Office Ladies - Second Drink: Ben Franklin

Episode Date: August 18, 2025

This week we're breaking down Ben Franklin. We start things off with some facts about the real Benjamin Franklin, and we get some audio memories from the incredible Andy Daly (Review, VEEP) who played the Ben Franklin impersonator in this episode. Then, Angela debunks Prima Nocta, Jenna answers everyones burning questions about Pam's hair color, and we chat about the 'guy shower' down in the warehouse. Finally, we get a 'proof of cold' fan catch, Jenna does a deep dive on Elizabeth's no secrets quote to Michael, and we end with some more memories from Andy Daly. Office Ladies Website - Submit a fan question: https://officeladies.com/submitaquestion  Follow Us on Instagram: OfficeLadiesPod Follow Us on YouTube Follow Us on TikTok To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's better than a well-marbled ribby sizzling on the barbecue? A well-marbled ribby sizzling on the barbecue that was carefully selected by an Instacart shopper and delivered to your door. A well-marbled ribby you ordered without even leaving the kitty pool. Whatever groceries your summer calls for, Instacart has you covered. Download the Instacart app and enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart, groceries that over-deliver. Hello, and welcome to your second drink of Ben Franklin, one of my personal favorite episodes.

This is a great breakdown, Andy Daly, who played Ben Franklin's in an audio clips. I went back to our mailbag after this episode aired, and you all noticed a few things we missed, so let's get to it. Gabby A said, around the five-minute mark, Todd Packer and Michael do this bit where they see each other and Todd pretends to kick Michael. Ryan is seen smiling, sort of finding the moment amusing. But was that BJ breaking? Okay, Gabby, I went and looked. Mm-hmm. It is 100% BJ breaking. I totally saw it. Gabby had said in her letter, like, I don't think that Ryan, the character, would be this amused by this tomfoolery. And yeah, no. But BJ, yes. It's BJ. Well, during this episode, I became somewhat obsessed with sweater dimples.

Oh, I remember you did a whole deep dive. Those are the bumps that you guys. get when you hang a sweater on a hanger. And I had not heard the term sweater dimple before. I'd not, I've never heard of this thing. I mean, I experienced it. Right, but you didn't know there was a term. Correct. Well, we got some mail, and I want to read this from Cassandra V because I guess I missed one. She wrote in and said, Angela, Kelly's sweater also has nipples. Check the conference room scene right after the awkward president exchange. It's around 10 minutes and 40 seconds on the Netflix version. She has sweater nipples near the bra line on her back. How was that sweater hung? L.O.L. It looks almost like it was folded and hung with a pants hanger. Yes, I saw it. It's so

weird. Yeah, they're really pointy towards the back. Yes, yes. Like super pointing out, like kind of above her shoulder blades kind of. It's true, true sweater dimple action. And Deborah E wrote in to say, sorry, this is not a question, but a, did you know? A quick emergency fix to the, quote, shoulder bumps is just a mist of water to dampen the area and then a few taps of the finger and the bumps will disappear. You can also dry the area with a blow dryer. Oh. I have done the blow dryer bit. You have? I have wet the area and done the blow dryer. How often in general do you get your iron out? Oh, man, I used to get it out all the time. And it's funny you asked this because this morning I almost ironed the pants I have one, but I couldn't find my. Oh, so I guess not very often if you can't even

find it. It must have been a while. But you know, Josh organizes stuff and he puts everything up high. Yeah. So I think he's moved it from where I had it and now it's up high somewhere. Well, I know your laundry room and your cabinets are very high. They're high for me. I know because I live with a tall person who helped design that room. I'm talking about you, Josh. Well, one of my fast packs for this episode was about Ben Franklin. And we got a letter from Kat Q, who said, quote, just wanted to add that I was hoping you would cover one more interesting fact about Ben Franklin. I am from Franklin, Massachusetts, which is named after Ben Franklin because he donated a set of books to the town in 1790, which then started the nation's first and still running public library. Thanks, Ben.

