Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - John Kim: “The Angry Therapist” gives his no bullshit self help advice in a shot glass

Episode Date: March 2, 2021

John Kim, self proclaimed “The Angry Therapist”, author of Single On Purpose and I USED TO BE A MISERABLE F*CK shares all about his unconventional methods of therapy that humanize the approach and cut through the bullshit. He shares about his own personal traumas which led him from being an aspiring screenwriter to a pioneer in modernizing the approach to therapy. Kaitlyn and John's hilarious conversation includes discussing peeing in the shower, scheduling “man dates", and more of his unconventional anecdotes and advice.  You can follow John Kim on IG at @theangrytherapist  CLARINS - Discover more at clarinsusa.com and use promo code OFFTHEVINE10 for 10% off  GEICO - Go to geico.com and in fifteen minutes you could be saving 15% or more on car insurance JORDAN HARBINGER - Search for The Jordan Harbinger Show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to podcasts, or go to jordanharbinger.com/subscribe JENNI KAYNE - Find your forever pieces at jennikayne.com. Get 15% off your first order when you use code VINE at checkout—and for a limited time, that includes furniture, too VIZZY HARD SELTZER - To find out where you can purchase Vizzy go to vizzyhardseltzer.com/VINE See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Here's Caitlin. Welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host, Caitlin Bristow, today I'm sitting down with someone who is truly transforming the field of self-help by being open, honest, and very different from what you think of when you hear the word therapist. He's a writer, a speaker, a life coach, a licensed marriage and family therapist, who you may know by his popular nickname, The Angry Therapist, as if that's not impressive enough. He also has a podcast, a book that was just released, and helps. run several businesses that improve people's lives. Not a big deal. He is definitely not your average therapist or self-help guru. And that's exactly why it was so fun sitting down with him. We also get into some listener questions from the vinos, both about relationships and about being single on purpose.

So hope you guys enjoy today's podcast with John Kim. Okay, really quick, hold up. Before we get into my interview with John Kim, I want to remind you about my new upcoming segment called Pump Your Tires, where I feature small businesses and organizations that truly deserve to have their tires pumped. This month's theme is black women-owned businesses. So if you haven't already, go to the Apple podcast review and tell me a black women-owned business you love in the review. And I will be featuring one of your recommendations each month. So get on it. Hey, how are you?

Hey, I'm so good. How are you? I'm doing well. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it. it. Oh my gosh, of course. I wanted to start off the podcast, just, we'll kind of dive into some of these things anyway. So I wanted to do a really quick fact or fiction about therapy. Ooh. It's to kind of set the tone for the pot. Yeah, I love it.

Here we go. Fact and fiction to get your thoughts on the below statements. A therapy is unnecessary if you have a close group of friends and a solid support system. Oh, geez. It could take several therapists to find the one who is right for you. Fact. Yes. I've been through a few. Therapy is unfortunately expensive and only possible for those with money. Oh, wow.

That's a tough one. No, I'm going to say fiction today because of the Internet and other resources. Exactly. And I think also just like how many podcasts have you done or I've had so many therapists on my podcast that there's probably a podcast out there for so many different topics on therapy, right? Yeah, absolutely. Therapists often choose the field so they can fix and address their own personal problems. Yeah, I think that's true.

Yeah. Therapy can be an on and off thing and doesn't need to be a lifelong endeavor. That's a fact. Really? Okay. I think so. It doesn't have to be. Okay, it doesn't have to be.

That's fair. Therapy doesn't have to involve sitting on a couch in a traditional setting. Oh, a fact. 100%. I'm actually living example of that. I've never had an office. I love that. I can't wait to get it more into that because when I heard that, I was like, that's freaking cool. And I, I would love to meet my therapist for coffee instead of in her office. I'm always just like, it's cold air. Okay, therapists typically have it together more than the average person going into therapy. Oh, that is fiction. A hundred percent fiction. And last one, therapists are typically seeing their own therapists.

That should be the case, but I think a lot of therapists, including myself, were lazy. And we do a lot more, do as I say, not as I do. So let's get into childhood because that's usually where therapy starts. It's usually what it's all about. But you've been in L.A. pretty much your whole life. But you were born in Korea. Is that right? Yeah, born in Korea.

