Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - Arielle Kebbel | The Truth About the John Tucker Must Die Sequel, Her Hollywood Start & Choosing Herself!

Episode Date: February 19, 2026

#921. Arielle Kebbel has spent over two decades in Hollywood, but this conversation reveals the parts of her story she’s never shared like this before. From booking Gilmore Girls just days after moving to Los Angeles at 17, to nearly landing iconic roles that could have changed the course of her career, Arielle opens up about the fear, pressure, and survival mindset that quietly drove her for years.She shares a deeply honest update on her relationship status, what it really takes to break your own patterns, and why choosing yourself can be both the hardest and most empowering decision you’ll ever make. We talk about the emotional pull that led her to adopt her wild Mustang, Snow White, the unexpected role horses have played in her healing, potentially producing the long-anticipated John Tucker Must Die sequel, and stepping into her current meaningful role in I Can Only Imagine 2!This is a raw, vulnerable conversation about identity, timing, and what happens when you finally stop running from yourself.If you’re LOVING this podcast, please follow and leave a rating and review below! PLUS, FOLLOW OUR PODCAST INSTAGRAM HERE!Thank you to our Sponsors! Check out these AMAZING deals!ASPCA Pet Insurance: To explore coverage, visit ASPCApetinsurance.com/VINE. Bombas: Head over to Bombas.com/VINE and use code VINE for 20% off your first purchase.Tonal: Right now, Tonal.com is offering OTV listeners $200 off your Tonal purchase with promo code VINE.Audible: Listen to Messy Love: Difficult Conversations for Deeper Connection now on Audible. Go to Audible.com/MessyLove to start listening today.Apartments.com: The Place to find a place!EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: (5:01) — Arielle’s honest relationship status update!(20:04) — The emotional story behind adopting her wild Mustang, Snow White(30:15) — Booking Gilmore Girls days after moving to L.A.(37:50) — Her fear around money, overworking & survival mode(45:55) — The truth about the John Tucker Must Die sequelSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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please contact Connix Ontario at 1866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. This episode of Off the Vine is brought to you by ASPCA Pet Insurance. To explore coverage, visit ASPCApetenturance.com slash vine. Bombas, head over to bombus.com slash vine and use code vine for 20% off your first purchase. Tonal, right now, tonal is offering off the Vine listeners $200 off your tonal purchase with promo code Vine. Audible, listen to Messy Love, difficult conversations for deeper connection now on Audible. Go to audible.com slash messy love to start listening today.

And Apartments.com, the place to find a place. You're listening to Off the Vine with Caitlin Bristow. Hey, Vino's, real quick, if you are listening right now, which obviously you are, you wouldn't be hearing this, can you hit the subscribe or follow button on whatever platform you're on? Please, that one simple thing helps more than you even realize it allows me to keep growing on this podcast and making these episodes the best they can possibly, be obviously for you. That's the only favorite I'm going to ever ask. It truly means the world to me. Thank you.

Now let's get into it. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host, Caitlin Brissau. And today I have Ariel Kebbel on the podcast, who is just an absolute delight. It started off very raw and real because we find out her relationship status. And then I wanted to talk to her about something that I think is relatable to all of us. And that's timing, not just in relationships, but in life.

where she's at in life right now. She's been steadily working in Hollywood for over 20 years, which is such a long career. But she also talks about her mindset of when is it ever enough and how she lives from a place of fear. You've definitely seen her on Gilmore Girls, The Vampire Diaries, John Tucker Must Die, and so many other shows and films. From the outside, obviously careers in Hollywood can look very glamorous and seamless, but there really is a lot of discipline and side jobs and rejection. And also her just being a human and talking with me through that, was kind of inspiring. I feel like as a woman in the industry that doesn't always make space for women to thrive and survive, she's really been doing it and doing it with grace. She's now starting

in the movie. I can only imagine, too, a film based on a true story about marriage, illness, and faith, where she plays the wife of a man named Tim, who is battling a rare cancer. And she's stepping also into producing advocacy for work with wild horses and a new CBS called Marshalls. I mean, I don't know how she has mindset of like what's next she's got it all going on for her so today we're talking about longevity emotional maturity financial independence intuition reinvention what it takes to build a life we literally cover it all it was i think we became fast friends so you will enjoy this welcome ariel to the podcast before i welcome her i would also like to have this on record which it already is because it happened to the podcast but she said if there is a john tucker must die sequel that i can be in it

okay just i'm so excited for you to go to the opera it's just are you a country music fan or like like the history of it. Girl, listen. This is like a dream come true for me. I have been listening to country music since I was five years old at the barn. I always say barn with an N, not the bar, the barn. I started begging my parents to horseback ride when I was five. Well, really when I was three, they let me when I was five.

And like by the time I was eight, I was like, drop me off at 8 a.m., pick me up at 8 p.m. Don't bother me. I'm at the barn. And I would listen to country music, picking my horses, hooves. and Tim McGraw was my first country crush. So like to be back here, it's like, it's just, it's like perfect. That's amazing because my first crush was also Tim McGraw. And we're the same age.

And I feel like I also like you live the life that I wanted to live growing up. I used to lie to people in school and tell them that I was a horse girl and that I lived on a farm. Because in my mind, that's where I thought I was meant to be. and I also listen to country music from like out of the womb. I love the Granol Opry. I took my dad there like a couple months ago and I've never. My dad is a very like emotionally in tune man and I can talk to him about anything and he's always been that way. But I've never actually seen him break down and he broke down in the Opry because he got to meet Ricky Skaggs and Vince Gill and he just stood in the circle and I've just never seen him so happy in his whole life.

