Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - Bobby Bones | From Food Stamps to Radio Fame: DWTS, Childhood & the Stories He’s Never Told!

Episode Date: January 6, 2026

#908. This week on Off the Vine, Kaitlyn sits down with radio powerhouse Bobby Bones — and what starts as a conversation about success quickly turns into one of the most raw and unexpected episodes we’ve ever recorded.Bobby opens up about growing up with very young parents, childhood without money, and realizing early on that he was chasing love through performance. He shares deeply personal stories he hasn’t told in years — including why vulnerability didn’t feel safe, how success complicated trust, and an unexpected act of kindness that left him emotional for days.And yes… we go there on Dancing With the Stars! Bobby clears the air on the Mirrorball controversy, what was really happening behind the scenes, and reads a never-before-opened DM from Tom Bergeron for the first time on the podcast.We also get into identity, rejection, why Bobby has never had a sip of alcohol, the anxiety that still keeps him up at night, and an embarrassing childhood story that’s both traumatic and hilarious.Trust us, you’re going to want to hear this one!!If you’re LOVING this podcast, please follow and leave a rating and review below! PLUS, FOLLOW OUR PODCAST INSTAGRAM HERE!Thank you to our Sponsors! Check out these deals!Covergirl: Go the distance with COVERGIRL’s new Eye Enhancer Wrap Tubing Mascara for a lash extension effect. Shop at your nearest retailer now. Only from Easy, Breezy, Beautiful COVERGIRL. Bombas: Head over to Bombas.com/VINE and use code VINE for 20% off your first purchase.Figs: Take 15% off your first order at Wearfigs.com with the code FIGSRX. Quince: Go to Quince.com/vine for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada, too!Progressive: Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance!Wayfair: Head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. Wayfair. Every style. Every home.EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: (9:25) — Growing up without money or Santa Claus, and what it was like being raised by teenage parents(14:40) — The first time Bobby ever said “I love you” — and why it didn’t happen until his wife(26:58) — The unexpected act of kindness from a stranger that left Bobby crying for days(1:11:19) — Bobby opens and reads a never-before-seen DM from Tom Bergeron about the Mirrorball controversy(1:20:20) — The embarrassing childhood story Bobby has never lived down — and how it still affects him todaySee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Now available in Canada, too. You're listening to Off the Vine with Caitlin Bristow. Hey, Vino's, real quick, if you are listening right now, which obviously you are, you wouldn't be hearing this, can you hit the subscribe or follow button on whatever platform you're on? Please. that one simple thing helps more than you even realize it allows me to keep growing on this podcast and making these episodes the best they can possibly be obviously for you. That's the only favorite I'm going to ever ask, okay? It truly means the world to me. Thank you. Now let's get into it.

Hey, everybody. Welcome to Off the Vine podcast. I'm your host, Caitlin Bristow. And today's guest is someone that you definitely know, even if you don't realize you know him yet, because Bobby Bones is one of the biggest names in radio. He's the host of the Bobby Bone Show and nationally syndicated Morning Show heard by nearly nine million listeners a week. He's also a Dancing with the Stars winner, a New York Times bestseller, and wildly self-deprecating.

I went on his podcast not too long ago, and I thought he was going to be intimidating, and we hit it off. I really enjoy his company, and of course we had to talk about the whole, what is the word, finango, finago, fendigo, finagle,

whatever, we talked about the whole situation of how he sent back the mirror ball, because Tom Bergeron had said something. Now, we clear a lot of ground on that topic, and we even got a DM from Tom Bergeron in the moment that he reads out loud. But what makes Bobby really interesting is his story.

His parents were 15 and 17 when they had them. He grew up in a tiny town in Arkansas and ended up being raised by his mom, but most of the time, his grandma. He didn't come from money. He didn't come from connections, but he built his own empire, and he's just honest.

I really like how honest he is. Let's introduce Bobby to Off the Vine. Have you heard of this mysterious sickness that's going around? Which one? I forget there is a name apparently for it. Do you have TikTok? Yeah, you have TikTok. Do I have TikTok?

Do you have running water? Well, I was just talking to somebody the other day who didn't have TikTok and I was like, that's crazy. You have to for your job, obviously. But it was, I found the name of whatever it was. I can't remember. It's too long of a name. But they said it was this thing where somebody gets a sore throat for like four weeks,

which I had. And then the surthroat's now gone. Well, actually, today I still woke up with a bit of sore throat. It's not contagious. They're saying it's just like. Who's they? TikTok. Yeah.

I don't trust. I shouldn't trust them. I wouldn't, yeah, I wouldn't trust that. But it was weird how many people were like saying, I've had a sore throat before. It's winter. It's just a cold, right? Well, whenever it gets colder outside, everyone, most people congregate inside of buildings instead of outside. Well, that's, and that's why people get sick in the winter is because we're all closer to each other.

Not really because it's cold or growing up. It was if you get a wet head and you go outside. Yeah, that's old wives. Yeah, it's just literally we're all in the rooms together. And then there are also allergies are terrible here. Like, I'm so dry. Oh, it's so bad. I don't know that it's a mystery illness, but I can definitely see where I could talk myself into it if I watched enough TikTok.

Yeah. I talk myself into anything if I watch enough TikTok and that is a me problem. Do you ever get the TikTok where I'll be on at night and it'll give me the video after like an hour and a half and it's like, hey, you've been. you've been watching a lot of TikTok. Maybe you should get off. Do you ever get that? No. Oh yeah, it's a thing.

I'm not proud of it, but it's a thing. The algorithm? Yes, because they're concerned that you've been on for so long. They're not. Who's concerned? They're probably putting out for a legal reason, but I literally will get a video and it'll go, hey, so you've been on a long time.

Maybe you should take a break. And it's telling me to relax from TikTok. Ooh, passive aggressive. I don't like it. Probably a good idea for me to get off TikTok if I'm getting that warning, though. Does it make you leave? No, I know it now.

I've had it so many times. as soon as I see the first second of it, I swipe out of it. You do? Yeah, yeah. Oh, God. Instagram. Oh, it's somebody, I've never seen this before. I took a screenshot of it.

Somebody, I got a heart and it says, you're not alone. Someone thinks you might need some extra help. Yes. Somebody thinks you might need some extra support right now and asks us to help. Did you cry in a video? After that. I cried about Pina last night. Wait, did you cry?

Were you emotional in a real? Nope. I didn't even post a reel in days. That's bizarre. Do you think that's passive aggressive? I think someone's like... Actually, I think it's, okay, the super conspiracy theory. I think it's probably Big Brother.

They know everything we're doing. They're obviously listening to us when we're not using our phones, right? There are microphones and everything. Yeah. And the same reason we get ads, targeted ads, they hear us talking about things. Possibly you were sad. They heard you and you got that the same way that you would get the limited ad if you walking by one of them all.

But you don't think, like you don't think someone went to my page and clicked, I'm worried about her. Definitely could have, but if you were honestly emotional the day that that happened, I wasn't. Even for the dog, not on the camera, but if you were sad about your dog or for any reason whatsoever and your phone had the ability to be close and hear you, I think it possibly could have heard you and given you the heart. I genuinely remember thinking, actually, I haven't been sad in a hot minute, which is surprising.

Like, I don't know. Then it may be a weirdo. Yeah. But I wouldn't put it past social media, though, to be listening all the time because they obviously are to give us ads. Yes. And that if you were super sad, it reaches out as a friend. Well, because they don't want to see you go to use it so much.

Do you believe in dog mediums? I've paid a couple of them, but only as a bit because I do not believe them. Now, I can't prove that they're not telling the truth. Right. It's like people that die and go and I see the lie and talk to people. I can't prove they're lying. Right. But I don't believe they're telling the truth.

I'll tell you what. So my day was sad because I think I go to like worst case scenario for a lot. lot of things. Pino had to go in for surgery to get his tooth extracted. Heart problems. I was scared. Blah, blah, blah. But I was like, I'm going to talk to a dog medium about when it was before he went in for surgery. And I am, I am a sucker. I'll give you all of my money. You believe you have a mystery illness for four weeks. Yes. And I believe it could be healed by a crystal. A crystal. Oh, yes. I've got the ones that I need downstairs by my bed. But this medium was like, tell me how she knew this. So I told her my name was Kelly. That's my assistant's name. So I made the Venmo come from

Kelly. She did not know Pino's name. She knew he was a golden retriever and I sent a picture of the dog. She was quite older. Don't think she's on social media. She could be. But anyway, she thinks my name's Kelly. She has never seen me. I was texting from a different number. I then moed from another number. And she said, I wanted to see if she would bring up something about his heart. And she goes, has something in the last week happened that like kind of rattled him that would either hurt his like tummy or his heart? Like he seems to be having pain in like the heart or his stomach. And I was like, his heart disease. Okay. Anyways, I was asking all these questions about like his ears, his fur, his coat, how often he pees. Like I wasn't giving her information. I was just

asking like what she's getting from him. And she goes, you might want to check his upper back right chewing molar. And that is the tooth that was cracked on how I found out Pinot heart disease. How did you know that? I don't know. She honestly could be the owes the mentalist of the dogs. That guy was on my podcast once. He guessed my, oh, you had him? Yes. He guessed my pen, my bank pin code. He knew my friend's birthday. He knew some random person's name that I'd like not thought of in a long time. I have no idea how he does it. Yeah, like I said, I can't prove that they are not telling the truth. And there's probably a couple real ones, but there's so many, not the mentalist, but him as well, but he even admits

he's not magic or he doesn't have his psychic power. Yeah, he's, he's like, no. But there's probably like three real life psychics that exist, but there's 700,000 that are faking it. Yeah. So therefore, I don't believe any of them because the odds that I'm going to get the actual one, probably not that high. That's crazy though if they said the dog had a messed up tooth and then the dog had a messed up tooth. That's one of my friends runs Dan White's magic show in New York and I went to that one time and it was the most unbelievable thing I've ever seen. And I was like, please just tell me how he does one thing. And he goes, you don't want to know, Caitlin. You don't want to know these people's secrets and you don't want to know their tricks because then you won't believe

in magic and it's still a little bit of magic that you have that you've like lost as a child. And I was like, you're right. Don't tell me shit. That's what I watch on TikTok. I watch honestly the revelation of magic tricks revealing. Really? I watch them constantly. I watch the old ones from David Copperfield specials to even how they do the slide of hand ones. Because I don't actually want to see the trick. I just want to see how it's done. When I read a book, all I can do is wait until the last page.