Came to L.A. when I was three. When you're three. And did your family stay? or was your family with you? Family with me. So just mom, dad, and brother, just to four of us. Nice. And I wanted to ask what your family dynamic was like growing up.

Like did your parents put pressure on you to follow a traditional career path? Did you? Because I know you went to school for film and to be a screenwriter, which is a really cool career, but of course not often a very stable or reliable one. But what was that dynamic like for you growing up? Yeah. I'm in my 40s. So parents old school wanting us to study, get A's, become a doctor, like all that stuff.

and they came here with little money. So I tell people I was raised by Pulp Culture. So I got into things like breakdancing in the 80s when it was in the first time bikes and stuff. And I think part of that was because I grew up in an all kind of white Caucasian world. Being a minority, and we were like the only Asian family for blocks, you know. And it's not like that now, but in the 80s, there's a lot of racism and stuff. And just to survive, just to not get bullied, I had to be good at something, you know. And so I got obsessed with like BMX bikes, skateboarding and all of that.

And I think that was the reason why I didn't get beat up is like in the 80s, they let one cool Asian kid in, just one. And you were the one. I mean, sometimes. And I would just kind of slip in through ability. And so I hated school. And I loved activities. I love doing things, chasing flow states and all of that.

Yeah. Yeah. That's break dancing in the 80s. That's what I actually took. I was part of a hip. pop company, gosh, how old was I? Maybe 20, I think I was 22, 23. And we learned like the real background of hip hop and we took graffiti lessons and we did all these really cool things. And break dancing was always something I wanted to be good at. I took it for a year. I was not good, but I did. I was just on Dancing with the Stars and I was able to bust out my one dance move that

I knew from break dancing. One of the dances, I was like, yes, if I took break dancing for any reason it was for this moment right here. But you have a natural knack for dance and movement. It's the only obviously. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Did you stick with that or was that just like a, or did you really commit to the break dancing? I stuck with it for a while and then I had to put my fat laces away, my windbreaker and all that. It kind of grow up. And then I got into all different things. You know, I got after my divorce, I got into CrossFit. I got into motorcycles. I got, you know, I'm always into something that's physical, but I'm definitely not a break. the answer today. Damn, I was going to make you bust out of a move. Oh, I wish.

Just kidding. I wouldn't do that to you. But what was that transition for you? Because being in L.A., getting into the screenwriting stuff, and then becoming a therapist, what was that transition? Was it because of a divorce or did you talk about your divorce as a therapist? Entertainment, as you know, Feast or Famine, right? And I knew that I loved writing and I went to film school because it was the only measured that

I actually loved. And I also just kind of wanted to graduate. And I was like, oh, like, yeah, film. We just watch movies. And so I kind of fell in love with it, though. And I managed to get representation, which is really hard as a writer, right? Because it's what's on the page. You can't, like, just be attractive or something, you know?

You have to have some kind of talent. And then I sold a couple things, but it wasn't enough to, like, make a career at it. And at the same time, my marriage was falling apart. And I felt like, okay, I really need to be responsible and do something where I could get, like, a stable job. I was talking to my own therapist. And he's like, what? about going back to school. And I was like, no, never. But I really loved psychology. Yeah. And I loved this idea of helping other people. I wanted to do what he was doing,

you know, have an office and help people. I just thought like, oh, that would be amazing. Yeah. I had no idea that I actually didn't want that. But at the time, I thought, oh, that feels like amazing, you know, wear the wrinkle-free pants and the little balls and the really bad art. And like you said, it's always cold in those rooms. That felt like safety for me. That felt like success. And I didn't know what was on the other side of that. So at 35, got a divorce. And then I went back to school, got my master's.