It was awesome. That is so cool. And I love that you took your dad because I have those moments with my parents. Like I flew. The last show I was doing was in Hawaii. And I flew out to like have a trip and everything. And there's really, and we all still talk about it. So I love that you did that because there's nothing.

Like those moments are priceless. They really are. They are. And it's sad that like it takes you getting older to realize how precious the moments are. But it really is. It's just like a life thing. It's, you know, when people have kids, they're like, oh, my kids will never understand until they have their own kids. And you're like, I wish I knew how precious my time was with family when I was younger. I mean, I still spent so much time with them, but you just don't know until you know. But it takes what it takes. Yeah,

it takes what it takes. I mean, that's in all relationships, I think, too. Like, the older we get, the more we find, like, the person we're supposed to be with. And I think it used to be the opposite at back of the day where our parents thought, like, you marry the first person you meet and you just make it work and you have kids. And it was this very like almost blueprint they thought they had to follow where now we don't have to do that, which is amazing. And I'm going to be creepy for a second because for all the vampire diary fans, I have to ask, I saw that you and Zach rekindled. What is the relationship status there? I haven't been in a relationship in quite some time. Oh, yeah. I'm sorry. No, it's dope. Please. Well, then congratulations.

Because when people used to say sorry to me when I ended an engagement, I remember being like, don't be sorry. This is like what was meant to be. And I'm, I need this alone time for me. And I actually felt empowered coming out of a breakup. So I hope you feel the same because I want to say now congratulations instead of I'm sorry. I feel like that's a very vulnerable and important conversation you just brought up because I've had this conversation with many girlfriends like going through either breakup or divorce. And some is. I don't. I'm sorry because there's so much love and grief there. And others are congratulations because it's the hardest, best thing you could do for yourself. So actually, I do understand both, but I think what you brought up is so important because depending on the situation and the backstory, it is either one or the other. You know, it's not always I'm sorry or it's not always relations. And I think that people are still kind of learning that. So for me, definitely it was one of the hardest things I've ever done, but it was. Now I'm in a place of like really leaning into my own life choices.

I feel like probably for the first time in my life. Wow. In this raw way. Like like raw, you know, like yes, the feel good moments, but whoa, wasn't really ready to like crack open like that. Yes. And get to know myself in a way that's like. What it has taught me now is the gratitude of what I've learned and also what do I need to explore to really change patterns for myself in the future, from my heart, from my soul. Yeah.

For what I want moving forward. And I don't think I was ever really able to be that honest with myself until now. I just feel like there is something. I think, again, it goes back to just generational things of what we thought we were supposed to be doing. what our parents thought we should be doing. But I just feel like I turned 40 and felt so empowered to like choose myself and not do what other people expect me to do. And I don't know if you felt the same way. Like something really truly shifted from within me when I turned 40 and I can't always put my finger on it. But something about it feels very empowering. And it's like even the

girlfriends that I have in my life, the relationships I have in my life, the relationship I have with myself is so different. And it's because I feel like in your 30s, you just, 30s are almost like 20s now where in their 30s, you're kind of like, now I'm figuring out who I am. Wait, no, that's what I was going to say. So interesting. I was on the plane thinking about this, because again, self-reflection, not not throughout this like we were going to have this conversation. I mean, just thinking about my life. And because what else do you do? And I was actually thinking to myself, I'm like, you know, it's so interesting. I in a lot of ways, I had a lot of a responsibility at a young age, which I'm fine with. I've, you know, I've been in front of the

camera since I was 12 or 13 years old. So, you know, it just happened. But so that I was thinking about it. And I was like, you know what? In my 20s, I was so mature for my age. And, you know, like, I didn't even realize, like I moved to LA at 17 on my own. Wow. Wow. Myself, you know, like that takes guts that I didn't even know I had at the time because a little bit of like ignorance is list, you know? And then I was thinking about it. And like, you know what's so funny. I feel like in my 30s where I would have thought that I was really coming into my own or whatever you want to call it, I actually feel like that's when I regressed. Yeah. Yes. Way I feel like my 30s were my 20s and my 20s were what 30s would look like. Totally agree. Like I live so much in my life with so much responsibility.

I had to like, for a second and just like do all the things that I was too afraid to do or just like too controlled to do before or whatever the language is. And then all the sudden I turned 40 and was like, I don't know what's happening in me, but there is a deep pull to truth that I can't deny. And I also can't like play pretend with anymore. I couldn't have told you this six months ago. Wow. You know? And so it's an evolving thing where I feel like I don't even know what this is now, but it's a different feeling for sure. And it is a different like knowing than I've ever had.

And I don't think I could have done it before because I think I wasn't ready. I don't think I was really ready to get to know myself in this way. No, it's really beautiful. I just think I get excited that you're having this conversation with me because I think so many women out there will love to hear this because again we just put so much oh my gosh, yes. We put so much pressure on ourselves and it's really just like I actually something came up on my feed on Instagram today where it was a woman in her 90s talking about being in your 40s. And she just said like how different it is now to be in your 40s. She's like 40s are so young. You can reinvent yourself at any time.

You could have new life. You could have new love. You can start a family in your 40s. Like everything is so possible. Isn't it like Martha Stewart's like started her business in our 50s or something like that? Yes. Amazing. Janet Jackson had a baby in her 50s.

Like there's so many stories if you look for it. Like I forget who it was. Somebody had like the biggest hit of their whole life in their 50s. And like a huge. I can't believe I'm blanking on the name because it's someone like Aretha Franklin. Like someone like where it was it's just people. Some I got. Some icon, I think her name was like Taylor Swift or something.

I don't know. I think I've heard of her, you know. Yeah, yeah. But it's someone I should know. But the point is it's just like I think we really enter a new phase of our life in 40s where we can really, I love reinventing myself. I think it's cool to do. I think it's like more of an evolution. And I just always want to evolve as a woman.

