Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - Amanda Kloots | Does Grief Ever Get Easier? Love, Loss & Dating Advice for Harry Jowsey

Episode Date: September 15, 2026

#980. Does grief actually get easier with time… or do you just learn how to live alongside it?Amanda Kloots is back on Off the Vine for a conversation about the part of grief we don’t talk about enough: what happens years later, when the world has moved on but your relationship with loss is still changing. Amanda opens up about where she is six years after losing her husband Nick, why she no longer believes in being fully “healed,” and the unexpected therapy experience that completely shifted the way she looks at grief.She and Kaitlyn also talk about what actually helps when someone you love is grieving, why we’re so afraid to talk about the people we’ve lost, and how Elvis is getting to know his dad as he gets older.Then things get a whole lot lighter with Harry Jowsey. Amanda takes us inside their unexpected friendship, what it was like helping him look for a wife on Netflix’s Let’s Marry Harry, and why losing Nick completely changed what she believes a healthy relationship should feel like.It’s grief, healing, dating, friendship, a little Harry Jowsey chaos — and a conversation that might change the way you think about loss.If you’re LOVING this podcast, please follow and leave a rating and review below! PLUS, FOLLOW OUR PODCAST INSTAGRAM HERE!Thank you to our Sponsors! Check out these AMAZING deals!Boll & Branch: Get 15% off your first order plus free shipping atbollandbranch.com/vine20, code vine20.Dipsea: And right now, Dipsea is giving our listeners their first week FREE and then 25% off after that, when you sign up at DIPSEASTORIES.COM/VINE.Klarna: Get your money sorted at Klarna.com. So you can think about, well, anything else.Arya: Right now, Arya is offering our listeners $10 off your first month at GETARYA.COM/VINE.Zenni Optical: Go to zenni.com/PODCAST and use code PODCAST15 for 15% off your first order, plus free shipping on all US orders over $65.Progressive: Visit Progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little extra cash back on your car insurance.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This episode of Off the Vine is brought to you by Boland Branch. Get 15% off your first order plus free shipping at B-O-L-L-A-N-D branch.com slash Vine 20, Dipsy, and right now Dipsy is giving our listeners their first week free, and then 25% off after that when you sign up at D-I-P-S-E-A-S-E-A-S-E-A-S-E-A-S-E-A-S-E-A-S-V-V-E-A-R-N-E-A-R-A-R-A-R-A-R-A-R-E-N-I-L-V-E-E-N-I-L-E-L-E-E-N-I-L-E-L-E-N-E-O-S-P-E-E-E-N-E-O-S-P-E-E-E-O-S-E-E-E-E-O-S-E-E-E-E-O-S-E-E-E-E-E-L-S-E-E-E-E-E-E-L-S-E-E orders over $65.5. And Progressive, visit Progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little extra cash back on your car insurance. You're listening to Off the Vine with Caitlin Bristow. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host, Caitlin Bristow. Now, when someone loses the love of their life, everyone asks, how are you? Of course. But nobody really talks

about what happens years and years and years later. When the world moves on, people expect you to just get better and feel better. And you're left figuring out how to build a beautiful life alongside side grief. Amanda Cludes. Hi. My friend is back on the podcast off the mind today. And we're going to talk about conversations people maybe don't ask enough or talk enough about. Does grief actually get easier? How do you stop feeling guilty for being happy again? Can joy and heartbreak exist at the same time?

We also are going to dive into her brand new podcast, Good Grief and why she's helping Harry. Harry Jousey. Yeah. Find love on Netflix's. Let's marry Harry. I just find that guy so hilarious. I know. And what she's learned about relationships after everything that she's lived through.

So please welcome to the podcast, Amanda Kaluze. Yay! I always see that, yay, and then I clap. Yay. That's so funny. We're two performers at heart. Yeah. High kick after.

Oh, gosh. Thank you for being here. Are you in New York just doing some press? Yes, just doing press for the podcast and for Let's Mary Harry. Oh, that's so cute. And I love that Elvis was like, I'm over it. Oh, he is not a New Yorker. He's just breaking my heart.

I know. But it doesn't, I feel like you got to. for a kid, I feel like that's got to be, you're like, what? Yes, that's true. And then I feel like you start to fall in love with the chaos. So maybe like on, if he's back a few times, he'll be like, I love it here. I feel like, yes, when he's 18, I feel like he's going to be like me and be like, mom, I want to move to New York City.

And I'm like, wait, you used to hate that place. Exactly. He's been very funny walking around today. He's like, my feet hurt, my legs hurt. It's hot. It's loud. This street's all bad. And I'm like, welcome to New York, buddy.

It's true. You were born here. He's a New Yorker. We all have those thoughts on a daily basis. Yes. Yeah, even if you love the city, I feel like that's what's going through our minds at all time. It's true. And you were just doing Dancing with the StarsCon.

That was so fun. Yes, it was very fun. It was like a crazy whirlwind. Yeah. As you know, as you know, that show can sometimes be. And we put it together, though. And it's just so fun to be back with all those dang. pros that they're just like, they're so amazing. And you know this because they are freaks of nature.

They are freaks of nature. And we were so lucky to, we didn't do the tour together, but we rehearsed the tour together. Yes, we rehearsed and then we swapped roles. And yes. And it's just like you're just in awe of them. Like the way they dance. Yep. They way they remember choreography. The athleticism mentally physically is beyond. It's insane. And girlfriend, Lindsay Arnold, who had her baby. I weeks ago. Out there just out there. Doing the most.

But also rehearsed herself at home with videos and then came two days before and taught herself everything and performed. True professionals. They are freaks in the best way possible.

I wish I could be that level of freak. I really could. But you're kind of a freak too. I mean, you've got so much going on. You're dancing. Every time your videos come up, I just, like, stops me in my tracks. One, you have to be.

I would love me when you're in L.A. I would love to. It looks so fun. It's so fun. How many times a week do you do that? It's just Monday nights. It's my Monday night therapy. And it really is therapy.

Like I started it and I know like, oh, Amanda probably just loves to like feel sexy and dance to this, which also is completely fine. But I swear to God, I started taking this class because I was at a moment with grief and my journey where I just felt like I had. had lost all my femininity. Yeah. I was not dating anyone. Nick was Latino. He was constantly like hugging me, telling me how beautiful I am, kissing me, grabbing me. And also it's gone.

And it's gone. And for all intents and purposes, I'm the man of the house. I control everything. I run everything. I work 10 jobs. And so I have like, did not feel feminine at all. I saw this dance class. My girlfriend had been going to it.