And what he didn't tell me was the 3,000 hours it takes to be licensed. So that was, oh, my God, that was a long journey. That was like five years of just. Yeah, I mean, it's such a meaningful career. And obviously, you were drawn to helping people. But that's a lot of freaking hours to put in in five years. Especially because I think about, like, I don't know if you had this thought, but a lot of people have the thought of you need to have things figured out by this age and you need to

be here at a certain point. And if you're, you know, go to school, get your education, marriage, and then you have your career. And obviously now and this time, we're able to talk about how that's not always happening for everybody and how it's more normal to go through the different phases of life at different times than it ever has been. But I just, I was wondering if you always had that, that urge to kind of help people or if that came from your own therapy. Part of it came from my own therapy. So I fell in love with therapy. I was like, I didn't understand why people are resistant to going into a room with a cabuccino and talking about yourself for like, it's like a mental massage.

I know. And I mean, because there's stigma behind it, right? A lot of people think that if you have a therapist, I mean, something's wrong with you or that you're crazy. But I look forward to it weekly. It was my therapeutic. It was my mental shower. And I was like, wow, this is amazing.

So I got really into it. And then I thought, I need to do something bigger than. my own stuff. Like, I need to do something that is bigger than me. And I thought, you know what, I want to help people. Yeah. So, yeah, I just fed that fire. And then I was on my path of getting 3,000 hours. And it was rocky, you know, I worked in nonprofit. I worked in the rehabs here in Malibu, all the fancy rehabs. I worked in, you know, all different types of settings while I was blogging. And so I started a blog on Tumblr called The Angry Therapist. I was just about to ask all about the angry therapist because I want people to read it and know how it started and

why you called yourself the angry therapist. Yeah, just being Korean. That's just the default angry. No, I'm kidding. I was an angry person in my 20s because I wasn't happy. I had no sense of self. In relationships, I would lose myself with my ex-wife. I put her on a pedestal. I went from what I call from mouth to nipple, meaning I was when we met, we were kind of, you know, equal and then the dynamic was lopsided where I felt like I went from man to child if that makes sense. And so

I think ultimately the angry therapist is me humanizing myself and I didn't know this at the time but on Tumblr I didn't think anyone would read it. It was just something for me to do to pass time as I was healing from a broken heart. Didn't have any friends.

I was broke and I was like oh well everyone else is blogging. Might as well start a blog. And then I think it kind of caught because people thought it was interesting that a therapist was actually talking about his feelings and that he's not perfect and he's going through his journey. And also like a minority and just being a Korean dude, there aren't a lot of Korean therapists. I think that was different.

And so that's kind of the first domino. That's what started everything for me. And then from there, people wanting help, a full practice and then, you know, book deals and, you know, social media and all that stuff. Grab a coffee and discover nonstop action with Bud MGM Casino. Check out our hottest. Exclusive. Friends of one with multi-drop. Once even more options, play a wide

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2,600 to speak to an advisor, free of charge. But MGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. I struggled and like we kind of talked about earlier was finding the right therapist and that you could go through a few until you click. And I still, to this day, like, I love mine. She is incredible and has helped me tremendously through so many things. But I always wanted just like a more relatable approach. Like, you know, somebody, I remember she opened up to me one time and then said

something about how you're like really not supposed to do that. Right. Right. To me, that just makes me feel more vulnerable. It makes me feel more connected. It makes me feel more like just not, you know, the teacher, student, therapists. It just felt so much more relatable. And so I love that you do that. And because you'll, you'll often go for coffee with your client sometimes. Is that right? And what I wanted to know how. Why, why would my therapist and other therapists say that it's like kind of a faux par are not allowed to do that. And, and it works, but it works for you. Because we're taught in therapy school to not show our personal side. And I get it.

You know, we're not supposed to make it about us, right? But what I learned through my story and my practice is that if you are not vulnerable, at least a little bit, you're kind of seen as a cardboard cutout. So we're taught to flip things around. Like if you were to ask me a personal question instead of me answering it, I would say, why are you asking me that? Where is that coming from? And how does that relate to your story?

So constantly reflecting back to you, which I think. is good. But I think if you do too much of that, people don't see you as human. So I think a lot of therapists, because of the fear of, you know, the board and how we were trained, we can show up as kind of like cardboard cutouts, not three-dimensional. And I decided to not do that because it just felt more honest, you know. And I'm not for everyone, right? And I know there's a lot of therapists that are like, this guy is crazy. What is wrong with this guy? He's irresponsible or whatever. But I know that when I was more like me, meaning when I met people at coffee shops and jeans in a T-shirt and said, if we're going to talk about life, let's do life when we're talking.