Oh, didn't know that. Didn't know that. Okay, well, you know the funny runner at the end of the episode where Dwight is interrogating Ben Franklin? Yes. They're in the break room. And Jim has Dwight convinced that he is the real Ben Franklin. Yes, and Dwight is trying to like stump him with a bunch of questions.

That's right. Well, Katrina N. wrote in to ask, why is Dwight holding a football in the break room? Well, Katrina, I went and looked in our shooting draft and here is why. It reads like this. Interior break room, Dwight interrogates Ben Franklin. Dwight. So, Ben, it's pretty cool you invented electricity. After work, you must have gone out for a cold beer. Ben Franklin. Cold? We always enjoy our ale at room temperature. Dwight, of course, of course. Dwight pulls out an American football. Dwight says, hey, after work, we should go play football, Ben Franklin. Ben Franklin. Indeed, but pray tell, what is that?

Football is played with a round ball that you kick. Dwight, right, right. Whatever was I thinking. Here, have some chocolate. Then Franklin, chocolate, how did you acquire it? It is a delicacy in the Amazon, but it has not yet been imported to the United States. Oh my gosh, so that's where it starts in the episode. Those first two were cut out. Yeah. And lady, I even went to the Peacock Superfan episode to see if I could solve this football question,

and that stuff is not in there. That's why he's still holding it. Yes. There you go. Good sleuthing. Thank you. You know, I love a little bit of a mom detective in our, archives of scripts and candy bags. I know you do. I got this question and I couldn't find the answer and

I said, Angela, can you dive into the scripts? I know it's your favorite thing. And I was so excited. All right. Well, listen, one last thing before we go. My play, Ashland Avenue, starts previews in two weeks. And then the play officially opens September 15, but we need audiences for previews too. This is like an important part of the play process where you get audience feedback and then we might make little tweaks. So it's like you're part of the process. It's one of my favorite parts of being in a play. So listen, you can get tickets at goodmantheater.org. Please come see the show. I can't wait to see it. You're coming to the opening lately. I sure am. You betcha. All right, folks, well, that's all we got. So please enjoy our second drink of Ben Franklin. I'm Jenna Fisher.

And I'm Angela Kinsey. We were on the office together. And we're best friends. And now we're doing the Ultimate Office rewatch podcast just for you. Each week we will break down an episode of The Office and give exclusive behind-the-scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you. We're the office ladies. Angela, I am so excited. I'm so excited. This is one of my favorite episodes. I watched it again this morning. I know you did do. And just for joy. Just to start my day off with a laugh. I have been giddy. Guys, it is Season 3, episode 14, Ben Franklin. Oh, God. It's so good. It's just when I say it. It was written by Mindy Kaling and directed by Randall Einhorn. Here's a summary. Michael wants to celebrate

Phyllis's upcoming wedding by organizing two parties, one for the ladies and one for the guys. He asks Jim to hire a stripper for the ladies, and Dwight is going to hire one for the guys. So Dwight hires Elizabeth, who is going to end up giving Michael advice on his love life. Jim hires historical speaker, Ben Franklin. Also in this episode, Karen confronts Pam about her past with Jim. Oh, if you want a few minutes of awkward, awkward in the kids. kitchen. Awkward in the kitchen. It's a new song. Yeah. All right, guys. Fast fact number one. Ben Franklin. You might know him as the guy on the $100 bill or the inventor of the lightning rod or the bifocal lenses. Or maybe you know that he is the only founding father to sign all four documents credited with creating the United States of America. That includes the Declaration of Independence, the Treaty of Paris, And the Constitution.

But here are some other interesting facts about Benjamin Franklin. What? He had 16 siblings. His poor mother. His mother was pregnant her whole life. Her whole life, she was pregnant. My grandfather was one of 11. He was like the third to last born, and his mom named him Plenty.