And I was like, maybe I just need a dance. again. And I'll tell you what, there is nothing like being in a room with a bunch of women, all shapes and sizes and ages. Most of them aren't even real professional dancers at all. In a hot, sexy outfit, looking at yourself in the mirror going, I'm sexy. I love that. I got this. You know what I mean? Like, I'm going to grab my legs. I'm going to feel myself. I'm going to whip my hair. I'm going to stick out my butt. How fun. It's so fun. Truly because I do that in the mirror at home by myself all the time. I know you do well. Well, you share it on Instagram too. Oh, the time. I love it. And so I feel like, why don't I do that more often? What is it about just getting your shoes on and getting

out the door? Because we all know it makes us feel better after to go do something to move our body to like being our feminine. Why is it so hard to get out the door? Oh, and Kila, not even that, but like to go to a dance class again. And this is what doesn't even make sense. You and I were on Dancing with the Stars. You won Dancing with the Stars. I would. I would, so intimidated to walk into playground to go to a heels class because I had never gone to a heels class. I didn't know if I could dance heels. I can't. Yes, you could. In the ballroom heels, I got the lowest possible shoes. So did I. Can't do it. But like, you set yourself up for this disaster. You put yourself down. You tell yourself you're not going to make it. And then as soon as I was in

class warming up, I was like, I'm fine. And then you walk out there probably like 10 times happier and just feeling yourself more than you did walking in. That's why I call it therapy. It is therapy. And I'm sure you know a lot about a bunch of different forms of therapy, which is so wonderful because you know, you're someone who knows a lot about loss, grief, learning to live again. And I think that's the last time, you know, you were on the podcast.

We talked a lot about surviving. But I want to talk about living today. Yeah. Because I think so many people listening have either I just looked at the camera like, that was weird. Like, I think so many, oh, you're right here. So many people listening have either experience lost themselves or love someone who has lost. You know, like we all know.

It's affected us in some way. Obviously. And they're wondering what life actually looks like later. So everyone says time heals. But has time actually healed anything? Or does it simply just get lighter? I don't necessarily think it gets lighter. Yeah.

And I don't think that. it heals. I think healing and healed are. Was anything or anyone ever healed? No. No. I don't believe so. I think it's a journey and it's a constant journey because life is a journey and we keep changing and growing and so healing keeps changing and growing too. I think that time is tricky. Listen, grief has very much changed my relationship to grief from year one to now. Of course. Of course. completely different, thanks to the immense amounts of therapy that I have done to try to understand grief and understand Amanda now that I live with grief. Yes.

And that's where I am today. Well, that's, people say that grief changes you. Yeah. What's something about Amanda today that only exists because you went through that level of grief? I would say my patience and my, I mentioned this in my first episode. in my podcast, how much grief has taught me to have grace with people and patience and peace in my life. And I think, too, and you'll relate to this now being a New Yorker. When you're a New Yorker for 19 years as I was, you are just impatient and you want everything now and fast.

And, you know, I saw today I get in my Uber and the Uber drivers gets into a huge fight with a taxi driver next and they're like yelling obsidities at each other. And I'm just like, welcome back to New York. Yeah. And I just literally was like, wow, my life is so in a different space. And I think it's what grief has really taught me in a beautiful way. But yeah. Slow down. Yeah.

Yeah, patience and pieces, I can imagine a big one because what's the hurry? What's the hurry? And also, I think that grief makes you want to scream and kick and cry. And it makes you want to. like avenge it, you know, like how can I get rid of you, you know, is the feeling that I had, at least, the first like probably three years. I was just like, how can I, what therapy can I do to just get you out of my life? And so I think that once I learned to accept it, it brought this peace over me. And that, and that's where I am today, which is so lovely. Yeah, because it's not going

anywhere. Grief doesn't go anywhere. I've only experienced it with a best friend only. It was a big loss. But it's been 23 years. I just talked to Teresa Caputo, the Long Island medium. You need to have her on your podcast. Well, I've done her show. You have. Okay. Yes. So that would make sense. Yeah. Because I was just saying it's so interesting how I can hear one song and it can hit me like a train. and she's been gone longer than she was even alive and it still sits with me. Yeah. I still miss her. And I'm, it's just, it's such a, it's, it is such a thing that so many people experience and nobody can compare their grief to somebody else because it just, it hits us in different waves.

Yes. In different ways. It's like you said, you said for three years you lived with this like avenge of wanting to get rid of it. now you're learning, this isn't going anywhere and I have to live with it. So you've lived with grief now for more than four years. So at what point did you kind of wake up? You know when you go through something so tragic and every morning you wake up, you have maybe a couple seconds of peace and then you go, oh my gosh, this is real life. How long did it take you to get past that phase where you can wake up and kind of see the light? I do remember saying on my third year of

grief going, I think I feel like I have a little bit of a grasp on this life now. That was three years. Now today I have a completely different opinion even from then. And guess what? I'll probably have a different opinion next year or in five years too. But I do remember that third year being like something shifted. And then I would say a year ago, almost a year ago, I did this, I did psilocybin therapy for the second time. Wow. And it's life-changing.

Wow. And one of my favorite therapies I've ever done. And I will forever do it because it is such an amazing way to really take time to go in. Yeah. And visit a whole other part of you that you didn't even know existed. Yes. And it's, I say it's 10 years of therapy in one session. It is just wonderful.

And in that session, that was in October, that was another huge shift for me where I was just like, well, can I share a little bit? So like when I'm doing psilocybin therapy, I'm with a therapist, a guide, and he is, you know, with me the whole time watching over me. I'm, I'm under the medicine and I'm in my, in a, when I'm under, I hear. This time around it was like a mother God voice. And she said to me, she was like, you know, Amanda, and I'm speaking like this because she's talking to me like this. And I'm not talking back. It's all kind of like telepathically when you're under.

She goes, Amanda, you know, you say things are hard all the time. Like everything's hard. She was like, you know, taking all of us to school is hard. Dating is hard. Your, you know, career is hard. Everything's hard. She goes, but you know hard. She goes, you lived through hard.

I showed you hard. You survived hard. She goes, do you want hard again? And I'm like under the, I go, no, no, no, no, no, no. She goes, then stop saying everything's hard. You lived through it. You survived it. It's not hard.

And I remember coming back from that ceremony and I opened my eyes when I was like, you know, out of the medicine. And I looked at my shaman and I was like, well, I just got slapped across the face from Mother Nature. I was like, damn. I was like, but I will never say that word ever again. And that was like the start of my kind of new relationship with grief. Yeah.

I've always wanted to experience that level of therapy and healing. Girl, do it. It's amazing. I want to so badly because I get so much out of, I did this. I did a lot of. of visualization therapy at one point in my life. And I can so easily now lay down, close my eyes, visit my spiritual self, my ancestors, my, yeah. And I just, and without anything, I can just communicate and get to the, you know, what I'm actually feeling in my body. So I can only imagine

how beneficial that can be for what you've gone through. Well, just to show the difference, the first time I ever did psilocybin therapy was two years. after Nick passed away, it took my body three and a half hours for me to surrender to the medicine. Three and a half hours? Three and a half hours. What were you doing while you, like what, in what way were you? I was wrestling. I was like, I should just leave.