I didn't feel like Clark Kent pushing the mail cart. I felt more like Superman, if that makes sense. You know, I felt more honest to me. And so I kind of secretly did that and you weren't supposed to, you know? Right. And I just like, you know, I'll call myself a coach. And then I started meeting people at coffee shops, brought them into the gym, a walks around lakes. And I did draw boundaries. It's not like, you know, I started hanging out. Yeah, yeah.

As a therapist, it's like the number one thing you probably teach is boundaries. So I'm sure you yeah. But I think that's the new. I think what the new generation is interested in now is who their therapist is more so than the letters after their name. You know, and I think part of that has to do with social media on the internet. I think so too. I mean, there's so much of my own self-healing has come from relatable people on Instagram. who are sharing their struggles and being vulnerable and, you know, anything from mental illness to body, dysmorphia, anything like that. Like when people show up on the internet and that way, I have found that therapeutic in my own ways, listening to podcasts, you know,

when people are just feeling like they're more authentic and genuine and in person like that. It just, it does create way more connection for me. And I, I wish, because there's not many therapists like you out there, but I wish there was more. Do you do anything online or is it basically like your blog and then you meet people in person as clients? Yeah, during the pandemic, I created something called the lab and it's a team of coaches and therapists all via Zoom running very interesting groups and classes like attachment styles and codependency and all of that. So I think it's really cool to use the internet tech as a tool to connect people. I know when I started, you weren't supposed to do that.

And I think you're still not supposed to as a therapist. You can only see people in your own state via Zoom. Yeah. I was like, why? I mean, we could drop into someone's living room across the globe at any time. Like, why not take advantage of that technology? And so is that starting to change now? I don't know, but I know that the board is very old school.

I think that therapy is a profession that has never had a shakeup, you know, has never been reinvented. And I know with the explosion of wellness in the last five years, there's a lot of stuff happening with coaching because therapy is so, they have such hard lines, you know. And a lot of therapists, I don't blame them because they're afraid to lose their license. Right. And so I don't have that fear. And that's why, you know, I show up in this way. But I get it. You know, if you have a practice and you don't want to lose your license, you've got to really play by the rules.

Yeah, that's fair. So if people that were listening wanted to be a part of, do you say the lab? Yeah, the lab, TAT lab. So can people like that are listening to this podcast be a part of that or check it out on your website or? Yeah, just Instagram. Yeah, absolutely. Just go to my Instagram. You can check it out there.

And is your Instagram, the angry therapist too? Okay, amazing. I wanted to actually go back for one second because you said something that really stood out to me is something that you did in a relationship and past relationships and something I did in mine all the time. And I'm from, you know, just having this community from the podcast, I have heard other people relate to my story and yours as well where they kind of lose themselves in the relationship to the other person and put that person too much on a pedestal and that's how you lose himself. I did it in almost every relationship I was in until this one I'm in right now. What do you think? Like, what advice would you give to people who are struggling in that way who, you know, get into relationships and emotionally, financially,

whatever way they are, depend on the other person? How do you get out of that cycle? Yeah, I think it's a very common cycle. And I think it runs deeper. I think it has to do with codependency, ammishment, definitions of love, partly from, you know, Disney movies and advertising. You know, this idea of the one. I used to think that it was romantic that if you go down, I go down with you.

And if I go down, you go down with me. And I thought that when you get married or you share a bed with someone, that you're not two separate people, but you're just one person. And then I realized later that that's not love. That's that's go to the pendency. That's dysfunctional. I also think that there's something called trauma bonding, where we mistake attraction and love by the, dopamine we get from the dysfunction, right? So a lot, a lot of times, a lot, many of us grew up in chaotic families. My dad was a was an addict and alcoholic. If you grew up and that smells

familiar to you and you are naturally attracted to the chaos, the drama, the, what I go telemundo, whatever, that can be mistaken as chemistry. That can be mistaken as, oh, this person loves me so much, right? And then when you find healthy love, you could think it's boring. Right? You could be like, oh, this doesn't feel like, because you're not getting the dopamine that you got when you were 20 or when you were in those kind of crazy relationships. And so I talk about this idea of swimming past the breakers. And this is what's really hard is that when you do find someone that is healthy and build a relationship that's healthy, you've got to swim past the boring or the unfamiliar to create a new love imprint where you're like, oh, now this is what feels good. Most people don't swim past that. And so they just snap back and they get into something that's crazy and chaotic. And then they're like, why does every relationship, you know, hurt so much, you know.

