but now very dirty martinis.

Have you ever gotten it too dirty? I thought you couldn't. And then once I did it, and I was like. You can get it too dirty. And you're like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I still want to, I don't want to just taste brine and that's it. Yeah.

But I haven't had one that's too dirty yet. They've been pretty good. What's the most exciting cocktail right now? Is there anything on the, on the streets? I had a cocktail recently, which I really. loved at a restaurant called Cornus. It was a clarified coffee, Nogroni, which I thought was absolutely phenomenal. Oh my God. Okay, that's fresh. Yeah, yeah. And it was a lunch as well. It was an early lunch. So we were meeting at noon and I had it, that's the first thing I had clarified

coffee Nogroney. So you feel like you're kicking off your day in style. It was really, really good. Classy. So that's the, for me, that's the hot cocktail news on the streets. Okay, thank you. That's good. Do you think that's something you could, no, you can't just order that anyway. They have the clarified coffee, right? You got to go to Corners? Cornus. C-O-R-N-U-S. If you went, I'm sure if you went there, you could just say, have you got a seat at the bar or something, maybe? No, I mean, you couldn't simply order it at any restaurant. It's not like on the streets in that way. No, I don't think so. I think it's specifically. Is there anything like taken over? Like, for a little while, espresso martini was like really everywhere.

Nogroni, but that's been a couple of years, I think. Sort of a classic. Yeah. Same with spicy margaritas everywhere. I don't know if There's a new one sneaking up. No, I know. It's like, there's, that's why I had to bring in the peach. Yeah. Yeah. There's something a little boring about the spicy margarita, but I can't, I can't deny it.

I want it. I feel like it always starts in the States as well, so I feel like you'd know better than us. It's probably some protein thing. So I guess I'm ordering. Oh, right, right, right. Horrifying, yeah, yeah. The protein stuff is too much. It's like every internet recipe is like way protein.

Like, look at it'll do amazing things. Yeah, yeah. put this in the microwave and it'll grow to the size of the microwave in minutes. And then it's like, I don't know, they're trying stuff over there. So I guess I'm getting another cocktail and for that cocktail, I'm trying something else. Maybe I'll stick with the same spirit. Did you pick a tequila? Tequila.

I did. Originally. I did. Yeah. Fuck it. I'm getting a martini. No, this meal is chaos and I'm going to allow it. Yeah.

Let's try your martini. Let's try it straight up dirty vodka. Vodka. martini. How many olives? Fair minimum, too. Yeah. And then three, I respect. Antchavie? You know, I've never done it.

Chuck it in there. I've never even, I don't think I've even seen it. I've never seen an anchovy martini. I've seen the oyster, oyster martini, a whole oyster in there. With the shell? With the shell. Because that's where it's at. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, I mean, I feel like Ursula, you know, and Little Mermaid, like that's what I really enjoyed about oysters. Like, you know, you just really feel like you're down there.

Yeah. The way that Earths the Little Mermaid eats oysters. Yeah. And then doesn't she use something as a lipstick? Oh, yeah. It's like, I can't remember what she uses as a lipstick. She was great, Ursula. I was very scared of her when I was a kid. Incredible.

I used to pretend, I used to do her numbers. Yeah. Alone in the basement. Ariel's as well, but, you know, poor unfortunate souls. Yeah. Yeah. So, we arrive at the dream dessert. But this is where the ice cream chat.

Okay. This is where the ice cream chats comes back around. Oh, wait, I have three in mind. Okay. I thought two seemed ambitious. Okay. I'm thinking back to this dessert that one summer I got at this place, I really like in New York Ultra Paradigiso, that I went like a lot.

And it was, don't recall its name, okay? But there were strawberries. There was some kind of creamy ice cream type thing. I bet I could find it out. And then this other layer of sort of lighter cream. and this sort of drizzle. It was just, maybe there was a little spongy something on the bottom. Okay, it was like, I'm going to find out the same.

I'm going to find it out. It was incredible. But then I was just thinking last night someone was talking about, what is it called, affigato? Is that what is it? Yes. Where the espresso is cutting through the ice cream. So, like, what I like about that is it's like, it's an experience because it's not

like a unified thing you're eating, right? sort of like something that's unfolding in time. Like it's like, because you pour it and then it's starting to cut through the ice cream. Like what do you do? Like where do you put your spoon, right? Like are you just going for a spot of ice cream that's been perfectly sort of cut by a hot bit of, you know what I mean? Like where do you go? Where do you run?

Where do you start? And it's constantly developing. Yes. And I'd say personally, yeah. Spoonful of the ice cream with the coffee on it. Maybe it's a bit of the coffee pooled. at the bottom of the spoon. That's my first bite.

I think the pooling is important. The pooling is important. Then maybe I'm going for just a spoonful of coffee, which has just had some ice cream start to permeate it. Yes. So that's mainly coffee. You're experiencing different. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm trying to get all the different combinations. Yes, yes. Eventually, you're going to get to the point where half the ice cream's gone, and then I'm leaving that for a little bit. Oh, I thought you meant forever. No, not forever. I was like, ew. I'm letting it.

letting it develop. And then I'm... Spooning? I'm... Or full on drinking. I'm drinking like a creamy coffee. Oh, my God. I'm going to have to have that tonight, I think. Some version. There's a place called Brat. Okay.

And they do... Oh, you have to go there. They do an excellent espresso, afigato with salted caramel al ice cream and the espresso over the top is amazing. And they do an oyster shell martini as well, which is... God. Very delicious. I mean, you can't have any of those things.

