Off The Vine with Kaitlyn Bristowe - Josie Balka | The Voice Behind Every Poem You’ve Saved on Instagram!

Episode Date: December 9, 2025

#900. Today on Off the Vine, Kaitlyn sits down with the internet’s favorite poet — the woman whose words somehow manage to read our minds — Josie Balka.They unpack the unexpected moment her career began with one poem at 30, how everything blew up overnight, and what it was like when Hollywood royalty started using her sounds. Josie opens up about creating her own music, the pressure of writing work that feels like hers, and the mindset shift that made her embrace her “luckiest girl in the world” era.She also gets beautifully vulnerable — diving into the love stories behind her second book Loves of Our Lives, the friendships that shaped some of her most emotional pieces, the cosmetic surgeries she chose entirely for herself, and her hilariously relatable take on being a “pessimistic optimist,” aka constantly worrying every good thing might be the last good thing.It’s girl talk, real talk, and everything in between. Enjoy!If you’re LOVING this podcast, please follow and leave a rating and review below! PLUS, FOLLOW OUR PODCAST INSTAGRAM HERE!Thank you to our Sponsors! Check out these deals!Bombas: Head over to Bombas.com/vine and use code vine for 20% off your first purchase.Aura Frames: For a limited time, visit AuraFrames.com/vine and get $35 off Aura’s best-selling Carver Mat frames - named #1 by Wirecutter - by using promo code VINE at checkout.Chewy: Every pet deserves a wish come true. Send your pet’s wish to Chewy.com/ChewyClaus and it might become a reality. Plus, your wish means Chewy will donate 5 meals to pets in need.Quince: Go to Quince.com/vine for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada, too!Better Help: Off the vine listeners get 10% off at BetterHelp.com/VINE.Pura: Right now, when you subscribe to two scents for 12 months you get the Pura 4 for free. Don’t wait—this limited-time offer won’t last. Try it risk-free for 30 days now at pura.comEPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: (07:36) How it all began: Josie shares the story of turning 30, writing one poem on a whim, and waking up to her life completely changed after it went viral.(21:49) The “luckiest girl in the world” mindset: how shifting her perspective transformed her confidence, creativity, and career.(35:38) Josie reads a poem from her new book Loves of Our Lives.(40:01) Josie gets real about the cosmetic surgery she’s had, why she chose it, and how she approaches transparency with her audience.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Now don't wait because this is a limited time offer and it won't last. Try it risk free for 30 days now at pura.com. You're listening to Off the Vine with Caitlin Bristow. Hey, Vinoes, real quick, if you are listening right now, which obviously you are or you wouldn't be hearing this, can you hit the subscribe or follow button on whatever platform you're on? Please, that one simple thing helps more than you even realize it allows me to keep growing on this podcast and making these episodes the best they can possibly be obviously for you. That's the only favorite I'm going to ever ask, okay?

It truly means the world to me. Thank you. Now let's get into it. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Off the Vine. I'm your host, Caitlin Bristow. We have Josie Balca in the house, and it's so fun to be in Alberta with a prairie girl talking about all things, plastic surgery. What else do we talk about? Being the luckiest girl in the world. Being the luckiest girl in the world. I'm blacking out on everything we talked about. Zootopia. Oh, yeah. We did a couple conspiracy theories.

But overall, I don't even think that's what it is. Zoology? No. Zucology. Zucology. Is that what it was? I don't know. Okay. We'll find out soon because I'm going to watch us back just to hear about it. Anyways, it was just like a good fun girl chat.

And I even got her to read one of her poems on the air. On the air? On my podcast. We're on the air. I'm brain dead right now. I got to go. Okay, before we started recording, we were talking about just like flying because you have a bit of a fear of flying. Such a bad fear.

Okay. Like, it'll cripple you. You'll still go to Mexico. Yeah, but I like look up recent plane issues on Google. Oh, gosh. That's like I have a headache. I'm going to Google what's wrong with me. It's almost like if one had happened recently that like my chances are all right.

Because it wouldn't happen twice. But you get scared to get in a car drive? No. I know. I know statistically. But I'm terrified. Well, also I feel like the media is trying to scare us right now with flying. 100%.

Which I'm like, why? This morning I got on a TikTok conspiracy theory rabbit hole about certain things, which I'm going to get to. But to me, flying, I'm just like, I. have flown, I don't even know how many times, like, I am a million mileer with Delta. Yeah, that's crazy. I am, like, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, it feels, yes, yeah, it feels like it. It's very shocking when I'm home for two weeks.

Okay. Crazy. That's hard. There's just nothing that phases me anymore, except, and we were talking about this off camera, the people flying. Yeah. Because, uh, the plane could be like, like, like dropping up and down with turbulence. And I just know, I'm like, well, the air must be crazy.

they're like I don't know yeah and I watch the I'm sure the flight attendants are trained to stay calm but I watch them and they are not they're just scrolling on no matter what yes people always say that they'll be panicking if but some flight attendants have like this really uneasy look on their face sometimes well that's because of the people yeah very likely honestly so which brings me into maybe my next point of the conspiracy theory that I went now I can't remember what it's called it's like not zoology scientology no no I just just went through a rabbit hole of Scientology, people. Let me pull up my TikTok and see.

Because you know how people will do a TikTok and they go, what's the craziest conspiracy theory that you've ever heard? And they're like, not like we didn't land on the moon. Like, I don't want to sleep tonight kind of conspiracy theory. I love those. I read all of them. Same. Okay, it's called zucosis.

Okay. I'm just going to play this video so everyone can get on the same page of what this is. What if humans went insane in 2020, the same way animals go crazy and when they're locked into cages. This is called the Sukosis theory and it said that in 2020, we all went crazy because we were all trapped inside our home. The belief that during lockdown, humanity went insane. We broke. Zucosis is a real condition that happens to animals when they're trapped, overstimulated, you know, trapped in a cage. They start pacing, rocking back and forth, trying to comfort themselves while they're kept in captivity. Now, for humans, this is a little different for us.

Stuck indoors, watching screens for hours, just so. to feel something. We stopped touching, stop talking, stopped being humans. And when our world was open again, everything was off. People were still angry, paranoid, and completely disconnected from everyone else. People say that 2020 wasn't just a pandemic, but it was the moment that humans, something happened to our mind. The background music is not helping. Because many people swear that in 2020, something shifted and the rest of the years completely fell off. I actually don't really remember 2023. I don't remember at all. I don't remember 2021 to 2023.

I don't know if it's just getting older or if like those years have actually, I said this at work the other day to one of my coworkers. I was like, 2024 feels like it didn't happen. Right? Zucosis. Oh my God. Jason, how old are you?

22. Do you feel like times going faster than usual? Yes, it does. Okay. Since like, yeah, 2020, such a blur to me. Okay, see? So it's not. Oh, my God.

Zucosis. It's zucosis. I think the world is shifting fast. I think time's going faster and I think something happened in 2020 and but that's I've never seen I mean the internet so divided human beings I just completely no it's actually crazy yeah no I totally think that well I just feel like the internet is such a place where I'm like I have no hope but enter Josie I feel like every in the world should follow you. Oh, my God. No, I'm dead serious.

