Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - Holly Madison | Hef, Hooters & Hard Truths of the Playboy Mansion!

Episode Date: May 22, 2025

#843. Holly Madison is here, speaking more of her truth — and did you know she has never signed an NDA!? No NDA = No Filter! In this unfiltered conversation, Kaitlyn sits down with the former Girls Next Door star to talk about everything from growing up a gifted bookworm in Alaska to racking up credit card debt chasing boobs, Hooters, and Hollywood dreams. Holly opens up about her undiagnosed autism, what really went down inside the Playboy Mansion, and the manipulative tactics that kept her there longer than she expected. From card tricks at Hooters to Hef’s infamous “grading system” for women, this one’s as jaw-dropping as it is personal.. Plus, an update on what Holly’s up to these days — and she is BUSY!If you’re LOVING this podcast, please follow and leave a rating and review below! PLUS, FOLLOW OUR PODCAST INSTAGRAM HERE!Thank you to our Sponsors! Check out these deals!Booking.com For the bookings you’ve dreamed of, list your property on Booking.com!Nutrafol: Nutrafol is offering our listeners ten dollars off any order! Enjoy free shipping when you subscribe. Go to Nutrafol.com and enter the promo code VINEGIFT.Apartments.com: The Place to find a place! Boll & Branch: Get 15% off plus free shipping on your first set of sheets when you use promo code Vine15 at BollAndBranch.com.EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: (8:43) – Discussing going into credit card debt for breast augmentation!(15:56) – Recounting her first encounter with Hugh Hefner and the events leading to her move into the Playboy Mansion.(19:41) – Opening up about undiagnosed autism and how it affected her social interactions.(29:54) – “I got dragged so hard during my book tour…” See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Hey, Vino's real quick, if you are listening right now, which obviously you are, you wouldn't be hearing this, can you hit the subscribe or follow button on whatever platform you're on? Please, that one simple thing helps more than you even realize it allows me to keep growing on this podcast and making these episodes the best they can find. possibly be obviously for you. That's the only favorite I'm going to ever ask, okay? It truly means the world to me. Thank you. Now let's get into it. Hey everybody, welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host, Caitlin Bristow, co- Peanut, Bailey Stanwer. And we just interviewed Holly Madison, which was iconic. I knew that. Because we finish each other's sandwiches. Yes, I knew it. She was so fascinating. I love that she does not have an NDA so she can speak her true. It was wild.

It was, I can't believe that they never made her sign an NDA. It made for a good podcast, I'll tell you that. We love it. We love it. It was nice to just have her, you know, share her voice, her stories and talk about what life looks like now post- Bunny Life. Because honestly, who hasn't heard of Holly Madison? Everyone. Yeah.

I can't believe she was on my podcast. She was. Enjoy. We're all feeling some sort of weirdness right now. I'm not sleeping well. And it's because, what was it? Well, we just had a crazy Scorpio full moon where all this stuff is coming to light. can see like a lot of people have been like outed for cheating and stuff. I found out a guy I was

dating. I broke up with him like three months ago, but I found out who's cheating on me with 10 people. So I just totally blasted him. So that was one of them. But there's also like that Britney Furland, Tommy Lee thing. All this stuff is coming out. And then also there's a Uranus Kazimi happening, which is supposed to mean that all this unexpected stuff can come through, which can be good unexpected stuff too, nothing to be afraid of. And I don't even know exactly what day that's happening. I'd have to check. I don't pay too much attention to the days because I have this weird thing where everything that happens astrologically, I feel it like a few days to a week before.

Interesting. And I don't know why I've asked astrologers, like, is there something in my birth chart that makes me feel this early? Right. Really, really has an answer. Wait, what's your big three? Now I've got to ask.

Yeah. Well, I'm a Capricorn sun, an Aquarius rising, and a Libra Moon, too. Oh, really? Yeah. But I really identify, like, I'm a Scorpio Venus, and I feel like that's a huge part of my personality. I feel like it's really, like, the big six you have to get into.

Yeah. See, I'm Gemini Cancer Cancer. You are. Oh, that's a fun ride. It's a ride, yes. It's a fun one. But it makes you great at what you do. Because Gemini's like the chatty sign.

That's true. And I really feel, yeah, I love conversation and I really like, if you were feeling something and you wanted to talk to me about it, I like love talking through feelings with people. Oh, good. So that's perfect. That's your cancer. You do too, though. Yeah. Yeah.

I think that's a little bit of my Lieber moon, but I'm also a cancer Venus. Oh, nice. Very, like, when I love, I love very. I think I'm cancer, Venus, too. Of course you are. Yeah, that makes sense. What's your son sign? I'm a Leo's son, Scorpio, rising.

Oh, nice. Leo's my favorite sign. Really? My son is a Leo. My ex-husband was a Leo. I keep saying the next person I marry is going to be a Leo, because that's also like Leo is my seventh house, so. Oh, there you go.

So there's any Leo's out there? I heard that Gemini's do well with Capricorns and other Geminies. I feel like two Gemini's. I don't know this, but I feel like that could be crazy. Right. But two, like, man and woman, apparently, Gem and I work well. Okay. Which I would think the same thing.

I don't want to date another me. That would just be too chaotic. But I also think it all depends on your whole chart. True. That's true. Man, I could do a whole podcast on this. Literally. I really have the astrologers on.

But we were just talking before we started recording about misinformation that was out there. So you were on bunnies. Yeah, when I was on Bunny X-O podcast, she was like, so tell me about how your parents dropped you off at a church when you were a kid and you were raised by a priest. I was like, wait, what? And she goes, no, I found this online. I thought it was true. And that, like, nothing even remotely close to that.

You were born in Alaska. Not born in Alaska. I was born in Oregon, but I moved to Alaska when I was, like, two and a half. So I spent most of my childhood there. Because that's what my research said that you grew up in Oregon, but you were born in Oregon, but you were born in Oregon, grew up in Alaska. Yeah, I mean, partially true because I lived in Alaska for, like, 10 years from when I was, like, two to a little past 10.