And I just feel excited for 40s. And then I hear Jennifer Annison talking about her 50s and I go, okay, great. Can't wait for that too. I know. If you have a pet, then you know they are not just a pet. You know what I'm saying? They are family. And I mean, I would do anything for Pinot and Ramen.

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Plus, mm, the best. purchase helps someone in need. So one item purchased equals one donated and that has them at over 150 million donations so far. That is beautiful. Okay, head over to bombas.com slash vine, use code vine for 20% off your first purchase. That's B-O-M-B-A-S dot com slash vine, codevine at checkout. Have you always been on a spiritual journey or is this new to you? Oh, always, always. Okay. I think it's really, again, like my whole life, I've always has been very spiritual. My whole life I've always had a draw the horses. And for some reason, in this past year, it's really been the first time where these things are like all coming into

alignment together where he was all kind of compartmentalized before. Like I had my horses, I had my spiritual journey, and then I have my work. And then all the sudden they started coming together in this beautiful way where I got to take away the different compartments and just go like, oh, yes, here I am. I get to show up and work this way. I get to like combine all the things. I'm passionate about and bring them to the table at once. And the truth is I didn't know that I'd ever be able to. I kind of was so used to compartmentalizing these things. And so again, this past year has been really exciting for me and a new feeling in the way of being able to like bring forward the things I care about the most and actually infuse them into my work instead of having to

separate them. Separate them. That's cool. I like that. That's that's again, the dream. I want to like nerd out for a second about horses because I want to live vicariously through you as a horse girl because that is my like 10 year plan. I always thought horses were going to be like dogs until I start. I did horse therapy a couple times and I remember being like oh you have to like equine therapy. I would okay you know what's so funny I panicked when I said it because I thought is it equine or equine and so I just said horse therapy. You know who else had that? Luke on set we talked about that. Yeah. Yeah. You you totally have to remove ego and I just thought like well dogs love me this horse is going to love me and it like

then that showed up in so many different parts for me of what do I think of myself it was just a really wild experience but what do horses personally give you emotionally I think when I was younger I didn't have any sort of scientific term for it I just knew that I felt different around them and I knew when I wasn't around them I was craving them I was craving them I was craving how I felt when I was around them, so much so that, like, I used to bake to sleep in my horse's stall just because of my, I, like, felt my heart open when I was around my foot. And as I've gotten older and learns more about equine therapy and, like, literally the scientific healing around horses is, you know, their electromagnetic field is like five

times hours. And so when you're stepping into their field, literally scientifically, they're bringing your heart rate down to match theirs. You're sinking up with their breath. You're sinking up with their groundedness. And so it's also why like one of the first things my trainers always taught me before I ever approached a horse was exhale and yawn. Because you want to get of any sort of anxiety you have, any sort of uppity, heady space you're in. Like bring it down, bring your heart rate down, bring your body down into the earth. Because that is actually where the horse will meet you.

Anything before that point, they're going to be reflecting your energy because they can feel it five times the amount that you can. So when someone in inquieter therapy says, like, oh, this horse hates me or he won't come near me or he's charging me or he feels nervous around me, that is a reflection of what they're literally feeling, feeding back to you. And that's why the therapy is one of the reasons why the therapy is so powerful, right? is like when else in life do you get a perfect reflection back? Because when these horses are left alone, they are perfectly in sync with the environment.

And so it's only when you come around that you disrupt that. And so you are actually getting to see yourself back in a way that maybe you haven't ever before. And what's really interesting is horses are herd animals. And so when they're in the wild, their heart rates all sink up. So if a horse is sick or a horse is in danger or. or there's danger coming, say a coyote or something, the heart rate speeds up. And so the entire herd knows something is not right. And then everyone pays attention.

And then it moves from there. And so it's just such a beautiful example of connection, family, you know, feeling, emotion. And like really a reminder of how deeply, if they can feel that in a herd, they can feel you coming from 20 feet away, you know? No kidding. Yeah. So as I've gotten older, I've learned the science around it. But, you know, it's kind of like the science is nice to know for your head. But at the end of the day, the feeling is all the same, which is like I've just felt the magic of horses since I was a young girl. And the healing. You know, for me, it was a safe place. And, you know, when I needed that, that's who was there for me. That must be like the place to go when you feel overwhelmed or. disconnected. Like that just must be your immediate, like, I got to be around. Your sweet adopted

horse, I saw it on your Instagram. Oh my gosh. Her name is Snow White. Obviously, I'm Ariel. So no, but the crazy part is I did not name her. So I am on the board of Sky Dog Sanctuary, the most incredible horse rescue organization. They rescue wild horses from mountup and slaughter. And so they rescue horses every day. And, And a few years ago, there was this group of 11 that were headed to slaughter the next morning. And Skydark stepped in and rescued all 11 the night before slaughter. And they happened to all be named after Disney characters from the BLM, the Bureau of Land Management. So there was like Aladdin, Rapunzel, Snow White, Cinderella.