I think every single person, if you have Instagram, you must follow you. That's the nicest thing anyone's ever said to me. That's so sweet. Is that the first time you've heard that? Yeah. Oh, I truly, I truly mean, I mean, your account's obviously blown up, but I just can't, the words that you speak, it changes a program in my brain and it makes me live a better life.

It brings you back from zucosis? It brings me, what, when I'm on your page, I'm like, what zucosis? It's, it reminds, it just puts me back in my place and it grounds me and there's something about your voice that's special too and just your delivery and what, how did you start doing this? It was super random. It's like a whole string of events, but I moved into my now husband's house and there was like this, we were dating at the time. And there was like this empty bedroom closet in the basement that was a walking closet and

I wanted to make some extra money on the side. So I like patted it all up and I got a microphone and I was going to do voiceover work. right because that's what you did yeah so I'm because I'm a radio host so I was going to do voiceover work and like there's a website called voices dot com it's actually really cool you go on and you get an account and you pay like $500 a year yeah and then it shoots you out auditions every single day and you just audition for like literally you could do a hundred in a day if you want and then they'll like choose a voice and then you get paid obviously if they pick you is it good money it can be wow it can be there's actually a lot of people on there right now looking for AI voices which will pay you like not enough to give up your voice but maybe depending on if you're you care or not like 20 or 30 grand just have your voice holy yeah it's pretty crazy but I didn't do that because that scares me yeah but I was doing that and then I also was like writing just for fun on the side forever like always so you've just since you were I always say out of the womb since you were out of the womb like you like always okay writing even I would get these like little recorder you know those little white recorders are like the colorful buttons and like the microphone that was stuck in the

side yes yeah so I would like make up songs and like I had that and I used to pretend I was a radio Yes, it's a thing. You can record on the tapes and listen back, yeah. So I used to do all that kind of stuff. But when I was turning 30, which was like a few years ago now, I had like an existential crisis. I was like, oh my God, I'm turning 30. So I wrote this little poem about turning 30 and I posted it and it like kind of people

watched it. And I was like, oh, so as soon as that worked, I was like, I'll do another one. And then I started to just very quickly shift out of my voiceover work in that studio and started basically doing only poetry from there. And it just like happened. so fast. Like, you know how we were just saying we scroll our own content and think we're wonderful? Yeah. Do you, and did you know how wonderful your poetry was? Like, were you, did you believe in yourself in that way? Or was it shocking that people resonated? I don't think I do

still even. What? And it's always the, and you probably have this happen with content too. It's always stuff that you think is like just okay. The people love. And then the stuff that you think is amazing. People are like, I don't really resonate with that. 100%. But that's kind of, it's, it always trips me up because the stuff that I think is so good a lot of people are like and the stuff that I think is just okay so it's kind of hard to come around and believe in it interesting but when you do when you do see people like people are using your voiceovers for so many reals it's really cool like I'll see big celebrities like who's the biggest celebrity that has used your real sound you are one of them um oh god I saw somebody where I was like Drew Barrymore

Drew Barrymore and Jennifer Anderson are probably the two biggest ones Jennifer Aniston used... Yeah, the dog one. They both use the dog one. Yes, yes, yes. Do you know that... I think I told you this the other night, I can't remember because I'd had a couple more trainees, but...

I can't get through it. I haven't been able to watch the full dog ones yet. The dog one, our dog is like not on a great road right now. So I can't even do those ones either. Oh, my gosh. If I see it has anything to do with a dog, I'm like, I can't, I can't. No, I know it. It always freaks me out.

But also, I think a lot of that has to do it as the music. Like, that's why I love using that, like, cinematic orchestra to build a home. But then you get, like, dinged if you get caught for using other people's music. Oh. So what I do is I, like, have a keyboard set up, plug into the computer, like a piano. Yeah. And I, like, do the music myself. So I, like, I, like, score my own poem.

So, like, I'll record the voice and then I'll, like, plug the piano in and be like. No, uh. So you're also creating music? Yeah. You, okay, so when you see the black and gold dress or the black and, but, What color do you see when it's the... Oh, my God. Somebody, I mean, editors, you should put up a picture of this, the blue and black dress.

I need to look at it again. I was doing this with Bree's little boys the other night. And we all saw different colors. And Seb, Breeze, little boy, could not believe that our brains could see different things. I don't remember what I saw. And it was so cute to watch his little brain just be like, what? What color do you see? Blue and gold.

Yeah. Oh, gold? Wait. You see blue and gold? Yeah. I see blue and black. No, it's blue and gold. I don't see any black on that.

All of that is black. No, that's all gold. It's like bright. It's like bright. Look, what color is that dress? I'm seeing blue and black. I don't see any black on there. Well, there's that other theory that colors look different to everybody.

Like that nobody sees the same, like, shade of red. Yeah. But I don't know if that's true. Okay. Okay. I'm one more test for you. Okay. What color is this shoe? Pink. Yes. Okay. Which makes sense because that is your creative side of the brain. What color do you see, Jason? Yeah, I see pink. Okay. A lot of people see, like, Bree saw mint green. What? Yeah. And one of her other kids saw mint green. But what they're saying is if you see, some people see white and gold on the dress, and that means you use the left side of your brain, which is the more logical part of your brain. And if you, you see blue, you use your more right side dominant with your brain, which is more creative. Interesting. I'm definitely not logical or smart. I mean, like, I'm not, like, I'm not, like, I'm not like math or science. No, I could never. I could never. No. And you're creative, but that makes

sense of what you see. Isn't that crazy? That is so weird. Yeah. It trips me out. It trips me out so much when I'm, I don't know. And then there's like other ones. We just got into it last night because it was so fun for the kids to like, so funny. Do that. But yeah, it's, you clearly have this creative brain. I didn't know you also create your own music. That's like it really matters when you, I mean, that conspiracy video that we just watch with the, it freaks me out because the music in the background. No, I know. The music adds so much to it. Like without music. I've never tried without music and I don't know if I ever would. But you do music, right? Like you sing and do that. Like that was my initial kind of like stick. Like I posted songs all the time. So like I have like one. This is so dope. Don't go find it. But I have like one song on Spotify that I did that forever ago. And now I like want to take it down. Because I feel like a lot of people go on Spotify to look for, like, my sounds, but they're not on there, but only that one song. Could you put your sounds on Spotify? I could, but then in my audiobooks, I feel like there's like a contradiction of whatever. Got it.

Yeah. I feel like poetry or just sharing such personal thoughts feels to me so vulnerable, but I enjoy being vulnerable for the most part. Well, the one thing that you worry about the most, I don't know if you ever deal with this with kind of posting online, you worry about what other people are going to think about you. Yeah, of course. And I love writing about, like, things I've been through. like nothing hurts you more than and nothing's more memorable than people that you were with that didn't work out. So like all those people that you dated that like hurt you or didn't choose you or whatever, like those stick to me. The relationship that ended with like, oh, I'll probably always love you a little like, have a great life.