Oh, no. And in my family, we've always been like, what does that mean? She was just like, I need a break. Hey, that's plenty. Take a pause. They could have named him enough or finished. Stay off me. Yeah, get away.

This is my kid, get away. Well, Ben Franklin's father had two wives. Oh, good. He had seven children with his first wife, and then he had ten children with his second wife. Ben Franklin was the 15th child in that birth order. That's still, that's a lot of snacks. Oh, my God. It's a lot of...

I mean, you're making a lot of... Can I have some waters? Yeah. Ben Franklin only had two years of a formal education. Wow. He was a vegetarian. Oh. Like your character of Angela Martin,

this might explain why you were so taken with him in this episode. Oh, well, maybe. Mm-hmm. He started the first volunteer fire station in Philadelphia, and he invented an instrument called the Glass Armonica. That's not real. It's real. It was used by both Mozart and Beethoven. Here's what it is. It is basically, it is a series of glass orbs that you play by spinning them and then getting your finger wet and putting your finger on the orb. Oh, we've seen this. This is like in talent shows. Like seriously, a junior high talent show. There's like someone that sets up a table of glasses and then is like me for me, me, me, me, me, me.

Yeah, Ben Franklin invented that. Okay, and here's the thing. He would later write about this invention. I loved this, quote, of all of my inventions, the glass harmonica has given me the greatest personal satisfaction. More than the bifocals. Why do I feel like if you went over to his house, he was always busting out his glass harmonica. And you're just like, hey, I just want it. And he's like, me, me, we're like, okay, Ben, we get it.

We get it. Exactly. So Ben Franklin was a prolific inventor, you know, the kite in the air and all the yada yada. Yeah. Then he died of a disease that could have been treated by antibiotics today. What did he die from? Well, some people think he died from complications of syphilis, but he died from a disease that I hadn't heard of that sounded like sort of similar to pneumonia. Oh, okay. Yeah. But is something treatable with antibiotics likely today? How old was he? I don't know, Angela, I'm sorry. What was the name of the disease? How old was he? Okay, okay, okay, okay. Okay, what's fast fact number two?

Fast fact number two is Andy Daly the outstanding comedic actor who played Ben Franklin in this episode. Yes. Are you going to tell him what we got? We got some audio clips. And they're so good. He is so funny. Jen and I love these, Andy. Thank you for sending them in.

Here's the thing. You might know Andy Daly from Veep, Reno 911, Modern Family, Comedy Bang Bang, Eastbound, and Down. He studied and performed improv with the Upright Citizens Brigade. We have a very interesting little thing in common, Andy and I. What? Both of our first television credits were for Spin City. Wait, is Spin City with Charlie Sheen? Well, I did the Charlie Sheen one, but he did the Michael J. Fox one.

Oh, right. There were two. Yeah. Well, guys, we asked Andy how he got his role in the office, and he said he got it the old-fashioned way. He auditioned for Allison Jones, our casting director. But he had a funny story about his audition and first meeting Allison. Here's what he had to say. Hello, this is Andy Daly, aing your cues about Ben Franklin.

Here's my funny story about Allison Jones. When the UCB Theater opened in Los Angeles, we were doing ASCAT every Saturday and Sunday. night that's a fully improvised long form show long form improv show and i was in it every saturday and sunday and we acquired a superfan this a woman who was just seemed to be at almost every show and we got to talking to her a little bit during the show and a little bit after the show and she just seemed like such a sweet nice lady who was just a real like improv superfan and then um i got an audition for this role of benjamin franklin in the office and i went to the audition, and the casting director was that lady. So I've always said that that speaks so well of

Allison Jones that she is like somebody who goes out to shows and is a comedy fan, and that's why she is the greatest casting director, probably in town for comedies. She casts all your favorite comedies, and that's why. Okay, but yes, I audition. And by the way, when I got that audition for Ben Franklin, I thought, well, I'm going to go, because why not? I got nothing better to do, but they'll never hire me to play Ben Franklin because I was in my mid-30s and in the shape of my life. I mean, I'm like, I got a swimmer's body, no matter. But I figured they're going to hire somebody, some middle-aged, ponchy, bald dude, right? Wouldn't you think?