Yeah. And then I went to, like, middle school and high school in Oregon. What was Holly like as a little girl? Very imaginative, very, I was always really good at school. I was always like in the gifted programs and stuff. I would spend a lot of time in the woods just using my imagination. I was a huge bookworm. Wow.

Oh, I love that. I feel like I kind of, well, I feel like when you grow up in a place, like I grew up in a place where like there's like a couple stop lights and like it's just, I love you, LaDuke, but you're, but it forces you to like use your imagination and go out and do stuff like that. You grew up in Surrey? Langley. Langley. Same, same. But, like, I also agree that if you're also the day and age that we grew up, we didn't have social media. And you had to, like, go out and be so creative.

And I'm so grateful I grew up on a double-ended cul-de-sac. And I would just be, like, outside playing. And, like, it was so safe. And I feel like we were all dreamers back then. You know what I mean? Like, a stick was a wand. Like, literally. I was playing with, like, blades of grass.

Totally. Oh, the simple times. Everything was magical. 100%. We were talking about this earlier about Bailey's obsession with Marilyn Monroe, and I know that you loved her growing up as well. 100%. Yeah, I think, well, it started with Madonna because I was a kid in the 80s and I loved Madonna. And Madonna was always doing these things that referenced Marilyn Monroe. So then I was curious about who she was. And then one year my aunt gave me these Marilyn Monroe paper

dolls for Christmas one year. And it had like Marilyn's whole life story on the back of it. And like the costumes were from all of her movies. And I just like sunk into it so deep. Like I wanted to see all her movies and know everything about her and read every book about her. That was me with Alanis Morset. Oh, have fun. Literally. Random, but I love it. Oh, I did a book report on her.

I also feel like she'd be so interesting. I want, I would love to have her on the podcast. And she's Canadian, but I just love Alanis Morset. I'm obsessed with her style of music. I love her, like, she doesn't give a attitude. I just love her. But, I mean, we all had somebody, but it's funny that you both had Marilyn Monroe. There was something just mesmerizing about her.

Yeah, everything from her story to how kind of open she was, but yet it's so mysterious at the same time. You know what's funny about Alanis Morissette? I'm just sharing this because I'm older than you guys, so maybe it didn't hit the same. But I remember where I was. I was like in middle school or something, and I was at my friend's house when the You ought to know song first came out when it says, would she go down on you in a theater? And you never heard anything like that on TV or the radio at the time. I remember where I was being me and my friend looked at each other like, what? Wait, how old are you?

I'm 46. Oh my God. I thought you were like 35 maybe. Thank you. Well, I guess that wouldn't make sense for how... How long I've been around? The timing of everything, but yeah, I'm turning 40 next month, and I feel like 40s are so chic. You guys look really young, though.

Well, so do you. I thought you guys were, like, 29. Yeah. Wow, that's a full... No, that's why I'm telling these stories, like, I'm like this old wise, like, no. You guys wouldn't know what it was like to hear, like, I'm like, to hear, like, that on the radio. No, no, no. I'm 40 in one month. That song's a great song, though. It is. It was about Uncle Joey. I know. That's crazy. That's the best part. I can't even believe it.

And he, like, addressed it recently. I can't remember he was on a podcast or a radio show, and he finally addressed how that song was about him and how it made him feel. What did he say? He said like he deserved it. I think he was taking accountability. So then you moved to L.A. for college. Yeah. And what did that leap look like for you? Like emotionally, were you like L.A.'s where I'm supposed to be. Or were you like, oh, I'm taking a risk? No, 100%. I always wanted to be in L.A. I had no money. I didn't know anyone here, but I knew it was where I was meant to go. Yeah. So I transferred colleges. So at least I had like somewhere to, you know, live and whatever. So I moved down here and was in school, but got sidetracked by life. And, you know.

What were you going to school for? Yeah. I was a double major in theater in psychology. Oh, really? Cool. Yeah, I think it served me well. That's awesome. Wait, so were you not hoping to, like, make it into the biz of Hollywood? No, I definitely was. But I was always, like, programmed since I was a very young child, like, you have to go to

college and everything. And honestly, it was my only way to get down here, too, because I just didn't have any money and don't know anyone down here or anything like that. So I was trying to do too much at once. I was trying to keep my grades up so I could keep my scholarship. I was trying to audition. I was working at Hooters after school to, like, pay my other bill. and everything, you know, just kind of got out of hand.

Yeah, didn't you go into debt for getting breast? Now that I have boobs, I call it a breast augmentation. Yeah. I don't know. I feel like, say, boob job just sounds old school. I'm like, anyways, you went into debt to get boobs to go work at Hooters? Or was that just not? Not specifically to work at Hooters, just because, like, I thought, you know, I haven't asked,

let's get the tits to match. But you know how when you graduate high school and all of a sudden you're sent all these credit card applications. I signed up for all of them, put the boobs on the credit cards, and landed myself in a whole lot of trouble. What do you mean? Well, you know how it is when you just have debt on your shoulders and you're struggling to pay the bills as it is and keep your grades up and then you have to pay the credit card bills. I do not know what that was like because I could not get a credit card until I was, no, I mean, I made on paper like under $20,000 a year at a restaurant. My dad had to help me pay rent. I was trying to be like a dancer.