This isn't working. And my shaman was like, just breathe. Let's play some more music. He knew, of course, it was working. He knew. But I'm like holding on for dear life because I was so closed off. I was so protecting myself from feeling this emotion that I didn't want to acknowledge. Last year when I did it, I was in 10 minutes, I was like, shalalal la.

Because I've really worked hard on just letting myself be a vessel, like just opening up instead of trying to keep everything so suppressed. I mean, there's a reason we all say we have walls up. They're not, you know, you can't see them. They are there. They are there. They are there. And until you break those down, it gets easier and easier the more you work on it. But it really is, I mean, at this point, it really is science of changing your neuropathways, doing the work, retraining your brain, your heart.

But at the same time, holding the space for yourself to feel like awful things and sadness and darkness and knowing that that's okay too. Yeah. And I think a lot of people are afraid to crack that open. Yeah. You really, I mean, especially on a day like where you're going to, you know, go into a full day of therapy for yourself, like 10 a.m. to 7 p.m. Yeah. You are walking into, I'm going to face things today and take the whole day to do it. Like, it is a commitment. And a lot of people are very scared to do that. I was. I was terrified. I had never done a drug in my entire life. And I walked into three grams of mushrooms. I was to, I literally, Caitlin, I had never done a drug.

Yeah. ever. So I, okay, I am on an SSRI. I feel like that blocks the mushroom of what it's supposed to actually do because I've tried doing mushrooms before, not obviously in the right setting. Yes. But it made me, I'm angry. It made me paranoid. It made me, I didn't like anything that was around me or going on. I wanted to go sit by myself. It was not good. Oh, interesting. But I think it's because I was on an SSRI and I heard there's like an antidepressant anxiety med. Well, I will say that my guide is always, because I've sent now so many people to him, he always encourages them to try to really back off of their dose of their antidepressant

or try to completely get off of it. Okay. So that makes sense. I need to go see your guy. Yes, you do. In L.A.? Yes, you do. Okay.

I'm all for it. Yes. What do you think something is that people still misunderstand about grief? Oh, my gosh. So many things. Mm-hmm. You know, I mean, this is kind of maybe the more stereotypical one, but I'll say it again because it really does matter. Stop trying to put a time limit on people's grief journeys.

It's really disheartening. Because somebody, you could go dance and be happy and work and do all this thing. And you're going to find somebody that says, how can you do this? Yes, yes. Or like, you know, you're still talking about it or something. You know what I mean? You're still driving your dead husband through the mud. And I'm like, no, he was my husband. And we have a child together. And I'm keeping his legacy alive. Yes. Like, I think it's so important to keep saying the names of the people that we lost. Like, why should we have to bury them? Well, I know. I agree. I even, this is so different. This is such a different topic. But I got so upset. Brittany Cartwright is a friend of mine. And she didn't lose Jacks to death. She lost him to. waking up, realizing he's a narcissist, to believing in herself.

She's finally, after years of like being beat down verbally, finally finding her voice and exposing and people like, get over it. Oh my God. Yeah. And I just go, but you know what? But you know what? Those people are hurting in their own ways. And I was telling Brittany the other day, I said, girl, these are mothers of sons who have

narcissism who think their son's perfect. and they're coming at you because you're standing up for yourself. Yes. So it's always, you know, it's always something, again, completely different situation from yours. Yeah, but yes and no. Yeah. Because it is about just like, these things affect us.

And you, I know grief is a tough subject and death is too. It's not necessarily something people love to talk about. I do. I love talking about it. Right. You're like, I made a podcast about it. Really like talking about it. But, you know, I think that.

We should never feel shame in saying and sharing and continuing on a legacy. And never. Oh, I agree. And how do you and Elvis keep Nick's legacy alive at home? Oh, I mean, all the time. I mean, all the time. I mean, thank God Nick was an actor and a singer because we have video of him and we play his album all the time. That is awesome.

And, you know, Elvis is so much like Nick, too. that it's so fun because now he's doing stuff. I'm like, you know, that's just like your dad. Or like, you know, I mean, you know, I'll be drinking coffee in the morning. And, you know, it's like, well, your dad used to drink this like black. It was like I used to call it gasoline. And so it's fun because he's at an age where I can start to tell him these stories or he'll ask me questions that I have a story about.

And so it's getting kind of fun in a way because he's getting to know his dad on this different level, you know? That's what a beautiful thing to have. recordings and, you know, hear him sing and all of those things. It's the best. Yeah, I mean. Because Nick had a really cool speaking voice. And I would have probably forgotten that if I didn't have him recorded talking.

And now Elvis gets to hear it, you know? That makes a lot of sense. That is cool. That's a really. He was Canadian. He was a you. Yeah, I know. This is really morbid of me.

me, but I refuse to delete any voicemails that people I love send me. Yeah. Because I'm like, oh my gosh, what if something never happened? I would want to go back and hear this all the time. Yeah. Well, don't delete them. I was so funny. I was just thinking about this the other day, Caitlin, I don't know why.

But I was getting, I was driving and I was getting so mad at myself because I was like, why don't I have any voicemails from Nick? And then I started like replay, like Winnie passed away. and I was like, I had to have had a voicemail. Like, how did I not? And like, how did it get lost or did I delete it? Like, what, I was really getting mad at myself about it. That's understandable.

But if you watched that movie voicemails from Isabel? I just started, yeah. Oh, it's so good. It is so good. I was crying the whole time, but it was really great. I thought it was such a cute movie. I am usually all about murder mysteries and crime and documentaries that are like, how do you watch that and fall asleep?

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dipsy stories.com slash vine. Now, this is an exclusive offer for our podcast listeners. So go to dipsystories.com slash vine for your first week free, then 25% off. And I'm going to spell it out for you. That's D-I-P-S-E-A Stories.com slash vine. Of course, we fear the moment that either we are going to pass or something. A lot of people fear or death, but has your relationship with fear changed? Like, are you less afraid because you've already lived through your worst nightmare?

Are you more afraid because it's happened to you? I mean, I'll get a little, it's a twofold. I'm sure. The first is because I feel like Nick is always around us and I get signs from him all this time. I saw you talk about this the other day on your podcast about signs. Yeah, we'll talk about it. Because of that, I kind of feel like, wow, it's kind of, you know, I don't think of death as a finality anymore. So in a way that has taken away the fear.

However, because it's just Elvis and I, and I know I have a huge family and Elvis would be very taken care of if God forbid something happened to me. Yeah, knock on all the wood. Knock on, I don't know where there's wood, but I'll knock on my head. That's where I get scared because I'm just like, oh, my God, I, you know, I would never want to leave him alone. Yeah. And if we keep saying, I'll just cry. So. I can't even.