That's so, I feel like you're speaking to my soul right now. I feel like I did that for so many years and so many relationships. And I always think about that, that idea where the, like you said something about the chaos, you're attracted to the chaos and like my own insecurities. If I found somebody else with those insecurities, I thought we were like meant to be. that we would understand those insecurities about each other, so it would be okay. I was never really attracted to like the I'm going to fix you kind of people. I just looked for my level of unhealthy and matched it.

And I think just from, you know, if people do work on themselves, go to therapy, talk to somebody that if you're doing that consistently and growing as a person, then you grow and all of a sudden you find this love that's super healthy for you. And you're like, wait, what, this is too easy or like, you're like, where is the, where is the, where is the, like if I like with Jason my my boyfriend right now I'm like I'll throw a punch and he's like he doesn't meet me there and I'm like what the hell is that about and then we end up having a healthy conversation and resolve it and I'm like oh okay like it's it's just such a different kind of relationship but I went through like a phase when I first met him of is this going to be like enough for me because he's so healthy he's so level-headed he's so great he's got you know all this education and he just wants a family and everything is lying me not so much that I'm like and then it worried me to put him on a pedestal and then lose myself to him again but luckily it hasn't gone that way but all these things that you've said and talked about and I think are you know I'm not feeling like I'm alone here I feel like everyone listening can can relate to that same kind of you know thing that they do in relationships so yeah and also subconsciously maybe on a deeper level many do find healthy or amazing

and they don't feel they deserve it you know yeah and so they sabotage hush it or they go back to you know the dude with the transam or whatever the dude with the trans sam waiting outside the high school you know with his leather coat it's like all i'm picturing right now wait so were you attracted to bad boys in the in the neck or no it was interesting is no i was i was all of my past um relationships i could actually probably speak very highly of it's just that they had the exact same insecurities as myself. It was like people, like the divorced parents or the insecurities in a relationship, the not feeling good enough, the competitive, the everything.

But like removed from the relationship, really good people. Right, of course. Right, right, right. Yeah, there's something about the parts being good, but when you put them together, maybe that's not so healthy, if that makes sense, right? Yes, exactly. Yeah, I was just talking. a girlfriend about this last night where you usually attract like your level of your mind of a

healthy healthy relationship like what you think is a healthy relationship or what you are in a relationship is what you're probably going to attract and that's how sometimes if you keep evolving as a person you're going to grow out of that relationship and people usually think we got to stick it out because you're married or all these things when really you've got so much of the rest of your life to live you do what's hard but what's best for you and your first book was called, I used to be a miserable fuck. God, that makes me happy. Nothing I like more than an F-bom. It just really drives at home. It's an every man's guide to a meaningful life. And the book essentially tries to help, you know, like you said, you go from a man

to a boy, help boys get advice and follow the journey you did to become a man. So I wanted to go through a few of the pointers mentioned in the description for this book. I'm so curious to get your point of view on what these mean to you. And I just, I just know everything you're going to say. I'm be like, yes, yes. That's not true. We'll see. Maybe. Okay, being nice is for boys and being kind is for men.