I was just auditioning for like everything. And yeah, I just, I could not get a credit card. And I remember the guy that I was dating at the time, he's like, let's just go and try and like apply. And I came out sobbing. I was like, I'm such a loser because I was like 27. And I couldn't, I didn't get a credit card until I was probably 32. Maybe somewhere in the years between when I got all my credit cards and you tried, they changed something. Because it's kind of, that's a little how they're sending like every credit card application the second you graduate high school like that's a little crazy yeah i mean i used it to my advantage so i'm complaining but i feel like they there's still a little crazy everything these days there is a credit card for anything get this you'll

get bonuses and perks and when you auditioned that's not the word applied to work at hooters was it like an immediate yes because i worked at a restaurant earl where i feel like they hire like this is not toot my own horn but they do hire like good looking women and then it was like it's like they know right away. Did you, were you like, sit down interview and they're like, could you get on the floor right now? Oh, yeah. It was the first thing I did when I came to town because I knew I needed to make money and I,

you know, looked up, I'd heard about Hooters. Like, somebody had written an article about it for like Jane magazine and how the girls like make the most amazing tips, which we really didn't because we were in Santa Monica and it's very touristy, a lot of Europeans, so they're not tipping. Oh, yeah, Europeans, because in Europe, they don't tip there because it's like baked into their salary. Yeah. So they don't think to tip.

Oh. But I love that job. I loved, I was undiagnosed autistic for a long time, so I always had really bad social difficulties. But when you're working at Hooters, they almost give you a script. They're like, this is the kind of girl you're supposed to be. You sit down at the table. You talk to the wives and the kids first so they don't feel left out. You, you know, go do card tricks if your section's not busy with your tables.

Like, they tell you exactly how to be. So it was the first place I could really thrive socially. Yeah, because you had some direction. Yeah. It's an acting job. Yeah, totally. Oh, that's so interesting. Did they have Hooters in Oregon?

Not at the time, or if they did, it was so far away. I remember before I knew what it was in high school, this one guy had, like, been to a Hooters somewhere. And the inside of his locker was covered with, like, all the pictures he took with the Hooters girls and the menus. And I was like, you went to a strip club? It was so iconic. And it still is.

But, like, in Canada, we didn't have it. Yes. Did we? Well, Edmonton did? In West Edmonton Mall, there was a Hooters. Justin Bieber went there once. You got the receipts, you got the facts. I remember the amount of times I talk about Justin Bieber on this podcast is kind of

embarrassing, but didn't you go to the National Hooters Bikini contest or did you not because Hugh Hefner didn't want you to? Yeah, I didn't. Well, I kept my waitressing job when I moved into the mansion because I was just like, I don't know how this is going to go. Like, I'm, you know, not going to at least I'll have a waitressing job to go back to. That's not much, but whatever. But they wanted me to go because they would pick a girl from each region to go compete

in this bikini contest. They wanted me to do it. I was going to go to Vegas. I was so excited. And he was like, no, that makes me jealous. You have to quit that job. And I was like, oh, really? Yeah.

He was jealous. Well, that's what he said. I think it was just like a control mechanism. Yeah. Because I was going to say, thinking of all the women that he dated, were the women jealous? Hoo, it was really, really catty there. It was bad. Like when I moved in, there were six other women.

And they were all kind of on the way out when I showed up. So then this whole other group of six arrived. And it was just a nightmare until it was kind of narrowed down to the three of us that you saw on the show. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, everybody was jealous because everybody kind of thought, I mean, he would play girls against each other and everybody thought somebody else was getting more money or keeping them from getting more money or things out of it or keeping them from getting in the magazine.

It was just a lot of craziness. Well, because also you probably came from just from working in the restaurant industry. I feel like it becomes like a sisterhood. You make friends at the restaurant and you're all like helping each other. And if you need help at this table, like I got your back. And then you go into something like the man to the playboy. mansion, and it turns into that, you're like, that must have been so overwhelming. Yeah, it was night and day. Like, at Hooters, it was a great place to meet other women who had

just moved to L.A. and we're trying to make it. And you had this automatic sisterhood. And at the mansion, I thought it was going to be that way. But it was the opposite. Grab a coffee and discover nonstop action with BudMGM Casino. Check out our hottest exclusive. Friends of One with Multi-Drop. Once even more options. Play our wide variety of table games. Or head over to the arcade for nostalgic casino thrills only available at BetMGM. Download the BetMGM Ontario app today. 19 plus a wager, Ontario only. Please play responsibly.

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Yeah. Well, I was also working for Hawaiian Tropic at the time. They would pay you basically to, like, show up in a Hawaiian Tropic shirt at different events and things like that. By the way, that was like my dream. I always wanted to be a Hawaiian Tropic model. It's so iconic. And they're bringing back the commercials. Are they? Alex Earle just did one. Yeah. Oh, did you really? Yeah. That's cool. Okay. I'm trying to make a documentary about Hawaiian Tropic, actually. So hopefully coming soon. That's awesome. Yeah. But anyway, I worked for Hawaiian Tropic and that was a great job. And I was at one of their events. And Hep's doctor came to that. And he said, I want to invite all these girls. to the Playboy Mansion party, which I was so excited about because back in 2000, those were like the cool parties to go to. Like, it wasn't thought of as like this weird, gross sex thing. It was like the cool party everybody wanted to get to that was so exclusive. Oh, yeah.

So I was so excited to be put on the list, and I got my roommate in so we could come together and, you know, she submitted her picture and got approved. So we went to that, and then based on the picture, because they take a picture of everybody who goes, and they put it on file and Heff will grade you, A, B, or C, and then if you get like the good grade, you're invited to all the things. So I got invited to like the pool parties, which were a lot more intimate. So I kind of knew heff from that just casually. And it was kind of this illusion where I kind of thought I knew him or had a better gauge on him than I did just because you're surrounded by all his friends who love him so much. And he seems like such a gentleman.