But I was like, well, I'll go anyway and I'll do my best. And so, and that has happened to me with so many of the rules that I've gotten. And I have gone just for the hell of it, even thinking they'll never hire me for this. I'm all wrong for it. And I'm so glad that I was wrong. It was a fun audition and I was surprised to get the part, surprised, but delighted. There you go. I love that Allison Jones was just going to all of those shows.

I just love it. I think she still does. And all of you aspiring actors out there, go to every audition. You don't know what they're looking for. Why not you? That's what I always say. Yeah, why not you? Don't psych yourself out of a part.

Yeah. Well, I love that. What's your fast fact number three? Well, before we move on to fast fact number three, we have a fan question from Morgan McLeod. I need to know more about Elizabeth the Stripper. She is amazing. And I love how she reprises her role in a few more episodes.

How did she get cast for this role? Well, guys, her name is Jackie DeBotten. She is so funny. She's so funny. She's so perfect. Oh, my God. Well, we tried to get in touch with her because we really wanted Jackie to send in audio clips too. But Jackie, I don't think you check your Instagram very often because the next time you go on there, you're going to have a sweet DM from Ms. Angela Kinsey, just waiting for you.

Well, listen, Jackie, someday you're going to see that DM from me and you have two more episodes and we would love to talk to you. So hit us up. Yes, Jackie comes back for fun run and the finale. I reached out to Allison Jones about Jackie, and she told me that Jackie auditioned for the role in Los Angeles was fantastic, was kind of known in the comedy circles here. She has since moved to New York and still works a bunch there. So that's what she's up to. If you're friends with Jackie DeBotten and you hear this, tell her to check her DMs. Yeah, tell her to hit me up.

All right. Now, fast fact number three. Fast fact number three is that we shot this episode. in January. And it was our first episode back after taking a very long holiday break hiatus. And over that break, Angela, do you remember we got nominated for our first Screen Actors Guild Award? I remember we were so excited. Guys, here's the thing about the Screen Actors Guild Awards. It's actors nominating other actors for their work, their body of work. And if you win as a cast, everyone gets an award. That is not the case with the Emmys. The Emmys only producers get the award. So like even when we won as a cast, we didn't get one. And this was really just like this great, amazing thing for us as a cast to be able to be celebrated like that. Yes. And I guess we were all in a very good mood because when we asked Andy Daly if he had any favorite memories from his time on the show, this is what he mentioned. It would be hard to say that I have a one

specific favorite memory. But I will tell you that the week that I was there, something was going on, like the entire cast was maybe going to the SAG Awards or something like that. And everybody was just really excited and in a good mood. And there was a lot of talk of dresses and tuxedos and hair and makeup getting done for some big event. And I was just really delighted by what a positive, happy mood everybody seemed to be in and what fun everybody in the regular cast seemed to be having every day, getting along very well with each other. You know, you end up on sets where there's different kinds of attitudes towards the work and the schedule and the co-workers, but this was one where everybody seemed so happy

and to really realize how lucky they were to be on such a great, well-written show that it was so much fun to do. So just in general, the spirit and the incredible welcoming-welcomingness. I know that's not a word. But everybody was just so welcoming and happy. It was a very lovely week. That's all. I love that. Lady, I wrote about this in my journal.

The Screen Actors Guild came by. are set to present us with our official nomination certificates for best ensemble for comedy. E. stopped by with their cameras and interviewed a few of us as well. When Phyllis looked at her certificate, she began to tear up. And then I began to tear up watching her. The SAG Awards are January 28th. I really hope we win. And we did. And we did. We won. It was such an amazing thing. It was just, just magical and just such a celebration for our cast. Oh, I remember when the certificate guy came to. It felt super official.

