Off-Nominal - 69 - Was That NASA or MythBusters?

Episode Date: July 8, 2022

Anthony is joined by Joe Barnard of BPS.Space and Tim Dodd (the Everyday Astronaut!) to talk about how to cook meat with a very fast rocket, what life is like in Boca Chica lately, and…what has NASA been doing with those chickens?TopicsOff-Nominal - YouTubeEpisode 69 - Was That NASA or MythBusters? (with Joe Barnard and Tim Dodd) - YouTubeSEND IT! - Level 3 Rocket Build - YouTubeSEND IT! - Level 3 Rocket Launch Process - YouTube2022 Elon Musk Explains Updates To Starship And Starbase! - YouTubeGo up SpaceX's Starship-catching robotic launch tower with Elon Musk! - YouTubeElon Musk Explains SpaceX's Merlin Engine! - YouTubeFollow JoeBPS.SpaceBPS.space - YouTubeJoe Barnard (@joebarnard) / TwitterFollow TimEveryday AstronautEveryday Astronaut - YouTubeEveryday Astronaut (@Erdayastronaut) | TwitterFollow JakeWeMartians Podcast - Follow Humanity's Journey to MarsWeMartians Podcast (@We_Martians) | TwitterJake Robins (@JakeOnOrbit) | TwitterFollow AnthonyMain Engine Cut OffMain Engine Cut Off (@WeHaveMECO) | TwitterAnthony Colangelo (@acolangelo) | TwitterOff-Nominal MerchandiseOff-Nominal Logo TeeWeMartians Shop | MECO Shop

DLS and go for main engine, start. Hello, friends. Welcome to Off Nominal. We've got, as I equipped on Twitter earlier, when Jake is out of town, I hire some legitimate YouTubers to join us on the show here. So we've got Joe Barnard, sometimes Tony Pepperoni, as the co-host here. And soon we got Tim Dodd, the Everday Astronaut, showing up. There's something going on. I assume he's in Boca Chica, so there's something going on down there, but he'll be with us in a couple minutes. How's it going, Joe? I'm doing well, how are you?

Oh, you know, it's good to be here. Oh, look at this, right on cue. We've got a... Oh, is it Tom did? Tom did the occasional scuba man or whatever you said. It's Tom, it's Tim Dow. The Everettian astronaut? Hi, guys.

We're live. You called in right as we're live. So you nailed it on the intro. Ah, that's what I do best. Yeah. We assume there were some shenanigans going on down there. So what's been going on in your neck of the woods? Oh, man.

Okay, well, first off, I'm hearing myself, which is just a nightmare. So I'm getting the brain jam. No, no, we're not hearing you because you took your Bluetooth out. Okay, it's terrible. This is just the game dog. I don't know. Anyway, can you still hear me? Yeah, you're back now.

Yeah. Okay. So more of the story. Yeah, we're dealing with like three different issues down here. We're trying to get our 4K streaming set up ready for potentially a starship orbit. launch-ish soon. You know, we just want to be, we're trying to be prepared. And, uh, it's an absolute nightmare. We like, we have four lines of data and all we're trying to get is 20 megabits per second upload, which is like nothing. At home, I'm sitting on 10 gigs. I can literally

shoot 7,000 megabits per second up to, uh, frame.io. And here I'm struggling to get 20 on four different services, including Starlink, two spectrums, and AT&T. And those combined can't even get us a stable 20. Then we also found out that the way we're going to be getting 4K streams from like our remote cameras, Joe, you might be interested in this. Do you know if you stream out the SSP protocol in Zcams, it turns off the ability to record? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

If you use a Zcamp to stream, if you... Hold on, your Bluetooth. You're doing a lot of Bluetooth management. You're back. He's gone again. Bluetooth Tim's back. Are you back? You might need to quit your browser or something.

Your AirPods or whatever you've got there are all screw with you. Are they better now? Yeah, you're back. You're back. Yeah, yeah. Okay. So, okay, wait. So if you do that, if you take a Z cam and record at the same time out of the NDI port or out of the Aepidap port.

That's really cool that they did that. That's a super cool thing. Now, Joe, this is fantastic. Is this problematic for you because you are known to kill a couple of SD cards in your life. So maybe you should stick to the streaming? I do like, Tim, I like that you asked me the other day, you were like, how do you set up your stream? And I was like, you don't want what I got, man. I like, I'm like going around Verizon's back.

Like, I'm changing. Like, I've got terminal open on my computer right now because we did a patron stream earlier today. and I'm like hacking through like trying to trick Verizon into not knowing that I'm on the network. And the way that Tim's doing it is definitely more through the front door. I'm curious, how do you not get it? How do you have four connections and you can't get 20 megabits? It's in the middle of nowhere. Something about, yeah.

Well, even like Port Isabel, it's just basically impossible. They have fiber run to a few places, but they will not bring it out here without $20,000 and $500 a month for a five-year contract. Yeah. So it's like, no, we're not doing that. And you have to do a whole environmental assessment to get them to run that line as well. Well, it's the thing it would take three to five months, too. You got to put up historical markers about what used to be at your house.

It's a real situation. You got to write a book report, Tim. Wait, I skipped over the whole drink segment where we talk about what we're drinking. Joe, you recently woke up from a nap. Are you drinking anything at the moment? Yeah, I think I can go. grab some. Tim, why don't you go first? He's out of here. He's gone. I mean, in normal, typical

three o'clock off-nominal fashion, I'm drinking a delicious off-nominal razz cranberry. That is nice. I got a similarly typical off-nominal situation. I've got a dogfish head 90-minute IPA. This is a very delicious. Oh, see, that's an actual this is a legitimate drink. Yeah. Dang it. Why don't know what he grabs. I grab my drink. I grab what I'm drinking today. I have from the from the lovely

kind of angry woman at the gas station in Lucerne Valley California I have this it's a sparkling water it's lime that's fancy good makes a nice nice when you open that's fancy I love that you're gonna we are making Anthony look like an absolute alcoholic at this point yes one of us hosts the show that you drink beer and talk about space stuff So that's totally legitimate. I can get a beer. It will ruin my day at this point. I woke up like 15 minutes.