Like, it's all I think about is this book being over. Like everything I do, I started, but I don't live in the process in a healthy way. It's just I cannot wait to complete it. I get that. So I'm not a big magic show guy, but I like to see how they're done. Yeah. Yeah, see, I like both. I like seeing how things are done, but I also love the process and like feeling the

magic of it because like I know he's not like there's some trick to it it's not like he just learned how but then I think about some of my friends kids are getting to the age of not believing in Santa and I was like oh how sad like that magic to me was just so nostalgic and then I was thinking of you your parents were what 15 and 17 when they had you they were little children when they had you I never believed in Christmas oh I mean that for that reason it's not Christmas we didn't have a lot of Christmases I mean Because you were basically raised by, like, what, your grandma? Mom had me when she was 15.

Yeah. My biological father, who I don't know my dad. Right, right. But he left when I was very young. So it wasn't like there was any money. And when there's no money, coincidentally, there's no Santa Claus. Because how do you get, because, you know, Santa's. Hey, don't listen to this while you're in the car with the kids.

Exactly. We should have said that at the beginning, but yes. I'll put a trigger warning at the beginning. And my mom left when I was four or five years old. and she did come back eventually. Okay. But my grandmother adopted me. And I didn't know my grandmother had adopted me until later in life.

Now, I knew I spent a lot of time with my grandmother, but I found a social security card where my last name was changed on it. To Bones? Just kidding. No, to her. Well, and Bones isn't even my real last name. I know. But my grandmother's name was Hazel Hurt, which I have,

oh, beautiful. Like I have her name tattooed him on arm, but it said Bobby Hurt. And I thought, who's Bobby Hurt? And then it was that moment where she kind of had to admit that that was me, I was adopted for a long time by her. What age were you? Five, six, seven, nine. My mom was in an out of bunch.

Yeah, yeah. There was no Santa. And I remember thinking, and this is unfair to think, these kids are so stupid because they believe in a magical man that brings them presents. And my wife now, we talk about this because we're going to have a kid soon. I don't have any kids. This is crazy. I never thought I would have kids.

Never thought I would be married. And she has a wonderful family. She loves Christmas. When I started dating her and became engaged to her, we would go back to Oklahoma for Christmas, which was weird for me because we didn't have Christmas really as a kid. And as I got to be an adult, I didn't have Christmas. I mean, I'm by myself. What am I going to do? Put a tree up and open presents alone. I do. Well, you still believe in the magic. But yes. And so, but they would have this tradition where they watched Elf on Christmas Eve. There was a Christmas dinner. And I

felt so awkward. It was, it was so foreign and uncomfortable to me because it was so much togetherness. And people would just, you just sit around with people and not do anything. Well, and you, you don't really have the nostalgia. None of that time. No Christmas nostalgia, no family. I'm not used to sitting around with a bunch of family and just for the, just sitting and talking. Right. With no intention.

And how long have you been with your wife? Married almost five years now. Okay. Are you start, yeah, how long together? Six, six and a half or so. So are you starting to like. Oh, now it's great. Yeah.

I love her parents. Yeah, that's nice. All my friends were warning. me of, hey, whenever you get married, the parents are often difficult or one of them's difficult or I love them. Now, I don't have parents. Right. But I'm very fortunate that they're so great. And what's awesome for us is at this point in my life, like I have money. And so we went on vacation to Italy again. And I said, let's take your parents. And so to be able to, we took them and they said, well, that's in first class. It was so fun. That's nice. So that to me. But I

don't have the Christmas magic built into me. I'm starting to get it a bit. But the debate now with my wife is, I don't know if I want to tell my kid that there's a Santa Claus because I want the credit for the presents. I get that. I've thought about that often. I was watching the Santa Claus two last night. That's good. Underrated. So underrated. Two is better than one. Two is better. Two is better than one. Two is better. I don't go that far, but I think two is really good. You're right. They're both very up there. Two is better than normal twos are of anything. That's what it is. I think I'm usually just. used to the second one of anything sucking and the fact that this one was on par, same with

Home Alone one and two. I find the same. Like, I love both of them so much. I like Home Alone too a lot. Yeah. Yeah. And then there, but have you seen the Santa Claus 3 also. Is Tim Allen still in it? Yes. He's still. It's so good. They have like, what's the Canadian? Um, Alanis. Alanis. Justin Bieber. Brian Reynolds. Martin Short? Yes. The comedian. Yes. Yeah. He's in it. Did you ever watch Lost? On and off. I had the DVD set later, but... It's a great cast of Santa Claus 3.

Anyways, I was thinking about how stupid these movies are, even though I love them so much, because I'm like, how did the parents at the end just start being like, there is a Santa Claus? And my husband is... But then you're like, well, you bought all the presents. That's the problem that I have is, and the kind of understanding we have is the big presents, we're getting credit for. Santa can bring the mid-presence. Oh, that's a great idea, because Santa always brings the...

legit big ones. I don't want that to happen. Smart. I want the credit. Yeah. Give them like, are you having a boy or girl? Do you know?

We don't know. When's a due date? We don't say. I know. Even better. I love privacy. It's something that I've learned because my wife is not public at all. Yeah.

And that's been something that I've started to value a little more because she values it. Because old me is like, here's what's up. Here's how dialade everything. But with her, it's been. that where I do value her, she's private, and I've also started to make a few things precious. Yeah, like secret. Yeah, which really, to me, to me, it shows even to her that I value it.

For her, it's what's been interesting is, like, I never told anybody in my, my family, we didn't say love. Nobody ever said it. My wife is the first person in my whole life that ever told I loved. Your wife is the first person you ever said, I love you? Ever. Really? Okay.

And was there other times that you had been? been dating that you wanted to or you felt it or you really? No, I thought I was broken. I thought I was broken. I just was never, nothing was ever real. And I never thought I would get married, never thought anything. And yeah, I never said it to anybody. And it also became a deal where it's like I didn't want to waste my flower. Yeah. It got to that point. It was like your virginity at that point. Yeah. So she's the first person that I have ever told that I loved. And what happened was it kind of opened up, opened up a lot of, there's some freedom in me now to tell people that I do love, that I do love them now.

It's a lot of therapy. Wow. Yeah, of course. And, but I credit her as to being like the foundational shaker of me that made me realize that I have it in me. Wow. So that's beautiful.

I think so. It is. I'm telling you so. It's, you know, when you're so close to it, you don't know if it's beautiful or weird or awesome. It's awesome. Yeah. But yeah, she's that.

Wow. Oh, yeah, we're going to have a kid and it's crazy. Did you know right away? I don't, I don't know. No. I don't know anything right away. I'm the same, but some people really have, well, especially in your situation where you've never told someone you love them before, I was thinking, wow, you must have known right away.

I try to talk myself out of everything, out of everything, not even just in romantic or relationships, but everything. If it's good, I try to think there's no way it's this good. So let me find a way to sabotage it. Yeah. And you didn't do that with her? I didn't. It was so valuable to me that I, every time that I would meet myself with something, it was,

this is so different that you should actually treat yourself differently because this feels different. That's like a pivotal moment in life to realize to treat yourself differently in that moment because I kind of feel similar. In past relationships, I'm like an L-bomb dropper though, but I was always like, ooh, it's just fun. It's at that point we should say it. And then I feel like I was, I never felt really truly safe and I wasn't treating myself properly. to be at the place that I needed to be for somebody else. And then I would project so hard, even if they deserved it. But I was like, I became mean at the end of relationships.

And I would say things where I'd be like, how could I say that to anybody? Where now I'm dating and I'm like, I can't even imagine those words coming out of my mouth because I just like respect myself and that person too much. For me too, it was the ability to accept a love. Yeah. Because I never did that. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense.

that was that that was the hardest thing what about from your grandmother uh yes but you're talking about like a very old school lady she's she's old and she was awesome she was the one stable anything that i had yeah but you're talking about she was 70 there was stability there but also we were so poor yeah that the only stability was i knew she would be there you know when you're struggling for hamburger helper it's a bit hard to really focus on the other parts of the day in life we're were living off of her social security. So I'm so grateful for her. Like she was the reason that I'm here. But I think like the second version of that is my wife. And I never thought I would say that. Wow. Yeah, that's crazy. Because I, I'm the guy that, you know, like I said about the psych,

there's no way. I can't prove there's no way. But I just don't believe in anything magical like that. You're skeptic. Yeah. I think I'm a, I'm too pragmatic at times for my own good. And it at times poisons the well. I mean, it does, obviously you know why and it makes complete sense. Why. And the main thing is you have actively worked on that. It's therapy. Yeah. It's not even like I had some realization. Right. It's I, the first time I ever got insurance, I went to therapy, just to see what it was about. Yeah. Maybe to talk about it on my show. And I bet I was shaken because there's somebody who didn't care anything about me, giving me unbiased, educated opinions based off similar situations and I thought wow they don't need me for anything yeah and they may not be right but

they probably are and I should listen to this because again they're coming from no bias they don't have to live with me they have to work with me yeah and I really dedicated myself and I've done everything I've done MDR I've done I've gone to onsite I go I have two therapists now we go as a couple we started that way early on it's the greatest it allows us to have conflict yeah not fighting I did not know the two were different. Yeah. I didn't know you could have conflict or disagreements and not fight. Yes.