We're in on good terms. Those don't like sting you. Yeah, no. But the other ones too. So I write about that because those are the feelings that have stuck with me. Yeah. But I've kind of been dealing with just a bit of like, I guess writer's block, I guess because I just got married. So being like, it's like Taylor's.

I hate you and I. I can't believe you did that to me, but also, like, I love my husband. So it's, like, a weird thing that I'm kind of worried lately to get judged about. Interesting. I'm trying to, like, kind of wipe that away and just be like, who cares? No one's looking at my algorithm in a way that they're like, didn't she just get married? Yeah. No.

And this is, I say this all the time when I interview musicians. It's kind of the same thing when, you know, the heartbreak songs and the ones that cut you deeper, the ones that do the best. Yeah, the relatable ones. But everyone still makes the music and you can still write about things. You can do whatever you. You know the song Where the Wild Things are by Luke Holmes? Yes.

He doesn't even have a brother. Yeah. Like, I was so disappointed. I wasn't disappointed because I'm like having nobody died. But I was like, what? It was just all fake. A lot of artists have people that write songs for them and then they'll pitch the songs to them. This is all your own words.

So I get that that's a bit. It's a little scarier. Yeah. Sometimes Steve will be like, that's my husband. He'll be like, what? What I do? You're okay? But that's, like, Taylor Swift, there are so many songs she writes where I'm, like,

Like, the one that I always reference is when she sings, how do we end up on the floor? So anyway, I'm maroon? Yes. And then she goes, your roommate's cheap-ass screw top rosé. Yeah. She's not dating guys who have roommates. No, I know. She's not dating, or she's not drinking cheap rosé.

No, I know. Things like that. You're like, when did that happen? But also. But she's a businesswoman. She knows how to relate to people. Or she was messing around with shitty guys. Maybe it was from her 18-year-old times.

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, it's like the people, you can pull from things that don't have to be the present moment right now. But I get that you must have times of writers block because that is what you do. So much. Leading up to planning our wedding, I was just a disaster. Like I was so much work that I like couldn't think of anything else. So sometimes I'll just sit there and be like, oh my God.

Like what do I? So I'll put out like a thing on Instagram that's like, what do you guys want to hear about? Yeah. But I also get a lot of requests very frequently for things that I haven't been through. And I have to write about the things that I've been through, even though it's not happening right now. But I always struggle because I worry that if I post things, my friends are going to, I get a lot of them being like, write about never feeling like anybody loves you as much as you love them, like in your friend group. And I'm like, I don't want to write about that because I'm scared that my friends are going to see it and be like, what is she talking about? So you will only write things that you personally have felt.

Yeah. Dang. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So writer's block is even more real. for you. I probably should expand on that. Would you ever? I could. I know other girls who do like poetry stuff online and I hear them right about like things that they I know they haven't been through but they're like they get requests and I could try but I feel like it's not like it's hard to relate to something you haven't done. My favorite month is here and it's December

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save on the perfect gift by visitingoraframes.com to get $35 off or is best-selling Carver Matt Frames. Name number one by wirecutter by using promo code Vine at checkout. That's A-U-R-A-Frames.com promo code Vine. This deal is exclusive to listeners and frames sell out fast. I know this. Somebody actually told me that. So order yours now and get it in time for the holidays. Support the show by mentioning us at checkout. Terms and conditions apply. It's so interesting how you can articulate feelings the way that you do because I can feel so deeply, but I cannot express how I'm feeling a lot of times. I can never put it into words or really capture how I'm feeling, but it always helps

when I go into a writing room with other writers. If I'm writing music, I go, oh, it's all just coming out. Yeah, because it can kind of pull it out of you. going, it's like an idea spiral, right? Like one person says one thing, and that's all it takes sometimes. Yeah, but you must feel a little pressure to make it relatable. Yes, totally. And then there's also times when you're worried that something you really relate to,

you're going to put it out there. And then everyone else, like, I have a couple like half notes in my notes up right now. And I'm like, I don't even know how to put this out there to make it make sense and be relatable, but not be offensive. You know what I mean? Like things like that. I don't know. It just freaks me out.

Struggle of my life all the time. I'm like, am I being offensive right now? I know. It's so hard to know. Everybody's so judgmental and they want to, like, build you up and tear you down. So that's, I always ask people if, because there's people out there that it will shake me to my core if you personally have people that don't like what you do. Oh, I know. Do you? Do I have people that don't like what I do?

Definitely. There's people who comment, like, but it's always a troll person that doesn't follow you or whatever. Yeah, yeah. But I'm just looking for attention. A lot of the time, too, there's people who will misconstrue what you've said. Oh. Like the other day I posted about how I'm just like really happy right now and I feel like I finally found my place and someone commented being like, wow, she gets married and finally

she found her place. Like I thought we were past that narrative. And I was like, oh, I think you misunderstood. And that's my new thing that I'm going to start saying to people. I think you misunderstood and that's okay. Yeah. Like you can just, you can be, you can misunderstand. Yeah.

Yeah. That's okay. You know. Oh, I like that. So you're in, you're in, I always call it like the seasons. You're in a very happy season right now. Yeah. We were talking about this the other night.

with just how some people feel like they need to get married or they feel like, oh, no, is this the right thing to do? Or are they, like, my gut when I was like, yes. Yes? Oh, God. Is it? Am I supposed to feel this? But you just, this is your person.

Yes, it's my person. I'm, like, very much, I've always had very dramatic, like, been really interested in people who, like, aren't that interested in me. I always really wanted to, like, have to beg for it, essentially. to be like oh come on just give me a chance like so it was really weird to kind of come to the conclusion that like no matter what I do this guy is not going to stop loving me yeah so and I don't really have to ever ask so there have been little bouts of time where I've been like it's too good to be true and he always used to say like that was cute before but like now we've got to let that go yeah so like as we were like planning our wedding you just kind of get more and more obviously sure of everything yeah but yeah no I'm definitely happy with the guy. What do you think contributes to this happy season of your life? Of course him. That and I was telling you a little bit about this other night, but I was thinking, I was like, we're going to repeat a lot that we probably said the other night, but yeah. But it's, I've tried to adopt this mindset of being the

luckiest girl in the world. Okay. Yes, yes. Yes. I love this thing. Yeah. And in 2023, I saw a TikTok. Everything's from TikTok, but I saw a TikTok that was like, just say to yourself, no matter what, I'm the luckiest girl in the world and only good things happen to me. And I was at a work Christmas party in like January and there was a raffle and I was like guys I'm the lucky screen in the world only good things happen to me I'm going to win this best buy gift card and they did the raffle pull my name out and me and Steve were like that he's my husband he's there he was there that night he's like interesting and I was like I was pretty crazy yeah and then that same year we got invited to do like a really cool brand trip on something that I've never been

like done anything like that before and then in October of that year I started posting my poetry, which now that I'm actually putting this in my head, I think October 23rd, 2023 was the first day that I ever posted a poem online. And I think, well, and then we got married October 25th years later. So it's kind of like, I guess October is a good month. But I just adopted this happiest or luckiest girl in the mind mindset. Likeest girl in the world mindset. And it's been this crazy thing where if you believe everything's happening for you, it makes everything feel right. Do you know that there's an October theory? There is. Yes. What is it? It's like when big shifts of good

things happen. No, it's good. Who did this the other day? And they said, go back into your camera roll and look at every October of the last five, I've goosebumps of the last five years. And you'll see that that was a moment where you're like, oh, beautiful things just happened. It just changed everything. It was when I went on The Bachelor. It was certain, I went back into my, all my October and I was like, really? Oh my God. That's when I was on dancing with the stars. That's like, yes, I'm going to try and find October. I want to know. Yeah. I think back to like all the October because that was the first October was the first time that anything ever like really made moves for me online.

