Off-Nominal - 40 - SpaceX Play Place

Episode Date: April 27, 2021

Miriam Kramer joins Jake and Anthony to talk about space tourism. From Inspiration4, to Axiom-1, to suborbital flights, to some future adventures we’d like to go on. And some we wouldn’t.DrinksMeta Mosaic IPA - Bones Brewing - UntappdSunshine Pils - Tröegs Independent Brewing - UntappdOld Crow - WikipediaTopicsOff-Nominal - YouTubeEpisode 40 - SpaceX Play Place (with Miriam Kramer) - YouTubeInspiration4 - HomeSpaceX on Twitter: ”A new view for crew”Meet Ax-1, The Beginning of a New Era — Axiom SpaceMichael Lopez-Alegria — Axiom SpaceVirgin Galactic unveils new suborbital spaceplane - SpaceNewsNew Shepard Mission NS-15 Webcast - YouTubeView all deals for Fighter Jet flights at a glance | MiGFlug.comVMF Flight Experiences and Flight Training Programs - The Collings FoundationdearMoonSpacewalk - Space AdventuresPicksmars-date-utils - npmFIRST FLIGHT - Ingenuity | WeMartians PodcastStar Trek: Enterprise | Star TrekFor All Mankind | Apple TV+Follow MiriamMiriam Kramer (@mirikramer) / TwitterAxios Newsletter SignupFollow JakeWeMartians Podcast - Follow Humanity's Journey to MarsWeMartians Podcast (@We_Martians) | TwitterJake Robins (@JakeOnOrbit) | TwitterFollow AnthonyMain Engine Cut OffMain Engine Cut Off (@WeHaveMECO) | TwitterAnthony Colangelo (@acolangelo) | TwitterOff-Nominal MerchandiseOff-Nominal Logo TeeWeMartians Shop | MECO Shop

TOS and go for main engine, start. Hello, Miko. Welcome to space. Anthony, we made it back to YouTube, despite all things being against us. It's been a while since we had a show, and the excuse is we don't have an excuse. Sorry, I just didn't do the homework. It's been a real, real bumpy few weeks, and we just didn't squeeze one in. But we're here now. Finally, we're back.

We had to have a little tussle with YouTube just about five minutes ago. but we made it on. I'm excited to be back on here. It's nice to see you again. And we have a new friend with us today, Miriam Kramer. How you doing? Hi, I'm doing well. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, we're so excited. You are the definition of Off-N-N-L today. You're a little tired. I think you were covering some space events this morning. Yeah, just a small one, cult crew, too. I have to fully admit, I just, I just slept right on through. I just, I'm on Pacific time, and I just, I couldn't make it work. I was like, I'm not doing it.

I got too much going on right now. I did not want to get up at whatever it was going to be midnight and then watch through till three in the morning. Yeah, that was a particularly not operational time for West Coast, especially Jake. Yeah. He's an early to bed kind of guy. I go to bed early, yeah.

And I already had to do ingenuity this week. So I was just like, no, I've done my quota of middle of the night space events this week. That's totally fair. Yeah. For me, it was the SpaceX crude launches are still so new that in theory I could like, you know, pre-write something and give it to the person that's kind of on for Axios at that time of night. But I just like don't feel comfortable enough yet. I got to, I feel like I need to

watch a few more, get a few more under my belt. And then I can like start to maybe let go a little bit. But it's like half superstition, half real. It's a little fresh. And honestly, like after when they, do you remember it was a couple years ago now, I guess, when the, the Soyuz had the abort. And it was in like, it was kind of the middle of the night as well. And I, I wasn't watching Soyuz launches. Then I woke up and looked at my phone and it was like, oh my God. And then I was like, all of a sudden I just like developed right there like an anxiety for crude flight. And now I'm just like, so now when I sleep through them, I still feel like I am breaking laws. Like it's it's got to be illegal what I'm doing. I actually feel the inverse because

I don't, I have never made it to a live anomaly. Like all of the anomalies of history I have not seen. I wasn't awake for Starliner. I wasn't awake for the Soyuz thing. So I kind of have the opposite where I'm like, I better watch this thing or else, you know, feel a little pressure. That's so funny. Everything's funny. I'm in the opposite.

Yeah. I really dig the whole 24-hour live stream that's going on because I was just going all day. I had left it on the app TV downstairs and I would just walk by and be like, oh, what's going on? You know, where are they at? So it's pretty, I like that style for NASA. It's totally non-functional for their teams, I'm sure, because that seems

like a ton of work. Yeah, when they have, um, uh, is it Dan Hewitt and, um, I'm forgetting her name, the other girl who does the NASA when they wear the jackets and they're just like, they're just up for hours and hours and hours covers on the stream. I like, oh my goodness, that's crazy. There are many cruise shifts and all that. And you're like, wow, this is really, really gun it for it. They have the sweet jackets though.

So, yeah. At least they have the jackets. It seems like way too much for anyone human to sort of take on. But yeah. They do a great job with it. The continuous live stream is so great. Like, particularly when I'm covering it, it's just nice to have something on, like, during the day where I'm just like, okay, I can, like, halfway looking on them,

say goodnight to the astronauts. It does feel kind of all-timey that way where it's like, oh, they're right into my living room. You know, it's got a little of that vibe to it. Were you watching when they couldn't find the sweaters? No, I missed the sweaters. They were trying to find sweaters. And then there was like, try this box. Nope, not in that one.

We looked at that one already. Try this other one. Nope, didn't. And then, like, that was all they were working on for 25 minutes or so until they finally found the sweaters. Toma Pessier was like, I got them down in this hatch or whatever. That's great. Pretty entertaining.

I just love that stuff, you know, that's great. A little tiny drama. Where the sweaters at? Yeah. I was going to hope that. They'd give me the sweaters. I was hoping they wouldn't find them and it would be like a whole thing. I thought so, too.

They forgot the sweaters. Yeah. I was open for that. I was going to be cold on the space station for six months. Incredible. Yeah. The next commercial cargo launch is like, well, we have 6,000 kilograms of science and four sweaters because we forgot the ones for crew two.

Oh, man. What do you drink it, Jake? What am I drinking? So I have, I did this brewery a couple of episodes ago. I had that, this brewery is called Bones, Bones Brewery, which is hilarious. It's awesome. But I have another one. from them. So this is Bones Brewing Mosaic IPA. Am I in this shot there? Yeah.