Yeah, let's hear about your desert travails today. Like, what's going on out there? Yes. I was up until 10, but that's not 10 p.m. I was up until 10 a.m. Because I did a launch this morning. I did a launch and landing test. And they're getting closer.

You know, it's not working yet. We're like finding all of the ways that it can't work. But then I got back here with my, my trusty seltzer and passed out and then woke up just in time for this so we're doing great yeah we should talk about what you've been up to lately because you had a pretty epic um this level three rocket that you've this was like what a month ago that you posted no two weeks ago a week ago yeah yeah something like that it was like all of june rocket motor to well yeah the timeline in your life was way longer than the timeline in our life in which we have now enjoyed this um

I thoroughly enjoyed the, you had a great recap of things that go wrong the day before launch. And maybe I should skip to that part. Yeah, there's like no avoiding that. It's the same thing as like you decide, hey, I'm going to do a stream. Tim knows this. But like, you're like, hey, I'm going to do a stream. And then it's like all of the cables that were just about to break decide that they're going to break. And like everything that can't go wrong well.

That was a fun project, though. That was really cool. It was like a pretty easy rocket, relatively speaking, because you just get parachutes out and, you know, it'll come back down either way. But, yeah, it was fun to do a project where I can like start it and finish it in the course of a month because most of my stuff is a lot longer. So it was really, it was like, satisfied to do that.

Can you give us like the rundown on where this is in the Joe Barnard Cinematic Universe? like you're on this general mission to launch something to space, but you have a lot of solar tasks in there. And so where does this isn't even like parallel universeism is. Yeah. In the Joe Barnard's cinematic universe, uh, okay,

in the canon of, of the cinematic universe, this doesn't actually need to be there. It's mostly just, um, like you can go to space without getting your level three certification. Um, but it gives you a lot more.

It's like a, it's like a trust building measure with these organizations to be like, look, I'm going to go ahead and do it the right way. And there's a bunch of fun parts of this process that were omitted from the video is the way that I'll say that. But I got the certification. It's done. And mostly the flight was just like, you know, good to get some experience under my belt because

the next thing I'll do is insane. That's the meat rocket. Wait, before we get to the meat rocket. Keep focus here, focus here. You mentioned in the video that level three certification, it's like basically when you do a good amount of science and curbel and it unlocks a bunch of parts. Like this is effectively, you're going up the tech tree. Yeah, you're going up the tech tree.

Have you made any purchases in this life? Or have you gotten your paperwork back? I don't know how this works. No, the paper, these organizations work pretty slow because they're like not, you know, they don't have a ton of people. And so I haven't gotten my paperwork back. I guess there's a chance that I totally failed it. and I just lied to everyone on YouTube,

which like, sorry. But, yeah, no, I mean, it worked pretty well. It was a super basic project, but it wasn't,

you get the certification with the organization, and it's not like a legal thing necessarily. So you can still buy massive motors. You can still, like, build, well, it's really more you can build massive motors

without having this certification. But getting the certification, is like a measure of good trust of like I want to do it the right way and for a lot of these older folks that are like running the show with the organizations it's kind of good to show that you want to do your homework yeah um if that makes sense why you include um segments such as these okay so that's one great way welcome back to Tony pepperoni leans his entire body weight onto about six pounds of ammonium perchlorated composite rocket propellant

because this is doing it the right way right? This is the cut. Yeah no and I'm glad you picked this one not the one where we're hammering it in with a dead low mouth. I should let it move a little farther in the background while we're checking. I love that. This did make me very nervous. The hammer moment made me very nervous. I was pretty sure you're about to go off your garage. I'm not going to say it's an amazing idea but I will say

that like APCP was developed as this like to be a really safe propellant. That stuff won't become a problem for you until you really try to light it and you really try to contain it. That's what I'll say. So you got to really do it wrong before it gets you in trouble. Level four certification is which propellants can you or can't you hit with a hammer? That's the test. Yeah. Which of these things would you hit? It's just one question. Yeah, yeah. It's just one question. Wait, what do you mean light it or try to contain it. Like if you try to like, oh, you mean like, if I took a match, don't do this. If I took a match and I put it next to that rocket motor,

I should be careful what I say here. Um, it's going great. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't light. Like APCP really wants to like under pressure. So when you start one of those motors, half of, more than half of the process of starting it is just building the pressure inside the case. Right. Like you know about, you know all about combustion and instivis. Oh my gosh. combustion efficiency and how it goes up with your pressure and your chamber, right? It's the same thing with solid rockets. Like below a certain point, the AP doesn't want a light.

And so until it's contained, it's A, like, it could catch on fire, but it won't explode. It's not a, it's not like an explosive compound necessarily where it won't, it won't detonate. It'll just burn. Like it'll be a really pretty fire. Um, you also, just for the record, like, I'm running on like, I've been awake for 20 minutes today and I am not an expert. So don't take any of this. I'm about 70% sure of what I'm saying. That's the way I want my Joe Barnard. I mean, I have, I selected a couple clips from both of your recent videos, uh, that I thought would be fun to, to play on the show. And I feel like this is a good moment to pivot to, uh, Tim, one of your recent star base tours. in which acclaimed smart person Elon Musk had one of my favorite quotes of all time, so I'd just like everyone to sit back and enjoy this one. At an angle similar to the shuttle of like, I don't know, 60, 70 degrees.

So it's sort of like if the ground is the surface of the earth, we're... He just said, if the ground is the surface of the earth, which didn't need an explanation. If the ground is the surface of the earth. The ground is the surface of the earth. If in that case, it is the surface of the Earth. Here's what it would look like. What if it's the moon? I guess.

Or Mars. Yeah. This means thinking about other planets, man. It's true. All right. You know what? You saved it there. You saved it there.