Like aside from like a few random viral videos like about completely different things before that. Yeah. Got married this October. Last October. I don't know what I was doing but probably something cool. Yeah. Go look at your camera.

Can I have a look? Yes. I'll read the October theory while you get your phone. Okay. So October theory is a viral trend and mindset that views October as a second new year and a time for a mid-year reset and final push to achieve goals before the year. ends and it's like a time where like things finally happen October 2024 where I was like watch it's like the worst month of my life either like getting married or leaving unhealthy situations like something that

changes the trajectory of your life in a positive way that's so interesting everybody grab your phone right now and look through your octobers I hope nobody like debunks with you I hope everybody's like you're you're brilliant Caitlin everyone's had such transformative octobers I want everybody to go look because it really is a whole thing All right. Good to know. I don't know. TikTok has, it's a beautiful thing and a scary thing because it's taught me so much and it's

opened my brain in so many different ways and my heart. And then other times I'm like, uh-oh, I'm on the wrong side. No, it's so good until you're there. Like, sometimes it can be so overwhelmed. Like, you'll just be living your day. And then someone will pop up and be like, have you had 130 grams of protein today? And you're like, oh, God. Yeah.

Yeah. And they're like, I'm not. And if you have, I hope you. Yeah. I hope it wasn't eggs because eggs are now on. Oh, yeah. Here's the reason that what you're doing every day is absolutely not what you should be doing. I learned that same thing, the Lucky Girl Syndrome, the Burt Toast Theory, all things that can

shift your brain into having this more positive outlook. And then we're all vibrations and energy. And so as soon as you're aligned, everything just starts, like, happening for you. You listen to The Secret or read The Secreter and watched. Eight million times. I just listened over the first time. Did? Yeah.

So that was, like, I did all that, the Luckyst Girl thing before. And now I've been listening to The Secret. Like, I just finished the audiobook. book oh and like the whole like thoughts because there's certain things in it that I'm like yeah well it's so dated it's so dated yeah but like the thoughts become things and there's one thing that like really resonated with me I don't remember what it was but it was in the kind of near the end of the book but the worst thing that can happen living that way is that like you think everything's meant for you and it's actually not but you'll ever find that out you know I know well

it's so crazy so I think I've told this I'm sorry if I'm repeating a story but it was so long ago my mom was actually going on her first date with my now stepdad who I just love and adore and so this would have been oh my gosh like almost 20 years ago maybe like I think I was 21 years old I am in Ladoek where I grew up and I'm visiting my mom she goes on this date I get a phone call from my best friend in Vancouver Shana and she goes I didn't answer and she texted me and she goes you really need to call me back and she calls me and the guy that I was with had been in a really bad accident snowboarding. He went to do a backflip. He was a really good snowboarder. He went to do a backflip and there was a kid crossing and he panicked in the air and he landed on his head.

Oh my God. He was in an induced coma. Enduced coma. Yeah. Air lifted, taken to the hospital. He was on life support. Holy. And I couldn't find out. I couldn't figure out why he wasn't texting me back and I just got sick to my stomach and my mom had just bought the DVD the secret because she was feeling very lonely and sad and wanted some hope and so I was the only flight was the next day to get there and my mom was like do you want me to come home and I was like no just I'm going to watch this DVD and like get into it and I was just like sick I think I think I was like in the bathroom like trying not to throw up I was so scared yeah of course and then I watched the secret and I started that's when my whole like manifestation journey started because I went I am going to do this I'm going

he is going to be fine and I started telling myself all these things and I started imagining him just waking up and being totally fine and I ended up flying back to Vancouver I got into the hotel the hospital room he literally woke up and he had like tubes in his nose and his brother was there and he looked at his brother and he said do have something in my nose and he was totally fine are you serious yep that is crazy and when things like that happen even if by some chance it wasn't your positive thinking yeah who cares if you get to move forward feeling like it was like It's so powerful to just sit there and believe that everything's going to go right. And if everything goes wrong, at least you didn't spend the time leading up to it going wrong,

thinking that it was going to go wrong, because then it's like a double negative. I'm really working on this. I am quite negative, but I just remember the part that it really resonated with me. And it's how much you really believe yourself when you say I am, but it's negative. Like, I am tired or I am grumpy or I am ugly or I am whatever. You like give that so much weight. and very infrequently are we like I am smart and I am funny

and I am wide awake today and I am full of energy because if you start saying things out loud you do start to believe them but it's so rare for us to like lean positive with an I am. Well I went even as far as to say like when people now when something's so funny

they say I'm dead I go don't say that I am alive and I'm going to start saying that and I'm going to start saying that and said like with something so funny I'm going to be like I'm alive I do believe how powerful the words are. No, I've seen it change my life. I'm still working on it and I'm still a pretty negative.

But I'm negative too. But I catch myself now and I flip it and I just notice these. Like even Pino, my dog being having heart disease now, I just go, oh, well, the world's just going to have to adjust because he's the healthiest dog in the world. No, you have to, you have to put it like that. And I always say that about our dog too. It's harder. Like it's Steve's dog.

It's our dog. Yeah, but he's, like, nine, and he's big, big boy. He's a Bernie's not a dog. He's really slowing down. Oh, nine, it's good. Yeah, he's lived quite a long life so far, but, like, he's really slowing down. And I'm always like, he's fine, he's fine, he's fine, but there's only so much. You can say that without annoying someone, like, Steve's like, okay, can we just actually have a real conversation about what's happening here?