You're supposed to do this. I'm the producer over here. So let's do that. That's nice looking. There you go. It can. Tallboy. I've been doing a lot of these cans lately just because the store by my house to stop selling, you know, our traditional Jake-sized bottles. And so I've been doing a lot more cans. And it's actually gotten me into some beers that I haven't really tried before. So it's been kind of nice. So, yeah, so you're reading that can life. Yeah, living that can life. I'm going to do a little pour here. He's very dramatic about this.

Chris. I've been waiting for this all week. I'm also living that can life tonight. I have focus issues, and I have a sunshine Pilsner from Troegs because it's almost summer and it's delicious. And I've been looking for some refreshment in my life. So that's what I got. Have they started sponsoring us yet? what you know you say that i haven't had some like pa beer in a long time on this show so

you know cool miriam what do you got oh yeah um i have bourbon on the rocks um it is old crow bourbon um and it's part of this thing that my husband and i have been doing uh where we've kind of been going through like the history of bourbon um so old crow was kind of one of the first mass Burbans. It is owned by like one of the big distilleries now. I can't remember which one it might be Jim Beam. But it sort of when it was first started, it was this like, you know, smaller but still mass produced brand, basically. So we've sort of bit like we drank some apple jack. We've like tried cognac, like a bunch of things that sort of led up to bourbon. And now we're getting to actually drink the drink that we like the most switches. Bourbon. so that is what I'm having tonight. That is a nice pandemic journey that you're having there. Oh, yeah, we have a lot of projects. We have many projects, me and my husband.

I thought about that the other day that like, I do sort of miss the weird projects that people got into. Like, people got into just weird stuff, and I do miss that. There was some guy I follow was doing like yearly playlist. He was listening to every album that came out in a particular calendar year making like a playlist of his greatest hits from that year. And it was just this like slow project that I'm like, no one's going to have any time for that anymore.

So, which is good. But also I like weird projects. Yeah. You know, you got to take a vacation for a year. Yeah. You got to like make time for him. Yeah. That's true.

I don't know. We're all in on like the weird projects. We're watching like the best action movie every year as rated by like this one writer that we really like who wrote for the AV club for a long time. And, you know, you got to have them if you want them. We are people of projects here. Yeah, well, I hope that like we take something from it, though. You know, when the pandemic is gone, that we take like 10% of the lesson or something

and make it part of our regular life. Because I think there was probably a lot of positive stuff that came out of the time at home with family. and yourself, you know? Yeah. The other good thing is that explaining this makes a lot more sense now. Like, this used to be like, that's weird. You're like, your friend is with this guy from Vancouver and you do this.

You like rope in other people to this. But now it's like, oh, I get it. I understand. Should we talk about some space tourism? I think we should. We've had a collection of space tourism topics. And I have a list of things to talk about, but we can let our hearts wander. Should we talk about inspiration four first?

Because it seems pretty rad. I think so, yeah, yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of angles, but the glass dome thing, like glass dome instead of a docking adapter. This actually surprised me because they're building that into its endeavor that they're flying, right? So that was the DM2 crew capsule, which is it? Yeah.

That one that just came home or is still? No, it took off today. They're flying. Or they're flying resilience, the one on the station. That's the one that's still up. It's coming down and that'll be their ship. Okay. So it's April and they want to fly in September.

The vehicle they're flying is in space and they want to put in a new window. So like this is like a pretty incredible like timeline of when they're going to get it back. I think it's coming back in like a week or something. Maybe. Yep. I think like Wednesday or Tuesday or something. Wednesday. Yeah.

Yeah. So that seems like crazy to me. I love that we are striding with the window because I said to my colleagues who are not necessarily space people, they were sort of asking me like, well, what's cool about this? Like with the announcement that happened just a little while ago. And I was like, well, look, man, like the space nerds are going to love the window. Like the window is the thing that the space folks are going to be very into. And I love it what I'm right sometimes.

But like, it's great. No, I had not actually thought of that angle, though. that they're going to have to get this thing down and then install this window that is like a just like a totally brand new thing and then like send people up with it like it's September. Sure. It's very SpaceX. It's extremely SpaceX. I like I do like the rendering of this because it's you're like you're facing the wrong way man. Like what are you doing out there? You know? Why are you facing that way? Turn it around. That is. That's wrong. Yeah. That's wrong. You should have put Earth on top of that picture.

That would have been you could get the best of both world. There I go. It kind of reminds me if you ever go to like a McDonald's and they have the kids thing, the plate place, you know, and it's like all those like cubes and there's always like a half glass dome and then like the kid always talks out of the time in here, mom. You just ruined my excitement for this window. It's so great. You're not going to be able to see anything out of it.

Now I'm like, oh. Yeah. because some kid will have like licked the inside of it. Pizza's juice on it. It's going to have so many germs on it. It's going to be just gross. So gross. No, all right.

I have a really off nominal window topic. Okay. All right. If you remember the layout of dragon, the Komodo dragon is up near the docking port, which means it's very likely that you could be taken to shit while looking out that window. Angles of work.

So I'm just saying that's like, It's pretty, I mean, it's right there, you know. It's an experience. It's an experience. I'm just saying. Maybe that's why. I mean, could be. Little extra space never hurt, you know.

Yeah. It's going to be really fun for one of the, one of the participants as well, one of the astronauts to have to be like, can you get out of the window? I got to go to the bathroom. Okay, can we talk about that angle as well? Because I do think this mission as a free flyer, non-IS mission, is unique for these crew members because they are committing to a small box with these three other people for three days or something, right? The other flights that are going to ISS, it's a long drive, but it's not

an extensive amount of time in this box. And then you can stretch out in the space station. So that's like a, how do you, how would you get into that mindset? Just be really good friends with them. Yeah. I guess. Yeah, I mean, like become friends, I think. Like that, it's funny. So I've talked to them a few times. And it sounds like the crew is really starting to gel. Like they kind of talk about each other, like they're a family already, which is kind of cool.

And like their group dynamic is really kind of goofy. Like they like to sometimes like tease Jared and it's like cool. It like it seems like a space crew already to me. Like when you sort of look at astronauts, like that's sort of the group dynamic that they tend to have. It's like friendly. It's banter filled. It's like kind of goofy.

a lot of the time. So I don't know. I'm really intrigued to see like how the next few months of training is going to go. And like if, you know, the honeymoon period, if they're still in it now, if this is going to last up through launch because like they really don't have that long of a training period at this point. So yeah, it's cool. It's been cool to like see what they're doing.

But they're just spending a lot of time together, you know. Yeah, that's good. I mean, it's probably what you have to do. but it will be very interesting to, I don't know how we'll learn about this, but I would love to even just see someone publish a paper on like the crew dynamics of these non-traditional, you know, because coming up through the NASA pipeline,

like it sort of beats into you a template of some kind of person where you fit, those pieces fit pretty easily together. I'm sure there's, you know, fights in the crews or whatever. Yeah, there's, who's our favorite? it, Stan, what's his name? I can't think of it. Stucky. Who's the guy's name? Not Stucky. Story.