I didn't know they did that. I didn't know they did it either. And I think we were just sort of all taken by surprise. And then just watching Phyllis hold that in her hands and watching the emotion go over her face. I remember it. It was, it was really just such a tender moment to share. I love that you wrote about it, and I love that you told us. And I think that makes it a good place to, we can take a break.

All right, lady, we'll come back and break down this episode. Love it. Hey, we know you probably hit play to escape your business banking, not think about it. But what if we told you there was a way to skip over the pressures of banking? By matching with a TD Small Business Account Manager, you can get the proactive business banking advice, and support your business needs. Ready to press play? Get up to $2,700 when you open

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where Ken Cole and Tom Ballet share about the night their son had a psychotic. break. And at that point, I didn't actually know I had been stabbed all over my arm. I was in shock. Find the risk episode after all on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. All right. So now we're in the episode. It's the cold open. Michael has decided he wants to make a video for his future son. Dwight is filming him. here was what happened. Michael had a near-death experience. I guess he was cleaning some gunk off the wall sockets of his condo, but he was using a fork. Yeah, he was using a metal fork. Michael. Michael, anyway, this led him to have an epiphery. Life is short, people. Wait, we had a fan question

from Keisha Heath, who wants to know, was I had an epiphery in the script? Yes, it was. Steve's delivery is flawless. Brilliant. Yes. Well, Jenna, I wrote a few things, just overarching things about this whole episode. Here are three of them, ready? All right. Jenna was sick this week. I was. You can totally hear it. Yeah. Jenna had a cold. Um, where's Oscar? Yes. Yes. And then number three, the season of the Fluffy Blouse. Is this your third Fluffy Blouse? It's my third Fluffy Blouse. We'll get to it. I I have a background catch we'll have to talk about. All right. So now we're in the episode.

Yes. And Michael is addressing the group because it is six days before Phyllis's wedding to Bob Vance. He wants everyone to get their hair did. He tells Karen, maybe she should consider investing in a dress or a skirt. Michael says, guys, this might be Phyllis's only wedding and he wants to make sure everybody looks great. so he is instituting prima nocta, which Jim then explains in his talking head is something from the movie Braveheart where the king is allowed to deflower every new bride on her wedding night. So Jenna, here's the thing.

Prima noctica was a myth. There's actually no historical evidence that this ever happened. According to the internet, this was just something. that was literary. And I did a deep dive on Reddit, guys. In I-D-J-E-T, that's the handle, they wrote this. Premonautus did not exist as any feudal right or custom. There are a handful of mentions of it in medieval sources, but they're all literary, not historical. It's a myth that developed after the Middle Ages. In 19th century, French historians interested in creating a negative portrayal of the Dark Ages for their own political

reasons created a custom out of it and gave it a Latin name, thus making it real. The actual history of the development of the idea of premonautus is way more fascinating than the idea itself because it tells us a lot about how historians bring biases to their sources and opinions. I found that fascinating. Who writes the history writes the history? Yes, this is why women and people of color are missing from the history books. It's not that we weren't contributing, y'all. It's that we didn't get to write it down. Right.

Someone else wrote it down. Thank you so much, leaving my soapbox. Okay. I enjoyed my time there. Yes. I-D-J-E-T goes on to say there is a really astonishing investigation by Barrow. It's by Alan Barrow. It's called the Lord's First Night, the myth of, oh, Jenna, I'm going to butcher this French.

Dray de corsage And do you know what that means? Doat means right, well, it means right of something. Ready? It means right of the thigh. Right of the thigh, like the woman's thigh. Duquesneur? Yes.

So it started all in France, this myth. They wanted to make medieval times look bad. They wanted their sort of history, their religion, their story to seem superior. So they were trying to make medieval England and Scotland seem more barbaric so that the French would seem more evolved, according to this article. So they first called it... First they called it right of the thigh.