Not that I love crying. I'll cry anytime. I'm the same way. I like almost cried when like three times already in this podcast. You, your new podcast, congratulations, by the way. Thank you. What a beautiful, I was telling you this just over text, but how many people are going to be able to find comfort through this podcast, you know, and find strength and relatability? And one thing I love about your new podcast is that it's, it really is not just about losing someone. It's really about what happens after life changes in a way that you never expected. So again, everyone who listens can take something.

away from that. Now, you say grief isn't just about death. It's about losing a marriage, a friendship, a job, your health, even the future that you pictured. Yeah. Why do you think we minimize those kinds of grief? Isn't that strange? Isn't that really weird? It is. Yeah. You know, I think on an upcoming episode, soon, my little sister, Anna, comes on. And Anna just went through a miscarriage. And it was her first pregnancy, and she lost the baby at 12 weeks. Oh, my God. She already had clothes for the baby. Of course. She was already had a name picked out. They had a gender reveal party.

She had just posted about it on Instagram, you know, was really like, talk about like planning the future, right? And they were looking at apartments and getting so excited. And she lost the baby. And she said to me, she was like, it's so weird how we try to minimize our own. like I shouldn't feel like this. Like I'm young. I can try again. And a lot of people would say to her, it's so common. You know, don't worry, but it's so common, you know, you get to try again. And I said to her, I go, isn't that funny? I said, when I lost Nick, no one said to me, it's so common. Don't worry,

you'll get to date again. You might even get married again. Right. Yeah. Like, you don't say that, but you say that to a woman who just lost a baby. Or, you know, I have Rabbi Steve Leader coming up on an episode. He was a rabbi at Wilshire Boulevard Temple in L.A. for over 30 years. He just retired. We talked about the grief of retirement of not knowing who you are after being a rabbi serving your people and your community and your synagogue for over 30 years. And then all of a sudden, you have a whole new life. That's grief too. That's what I think people forget that there are so many different categories of grief and a lot of it comes from other people making us feel shame. You know, though you shouldn't move on it or this is common. Whatever it is, it really does

minimize what you're going through when nobody else can really understand. Right. And I guess my I have this later in my notes, but I want to know right now, as someone who's gone through what you have, what would you recommend saying to somebody going through grief as a friend when you don't know what to say? I would say, if you don't know what to say, just show up. That's the best thing you can do. Just show up and be you. Like if you are my friend and you come and see me, Caitlin, I want you to walk through my door and I want you to do ridiculous things and laugh and make jokes like you normally would do and just show up. You don't have to say anything. There's nothing to say a lot of times. You know what I mean? And you're never going to find the right thing to say. Yeah. There's nothing really that I'm going to necessarily need you or want you to do. You know what I mean? And you're never going to find the right thing to say. Yeah. There's nothing really that I'm going to necessarily need you or want you to. You to. I'm say at that moment. But if you show up and you're your authentic self and I know that I can count on you to make me laugh because you always make me laugh, then I don't feel like the bottom is dropped down. You know what I mean? When it's already dropped out. I think everyone's so scared to say the

wrong thing. Oh, it's terrible. Even I'm still scared to say the wrong thing. And you would think that I'd be an expert, you know, that I would have the exact words to say. Right. The truth is we don't. Yeah. No, I'm like just even reflecting in my brain right now of things that any and the the different phases of grief are so real even if like I remember realizing, I can pinpoint the moment I realized this is not the person I started dating and starting to feel the resentment building and noticing every little thing of oh my God I was tricked or like maybe I wasn't. Maybe he really did change this much. And even the grief still hits me today when of course if I talk about it, people will be like, get over it.

But it does still come in ways of like frustration, anger, then sadness. And then I don't give a shit. And then it comes and it goes. It comes and it goes. And it really is just, it's just such a fascinating topic. I can't wait to listen to your podcasts on it all the time because, again, I love that you're having so many different conversations about it with so many different types of people and different losses.

Yes, all different walks of life. Was there anything that someone said to you that helped while you were going through your grief or was it just showing up? You know, I'm going to use Katie Couric as a great example here because she comes to mind because she was the first widow that reached out to me. And I think this goes to when you know somebody's pain, you can reach out easier. That's why I feel like community is so important, which is why I'm doing this podcast. Like community is everything. Having people that understand what you're going through and truly get it is so important.

And when she called me up to like, you know, say hi, I'm Katie Couric. I was also in my 40s when my husband died and I also had children that I had to raise and I was on a talk show. So guess what? We have a lot in common. And I was like, oh my God, just to see and hear how she was talking about her life now just gave me so much hope. But I think what she did was she just was talking to me openly and honestly.

and just asking me questions and wasn't afraid to say Nick Cordero or say you lost your husband. It's hard for you right now. This is tough. You know, to acknowledge, and I think that's what you kind of were just talking about. It's like to acknowledge it. To try not to go, time will heal or it's going to be okay. It's not going to be okay. That's not what you want to hear.

No. So just to have somebody acknowledge, like, I know what you're going through. It's awful right now. Yeah. People are so afraid to bring up the person that has passed. And I'm sure it's out of care that they don't want to trigger something within you or whatever. But it's like we're already triggered. Yes.

I remember losing my best friend and it's all I wanted to talk about. I wanted to talk about her. I wanted to remember her. I wanted to laugh about her. I wanted to cry about her. I still to this day want to. Yeah. It's something that I felt guilty dedicating a dance to her on Dancing with the Stars.

because I was like, people are going to think I'm using this to get votes to get ahead, which I would of course never do. I had the whole opportunity on The Bachelor to talk about her and I didn't want to use her story for anything. But it was such a big part of my life that really impacted who I was 20s, 30s and into today. I spent every single day with this person. I was pissed if she hung out with another friend. How old are you? I was 18, but we met when we were three. Lived next door to each other.

And it was just so heavy, but I'm like, I think because of the time that's past, but my girlfriend and I, we have the same matching tattoos with her initial. We love talking about her. And I think people, I mean, now, again, that's been however many years. But when it's fresh, people are afraid. But I think we need to remember that it's okay. Yes. I think this is a great message.

It is okay. And even in all of the people I know in the grief community and in doing the interviews, I've done so far. One of the common threads is I love talking about my son or my daughter or my husband or my wife. Yeah. Even if it makes me cry, I want to talk about it. It's okay.

We are so used to crying. We're fine. If it makes me cry, it's okay. It's beautiful. And a lot of times, this is also a common theme. We want to cry because it makes us feel closer to our person, which sometimes as time goes on, you feel removed from. And so crying helps you feel closer, which actually,

makes you feel good. It's like a weird thing to understand, but it makes you feel closer to them and connected. I actually agree with that. You ask every guest about their good grief moment. Your podcast is, of course, called good grief. Was there an answer that completely changed the way that you think about healing yet? Or I don't know how many, you've done what? I've done like 13. What I'll say about this is it might be my favorite moment on the podcast. Because it shows. It's shows the levity that you can receive and the beautiful lessons that you can receive from such a hard thing that you go through. And everyone's answer is different. And it's really beautiful to hear the answers. And I don't want to give them away because they're all so unique and very unique

to the person. Personal to them. And it's just such a beautiful, surprising moment on the pod right at the end. And I think and I hope that it just offers that little bit of light to somebody that's listening that's going through a really hard time. Yeah. Oh, that's really beautiful. Yeah. I love it. Wow. And has interviewing people made you realize that there's still parts of your own grief that you hadn't unpacked yet?