No. Story Musgra? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. There's, like, that's, he's, he's one of them, right? He didn't really nicely fit in that box. He's pretty fiery. Yeah, he's pretty fiery. But I don't know, just like, just seeing a normal person go through this process and do all

the things that you do, I don't know how we learn about it, but someone should be studied it, I think. I do wonder if, um, like clearly, you know, there's been space tourists before, but they were amongst the like very professional government run or agencies and, you know, jammed through that same process. This one will have a different vibe and I wonder how because like, I guess if you're one of a three person, so you're picking up how to act based on the other two and you're picking up things to do and things to not do. like I'm sure they'll get that advice but not a lot of it's going to stick until they're up there flying right and like what if they all freak out when they're in orbit like not mentally but just like wow this feels crazy and like I don't know what to do with my insides you know what it just seems like there's not having that presence there does matter and I'm just curious how they're going to handle that on launch day yeah I mean I wonder too if like a lot of it is going to be sort of SpaceX

helping them out from the ground, like, and sort of proving out that element of it. Because, like, I mean, this is a very, you know, it's a decision, like, to do this without another, like, without a professional astronaut or anyone who's been to space before. And I think that it's sort of, like, important for SpaceX in some way to prove that they can do this and that they can, like, shepherd through this crew who are, you know, not, like, the, the, cream of the crop for NASA, but are like very capable people. Absolutely. Yeah. You're talking about somebody who's flown like formation jets, someone who made it almost to be an astronaut. Like there's there, there's a lot of that

DNA there, but it's just the, you know, maybe we, I mean, it might show that what we're saying here is nonsense and like all of that, oh, you had to know the way to do things is like just posturing. Well, I was going to say that because this is actually a really, it's really important for SpaceX to demonstrate that. But I I think it's also really, this is like a bit of a like a watershed moment in US spaceflight. Because like think of the history, all the history of the NASA human spaceflight have this whole like this, this storyline embedded in where the astronauts like insist on having, you know, these are piloted spacecraft. Like people fly these. None of that autonomous stuff.

I do not want to have all these fancy computers like we are pilots and we're going to fly this space. Yeah. Where's my window, that whole thing? Yeah, that's why we have like the shuttle and even on the Apollo spacecraft, there was always like a commander and all that kind of thing. So there's a, it's going to be very interesting to see what that means, right? Because like it's a new thing for human spaceflight, at least in the U.S. Yeah, I just, I need to apologize because my cat was screaming at me. And now he is on my lap and very happy and hopefully will remain happy.

Jakes will come in at some point. Sorry for that. door. I was smart. He would not abide a close door, this cat. I've had a cat like that. I know the, I know the feeling. My old cat, I used to have to lock, she had to be behind two doors. An airlock, you needed a cat airlock? I needed an airlock because, like, she would scream from the other room and I needed the extra.

This is, this is, that's what he does. We have to lock him twice away. I think, buddy. Oh, man. Okay. Hmm. All right. I think everything you said is exactly great. I think that's a, you've made some very good points.

Axiom and their flights are like the other side of this coin, right? A lot of similar takes where it's no professional astronauts, but then they're getting, they're going to the ISS. They're like, and right now there's not, there's not an extra have. One day when there's Axiom station and there's a hotel room or whatever on board. You know, they can go to their quarters and not bother the other ones as much. But this is going to be very interesting. We had Richard Garrett on a couple months ago talking about stories of integrating with the

ISS crew and them accepting him as that, but it being kind of a weird experience. That was one person subbed out of the full ISS crew. This is four additional, you know, because actually, is anyone clear on exactly how this fits in schedule-wise on how many people? people are going to be on the station already when these four come up. Is it for a week? Do they do it during handover? What's the deal? It's a good question. I actually don't know. I would bet that it's like this right now where crew two's going up. There's a week overlap with 11 people and then they would go home. So Axiom might come up, stay for a week or whatever. Seems like that would be

the way to do it. I don't know how you would do it otherwise. A lot of people on ISS. Has it been scheduled, like manifested or whatever on there? If it's on that crazy schedule. Is that what you mean? Yeah. It's probably on that crazy schedule. I don't keep tabs on the on the traffic flow there. I mean, that crazy schedule is built out to like 2024 already and they just keep moving stuff. Yeah. I'm curious about that though, because that you can get, that's a lot of people jammed into ISS. It already is and it could be like a ton of people there.

How do they do that? I wonder if you're going to get the sort of the pushback from the professionals being like, trying to get work done and there's all these tourists in the way. Because there's just not a lot of space. No selfie sticks. stuff. Yeah. And what do you do? Okay, you're a tourist.

What do you do for a week on the ISS? Oh, man. Besides look out the window. I mean, yeah, like, you look out of the window a lot. It's a nice window.

Probably are going to do some science. Like, that's usually, like, Inspiration 4 is doing science. Yeah. Some outreach stuff. Yeah.

And then I bet they'll, like, talk to the ground. They'll have, like, media availability. They'll do, like they'll chat with like their high school you know yeah yeah um that that fills some time and then you know you need like the the two days to get your feet under you probably like motion sickness yeah yeah i wonder you know are they going to have the same exercise requirements

like oh wow how much bone and muscle mass can you lose in 10 days like yeah i don't know probably not probably not much yeah no shuttle astronauts used to just like leap down the stairs after they landed. That's true. We're home. Yeah, yeah. They don't think they care that bad.

But no, it's interesting. And actually, it's weird that the Axiom one, I feel like they haven't, it hasn't been as much press. Like that inspiration for is like, it's a big deal.

But like, axioms like, it feels like almost like much more like a private. Like it's four rich guys and they're going to, they're going to space. And like, if you're interested, fine,

but like we're going for us, not for you. You know, it feels a little more like that. I think that's more about their future market, you know, than necessarily like, the markets thereafter are different, you know? Yeah. UAE has four astronauts now, and they ain't booked a flight for any of them, you know,

beyond the one that they already flew. So they're going to sell these things to those people, not Jared Isaacman. Yeah. Which is interesting. I would love to ask him why he chose a free flyer. Was it like he couldn't get an ISS flight, or did he not want to go? I'm very curious about that aspect. That's a good question.