And for some reason, this one horse, Snow White, I started dreaming about. And I never met her. I never met her. I didn't, you know, I'd had horses. my whole life. I'd never had a wild horse. I was supported the organization, but I'd never adopted one myself. Yeah. I just couldn't get her out of my head. And so I texted Claire, the founder of Skydog, and I just said, hey, I can't get this horse out of my head. What's happening with her? Where is she? She was in way, way upstate. Well, she was in quarantine in Kansas, but then

headed to upstate, this wonderful woman named Anne had had taken on fostered all 11 and then was going to help find them good homes. And I said, I think I got to meet her. And so I drove up with a girlfriend. We actually filmed the whole thing. And when I first met her, I couldn't look at her. I couldn't touch her. I couldn't give her a treat. I couldn't do anything. And so I adopted her, having never touched her, let alone rode her or anything. And then little by little, we got to know each other. And for the first couple days, I would just sit in her stall and I wouldn't touch her. I wouldn't do anything. I just wanted her to get used to my energy. It was very much like the real life version of like Horse Whisper or something. Yes. And then in time, she learned to trust me.

as mama and by the time I would leave, like she would be winning for me or she'd greet me when I came back. Now she's like absolutely one of my babies. And, you know, we were filming marshals out in Park City and was able to move her out there. So she's on over a hundred acres of beautiful lands. How special. It's this wonderful organization called Saving Gracies that's out in Park City. They work with Sky Dog and they have all these beautiful. beautiful rescue horses, rescue cows. And so that's where she is now. And so I would get to see her. Like, sometimes I'd be on set and I'd have a scene off. And I'd look at them and they go, okay, go, just be back in 45 minutes. And I'd race over and I'd go see my horse. And I would come back with allergies all over my face. And they'd go, they would go like, go to hair and makeup.

You know, like five Zyrtex and eye wipes and whatever. You're like, it's worth it. Yeah, yeah. And then I'd race back to set. And, I mean, that girl has changed my life. Wow. May I ask a silly question? You couldn't touch her because she was, like, traumatized or because she's wild or which all of the above? All of the above. Yeah.

Okay. Okay. From what I know, she was rounded up when she was around two and basically held in a place where she could barely move so she was about four. Wow. And so she had no reason to trust humans. And, you know, I mean, she was headed to slaughter. Right. And so when I.

got her, her spirit was very gone. And, you know, she was emaciated. She was young. She was tiny. She didn't really, she was a little bit just like. And I remember after about day three of her being there, I turned to my trainer at the time. And I said, she needs to go outside and run. She needs to remember how to run. And my trainer said, we don't even have like a halter on her yet. And I said, I don't care. Put a rope around her neck. She's got to go. And that was the other thing with her. Like I really felt like she would communicate with me like that. And all of a sudden when I knew something, it was like, you got to do it now. Like she's like she's talking. We got to do it. Wow. And we turned her outside and she just stood there. And my trainer kind of looked at me and I was like,

she doesn't remember she can run. I know it. And so I just started walking. And then she started walking with me. And then I started kind of jogging. And she waited a minute. And then she started jogging. And then she took off. And I actually have the video. Raised her tail and she whinnied and she just started running. And it's the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. That gives me chills. That is so beautiful. And that new show that you're on Marshalls, that is like kind of like a Yellowstone-ish type show. Like you get to be kind of in that era too, right? So it's a spinoff of Yellowstone and it is the first, they're doing a few spinoffs, but it's the first one that's actually going to air. So it airs March 1st on CBS and then

next day Paramount. And so Luke Rines, who plays Casey and Yellowstone, it's essentially his spinoff. It's, you know, life post ranch. What is he doing now? And we're a group of U.S. Marshals, but we're a new team put together. So part of the kind of fun of the beat, the first half of the show is it's not like We're a well-oiled team that is just thrown into missions. We're a team that has to go on these really intense missions, but we're just getting to know each other for the first time. So there's personality clashes. There's humor. There's intense dramatic moments.

There's the horseback riding, the guns, the beautiful backdrop of like Hannah. You know, so it's funny. It's nothing like this. But for some reason when I read the script, the first like half of the season might have a lot of Armageddon when you had like all these big personalities that were coming together for one common purpose, but were so different in life. And it made it really funny and fun to watch. That was kind of how I saw these different characters because like they're all so different in how they approach life, but they're, they have to be one unit, you know? And so there's these

moments where they have to put their drama aside and like save each other's life. But then like there's the drama again. And then, you know, and then. That's all. Like the horses and the Yellowstone. And so it's a really fun combo, I think. At least, you know, I hope. I hope people get that one to watch it. I mean, people love Yellowstone. People love anything like that kind of show.

And that seems like such a fun role for you compared. Like, how is that role so different from other roles you've played? Well, for one, I get to ride horses. Yes. I love that for you. Also, I play a Montana. I play a local. And so I get to have this kind of sass that, you know, I grew up in Florida, which obviously is very different than Montana.

I get that. Don't come from me, people. But what I could relate to is the part of Florida, I grew up and I was at the barn every day. I, you know, the women I was around drove pickup trucks. You know, they were very sassy. They were very hands-on. They could do it all themselves. elves and there's a real kind of like grittiness to that. There's like a power to that. And it's

not forced. It just is. And I really felt like, okay, I know who this woman is and I get to bring some of the women I was around growing up and honor them and kind of what, who made me who I am today and put that into this role. And there hasn't been a lot of roles. I've done a lot of very physical roles. So that piece of it wasn't new to me. which I'm actually grateful for because I feel like if that would have been new to me for this, it would have been overwhelming. For sure. But it was more like getting to bring that kind of horse girl, the outdoorsiness, the sass,

the kind of inner quiet strength of like, you know, you don't know who you're messing with. And I don't even tell you what you're messing with. You know what I mean? Like that kind of badass, yeah. And I haven't been able to do that before. So that was very freeing. Yeah. That sounds like a really, I mean, fun doesn't seem like a good enough word for the role.

But, I mean, just going from, you said earlier, you moved to L.A. when you were 17. Now, was that when you booked Gilmore Girls? That was. I actually met. I graduated early from high school. I had been going back and forth to meet with agents and managers. But I had said to them, when I met with the agents that I was pretty sure I was going to sign with, I said, look, because I was the summer headed into my senior year, I said, look, I'm graduating early, which means I'll be done by December instead of May. Let me go home.