Yeah. That's how it started. Yeah. Illusion is a good word, I feel like, for that. And you don't know any better, right? Yeah, totally. You're just entering. You're going to these parties. It's fun. It's exciting and you don't know anything else. Yeah. Yeah. I can't even. I always wanted to go. My funny story is that so, you know my friends like Ben, Dave Lingwood, all the guys from The Buried Life. Have you ever heard of the show The Buried Life? I've heard of it, but I'm not doing longer. So it's four guys from Canada who then signed a show on MTV called The Buried Life and it was 100 things that you want to do before you die. And they would cross things off their bucket list. And one was to break into the Playboy Mansion and get into one of the parties. And they sat specifically break in, not

get invited yeah no they sat in a fake cake for like six hours and um I think Ben Nemton pretended to be what's that soccer player that's really good looking Christian yeah looks just like him convinced the one of the security guys that was him they brought in these cakes that they said they ordered they were all hiding in them there's video footage of this and they broke out of the cakes at the party and ended up partying at the Playboy mansion for the whole night and got in and it was all for their TV show. That's so easy. They did not think it was going to work and it worked.

Wow. Isn't that funny? How did they film it? Were they like wearing gopros or? They must have been. Yeah. Because Playboy would have had to know if there was a camera crew there. And I asked, I said, is that, was that actually set up like they, you knew?

And he was like, I wouldn't have sat in a cake for six hours if I like knew. That's a long time. No, he said he was starting to get anxiety. He had to pee. Oh my God. It was a whole thing. They were like drinking in there. I'm going to have to ask him about the camera thing, though. So what was it like when like you met Heth? You guys are bonding. You obviously became like the it girl. What was that bond like between the two of you? It was crazy. And I think a lot of it comes from me not knowing I was autistic and not understanding why I wasn't bonding with people. Like I never really bonded with guys my age or connected with people. And here's this guy who's like a very seasoned manipulator. You know, we do have things in common. And of course, he's living this amazing lifestyle.

Like, who wouldn't want to be part of it to an extent. So I just felt like this was the one. Maybe I was meant to be with somebody older. I'm such an old soul. You know what I mean? I could see that. I have a different perspective, of course. When did you find out that you were autistic?

Not until, like, maybe like five years ago. My mom brought it up to me that she always suspected that. So I started looking it up online, like looking up Asperger's and seeing that I really fit that profile. So I finally got a formal diagnosis. I think it was like two or three summers ago. Yeah. What are some signs that were related to your, to the autism that meet, because I've heard in

women it's masked more than in men. Oh, 100%. Yeah. The first thing my mom noticed was I would zone out a lot. And everybody would comment like, what is she doing? And she's like, I don't know. She's just thinking. Like, I would just be like locked on to something up here and just completely like dead

to the world when I was little a lot. And I was really introverted and couldn't connect with people, which a lot of times I just wrote off to having been growing up in such an isolated place where I was in Alaska. So those are the main things for me. I would do things they call stims. Like I'm constantly playing with my hair. Like you can see it like I'm trying not to do it now, but like you do constantly see it.

Yeah, you can see it like in my podcast on the show all the time. I don't show a lot of emotions. Sometimes I'll feel like I am and I just look like dead to the world. Monotone voice, you know. It was it validating though to have an answer? Yeah, 100%. Because I understand where it's coming from now. I can explain it to people.

I think people understand me better and know not to take something personally if I'm not like hitting every social cue perfectly. Well, there's so many different things out there now where it's just not as, I mean, there's still, I'm sure, so much stigma to break down. But I will say like one of my girlfriends, I won't say her name, but she just got diagnosed as bipolar too. And she felt so much shame. And I was so excited for her to be like, you have an answer.

And like there's medication and like Selena Gomez talks about it. And it's like so great to see people with a platform being able to see. speak on these things because it's like there really is no shame around it like yeah you know it's it's that's why I asked if it was validating because I'm if if it was me I would want answers sometimes I think there's something like I know I have you know depression I know I have anxiety I definitely have ADHD that's undiagnosed and like even just knowing that like my therapist was like does anyone ever yeah and I was like no I was like but I could see that oh my god and I disassociate so fast if I'm uncomfortable but I'll like if something makes me

uncomfortable, I'll just completely, and like, it's, it's not even, I don't know if it's fight or flight, but I just, I'm gone and I can't come back from it. And then I get really tired. Oh, yeah, your body's shutting down. Yeah. Like I just, I'm like, I just want to go take a nap. It's like a nervous system response. Yeah. And I could, and I could go nap for like three hours and just shut off. I've done that since I was little too. There is, I'll never forget, there's a really, really big tornado that happened in the town that I grew up in. And they called it Black Friday. It was like the scariest thing. And I still, have like trauma around it, I swear, but I pretended to sleep because, and then that's what my

body, like, learned how to do with stress growing up. I'd be like, oh, this is stressing me out, disassociate sleep. And that's just all I would do. Yeah. It's crazy. Anyways, enough about me. I just went on to like a rantler. No, it's so interesting. Moving into the Playboy Mansion, did it feel glamorous or did it feel intimidating, surreal, all the above? Was it like everything you thought it would be? All of the above. It definitely wasn't what I think. thought it would be. I thought the girls would be a lot more supportive. But, I mean, it was intimidating and scary. And I think one of the most surprising things that happened early on is I started to see some of the other girls cycle out in ways that were kind of dramatic. Like,

they'd get caught cheating. So they'd be kicked out. And, like, their stuff would be packed up and, like, thrown out the back gate and stuff like that. Really? Yeah. Or a girlfriend would be there. And she'd become a centerful. And she'd be like, oh, she'd be confiding in me saying the last thing she ever wanted to do was move back home to Ohio. But then, you know, she'd get out and she can't make it after a couple months. So she has to go back home. Nothing's bad to go back home, but I'm just saying she said she didn't want to do that. So I was just seeing all these people cycle out or they would end up at like a high paid escort place or not if there's anything wrong with being escort if you want to do that. But it's just at a young age, everything just seemed so scary. I didn't know if that's what they wanted to do or if that's what they felt like they had to do to get by. So it made me feel kind of trapped there in a sense. Like, oh my God, like when I leave, it's going to be really bad because look at what's happening. Like I really need to like save up money. and, like, make sure I have somewhere to go and something to fall back on. How long were you in L.A. before you moved into the mansion? Maybe, like, a year, year and a half.