I wonder if it was what they could slot into the manifest. Probably can't fit them, right? It was a pretty quickly time or quickly planned mission. Like they have not, this is not necessarily even been in development for a year at this point. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So the SpaceX manifest, right? Just the vehicle availability. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I, you know, I, it's interesting, like, to look at Axiom versus Inspiration 4. because like the timing of it all was really like fascinating to me as when it's covering all of it because like wasn't it and I may be misremembering but what I remember was Axiom announced one week like the end of one week and then Inspiration 4 announced like that Monday yeah like with an

with an Elon presser too yeah which is the Axiom did not get the Elon presser No, I took the wind out of the sales a bit. Yeah, which was pretty fascinating. And then they like leapfrogged it in timing too and like sort of took all the air out of it. But it's also an interesting thing because like Axiom was not giving away seats. Like Inspiration 4 like had a Super Bowl commercial and like these are normal folks with like Jared leading them. So it's just an interesting. I don't know.

The differences are so fascinating. Yeah. It's bizarre. It's like this a year. from now we're going to have so much like varied perspective and like what it means to fly people in space. We're going to have all these extra flights of like just different stuff. And I don't know, it's going to be really fun to kind of process. Yeah. I'm excited that Michael Lopez-Elegria gets to go again. I feel like that's going to be really fun for all of us. Yeah, he's been up a lot, right?

He flew a lot of time. He's got a lot of space. He's the space war guy, right? Didn't he have like seven raid spacewalks. Yeah, he had the record for a while. I don't know if he still does. Or at least he's tied with it, right? Yeah, something like that. That's a cool record.

It is. It's a great record. Most hours. I spend a lot of time just float around Earth. Yeah. Yeah. Whatever. No biggie.

Do you feel like the timing of all these things crushes the soul of suborbital tourism. Looking at the schedule, New Shepherd might fly people before inspiration four, if the schedules are as they are now. Spaceship two and three, they've flown the pilots and Beth Moses, but like, I have no idea what their schedule

isn't flying anyone other than that. Yeah. It's pretty weird timing. I feel like the suborbital stuff is going to end up being just a such a different product and like a different market, you know, because, oh, just one, the cost is going to be maybe two orders of magnitude different. Like it's going to be a completely different thing, right? So, you know, if you think, if you compare it to like flying in an airplane is, is the

orbital flight going to be like, I booked a thing and I get to go in an F-16 and do spins up. And then the suborbital one is going to be just like, yeah, I grabbed into the Cessna at the local airport and flew around, which is like, way more accessible to most people, you know? I think you're overestimating how much it costs to book like an hour on a fighter jet. Like that's, you could, you could save up a little bit and budget for that. Because there's like some people that will take you for like not that much money. You'd be shocked.

Okay. I have no idea. You'd be shocked. It's like low thousands to like fly on a fighter jet. I think if you're friends with the Google guys, it could just convince them also. It's funny. I mean. Sub in whatever metaphor you want.

Yeah. it could like I keep kind of coming back to Virgin Galactic being like publicly traded now and sort of the cushion that that gives them and like I agree it's a complete I think that the markets are very different for these for these flights and there's like this sort of interesting luxury element to the sub-or-galactic especially right yeah I mean like you know God who was it under Armour did the plate suits. Oh, right. They were walking around IAC with it. Remember? They were like, catch us around IAC in our like little sport outfit.

Yeah. That's so great. So there's like, there's that element of it. I think it's, I think they're definitely playing to different audiences. But I think that they need to start flying people, like really flying people soon or like folks are going to lose not just interest,

but like confidence in it, which like as a probably. traded company, like, that's not great. What do you make of the publicly traded thing is interesting? Because there's been a lot of stories in the last, like, several months of, like, so-and-so sold $300 million of stock or whatever crazy amounts they've been selling. What do you make of that? It feels like it's, I can't help but feel just super gross about the whole thing.

I don't know. It's like, it's funny because, like, it feels like they, they, it sort of made sense for how they described it, like, to go public bias back. Like, they need the capital. It's a good way to get sort of upfront capital. They have, like, all of, they clearly have, like, a public, you know, market that is friendly to it, you know, like, and is interested in it in a way that maybe, like, I don't know, like, folks who are deep in the industry, who have, you know, who watched the,

you know, the tragic accident. Yeah. that not happen all that long ago. Like our memories are pretty long in the space world. So I think it's like diversifying it in that way like makes some sense to me just from a business standpoint. Like I'm curious what you guys think of it though. Yeah. I don't know.

It's it's weird to me that like it both makes sense that you go public before you start offering your product because you need the money. And also like doesn't make sense. And it's like I don't want to invest. in this company unless you're flying people, you know? Like there's a weird like, uh, tension with sort of, I don't know, with space stuff. Like the, you know, Rocket Labs spec makes a little more sense to me because like they were already flying. They're doing stuff.

They're an established business and they need money for the next thing. Like, okay, perfect. Yeah, that that makes sense. And like you've got, you know, revenue we can look at. But like, I don't know, Virgin Galactic is just a, it's a complete gamble right now. But they, they kind of, it seems to me like it's being marketed like a stock that you just hold in your portfolio like any other dog and I'm like no this is like a crazy

startup like this is a super risky thing to be investing in like you get it needs to be looked out that way but I think because it's got virgin in the name it's kind of seem a little differently so I don't know it's it is it does feel a little weird to me too so I don't know if I feel yucky about it but it's like something

there's flags there for me yeah I guess I mean I have a long history of not loving Virgin Galactic as in general like just decisions and the strategy and everything. And I think it's different if it's like framed as, oh, you're buying a stock in like what will become the space airline.

And like, and they're trying that. But the technical roadmap is like, what are you talking about? You're going to have like, you're going to make a new vehicle that goes like mock bagillion and it gets everywhere in 20 minutes or whatever and buy our stock because of that. And it's like, I've seen none of that that's happening. So I think that kind of just all. All of the pressers or the presentations are, we're going to fly 400 times in 2026.

And I'm like, there is no way that this company is flying. And that's the part that just feels like this is, you know, what are like Amway and all that stuff? I feel a little bit like, you got to have a good downstream, you know. It feels a little bit like that. So that's what makes me kind of gross. But I do think it's the timing sucks for them, man, because, you know, you hear people going to the top of Mount Everest today and you're like, cool, like that's fun, you know. probably cost a lot.

And it's like... Especially because it's looking like blue origin is going to be virgin galactic. And so, like, they're not even going to be the first suborbital tourists, you know? Can I go on a rant about their naming scheme? Have you looked into the naming scheme? In a tweet, I think we need to go into it. Yeah.