And I'm like, no, there's nothing to talk about. That's what I said, he's going to live forever. I said, I said to Pino, I said, that's interesting that you have heart disease because you don't. Yeah. And the universe is just going to have to adjust because. The scan was wrong. Yeah, the scan is. wrong, I'll put you on this heart med, but you're also going to be getting acupuncture, more love

than ever, and you're going to be the longest living golden to have heart disease, so, okay. I feel like everybody's usually on board with this sentiment, but the holidays are just truly my favorite, and maybe it's because of my dogs. Romney Pino make this time of year just so much brighter. I like put them in little Santa hats. I have my friend over at Perky Prince making Christmas ornaments and mugs for me with their faces on it, sweaters, everything. But that's also why I'm joining Chewy Claws, who's out here making pet wishes come true. So from now through December 24th, you can share your pet's wish list at chewy.com slash Chewy Clause, and it could actually happen. Every wish submitted also triggers five meals donated to shelters and rescues

across the country. And if you submit your wish through the Chewy app, they're going to double the donation. Double the donation. So your pet's little wish spreads joy to other animals who really need it shelters and rescues can join in too submitting their own wish list so their communities can donate directly it's all about spreading joy one little paw at a time i'm submitting mine as well as we speak every pet deserves a wish come true so send your pets wish to chewy.com slash chewy claws and it might become a reality plus your wish means chewy we will donate five meals to pets in need okay no one you find something just so good so good so good that you just want to tell us everyone about it. That's how I feel about Quince. Probably why I bring it up on the podcast all the time.

I am loving their bamboo jersey, long sleeve pajama set. It's so soft. It's insanely soft. Perfect for cozy nights in. And if you want something a little more statement, I do really recommend their 100% leather oversized bomber jacket. So gorgeous. It fits so well and it feels like it'll last forever. And you can throw it over anything and make it look chic. And what I love about Quince the most is that every piece feels so premium. Without that crazy price tag, the details, the stitching, the fit, the drape, they actually matter. Now, I've been grabbing a few things for myself, but I also love giving their pieces as gifts. So from everyday denim to silk tops or even just cozy pajamas, there's something for everyone.

And they even have options for home, bath, kitchens, or travel, perfect for if you want a gift that they'll actually use. So find gifts so good, you'll want to keep them with quince. Go to quince.com slash vine for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, now available in Canada too. That's quince.com slash fine to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com slash fine. Moving on, I want to talk about your second book coming out. Yeah. I have both. I have your first one. I think we sent you the second one. I don't think I've got it yet. Or maybe it's out my house where it's in a box somewhere at your house. Yeah, I do that. I leave all my boxes and then I open them all at once. Yes. After like a month of

accumulation. Exactly what I do. That might be working. it is. That is exactly what I do. But tell me all about it. I'm really excited about it. It happened really quick. I wrote it like my first book came out in May. Yeah. And I signed for this book before that book came out. So it's two books in one year, which is crazy. Crazy. And I actually wrote it while I was recovering from a plastic surgery. Because I had to have my arms elevated like this. So I had my laptop on my big pillow and I was just like, but that was most of it got written while I was recovering from that. Wow. But the concept, I love love. Like I've always loved it even when it was hard and bad.

So the concept is like all the different types of love you find in your life, they have a chapter. So it's called Loves of Our Lives, and there's romantic, toxic, friendship, lost, family, and self. And the six chapters of all the love that you might have come across. And then so each of the types of love is like in one chapter. So if you're looking for a poem maybe like about your partner, you would go to romantic love, your friends, you go to friendship love so that you know where everything is.

And you could like send a picture of it to your friend. Yeah, exactly. So I like that it's all separated out. And it's pink and red, which I also really like. Wait, that's so cute. I feel like it's perfect for just flipping open to any page too, which I love those books because obviously I love the books that are like Colleen Hoover books and Creed of Fat and Books. And then I love having a book on my coffee table that you can just flip to any page and be like,

well, Tarkas, when you're reading those books often like one line will stick out and you'll want to like underline it or highlight it or do whatever in your book reader. but then you just never go back to it so I like having a book that's like we make them hardcover so that they can be left out that's kind of the point and then hopefully whatever page you flip to you can resonate with at some point

yeah that's so sweet is there a poem in the book or something that you were hesitant to share or do you ever have moments of being like ooh I don't know if I should share that one yeah I think there's like a little bit in each chapter probably not romantic because I feel like that's just kind of

is what it is yeah there's one that's kind of like leans into like infidelity which I don't love that I was ever a part of but that's just life people do things so like there's one that I'm kind of like uh sure why not you know and the self-love ones I get a little nervous about too and I didn't really realize it because when I'm alone and I'm writing and I'm sending it off to like an editor and they have my manuscript it doesn't really feel like much but I went to record the audiobook and as I was reading the ones about like self-love and body image and like the way that you see yourself and what you order at restaurants and like

the scale on your bathroom floor and all that I'm like oh god this is so like I'm just reading it to this guy that's recording me and I'm like anyway now you know what I'm dealing with on a regular basis so those ones are kind of always a little bit vulnerable yeah yeah do you have your book here no but I have the manuscript in my phone oh can you read us one okay like why don't you like say a random page there's like 180 pages or something so why don't you say okay let's do 111 oh okay oh it's a friendship one okay okay okay ready yep yep this is going to be my first poem ever without music um i'll like make something about i want to marry my best friend you say at dinner to the people at the table as you dream

about the great love story that you'll start eventually but haven't found the beginning of yet you talk to one another about it all the time how you want to feel when you finally find it you want it to feel easy and comfortable exciting and safe you say you can't wait to feel that way you say you want it to feel like you're marrying your best friend how easy to overlook that you only know what it feels like to love that way because it's the way you already love and are loved by your friends you're looking for a love that's reminiscent of what you already have searching high and low like you don't already have it yeah wait that's beautiful thank you yeah i like my friends a lot i'm big on girlhood me too yeah me too because i think that and i think that's why my cup is so full

and like i'm not saying i'm not dating i'm just saying like i have such good people in my life who fill my cup and i have so much love in my life i have gotten to a place place where I'm like, oh, I don't need to go looking for it because I have so much of it. And there's also so much excitement about, I don't know, like, there's a lot of fun in being alone. And it's, like, you can take advantage of it in so many ways. And I have a girlfriend who just got divorced and I'm telling her, I'm like, stop filling up so much of your time. Yeah. Stay home. Yeah. Order your favorite food. Be alone. Have a bath. Put on music. Clean your house. Like, do your thing alone. Yeah.

Because, like, some of my favorite memories are, like, having no one and nothing. And just, like, going to pick up pizza for my favorite place and, like, opening a bottle of wine and just being in my apartment. Yeah. When I, like, it was exactly how I wanted it. Nobody else got to decorate it for me. And you can be, like, gross and, like, not care about what people are thinking about you want. Yeah. It's, like, it's great.

I think it's a very transformative time. You get to become exactly who you want to be when you're alone. And then, like, everything else kind of falls around that. I'm on year two of living alone, and I love every second of it. It's so fun. As I just literally just have a husband now for two weeks. I'm like, I miss living alone. Well, you look back and you enjoy that time of your life and you see how empowering it is.

It truly is. That's another one that I have in here. It's called like, they don't have titles, but it's like you made me a lover girl again. It talks about how like excited I am to be with somebody and how I love like happy songs again and like blah, blah. But then it kind of like leans into all the things that I did to kind of make myself that way when I was alone. and then it's like oh wait maybe you didn't do that maybe I did that and then I met you yeah and that made me able to love you like this because I spent enough time I think figuring it out and I just yeah I think it's really important that's I was just in such a masculine

era for my last few years that I've been like which is empowering and I loved it and I'm like finally turning a corner into like a soft feminine version of myself it's so nice when you can do that though I never thought I would I was like nope I'll live here forever this is that I And I'm kind of like, oh, the only thing I'll never give up is I like to drive. I love me and the one who drives. I do too. But aside from that, it's so nice to just have somebody who you're like, can you fill out my water bottle? Can you make me a tea before I go to bed?