Let me graduate. Let me go home. Let me graduate. Let me move out in January for pilots. season and give it all I've got. You know, I was like, I don't want to go back and forth. I don't want to do half my year in L.A. half my year in Florida. Just let's sign now with the understanding of come January, you have me full time. And so that was the plan. And so then, you know, I would put myself on tape for things before then. But I was busy graduating early. And then I got the call,

like right before the holidays, like, okay, January, I can't remember what it was. Like 16th or something. You got to be in L.A. for the Gimmer Girls audition. And I was like, okay. And I actually didn't, I didn't know the show. And so they sent me a VHS. That's how old I am. I know those. All too well.

So they sent me a VHS so I could get to know the tone of the show because the requirements were, I mean, besides being able to act, was you had to be 5'8 or taller because it was Jared, opposite Jared. And you had to be able to talk fast because of the rhythm. So they really wanted me to learn that cadence. before I got there. And so I was like, okay, great, done. And so I just watched the show and kind of memorized, not to mimic them, but to just understand the pacing. And then the time came to move and all of a sudden it was really hitting me. And I was like, what am I doing? What are we doing? And so I pushed and I pushed it. And finally, I think my dad was like, honey, you know,

like you've got two and a half days. It gets to LA. Right. So my mom and I packed up the car and we drove. Wow. L.A. that evening, I had the audition. next morning. I had a callback, I think like two days later. I was terrified. I blew it at first. Like, I fully blew it. And I remember running for the door. And Kenny Ortega, to his credit, said, stop. He's like, I know you know this girl. I think you're nervous. I think you need to just take a breath. Yeah. And he kind of walked me through it. And we did it again. And I remember feeling something just wash over me where it was like the nerves were forced to go away because whatever he said had put me in a place where all I was in that moment was in the character's moment.

Yeah. And I remember walking out and going, my God, thank you so much. And I felt almost like I had been in a trance, you know, like. And so I walked out and I was on this high and I was like, I don't even care if I get the role. I can do this. Like it was this moment. Like I don't even know.

what just happened, but I can do this. There's a reason I'm here. And by the time I got home, I had gotten the call that I'd got the job and I actually was on set the next day. So it was a very fast turnaround. It doesn't always happen like that. It really actually happens like that. But that was my, and then my first day on set was the ice skating rink where Jared and I kissed. And so it was like, I mean, there was so much coming at me so fast. And I was just trying to play it cool. My mom told him it was my first kissed. I was humiliated. He, yeah, I know. He handled it like a tamp. He was super classy about it, but he did tease me. Because I mean, I think he was 18, you know, it was like, yeah. But yeah, and then off we went. And, you know, he was so wonderful to work with. And Jared and

Milo, I mean, Alexis and Lauren. And I mean, there's not like a better first set to be on, you know. kidding and I love that story because I feel like somebody believed in you more than you believed in yourself and gave you a second chance and then you like you were able to to ground yourself go back in and then you believed in yourself and then you've got it. I love that story. All right you guys when life gets busy workouts are usually the first thing to go. I feel like that happens to me. You have the best intentions but between work, travel, everything else getting to the gym can feel like a whole other thing, a big production. But that is why I love tonal. It's the ultimate strength training system because it really makes working out actually fit into your life. And it is so smart.

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difficult conversations for deeper connection now on Audible. Go to audible.com slash messy love to start listening today. You also auditioned for Mean Girls and Freaky Friday. I want to know who you auditioned for for Mean Girls. I did. So that was before I moved. Gosh, I'm very impressed. I'm very impressed. But what was I going to say? Oh yeah, but you've actually, I think you might be the first person ever to like deep dive this way. I love it. So, okay. So those two auditions, I actually was still living in Florida. And those are, and so they would fly me at, they flew me out to test for both. Wow. And this wonderful casting director, she's doing producing now, but her name is Jamie Roberts, Spares. And she discovered my modeling

card. I called it a comp card. She called it like a Zed card or something. Anyways, from Florida. And she said to Marcy Leroff, we should see this. girl. So I did like a pre-read for Friggy Friday. They ended up flying me out. So first I read for Lindsay's part, Lindsay Lohan, then obviously Lindsay got it. Like I was never getting up. Obviously. So then they switched me to. Then they switched me to whoever the snotty girl was opposite her. I'm forgetting the character name. But I remember Julie Gonzalez played the part. So by the time they flew me out to test for it, it was between me and Julie. And I totally, I think, bombed it. I mean, I was so nervous. I was like, what am I doing? I think I was 15 or 16. I just

like couldn't believe this was happening, you know? Anyone would be nervous. And so I think they even brought me back the next day. I think they were like, look, we get it. You just flew, whatever. The same people then Disney was also doing mean girls. And so I'm, I'm pretty sure it was the Regina role. Oh, my God. And I got close on that. And then again, I didn't get it. But that tape, circulated and then that's what actually got me all the meetings for agents and managers that were like real in Hollywood because before that I'd had people reach out and I kept telling my mom and dad I'm like I feel like these people are phonies and I think my parents were kind of like well who are you going to go with because we don't want to send you to L.A. without representation

I just kept telling them I'm like I don't know I don't have a good feeling and then because I did these auditions and didn't get them but people saw the tapes then I I felt like the real people were calling. And so I did an intuitive queen. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. Ever since I was little, I just kind of like listen, you know?

Yeah. That was, so that actually, that question, what you asked, is actually what actually started. Actually, that's what my role in Hollywood. Like, because of those agents and managers, that's why I moved for Gilmore Girls and, you know, like that. Yeah. Yeah. It was all happening the way it should. I will say I could totally see you in the movie Mean Girls.