Oh, gosh. You know, yes, I will say right now I'm doing a lot of inner child work on myself right now. My favorite kind of work. I do it. I've done it. I've talked about it on the podcast. I should make a t-shirt. It's a lot. Because I don't think anyone's ever, it's a new thing that we're like, oh, you have to heal your inner child. Yeah. And yeah, it's a wild ride. It's a wild ride. And I love it so much, though. I asked my therapist recently, I was like, why isn't everyone doing this? Everyone should be doing this. And she goes, Amanda, everyone can't handle this.

Yes. She was like, it is hard to go into your inner child. Especially if you really go there. Yes. Yeah. So I would say that that is a part of my grief that I'm exploring now. And I say that because I experienced grandparents dying when I was a young girl. It's not about that for me. It's about how little Amanda is that what we call her.

Yeah. Little Amanda is coming to the surface as big, Amanda is going through grief. So it's so true. It's a lot. And this is why I'll say that grief, once you really start being curious about it, it's really kind of cool because it really starts making you ask questions about all the different parts of you.

Yeah. And then when you start working on it, it's like, okay, now we're doing inner child work. My God. Because you think that that's such a piece of your past that doesn't show up, but it shows. up every day. You literally are still that little kid in a grown up body. You have been conditioned to feel and think a certain way. It's all stems from who you were as a child into who you are today. Yeah. And it also, it's made me love myself more. Because all I do now when I have a really tough time is I'm like, oh, I just want to be seen or heard or loved. And then I give it to myself.

Yes. Yes. My therapist is always like speak to little Amanda, how you would speak to Elvis. And it Immediately. Makes you cry. Oh, my God. Because if Elvis comes to me like complaining or kicking and screaming, I was like, oh, honey. Like, well, let me tell me about it. Yeah. Let me try to help you.

Yeah. So now I have to speak to myself like that. And it's so funny at the beginning. It is funny. And then really rewarding. And then very emotional. Because when I picture that little Caitlin who just, I was such a scared child. I was scared of everything.

I was scared of my parents dying. I was scared of my own death. I was scared of getting sick. Everything was scary to me. And my parents were so amazing because they really, they just wanted me to feel safe and loved at all times. Yeah. But they never said that that's okay to feel scared. They just wanted to fix it.

Yeah. And I had like no coping skills growing up. So now when I go back and look at little Caitlin, like I'm always like, you little sweet angel pie. Like you're just so scared. And like even as an adult, I'm so scared of certain things, but I can recognize now because I'm like, oh, I'm just a scared little girl. Yeah.

Let's nurture her. Yes. Let's go back and it's really. Give her some love. Give her some love. It's really sweet. Everybody should try it. Yeah, I know.

Like we're not doing it even justice, the work that we're not. We're not. It's deep. It is deep. Okay. A weird question coming at you. But do you ever get in the shower? and then suddenly your brain has a question that you absolutely have to work through.

Because I had one of those, what do you call them a shower thought? I had a shower thought lately. And mine was, when did my definition of a really good night completely change? Like when did being home by nine? I'm talking like my skincare is done. I'm getting into clean sheets, my fresh pajamas. When did this become the absolute dream? Now there was absolutely a version of me.

Now it feels like in a past life where home by nine sounded like the most lame, boring thing ever. I'd be like, oh, so the night was terrible, nine o'clock? The night hadn't even started. Back in my prime. And now you're telling me I went out. I had fun. I saw my friends.

I may be at a great dinner, glass of wine, and I'm walking through my front door at 8.39 p.m. Perfect evening. No notes. Because now I have time. I have time to properly take off my skincare. I make it part of my wind-down routine. I put on my pajamas, like I said,

maybe watch something like something calming like a murder mystery before I fall asleep. And then the ultimate luxury just realized that my sheets are clean. I just feel like nothing else needs to happen at that point. I have officially peaked. And that's where the shower thought started to spiral because nobody announces these changes to you because you don't just wake up one day and suddenly someone hands you a pamphlet and it says, congratulations, here are things you're going to start really celebrating now. I feel like your priorities just quietly rearrange themselves while you're busy, just live in your life. And then one day you realize, wait, when did I become this person? I feel like my parents warned me about this day. Like an empty Sunday, now if I look at my calendar

and there's nothing on it, nobody invite me anywhere, do not ruin this for me. My Sunday is sacred. I have plans and my plans are nothing. Or then just like getting something done around the house that you've been putting off for like a few weeks. Why is that so satisfying now? You finally open the drawer. Everybody's got a junk drawer. You get rid of the pile that's been sitting in the corner. Suddenly you're walking around your house like you've accomplished something now. absolutely massive. Nobody can tell you anything that day. You're like, actually, you do like a hair flip. I cleaned a cabinet this morning. Okay, Caitlin, congratulations. But it really does. It feels so good. And then canceled plans. Okay, I know I love a plan. Like I really do. I love seeing my friends.

I want to see my friends. But every once in a while you get that text that's like, I'm so sorry, can we reschedule? And you have to pretend you're disappointed. You're like, oh no, that's terrible. And then you're actually like already in your pajamas eating ice cream. Like, oh no. I used to think this is what people meant when they said you get boring as you get older, but I actually don't think that's what it's about. I think you actually just get way more specific about what you actually enjoy. And if I want to go out and dance my butt off until 3 a.m, I'm still going to do that. But if I want to be home by 9 and crawl into bed, I don't need somebody to convince me that I should want something else. And maybe that's the actual upgrade, you know? You start realizing that a really good life doesn't have

to be made up exclusively by really big moments. It's the little things. I think we all know that. Obviously, we're going to remember the big trips, the celebrations, those nights where you laughed until two in the morning. But there's also those tiny things that just make your day so much better. Coffee that you actually had time to drink, the little walk with doggies, a really good shower where apparently this is where my brain decides to spiral or solve life's mysteries. But then there's other shower thought inside the shower thought. Why does time get so weird as you get older? Remember when one school year felt like approximately like 12 years? And summer vacation just felt like an entire lifetime.

Oh, the good old days. Now somebody says, can you believe that was three years ago? And I'm like, no, actually. My brain says that happened three months ago. And weeks can somehow feel incredibly long while entire years disappear. It really freaks me out. Now that I'm thinking about it, maybe that's why the little stuff starts feeling bigger. Life moves so quickly, you know, that if you always are waiting for that next trip,

the next event, the next accomplishment, you miss a lot of really good ordinary days in between. I really mean that. All that to say, that's where my shower thought landed. Maybe getting older is realizing that some of the things used to think sounded boring are actually the things that make your life feel calm, cool, collected really good. And apparently these are the kind of things that my brain has room to spiral on, which I guess is a blessing. When the practical stuff feels a little more sorted, which all and all brings me to the next point, Clarna. Klarna helps keep the money stuff simple, clear, and sorted so that your brain has a little more room to wander to the bigger. We're apparently very important questions in life like, when did a fresh, crisp, clean pillow become exciting to me?