Like, it's just great. I never thought I would be like that. No. Because I, even when somebody wants to help me or like do something, I'm like, no. Like I would. So much faster and more efficient. If you just let me do this myself. You were saying that you were, because when you were writing your book, also can people just get your book?

Is there like a website or where can they, anywhere you find books? If this goes up after December 9th, it's available. Okay. Everywhere. Okay. So like Indigo, Barnes & Noble, Amazon, any, like, a lot of, like, little local bookstores, like, Zippies in L.A. We'll have it, like that kind of stuff.

That's cool. Yeah. I love little bookstores. I know me too. You said you had your arms like this because you had gotten a plastic surgery done. Let's talk about it. Okay. It's my favorite thing to talk about.

Is it? Yeah, I love it. Okay, tell me what you did. I just find it so empowering that things exist. that you could literally do whatever you want. And I think that there's never anything that requires any kind of change unless you want it to change. Right.

So I would never go to somebody who has the same thing that I had. Like you wouldn't come to me. I've hooded eyes and be like, you got to get that surgery. Right. You chose that for you. I chose certain things for me and I would never push them on anyone. But if anybody decided that's what they wanted to do, I would empower them to do it. Totally.

Yes. That's why I love it. But I had like a big weight loss. I lost over 100 pounds. And in 2019, so like six years ago, seven years ago, I got like a tummy tuck and a lower backlift. So it was like a full circumferential 360 scar. Yeah. I actually almost died from that surgery.

I like got sepsis. That's crazy. It was. And I said I would never do it again. But then I lived. And I was really happy with the results. I love what came of it for me. That was really super scary.

And obviously, it made me in the moment be like, did I almost die? What is that? Sorry. Just so people know, sepsis. It's a blood infection. So it's like, I just got like a really high fever and was like, it was tough. Can it just happen to anyone or did something specific? Did you not clean something properly? I don't know what it was like because they tell you to shower right away.

But I guess maybe water got into the wrong place or something. But basically I just had like a big blood infection and I went back to the hospital. I'd stay the hospital for like a month. Holy shit. It was super scary. And I was like obviously regretting it in the moment. But after I came out of it, I was like, okay, that's really rare. Yeah.

And really scary. and obviously doing something cosmetic and then almost dying from it is terrifying. I can't imagine. Like, you know? But I ended up six years later going in and doing the same thing on my arms. So it's called a brachialoplasty

and it's excess skin removal. So the scar goes from here to like mid armpit. And it was so painful. It was way more painful than I ever thought. Really? But I would do it again. How long is the recovery process in that? It's like six weeks of wearing an undergarment

that is like compression. Yeah. And then still to the day, I'm getting like flare out pain in my like lower arm. It's, it takes a while for your nerves to like regenerate and stuff. But I just found that that it's been worth it so far. Was there a reason that you, like did you start a weight loss journey or were you like told something bad was going to happen if you didn't lose weight or what made you start your

journey? No, I was young and my, it's kind of like it's going to sound like bullying, but I don't think it. Now that I'm older, I don't think it is. Okay. And I'm still friends with these people. Okay. But like I had gained a lot of weight.

Like I was 18 years old. and like above 300 pounds, which depends on who you are. But for me, I was like sweaty at the mall. I couldn't get up a flight of stairs without, like I never was active. I was not flexible. I'm still not flexible. But like it was bad.

And my friends kind of came to me because you were 18, 19 years old and they were like, we think that this is something that's going to like become a bigger thing. Like a serious problem. Is that devastating for you to hear in the moment? I was so mad at them. I was like, what the hell? You guys are not my friends. Right.

And then like a week after I stopped feeling bad for myself and I was like, okay, maybe I should. And it literally just started there. Wow. And I like joined Weight Watchers and like did a whole thing with that. And it was, I'll never regret learning how to be healthy ever, like learning about nutrition, learning how to move my body. Because now I just do it on my own. Yeah, like you're a Pilates girl, aren't you? I used to do that a little bit.

But right now I'm just more of like a gym like slash hit class person. But yeah. That's good for you. Yeah. Because that would be really hard to hear, I feel like. and really hard to start. Yeah. But that's, so you're now still friends with these same people and you're grateful that

they came to you and said something. So grateful. And it just obviously meant in the moment hurting feelings. And I don't know if I would have ever said anything to anybody like that. Yeah. But you also had plastic surgery. Yeah. Are you like so happy you did it?

I'm obsessed. Yeah. I'm obsessed. I know. I mean, I did a lot of research too because one of my fears is getting breast implant illness. And I know that is such a real thing. and a lot of people talk about it online,

and that is obviously a very big fear of mine. This was just more of like a, I'm going to do this for myself. I've never, I had never thought about getting boobs done. Never. I was like, no, I love my small boobs that they're like so chic. I loved it. I always wore like little tops and I just loved it. And then I was like, you know what?

I thought I would get them done maybe after I had a kid or. Once the thought crosses your mind, it's really hard not to think of it. Well, I was like, wow, what a fun 40 birthday present to give to myself. And I'd already done my eyes, which I, absolutely loved it. Oh, did you do your moves after your eyes? Yes. Okay. I didn't even know that. My eyes, that was like the easiest surgery. It was like 20 minutes? Literally. Crazy. I want to do that one so bad. It's, it's truly very easy if you did want to.

It's, yeah. And then I expected this to be easy. It was kind of a tough recovery. They, it's, when you like actually get put under for a while, it's like, even coming back from that. Yeah. It was crazy because I remember, I remember waking up and I was like, one of my biggest fears is throwing up. And so I was like, oh, no, I'm going to throw up. And they, like, got me a bag. And I, like, had to eat some crackers and ginger ale. But I remember just being like, I'm in so much pain and I'm going to throw up. And this is the worst thing. It's deep. Like, the pain you feel is. It was deep. Awful. Yeah. And for the first couple of, it's like the first three or four days are an absolute nightmare. But even the weeks after. Well, and I live by myself. So I got a night nurse.

Yeah, good. Which, thank God. You couldn't have, you need someone. I would, I would probably would have died because I kept thinking I had not taken a like valium or an oxy and I would be like well I better take another one she's like you just took one and everyone wants to know so I might as I'll just say here but now I forget what I got I got 225 cc's I got I got them in your hands first uh-huh I got I showed him a like picture of like make them look like this they have like a picture of someone's boobs yeah okay because I have a playboy magazine in my bathroom because I don't know why I think that's like so she. No, yeah.

And so I was looking there, I was like her boobs. But it's so different because people could take my photo in. Somebody, this is actually crazy. Somebody told me they took in my photo as like an inspiration pick. Yeah. And I was like, but it depends on what your chest cavity is. Like I have space between here. Yeah, like it sits differently.