Then they changed it to right of the Lord. And then it got translated into Latin as prima noctus. Prima nocta. So there you go, guys. There is no history to support that this ever... happened. It was mentioned in literature and it was a myth, but it was part of the French rewriting history. Guys, you cannot say that you did not learn things from listening to this podcast today. You can't do it. No. And you know what? There is more to come. I've got a deep

dive on a girl band coming up. Oh. You'll find out why. Lady, I have a deep dive on a sweater dimple. So you just wait. Well, moving on, let's go into the conference room. The party planning committee is setting up for Phyllis's luncheon shower. And Michael comes in to brag that he is also having a party in the warehouse. It's not gay, but it is an afternoon shower with guys. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Every time you walked into the room, Steve would say something different to us. There are fantastic bloopers from this. because we kept laughing. We were laughing so hard, but they picked, what's up? My Spence does. But there is a lot of great outtakes from this scene. Well, then we find out that there is trouble between Karen and Jim. Yeah.

They've been having a lot of late night talks. A lot. Long, long, long, late night talks. Oh, Angela, this took me back. It took in these relationships. Oh my God, me too. Me too. When Karen was like, we need to have a talk.

We need to talk. Both of their talking heads are so well written. And I feel like Mindy was probably writing a little bit of her life at this time. But also when Karen is compelled to get up and go over and just give Jim a hug, just like that reassuring hug, I was like, oh gosh. Yeah. She's like, we're okay. We're good. Yeah, Pam notices.

Yeah. She's like, there's something weird with Jim and Karen. Pam says she's gotten really good at reading the back of his neck. Mm-hmm. So Pam is aware there might be a little trouble there. Yeah. Yeah. And then, guys, Todd Packer makes an appearance.

He comes in and is just in rare form. Yeah, he finds out that Jim and Karen are dating. He can't believe it. Mm-mm. And then he sees me. Michael, and they do this whole weird bit that involves him like fake kicking Michael in the face. Yeah. It was amazing. At five minutes, 13 seconds, I have a sneeze catch. Did you sneeze? I sneeze in the background of this scene. It was also noticed by Chris Robinson and Anayas Nethersole.

Jenna, I saw a montage of you sneezing on set on YouTube. Have you seen it? Yeah. I used to sneeze so. much. You had really bad allergies. I feel like there was something on the set that you were allergic to. Well, every time they would move the lights above my desk, all of that like particles from the ceiling would fall down on my desk. And so it was really dusty. And then they started doing this wonderful thing where they would come like Dale, who like was one of our grips would come over and he would like feather duster my desk off for me because of the sneezing problem, which was causing problems for sound and camera. So, but yes, I think this was before we started dusting my desk because the early seasons, I sneeze a lot. Yeah, you do, you do. A lot. So now we're

in Michael's office and Michael is telling Todd about the afternoon bachelor party. And Todd Packer is so bummed. He has a day of sales calls. He's so ticked. He starts breaking pencils. He's like, I can't come. Oh, we have a fan catch about that, Angela. What? Alina B. said when Todd Packer is talking to Michael, Todd breaks a pencil. But as the conversation goes back and forth between the two of them, you can see that the blue mug that holds the pencils goes from having pencils in it to no pencils in it. And it's true. At the top of the scene, he breaks a pencil, but then at six minutes, four seconds, the pencils are back in the cup. So clearly, Dave Kekner did that pencil bit probably one of many times and they loved it, but then, you know, they used other takes for the rest of the