I could have totally seen you in that. Well, thank you. I mean, I love Rachel Legatoz, but I appreciate it. I know. I do too. She's a Canadian, so am I. This is also something I feel like people don't talk about. And this could be like, yes, I did my research,

but also I could just be creepy at this point. But you've said you were terrified of not having steady income in your life. And I do feel like that's not something that people talk about. But where did that fear come from for you? Gosh, I am loving this deep dive. Like when I need to remind myself about myself, I'm going to come to you. Yeah, just come right to me. I've got you covered.

What am I say? Can you remind me? I'm your girl. Yeah. Gosh, no, I'm thankful you ask that because that is a deep rooted fear in me that I have. It's even reflected in some of my work choices. Like I can definitely tell you pivotal moments my career where like my age and Amanda will say to me, you don't need to do this.

job pulled out for the next. And I was like, you don't understand. I have to. Well, I mean, even the fact that you were working second jobs while you had like a hit show, your cocktail waitressing. And was that humbling or empowering and then continue on because I interrupted you? It wasn't either. It was exhausting. I bet. It was exhausting. And I didn't know. I was so trained in somehow seeing the equation of overworking equals success. Yes. That I would not ever let myself slow down to appreciate any of it. So it's like it didn't matter that I was on Gilmore Girls.

It didn't matter that I was about to do a movie. It didn't matter. It was like I have to fill every moment of my time with some sort of work, whether it's actually or not to know that I am safe and taking care of and that somehow people from the outside looking in will see that hardworking equals successful. You know, that it was almost like I was afraid if I ever had downtime, they would see me as like lazy and not take me seriously versus the girl who is an actress and also a nanny or an actress and also a cocktail waitress. It was almost like I had this opposite mindset. Like most people move to Hollywood and they do those things until they're acting. And then that's it.

And I was so afraid to let go both. I will never forget the day I pulled over on the side of the road because my manager was begging me. He was trying to figure out how to make my audition schedule work with my nannying and my cocktail waitressing. And he just like hit a breaking point. And he was kind of like, do you want to do this? You know, like are you? And it wasn't, it's not something you'd say to everyone. but I was already working.

So, you know, when you start working, people do start to rely on you to be available. And so I remember sobbing on the side of the road because it was like my nervous system was going through a breakdown of like just being willing to say, okay, I will lean into acting full time. I know it's most people's dream, but it scared the shit out of me as a survival mechanism. But where, and that's what you were going to say is where was that rooted in? Like, where did that come from for you? I think growing up, seeing how hard my parents works, seeing how quickly money can come and go, you know, that that I think even in times where you have a wealthy moment, it can be so fleeting that as a kid, that felt very scary for me. And. And then so then I think as I got older, it almost became counterintuitive because I'm not sure. that I believed, I'm not sure I believed that I could make money and keep money. Yeah. That's a big fear for people.

Yeah. And so it was almost like instead of working on that root problem or wound, I overbisied myself to try and fix it instead of just slowing down and going, well, what am I afraid of? And how can I look at that? And, you know, so yeah, yeah, it's a money has definitely been a very vulnerable topic for me since I was a young girl and I think it's part of what's made me successful, but I've really had to work through a lot. It's a, you know, it's, it's even been a trigger point in relationships.

It's a, it's definitely a hotspot for sure. All of our deep wounds will show up in relationships. That's for sure. That's something I realized over and over and over and over and then over again many times. I know you've obviously worked on it, but do you still operate from a place of fear or what have you done to help shift that perspective. Not the same. I think that, but I've just started to slow down. I mean, even up to a few years ago, I was so much of like a yes person. And I think getting older has forced me to start realizing even like on a deeper level, the power of no, because before it was like, if I can do it, I'll do it. And now I understand just because I can do it doesn't mean it's a yes. You know, it has to click more boxes than just like, oh, well, I'm available. I can.

Especially because you are so good at having a feeling and understanding to trust that feeling, like just listening to that more because clearly you've got that gift of intuition. I think all women do, but some more than others. So it's nice that you could like start leaning into that and know like, oh, this doesn't feel right in my body. You've probably realized that without me saying that. But, you know. No, it's a big, it's a big thing. And I think like in my private time, I can honor it. It's really learning to honor it in like a group setting or if I'm on the phone with a team of people and, you know, going against the grain or whatever the conversation may be. I think that was the piece because I was also like I was a people pleaser for a long time. Yeah. Yeah. So I think that's where like really remembering, wait a second, this is my dream. This is my vision. I'm leading it versus like the people around me are leading the way. And it might be on. It might sound like a duh, but again, because I started so young, you know, I was a kid when I started. And so even though even technically then I was like a CEO of my own company, I was always looking outward to see what their advice was because I was so young. Yeah. I think that was the piece that was harmful. Not on purpose as I got older, but because I didn't understand because I'd learned at such a young age to look around for, you know, that. Then the people pleasing came and da-da-da-da-da-da. And so then it was like, wait a second, no one's going to change this but me. And then when I change it, everyone will take my lead.

So what is my lead? You know? Yep. Okay, we all know this feeling when your to-do list is so long. You don't even know where to start. Oh, I feel like that right now, actually. Work appointments, catching up with friends, remembering to drink enough water. Life is nonstop. And if you throw apartment hunting into the mix, well, forget about it.

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Yeah, it was like 2004, 2004. five something like that something happened where oh my god why am i blanking on his name i competed against him and dancing with the stars jesse mcina yes jesse mcgap i remember like he came into the restaurant that i worked at and all the girls were freaking out and they were filming the movie but so funny i competed against him on dancing with the stars but then i actually heard that there's talk about a sequel and i just want to know for all the john tucker must die fans is there going to be a sequel well first of all i love that you guys run dancing with stars together um what a small world right okay So I started producing a few years ago.