I got like more of a bottom heavy. I got saline. I got like medium profile. Like there's so many different things to look into. It's crazy when people go and do what you did. like... But I'm like, does your body look exactly like mine?

Yeah, you gotta be careful with what you're asking for there. Yeah. So this girl sends me a message and she goes, oh, I just am like, I took your photo in for inspo and she goes, and then I showed it to the guy that I'm seen and he told me that you're his ex-girlfriend. She goes, do you know Glenn, blah, blah, blah, and I went, I've never heard of that man in my life.

And she was like, he said that you're his ex-girlfriend. And the amount of times I've heard people say that about me like a girl, it's so random that I even saw that DM, but like I'll... I know, like the ones that you'll randomly click into. I'll randomly meet someone and they'll be like, oh, you dated, blah. And I'm like, I've never heard that guy's name. So, Glenn.

So people are just out there telling people that they dated you. Well, you can let him know that I said, I don't know who he is. And I said, send me a photo. Like, maybe I'm missing something and like I worked with him or something. Yeah. Never? Oh, my God. No idea he is.

And he said, yeah, that's my ex-girlfriend. Ew, I dump him immediately. That's crazy to say. I know. I know. That's being open about it. I do like being open about everything that I do because. I just think it's important to say, yeah, this is what I've had done.

And I'm not saying you should do it. But if you want to, like, do your research. My body's different than yours. And I think that the more you talk about anything, the less shame gets attached to it. And I think that everybody, nobody owes anybody anything. But if everybody opened up the conversation about, like, plastic surgery, about Ozempic, like if everybody using these things or doing these things, just said it, it would kind of take the secrecy away and make less people feel bad about what they're choosing for themselves.

And it's, do whatever, do whatever the fuck you want. Do it or the fucking want is the bottom line. Do what you want. It's your body. I get that it is very like a complex confusing like Victoria Brown Garrick. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I get that that's very triggering for her to hear. Oh, I'm using Ozempic and I just lost weight when it's like, but my body doesn't need to look like that.

Like it's, I get that it's so complex for people who have had struggles or mental health issues with it or body dysmorphia or eating disorders. Like I get all of that. I get that that's hard, but I like what Victoria is doing. Talk about it. No, I love her. Like, she's amazing. Yeah. And I, so, like, that's literally one of the poems that I have written in my phone right now.

It's like, because I'm not using any GLP ones because, well, honestly, because I want to have a baby. Yes. And I just don't know. I don't know anything. And also, I don't have PCOS. I don't, so I'm just like, there's probably, I don't know. I just haven't. Plus, I think that can be an addictive drug, too.

Totally. Yeah. And I do not, like, do whatever you want. I don't care if anybody is, but it is triggering to watch people get smaller and smaller. And I have, like, a note in my phone that starts with, everybody's getting smaller, and it feels like the biggest thing to me. Like, I can't get away, because the older you get, the harder it is to, like, lose weight, maintain weight loss, like, all that.

You're, like, living your life. If you travel a lot, if you, like, I've had a crazy year. Like, it's harder to, like, get to the gym every single day and, like, do all those things. So it is, like, totally triggering. but I also think that a lot of the time it's because it's like a secret too. Totally. So you're like, oh, I wonder what happened there?

Like, I just wish that we could all talk about it. Right. And I just, I always say, like, research is the biggest thing. Like, you know, because I think what would scare me about a GLP one is I'm trying to eat more. Yeah. And I think it makes you not eat as much. Makes you, I don't even know how it works. I think it works with your insulin.

Yeah. I'm like, don't ask. Don't listen to anything. But I just think it takes away your appetite a little bit from what I understand. Yeah. I don't know. I, no. Any friends I have on it, sing its praises.

Like, they are like, I would recommend it to anyone. Totally. The same way that I say about last six or two. Right. Exactly. If you've had a good experience, why would you not? But I don't know. It is triggering.

This episode is sponsored by my favorite better help. The holidays are such a special time. I understand that. But they can also get so hectic, emotional or even a little lonely. I'm actually struggling this year with just end of the year. Like, oh my gosh, I owe this money. I owe this money. And people haven't paid me this.

And I'm just stressing about every. thing. Not to mention I like can't be with some family over the holidays. My stepdad is going through his cancer journey and I want to be with them but they can't travel and my sister's coming to me and it's just a lot. And every year I try and create like little traditions that make the season feel meaningful like baking cookies with girlfriends that my grandma used to make. I still have her recipes, perfecting my hot chocolate recipe or even just taking 30 minutes each day to read a book and unwind. So this year I decided to start a new kind of tradition for myself too and that is therapy with Better help. Better help makes it easy to take time for yourself. They match you with fully licensed

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control your scent from anywhere. So you can choose from hundreds of premium fragrances, schedule your favorites, set the perfect mood for every moment. And right now, get yours for free when you subscribe to two cents for 12 months. So don't wait. This is a limited time offer. It won't last. So try it risk-free for 30 days now at Pura.com. We were talking about this at dinner the other night and I want to close with it about the pessimistic optimism. Oh, yeah. How, what did we say good things might? We have to accept that good things might end and that's okay. And that, like, it's really hard to not think that every good thing that happens to you is the very last good thing to ever happen.

And I said this to my husband, I was like, when I was handing in my manuscript for my second book, I was like, well, I can't believe I just wrote my last book. And he was like, why would this be your last book? Yeah. I'm like, well, it's not going to happen again. And he was like, why would it not happen again? Yeah. And it's so true that every time something good happens to me, I'm like, well, that's got to be the last good thing. Yeah, I do it too.

But I'm also trying to do the whole luckiest girl in the world. and every time anything happens, even if it's bad, I'm like, well, that must be meant for me then, you know? But it's so hard to do both. I do the same thing. Like, even just being in the ballroom the other night, I was like, I never thought I would be dancing on this dance floor again. And it was like, another dream got to come true because I won that mirror ball and I went, and now I never get to do this again instead of being like, I did it. Yeah.

Your immediate thought is that something's over rather than something happened. Yeah. And that is always what I deal with. Like, I can't even, like, because that's like dreams coming true for you every time, right? Yes. Yes. And I, there's just so many good, positive things that have happened in my life that I go, oh, God, that means I do for a bad thing.

Yeah. And I'm like, what is it? I was like, well, good things come in threes and three good things happen. So now something really bad has to happen. And then that's going to happen in three years. So like, yeah, my stepdad got diagnosed with stage four cancer. Pino has heart disease. So I'm like, now waiting for one more.

One more bad thing. Yeah. I know. Everyone always thinks like that. And then you, but when you start to believe. that nothing good can happen, you don't really let things become good things. Right. But it's, I'm totally the same way.

And it's funny because whenever I tell my friends I'm trying to be more positive, they're like, good. Because you're not. Like, you're not. But I love that thought. Like, it was a gut punch when you said it. You said, what if every good thing is the last good thing? What did you say?