Yes, I think that, and this is a generalization, and maybe not in every case, but I've learned that sometimes nice means that we want something back. So I think whenever you want something back, you're not really giving your taking, right? So if I help you move, but in return, I want your approval validation and you to answer my face time that's that's not really you know i'm saying yeah and so kind kind isn't attached to something back kind is coming from a pure place i think nice with with being nice there's room for something wanting something back some kind of exchange yeah that's fair i i feel like i used to be guilty of that actually yeah now that yeah now that you said that okay scheduling mandates could

make you a better friend lover and human being yeah so when i was married i didn't think that friends were important. Like, I thought they were a waste of time. Like, I have my person. Why do I need guy friends? And then I got a divorce. And that was very low. And I was like, oh, this is why you need guy friends. But I think, and also, you know, for women, girlfriends as well, because you should have your own set of friends. You should have your own life. And I think especially with men, we do a lot of activities. You know, there's that whole like locker room thing. But we don't like sit down and have crapes and talk about our feelings and what we're struggling with. And I think that's what a mandate should. Like, it could be dirt bikes and working out

on whatever you want to do, but it shouldn't just be that. I think that we should have a deep honest conversations where we're able to practice vulnerability. So, you know, we feel less alone in the world because we're human. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know what's so funny is Jason is on a ski trip with his guy friends right now. And I live for these times because I need alone time. I also a neat girlfriend time, but I really crave a long time. And I know he really loves to get away with his guys. And we never argue about it. It's always like, yeah, let's go do our thing. And it's, you know, social media. We have so many people that will comment if he's on his own trip and go, well, where's Caitlin? And what's going on? And even my sister wrote me the other day. She goes,

are you and Jason, okay? Because there's some like whispers going on on the internet that, you know, because you guys just took separate trips. And I was like, oh my gosh, this is so sad because it makes me realize that those people have that thought you know that they they probably don't have that in their relationship and they don't understand it or it like maybe bothers them on a deeper level that they don't have that but it to me it like it it really brings us closer together as soon as he comes home i'm like it's so nice to miss you like you know that we get to like actually connect when he gets home talk about things what did you guys do like it's just so important so when i read that you said that. I was like, I love that because I think also Jason is an open person

with his emotion. So he, him and his friends do talk about things, but I know that's maybe not the case for everybody. But it is important for you to connect with, with your buddies on an emotional level as well. You know what it does? It makes you appreciate your partner more. Yeah. When you're out in the world, doing your own thing, you know, having conversations with friends. it's when you are in this like incubator, this crock pot with your partner and you're not allowed to go outside of that where you can start to feel claustrophobic. Literally a pressure cooker. Yeah, absolutely.

It's true. And every time Jason goes on these trips, he'll message me and go, I think I'm ready to have kids. You know, he just realizes that he wants the best of both worlds and can have the best of both worlds. Wait, are kids in the future or you don't know? Oh, yeah. what if it's if i'm lucky enough to get pregnant i mean i have my eggs frozen and i'm 35 but i still feel like i'm supposed to be a mom and i can't wait for that so if it's in our cards then yeah i can't wait awesome that's exciting we've got we've got the little dogs now but that's do you do you kids

uh yes uh one she's one year old so i had a child at 47 wow yeah don't you think that you'll show up as a better dad just from being this is how i think Anyways, I just think I'm going to show up and not to say that people don't show up if they have kids in their younger, you know, age. I just know me personally. I have always had the urge to travel, to go places, to grow, to do therapy, to do all these things before I am a mom. And again, I don't want anyone to be mad at me if you had kids earlier because that's not for everybody. It is just for me. And I think I personally would show up as a better mom later in life. I know that I will be the old dude that rolls up to her high school in my 60s and her friends would be like, oh, your grandpa's here. But, but I know that I will be a 10 times better dad starting at 47 than if I was 27 or even 37. I just didn't, I didn't have the tools. I would have been impatient. I would have been reactive. You know, like, yeah, at 47, I could, I could barely handle it now. I hear you. Okay, this one, I don't think I agree with you on it.

It says peeing in the shower is a sign of a larger problem. Well, that, okay, so I have to explain that. I know it's funny because that's the one that everyone asks me about. It's not about peeing in the shower if your partner is cool with it. So this ties to my story when I was married. And, you know, women have a hyphen sense of a smell. Yeah. So she's like, I would appreciate it if you don't pee in the shower.