And so our couple's therapist is amazing. There's a trust. You have to have a trust in a relationship with them. I agree. Because there are times where he thinks I'm really wrong. Yeah. Do you have an okay with being really wrong? Are you okay with it?

Because I struggle with being really wrong. No, I'm terrible at it. Yeah. I want to be better at it because when they're saying it to me, I genuinely think they're wrong. but like maybe deep down I know but I think a lot of people are scared of therapy but they think it's going to be these this one big aha moment when really it's just like the small shifts of going to therapy actively and choosing you and choosing your partner and going all the time where five years later you're like holy shit yeah look at how far I've come without even

noticing yes same thing with my because I have a therapist that I go to just for me yeah and they have to be different yes and so I go to the therapist just for me and And it's rare that I have a breakthrough. But it's not rare that I look at it macro and I go, oh, wow, I have grown. It's almost like every day the earth is slowly turning. We don't notice it. The next thing you know, the sun's going down. It's nighttime.

That's kind of what it feels like going to therapy. Rarely do I have an aha moment. But I always have those moments where I'm happy that I've gone because I can feel like maturation inside of me. That's a really good. What's the word? Analogy. Analogies.

My brain. That's a really good analogy, actually. because, yeah, you don't notice, but it's all in like the small little times throughout your whole day and life. And that's, I've been doing therapy for I think 13 years. And I like, I want to hug 27 year old me so badly because I was like, you clueless little ding dong. And just I'm so proud that I stuck with it for that long. Because a lot of times I'd be like, I think I'm cool. I think I got this now. But I would still go back. And then I'd realize a whole layer of something else I had not unlocked yet or something I didn't even realize or remember. And same, that's, when EMDR did big things for me. Have you done the thing where you put the picture of like your 10 year old self down and talk to it? Yes. And I don't cry, not because it's a masculinity thing, but it's a vulnerability thing.

Yeah. Was not allowed to be vulnerable because you can't be when you come up like I do. Right. So there's no vulnerability for me. And I don't cry a whole lot. You want to see me freaking weep. It's that. You pull up the 10 year old picture of yourself and you talk to them and you tell them how

proud you are of them. and I don't do that. The waterworks just start pouring. I was the exact same way. And same thing when like, I remember I hadn't cried in a long time and I was feeling a little dead inside. And my, what was,

I don't know what her title is. She's like an intuitive spiritual coach. She's a shaman. His name is Jay Shetty. Just kidding. But it was someone who was like, okay, picture what comes up for you at like this, like what age were you when,

you started first feeling these emotions. And then she did this whole visualization through it. And then that was just visualized, not a photo in front of me. And then I think I told you on your podcast when I did Hoffman, where it's like the inner child work. And the front picture in your binder is like a whatever age you wanted that person to be when they needed you. Oh my gosh. When I looked at that photo and started talking to her, same thing. I just lost it. It was like uncontrollable sobbing and like that's now what I do all the time when I'm feeling like insecure or like I didn't get something like a big job that I wanted or I'm having like something triggering me from my family like anything I'll just be like I'm gonna go meet I'm gonna go meet her and I just picture the same age

the same girl I remember the clothes she has on like it's the same one every time that's powerful to put it on the front of a binder that you're gonna have the whole time that you're there um I went and again I used to look at therapy as what rich people did really Yeah, and I really resented people that did it until I did it. And I did it at first with insurance. And it was like a $10 copay. So if anybody's listening, and I always feel sensitive even talking about it because I never want to be the guy that's just doing rich people things. But it has changed my life. And I was going before I was before I had money. But I, like you just said, I felt really dead inside for a long period of my life. Because I was working so much. My relationships just with friends weren't good because I wasn't investing in them. yeah so holidays would come and i would be not sad it just there would be nothing so i had this dead feeling and i went to on site and i did that on my vacation like that's how little i had other than work so it's vacation and all my crew all my because all my crew's friends from 15 years ago everybody that works for me is all my friends from my life and so they all go with their

families and their kids and so i'm just home and um i had like dave from lady a who's a friend he was at my house and he said hey man you should go to onsite because you're super creative but you also have to run a business so you're also analytical and he said I think so he recommends that I'm not going to go to that crap and I then think well I don't have anywhere to go on vacation I'll just go to on site and so beautiful property I go or I call miles and I don't know them personally but I know I've seen him at events and stuff and I said hey I'd like to come but I only have like next week off I didn't realize you needed to book it months out yeah and he said well there is a there's an entire group here. He said, you should do by yourself because you're going to feel weird

if people are watching you tell your story because a lot of them are probably going to know who you are. Exactly. Yeah. I said, great. So I go and I don't know anybody there and I'm not in any group. I'm the only person doing solo. And so I go and I tell the lady, because it's intense. It's five days a week for eight hours a day and I have the same person. I tell her, it's a ham dead inside us. I kind of feel like an old bathtub that's just full of water that I just need to let it out, but I don't cry and I would love to cry. And she says, Well, don't pressure yourself to cry. Maybe you will, maybe you won't.

And we do day one, both sessions, and I don't cry. But I feel like I've been in therapy long enough that I know I'm probably gaining something even if it doesn't feel like it. You're cracked open a little. Day two, nothing. Day three, nothing. And I go to the first half of day four, nothing. And I've kind of given up on the fact that I may cry.

But I do feel like I need some sort of cathartic release. Right. And at lunch, everybody goes and everybody kind of had their clicks at this because they're all in groups together. I didn't know anybody. You weren't allowed to say your last name or your job or anything at this thing. And so, but there's a, like a piece of paper that's up on the wall and it says campfire tonight, 8 p.m. And so I'm looking at it and I'm standing next to these two other guys and it was cold. And I just said to one of the guys, oh man, this would be the one thing I would go to and I don't have any socks. I'd forgotten socks to come to this thing. And this is like a tatted up

biker dude. Because some people had come from prison. From rehab in. Some people, some people, were like me, some people for business. It was everybody. Yeah, mixed bag. And so I'm just judging this dude because he's got head tattoos. And I'm like, for sure, this dude's from rehab or prison or maybe both. It would be one to the other. There's jelly roll. We don't say names. You know, who knows? He just called himself jelly. Didn't know his last name. So I went to the campfire by myself, didn't know anybody. I'm sitting out and they're playing music and I thought this is kind of cool. And I also like hot dogs a lot. And they had hot dogs. And I'm sitting there and it's right at that stage where it's getting dark, dark. And the guy with the tattooed head comes

up and he said, hey man, I met you earlier. I have these and he gave me some socks. I started crying. I weeped. I weeped. It makes me, I don't, it makes me emotional now thinking about it. I started crying so much there in that moment. I think he thought I was like freaking out or having like a seizure. I was crying so hard because here was somebody who I didn't need anything from, didn't need anything from me. And that was the biggest part. Yeah, yeah. I'm so concerned now with why people like me because I, people didn't like me growing up. So all of a sudden I get a little success, people start liking me. What do they like me or do they like what I can possibly give them? Right. This dude did not know what my job was. He just heard somebody that

was hurting, even if it was cold feet. Right. And remembered it. Brought the socks out there just in case he saw me. I cried and then I went and I cried the whole next day. Oh, I'm like getting misty eyed. That is really sweet because like you said, I know from talking to you on your podcast and your story and so many things like it means so much more that he just listened didn't want anything in return and just cared and he just genuinely cared that you might have coffee and that was such a reminder to me to just care and stop worrying so much about all the things like why are people using you do you what do they think about you and I still definitely deal with that and I'm wildly insecure we all are we wouldn't be in this creative business but that that is really one of the monumental

a freaking pair of socks yeah mental in my life. Do you still have the socks? I do. I do. I would do a thing. I did a tour doing the show called comedically inspirational. And I ended up being a special that was on CMT, like a comedy special. And it was great. I really loved it. And it was like 15% of me telling stories and then 85% of me telling jokes. Yeah. And I told a very short version of that story. And at the end, every night I had socks and I threw them to the crowd. And I was like, hey, these aren't

to wear. These are to remind you. Yeah. Yeah. And that, I haven't told that story in such a long time. Like it makes me like feel emotional even sharing that again. Yeah. But yeah, those socks. It was amazing. Well, it's too such the buildup of everything you'd cracked open like before. And that's what it was. That's what, that's what busted it open. On site for people who don't know. I've talked about it so many times. I'm sure people do. But it's, it's, it's just like an intensive retreat for therapy. Super intensive. No phones. Yeah. You read books. You live like Abraham Lincoln. You turn butter. Yeah. animals. That's not the pamphlet, but do it you will. I went, I was around the horses every single day. I was just obsessed. But I think it's so, yeah, on-site I was like, on-site and Hoffman, I always preach to everybody, like my listeners have a joke going on of how much I talk about. Oh, good. Then that's not completely out of the left field. Okay, go the distance with Covergirl's new eye enhancer wrap tubing mascara for

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That's B-O-M-B-A-S dot com slash vine, codevine at checkout. You know, sometimes it can go one of two ways for people. And I think we kind of touched on this on your podcast. But for my listeners, I think a lot of people can go the way of like drugs, alcohol, get like angry and not that you're allowed to have anger, but just go a different route that you did. You got really motivated.