And one of the first projects I ever sold was a sequel to John Tucker, which was very exciting. And the whole cast was back on board. And I mean, it's still very exciting that it even happened. So we worked with the studio for a while. And then we got a script in right before the Rider Strike. They were very like, get it in, get it in, you know. And we did. And then post-rider Strike, we were supposed to pick up and like full force move forward into casting

and like ready to rock. And their slate totally changed. And, you know, that happens. Yeah. The game with studios and the film business. But it got like shelved, which is not a permanent thing, but it is not currently active. And it was definitely a disappointment. For sure.

For sure. Because there was so much enthusiasm going into the ride and strike. Like literally they were like, get it in before the strike so we can keep going as soon as the strike ends. And, you know, and obviously we were all very respectful of the strike. That was the whole point of making sure that we could do all things, you know. And so it was definitely a lot of hard work and a disappointing moment. But I also just like really have faith that, you know, we have a great script and everyone's still excited about the project. And I do have faith that, you know, when the time is right, we'll pick it up again.

Yeah. Time means always everything. I always feel of the fans. Like, honestly, at the end of the day, like, I'm not even joking. such a huge part of our pitch was literally just showing, sharing the fan enthusiasm that's still out there to thank God for things like TikTok where you can see, you know, just like the numbers don't lie. So it is very real. Like, you know, when I say this, I'm not joking. Like they, you know, you all, you all actually hold the power. So I do also believe like if there were to ever be

some sort of resurgence that way people would pay attention. But it has to be. You have to be be organic. You know, it's not something I can, I can do or force. And I, and I never would. You know, but I, it is a really good reminder of like how powerful the fan base is because. I mean, it was an era. It was everything. Well, I mean, if it weren't for that, I wouldn't have ever even been able to talk about a sequel. So, you know, just like facts that I was able to, to do what I was able to do was so exciting, just knowing that there was the appetite for it. So I don't know. Yeah. I have. faith, you know, the moment will come, but it is, it's on pause for it.

I would love that. I, too, I was cheerleading in the Canadian Football League and they picked two cheerleaders to be in the movie and I didn't get picked and I was like, dang it. But two of the girls I know we're like in a little background scene for something. I will make you a deal right now. Should we get a sequel? I will find a way to get you in it. I'll just do like a little like, I'll just be the background somewhere like just sitting in a corner. I don't care. I'll just be like an extra. I would love that. I mean, put me in coach it, a real deal. But if I'm just in a corner, I'll be happy.

I also wanted to say that I love that you're producing and reclaiming your voice in that way. I think that must be such a fun shift in your career and obviously something that I feel like you'd be really good at. Thank you. It's been a really really fun journey. I actually just had some meetings this morning that I'm really excited about. And you know what? At this point in my career, too, I love being able to support and lift up other artists that I believe in. Like, if it's not a story,

I'm telling through my own acting career. I love being able to support someone through producing and tell their stories. So it feels good, you know? It's like it feels like the right next move in my career. You and Sophie both, like you just have very, like you just seem very grounded. And I don't know. There's something like about both of you that talking to you, I just feel like you, like your intuition and your groundedness and just like how both of you, I just, I've really

enjoyed talking to both of you. And that brings me to obviously. the next point of why we're here with I can only imagine two. I watched it. I loved it. I cried three times. It was really sweet. Three times. That's very specific. Three. I really, it was like beginning, middle and end. I cried because I didn't know what to expect. I didn't know the storyline yet. And I love that it was a true story. And so whenever it's a true story, it always just like hits harder. Now, obviously I got Sophie to describe the movie in her words because she has a different character than you. But if you describe your character and the movie, how would you describe it?

It's interesting. I don't know where this came from. I've talked to Hillary, real Hillary, about this a bunch. And like, because she's never described herself this way. But for some reason, when I met her and when I think about her, I always say this term, like, she's so eagle-eyed. Like, she's just like heroed in. And I think where I was really feeling that coming from, because I feel like it came out of my mouth before I realized what I was saying and it just kind of stuck was, you know, She's a wife, a friend, a mother of four beautiful children.

Obviously, Tim Timmins is a walking miracle. And the way that they have been able to face life head on, literally moment to moment, not even day to day, moment, with joy and lightheartedness and humor while still really navigating, like looking mortality in the eye and balancing grief and gratitude and supporting. Tim on his journey. And one of the things Hillary kept saying to me was I was not, you know, Tim, oddly enough, accepted his circumstances long before Hillary did. You know, she was angry. She wasn't there yet. And that's okay, understandably. Of course. But so there was just this term eagle eye that came to me. And so I just, I feel like her character, she is so full of joy. And

she understands that Tim's love language, even when he's hurting, is humor. Yes. You know, and so his ability to make other people laugh, makes him laugh, his ability to bring other people joy, brings him joy. And so even when she was angry, she would turn it into meeting him where he was at. And I think to be able to do that, you have to be so ego-eyed, like, zeroed in on meeting someone at the present moment, no matter what all these emotions around you feel like or look like. And I respect the hell out of her. And, you know, and I've never gotten to play a character

that's in a relationship like she and Tim are in a relationship. Like, they really do like, they like prank each other. You know, it's like, how fun is that? And like, would you ever see that in character, you know? I kept forgetting that these were real people that you were playing. And I kept being like, in a way that couples, and then I was like, no, this is off real people. I keep forgetting that. And that must, like, portraying someone who's a real person whose family will watch this, that must be like such an added, like, layer of heaviness compared to playing a fictional character. Hey?

I'm so committed. Hey. A lot of responsibility for sure. And they were on set a lot, too. And I wasn't sure how that was going to feel at first. And then I realized I'm so grateful they were because it was literally like just one big. family. It was so great. They just, everybody in that film, like everyone who played someone and then everyone who is the real people, all I just couldn't get over the kind of characters they were.