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aria.com slash vine. Now, this offer is only for, our podcast listeners. So use my link to get the discount. Get Aria with a Y. Get A-R-Y-A-A-com slash Vine for $10 off your first month. That's get aria.com slash vine. Let's switch gears a little bit to helping Harry find his person. Yes. Does Harry do therapy? Oh, yes. I think I've heard of talk about it before. Yes. Yes. And reads like every self-health book you can buy. All. Sends me podcast all the time about like how to better your or how to manifest or these three rules to live by. Like he is Mr.

Self-improvement. Yeah. How old is he? 27 now? Oh, he's such a baby. I know. But still, that's great. Or maybe 27.

Or maybe now he's 29. Okay. I met him at 27. Even better because I just feel, I love when a 29-year-old man starts. If he's already doing the work to get to where he's at, he's going to be wonderful. Because this is what I always say. I'm like, Harry, at 40 years old, I cannot wait. He's going to be the most.

I mean, he's not, he's already an amazing man. But Harriet 40, I'm like, I can't wait to see you at 40. I look like he said you're the big sister that he's never had. How did this relationship develop? Was it from Dancing with the Stars? No. What? No, we didn't do the same season.

You weren't? Oh, why did I think he was a season after me. Oh. So I was watching his season because as you do, you know, then you start becoming obsessed with the show and you watch. Yes. No. And then basically, we met at a charity event.

he was hanging out with Alan. Alan was my partner. I met him quickly at this charity event. And then I was hosting a show with Tyler Henry called Live from the Other Side on Netflix. And he was one of the guests. And I walk in and I, to, you know, meet the guest before the show starts. And I was like, you're not going to remember me. I was like, but we met at a charity event.

He's like, I remember meeting you at the charity event with Alan. And I was like, oh, yeah. I was like, I didn't think he would remember like a two-second meeting. Right. He's like, of course I remember you. And he like, I was like, oh, you're so cute. And then that whole show, Tyler just kept being like, you're made for so much more. You've got so much going for you.

And he was talking about manifestation and vision boards and all this stuff. And I was like, I'm obsessed with you. And that's how we became friends. Oh, that's so nice. Is he too young for you to have? Is it just too much of a brother-sister relationship right off the bat? I mean, there is quite an age gap. And also, yeah, I don't know.

I mean, well, we're like, wait. Why would be rooting him for you guys? We really bonded. I mean, everyone thinks we're dating. We joke about it all the time. I mean, because I bring him to events all the time because he's the best plus one because he's six, six. And he's like, my buddy. And he's a social butterfly.

And he's a social butterfly. And he gets it. Like, he's like, you need me to take a picture? And I'm like, thank you. You know, and he just, he's so great. So I bring him to all these plus ones. And so everyone's like, are you guys dating? I'm like, no, we're not dating.

We can just be friends. You know. That's my toxic crate is as soon as I see a guy and a girl. being best friends. I'm like, my dear to me. Yeah, that's my bad. Now, speaking of dating, you watched him date very up close and personal. Yes. What were you looking for as a best friend to somebody that maybe he didn't even know he needed? Yes. Well, I feel very strongly about this because I'm very protective over here. See, okay, so Harry has this very emotional side to him. Like, we bonded because he was losing his father. And I had been through my loss. And so I, I,

I, you know, now when anyone's going through loss, I'm like a moth to a flame. Of course. And so I was really, you know, trying to be there for him as much as possible as he was losing his dad. And so I know this very grown, emotionally mature man who wanted to change his life after loss, which I could completely relate to again. So I was looking for someone that could match that capacity. But that can also, on a dime, be extremely silly. and make jokes because he's also that guy.

Yeah. So you got to keep up. You got to keep up. And he lives a very big life. So you need to be okay with the public eye, with him being around beautiful women all the time. But he actually is like when he is with a woman, like with a girlfriend, loyal and loves her and dotes on her and treats her like a queen and constantly thinking about her and her needs before his own. Like it's really really beautiful. So the concept of the show is literally, he's basically the bachelor.

He's basically the bachelor. He's trying to find the one to marry. So in five weeks, it's to find a bride. And I'm not kidding you. Because before the show, we were like hiking every day and like, you know, working on our plan to get him ready. And I was like, are you really like you're going to do this? Like you're going to get married at the end? And he was like, I hope so.

I really want to buy. I hope my bride's there. I want to get married. It's a good binge. Did you ever disagree with Harry on who he should, he should keep. Oh, yes. All the time. Yes.

Yes. Yes. But thank God we had the authority. So Sonny Georgia and I had the authority until the end. He had the authority at the end. But we had the authority in the beginning. That's crazy. Yes.

It was good. Was he just like when this show came to be, did he plan it? Did you have a partner? Or was he just like, I want you to help me? He really gave Netflix like, you cast it. Cool. I'm just happy to be here and I want to get married. Wow.

And then he gave them a list of friends to, to interview and girlfriends, ex-girlfriends to interview. And I was like hoping and praying that I would be on it because I was like, I need to be there. I have to be there. I have to help you. God. That's really, that's a really five weeks. I mean, I'm not saying it can't happen because it probably did, but also I've fallen in love in five weeks before. Yeah, you know what? That's a good point. I have too. And when somebody is right for you, you do kind of know very, very quickly. But I I will say, and I mean, you can speak to this. This was the first time I was in this a dating show environment.

And to see these 20 women, you know, just fighting for their two seconds, two minutes, five minutes with him or to get the date. Yeah. And then you see like women getting a date and then you're like, boy, that woman has not had any time. Like, how is she ever going to make up for the lost time? Oh, it's time is of the essence. It's, you know, and then how do you not feel like the most? most pushiest person, but you have to. I know.

It was like, I mean, it's very nervous to watch. Like, as a person, I was like, oh, my God. It's the worst because I wanted too hard to be the cool girl when I was on The Bachelor. I was also 29. Yeah. So I was like, I'm not going to fight for him. But it's like, okay, well, then how are you going to get your time? Yes.

And then I'd be like, well, he can come to me. And then it's like, that's not how this works. You're on the wrong show. That's how I would be. If I were one of those girls, I'd be like, I'm not. I'm going to look desperate with all these women. And then I did. And I'm also awful at that.

I'm also like, I'm not the girl that will go up to the guy at the bar. Still to this day, I wish I had the courage. I'm just not. I am. I know. You are. I could tell you are. I used to, that used to be my move in my 20s.