Yeah, it was not that long. So, like, to do that, make your move and then go into the mansion and have, like, and what were you not be able to work? Yeah. That's a lot. That is a lot. And at 21, right? I was 22 once I moved in.

I was 21 when I first started going to parties. I heard you had to ask to move in. Is that another fake fact? Well, what happened was I had been invited to go out with them before, and I'd always said no. Like, I liked him. I wanted to be in the matter. magazine and everything like that, but I was like, oh, I don't want to be part of this, like, multiple girlfriends thing.

Yeah. But then I was just, my roommates, our lease was up. My roommates found somewhere else to live. I didn't have anywhere to go. My credit was bad because I charged all my credit cards to get my boobs done and things like that. So I was like, hey, what do you, you know, I could go out with you guys because I heard from one of the bartenders at the pool party that week that one of the girls had just been kicked out and there was a slot open.

So I landed in that spot. So you landed in the spot and then how did your role evolve once you were? Like I said, a lot of the girls were cycling out once I came, and the girl who was, like, his main girlfriend who, like, shared his room with him was moving out. Her name was Tina. Oh, okay. I don't remember Tina. Yeah. So, and Huff and I were bonding a lot.

Like, we both loved, like, watching the old movies. And I liked going to, like, his buffet dinners. And, like, I liked doing a lot of the day-to-day things around the house that the other girls thought were boring. You know, they just wanted to go out to the club every night and, like, find the next celebrity to jump onto or whatever. So once Tina was leaving, they were all very supportive of me being in that number one girl spot because they didn't want to do it. That makes sense. Did you get jealous of the other girls? Not at first because I wasn't really expecting anything out of the relationship.

I kind of saw what it was. But, you know, when the relationship got more emotional between Huff and I and he started making promises he wasn't keeping and I'm like, oh, but why are you still like moving more girls in? Like, I thought it was just going to be us. and then he starts like playing people off each other a little bit and like saying oh well this girl said you said this about me and I'm like what the fuck and to this day I don't know if that girl really even said that it's just yeah did you have anyone to kind of confide in or have like an emotional outlet in the house I would talk to his secretary sometimes and obviously I know that anything I could say the secretary is probably getting back to him right I didn't care and then Bridget moved in from the show and she became a close friend but that's really about it that would be so hard I'm like someone I need well I I would feel so isolated. Yeah, and you have to keep everything close to the chest there because one thing I learned early on was that all the other girls are out to get you. They're out to get you kicked out.

They all think they're competing for like a month in the magazine. Did you have to learn that like the hard way or did you kind of go in with that mentality? I definitely didn't go in with that mentality, but I saw it happen pretty quickly. Like I said, like some of the girls getting kicked out. I knew it was because other girls had ratted on them. Yeah. It sounds like though you didn't really have to change who you were to fit in there, though. Like, it sounds like you could just be who you were.

You didn't have to be like, oh, God, I've got to go out to the clubs and go do this. Like, you got to just be. Yes and no. I mean, part of it was like, half and I had a lot of things we liked in common, and that was very genuine. But I didn't love, you know, the group aspect of the relationship. I wasn't crazy about going out to the clubs all the time. It was very, like, half and half. And I felt like even though I could express a lot of who I was at the mansion in a way that I felt like I couldn't before

because when you're young, nobody else is interested in, like, old Hollywood lore or, like, old movies or, like, you know, different things you would talk about there. But I felt like I couldn't be my whole self, like, you know. That makes sense. Did you ever read the book or hear about the book, you'll never make love in this town again? Yes. And is that accurate? The heft part.

I mean, I wouldn't know about the other parts. I assume they're true. Oh, well, I read it so many years ago, but I remember there was very, there's very, there's There's a lot of stuff in there about the Playboy Mansion where I was like, oh, dang. Is it like a Hollywood tell all or is it? Yeah, it's like it's women that, it was four women's stories. It was different women that worked in the sex work industry and they would tell their stories about like celebrity clients they had.

And there was one girl who said she went to the Playboy Mansion like in the early 80s or something. And she went upstairs with Huff, but at that time, I guess all he would do is like watch other women do each other and then like jack off in the corner. Sorry to be explicit. No, that's what the book said. Yeah. No, I was wondering if you.

So that was the only thing I'd heard about his bedroom before I went there, you know. And then is it like, not that I want to know what's really going on in there, but do you have to sign an NDA? Nope. Oh, that's wild. That's wild. I have a theory on that, though. I think he's so greedy to get so many girls into the bedroom, like whoever he can find at the nightclubs. He doesn't want them to have a moment to pause and think, oh, wait, what am I doing?

Right. You know what I mean? I mean, good point. But then there was, what was that documentary that came out? And it was like very dark about him and everything that went on in there. Because then people aren't, people are like, I'm just going to tell my side of the story. And they can say whatever they want, which I didn't think he would be okay with. Well, I just think there was such a culture of silence for so long.

And also, like, you have to think, like, back in his day, there was just major media. You know, there was no social media. There weren't podcasts. There weren't just like everyday people. Yeah. That's true. it took so long knowing that nobody had NDAs to get a documentary about that. Well, because I, yeah, I just assume, like, you must have a lifelong NDA,

but then I hear you on podcasts and I saw Kendra go on a podcast and say everything. And I'm like, oh, my God, they're going to get sued. But then you get to speak your truth now, which must be a little bit freeing. Yeah, for sure. It was hard at first, though, because I don't want to say I'm the first person to speak out. It's traumatic. It's traumatic. It's traumatic.

done it over the years and it kind of got buried. But I was the first person before like the documentaries and everybody else. And I just got dragged so hard when my book came out. Like it was rough. Just everybody from like the mansion world attacking me or people who are fans of the show and disappointed that the show wasn't real just dragging me. And oh my gosh. It was crazy. Like when I went on my book tours, I turned to the guy, you know, who was from the publishing house that was doing the PR for that. And I'm like, I feel like I'm a politician right now. Like I just didn't think anybody else in the world got dragged or like, like, you know, attempted to be exposed or anything like that.