And wasn't it like the age of seven you wanted to have your own radio show? Yeah, I was really young. I wanted love. And the only way that I think I was finding love was being performing. And even though it wasn't real, it was how I got it. And so it didn't matter if I was in a play at school, if I was just funny. I just wanted love. And performing is that. And so, yeah, I was wanted to be, my goals in life were to be on the radio, were to be a stand-up comic and were to do music. And I've done, listen, I'm not great at really any. I've had success. but that doesn't mean I'm great. But I think my success has come from a connection with people.

And so I've always known what I wanted to do. I read a lot of books growing up because that was the way to get out. Because nobody in my family graduated high school. Right. Nobody graduated college. And also I'm so proud of me as a kid that because even today, like I've never had a drink of alcohol and I would love to drink alcohol. It'd be my favorite thing to do.

Really? Because there's no judgment. I love feeling. I wish that I could. I think I would and I would be awesome. I'd be so awesome at it. I would love to do every drug. I would love to have all alcohol.

And I haven't because I know when I would, I have such a personality that I want to do everything all the way. I got blood work done and I got tested for the gene to see if I have the addiction gene. I don't have it. I was reading a book in the realms of hungry ghosts and fantastic book and the doctor that wrote it. Because I think a lot about addiction. I've lived through a lot of addiction. My mom died in her 40s from a drug addiction.

I don't know my dad probably from alcoholism. So I've really spent a lot of time learning about it. And he writes this book and he talks about how some people like you just mentioned there, they can, and I'm going to go all the way hard. They can take heroin and not get addicted to it. Right. And he's like why it's so severe is you don't know until you know. Yeah.

It's almost like you have to do heroin. To know if you like heroin. To know if you're addicted to heroin. Yeah. And that's not like having a glass of wine. And oh, I may be like this. Like having heroin, it's like you could die. Yeah.

But even wine, if you're an alcoholic and you have that in you and it hits, you're in. Yeah. Like you love the taste of blood. Yeah. So I know that I would. Good for you. So I don't. I wish I could.

But that is what I mean. Like that's, you have such a strong personality in so many ways. Like I'm sure it is used good and bad. But like to have that. kind of self-motivation and know yourself to go, I can't do that or this is going to happen. Yeah, I feel like it'll hurt productivity. And my only way out was productivity. And you enjoy it. Enjoy what? Productivity. Oh, yeah. I enjoy the product of productivity. Like I talked about earlier. You know, the process at times gets to be a bit difficult. But I like when things end in a success.

Which I know you are humble. But like obviously you have been wildly successful. And then at 17, you did get on the radio. I did. Yeah, I got a job. I went and begged for a job. 17. That's crazy. Yeah, but the job was changing out Rick D's countdown CDs. I wasn't on the air. But what happened was, as this happened many times in my life, yes, I was there. I got this job. And before I ever worked my first day, because I was also cleaning the lobby on Sundays, they had to fire somebody because they were stealing station equipment. And they said, hey, you have to go on. And I was a kid. I was 17. It's what I wanted to do, but I didn't know what I was doing, which is fine. I've done that my whole life. And so I went on the year on weekends immediately with no experience. They didn't

hire me to do that. They just needed a warm body. Whoa, how? How did you do it? I've seen a radio studio. It's a lot. I went on at like 1 a.m. when it didn't matter in a very small town. I didn't even have a, my name was my name that people know me now is Bobby Bones, but I didn't pick that name. That's the worst name ever. No, it's not. Well, it's just normal now, but I think it's a sick radio name. I know, but that's the thing. Like, my whole career has been built off authenticity and to have a fake name always felt dopey. And so my real name is Bobby Estol. Yeah. And my wife uses my, our real last name. And so it's not like I hide it. Oh, yeah. Oh, so she's not Mrs. Bones. Oh, no. She'd rather stab herself in the eye with a pair of

scissors. Yeah, no chance. Oh, funny. No chance. Oh, she like respects, like, where you come from, who you are. I don't know if it's that, but she knows that Bobby, Bones is an elevated version. It's not the real because everything is so... It's the on version of you. Yeah. So she doesn't go by bones at all. But it was either Bobby Bones or Bobby Z and I thought, man, those names suck.

But also, I'll just pick bones. Kind of sounds like a pirate. But I'll change it. But then everywhere was connected and I couldn't change it. And then it was just a part of it. Yeah. And that all happened from you just, they needed someone in there. They needed someone to clean the lobby and change a CD.

And they told you. you, you can't have your normal name. You need a radio name. Okay. Because I feel like you're also known as somebody who kind of made it without the safety net. Like you, you really didn't have anyone behind you helping you. You didn't have people paying for like you to go to college and you really did build everything on your own. Yeah, none of that. And I used to be very resentful about that. Really? Where just towards people that had things given to them. It's unfair now as an adult for me to feel that way. Because I'm going to give my future kid or kids stuff. Right. But I would be so jealous and insecure that it manifested itself into resentment. And I would be

resentful if people got their college paid for if they had somebody they knew they helped them get a job. So yeah, I didn't have a safety net. And it really bothered me for years. However, I think now I'm so grateful that I didn't have a safety net because I have such a Swiss Army knife of skills that allowed me to, when things didn't go right in my career, easily pivot and hop into other things. So I'm happy that all that happened to me. But at the time, I was really pissed off about it all. I totally get that. I feel like there's probably parts of your story

that people romanticize that piss you off too. I think that everything after it happened years later is a much glossier version of how it actually went down. Yeah. When I moved to Nashville? It was a disaster. When did you move here again? 2013.

Why was it a disaster? I was hated. I came. So I lived... You were? Oh, it was brutal. In the city, within the city. And the format.

Like, I was, I was so. different than anything else here. So I moved here in 2013. I was doing pop and hip hop and I built my own syndication company with my own money in Austin. It's amazing. And I was just patching together equipment pieces. And we were also podcasting like crazy in like 2008. So we were podcasting was a thing in 2008. It was and I was again, I was very fortunate that I was the youngest doing it. Yeah. Because all I was doing was doing was listening to the podcasts in the early days. Because it literally was a download on an iPod, which is why they're called podcasts. Interesting. So I would, so what we were podcasting heavily then early. And so it was like, just guys, revolutionary.

No, I was 23. I wasn't revolutionary. I was just young doing it. Sure. And I built a massive network of stations on pop and hip hop. I even had hip hop record deal for a while as a rapper. You did not. Yeah, honestly, my name is Captain Caucasian. And I was funny. What? Yeah, I did a song. What are you like the lonely? Island? Sort of a bad version of it. And I did a song with Carly Patterson, the gymnast, when she had a record deal. Can we please play it? You don't want it. I think that I think they honestly took it down. Not because of me, but there's stuff still on the internet of that time. I was voted, I think, second best rapper in Austin, Texas on the Austin Chronicle Music Awards.

You're kidding. In like 2006, maybe, I definitely. What was your rapper name? Captain Caucasian. So I did this. I built this network and I moved to Nashville because they didn't have a nationally syndicated show. And I thought, I'm from Arkansas. I'm not going to change what I do, but I think I talk to people more than a format talks to people. I moved here. It was a nightmare.

But I was also playing hip-hop music on country stations. I still do it today. Yeah. Yeah. So the format hated me and I didn't take guess because it was just part of the cycle. It was so bad for me. Do you know the Billboard story? No.

Okay. So. You know, I don't, Kevin asked me to ask you about the Billboard story. You reminded me of this because the version and real life is way different than the version now. It's been glossed over. Yeah. And revisionist history. But it was going terribly for me here. I was a year and a half in. Do you want to quit? No. I wanted to kill everybody. Okay. Fair enough. I was a bull in a china shop. I was fighting with everybody. Artists, record labels. Wow. If you, if I felt like you were a threat to me or were mean

to me, even unfairly, I lashed out. Because you wanted to prove yourself? Very much so. I was wildly insecure. Yeah. I manifested differently now, but that's how I manifested it then. So I didn't know what to do. And I thought, what if I trick people into liking me or giving me a chance? So I went and I bought three of the biggest billboards in Nashville in the middle of downtown. Which is not cheap. No. And all in all, the time for like the two or three weeks, it was like $15,000.

And so I went and bought them, but it was just a white. And you can find the pictures of these. All white billboard and black letters, it just said, go away Bobby Bones. That's all I said. I bought them. I bought all three of them. So my thought was people will see them and go, I agree. Yeah.

That's mean I don't agree or who is Bobby Bones. I felt like there was a no law. And when I went, I learned how to build basically a shell company just going on legal Zoom. And I paid for them so they couldn't track me. But I went to the guy at the billboard company and he knew what was up because I was buying the billboards. I told nobody.

And I said, dude, I will pay you an extra $2,000 if you say nothing. And I just trust you. He's like, great. So the billboards go up. The whole town's buzzing. I'm getting calls. The news is doing stories on it. My company's investigating to see who puts a people. Nobody knows it's you. Nobody. My show doesn't know it's me. Nobody knows it's me. Yeah. And so the billboards go up. Three weeks later, they come down. Life moves on. Until I wrote about it in my first book, nobody knew. And it exploded again after I wrote about it. Because people were kind of invested. Anytime we do like research, people remember that. Yeah. And so it was a big risk for sure.