I just want to, I just want to, I want to make a little protest here that you brought up a clip of me hammering ammonium bricklorate. And then you brought a clip of Tim interviewing Elon Musk. And that feels a little bit off balance to me in terms of how good it makes us like. Yeah. Well, all of my clips of it. YouTube are me sitting here drinking beer. So, you know, you know, don't get too high and mighty. So, Tim, you're back in Boca Chica now. I assume you were, you were not there for a long time, right, while all the environmental assessment situation was going on. Like, you had kind of just cooled off

to see how things were going to go. Sorry, I'd switch things around and now I can actually hear myself without crying. Can you repeat the question? I'm talking about your time in Bocaca, because you had, I think the last time we talked to, we still didn't know how like the whole environmental situation was going to go. So you were right kind of just hedging your schedule and had not been down there for a while. I've now spent two weeks back down here. And as you can tell, SpaceX is ramping up like crazy. There's a lot of testing going on. We have both B7 booster and S24 at the, at the size, you know, getting ready to be tested here and static fired and all this stuff. So things are ramping up.

I don't know for sure if it's going to be in the next, I don't know. What do you guys think? I feel like we're maybe two months feels possible. A month or two feels maybe even possible. But I don't know. So therefore I'm like, you know, scrambling. I'm back in scramble mode. Yeah.

How soon is it going to be? I mean, that's what I actually want to know from you from now being there again, right? Like there's this whole list of things that have to happen before you're going to be doing your stream for the launch. Are any of those things, like, visible? Do you see active wildlife stands being set up? And have you read any recent reports on the Civil War? So, I don't know how much of that stuff needs to be, like, actively finished or, like,

in process, you know, like, hey, we now have a person looking for oscillates or whatever. Like, is that, like, good enough? Or do they have to see an oscillat before that gets checked off? That would be incredible. If the FBI license is held up. I have a question about the book report. I have a question about the book report If it's like riddled with spelling errors

Are they gonna make them go back and like redo it? And then they run it through one of those Who sees that? What's the thing that you run it through the night before To check if you've plagiarized everything Like they got a lot of... Yeah, yeah If it turns out that they just ripped a bunch from Wikipedia

They just copy pasted The War of 1841 I mean that's the pro move actually Is to hire a bunch of people from Wikipedia to write the report. Yeah. I mean, why not? Circulate that, Tim.

Circulate that amongst the people down there. That is the thing. I don't know how many things have to be completely in, like, you know, moving or whatever or done. I have just no idea, honestly. So we'll see. But meanwhile, like, yeah, we're in full-blown panic mode just trying to get stuff stable and running and blah, blah, blah, because I don't want to miss this.

yeah and it feels like i don't know i've got that pressure of like oh god it feels like it's actually close but then knowing you know how s and eight and nine how long they took to you know really they yeah from rollout to it was over two months i think for each of them there's a big there's a big gap between eight and nine and we all thought like oh it's going to be like in a week and it wasn't so that's trying not to go you know especially with all those engines under there yeah it seems like that's a lot to do. I don't know. I still can't believe there's no like

deluge system or anything. I just don't know how this is going to turn out. There's not like a ton of it, but aren't there some sprayers that go inward? Like a little. I think. Like just. It's a sprinkler.

I don't know. It's just a bunch of garden hosts and just put it on the mist setting. Yeah. It's kind of what it looks like. It's definitely not anything you know, like the shuttle. You know, or 39B or anything like that or 39A where they have the giant water tower with a tube the size of a house. But, you know, you'd think that's what it would take to actually suppress sound and all that stuff.

I don't know. I have no idea. How are your windows at the house? Oh, man. How are those doing it blown out? So that's a hot topic. What's your insurance like? Does it cover Axe of Elon as well?

Anything around here has hurricane rated windows. You know, like if, I mean, if they're within, I think everything should. And I think rumors have it. This was just rumor. I didn't have any collaborating, corroborating sources on this. But people were saying that SpaceX was going around to older buildings and checking on the island and making sure that people's windows were up to code. And someone claims that a business got free windows from SpaceX that, like, were hurricane-proof windows.

Claims. Now, I, again, no idea. but if okay so if it goes off normal and it flies and no big deal I don't think it will break windows for the most part you know maybe in the village some of those will break but I think the big you know the big thing is if it like falls back on the pad or ruds on the pad that's a if doing a lot of work in that sense I'll be honest that's yeah feels less iffy than my well of course I'm the one that made the prediction when we talked like a year and a half ago that a wing is going to fall off a starship at some point.

So we'll see. I don't have the best track record for predicting failure modes of these things. I really think they've got the Raptor 2 tame so much more that running 33 of them doesn't feel as like terrible. I think a year ago that sounded really scary. But it feels like they've tests the Raptor 2 so stinking much now that it doesn't feel scary. So lighting 33 of them and being able to shut one down if something happens preemptively,

I think they'll have a chance. I don't think it's going to be as like, I don't think it's going to end one. We'll put it that way. I don't think it's going to end one. The Vegas odds on that would be quite entertaining. At least not N1 flight three or four. Like the one that went basically straight back down.

Because wasn't it the first one that actually went the furthest? And then the first one almost made it to stage set. One of them was like cooking. One of them did pretty well. Yeah. Almost made it to stage set like within, I don't know, 20 or 30 seconds.

So I think it'll do that. Do you think? So you've, you've watched a lot of their progress with both like S&8 and S&9, a lot of earlier testing and stuff like that. Do you think that like it's been, I think it's been longer than any of us thought to like get to static fire or get to like this point? Do you think they have used that time to like streamline stuff or do you think they can't do that so much without just doing the tests themselves?

Do you know what I mean? like streamlined stuff as in like um just the operations like how quickly they get tests run up yeah yeah um so when you talk about like when we talk about like SN8 was on the pad for you know two months three months however before it flew um you know you have to imagine that like they've learned a bunch since then and have they been able to like anticipate things with like the booster get into the pad where they can really start rolling more what do you think yeah i think operational Again, I think a lot of it was just, they were, Raptors were so new, so relatively untested.

You know, like SN8 had, I think, in the, you know, dozen, like 12, 14, and 18 serial number engine or something, you know. And now we're into the hundreds. So just the amount of, you know, time they spent firing and testing and using Raptor, I think is going to help a lot because that was half the thing. It's like they'd go for a static fire, you know. This could also be like, we're on the hundreds because they blew up seven. of them. You know what I mean? Like,

how many have we seen? How many Raptors have, has the public seen? Okay, well, Booster's World Warwick up a ton. Yes, that's true. I'm not saying we haven't. I'm just saying, like, we should count how many we've seen, and then compare it to the serial number. Well, we know there's 29 out there in existence on Booster 4. There's 33, so there we got 62.