Okay, so there was spaceship one, which was capital S, capital S, capital S, capital L. Cool. And there was spaceship two, capital S, capital S, capital T. Those flew on White Knight 1 and White Knight 2. That's great. Now there is spaceship, capital S, capital S, the space character, three Roman numerals. What? And that is, and that is a spaceship two.

Spaceship 3 is a spaceship two. What is happening over there? And I think that, that to me is Virgin Galactic, and that's what drives me nuts. Like that anecdote is all I need to say about how I feel about Virgin Galactic. So, okay, thank you. Thank you for that. We've done the whole show now. We can go home and everything's good.

I'm not going to say, that was great. All right. I have a handful of future trips that I wrote down that I would like your take on. Because I think these are all fun. Are there any of these particular ones we talked about so far that you would be most interested in? What's your power ranking on which ones you would like to do? Like, what do you like? Do you like ISS?

Do you like Free Flyer at Hubble altitude? Where are you at, Miriam? Oh, man. Okay, if I were to do one of them, I think I don't want to go all the way. I think I want to go to the space station. It's just like if you're going to send me to space, like send me somewhere cool.

But I will say, and I will admit this, since I'm among friends and your viewers, I am extremely hesitant about ever going to space. slash I don't know that I actually want to. I get that. There's no shame there. You know what I've always said actually is I've always wanted to do like worldview. Like do you remember that?

Oh man. Don't get me started. That's the one that I would do. That's the one is like put me in a balloon, send me up into the stratosphere for like six hours. Yeah, a dinner cruise. And gently bring me back down. That's really funny. I am like the opposite there.

Like I would go to space tomorrow. someone offers me, but I will never on my life ever step into a hot air balloon. It's just a basket with no harnesses. Like, what are you talking about? It's just flying around in the sky in a box. No, thank you. I never going to happen. I think I have a similar thing to you, Jake, where I'm like, I think I'm afraid of heights, but I'll fly in anything like remotely metal and that moves to the air rapidly. Yeah. I've flown in some weird stuff, you know, and then I'm cool with that, but for some reason, yeah, the basket thing. I also have a similar hold up on the basket thing.

Yeah. I will stick my face up against an airline window and stare at the ground, no problem. Or a McDonald's thing, a greasy pizza McDonald's thing. Or a play play play set at McDonald's. But as soon as it's like a wicker basket with, no, not, not. I can't even like walk up to edge of balconies. So, I don't know. Yeah, I have less of a fear of height, so that might be part of it for me. at more of a fear of rockets. Yeah, they're a little spicy sometimes, right? A little bit, a little bit, a little bit much. All right, I have a...

What about you, Anthony? It's actually interesting because I... So I want to know first how McDonald's like the dome is. You know, can you actually... Do you actually feel like you're out of the hats or not? I want to know that answer before I can fully state it, because Hubble altitude looks pretty cool. Like that, just a photo...

Did you ever see the Hubble IMAX film that they made? I think it was like the first IMAX film or something. And actually, Megan MacArthur was on that one, right? She was the robot arm operator. That IMAX film is like, damn, they're high. That's a really nice altitude. So that sounds kind of cool. But I do think, like the ISS is falling apart, man.

So if I could go to the ISS, I think I might do that. Check that out. That's what I'm thinking. Like you get all the way to 28,000 kilometers an hour, and you're not. going to visit the space station like come I don't know yeah because if you he told me like I had a chance to go to sky lab

I would be like I want to go see sky lab you know it's like flying all the way to Disney world and then just staying in the hotel going to Universal Go to Universal Yeah Sick burn on Universal I think on this new coaster whatever I've seen a ad of it looks cool

All right um can I run through my well first one note about future trips I found an interesting that Inspiration 4 is going to the ISS inclination and they said because of the recovery zones. And I'm very interested to know, is that a forever constraint or is that while we're still working out Falcon Dragon constraint?

Because that's like, if it's a forever constraint, that's super limiting and something that should be noted. Yeah. Maybe like a discount. A discount if you don't get recovered. I kind of wonder if it's a timing thing. So the same reason they could only fit the schedule in, you know, right now.

And so if you're going to move that fast, then you just got to reuse all of our operational plans, you know. Right. Just use the board zones we know and understand. Like don't invent anything new, right? Yeah. I don't know for sure. But I feel like that's probably about about what they're doing. It's like they're trying to drive down as much risk as possible.

And then, like, I don't know, put in a bunch more risk with the window. I still have so many questions. Yeah, we did skip over the fact that they had to be working on the window for a long time, right? I hope. Yeah. This is what I'm saying. Yeah, we skip that. If we're going to install it in the next couple months, it's got to have been made and they've tested it in some sort of hash they have on the ground.

And they're good to go, right? Yeah. And like, SpaceX doesn't announce stuff like that unless they've, like, at least done something with it. Like, you know, at least blown it up once or something. So I expect them to have done something with this thing before they, you know, sent out that cool photo. So that leads to my first future trip. And it plays into it heavily because no one's ever been to polar orbit before. There were plans.

It was going to happen within months of when Challenger happened. And somehow they were going to land at Easter Island if something went wrong, which is still the craziest thing to me. I would love a sci-fi book about a shuttle flight out of Vanderbur going wrong and then landing at Easter Island because that seems crazy. Polar orbit, though. I think this is one that is, it sounds, it would be cool, but I don't know if it would be as cool as it sounds like it would be, if that made any sense. It sounds really cool to say I was the first person in polar orbit, but do you think it would be that cool? That's significantly different, I should say. I mean, you'd see like Antarctica, which would be pretty awesome.

That's awesome. And you see Aurora. Yeah, like nobody's business. Right, because you can get it from the ISS, but it's not, you're not in it. It's always off in the distance. You'd be like right on top of it. Yeah, that's it. Okay.

You could even be like sort of feel like you're inside of it a little bit. That's what I imagine. The universal single for Aurora. You could, you could bring a, you could do like a really cool outreach experiment and bring like a compass, like old-fashioned compass on the thing and watch it like, go. Oh, that would be fun. All right.

We just still pull the orbit. It's good. Yeah, we'll help you out. We'll help you plan it. Just contact us. We're waiting by the phone. All right. I've got a new one,

a new offering here from Anthony's space line called Keepout Sphere Cruises. This is where you buzz the keepout sphere of various important objects in orbit. One would be the ISS. The other would be like Hubble. Chinese space station Are there objects that you would like to book a Keepout sphere cruise for?

What would you think, Jake? You seem to have one in mind. What would you like? Oh, KH. 11 spy satellites? That's like going to be the same as Hubble, but they also have those ones that they don't talk about that are like they deployed those like 100 meter antennas. Oh, dude, Orion. You got to go to geo for that though, right? That's like geo.