I felt like I was at the end of my rope as far as mentally, emotionally, and also like, are they going to fire me? Yeah. And looking back, it was, man, you're killing it. The billboards were hilarious. But that was like a last ditch effort. Right. And it worked. Do you think it was the billboards? It worked in a way that I would have never even guessed. Because people felt bad for me. Yeah. People gave me a shot or people just were trying to figure out who I was and why people wanted me to go away. I love your brain. That's so fascinating that that's how you thought, like, because there was, you said it was going to go one of three ways, but all three were kind of a win for you. As long as people didn't know it was me. I had to keep it. So I told nobody.

So what made you want to tell people in your book that it was you? I thought it was a great story. And I wasn't going to hold it forever. And it wouldn't hurt me four years later. Yeah. Did you have a backup plan if that didn't work? If what didn't work? Anything. Like if you're the business, like the, the, no. I didn't have a backup plan because I, I believe in myself so much that if I, I don't believe in me, nobody else will. So I believe in me so freaking much that if I do fail, I believe that I will find a way to succeed maybe on a different path. Yeah.

I've just been through it in life. The worst thing that can happen is I get fired and have to start over. That's okay. I was on food stamps my whole life. Who cares? Yeah. You're like, what's worst case scenario here? Yeah.

Worst case scenario? I'm not going to be there. Right. So I have that freedom, but I'm so lucky to have that freedom. Where does your, like, believing in yourself to that extent? Where does that come from? It's fear. I have to.

It's your coping mechanism. I have to because, again, if I don't, why would anybody else? And I need other people to believe in me. And you have seen it work. Oh, yeah, it's crazy. Yeah. It's wild. Are you like manifesting something right now?

No, because I don't really believe in manifesting, but I don't believe it's not true. Yeah. I don't. It's like Santa Claus to you. Yeah, I have trouble. If I can't touch it, it's hard for me to believe it. I don't think that it's wrong and I don't think that anybody, I wish I could do it. But you said something that hit me a second ago that I don't think people even understand.

All the nose, I get so many knows. Yeah. People don't see the nose. No, yeah. I get so many nose. We just landed a deal with Netflix for my podcast. I saw that. Yeah, you're going to be up one of the first episodes.

What? Yeah. I don't know if you care. I care. But yeah, yeah. So they were asking us today, and I don't know if I'm supposed to announce anything. But the Netflix thing has already been announced. Yeah, I saw on your Instagram.

I forgot to say. Yes, I liked it, but I was going to say congratulations in person. And they were like, hey, we need a few back episodes. So when they launch in January and yeah, yeah, I think you're going to be the first one that goes up. Cool. Because it was excellent. People loved it. People loved it.

So yeah, the Netflix thing is. Like positive feedback, just people in my Instagram DMs about how lovely our conversation was. I thought it was excellent as well. Like it was nice because you know what a good guest is. Yeah. So you were a great guest and you made it easy on me. But I loved it. and I'm not even promoting to go listen to it,

but it's going to be on Netflix in January. And I'm pretty proud of that. So it'll be your podcast episodes people can watch on Netflix. They're launching podcasts on Netflix for the first time. And so they went and bought like 25 podcasts, big podcast, video rights of them. And I was lucky enough to be one of them. You know, I don't like Lucky. I worked hard.

I was going to say, yes. I don't like Lucky. I worked hard. Yeah. And they believe in it. So, yeah, it's going to go up. That's so cool. Yeah.

I love when people don't believe in coincidences. or luck. I'm not much of a luck guy. Yeah, because if you want to talk about luck, you're like, let's go backwards in my life and see how hard I work to get here. I know, and it's unfair. I hate me when I talk about when I do this, it's so annoying. Because people will say to me, and I know it's not meant how I'm taking it. Yeah. They will say, hey, wow, you're so talented. And I take offense to that. Really? Because I feel like I have no talent. And I've had to grind everything. You built a skill that you wanted to have. And I probably have a bit of it. I was naturally

You're gifted. Pretty witty. Yeah. So I do, but I take that personally in a negative way, and I shouldn't. It's not fair. People don't mean anything bad by it. They probably mean something really good by it. Yes. But it's hard for me to accept that.

In general, it's hard for you to accept compliments or like. 100%. Yeah. I don't want compliments and I don't want criticism. I want you to let me say everything about me because I see it all. I want criticism, but I want somebody else to see the criticism and then deliver it to me in a more loving way that is going to resonate with me. That's good. at least you know what you like.

Yeah. You know how to digest what's being given to you if it's being given to it by the right vessel. Yeah. If it's by the right vessel, yes. But like, you know, obviously you know of shit online what people are going to say. And I'm like, are they right? Like I have a hard time being like, if I'm insecure about it and then somebody points it out online, I go, is this validating me or are they just saying anything to hurt me?

And like, that's hard to take criticism there. It fit. And I think you'll understand this more than anybody. But for me, if I'm just not. in a good space and I read criticism, it can really kick me in the butt. Totally. If I'm having a great day or if things are going right and I see it, I really can just go water under the bridge.

But if the conditions are right, it really hurts. And I am a believer of don't take criticism for someone you wouldn't take advice from. 88% of the time. But that 12% of the time, it hurts. So what I've done is I don't read any comments at all ever except on Tuesdays. Stop it. That's literally. That's your rule.

It has to be. Do you go ham on Tuesdays? No, but I give myself even the option. It's the same with being fit. Is it like for see you next Tuesday? It is not. It just happened to be a Tuesday. Monday I'm extremely tired because I don't sleep well.

And Tuesday you'd like to partake in your own mental abuse? Tuesday, I feel like I'm in a pretty good place. But it's not, I don't take it as abuse all the time. But I will go like when I was super into fitness and I still am a pretty fit guy, but I would have to have a cheat day because I knew if I didn't, if I knew there was no cheat day ever, I would never make it. I would crack. This is kind of like my cheat day.

Since it's there, I don't have to jump in on Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Because I know Tuesday I'll get my shot to go in. And where do you go in? You don't do Reddit, do. That replies on Twitter. Ooh, dangerous. Yeah. No, I don't do Reddit because I know people.

And also, if I'm being honest, I used to get on those boards and trash me. And I have other, and just say the worst, the worst stuff. And also say the completely wrong stuff, like inaccurate. Just so I could say, look how inaccurate. accurate that stuff is. So it's all a strategy. So I used to do that a lot. It's very toxic for my brain. Yeah. I don't go there at all. I look at replies on Twitter and I never look at Facebook. We have a show Facebook page that's, you know, does well. It's got a million plus. I never look at Facebook comments. And I'll go to Instagram comments on Tuesday. The fact that you choose a Tuesday to do

this is very funny. But why Twitter? I feel like that's a, it is dangerous. But I like Twitter. Okay. Not because of the comments and it is dangerous and it's angry. Yeah. And the algorithm has gotten meaner. So mean. But I do like news and sports. And so I'm on it a lot just looking and I do post over there a little bit. Okay. And so on Tuesdays I hit my at reply. I don't think I've posted on Twitter since NOM. I just, I really don't remember. Do you look at it ever? Uh-uh. Oh yeah. I do because I live in current events and I do work for the NFL. And so I do a sport show with the NFL and so I need to know that. Yeah. Matt Castle who played quarterback for a long time in the NFL. Him and I do a show. We work for the NFL. It's crazy.

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doing them. How many jobs do you have? One, do content. I mean, you get it. But how many, so I purposefully, and this decision has been at times, not to my advantage, but I decided that I'm not going to do like for hire TV work unless it was like a show that I helped create because I would just do a show and then TV is so fickle. Yeah. They move on from you faster than anything. Yes. I take it so personally and I can't and I do and it's awful.

So I did American Idol for four years, which was A-plus. Love my experience there. And I left that show to go to Nat Geo and I did a series called Breaking Bobby Bones on Nat Geo. And I did that. And then I went over to Peacock and I did a show. We lived in South America for a while and it was called Snake in the Grass. and they put all this money into it when they were going to invest

all this money into Peacock and they decided halfway through we don't think Peacock's going to work with all this money so there was the show just it finished but it was done and I was like man they just I'm done now

I'm in South America and it was and I was doing like one off episodes of this and that and I couldn't do consistently these podcasts that I own and I have like 11 shows on my network

and so I thought I'm not doing any more for higher work if I create the show I'm in but so I got NFL hired me to do TV work for them and but to do a podcast every week. Matt Castle and I do this podcast. I have my radio show and podcast, which is five days a week and it is a nightmare to wake up that early,

but it's amazing because everything else, all the books I've written, all the comedy tours, it's all based from that. It's all, that's the hub. Yeah. And so I for sure do that. I do the podcast that just got picked up from Netflix, which is an interview podcast. Yeah. I do that. I have a deal with Drive Kings where I do a sports deal for them. So I'm doing a whole lot of content. in that capacity. Yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, and I've written a couple books, and I'm working on another one, kind of,

but unless it's good, I don't want to put it out because I feel embarrassed to promote something that sucks. Yeah, I struggle with that. But yeah, I stay busy, but it's great. But I find that podcast and the audio medium, you have such rich relationships

with your people. Yeah. Or television, they just don't care. It's so true. Yeah. I've dabbled a little bit, but even... Oh, you're good. You're good host.

Oh, wow. Thank you. Yeah. You did great on. Bachelor. Thank you. Yeah. I thought so.

Did I tell you this on your podcast? I was like, I don't usually, like I usually have a bit of imposter syndrome at certain things. Hosting that, I had zero imposter syndrome. It was so natural. I was like, I'm supposed to be doing this. It was so natural because you, how did you get fired though? I think they just went a different way. No, I was on the dancing.