Yeah, we're already most of the way. Yeah. plus the 12 from the other ones. I mean, that seems pretty good, actually. Yeah, honestly. Like, if you made a bet two years ago, like, we're on zero number 100 and something, how many still exist? I don't know many people that would pick, like, I don't know, 70 or 80? Yeah.

I mean, that's pretty good. That's reasonable. Yeah. That's the thing that was, like, just think about how many times they would have S&8 or nine or any of them sitting out there on the pad, like, waiting to static fire or whatever, and, you know, they'd try to light it and it just went, like, you know, or they'd have a good, yeah, just a bad static fire. And it seems like they're beyond that.

Ish. We'll see, I guess, when they try to actually like 33. And knowing in the early days how many things they were working out with like ground systems, that's still in work. But they had a lot of other, at the time of S&8, like they didn't have a lot of things that they could sit on the pad and play with. Whereas there's been a long gap where they've had plenty of hardware sitting around to like, this is my problem with the SLS situation that Jake and I talked about a couple weeks back,

that like this vehicle that they took out to Kennedy was the first time they could hook anything up to anything at Cali. And whereas in Boca Chica, there's just like, we got this old booster. It's kind of close. Things don't really match exactly right, but like we can just test it out a couple different ways and see how things fit. And so they have a benefit there, whereas S&8 days, like they were still doing construction on basics in the area.

The one big unknown though, and I was just talking with someone about this the other days, and I don't know if this is true, but I don't think they've, ever loaded liquid oxygen and liquid methane from like the, you know, the new ground systems into the orbital launch mount mount standard stuff. And there could be a lot of kinks there, you know, for any kind of first. Because they've done nitrogen, liquid nitrogen. And I think they've put liquid oxygen in, but I don't remember now. Like, I don't know if they've ever done a full load of, no, they definitely haven't

because if they do a full load of liquid methane and liquid oxygen, like there will be, you know, an exclusion zone of... Yeah, they'd have to close the whole. A small nuke. Yeah. Most of Texas would be, like, camping for the weekend. For real. What is your sense for...

What are you guys in? Come on. No, I've had one more thing, because you went up the launch tower and we're, like, glazing over the fact that you went up this crazy thing with robotic arms and shit. And, um... What was the time elapsed between the last time you did a tour and this time, like, in real life? Was it like... It was only, like, eight months.

Only eight months, okay. other than having this epic view what were your main like did you have any moments when you were walking around like oh shit like things have changed significantly since I've been around these parts other than like I said this terrifyingly epic view

yeah up the tower is definitely the big I mean by far the biggest one just because that tower didn't even exist oh I guess it did actually the tower was out there last time but you know the ground system was being built still the tanks were being built it just looks a lot more complete and finished and all looks more official, you know. But big surprises, honestly, was I think almost more back at the build site where things

are starting to get a little tidied up and we're starting to see them actually build a factory over the tents and stuff. That feels more permanent and more real to me than like just tents. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the tents were cool, though. There was a vibe to that, you know. Elon loves those tents.

All right, we got to talk about the meat rocket. We can't let this show go any longer before we talk about the meat rocket. Meat rocket. Yes, let's hear about the meat rocket. Eat that meat. Yes. I got so many good names for it too. I don't want to tip my hand.

But this is the best project I've ever done. Here's the best part. Okay, so I'll just high level. If you don't know what the meat rocket is, when you start going fast, whatever is going fast starts to heat. up. And so about once you once you pass like mock two, these effects start to stack up in meaningful ways. And so I have a rocket motor in my living room that I'm looking at right now that will get us to about Mach 3 and change. And at that speed running some really like unproven math

on this, we should be able to get a surface temperature on the tip of the nose. of about like 270 degrees Fahrenheit. That's enough for some, you know, some thin piece of meat to get cooked pretty well if we're really careful about how we secure it. So what we need is like some type of shield that's over the meat because you don't want to, you don't want the meat to get stripped away.

You want to save it. And so the goal is we're going to launch this thing to mock bejesus and it's going to go to like 40,000 feet. It's going to cook. along the way because of how fast it goes. And then the other thing is like the heat soaks into the meat because it'll be like this metal structure that like stays hot for a little bit. And then when it lands, we're going to bring out like, oh, I don't, okay,

I don't want to give it all the way because there's a lot of really fun tidbits to like the meme of this video. But when it lands, we'll go out and we'll eat the meat. Like the, you have to eat it. It's cooked. You have to eat it. And I'm totally willing to get food poisoning from this. I was going to say, you have to eat it even if it's not cooked.

That's the rule. Absolutely. No, no, no. Like, I fully commit to that. But the other crazy thing, too, you mentioned that, like, one of the goals that I have is to do a space shot. So I want to go to 100 kilometers at some point. And as, you can do 80.

Stupid. No, I'm not doing 80. That's not space. We're not going to have this conversation. No, we're not. The craziest thing is that the Meat Rocket actually helps us get there because Mach 3 is a pretty happy medium ground between like Mach 5 and Mach 1 1 1.5. Like I've been to about Mach 1 and a half. And then so like inching up how fast we go.

So I can learn how to build structures that can survive that. How I can I can learn how to analyze like the dynamic loading that happens when you have like shock waves that are moving down the vehicle. who pass through different aerodynamic regimes. And it's all in the name of cooking meat. You're smoking these meats at 40,000 feet. Are you going to get this sponsored by like the American Beef Society or whatever? No, man. Dude, we have to.

I know exactly. No, Joe, I've got it, man. I've got it. We're going to workshop this right now because I live very close to the people that you need to sponsor this whole situation. You say you need a thin piece of meat, right? We can't be doing thick cut steaks, but we could do. thin steak. Okay.