Let's go. Okay, well, Gio's on my list. Geo is one that sounds cool, but it would be super boring. it would be the earth is like a ping pong ball yeah and you don't you'd only have the well you wouldn't really have any sunsets and sunrise yeah

but we missed Miriam do you have a keep out sphere cruise that you would like to book oh man I love the idea of KH11 I want to do I want to do like a spy satellite tour please that would be awesome because it would be like wait we're at Hubble No, we're not. This is the KH11 and you would have cracked the case. Exactly. It's like I need to know, is it truly a Hubble pointed down? I think it is, but I want to know.

Here's an alternate booking that I have. This one is more for like the people that are into ghost tours or those kind of things. Maybe we're on Halloween. We would go looking for Zuma. Cheap money, easy money right there for me of my spaceline. I haven't thought about Zuma in like years, man. We think about Zuma. It's going to haunt me. I'm going to have to start thinking about it again. Go looking for Zuma.

I like it. I like it. That's a good one. Here's one that I think it fits what Gio, what you would think would be cool about Gio, but is achievable. and cooler, which would be like a medium Earth orbit, like a nice GPS altitude, right? You can see the whole Earth in one view, but you are making progress and you're seeing different parts of Earth.

I think that one might be one that sounds boring, but would be cooler than it sounds. You know what I mean? That's my marketing strategy. I like it. Okay, I dig it. Yeah. And you could tour some GPS satellites while you're there? Yeah.

Swing on by the constellations. Some by-do. They're all over to place. You could do a Mio Keepout Sphere Cruise. Yeah, I like that. All right. The spacewalk trip. This is the one that's been, this has been rumored as a thing that's possible, right?

Can you book this? I think you can buy one from like Space Avengers. Yeah, you can. Spacewalk. A spacewalk? Outside the space station. Is this your ultimate fear, Miriam? I have no interest.

I have no interest. I'm having to like grip on with my fingers to those uncomfortable gloves. Like, no. How about ride the jet pack? Would you ride the jet pack thing? Maybe, but I would not trust myself with this. I am clumsy. I don't think I'd ride the jet pack, but it's one of those things where I don't know how I'd react.

Because like, right now I'm like, oh, I would definitely do a spacewalk. But that, like, I would not be surprised if I step out that hatch. I'm like, nope. And I just like lock onto a handrail. And I'll just hang out here for three hours. And you guys let me know when you're done. And they'll just like silently panic. That could very well happen because it's just like nothing below you.

You just, ooh. And you're like moving fast. Like you can like see it, really see it when you're there. Like that's not. I can't. I mean. Yeah, I'm getting a little panicky thinking, but okay, I'm thinking maybe I shouldn't do it. Subnote on spacewalks.

I feel like you know how there's always when you talk to astronauts? There's like the how do you poop in space? How do you eat in space? There's those questions. Have we ever discussed what happens when you have an itch on your nose and you're in a flight suit or anything? Because I have like a weird concern. Oh, they have the nose scratcher thing, right? Yeah.

I want to know how that works, and then I'd be interested in spacewalk. This was my mime for the astronaut nose itcher. I want to look into that and then I would book a spacewalk. If I could test that first. That's my main concern. how effective it is. Need to know. Yeah.

I'm not great in super closed spaces either, so. That'll do it. Space flight is not for me, guys. Space flight is not for me. I think we've established that. We figured it out. Yeah. My self-preservation instinct is pretty intact.

All right. Now, we're looking beyond. I think I've tapped out Earth orbits there. So a little beyond. Lunar Free Return feels like the only one in the remote vicinity of plausibility for us here. But the big variable would be like, what vehicle? Would you do that with like you and your husband on a dragon? Or is that too little?

You know? That's pretty small. Are you at all interested in Dear Moon and having like 18 other chuckleheads with you? I mean, I think Dear Moon could be cool. There's a lot of TikTokers on board Okay, see, I don't know if I'm I don't know if I'm about that TikTok life But you're into the bigger size of it

That's key Yeah, I think that's part of it I kind of like the idea of like a dragon Free Return around the moon I feel like that could be kind of like Neat The truth is if I was going to go to space I think the real crux of it for me

It's like, if I'm going to go to space, I'm going to, like, go to space. I want to go to the moon. I want to, like, see the moon. And then I want to come back home. Like, I don't know if I want to land on the moon, but I want to see it. I want to experience that. So I think, like, that sort of thing would be more my speed. And it could be fun, you know, a nice vacation from the child and the cat, perhaps.

I'm just picturing, like, being. in that glass dome and like when you go behind the moon and that's it's just you in the glass dome. Yeah. That's crazy. That's pretty cool. Yeah. That's really cool. I would do that.

Okay, I would do that one. All right. Cool. You got me on one. I mean, that is the ultimate of our era, right? Like, of our modern era of space travel. That's probably the ultimate. And I'm, do you think that's going to come back into the realm of possibility?

I don't think so, you know? doesn't seem like it's happening. Dear Moon's the business, especially now that they got the Human Landers Award. Yeah. Yeah. Man, that'll be the first like commercial, the first like civilian

lunar lander crew going down to the moon. I mean, like, what? What kind of world will you be living in if that happened? It's going to be the CEO of Twitter, taking his good friends. Jack's going on a meditation trip. Yeah, yeah.

It's like Burning Man on the Moon, guys. Some awful YouTuber guy who does pranks on people, and then it's going to be, yeah, TikToker, yeah, landing on the moon, drinking booze. Space influencers, man. How do you feel about, do you think Dear Moon has, like, radically, I'm trying to imagine the world in which SpaceX is developing lunar starship and Dear Moon inhabit the same universe,

and I can't figure it out. Like, I do not understand how that's possible that those are the same universe. Yeah. I'm a Dear Moon skeptic, so I don't know. No, that's what I mean, though, especially, like, you think Kathy Leeder's going to be like, sure, send those 12.

What? Yeah, I think, like, the thing with Dear Moon for me is I need to see, I need to see a little more from it. Like, I need to see some questions answered about like some transparency into the process of how people are going to get chosen like at the very least. And then I mean, obviously like Starship needs to like

advance past the explode stage of the SpaceX testing process. I don't want to say this because I don't think that it's like quite as much of a thing, but I get a little bit of like like

Mars 1-ish vibe. Not that I think it's a grift. I don't actually believe that. I think they really do want to do this and it's a real thing. And I don't think they're trying to like con people necessarily. Not to say that that's necessarily what Mars 1 was doing. No, we can go. Oh, yeah.