scene. I thought that was such a good catch. Good job, Alina. That is a great catch. Well, Todd asked Michael, you know, well, did you get a stripper? And Michael's like, what? No, no. And then he's like, you don't know anything about planning a bachelor party. It's going to suck. You got to have a stripper. Have you ever been to one? And Michael's like, yes. Well, no, not really. Not in person. Never. You know what I mean? Like, Michael is really just so innocent in so many ways. Well, so Todd convinces him that he needs to hire a stripper for the women. Because then that means he can hire a stripper for the men. And Michael is like, his mind is blown. He's like, oh my gosh, yes. I want to say the little 45. minute party that Michael had planned, minus the stripper, sounded really lovely. Yeah. It actually sounded like fun. Steak and cards. Yeah. Steak and cards. What a fun, what a fun like break in your work day. Yeah. And then Todd had to make it weird. Well, that's what Todd does. That's what Todd does. So Michael walks into the office. He announces that co-ed naked strippers will be coming to the office. Oh, Angela, this exchange between you and Meredith, it makes me laugh out loud.

Kate and I have reenacted this a few times for fans. Angela speaks up, and what do you say, Angela? I say something like, under no circumstance, should a man take off his clothes at the office? And then Meredith is like, shit it up, Angela! It goes from nowhere. It comes out of nowhere. It was so crazy. It was like, release the Kraken.

And it's like Meredith, you know. It's so loud and abrasive and just angry. Is it her? It's like one of her only lines in this whole episode. Well, that and then she, of course, is like, wait, this is the stripper. Yes, exactly. But here is my background catch at six minutes, 38 seconds, right as Meredith yells, shut up, Angela. I whip my head over my shoulder.

I'm standing at the copier. This is a great photo moment of my whole outfit with the flufy collar. But guys, I want you to know, six minutes, 38 seconds, you can see a sweater bump. A sweater bump? What's a sweater bump? What is that? This moment really brought me back, Jenna, because wardrobe had hung my sweater on a hanger. And when I went to put that sweater on over my fluffy blouse that morning, I had these two weird pointy-outy things

over my shoulders where the hangar was on my sweater. Right. And I walked on set and wardrobe was like, oh no, oh no. And they were trying to like, it would look so weird. They were trying to get them out. We couldn't get them out. And so I was trying to figure out how to tell you this story. And I looked up sweater bump on shoulder thingy.

What is this called, Jenna? It has a name? It has several. Depending on where you live. These are called hangar bumps. sweater bumps, sweater shoulder nipples, sweater dimple. And I went to she finds.com and they're like, listen, you need to fold your sweaters. But if you have to hang your sweater, you need to fold it in half and drape it over the bottom

of the hanger. But guess what? There are now special hangers for sweaters that you might have to hang that won't give you shoulder bumps and luxury living bumps be gone extra long hang. is made a flexible foam, guys, if you have a sweater to hang up and you don't want to look weird at work with your, I don't know, your sweater bumps, your hanger bumps, your sweater dimple, it's an option. All I can think during all of this is why you have not consistently referred to them as shoulder

nipples. No, that was my favorite one. Sweater, shoulder nipples. Sweater shoulder nipples. You have to say the word sweater, sweater, shoulder nipples. Sweeter shoulder nipples. Jenna, I took a picture of it to show you. It is hilarious.

It brought me back. I was laughing so hard because I remember walking on set and then being like, oh, no. Like, what happened? Look, I can't wait to show you. Oh, no. It's so, it looks like my shoulder has a nipple. It is. You guys, I'm so sad you can't see the picture that Angela just showed us, but we will put it on Office Ladies Pod Instagram.

We have to remember. I promise, Jenna. We'll put it on Office Ladies' Pod. I remember I was texting Jenna when we were working. working on this, and I was like, I have a deep dive you are not going to see coming. And that was it, Jenna. You're welcome. I absolutely loved it. Well, now, I mean, oh, God, this next scene is so awkward. I know. It's so awkward at six minutes, 50 seconds. Pam and Jim are in the break room. And is Pam like trying to bond, but she's flirting, but she doesn't know what to say. It is so

cringy. I think she's fishing. I think she's just wants to know what's up. She knows, she knows something's going on. I don't think this is the same as when she helped Jim with the whole like apartment issue. Remember when she was like, listen, I don't think it's a big deal if she lives two blocks away. I think you're, you're overreacting. I felt like in that moment, she was like, you know what, let's move this into a friendship lane and I'm going to be a friend and give you friend advice. This just felt like she was fishing for the gossip to me, but then also trying to be super casual about it, but then also, I don't know, super awkward.