Okay. Tony pepperoni take his trip down from New York and hang out with me in Philadelphia for a couple days. We're eating thin sliced thin sliced cheese steaks here all day long. And I think cheese steak meat is the perfect thickness for this. Maybe it's a little thin,

but I don't know. Maybe we could stack a couple things. I'm just saying, you could I'll walk right down 9th Street here, go to Gino's and Pats and I can stop at a couple others to see if they want to sponsor too. But we can Philly cheese steaks for sure. Can you next day air me some some meat from Gino's pizza?

A hundred percent, yes. No, it's not pizza, it's cheese steaks. You've never been to Philadelphia. I've never been to Philadelphia. I don't think you should do like really nice. Yes, I've had a cheesecake. So you know what I'm talking about? The thickness.

Does that seem like the right thickness? Yeah. That seems something to me. You think it seems thick to me? You think it seems like... I think it should be some really nice like waggy beef. Like it should be, I should be paying. Okay, class it up a bit, did you?

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It's not just gas station. Listen, quick star. All I'm saying is I've seen you use some pretty weak-ass epoxy in some of these rockets, and cheese whiz probably could do fine. I could probably hold your cameras in just as good. Get them.

Damn. It's coming for my epoxy choices. Well, guys, in Europe, you can have, like, beef tartar or something that's just completely raw meat. Right, and if it gets cooked, like, cool. raid. Yeah. I mean, that would be

their choice for the health, yes. Yeah. You want some type of meat that like would theoretically be, I'm torn because part of me wants to do chicken and commit to like, if I don't do the math right,

I get salmonella. And so like that's funny for the stakes of it, right? Pun intended. Through the stakes of it. The stakes to me. Yeah. Uh, no,

I think it should be like some kind of nice. Yeah. Um, I think it should be some like wagging beef, something real nice. Okay. Well, can the second one be a Philly Cheese Stick? Can I come out for it? Yeah, when the first one inevitably fails and then I double down,

I'm like, yeah, no, I want to do this again. I'll pack it cooler. I'll bring some steaks. Yeah. What happens if this vehicle breaks apart like at not even Mach 1 and are you going to have to eat it then? Well, if we can find it, I do think I should eat. Anything that goes more than Mach 3?

And what's the, it just gets thrown away? You got to put that food to good use. Well, what do you, what do you, is it going to be, is it just going to be like raw steak inside your rocket or is going to be slightly encased in something? Listen, if you are lucky enough to come across a little bit of desert meat, you got to eat it. It's true. That's true. Yeah. Well, yeah, I don't, if this doesn't work, this is one of those projects where it's a real fine line between is it worth it to try doing this again?

We'll see I love that When did you start ruminating on this as an idea Oh this has been This has been percolating for a long time I actually I was on a call Do you know William Osmond? I think so

He makes like goofy videos on YouTube Just a lot of science and I don't know how to describe what he goes It's chaos Yeah Oh, yes. Anyway, he was the one who first got me thinking about it. He was like, what if he like, I don't remember exactly what he said, but he got me thinking

about an idea that was really close to this. And so for the last year and a half, this idea has been like in my head, like, that would be really funny. Like for the bit, it would be really funny to cook the meat by going fast enough. And then there's all these other ideas where like, if the meat were bacon, you could also put a little reservoir up top and. brew some coffee with how hot it gets in there. And it would be like, you know, half a fluid ounce of coffee.

And you can do a breakfast rocket. And then you put a bowl of raw eggs under the motor so that when it lights, it just scrambles them instantly. Ooh. Breakfast rocket. Breakfast rocket. Breakfast rocket is really good. It's all, it's all, there are a lot of projects I do where I'm like,

especially for the landing stuff. Like, I'm in the weeds and I'm trying to do some really hard engineering and, like, do it just for the pure engineering of it. And this project is like, how clickbaiting can I get with a rock? Are you going to do any subscale tests where you, like, make a, have a nose cone that you heat up to the right, you know, based on your simulation, what you're going to achieve on the flight and see how you best can cook it? That feels like a smart idea. I haven't gotten that far yet. it feels like a pretty smart idea. Yeah.

Because you can do a third-up. You could do like a breakfast model, a cheese steak model, and the Wagyu beef. And just like run them all at the same time. See which ones would be the most delicious. You could do a shootout. Does the heating only occur at the nose cone for the most part? Or does it actually continue to go down the rocket? Because what if the whole walls were just a sleeve of meat?

Bacon walls. It trails off. Any surface that is feet like colliding with a lot of air molecules. So the nose is primarily where it would be. The other interesting option is doing the leading edges of the fins as meat. But the problem is it's really hard. I want some thermo couples in there because I want to be able to read,

this is the best part about it too. I want to be able to read how hot the meat is in the air over telemetry so that on the ground I can radio and I say, can I get a meat check please? It's all for that It's all for the meat I feel like this whole thing is literally just so you can radio that in Yeah this is incredible

It's all for the bit If I learned anything from Tid's recent videos You need to put some chines on this rocket So you can cook additional meat on various parts of the vehicle I'm pretty sure that's what I learned from T's video Yeah maybe Those things look sick by the way They look cool on the booster

Do they? I think they look kind of dumb. You don't like them? No. Speak to that. I'm surprised it's not more like molding. Yes, exactly. I want something a little more organically shaped. I think it's great. I feel like it's awesome.

They were just like, let's put some sheets of metal on here and call it a day. Put some angry triangles here at 120 degrees for each other and good enough. Now, could you cook meat in those? Yes. you know, I think I think this is probably worth Elon's time

I don't think we should ask him about this Take a trip down, Joe Yeah If you can run some demonstrators Reentry Can you imagine a sense stake And reentry steak? I would take reentry for sure

Someone did Put like a ham in a wind tunnel once I can't remember but I saw photos of it They put like a ham in a hypersonic wind tunnel and it just blows itself apart because the trick is that you have to transfer all of that thermal energy into the meat without transferring any of the

like kinetic air molecule energy into it and so you need a really thin piece of metal that just shields it I think to conduct the heat I've got to be honest I'm getting no results on ham meat in a wind tunnel no results on Google for that

I saw it on Twitter at some point it looks crazy We know that NASA shot a, was it a turkey or a chicken out of an air cannon to try to blow a hole in a... Wait, was that NASA or was that MythBusters? Same thing. Actually, it's a really dark joke to make, but... I was going to say that's what they shot at the leading edge of the shuttle wing when they were doing the Columbia investigation. Oh, no.