We think we're there. Okay. Well. Listen, I said earlier, I think Virgin Galactic is. So we are like well into that. But you know what I'm saying. Like it's, I get a little bit of like a tight,

like a little like worried when when we're talking about it just because I'm like, okay, like let's see a little more before we all get hyped on this whole thing. Not quite there yet, friends. Yeah. I feel like it's it's more likely to go gray dragon than it is to fly. So or you know, at least quite a bit like, oh, well, you know, we looked at the data. We're going to, we're going to.

actually just change it to a low Earth orbit flight and we're going to do that first and then I'll put it down payment on a lunar one later or something. It's going to just like settle into a little bit more of a real feeling thing. Yeah. It's funny because I see some people occasionally like trying to lump like inspiration for in with dear moon and sort of talking about them in the same way. And I actually have become more of like a less of a skeptic of inspiration one. Like I think that it's really, I think it's really going to happen.

Like, I think it's on the manifest. I think they're really aiming for September and that it's like looking likely that it's going to go in the time frame that they're setting out, especially with this last crude mission that they just cleared off the docket. Like it's, and like the technology is already flying and it's already flying people. Like I think that that's like a very important element to this. Dear Moon has yet to clear. So like come back to me in a year or two. Dear Moon, and maybe we can talk a little more. And I'll put you in the newsletter a little more than I have been.

Well, it didn't help for a bit that they were only in the news when they had like the contest to find a girlfriend or whatever it was. Oh, yeah. Oh, I forgot about that. I'm out of good luck. That was a tough one. That was a bad moment for a lot of people, I think. It was a low point in the space industry. Well, I'm out of, Anthony's Spaceline is out of, uh,

out of things here. So it sounds like you both bought the lunar trip. Interested in the Keepout Sphere Cruise, but maybe not for you right now. So I'll keep thinking on that, come up with some better targets. But, you know, should we do some picks, Jake? I think we should, yeah. Do you have a particular pick, Jake? Yeah, I can go first.

My pick is a little self-promotional. But I did something kind of fun. That's the next segment is plugs. We do the picks. Well, I have a plug, too. Okay. Oh, you double-d-d-month. I'll do it.

They're both. Yeah. No, but I did something kind of fun. I had like a weird moment inspiration last weekend. And I, you know, I've been doing a lot of coding on development lately, which is another part of my work.

And I made this little, this is funny. It's going to be like a piece of software that everyone's going to be interested in, but it's actually only going to be applicable to a very niche part of our audience. So shout out to all the JavaScript, no developers out there

who can actually use this. But I made this little library that I published open source and it lets you figure out what time it is on Mars. So it just this paper that NASA published. Well, there's a couple papers and then NASA took the papers and published a guide on how they used this for some of their software. And so I was able to go through this guide

and translate it all into JavaScript and build this little library that I published online. And so I can now use this to go and build things with Mars time, which is really fun. So yeah, I'll put a link to it in the show notes. It's an MPM package if you know what that is, but there's just all whatever 10 of you out there that know what that is, you can feel free to use it.

And I want to see some people build some cool stuff. Did you say the domain? Is that the one with the domain? Well, I haven't built that part with it. So I made the library, which is like the core fundamental code that like operates it. And then I can go build things with it. So one thing that I did build already so that the people in our Discord know about it,

but you can actually like in our Discord chat, fire off a little command. and it returns the Mars time to you at different sites. You know, what time is it at opportunity? Here's the time. What time is it at curiosity? Boom, here's the time. That's kind of fun.

They get to use that now in the live chat. But yeah, I'm trying to build like a website for it, which would be like a cool place to learn about how time works on Mars and play around with it, get some little input field to put your own date in and, you know, find out your Mars birthday or something fun. So maybe there'll be a part two of this pick when I have that ready to go. And we can share that. That's great.

This is like expert mode because the like everyone hates working with time zones. And you were like, yeah, but what about Mars time zones? Like that's where I'm going to go. Yeah, it sucks. But no, it's fun. So you can like you can put in like a longitude and it gives you like the different whatever the Mars equivalent of a time. I don't have time zones, but you can, you know, put in a longitude and find out what, what the solar time is there

and it's kind of neat. It was a really fun challenge. I think I did it over a weekend and it was that's cool to do. Miriam, did you, do you have a pick of any sort? Yeah, I have a pick. So one of the other projects that my husband and I have been doing is we have been watching

Star Trek. And like all of it. And I actually let me shock you. No, I was not historically. a Trekkie of any kind. And then we started to watch TNG when I was on maternity leave a little while ago. And I realized that I had been fooling myself this whole time into believing that I was a Star Wars fan. And in fact, I had been a Trekkie my whole life and I didn't even know it.

So it's been great. So we made it through TNG. We watched all of DS9. We watched. all of Voyager, and now we are watching Enterprise, which I was dreading because I had heard not great stuff about it. But I have to say, it is my pick. It is so good. I'm like shocked by it. I think it is we're like about a season in. We're sort of like most of the way through the first season. And it has been consistent. And yes, there have been bad episodes, but there are bad episodes than any trick. And I just would recommend that anyone goes back to it with an open mind. It's all on Netflix.

It's all there. There's a lot to love. You could have picked just an enterprise theme song. Yeah. Except for the theme song. It's funny. So you know how you can like skip intro on Netflix? It doesn't it doesn't skip it fast enough for me.

There's just like a little, you just hear the, very start of the song and I like I just like see red every time but I'm like no I can't do it. So yeah, pick is enterprise enterprise. I love it. Yeah, that's great. I'm really, I'm proud of you for starting TNG and making it through the first episode and then be like, I still want to watch this show after the like 20 minute scene of Riker like manually piloting the saucer section separation. Like a little to the left A little to the left stop A little bit up stop

It was all worth it It was worth getting through it I got to see Riker Play the bone And I'm pleased every time Weird which is just like wrong in the first season Do you know how like that

What you're getting at is like the pacing of old TV And old boobies and things like that I always wonder what that will feel like 20 years from now Like, what is our pacing weird? Are we the baddies? Like, what's the, are we missing also on this? I just, I wonder that. Because I don't understand that one doesn't make sense to me.

Like, how can you, are we just going to, it's going to be like rapid fire scene cuts? Yeah. That's the thing. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. It's the, the very first Star Trek movie, too, like the original Star Trek movie with Kirk. That had like that same sort of thing.

There was like a 20-minute scene of them going through the like the vortex. whatever and it's just like it's like the special effects people found a machine that makes fun sounds and puts lights on the screen they're like yeah it's machine so we're going to use it for like half the movie I mean 2001 is the ultimate example of that right with like yeah 30 minutes of let it roll let it roll yeah one of the movies had very like 2001 vibes of sort of like a hero shot of the enterprise and space doc. I can't remember which one it was now, but I remember that very distinctly. It's like, okay, we're doing this now.