Yeah. And that is how they are. I mean, like, I am not joking you. I get text. It's like we have the group text with everyone. And then I have the group text with Tim and Hill. And then I have the text with Hill. And then I have the text with Milo. And then like, you know, it's like we like, it's just this like ongoing conversation. of support and love. It's really special. Yeah. And I just feel like the audience here is all women, like 28 to 50. Many are divorced. Many are caregiving or thinking about it. Like the story just deals with a lot of different phases of people's life. Different. There's so many things that the story touches on. And illness inside a marriage just always like that must be so heavy. And what did it teach you about partnership? Well, shit. I mean, not much. I'm not in much. Well, maybe about one that you'd want to be in, a partnership that would inspire you to be in. Yeah, yeah, let's see. What did it teach me?

You know, I think I really heard when she said, you know, I wasn't where he was at. Yeah. When he was there. Meaning, like, you have two people in the same relationship dealing with the same disease, processing it at a very different times. And so how do you take time for yourself? And how do you support your loved one who's going through it? And, you know, the person who is going through it has their journey. The person who is the supporter through it has their journey.

How do you make sure it's not selfish? Right. How do you be selfless? How do you take care of your needs while you're being selfless? You know, I mean, I think it's one of the hardest things anyone can do in life is walk side by side during these trying times. And I think that is the basis of the story is like how do you walk through the fire? together having faith that this is the experience, right? It's not like it's better over there. Right. Like this is the experience. I was thinking a lot about it because my mom and my stepdad

have been together for so long and my stepdad has always just been like this provider and the go-getter and he now has stage four cancer and it's just been like so hard and hard for my mom to watch her like kind of have to step into this role where she is such a. a caregiver, she always has been. So like it's easy for her to do that. But I feel like I want her to also not feel guilty about taking care of herself during this. And I actually told her, I'm like, you need to watch this movie. Because they both do have really good senses of humor as well. And I do feel like they can lean into it at times. And I just think this story was so inspiring. And I always tell my stepdad. I'm like, you are such a stubborn asshole. Like you will fight this and

you will like, you could also make, they give him two to three years. And I'm like, I don't see that. Like, I just know that things are possible. And yeah, that's part of the story really touched me for that reason. But also really quickly tell me that story of the first time that you were recognized. So this was early 2000. And, you know, I used to call my parents every single day because I lived in L.A. But I was still a kid.

And it was how I stayed connected. And obviously, as you do when you're in L.A. at that age. I was coffee bean every day wearing my juicy suit. It was some like belor. I can't remember if it was like seafone green or like bright blue, but I know that it was like a juicy suit from head. Yeah, I can see it. Coffee being on sunset, right by Fairfax.

I don't even know if it's still there. But back of the day, it was a spot. And I'm ordering my coffee and I'm talking to my mom and all sudden these two girls. I'm like, excuse me. I was like, oh, hang on. I was like, yeah. They're like, are you? Are you, are girls?

I was like, oh, it's happening. I was like, I am. And they're like, we hate you. Oh, yeah. What the heck? How are you supposed to respond? You're like, in my mind, I'm going, you should say thank you because that means you're playing a very good character of,

like, were you not supposed to be liked? I don't know. And then I'm literally like, no. How'd you respond? Yeah, like, I don't know if I were hearing this. And then I just go like, okay. And I can't even remember. I honestly think I kind of blacked out after that because I can't even remember like how we

transitioned out of that. I think I was in such shock of like, oh, okay. Like, is this what making it feels like? Is this big? Let me tell you, it's not all that it's. cracked out to be. Yeah. That was not kind or exciting.

No. No. And then that was it. And I realized, I was like, oh, wow, my character is definitely hated. And that's my role. And then it's just crazy now years later. It's so interesting that someone comes up to me because I still have that like reaction. And now it's switched to like justice for Lindsay.

And I have to say I never sell that coming. That's amazing. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. This has been one of the most in-depth, wonderful conversations I've had in a very long time. So thank you very much. I love that. I really truly mean it.

And, you know, I'm sorry to hear what your family is going through. I wish you guys a lot of love and support. There is a lot of love there. So that's good news. I feel like that carries much further than people think. I obviously love conversations like these because they just always remind me that life does not move in a straight line. There's always twists and turns and timing of everything. Love doesn't go in a straight line. Careers don't. Identity doesn't. And thank you for reminding us of that today.

I think what is important is your story is just so layered and disciplined and intuitive and you're so evolved. And from early Hollywood, you know, and John Tucker must die days to producing your own projects, advocating for wild horses, all the things that you do and stepping into this new role of, I can only imagine, too, that asks big questions. I just really feel like you do do it all. So thank you for joining us today. Everybody go support the film and keep an eye out for the new series that she's in called Marshalls. And you can follow her on Instagram too, which is obviously just her name.

Ariel Cabell. At Pluto TV, we're celebrating Black History Month with our free curated collection of Black Entertainment. No ifs, ands or buts about it. Catch award winning films like Dreamgirls, Monsters Ball and Selma. We must make a man. Disative demonstration. Iconic hits like school days and set it off.

Plus full seasons of shows like Tyler Perry's sisters and power. I got you. It stars studded brilliant black entertainment and it's all free. This month and always on Pluto TV. Stream now. Hey Never. Hi, I'm Lauren. And I'm Chandler.

And we're the host of Pop Apologist Podcast, a weekly podcast devoted to celebrity gossip, Hollywood deep dives, real housewives drama, and anything and everything, Taylor Swift. We're two sisters who make no apologies for our love of pop culture and the fact that A-listers might be more to us than each other. Join us on your favorite podcast app every Wednesday for Pop Apologists. Pop Apologists, your new favorite sister and celebrity podcast.