Okay. That's what I was... I feel like I've seen footage. It was definitely mid-busters. foam. Okay, MythBusters shot something. Yeah. Why was MythBusters doing it? What were they doing? Do they need reasons? What about that show made you think they need reasons? You never watched MythBusters? I feel like that was up your alley, Joe.

Oh, no, no, no. I say I would watch that. Like, that's the reason is that people would watch it. I wouldn't watch that. Yeah, I'm look this up for a second. MythBusters, was it like a, do you remember what they were shooting it at? I think it was originally, well, I feel like it was the leading edge of a wing. I'm 100% sure that you're thinking of the, oh, wait, maybe. The Columbia foam. Oh, no, it might have been a bird strike test. Let's see. Oh.

I know they accidentally did it froze. No, I went about this one time. That feels like Mythbusters, where they would simulate a couple of like smaller bird strikes and they'd be like, well, we also bought this rotissory chicken. Yeah, I think, I think that's what happened. I'm pretty sure. But I feel like... That's what happened.

I need someone to fact-check this too. I feel like NASA actually did that for something, and they realized they needed to unthaw the chickens because they're shooting them frozen. And it was just, you know, way more projectile. What did you say, Joe? What are they doing? What is NASA doing shooting chickens out of a gun, though? I'm really trying to...

Hold on a second. Real quick. It's not to be. That's a sentence from a... NASA conspiracy theory video on YouTube for sure. What is NASA doing shooting chickens out of guns? Shooting chickens. That's what you sound like. NASA chicken guy.

I'm just typed in NASA chicken gun. The chicken cannon Snopes.com. British train engineer supposedly received help from the FAA about the proper use of chicken launchers. Hello?

Okay, well, I don't know what that is. Joe's getting a whole new idea for an upcoming video. When you type in NASA chicken gun, the third result is myth-busters. He's going to cook steak and see if he can cook the chicken on the way by. I don't know where we've gotten with this show.

I don't know about English-academic.com. But they say the misnames. The misnames is English-acadacadacadacadic.com. It's academic. Only the best source for. One of the several large diameter compressed air canons used by the FAA and the U.S. Air Force to test strength of aircraft windshields and the safety of jet engines using like to test for bird strikes. Yeah, I guess I'm wondering why you wouldn't pick birds that fly at the level of airplanes.

No, no, this makes sense to me. I don't know like what. It totally makes sense to me that you start with the small birds and then at some point, someone goes to the grocery store and they're like listen let's just see what happens it is cheap it's a cots program right there if you've got the wind tunnel time just like commercial out of the refrigerated section of the grocery store that's it's COTD commercial off the deli yeah oh my god I get it it is it is cheaper but like I've got a lot of Canadian geese in my neighborhoods down here, so.

See, a chicken would be a decent analog for like a goose. Oh, I was saying that those are free if you do it right. Oh. Yeah. There's a lot of them. That's all the same. Anyway, that's true. Yeah, I'm wondering about

your test program for cooking all this stuff. I've just been ruminating on that some more. How would you heat up a test object for this? Oh, blowtorch. Yeah, blowd torch. Is that fast enough, though?

Yeah, you just measure. Well, we don't need to, well. I'm trying to do this realistic. Here's the thing. Test as we fly. I'm not. Test as we cook. Fly as you fly, test as you test.

Cook as you fly. Yeah, I think we can do an amount of math. I think I have the ability to go on Twitter.com and toss out some math and be like, Can someone please fact-check me on if you think this is actually right? And then what we'll do is we'll toss a blowtorch on there, see if the heat actually moves through the object the way we think. You can probably get a thermal imager, like if we really needed it to like visualize that. But at some point, you've got to stick some meat in there and see what happens.

You know? Yeah. Boy, if I haven't heard that. Life is about taking risks. Yeah. Life is about taking risks and staying out of the wind tunnel. What is the scale of this meat rocket as you're imagining it? Is it similar to some of your recent stuff or is this a bigger vehicle?

Yeah, so it'll be pretty, it'll be, it's huge. Yeah, it's about Falcon 9.006. In between Send it and Lumineer. So Lumineer was like 9, 10 feet tall. Send it was like my ish height. And so it'll be, I don't know. I can't do the math on that. But I don't have the actual height yet, but it'll be four inches in diameter.

and I'm trying to get a conical nose cone because conical nose cones are really good for high mock stuff but I cannot find one yet Is it where it's just a straight It doesn't taper it all just completely like straight walls The tapers are always prettier but conical's a little bit Better if you're like really going For it like when I do the space shot it'll probably be a conical nose cone

That also gives you I don't know how to. That's true to. Even too. You don't want it to. Yeah. Anyway, there's a lot of work to do in the meat rocket. Like there is no CAD.

There is no physical design. It's just this idea that I have started purchasing parts for. So now it has to happen. Wait. Question. If you're making like a metal sharp cone. Yeah. Is that bad?

Like, is that like just a projectile more than... Is that bad? It does certainly look like a reentry vehicle. Yes, if that's what you're asking. Yeah, no. And like, if it doesn't... This is the same thing with any rocket. Oh, yeah, dangerous.

If you don't get the parachutes out, you get in the bunker. And honestly, at that point, with that scale of rocket, like, you're safer not in the bunker. This is the funny thing about going in the bunker out in the desert when, like, something's coming in ballistic. You're actually safer. don't take my word for this but I think you're safer out of the bunker not with a ceiling over your head because if it comes

and it hits the bunker it's going right through it like something that scale and it'll take the ceiling down with it and so the better thing to just stand out in the open yeah and if it kills you it'll kill you instantly you'll have no idea it's kind of a binary thing at that point and there will be two pieces of cooked meat binary that yeah

and a skewery Yeah, right. It's a Joe Kabab. That's what you want. You become a kebab. Joe Kabob. No, it's a metal tip nose. It's a big pointy rocket and it will not feel great if you get hit by it.