Now, if she's cool with it, write your name on the wall. It doesn't matter. Okay. But she's like, can you not do that for some reason? She didn't like it. So I said, oh, yeah, yeah, I won't do it. it, but I kept doing it and I'm chasing it down with shampoo, thinking, oh, how is she going to know? And so this is the hairline crack because she knows that I'm doing it, even though I'm saying I'm

not. So then she wonders, are you also feeding your dog under the table where you really go? So it's breaking trust. It's really not about peeing in the shower. Okay. I'm glad you broke that down because personally, I pee in the shower. Yeah, yeah. Everyone pees in the shower. I get it. But, but you know what? You pee in the shower probably because Jason doesn't care or No, because he doesn't do. Right, right. That's interesting, though. I love a good breakdown of something funny and simple like that.

Okay, arguing, judging, and answering, I don't know, are keeping you from a healthy relationship, a great career, and a happy life. It's the guy or girl who gives you the deadfish handshake. And you're like, it's that complete or the person where it's like, where do you want to eat? I don't know, what do you want to eat? Well, what do you want to eat? Whatever you want. And it's like, just pick something.

Yeah. It's the, I don't know, guy. guy. And I think that comes from insecurity, not knowing a sense of self. I think it's better that you say something and someone disagrees with it, right? Instead of just, I don't know, whatever you want. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I agree with that. I am very decisive when it comes to certain things. And I hate the answer. I don't know. But that I had something else I wanted to say, but I just lost it. What was it? I don't know. You're saying, I don't know as we speak. I don't know. I don't know what that was.

And then tell me, you just, you released a second book, right, in January. Yeah, it's called Single on Purpose. And that came from helping mostly women in their 30s who were single and frustrated thinking the, you know, the clock's taking. And because they weren't in a relationship. And listen, it doesn't mean, it doesn't say single forever, right? So I'm not saying it's an anti-relationship book. It's more of a pro relationship with itself. So while you're single, you got to spend the time on you.

and connect with yourself instead of just waiting desperately for someone to rescue you, save you or find you. Yeah, because there's so many, you know, somebody of my girlfriends and so many listeners and people that are struggling right now because being, you know, alone in a pandemic and not having that connection with everybody. I mean, obviously the grass is always greener. Like being in a relationship is really tough right now too. But, I mean, this is so the time my girlfriend said to me last night, I'm just so lonely.

and I said, I can't imagine, I can't imagine how lonely that is, but this is, what are like, perfect, she's 29. I'm like, this is the perfect opportunity for you to just dive into who you are, do ever, get to know yourself, ask yourself questions, work on yourself, like, and she really actually is doing that. And I've even seen a shift of her in her over the pandemic. But it's, I think it's like a nice reminder for anyone out there listening if you are going through that, that it'll change your life if you work on your. yourself especially in that you've got time right now yeah and i know that um a lot of people are sick of this this idea of or hearing work on yourself or like dating yourself i get it i'm sick of it too it sounds like a bumper sticker i like this idea of liking yourself i think loving yourself is easy because that can be a choice we love people that we don't necessarily like but i think like has to

be earned and it requires a journey and uh the more that you like yourself when you do find someone who deserves you you're bringing more to the table you're bringing more to the table you're bringing more of a whole person who has opinions and boundaries and a sense of self and worth than just someone who is going to, you know, lose herself in someone else because they desperately want a relationship so bad. That's so, I'm so glad you explained it like that because I feel like I even sound like a broken record to my listeners out there saying to work on yourself just because I'm so passionate about it because I did and I saw such a different. I'm like, I want everybody to do it, but I'm sure people do. It does sound like a bumper sticker. What are some of the first steps you think

someone should take when trying to work on the relationship with themselves and starting to be, you know, single on purpose. I love this concept of your pseudo self, which is your solid self. And your pseudo self is the false self. It's the self that exchanges truth for membership, which I used to do. It's been brainwashed by advertising society. It traces old blueprints or blueprints that don't belong to you, like your parents, right? That's the pseudo side. the solid the solid side is usually the quiet whisper that's your truth that's your what we call your authentic self so i think the beginning of this whole thing is you listening more to your solid self than your pseudo and i don't know what that looks you know like uh for some people it's actually

speaking up in the boardroom for some people it's you know telling someone how to go down on them i don't know like whatever that looks like for you yeah um because most of us don't do that most of us are so busy listening to a false side of us because we want people to like us and we want validation and approval, you know? So true. Yeah, we have a couple more things for you just because I know my listeners will love your no bullshit advice. So usually with my guests, I'll play a game.