So, yes, completionist for Bourbon and for Star Trek. Yeah, right? The story of the last year for you. Yeah. The only thing I've been watching is for all mankind, season two. It's a weird season. Boys are weird.

And I think historically my problem with season one was that it was like a very wide show and there was a lot of storylines and none of them got super deep and there was episodes where I was like oh I want like a lot of that storyline and then it doesn't, they don't come back. So I went into season two just like accepting

that I am existing in this world for 10 episodes and I don't need to worry about every little detail. And I like it better that way. But there's boys, there's some weird parts of this season, but it's like, I don't know, it's fun. Like, I'm watching it, I'm interested in the storyline. There's, in the same way the first season happened of like, what if this kind of, the thing that we know happened in space history,

what if that storyline happened? But it was all, all the details were scrambled. And they do that a lot really well, which is cool. So it's fun. I would recommend it. And I think you can still get Apple TV plus free. Like if you do anything, if you pay Apple any money whatsoever somewhere, they'll give it to you forever. I'm riding my free from the new MacBook here.

I'm right my free year of Apple TV. And they're just going to keep extending it until I feel like they've got enough rolling. So it's worth checking out for sure. So I still have to, that said, I still have to watch season finale. Like I'm, it came out yesterday, today, today. I didn't watch it yet. So no spoilers. What's your plug, Jake?

Now I'm interested what you're also plugging. I have a new piece of merchandise, which I'm really excited about. So, I mean, obviously, a big week for Mars with the ingenuity flight. So I don't know if you can bring it up, Anthony, but we made a coffee mug. I was like, the flight is three in the morning for me, and I need a coffee mug. So I made this mug. It was really fun because I had it all, like, I made it all ahead of time with anticipation of getting it out right after the flight to make sure it was all successful. And so on the back of it, there's like, I had to put placeholders when I was building it,

but there's like the flight stats. So you have like the date and the location on Mars and the flight time and all that kind of stuff. And then right there you can see in the middle, there's actual the Alpathy plot from, from Ingenuity's first flight. So it's a commemorative. And I'm really excited about it. People seem to like it, which is great. And you can have it on your desk now if you want to remember this historic moment.

Can you tell me about the pattern on Ingenuity itself? I picked some colors I liked and then made them into stripes. Cool. I don't know if there was more to it. For Mars and that's about it. All right. Awesome. So yeah, that's my plug. Miriam, what have you been working on lately?

Oh, I think I'll plug my newsletter. Yeah. So I write the Axiospace newsletter. It comes out on Tuesdays at 1 p.m. Eastern, I try to be very prompt. So it should be in your inbox right around then every week. I write about all things that we talked about today, like commercial spaceflight, space tourism, spaceflight in general.

And then I am like trained as a science writer. So there's always like a healthy dose of science in there. I have a particular soft spot for Mars and for exoplanet. So if any of that sounds of interest, you can sign up at Oh, hold on a second. My internet cut out immediately as you were giving the domain, so you said you could sign up at and then no one was going to hear it. And I'm very sad about that.

And I need you to repeat that part. No, sure, yeah. You can sign up at axios.com or find me on Twitter. I have the link sort of in my Twitter bio. And I'm Neri Kramer. So, yeah, that's my plug. Can I talk shop with that for like two minutes? I'm really curious to know like how involved that is for you.

I'm one of those people that always wants to write a newsletter, but then I'm like, no, I don't got time. Like, I'm kidding. I mean, it's my job. This is like what I do. So it's a little involved for me. I, the main way that like my week kind of works is I, you know, send the letter on the newsletter on Tuesday.

And then I immediately try to figure out what my sort of main story for next week is going to be. Like sort of could be based off of, usually it's based off of some news happening this week. Like next week preview is sort of about space junk. That is not, and it's not necessarily based off of anything that's happening this week, but more just like theme stuff that's going on, like important stuff that's happening in the space world that people should kind of know about. And then like the sort of the lower items in the newsletter, my like two, three and four, I tend to be just like quick hit news, like maybe a little bit of like a study story or something like that. But like that's also sort of like a very involved version of a newsletter.

It makes sense. Like I read plenty of great stuff that's like a collection of links and is sort of like giving your take about like the stories of the day. Like mine tends is like one of those sort of deeply reported things that we usually do at Axios. So tends to be tends to take my whole week up. But that is, you know, not I don't think that's the forever model of what a newsletter should be. I think there's much room for everyone's vision, if that makes sense. Okay, great. I wholeheartedly love Axios, like, all of the Axios things.

Thank you. How long ago did it start? It wasn't that many years ago. No, I mean, I think we've been around for four, five-ish years, something like that. Not very long. From day one, I was like, oh, I get it. This is great. This is what I'm looking for in my life.

So I'm, like, everybody should check it out if they have not. Thanks. Yeah, we try to keep it short. Yeah, but also not when you need to. It's great. It's the right hits it for me, and I love it. Thanks. Oh, that means a lot. I love hearing it when people are reading our stuff. It's great.

Anthony, what are you working on? Oh, man, the Starship News was the big one this week. So I talked about HLS on my own. And then Eric Berger joined me today for a nice 40-minute discussion. we got into some topics. He was coming out firing on a lot of topics. It was great. I haven't listened yet, but I heard it was spicy.

It was pretty spicy, yeah, on a variety of topics. Because we talked about the Amazon bought nine Atlas Fives, which is crazy. Like, no one buys nine Atlas Fives. That's crazy. And then we talked about Blue Origin, so it got pretty spicy. So you should definitely check it out. Main engine cutoff is that one. also there's like Apple Podcasts is like doing some premium things we need to look into I don't know

why I'm bringing up now but it was just topical and I was like the next time I talk to Jake I need to mention this and this is the next time I talk to Jake. I've not talked a while lately so like we're like catching up in the middle of this broadcast. Yeah so I've been like looking into that. That's what I've been doing this week. I don't know why that's a plug that I have but you know these pears are going down nice. It's good.

Okay. Well we promise to do our homework next month and we'll be on quicker. but, you know, towards the end of the month, expect us. And Miriam is like, this is excellent. This was like such a great episode of Offnominal. This is exactly what I always want out of Offnominal. Someone completely sleep deprived who has just gotten her second vaccine job. We all woke up too early today.

And is drinking bourbon, yeah, it's perfect. And it's drinking bourbon. You nailed it. You're stuck to lander today. One, two, three, four, five, four, three, two, one, end of death.