Yes. I was on the dancing with the stars tour bus. And I had a call with the head of like Hulu ABC, all this. And then one of the producers. And so they were like. I'm sure you saw this coming. That's how they led. And I thought they were calling to tell me like, we'd love to have just you do the

Bachelorette hosting. We're sure you saw this coming, but we're going to go a different direction. I went, I didn't see that coming at all. And then I went, but I understand. And then I hung up and I was like, oh, because I loved it so much. But then I got to do the Are You My First? It was just on Hulu. And it was about virgins dating on an island.

And it was incredible. and the numbers did better than Bachelor in Paradise. And now they're not doing a season two. Well, not that I've heard of. Come on, give you a season two. It's just money, right? Yes. Yeah.

It's crazy. It's so hard. Yeah, it's so hard. I have a, I'm not going to, I just can't. But I have mentioned to you, I loved my time of Dancing with the Stars. Yes. And that, so what happened there, aside from my time doing the show, winning the show, is after I got off the show, I had such great relationships with the people at BBC.

Yeah. And I didn't know them before. but after I won, after it was over, they told me that between first and second place, it was the largest gap in the history of the show. So I had won by that much. You're kidding. No, I'm not.

And they only told me that after, because you don't know during the show. And so they said, you had the largest gap ever from first to second place. And so they were like, let's work together in a capacity. So they hired me to write for them, like to do television shows.

Yeah. And then I did Breaking Bobby Bones and I brought them on as a production team. Yeah. So I've kept great relationships there. And as I alluded to in our podcast, there are certain conversations with that still with that entity now, which is great because I love that show. Yeah.

Just because the people are, some of the fans are mean to me does not mean I have a bad relationship with the show. Yes. But I think that would be fun to go back and do that. They talked to me about hosting it for a while. Oh my gosh. I could see that. Yeah.

It would have been great. It didn't work out. You know what happened? They were like, hey, we want you to host it. And then I got a call. Like, hey, we changed our mind. We're going with Tyra. That was literally it.

You're kidding. Tyra's was the first host when I was on the show. Oh, that was literally the call. You talk about the call that you got? I hate those. I remember, oh, it was awful. I thought it was happening. There had been many conversations. Yeah. And this would be great. I love the show. Love my time there. Obviously, there's some people that like me from the show. Right. And I got the call. I was like, hey, they're going to go with Tyra instead. And I was like, how about a warm up? How about, hey, today, let me know. Maybe it's not 100% in the tomorrow you tell me. It just went, roop, gone.

They're like, is it Tuesday? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that hurt. That's great. Okay, I did not know that. You would have been great if I love Julianne and Alfonso. Alfonso is like one of my favorite people of all time. But let's say they go a different direction.

Oh, you and I? Yeah. Yeah, that would be great. Yeah, that would be great. I wouldn't do it by myself, but I think you and I would be awesome. Yeah, that would be so fun. Is it triggering to see my mirror ball behind me? I want to know.

I had to ask. You can ask, you can literally. told you this when you came on my podcast, you can ask whatever you want. Did you, did you, did you take my advice and did you get it back? I do not have it back. Now, I don't, I don't know who has it. I've not had any even. You just shipped it off to that studio. Yes. I gave it to my assistant. Did you write a note? Uh, yeah, but it wasn't a mean note. No, no, I wouldn't think it was. Um, I, I, part of it was because I had ankle surgery the day before and I was so messed up on pain pills and I was emotional because I was getting crushed. And I was like, I'm done. Yeah.

Like, if I look at this, and also I loved the drama of it at the same time. Yeah. I thought, I'm shipping it back. Yeah. And I don't even know if anybody got it. I love your honesty, though. Like, the fact that you can say you love the drama of it and your feelings were hurt and you love the show. And both can be true at the same time.

It can all be true. I love that show. Yeah. It was so not always fun, but I grew so much and I actually appreciated being there. One of the property brothers, Drew, who did it. And I didn't really know Drew super well. but we were playing a charity softball game together and you're not supposed to tell anybody

you're going on the show but I knew he had been on and I pulled him aside and said hey they want me to do this show I don't know if I want to do it because I've never danced but ABC wants me to do it and he said you should do it

he said I don't know how to dance either but you will regardless it'll be an experience for you between him and one of my best friends is Charlemagne the God who does radio and TV in New York and I called him because I knew he would tell me

exactly how he felt I said should I do dancing with a star? he said, yeah, why wouldn't you? I said, well, one, I can't dance and two, do only lame people do it? That's what I asked them. And he said, some lame people do. He said, but Michael Strahan did it. Wendy Williams did it. Kim Kardashian did it. I was just in Kim Kardashian, Zendaya. Yes. He said, so people use it to go up as much as they go down. Yeah. And I really valued both of them for that. Yeah. And I'm very appreciative. And I loved it. And I remember being there

and Drew was like, hey, you're there. Like take it in at least one day. And I remember just sitting on the floor at dress rehearsal and just going, I'm going to look at everything for five minutes. And I still vividly remember the things I looked at. It was so special. Yeah. Yeah. Love it. I did that too. It was the finale because so many people had been telling me like, just remember it's just a show. And I was like, oh no, no, no, no. This is not just a show to me. This is like proof to myself that I can dance. I wanted to dance my whole life. I wasn't good enough. This is way more to me. But I remember somebody saying the same thing, take it all in. And I, when I was up, I came down on a swing for Moulin Rouge on the finale, and I sat up there for so

long, and I looked at every single string of light. That's so cool. And every, like, pipe in the wall. And I looked at the floor and I looked at each curtain, like everything that I could possibly be taking in. Same thing. I did that and I'll never forget it. That's so cool. Yeah, it was special.

I loved it. I didn't love everything about it. But there's nothing I love that I love everything about. Yeah, that would be wild. I mean, that was the best thing in my life I ever did. but I have notes. It's funny. Yeah, exactly.

It's funny that you say, because you're a good dancer, to me it was like, I need to prove I still have connection with people. The thing that I think I've come to great terms with, I used to worry, man, people are going to watch me fail and they're going to say,

man, you suck, because I'm so insecure about not being good enough. Yeah. Because that was my life. Right. Everybody's so focused on themselves, nobody cares about us. It's so true.

God, it's true. And I hope that gives people freedom to go and do what they want to do because you can go, oh, I don't even embarrass if it doesn't work out, literally nobody's, thinking about you except you're super, super close circle. And they're rooting for you. And when you fall, they will help you get back up. Exactly. Other than that, nobody cares. You're right.

That's freeing. You're right. What do you think people's biggest misconception is about you? I can be a lot because I know I'm right. But me knowing I'm right is my shield. I don't know. Like, I don't know anything. But I have to be so sure all the time or it's not compelling. Yeah. So I think that probably. And I think for a while, I've tried. I've tried. I tried to meet my poverty story now with my story of good fortune because I think my poverty story became such a dominating part of my life that people would see me having success and go, something doesn't check out here. So I can talk about them both now where I used to be a little ashamed of talking about

the success that I had. I don't anymore. That's good. And so I think the perception of, hey, this guy only talks about how poor he is. That doesn't really happen anymore. Yeah. I try to meet it in a healthy place. meet it with yeah this episode is brought to you by progressive insurance so you already made one smart

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And I was like, what does Bobby burnout look like? You must get, do you get burnt out? Oh, yeah. I don't sleep well. I go to, like, my therapist is me talking about sleep. Really? I get, I'm going to be a hypocrite here. I had a breakthrough last week.

Oh. They're so rare. And I know we just had that part of the talk. We're saying it doesn't always happen, but it happens. So here's me being a hypocrite. Okay. I was in therapy last week. And we were talking about my future baby.

And I, you know, he's like, hey, how you? feel any nervous? And I said, you know, I think I don't have something that I'm living up to or trying to be different than because I don't have anything. Like I didn't have parents that I want to be, I'll show them. I want to raise them completely different. I don't have a model. And there's some beauty in that for sure. I said, but I'm not nervous. I've been through some crap and I feel like it's going to be hard. I value it. But I'm not nervous about it. And he said, why can't you put that into tomorrow? Because I'm so anxious about every day. I can't sleep. I'll sleep two or three hours a night. Not because I'm up working away, but because my heart, my heart rate goes so high when

it's time to lay down and calm down that I'm worried about, I'm going to wake up in time. If I don't wake up in time and I'm late, the show will not be as good. If the show is not good, I won't have a job. I don't have a job. It's back to where I came from. I live with that on a constant cycle. Scarcity mindset. Yes. Fear-based success is all of this. Yeah. And so I think that the breakthrough was, I can not freak out about something important. Yeah. I'm not freaking out about the baby. Yeah. And that's a big deal. That's the biggest thing. That's way bigger than tomorrow. Yeah. And so the breakthrough was I have the ability in me to not lose my crap about every single thing. And so even coming here to this podcast, I have two things I want to bring up to you.

You finished and I have two things I want to talk to you about. I was finished. Okay. Even coming here, I know what it's like to do a podcast at my house because forever I did. And people, would show up like 20 minutes early and I'm an early person in general but I remember thinking man it's it's awkward they're here 20 minutes early it's my house they just sit around so I pulled up at 40 I drove by like seven times because I wanted to make sure I would be here in time yeah and then at 42 I got out of my car yeah so I would get here right at 45 so I wasn't late I was on time and I but I also know if you're early to somebody's house it's awkward because they're like doing the dishes because that well it depends who it is like I I was feeding the dogs while you're

downstairs. I don't care. But it depends who it is. And I'm also a big dog guy, so I love dogs. Yeah, that helps. The second thing is, I want you to be honest with me. Okay. You tell Kevin Kluge, I told you how much you charged me. I do I swear to you on everything. Did he say something? He raised my rates the day after you came in. Shut up. I, I promise you on my dog, Pia.m. Be on the mic. Be on the mic. Be on the mic. Oh, I promise you. Kate, it's so funny that you say that because it took me everything to not say something to him. And I even thought, I'm going to ask. Kristen, Kevallari, how much he charges.