Just people were just going for the jugular. Wow. Which I guess is fair game if you're talking about somebody else. But it would extend to the point where I had my second book come out, which was not exposing anybody, nothing negative. But people wanted the same reaction as from the first book. So it was just like the roughest press tour. And I was like seven months pregnant at the time.

Like nobody cared. They were brutal. And Kendra was going around trashing me so hard around that time. Oh, my God. Was she really? 100%. And you know what? My child is healthy, but if my child would have been affected by that, you know, people have

karma, so. Yeah. I always say karma has no deadline either. Yeah, totally. Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Oh, crazy. Yeah, it was rough.

It was like one of the craziest times. I feel like I can get through anything after that, honestly. Well, I think you are the most iconic. Yeah, oh, 100%. Thank you. Funny to imagine. So I feel like if you were speaking out, obviously, that's going to get hurt the most. But, like, true.

People hate women's opinions. Yeah, they really do, especially if you, like, are speaking. your truth about something like that's happened to you that you and especially because you're probably writing it and it's maybe a little bit therapeutic for you to be writing it and speaking your truth. So then to have people just give you so much backlash and come for the Jagular. It was mostly women or men or mix? The first time around like when the books came out, it was mostly women. I felt like when I was doing press, the male host kind of stepped back a little bit and, like, respected the fact that this is a woman's story.

I'm going to let her talk. Like, a lot of the male hosts or people behind the scenes were coming to me after the interview saying, thank you for coming out. I would never want my daughter to be in a scenario like this. It was women attacking me hard. I'm not going to say it was only women, but it was a lot of women. And I was prepared for backlash. You know, I knew what I was doing when I wrote the book.

But for it to continue on to the next book, when I wasn't saying anything negative, and it was just crazy. Talk about the strange routine of receiving photos every morning after nights out. Oh, yeah. He would always share photos with us after everything, whether it was like an event at the mansion or, you know, a night out or something like that, which is great because now I have, you know, so many photos. Like, I think that was awesome.

But there'd be times when, like, you'd be outside in a bikini and, like, whoever was snapping the pictures would make sure to, like, catch you at your worst angle or something. And I'd be like, oh, wow, I really look like that. So like the house had internal paparazzi kind of us. Like the butlers would take pictures. And for the most part, the staff was great as far as I knew. But sometimes I would get like weird pictures where I'm like, why did they even take a picture like that? Because it would be like me standing on the trampoline and I'm facing away.

Like it's not, nobody else was in the picture. I wasn't doing anything. Nobody was posing for, like most of the pictures were people just posing together or having fun or like mid jump on the trampoline. But I'm standing on a trampoline and you're standing on a trampoline. So you got to like brace yourself. And you know when you like brace yourself like you're. but looks really cellulite. Full picture of that.

They got handed out. You know, it's like, why are you taking pictures? Like, I felt like there was some shade going on. And is this before social media? Mm-hmm. So it's like, what were they doing with the photos? Just passing them out to everybody. Not selling them to magazines, just giving them to everybody.

But then when, like, a girl would be disgruntled and move out of the house and, you know, maybe blames me for it inaccurately or whatever, like, she's going to be throwing like every unflattering picture online. But then do you think? Because I feel like that would lead, well, speaking from personal experience, that would lead to wanting plastic surgery and getting procedures done. And I know have paid for you to get procedures done. Do you think that was like a tactic? I don't know if it was a tactic. Like I don't know, like when it comes to like a butler taking a really weird unflowing picture. I don't know if that was just them being a jackoff. Like I don't know what the motivation would be. Ha ha ha, you bitch. I don't know what that is. But I was definitely made to feel like I wasn't pretty. enough by him all the time. And I was constantly insecure and constantly wondering like, what could I do better? And I think that was on purpose. So we don't feel like confident enough to leave or so he feels like we're always competing for his attention. How long did you last in there?

Seven years. Wow. That, I mean, that's just such a mind to be in that world. It would be that for seven days. It would throw me off. Seven years is a long time to feel constant pressure because you probably grew up feeling like good about yourself and surrounded by love and friends and family. And then you go into this world of catty women and someone telling you you're not pretty enough and getting unflattering photos taken of you and you have this standard to be like the it girl and we're on a rotation. And I just can't imagine that. Does any of that still stick with you? I think my own past experiences with body issues, I've become so much stronger going through. But like naturally, I think especially as women, it does still stick with us. Like I'm curious now

that you've been, how long have you been out of the mansion, like out of that world? 15, 16 years, I think. Does it still come up or? I mean, I think. As I'm like, talking to you about everything, I'm like. Me being concerned about the way I look is so ingrained. Like, I probably don't even know how deep that goes. Right. But I do think I have a lot of arrested development with it too.

Like, I spent most of my 20s there. I wasn't dating like a normal person. I wasn't doing a career like a normal person. So I feel that there's a lot of immaturity in my life still or like I relate to a lot of my friends who were like 10 years younger than me because of that because I remember you saying or I can't remember I saw you say it that it felt like a cult at times yeah it does because everybody up there is so worshipful of one person yeah so that can definitely lead to some cult like thinking for sure goodness well I'm glad you were able to write a book and speak about and write two books thanks yeah because

it was kind of like your chance to be like I even think you even said like now's the time I'm to tell my truth, which was probably freeing and terrifying at the same time. What are the titles of the books? Down the rabbit hole and the Vegas Diaries. Oh, the Vegas. We're both like, but like, down the rabbit hole is so good for a tell-all. That is so good. Right.