So we're going to try to not do that. Yeah. Yeah, don't do that. No, it's a bad plan. This is why you have redundancy, all of your systems. Yeah. Yeah, I'm gonna convince you to put some cheese steak in this rocket and come out. Although it noted the last couple shows I've talked about how disappointing the California desert is.

So I might be kind of disappointed when we're there. I've got to be honest. It's a disappointing. The desert is beautiful. The desert is beautiful. The California one is just disappointing compared to the other ones that we have in this in this nation. That's all I'm saying. What's your problems with it?

A little east. It's just boring looking compared to Utah and Arizona. It's boring. I don't think it's a good enough. argument yeah boring looking sorry you guys have to see sorry sorry to change gears a little bit did you have to see dude perfect had like yeah one to space with New Shepherd and or one of them is and they did like a contest and they had no bunker or anything they had some large rockets there flying how did you feel

about that safety Joe well so they don't I don't know how transparent they are it, but they worked with this company called Locke Precision, and Locke actually built all of their rockets. So, like, this is not a big surprise. This happens with a lot of larger YouTube channels, so, but yeah, that's kind of how most launches work. You just keep your eye on it, and if it starts coming towards you, you try to move away. It's a little yaha parts of amateur rocketry. It's just, think about the statistics of, like, you know, there's some probably, that it hits within a circle. And if you're one point in that circle,

like the larger the circle is, your probability gets like really, really low. And that's kind of the odds that you're playing. Yeah. That's all I tell myself will be totally fine.

Yeah, I was going to say, that's how I tell myself will be fine out here. Yeah. It's a big circle. Do you know how far it can have to be for the orbital launch?

Well, there's been rumors swirling around that it will go beyond the five-mile radius, which I do not under, I can't fathom how that work. Because if it goes to six miles,

the south bit of Port Isabel would be totally, like, had to be emptied. And the south part, anything south of the Pearl Hotel on South Padre would also have to be, like, completely evacuated. And I just can't imagine the logistics of how you clear out, you know, a thousand people in Port Isabel and, you know, a couple hotels and condominiums and stuff.

And is LeBlanka Park, which has, like, hundreds of camping spots and the K-O-A? I don't know how, I just don't know how they clear that. You know, we're talking about thousands of people having, like, a mandatory evacuation. Yeah. And that's part of the launch license. So when people say, like, oh, they, you know, gave them approval, it's like, they just like to get a launch license. Yep Yep

This is why I'm like I don't know about this whole place down there Like I don't know what's going to happen long term Are you getting nervous Tim The more segments get stacked onto the launch tower Kennedy How do you feel about that? I'm excited for that Okay

I think that'll be great I still don't know why they're doing that at 39A though Like why aren't they doing it at 40 Or they have you know 49 A and B that they're I think working on Yeah I think they have another one even between 40 and 37.

It's just like, why aren't they building on something fresh instead of like next of the only pad that, you know, can currently do humans. The most historic. Yeah. And currently important. Yeah. It's not like it's lost its relevance.

DoD? Right. Why aren't they doing this at 40 or anywhere else? I don't get it. Yeah. Some people in the chat are saying, is it because like all of the infrastructure that's already there, the tankage that exists that they can use.

but they're adding all the methane, so... Right. You know, I guess it helps the oxygen, but... I don't get it. Also, then trying to convince NASA, like, all right, what we're going to do? We're going to launch this giant rocket, and then we're going to fly it right back here, right next to, like, everything you hold holy. Yeah.

People also got to remember, like, NASA's Kennedy Space Center contains two and only two launch pads. I guess three, if you count the little one that's inside the perimeter of 39B. But, like, the rest, they're on Cape Canaan. Averal Space Force Station. They can have those discussions with them separately, but NASA has two pads, and one of them is now going to be the target of a gigantic rocket that's trying to land back on it. It's, you know, I don't know. I forgot about that tiny little pad at 39B. Why doesn't Astrid use that? I don't know if it ever really existed. There were so many restrictions around it because it was like, you can use it if you do this, that, or this,

and don't conflict with any SLS stuff and try to plan a schedule around SLS stuff. I don't know. And there's other ones down the cape that are easier, I guess. I don't know. What's up with Astra, though? Yeah, that is a silly thing. Joe, you specialize in small rockets. What's up with Astra?

Oh, man, not that small. Well, not that size. I don't know what's up with Astra. I hope they get their stuff figured out. It's tough to see them stumble a couple of times. It's a bummer. And it was two NASA pilots too, which is too bad. They have great failure modes, though.

Like, SpaceX has some good ones, but Astha's got some great ones. The slide is like historic. The slide off the pad was chef's kiss. A Kool-Aid man out of the fairing? That's like, that's top 10 for me. Cool-Aid man out of the fairing. pairing too. That's so good. That one was the best one. Yeah. That's the best one. Yeah. I don't know. I can't. Power slide for me. I'm power slide. Cool it man great power

slide. Yeah. Yeah, that was. We didn't put a pole up somewhere. Coolid man or power slide. And the best part about the power slide is it went through the gap in the fence. It's like, it's like it knew where to go. That was unbelievable. Awesome. And I love how you know what's in the rest of weight ratio now. Because like one engine shuts down and its thrust away ratio was exactly one. So it's like, oh, I'd normally have a 1.25 to 1 thrust away ratio. It's hilarious. We're watching it again because it's too good. Oh, I guess.

Yeah, through the fan, I forgot about how precision this power slide was. Tokyo drift, baby. And it just immediately, immediately happened. This is a really good one. I still think you can see. I still think you can hear someone gasp on the stream, on the stream. Oh, no. Like when it happens.

I think so. Well, my favorite is, I don't remember who it was with NSF that was filming. It was either Brady or somebody or got ready, almost I think got nervous that they saw smoke and that they might have missed it tracking or, you know, with a tilt. And kind of like pulled up a little bit just in case

and then went back down and it was like, then you slowly see it like coming from the trees. Which is totally understandable. I mean, I'm not saying. that you shouldn't have done that. Yeah. That is hilarious because that's exactly what I would have done too, you know. Man.

Yeah. But it's too bad. You should maybe replicate that sometime, Joe. I have. I have done that. Well, like on purpose. One time I accidentally did. No, no, I didn't do it on purpose.