I'd go right up to the guy. And still to this day, like if you were single, you would do. Yeah. I feel you have more balls. I would absolutely. I need to get better at that. But I would have bad game because my game is like teasing. And I think men don't really like that.

I like want to take them down a notch. That's like my flirt game. And I'm like, what am I doing? What do you think about people chasing chemistry too much and maybe not compatibility? Do you think that happens a lot on dating shows specifically because that's all you have at the beginning, you know? Yes. Well, you know what's funny is that in doing this for the first time, like halfway through, there were times where like they were asking me about like which girls to keep. and everything. And I was like, I started flipping it going, you know, I don't think I'm making

this girl's name up. Julie is actually, like, I don't think that she's, like, should be with hair. Like, she's, you know what I mean? Like, not is she right for Harry. Is Harry right for her? Yeah. Is how I kept, like, going, like, I actually don't think Harry's right for Julie. Yeah. Like, it's, you know, instead of, like, so Julie, like, calm down. Like, you know what I mean? Like, don't work so hard. I don't think. Right. You guys are. compatible. Yeah, because at one point, it really turns into a competition, too, you know? And it's, it sometimes becomes about winning more than it becomes about compatibility as well. Yeah, that's tricky. And I can only imagine how hard it is when you're there, you've committed to this job,

you've left your life and you're one of nine, one of 20 women. I'm sure you're right. You're like, well, I'm here. I might as well compete. Yeah. But then I wonder if there is a moment in their own heads where they're like, I don't even want to marry Harry. Well, I mean, we're in the times of 2026 where having a platform is a whole business that you can make money off of. And I think that's where the dating shows have sometimes lost their charm like The Bachelor because everyone's just coming down there to be like, well, I want to be an influencer. Yes. Could you see through those people?

100%. And this is where we were so happy to like have the control, especially in the beginning, because there was one of the girls that literally was you could just tell. I think she even said, I'm here for the fame. God bless her honesty. Poor Harry's face like dropped. Oh, she said it in front of him. He said it in front of him.

And he got so, like, offended because he was like, you know, I'm here to find a wife. And I'm taking this seriously. And, you know, she literally was like, I'm here because of my Instagram profile. And it was like, so we would be like, she's got to go. I mean, you know what I mean? So it is a bunch of different things. So does he have to get married at the end? He didn't have to.

Okay. And did not have to is what he's told me. And if he does, let's say he does, do you really sign a marriage certificate by somebody who's ordained like it's real? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, then that, I mean, yeah. I do think that puts a level of, like, for example, when I got engaged on the Bachelorette.

Yes. We probably would have broken up a little earlier. But we took it a little more serious and tried really hard because we were engaged. And that felt marriage is the next step to that, which is even more serious. I'm the ordained minister. Are you actually ordained? I am. Cool.

I'm not ordained. I mean, online. Yeah, of course. It's so, yeah. Yeah. I could marry you. Oh, my God. Okay.

We'll keep that in my back pocket. It's a really great show. And you know what? They put a lot of time and energy. And I say they, as in Netflix and unwell, they did a great job putting it all together and really like making it feel very special and insulated and, um, And I think it came off really, really well. What was Alex Cooper's role in it?

Or was it just Unwell Network? Well, you know, Alex and Harry are really great friends. I don't want to speak too much on it because I don't really know. But I do know that they're really close. They're really good friends. Unwell came on board because she loves Harry so much and Matt, her husband. And they were at that final episode. And, you know, she and, you know, really, I think, wanted to, you know,

be a part of the show. Yeah. Yeah. We all care very much about this man. Yeah, that's sweet. Okay, the other day, I was on my computer. I have to tell you guys this. I hit a button.

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You've experienced obviously a love story most people dream about heartbreaking. lost then found the courage to open yourself up again. I imagine that changes how you define a good relationship, especially for not just yourself, for Harry, for other friends, for everyone. You seem to make decisions differently now before saying yes to a new opportunity or anything. What is the first question that you ask yourself? When I'm about, when I'm anything. Anything. A job, a relationship, dating, like things that maybe in the past you would have been like, sure, but now you, you know, before saying yes to something, that's a big deal. Yeah, I would say, well, relationships for me, I'll answer it because it's too differently.

Like I would say relationships right now, the goal is just like peace. Yeah. Is this bringing me peace? See, isn't that interesting how our definition of success changes, whether it is from a serious loss or just growth as a person, I feel like your definition of success changes. Yes. And, you know, even Harry and I talked a lot about this before he started the show because he would talk a lot about how fighting, like, he would fight a lot with his girlfriends and how he equated

that to love and passion and like a strong relationship. And I was like, boy, I have such a different view on this now that I lost Nick. I said because Nick and I would fight a lot too. And I would take back every single fight now. It's so petty. I don't want to fight with anyone. And then I said, and ironically, ever since losing Nick, I don't fight with. with anyone in my life. I don't fight with my family. I don't fight with my friends. I don't fight with Elvis.

So my day to day in my little house and Laurel Canyon with my son for the last six years is no fighting. Like fighting really has kind of been removed from my life. And I've realized that it's so important for me personally. I know everyone's different, but for me personally, I don't want to be in a relationship where it's where there's that. I need peace. I know that for my nervous system and for the life that I live now.

Yeah. I would say with career-wise, the latest question I ask myself is more like, is this divinely guided? Like, is this serving a good purpose? Am I going to feel good about this work that I'm doing? That's kind of where I'm at right now. I feel that too. And I feel so lucky to be in a place where I get to ask myself that and then choose the answer. Isn't that cool?

It's really, yes. Yeah. It's so, I mean, it really does matter. It's important to get to that place. And I don't mean financially. No. I mean spiritually. Yeah.

Currently, nothing I'm doing is making me any money and I am very happy. I'm hoping it starts to make money. But currently. Because you're passionate about it and you're showing up and I love that. It's so wild. Like, are you happy? I'm like, I'm actually the happiest I've been in a really long time and I'm making no money. Yeah.

I love that though because that I always, I always preach this to people. I didn't start making money on the podcast because you have to prove yourself first and foremost. But also, you are building a beautiful community and connection with so many people. And that, of course, is rewarding to you. And that will bring people in. And that's, you're doing, I feel like you're on the right path. And I know you feel the same way. Thank you.

I do. I really do feel on the right path. Which is very comforting. And I know it's weird to say, but like you just, your aura seems happy. Oh, thanks. Yeah. Yeah, it feels happy. Yeah.

Like content, peaceful. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not saying you have to be happy every day. Yes. And no. And thank you for saying that too. This is not toxic positivity people.