I just thought that I can't name it anything else. Yeah, love that. I mean, did people come out and support you with these books, too, like any of the women? No. Not at all. What are you? Not at all. I mean, it's weird because it's so weird because even women.

who've had bad experiences at the mansion as well, like, they still don't like me. Because I think a lot of those people, like in Secrets of Playboy, you can see it too. Like, everybody's talking shit. Like, even if they also had a bad experience with Huff, they're mad at me because, like, at least I got something out of it. So, like, well, who is she to talk? At least she got the show, I think, is what, where you're coming from. Are you close with any of these women at all to this day? Bridget, who, from the show, obviously, you know, and my podcast.

But, I mean, we're still friends with, like, a lot of the playmates from that era. When you came out of the mansion, did you have any trust issues with women because of these relationships? Oddly enough, no. Like, female friendships have always been super important to me. And I immediately, when I moved out of the mansion, gravitated to another group of girlfriends and have been screwed over since from some people. You know, I like, it's a female friendships have just always been so important to me.

I never really, I think I'm a little better about sensing when somebody's being a user or when their intentions aren't pure, but it's about it. Yeah, yeah, I feel like just from, you know, in birth charts, I'm like, you've got intuition. Yeah. And also, like, where it was with the women, not that some of those people were angels, but I know where the ultimate, you know, bad intention was coming from and why everybody was behaving like that. It was really that place, and it was really what he set up.

Yeah, of course. And then I think it's so cool how you've reinvented yourself because I was, I've talked about this on another podcast, but we were just doing the Sports Illustrated event, and I was interviewing these girls on the panel. And we were doing like a hot or not question, like a sink or swim. And we were talking about reinventing yourself and how important it can be because obviously you grow and you change and you mature and you step into a motherhood and wife and all these different things.

Like obviously you said you've done the books and now podcasts. So let's talk about this next chapter of your life. You moved to Vegas and starred in Peep Show. What drew you to Vegas? Well, I've been going there pretty regularly, you know, with half in the girls. girls because they had a playboy club at the palms so we would go and I and I just loved it there and I always thought if I didn't live in L.A. I'd live here. And then I really got interested in Burlesco. I was a big fan of Dita Vantes and the Crazy Horse in Paris and they used to have

a version of the Crazy Horse Paris at MGM and it was a little boutique cabaret show and I was going to do a guest star run in that as like a plot line for girls next door. So I was going there and having meetings and I was super excited about being in the show and this was also around the time when like heaps and my relationship just imploded. So I was going to Vegas trying to do that show and met another guy that I got into a really short-lived bad relationship with. And he talked me out of doing crazy horse because he was jealous, didn't want me on stage in a thong.

Oh. Was he in the celebrity world or was he a like? He thinks he is. I don't even know what you're talking about. Yeah. Okay. You shouldn't. Okay.

Yeah. But he talked me out of doing it. But the good news is when I broke up with him, I got an offer for a bigger. better, longer running, higher-paying show. So it was just like my dream job. I was so excited. I got to do my own reality show around it. Don't you love that? Like what's meant for you won't miss you? A hundred percent. I love. Oh my gosh. Me too. And it was like you got to reclaim who you were. Yeah, which is always so important. But yeah, so you did that for a year. Four years. Four years. Oh, wow. Okay. And then you created Holly's world and really kind of took control of

your image, which is amazing. What did the process of reinvention look like for you? I mean, I was just kind of fumbling around in the dark. I was just, you know, honoring my instincts and going after, you know, what I seemed organically attracted to, which was I want to do this burlesque show. I want to be in Vegas. I want to do a reality show about me and my friends. And I just kind of, you know, followed my instinct. It wasn't really calculated. I think if I'd been calculated about it, I was like, I'm going to go brunette and I'm going to have a whole different image and I'm going to get the high fashion. It was nothing like that. It was purely just instinctive and just.

Which always will be what works. Yeah. 100%. I think like the biggest scam we're taught is that everybody has it figured out. Oh my God. I think we're all just figuring it out as we go along and as long as you listen to your gut. I'll never figure it out. No.

I'll get on my death bed and I'll be like, did I even do that right? I don't know. That's what I think. And then your newest chapter, how it flips the narrative. Okay, the true crime, Playboy murders. Tell me about this. Yeah, I got an offer to do this show called the Playboy murders. At first I was like, no, I'm so done with Playboy stuff.

Like, I can't. And my agent was like, just look at the deck. I'm going to send it over. And I expected to see some of the more high profile cases that a lot of people know about, like the Dorothy Stratton case. But they sent me a deck on six cases that I'd never heard of. And I thought I knew everything about everybody in the Playboy world. And I had always grown up loving true crime, starting with Unsolved Mysteries. So I thought this show I would actually watch.

I have to do this show. And it was about real stories? Yeah. People went missing from the Playboy Mansion and murders and... Yeah, from that world. Yeah, because you have to think, like, the Playboy brand was so big. There were so many Playboy clubs across the country. So many women have been to playmates and worked as bunnies and worked for the company.

So there's all kinds of stories from all through the decades. We're on our third season now. And then that evolved into another show called Lethally Blonde, which is similar, but the stories aren't Playboy specific. So I love doing that. Was there like a case or an episode that, like, really stuck with you? Really? There's so many.