But I thought, since I have you here today, I'll get some questions for my listeners. And then you can give them some no bullshit self-help in a shot glass advice. So I got a couple questions for you and then I'll let you go. First one is Allison wants to know what is the best. way to have a conversation on values and determine if you are aligned in the future, especially a few years into a relationship? I would say taking away all the shoulds and going into conversations using eye statements. You know, here are my values, here are my, here, you know, whatever, fill in the blank. And I want to know about yours. And because a lot of people go into

conversations trying to manipulate control or putting a lot of, like, this is how it should be, not leaving a lot of room for the other person to, you know, express them or herself. yeah okay Alexis asks why are some women attracted to toxic men and won't give the nice guy a chance oh this is kind of what we're talking about before i think it has to do with the um underlining dynamic of what they're used to that usually is chaos uh the confusion of dysfunction being love because it shoots a lot of dopamine into your into your head so um i would do everything i can to give myself a new love experience you know swimming past the breakers so you could give yourself a new love imprint instead of chasing and having the chasing old blueprints and

it being a pattern. Yeah. Okay, Jordan asks, what are red flags that we can chalk up to paranoia and insecurity versus red flags that are clear signs to get out of the relationship? Ooh, that's a good one. It's a good one. Yeah, red flags to get out of the relationship would be someone who does not take ownership. That's a huge one. What do you do with that? If someone never takes ownership and is always blaming you, the magnet flips. Like there's, There's no, right? Another red flag is obviously abuse, any character assassination, even if it's subtle, you know, even if it's not like physical abuse, but something that is like a gaslighting or, you know, not championing your story, supporting you, you know, that kind of stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Jill wants to know if someone doesn't have any humility, is that something they can learn. Oh, sure. I think, you know what teaches people humility? Life. Yeah, you know, and it doesn't matter how successful or rich or attractive you are eventually.

Everything that goes up, goes down, there's gravity, you know, you're going to have your moments. And I think, yeah, life will teach you to be humble. That's very true. How long does it take? No, that wasn't her follow-up question, but I'm like, I think it is, it is about life and what you go through and how you choose to see failures or opportunities and all that stuff. Okay, last one.

Emma wants to know, do you think you can live a full? life without a romantic partner, but instead surrounding yourself with love from family, friends, animals, and yourself. Yeah, absolutely. No matter what you believe, I would try to get to believing that you can because if you don't, then you're going to be powerless because you're going to think that your life isn't complete unless you have someone, you know? And I know it's hard to believe that, especially in the world that we live in, that you can have a full life by yourself, but I believe you can. I do too. I'm with you on that one. I'm not, this is a joke, but I just saw one of the girls asked, Brittany, you said, why men great till they got to be great?

Quoting. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Why? Why? Why what? You know, Lizzo? And she says, why man great till they got to be great? That was her question. Oh, I don't even know what that means. You got to explain it. You got to bring it down to street level. I don't know what that means. I feel like Lizzo sang it in her song and she was saying like, oh, that guy's great. And then when he has to show up, he's not great anymore. Oh. He puts it out there as he's like, you know. Yeah, which is kind of the dating landscape today, right, with filters and swiping and hiding and ghosting and dickpicks. Yeah, yeah.

Face tuning your dickpicks. I really, really enjoyed your conversation and your approach and everything that you have. Yeah, to bring to, like that's, it's so refreshing. I'm sure you hear that word all the time, but it really is. And I appreciate you and let everybody know, because you have a podcast as well. So tell everybody where they can find you and hear more from you. Sure. Just at The Angry Therapist and my podcast is called The Angry Therapist.

So that's easy. Keeping it simple. I like it. Caitlin, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate you. Oh, my gosh. Any time, I really appreciate you taking the time. And thank you so much.

I hope you have a really great day. You too. Be well. I'm Caitlin Bristow. I'll see you next Tuesday. Thanks for listening to Off the Vine with Caitlin Bristow. Get new episodes every Tuesday. day exclusively on podcast one.com, the Podcast One app, and subscribe on Apple Podcasts.

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