And then I went, nope, because I don't even want to do that in case somehow that gets brought up. Well, I appreciate that. I promise you on everything. He texted me the next day and he goes, hey, I got to raise your rates because I've been with them for five, six years. And it's just been the same rate. And he's like, I got to raise your rates.

And I went, Caitlin. Well, I'm trying to think of the, I didn't even see him until. No, I believe you. That's so funny. I would tell you the truth. I'd be like, I'm sorry. It slipped. And it was annoying because I wanted to badly.

For those that don't know, Caitlin and I have had the same trainer forever, Kevin Kluge, who is a lovely man. And I, when I was talking to you about it before we went on the air, I said, does he charge you this much? Thinking you'd go, no, he charges me less. And I was going to go back and try to get a cheaper rate, except he charged you more. And you were like, oh, my God. And I thought, oh, I hope she doesn't say anything. And the next day I got the text. And I thought she said something.

What are the chances of that timing, though? because I remember I didn't see him till probably like the next week after I saw you because I was traveling. And I remember being like, did you talk to Bobby? Did he think we had a nice time? And he was like, yeah, he really liked it. And I was like, great. And I was like, hmm. Yeah, he is a great guy.

And when your friends that are great guys say great things about people, you know, you kind of go into it. Like when we, we hadn't really met. Okay, we saw each other at a restaurant once. We like knew who each other was and said like, hey. I had a real comfort with you coming without even meeting you because we had a person that we both respect saying I vouched for that person. Yes. And he was absolutely right. It was so easy. And you left and I was like, dang, I really like her. It was great. That was and I was like, now he has to come on my podcast. Ha ha. But I didn't expect my people to

reach out that fast. Oh, it's great. Because you were like, now I owe you one. And I was like, now you don't. And then I saw you on the schedule. I was like, yes. I hope this was good. Oh my God. I'm not done though. Okay, good. My last thing about dancing with stars is I forget if Tom apologized to you or not? He did post online that he would pay to have it shipped back. I love Tom Bergeron. I know. I know you do.

But that's also why it hurts so bad. Yes. I still love Tom Bergeron. Yes. And I don't think that there was before the interview when he said that, you know, I shouldn't have won. Everybody was surprised. I don't think he said, you know what?

When I go on to this interview, I'm really going to give Bobby the business. No. I love Tom. Yeah. But yeah, it was super hurtful. but it's hurtful if like a friend does something because you care so much. It hurts more that way. But I didn't, I don't think I got a message from him.

If he did, if it didn't, it went in my DM that I didn't see. He said he would ship it. I can look right now. Like I can search his name. I would like to know because I feel like he should. But also if he said he was going to pay to ship it back to you, I just want you to have it back. I don't know why this means so much to me for you to have the Mirabal trophy back. I just really want you to have it back.

Well, I appreciate that. Tom B. I said on his podcast. I was like, come on, you've got to get it back. Spell Bergeron. I did B-U-R-G. Is that I did? B-E-R.

Oh, no, it's B-E-R. Okay. Tom Bergeron, there's a message there that I've never seen. Okay. Let me read it. Let me read over it first. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Because this is how he starts at Bobby.

Here's my Social Security number, 238. And I don't want to read that part. Yeah, that's fair enough. Yeah. Just get past that part and then come back to me. And as you can see, too, it's in my unread. It's in my DM. It's in my DM.

a DM that goes into the... Bobby, it wasn't my intention to hurt your feelings. My outch was based on my honest feeling that your win spoke to the need to address the balance between judge and viewer voting. I always felt bad that you and Sharna had to deal with the aftermath of that win. And I certainly regret pouring any salt into that wound.

It's very nice. But he's a very nice person. Yeah, you're not surprised by a nice message from him. Yeah. So you guys can see too, any but whatever camera on, I did not see this message until now because it has except decline. I'm glad I made you look.

That's nice. It's great. Are you going to write him back? I will. Yeah. As soon as we leave here, I'll write him back. Okay. Yeah, no, I have, I really don't have any ill will to Tom.

I knew you didn't, and for people listening that, if they didn't see our podcast, I knew that, like, it hurt your feelings because you like him so much, and you respect what he has to say. And he was so great to me during that show because he knew I were struggling. Yeah. Like mentally. Yeah. Emotionally.

So, I love it. I'll message you back to time. Oh, that's nice. Well. Look at you. Bringing people together. Wow. I am so, I am just always, that's, that's what I do.

Actually, a girl on my podcast. She won a contest to come on my podcast. And I was like, I really like her. I want to find her a boyfriend because she was really sad on finding a boyfriend. So her name was Blair. We called it the Blairette. We filmed this whole season of her trying to find a guy. They just had their baby.

No way. The guy that she met on my, I set her up with, there was six different dates. And on the last one, I was like, I just have a feeling about this guy for her. And they hit it off. They got married. And now they just had a baby. And so I really do be bringing people together. That's great.

I want to do it again. I want to do another like matchmaking show. But the problem with that is, that would be like me going back on dancing with the stars. Because if you're one for two, that's not near as good as one for one. That's true. You want to have that. You did it once and you crushed it. Yeah, I did it.

Yeah. Well, we'll leave it at that. Okay. And I brought you and Tom back together. Yeah. Hopefully. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Last one was, God, there's so many good questions here of that. I'll rush through them. Okay. Okay. How do you personally, because you're so aware of mental health, you do therapy, when your job is constantly to be on, you know how you're saying,

and like your wife doesn't want to take Bobby Bowe's, that's on Bobby. How do you protect your mental health and compartmentalize on and off? I think because I've done it wrong for so long, I can tell when I'm getting to that place again. I can feel the cracks now because I've cracked so many times that it's, I've just put in the reps. And I've spiraled, I've crashed, I've burnt out. Oh, but I've done it so now it doesn't sneak up on me. Well, now you have the big aha moment of your like, Like, I could do tomorrow because...

Yeah, again, I don't know that that's... I'm glad I have the capacity to do that. I know it's there even though I'm still worried about my schedule tomorrow. That's... I mean, it's not going to change overnight, but that's... My capacity is very small, but my coping mechanism is sleeping. So if I'm stressed out, I'll sleep. You know what I do to keep myself from...

I don't feel stress, oddly. Okay. And I'm told that's because I'm always stressed. Interesting. Like, you don't know. Like, my baseline is hyper-stress. Do you wear an o'ring? I do.

Does it say that? Yeah. It's constantly stressed. I think the o'er ring's broken. I've gotten two and I'm like, this thing's not even tracking me right. It doesn't know me. It knows me very well.

So it says you're constantly in a state of stress. I'm constantly in sleep debt because that's a new feature in this. Yeah. And constantly stressed. Damn. Because the dots are at the top. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Oh, I'm always pretty restored once in a while. But then my sleep is always like optimal. Wow. I'm a great sleeper. Yeah, I'm not. But that's also, again, a coping mechanism. Obviously, you have, like, a big next chapter coming up because you're going to be a dad. I hope.

I mean, I know I'm going to be a dad. I'm saying, I hope the next chapter. I mean, yeah, it's a different, it's a different chapter. Yeah. So, yeah, I'm sure that it'll be awesome and awful and challenging and amazing. I really, I have no expectation other than this is going to be a really wild experience. I didn't have parents. I don't know what it's like to be a parent.

I don't know what it's like to have. parents. I don't know. I have no idea. That's why I'm like, I don't know what this is going to be, because I have no, but I'm so happy that I get to do it with, like, my wife is the funniest person I've ever met. And it's so awesome. And it's also, it drives me crazy because I'm celebrated for being funny. And I come home and she's funnier than me. Yeah, I couldn't handle that. And then I go, can we not monetize this? Yeah. I said, you're saying this funny stuff. We're not using it. It's just like, I am using it. I'm like, no, no, no. We can be on social media. you recycle her materially and use it

as your own? Doesn't really work. I did a TikTok today right before we came over. Okay. And I haven't even looked at it. And my wife she makes references that I don't get sometimes. And this, I literally just put this up before I came over and it's got like 70,000 views in like... Great. Hour and a half. But I didn't even get it. This is

just her. Okay. Because she said... She looks like Madam Blueberry from Veggie Tales. Now, I don't know Veggie Tales. And so I literally was talking. My wife thinks she's like, Madam Blueberry from Veggie Tales. And there's a picture of this big purple thing. But it's little Things like that. She's like,

I'm having a mad on blueberry day. I'm like. She's subtle funny. She's cutting funny. Subtle funny. Her parents are so funny. It's wild. She's got the funny gene.

She does. And some of her humor now I feel like, and maybe I'm projecting, like it's getting a little dumber. And I say because she has some of me inside of her now. It's making her dumber. Because the baby's half me. So. Aw.