What if every good thing is the last good thing? Yeah, what if every good thing is the last good thing? Yeah, I always think that. And especially when you have, like, the type of career, like, you have, for example, I'm not trying to be like, so this is why you should be worried. No, but no, I have the same. same thing with the online space. No opportunity is ever guaranteed. It's not like a salary. It's not a job that you sign a contract for. It's just your life that just like has to keep happening

for you. Yeah. Or it won't or nothing will happen. Right. And I find that with my whole like new view on being online and posting and doing things for that and writing books and all that. Everything could be the last thing. Yeah. And it's a really hard thing to wrap your head around. But just don't let anything be the last thing. Just keep working. I know because I look back on my 40 years of worrying and I go, I don't think any of the like, nothing, you know, 99% of those lies I told myself were lies. If something didn't work out to like the most extreme, like you'd be dead. Like everything will always work itself out. And if it doesn't, you died like that. And then you can't, then you don't know. And then you don't know. And we don't want that. Exactly. That was one of my biggest aha moments when

I did this like deep therapy retreat was that because I was always just like I'm going to lose my job when I get older because my job relies on being young and youthful and it's it'll be always the next young pretty thing and this and this and I've always been taught to focus on looks and then every job I had depended on my looks and I'm not saying like and I'm a 10 I'm just saying like that's that's very kind but I'm like saying like that just has been my belief system it's a scary thing to think about I thought the same thing yeah can I be sitting in this chair recording my little poems when I'm 50 like yes do whatever you want and and that's and then I'm like look at barbara walters man she was doing it to Martha Stewart small sinned in jail and everything's

fine now she's on the cover of freaking even Matt turn around sports illustrated exactly yeah that's I and I need to but that was my aha moment was my therapist said you're going to age there is no she goes but then what's the alternative I was like I die yes she goes which one you want And I was like, you, the first time that I ever connected with you was that you used one of my poems on your podcast forever ago.

I got so many messages. Everyone was so excited. So thank you for doing that. Of course. And it was just about how like you don't want to get older, but you don't want time to stop where it is because then everybody else will move on without you. Yes.

And both of those are so scary. Moving on is scary, but being alone where you are is scarier. Yes. And you have to just be okay with it. And one thing I think I'll never fully accept is time passing. Yeah. And not knowing what's happening next

because I can't control it and things changing and aging and the way that your looks change and everything changes. But I just think that it's like one of the hardest things that anybody can ever grasp is that time's passing and you're getting older and you don't know what's next. It's bothered me since I could, it's like one of my first memories is watching home videos and it was from I think I was five when I was four when I was watching this home video. And the home video was from when I was two. And I remember started crying and I couldn't watch home videos.

because I'd be like, but what time is passing? Like, and I couldn't watch what I used to be because I wanted to like, so what are you doing your memories pop-b-b-b-b on your phone or your Snapchat or like whatever, I know. It's really, it's really freaky. And like my mom actually said something really, it was very interesting because I've never thought about it. My mom is 68 and she said that there comes a time in her experience and like what's happened with her and her friends where you get to an age where like you feel like your achievements

and like what you can do is like behind you. like you've kind of decided your life, you've established that your kids have moved out, like it's, it is what it is. And she's like, and it gets like really depressing for a second because then you just kind stop and go, okay, nothing really changes from here. This is what I've chosen. Yeah. And then it gets way better because you accept that.

And she's like, it's a very depressing little pocket of time where you're like, whoa. Yeah. That makes sense. And then suddenly you're like, but might as well just like live while I have it. Right. And then it gets way better. And I was like, that's such an interesting. I guess that's probably what a midlife crisis is.

I feel like I'm having one of those. right in this moment. I'm like 40 is midlife crisis. Any, any milestone. I just thought, I'm like, oh, shit. Any milestone age is a crisis. Well, what's, anyway, on that note. Yeah, I was like, okay, let's end with this.

What is a dream project that you haven't said out loud yet because it feels too big? Okay. This is so stupid. I have this. Okay, this is so dumb. No, it's not. It feels. not dumb. Okay, I have this character in my head that I think would be the next.

This is like not to do with even anything I've done. Okay, number one would be that my audiobook wins a Grammy. Number two would be this character that I've made up in my head that I think would be the next big Pixar like a cartoon. Yeah. And it's this little girl. Okay, this is so dumb. I've actually never talked about this out loud except for my friends. It's this little girl and her name is Pan. Okay. She's like five and she's really, You're saying Pam or Pan? No, literally, exactly. But it's Pan.

And she's like five and she's like, like cute and chubby. And like she's talks in this like cute little weird voice that I'm not going to do. But don't just don't worry. We don't need to manifest at that far. But she ends up in like crazy situations. Like she like ends out in the real world and like McDonald's CEOs are having a meeting about their next burger. And Pan like somehow ends up in the like the room. And she's like giving them tips on what she thinks the next burger should be.

Like just dumb stuff like that. but she's like out in the world with this little five year old anyways that's my dream i love that pan is like a big Pixar star oh my gosh pan i believe in her now we've talked to winter out loud so maybe maybe that manifest k what's your big dream i don't know what i don't know i don't know but okay my all-star season of dancing with the stars winning that okay yeah that would be mine that's great yeah that will happen and then maybe like having one more hit song go out okay

Great. Yeah. Make it happen. But I'm also like, we're having a baby. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's a good one. You could have a baby, write a hit song about the baby.

Yep. And then go on dancing with the stars. And that's how I like show myself that I could do hard things again. Yes, exactly. And you'll be like this mom who won. And my little girl will be in the audience watching me dance. Exactly. 100%.

Okay. Well, or boy. Or a little boy. Maybe. every psychic that I've ever talked to says I'm going to have a girl really yeah so if I have a boy I don't believe in them anymore so I always talk about girlhood this is my last week I was talking about girlhood I love girls I love my girlfriends yeah Steve my husband is like you're gonna end up with two boys and I'm like oh see I want I would obviously be happy with anything yeah but I'm like I see

myself as a boy mom you give boy mom I would love it you give boy mom oh my gosh like hockey player yes i'm so canadian drinking my jim horton's talking about having a little boy play talking oh my god i love it thank you so much for coming on oh my god thank you for having you this was like one of those like just talking with the friends i know i feel like if anyone listening to this on the outside might be like what the fuck did i just listen to but i think they like those ones where it feels like they're just hanging with their girlfriends yeah where it's all over the place that's what the vinos are just girlfriends hang out listening with us i love it that's how i feel okay well everybody go get the book and follow god if you're not following her

follow her on Instagram. Thank you so much for coming on. stream blockbuster hits like 21 jump street ted the expendables and so much more on cluto tv stream now pay never hi i'm lauren and i'm chanler and we're the host of pop apologist podcast a weekly podcast devoted to celebrity gossip hollywood deep dives real housewives drama and anything and everything taylor swift we're two sisters who make no apologies for our love of pop culture and the fact that a listers might mean more to us than each other Join us on your favorite podcast app every Wednesday for Pop Apologists. Pop Apologists, your new favorite sister and celebrity podcast.