There's different ones in every season. With all the Playboy ones, especially, I feel like I can really relate to the women's stories and what's going on. And with my other show, Lethally Blonde, we'll have another season of that coming out after the Playboy Murders is done. And I was just thinking about a case of, like, a young mom who got murdered. And those always kind of sit with me the worst when it's like a mom who has a really young child who's now, like, 12 and never knew her mother. Like, those are so heartbreaking to me. And I just want to tell that woman's story in a more well-rounded way. like on Lethally Blonde, the cases we work with, a lot of them involve sex workers and those

women tend to be just written off as just that or even forgotten entirely. So I like to dig into who are they besides that. Yeah. I love that. And do you feel like it kind of helps the public see maybe like a more realistic, less glamorized version of it? Yeah, I think so for sure. Yeah. I feel like the stories can be heavy. I feel like it must be like emotional, emotionally draining when you're off the clock. You know what I mean? Yeah, you have to paste yourself when you're working on that kind of stuff for sure. I always think about that with therapists. I'm like, God, they take on so much, like, emotion and people's heavy stuff. And then how do you, like, how do you decompress? How do you prioritize your, like, mental health? Well, I have to space out what I'm working on, even doing the

podcast sometimes because you're tapping into, like, this old traumatic stuff that happened. Like, sometimes I'll just get really ahead on my work so I can take a week entirely off of the podcast and just focus on the true crime or get everything done so I can take a week off and just focus on like my brand deals and my social media posts and things like that. You just need a break from it so you can come back refreshed. Do you enjoy social media? I do. Yeah.

I feel like you would. I feel like you, some people like for myself, I love it. And then I'll go through phases where I'm like, get me out of here. I'm moving to an island full of golden retrievers. But I just feel like you do a good job with social media. Thank you. Yeah. And then it's wild to think that it's been 20 years since that show premiered.

So you're doing a rewatch. Yes. Do you feel like people start to like now understand you better or do you think people still misunderstand who you are? I think for the most part, most of the feedback I get, I think people understand. Like every once in a while you'll get some in cell roll in with like the most basic insult, but I don't care. That's true. And then you and Bridget obviously launched the next level. What is it, girls next level?

Podcast. Do you like podcasting? I do. I love it. Yeah. How often does that come out? Once a week, every Monday. And has that help you also?

you both reclaim a narrative? I think so, definitely. And especially we're about halfway through the series now. And the series kind of gets for us lighter and more fun as it goes. It was darker in the beginning. So I think for me too, because I'd gone through so much of putting out my book and like airing all the negative stuff. Like now I can go back and also like reclaim the good times as well. So it's been really therapeutic for me. You as a mom, how, how's that shaped you? Oh, it's crazy. I mean, honestly, like it's my biggest priority and my biggest boundary. Like, I don't share anything about my kids on social media. I used to when they were little, but once they started preschool, it just started to feel like, okay, they're out in the

world. I want to, like, keep their faces private and everything. I have a great relationship with their dad. He just did a big festival in Vegas. So I took them out there during the day to see, and they went around on golf carts and saw all the stages and stuff like that. But honestly, like, even looking back at the last relationship I had, I dated this guy for six years and he was like cheating like crazy. And he's like going around telling everybody that. This most recent one? Yeah. And he's like, oh, well, she never introduced me to her kids. Why the fuck would I? Yeah. I wouldn't introduce my kids to anybody until I was engaged. Like, I keep that part of my life totally separate. And I'm just so grateful that in addition to everything amazing, my kids give me,

they also give me that boundary. Yeah. Yeah, that's so true. What an idiot. I hate this man. Oh, me too. It just keeps getting worse. The more and more I find out. That's, I'm so sorry. Thank you. It's been really hard the last two weeks. Like, even though I've been broken up with him for months, like finding all this out. And like, it ruins every good. memory you have with that person. And then he'll have, like, his punk-ass friends try and come out and, like, say shit to me on social media. I'm like, yeah, that's just, it's just so embarrassing because you're like, you f*** this up. Why are we blaming, why can't men take accountability for some shit? Let me have my moment. Take the L. Take the L. I'll be done with it in a week.

Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry, because that's, thank you. I know how hard it is to have to, like, keep going with, especially because it's public and people know stuff. And then you're finding out things and it like you said it ruins all the good and then moving forward how do you trust exactly like you were with him for six years yeah yeah like that scares the shit out of me because i always think like the next guy i day at first i said the next guy i date it's going to have to be a year before i really know who he is now i'm like two years and then but it's because you're like you just it's so scary yeah i think i just the next guy i need to be with he needs to be somebody who's really up front and is really, like, secure in who he is

and lives his life as who he is and isn't trying to be, like, secret ever mysterious. Like, I need a good Leo man for you. Yes. It's like a good Mars sign for communication. Yes. That's, we're going to manifest this for you. I love it.

And in closing, we do on Off the Vine Confession Time where you tell an embarrassing story, something, did they prep you for this? They did. And I do. Sometimes people look at me and I'm like, I do not know about this? No, they did.

And I complete, but then they came back to me with like the, So I forgot. It's hard for me to think of like an embarrassing story that I haven't told because like I've been on TV and on podcast. So I feel like everything's just out there. I mean, I feel like just finding out you've been cheated on is embarrassing. And I don't know why because it's not like I did anything wrong. And it's not like there's ever anything wrong with the woman if she's being cheated on. It's usually that guy has some kind of like addiction, sex addiction, addiction to adrenaline.

Like I think this guy in particular love the feeling of like almost getting caught. Yeah. Yeah. No, that is an addiction. There's a lot of different addictions out there that people can have and that is definitely one of them. And I get what you mean about it being embarrassing because you're like, should I have seen this or like seen through or, you know, but it's obviously not your fault. You know that. I just want to always like hug you and be like, I'm so sorry you went through this. Yeah, but tell us everything where we can find your books, your podcasts, your shows, like everything. My books you can buy Amazon or anywhere you buy books. It's down the rabbit hole and the Vegas Diaries. My podcast, Girls Next. level drops every Monday. The Playboy Murders is on ID every Monday night at nine and you can stream it on Max. You are so busy. I'm watching that for sure. Yeah, me too. Thank you. Yeah. Do you sleep a lot? Because I don't know how you're doing all this. Yeah. Honestly. You know what sucks is I am somebody who needs a lot of sleep and I wish I didn't. I wish I was one of those freaks that only needs four hours

to sleep and then they can go. Yeah, me too. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Thank you. Thank you for coming and showing up today because I know when you're going through hard things like it's hard to show up and be on and I really appreciate your time. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you for coming.