That's funny. I bet I bet I could guess what she's. having. I don't want you to guess because I don't want to react to it. Yeah. Oh, you already know. Yeah. Oh, you're just not saying. Oh, I know. Oh, I know. We're just not saying. Oh, okay. I'm not going to say it. But my, um, somebody that I just saw, she has three boys. All she's wanted was a girl. She didn't know if she could get pregnant again. She got pregnant. She didn't. She's like, it's going to be a boy. And I literally looked at her and I saw pink on her belly. Like I saw a pink glare. And I was like, you're having a girl. And then she opened.

up her email and it was a girl. I think I'm a witch. Have you seen the Etsy witches that you can buy on Etsy? Yes. Should I sell myself as a witch on Etsy? I'm saying I mean, I think about buying them. Yeah. Wait, what is? Somebody was talking about Etsy witches on my podcast once and I forget really. Really? People have talked about that? Yeah. I thought it was the only person that knew about it. No. You can hire witches from Etsy to do spells for you. Yeah. See, that scares me. I want them to like help. I would love them to put a spell on a couple people, but I feel like karma would come back. But it could be like a good spell. Oh. Also, I don't believe in them. But I think It's funny.

Yeah, and I might have said, okay, I'm going to do an admission here. Okay. I might have said earlier we didn't know, but I say that to avoid the, yeah, we know, but we're not telling people, but we've actually told like 10% of people and you didn't make the cut conversation. Uh-huh. Yeah. Is Kevin told you?

Have I told Kevin? No, it's Kevin told you. About his? Yeah. Yeah. The new one? Yeah. Oh.

He's me a lower rate. So he tells me everything. Now can I tell him? Yeah. Okay. You can. Now that your rate went up, I'm definitely saying something because I was thinking so hard of ways that I could get my rate down. I can pull up the text message because I literally was like, Caitlin, you ruined it for me.

Look, here it is. So funny. Bobby, I do have an update to what I'm charging. I can just hear his voice. He probably gets so nervous to say it too. Oh, and he writes it so formally. Like we text all the time in normal text pattern. And then all of a sudden, when it's something, it's like Bobby in its paragraph formed.

Oh today I got a voice note I do have to update what I'm charging And then he goes to the if If that changes anything I get it Just let me know Obviously I'd love to get back on it Because I've not been training because my ankle Right

So your ankle's good now No But it's getting closer You don't have the boot Correct Hello hello hello I am driving to Jonas basketball practice

Figured an audio text you Isn't that just so him Like just awkward at the beginning Hello If you let it keep playing He goes I got your message I will charge him more just like you said.

Could you imagine? Shit. Okay, so how I always wrap up these podcasts is I make people tell me an embarrassing story. If you can think of an embarrassing confession. Yeah, I got you. Oh, you already got it. Oh, I have 100. Great.

Tell me the worst one. Sure. I'll go defining humiliation. Can I go ninth grade? Do you care? No. Okay. Seventh grade.

Because they got me in ninth grade, too. But in seventh grade, and I played football my whole life in high school. And so in off-season, we would run track. We'd be forced to run track and we would have to wrestle. And we didn't have a wrestling team, but our coach made us wrestle each other in off-season practice. Okay. And I was, I'm not a big guy now. I mean, I'm normal.

I'm six foot, probably 175. So I'm pretty normal, a decent shape now. But I was always really small with a massive head, but really, like a character. It's a freaking circus when you draw. Yeah. Or a bobblehead, even better. So I was really small, but I would not back down from anybody. It didn't matter how big they were.

just because I was like, had to prove it to everybody that I deserved to be here. Classic Bobby. And I remember there was this big guy named Shane and I was wrestling Shane. I lost.

And I was like, I'm not getting off. And they sent another guy out to wrestle. And I'm wrestling him two in a row because I was embarrassed. I got beat. And everybody starts backing away from me and pointing.

Oh, no. Oh, no. And my shorts had ripped and my seventh grade penis had come out. Oh. And it's flopping in the wind? Yes.

And so that's humiliating in seventh grade. Yeah. So not only is that happening, by the time I got back down to school, it had turned into that had a boner wrestling with the dude. Oh, no. And to a seventh grader, that's a nightmare. Oh, that's, I mean, I don't know how you lived that down, to be honest with you. So the nickname and no relate.

Oh, I was nicknamed my whole everything from seventh to twelfth grade. I hated it every day. My nickname, again, no relation was T-bone. T-bone. Like I got a boner, like the bone. But they call me T-bone. And then when my radio guy, when I was 17, the program director was like, Bobby Bones, I was like, oh, flashbacks.

Wait, that's like a full circle moment for you to like reclaim what bone means to you. Yeah, I didn't really want to reclaim it. But I did. But yeah, that's like the number one. That's funny. Yeah, it sucked. I do feel really bad. I'll never forget a girl that I knew she was hanging.

from like the monkey bars and somebody pulled down her pants and like her underwear came down with it and she like oh no it was uh she switched schools like it was and i'm like that's got to be the most fragile mortifying age for something like that to happen wow i'm so sorry uh once and this will be my last one that was one of my favorite ones though that's good so years ago and this is a little flex but the flex needs to happen in order for you to fill the severity of the embarrassment. I was the... I was the youngest person

ever put into the Radio Hall of Fame. So five or six years ago, by a bunch of years, they put me in the National Radio Hall of Fame and it was massive and I was the youngest by forever and there was a big ceremony in Chicago and so everybody went up

and wear a black tie and it was me in like four seventy-five-year-olds getting inducted. And it was super cool. I was speaking. I was getting this award. Right, big thing.

And they're doing the big announcements. And they're like, oh, good, Jonathan. And they're like, and Bobby Jones. I was like, oh, God, this is like the most celebratory thing. And they, they screw up my name. Like, that sucks. That was embarrassing and suck. That wasn't as humiliating as the boner.

That's more humbling. Yeah, I'm still kind of a little embarrassing. But yeah. That's, when I was at the vet today, all the girls were like kind of geeking out because everyone watches Dancing with the Stars now. and I was just on this season and they were like and you won

and blah blah and then she's like yeah I had to tell the whole office Catherine Bristow is in here and I was like and then you don't I didn't correct her

because I wouldn't be like it's Caitlin I was like yeah Catherine I was in Fayetteville last maybe two weeks ago we spent a lot of time in Fayetteville Arkansas

a big Razorback fan grew up in Arkansas my brother-in-law coaches on the softball team so we're up there a bunch and that's kind of my hub, right? That's where I'm from. And there's like six or seven people that come up to me. They're like, hey, you go to a picture. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And some dude who just sees people taking

pictures says, hey, man, can I get a picture? And I'm like, yeah, I would take it. He goes, you're Johnny Knoxville, right? That's funny. And I say, yeah, I am. Yeah, I am. Nice to meet you. That's funny. Welcome to Jagas. That's amazing. I've, some paparazzi stopped me in L.A. And I was like, what? And they were like, Brittany. And they thought I was Britney snow. Oh, at least that's a compliment. It was.

And it was like, this was probably like nine years ago. And I was like, oh, okay. We were going to Nobu and Malibu. So we were over there. We were shooting a show. And it was probably my last year on Idol. Not sure. But so I'm not a Nobu guy.

I loved it. But I'm not like cool enough to like, let's go to Nobu. Yeah, maybe it was, yeah, I think it was Malibu. They've won in Malibu? Yeah. Okay, it's on the water. Yeah, yeah, it's gorgeous. So we call and there's L.A., everybody's famous.

It's like Nashville. Yeah. Nobody really cares. Yeah. And everybody cares at the same time. And so we call and I'm like, hey, can I, isn't it we can get in? And they're like, ah, we're busy. I said, well, I'm bringing Bobby Bones from American Idol.

They have no idea who it is, but there's so many famous people that they don't start to go, well, let's check. They're like, oh, they just believe because they get so many calls. they're like yeah no problem uh yeah we can get you a table i'm like oh god okay so we go and all we had at the rental place was a van yeah we drive in a nobu in a van all the paparazzi put their cameras down and just sat as we walked in they didn't even oh one one better i don't mean to kill you all your time no please it's amazing we were going i was doing the today show i when i wrote my second book i was going out to talk on the today's show about the book and my wife was with me

and i was carrying my clothes on a rack because i was going to go up and steam them there before I went on. So I get out with my rack of clothes and she gets out behind me and they're just taking pictures of her the whole time thinking she is the person that's going on the show. She kind of looks like a star. And I'm like, yeah, it's me. I could use the press. Yeah, I'm not too good. I'm the guest. So yeah, I can probably go like 20 deep on those. But thank you for having me. This is, this is an awesome. It's so fun. Yeah. I hope I was a good guest. No, you were amazing. Honestly, if I could just talk to you every podcast, that would be great. Well, if for some reason, Alfonso decides he doesn't want to do it anymore.

Yeah. And Julian is like, I'm done. I'm tired. Yeah. We will step up. We will. We don't want to take it from them. That's their job.

They deserve it. Yes. They're great at it. And they're great at it. But we're in. We're in if anyone wants us to be. Just give us the call. And you can want, and not that anybody cares about my stuff, but they care about you because

they're listening to this podcast. They care. Tell everybody. Everything. In January, when my. when my podcast, the Bobbycast goes on Netflix, Caitlin's episode will be up. You can watch it on Netflix.

That's so cool. I want my podcast on Netflix. Oh, yeah, you do because they paid a ton. I bet. Yeah, it was crazy. Pluto TV has thousands of free movies and TV shows. This is the mindset. Free.

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Hazzar! Pluto TV, stream now, pay never. You're welcome. Hi, I'm Lauren, and I'm Chandler. And we're the host of Pop Apologist Podcast, a weekly podcast devoted to celebrity gossip, Hollywood Deep Dives, Real Housewives, Drama, and anything and everything, Taylor Swift. We're two sisters who make no apologies for our love of pop culture

and the fact that A-listers might be more to us than each other. Join us on your favorite podcast app every Wednesday for Pop Apologists. Pop Apologists, your new favorite sister and celeb podcast.