Hell no. No. I hate that. Hell no. In fact, I posted a positive thought because I do it every day on my Instagram. And today's was because I was tagged in some lovely person tagged me in this quote about toxic positivity. And it's, and the quote something like, it's not toxic positivity when you literally pull

yourself out of the darkness and try to shine light every day. It's called positivity. And so that was the quote today. But yeah, I just feel like, you know, when you have that pit in your stomach and you're like living with it every day, I feel like that pit is is not there in the last like five or six months. And it's so lovely. People just glow differently when that pit's gone. Oh, yeah. I swear. We see it in divorce glow ups. I love seeing divorce glow ups because I'm like, dude, were you? You allergic to him? You're looking at it. It's just you glow differently and you show up differently when you don't have that.

Oh, something's not right. Or I love the mom after a year glow up. I say this to moms after a year. You get yourself back. And it takes about that much time. And anytime I see a friend and I'm like, it's been a year and I'm like, oh, it's been a year. Yeah. You just had your mom glow up.

You have a grip on life again. Isn't it called getting your pink back? Yeah, I love that. That's so beautiful. Before I let you go, do you have a bag here? I do, but it's in, oh, we do. It's right there. Can we just play what's in your bag?

Yeah, sure. On my way here, I was doing arts and crafts. Okay. In the back of an Uber. Thank you. Thank you so much. I was taping and cutting and I was putting everything on my new little off the vine cards. I love those.

I need to get cards. And then I realized, this bag looks like. it's an okay size. But I realized I was just throwing all of my garbage from my arts and crafts in the back of the Uber into here. And then I started looking at what's in my bag. And I was like, this is silly. I'm going to do it real fast for everybody. You know what? I'm going to tell you about this before you even start. Okay. This is going to be a true test of are you a New Yorker yet? Oh. Because this is, this is what's in your bag when you're a New Yorker versus what's in your bag when you've lived in L.A. Go ahead. Oh, hilarious. Okay.

So as a new New Yorker. New New Yorker. I've got my antidepressants. Uh-huh. That's good. I've got a charger, an extra charger for everything. I've got a light for obvious reasons. It's such a good light.

I have that one too. It's good one. It really makes a good difference. Okay. And then I've got peppermint essential oils. Oh. Uh-huh. Just because I do this thing.

Oh, yes. I'm having a little anxiety. All right. I've got tums. Nice. I've got, again, I didn't plan on playing this game until I was literally putting my garbage in here and I was like, what is happening? I've got chamomile tea. Okay.

This is like a medicine bag. This is like a medicine bag all of a sudden. I've got sunglasses that are not in a case. Very tight view over here. Tape. Because I was taping my. Can't forget the scissors. Not just like a little tiny cute pair of scissors like my kitchen scissors.

lip gloss, that's obvious. A negative pregnancy test because, well, I'm on my period right now, which is silly that I'm wearing all white, but I took a pregnancy test the other day. Okay, it's still there. Still there. Lip gloss, more lip gloss. There has to be about five lip glosses in any bag. A tied-to-go pen.

Uh-huh, that's smart. You're wearing white. Oh, okay. Because once in a while, these babies pop off. Exedrin. because I have only had one migraine in my whole life, and it made me throw up and I have a fear of throwing up. So I get scared that it's going to happen again.

Okay. Oh, my God. And then to counteract, unisome for a fine tea. Why is unisome and sleepy time tea in my bag? Okay. An old man comb. I love an old man comb. Altoids.

Yeah, that's a good one. That's necessary. There's about five more lip glosses. Oh, yeah. They live in the bottom of the bag. What's that? Sunscreen. No, hair wax.

Hair wax. Uh-huh. That's smart. Isn't it? More lip gloss. This is getting ridiculous. Eye drops. Yeah.

More lip gloss. Oh, my God. Those eyedrops are good. I love those. And finally, apartment keys. Yeah. At the bottom. At the bottom.

Which is where I dig for every single day. Yes. Which I'm sure every day makes you so angry because you're like wearing a keys. And I can hear them jingling and I just can never get in there. And you have to dig through all of that. That is crazy. I. I love this.

Okay. And I also was just about to age myself and say, where's your metro card? And then I realized metro cards are extinct and there. It's all on your phone. Yeah. Which makes me sad. Which I haven't even got there yet. I'm too scared.

Oh, to go on the subway? Yeah, I'll get there. Scared that you'll get lost or scared that you are going to get killed? All of the above. All the above I am terrified of. And see, I told you, I just need to nurture in your little, little Caitlin with her fears. Oh, we do. I have very doomed state thinking.

Okay, you want to see what is in my bag? Yeah. Okay, so this is a new bag because I was coming here and I remember. This is also a new bag. So what the hell? Okay, go on. How important a shoulder strap in New York City is. Yes.

Because I do a handbag in L.A. because it's in my car and I just go boom. But I remembered that in walking around the city, you need to have a shoulder strap. So this is a new bag, which is why it is so clean. I have a bobby pin. Just one. My sunglasses also not in a case. Very cute.

Thank you. I have gum. Yeah. Ace Crunchy. Oh, yes. The best lipstick of all times, Charlotte Chilberry. Pillow talk? Pillow talk.

I'm surprised that's not one of my 20 lip glosses in here. A mini brush and a lip gloss. That's it. Wow. Sheek. That's chic. Mine's like chaotic. It's also, oh, and one more bobby pin.

I do have two. Oh, okay. I'm telling you, though, friend, that is a new bag, Plus not being a New Yorker anymore and living in L.A. and just like, I don't mean. I usually don't even have a purse. I usually walk around with no purse. I know. And now I'm like Mary Poppins. There's literally Mary Poppins. I love when I walk around with a no purse. I love no purse. It's so free. Oh, it's the best. I know. I feel like I can do anything when I'm walking around without a purse. But then I'm like, oh, God. I know. I left my friend. This is a humble break. I was on a yacht the other day in Hamptons. Left this thing with everything in it, including my antidepressants. Oh, no. On the yacht? On the top floor and it rained. What happened?

They went up and got it when it started raining. Oh, okay. And then I got it the next morning. But is there a garbage around here? Anyways, thank you so much. Oh, my God. Thank you. I love that.

I know we're doing yours now, which will be so fun. I know back to back. Back to back. I love a back to back. I know. Especially when it's not like I can do mine and then not do mine again. I get to do yours now. But everyone be sure to check out a man as new podcast with Dear Media.

Good grief. wherever you listen to podcasts. What days does it come out? Every, I think, Wednesdays. Every Wednesday. Yeah. Okay. And you can also catch her on Netflix as Let's Marry Harry. Thank you so much for coming off the line. I'm Caitlin Bristow. I'll see you next Thursday. And welcome to Pluto Fo. If you know the name of the movie you'd like to see, just stream it for free on Pluto TV where all your blockbuster favorites are landing all summer long.

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Hey guys, it's your friend Michelle Collins, and I'm here to invite you to listen to the Michelle Collins show. Yes, that's my show. Unfiltered, unscripted, unhinged, and covers pretty much everything you're going to want to care about. It's funny.

It's fearless. It could go off the rails at any moment and often does. So follow, rate, and review the Michelle Collins Show wherever you get your podcasts. And let's spiral together.