I was using the wrong thrust curve, like the wrong reference for a solid motor that I was using. And I was playing it really close to the chest. And I ended up matching. pretty well, like, the propellant loss from the motor with the thrust curve of the motor, which goes down over time. And, like, it pretty much hovered like a meter above the ground and then just slipped to the side. It's a great shot.

Somewhere on my channel, I think there's a video called like all my rockets that didn't work and it's in there somewhere. I'll link it. It's a great shot. It's a great shot. That's a great one. You've had some cool. We didn't even talk about the Christmas tree. God damn, we didn't talk about the Christmas tree. Yeah. Love the Christmas tree. We got like, we got to talk about the Christmas tree because this is, I don't know if you saw this, Tim. Did you see that Joe launched a Christmas tree?

Oh, yeah. Okay. Oh, how could you know? I watched it with my family on Christmas morning. Why did you do this? Why not? Yeah, I know. I mean, we were driving back.

Zyla did that bulletproof ball gown thing and then we went out to the desert and we like shot the dress. And as we were driving back, we were like, we should do a collaboration at some point. and we were thinking of all of these ideas that were like pretty serious and then I I don't know what prompted it but I looked up I knew that people had like shoved rocket motors into Christmas trees before and usually like it doesn't go super well Christmas trees aren't really meant to fly so usually the tree like curly cues or it does all sorts of like stuff that you don't want it to do and I was like what if we what if we tried to get one to actually fly pretty well and you if you see it on the screen like it's it's a gorgeous flight. Majestic, in fact.

It's like straight up. I had no right to be that good. Yeah, and that's like one of my, it's one of my favorite projects we've done. We also, the motor failed to light three times. And so how dark it is outside makes the whole thing looks so beautiful because of how bright the motor is. And we couldn't have done it if we tried.

Yeah. That's such a good one. Yeah, we sent it to like 300 something feet. And then it came right back down. When you were selecting the tree, did you, were there like deliberations about which kind of tree to pick and, you know, Douglas fir versus the other ones or whatever? Like, what were the deliberations there? We wanted a few things. We had looked at, I expected around a 40-pound tree and we ended up with about a 35 or 30-pound tree.

And, but they don't tell you how much it weighs at the site. So like we're all going around this Christmas tree, you know, store or whatever you call it, where they're in like a parking lot, like lifting up these trees and like, oh, it feels like about 35, 40 pounds. And then the other thing we wanted is we called the flu factor. So the branches go foof like that. Because you really, if you play the clip of the launch again, like all of the branches go in. It's perfect. When it lifts off and that's the funniest thing to me.

So those were the things that... It is perfect. Hold on, I gotta get back to... I think I got it. The flu factor. Oh, yeah. Oof. Yeah.

It really accentuates the lift-off. It's so good. I can't believe the light state on and everything. Yeah, we zip tied the crap out of those. That was sponsored by zip ties. And then we intentionally, we intentionally like, some of the ornaments hanging off just pretty loosely because we wanted them to fall off. Like it's really funny if they're falling off as it flies.

Makes it look like insulation on the vehicle, you know? And I kid you not, like pretty on average, about once every two weeks, I get a DM from someone who's like, hey, I found another ornament just at the launch site. We tried really hard. We like walked through the launch site back and forth to try and like collect all the ornaments so that we don't litter. And they're everywhere. They're all over that place. They weren't glass, were they?

No, no, no, no. They're just like little wood, you know, ornaments with stickers on them. But, yeah, it's just funny. I'll get a message and just like, hey, is this yours? It's like, yeah, no, you can just have it. Use it next year. Yeah. Oh, so good.

All right, Joe, what else are you working on if people have not partaken in the the Barnard Cinematic Universe. What should they be checking out? The big thing this summer is Scout. We are going to land a model rocket. I'm going to do it or I will die trying. It has been a billion years since I started trying to do that.

And the goal, like, laser set in my sights right now is I will finish this no matter what it costs. So we've got throttle control. We've got rocket motors that light in the air. We've got Super cool guidance systems, and if you want to see that, you can go to my channel. Which is?

Oh, BPS.Space. There it is. I'm a bad YouTuber. I don't know how to bug it. Tim, what about you? What you've got cooking other than trying to debug streaming hardware? Yeah. Well, at night, whenever I'm done trying to do stream stuff, we're still editing the last

Elon interview together, which is about Raptor. So we're standing in there with Raptor, too. And we're also making a companion video that compares Raptor 1 and Raptor 2 based on some of the conversations to help people, you know, digest some of that stuff. So we're almost done. I keep thinking we're done, but, you know, you know, this stuff is. Yeah. Soon. That is so good.

That's going to be great because that's something that, like, is still slightly mysterious unless you talk to people that work on it. So that'll be sweet. This is the best part of the interview by far, like the most information. Tim Dodd. Like, that's... Engines, baby. Yeah, that's where it's at. So I'm pumped for that.

Yeah. It'll be fun. Next week, we've got Nadia Drake coming on this podcast here, which is going to be a lot of fun because James Webb's about to release a bunch of images, maybe one.

I don't know how many they said, but the first images. So they pluralized it in a couple of announcements. So I'm assuming it's multiple. It'd be really disappointing if it's just one sweet shot. But that's going to be awesome.

I'm pumped. Jake will be back next week. And I think that's all we got going on. So until then, we're just watching the, land the rocket, figure out when we're all flying to Boca Chica, figure out when we're all flying to Kenny Space Center. There's a lot of travel to be booked in the next several weeks. Hey, one of you guys, if you come here, you can drive this,

if one of you guys comes here, you can drive this giant, one of these giant robots. These are really fun. We can stack it with like multiple, we got like 130 pounds in there. So we can stack it with multiple. Can we bring that to the meat rocket when it happens? Yes. Nice. Please.

Can I be able to rent out Tim Dodd services? You can do it 4K? Maybe. Yeah. All right. Thanks, everybody, for hanging out. Thanks, Joe. Thanks, Tim.

All right. We will see you all later. Later, guys. Thank you. One, two, three, four, five, four, three, two, one, end of death.