Well, I'll figure it out. Yeah. I'll make something happen. Can you not have any of that? Well, I mean, I can have anything because it's not, it's all just a choice. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, that's why I'm not like, I'll say in a restaurant, like, vegan because it is helpful to them.

But like veganism is its own full-on, like, kind of like moral stance. And I'm not trying, like, newly plant-based, so I can't, like, claim any. What do you feel like you, is, are you like, are you like, looking to upgrade to being able to call yourself vegan? And what steps do you think you'll have to take? I don't know because I don't trust that I don't read another book in a year and decide that something else is the way. You know what I mean?

Like I'm not coming. I'm like, I'm nothing. I'm a woman, you know, barely. Well, we'll see. You know, like, I need to make any claims. Yeah, I was vegan for like nine months because I read a book that I thought was cool. Yeah. Yeah.

So right now, yeah, I get very. I used to be. Then you decided what? It was called meaters for pussies. the book. Oh, genius. Yeah, yeah. Genius. I mean, they need to get, yeah, they got to break down the toxic ideals to get in there. That's very... So we're having that strawberry dessert. I'm still, I know, because I can't remember its name is falling apart on me, but then I suddenly remembered it's very hard not to order a tart or a pie. It's on a menu. So I just thinking about

those again. But I'm going to stick with the affigato. Yesterday I had the best lemon meringue pie I ever had in my entire life. My sister made it. My sister made this lemon meringue pie. It was from the hummingbird bakery cookbook. But it's the first time she had made it, and she was like, oh, it's a bit, there's some like syrupy, sugary syrupy things happened. I don't know what.

I'm sure when I make it in the future, that won't happen again. But there's a bit of that swimming at the bottom. I was like, never change it. Never change it. Because it is soaked up in the pastry. So the pastry now is basically lemon meringue pie flavor. So the pastry on its own,

if you had that on it, so it tastes like a lemon meringue pie. It's got all that syrup soaked up in it. it was absolutely delicious. It was the creamiest lemon tar. It was incredible. I love a lemon based dessert.

Well, first of all, key lime pie. Yeah. I mean, similar, right? Great. Like, you know what I love? And I always think of it,

like, in my mind, it's like a British, it's ginger lemon creams, these cookies. Oh, yeah. They're like, yeah, they're almost like a rogue interest.

I feel like, as a statesman. Like, oh, like, I don't know, like no one wants that, you know what I mean? But then I secretly want the ginger lemon cream. Like anything, tart lemon, a lemon bar. When I see that lemon, you know, that part of it, like, if there's a bunch of, like, cookies or something with like a fruit center, don't usually grab it and like, like, like, one by one, like, lick the delicious fruit part out.

Not that I don't want the cookie there, I do. But like, in a pinch. Yeah. But we can do that for you in the dream restaurant as you're leaving. there can just be a line of those cookies lined up to the door, like a little trail of them, and you can just eat the fruit out of the middle. Yeah.

Just thinking if I've missed anything. I mean, you know, it's an experience. It's like I was roaming down a street, popping into nine dream restaurants and trying things, I think. Okay. Well, I'll read your menu back to you. Oh, no. This is where it all falls apart.

And this is locked in now, right? Yeah. You're trying to give me an out, and I appreciate it. Well, I just, I feel like... This is locked in. I think it's locked in. I'll accept. Because I think we're about to watch you go through absolute turmoil when you get this back.

Yeah, look at me, I'm bracing. Aquapana, water, bread that you've had to fight over this, like, been fun on the floor. Yes, yes, yes. Oh yeah, that was a good part. You want a small tart, peach, spicy margarita, arugula salad, slightly creamy tomato soup with a hand-torn crout in it. You want tangy tomato sauce, pasta, pasta. with anchovies and olives and capers. You want a cruel vegetable on the side, like a wilted spinach. Plain, plain spinach.

You want a dirty vodka martini and avigato and like a lemon tart. Oh, yeah. And my berry memory that I can't quite access. And the vague strawberry dessert. Did you call it a berry memory? And you would like the berry memory. My memory. The berry memory.

Your berry memory. You could serve me a, yeah, just like a. puff of the memory. Like, save you a puff of memory, of course we can. That's way more coherent than I've, yeah. Given how we got there. I know. I was expecting insanity when we read that back.

It was like, yeah, sounds. It sounded fantastic. I know it seemed a little tomato heavy perhaps, but I can't, I mean, I'm not upset about that. Yeah, yeah. I'd eat all of that. Yeah, but apart from right, and the puff of the berry memory. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, a vape.

Someone brings a vape in. So hungry and excited now. Thank you very much for coming. the dream restaurant, Jacqueline. Thank you, Jasmine. So fun to be here, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much to Jacqueline for coming on the pod. Don't forget to watch Jacqueline's special.

Get on your knees on Netflix. Keep an eye out for future gigs. Jokesnovac.com is where you'll find out details about when Jacqueline is next in the UK, if you're UK-based. But if you're US-based, I'm sure she'll be near you soon. And Jacqueline didn't say knees. No.

We didn't kick her out at the Dream Restaurant, which is a relief. Yes, a real relief, which means you get to come and see my show, Fresh Hell, Ed Gamble.combele.com. You're talking to Jacqueline when you say that? Yeah. Congratulations, Jacqueline.

You get to buy a ticket for my show. Yes, that's a very exciting for you. Yeah. Big news. Yeah. Huge news. Yeah. But thank you for listening or watching,

as some of you insist on doing. Yeah. We'll see you again soon. Goodbye. Goodbye.