I don't think she was so much fishing for gossip as much as just she wants to know. I think, you know, she probably wouldn't want to admit this to herself. But if there's trouble in paradise there, she, you know, wants to know. But what's she going to do with the information? I'm sorry, we might be moving into wishy-washy-pam territory. We're in wishy-washy-pam because also like, oh, Jenna, your performance is so good. When she's sort of sing-songing, she's like, when I get eight hours compared to like six, it's like big difference. Like you have this.

And then she's like, got to get that rip sleep. Don't fall asleep at your desk. And then he's like, okay, Beasley. And you turn around to the vending machine and you're like, oh, you're so annoyed with yourself. All right, well, now we're going to move back into the bullpen. Michael tells Jim to hire a stripper. He's like, I will not. Dwight volunteers and immediately starts working on it.

Dwight gets someone on the phone. And he asked Jim if they should request a redhead or a brunette to which Jim responds blonde. And then Dwight is like, yes. Tons of people. Heather, Rochelle, Gabby, Jamie, Brianna. Steph, Allison, and many more all asked when Dwight asked Jim to choose between a brunette and a redhead stripper. It's implied that Jim feels uncomfortable answering this question because it's like he's deciding between Karen and Pam. Is Pam a redhead?

Oh! This is the question. And I have seen this question on fan sites before. What color is Pam's hair? Is she a brunette? Is she a redhead? one person wrote my family is very divided on this issue many people said this question has families fiancees and friends divided please tell us what color hair does pam have well your hair's

auburn isn't it yeah it's like a reddish brown you guys i think everyone's right but it did have these reddish tones however i think i shot a movie over our hiatus and in this particular episode my hair was not exactly as red as it was, I think, earlier in the show. So when they wrote this line, I think they were expecting that it would be more obvious that they were talking about me because I did have these reddish hues to my hair. But I think it got changed a little bit because I was shooting something and they took a little of the red out. I think that's the controversy, you guys.

Yeah, I just always have thought of your hair as Auburn. And I felt like in that moment, Jim wasn't taking any chances. Like, it was kind of like a dude moment where he's like, I don't really know what color her hair is. But if I rule out brown and red, I'm safe. So I'll just go blonde. I also have a fan catch from this scene from Hannah, who said at eight minutes, seven seconds, if you look behind Dwight, there is a picture on Phyllis's desk of Creed, Phyllis, and Ryan. Why does Phyllis have a picture on her desk of the three of them? And she does.

She has a picture of herself and Creed and BJ. Wild. I don't know why, though, but it's so cute. I don't either. I always remembered her photo of her and her dad that she brought in. Yeah. Huh. Yeah.

Okay. Good catch. Okay. So now Michael and Ryan have left the office to go to a sex shop for this bachelor party. Michael is just giggling nonstop. Well, Michael gets a phone call. It's from Jim. He's letting him know that there are a few options for the male strippers.

When he gets his phone call, did you recognize his ringtone? What was it? It was, my humps, ma'humps. No, I did not. Buy the black-eyed peas. All right. I like it. Yep. Jim says, listen, Michael referred me to a male strip club called banana slings.

But instead, I called the scholastic speakers of Pennsylvania. Maddie, Becky, and Andrew all wrote in to ask, is banana slings a real place and is Scholastic Speakers of Pennsylvania a real organization that offers a Ben Franklin speaker? Neither of them seemed to be real. I had always thought a banana sling was like a, also like a banana hammock. Isn't that like a male sort of like kind of Euro speedo? I mean, I think it's a good name for a male strip club organization, banana slings. It's like, you know, a lot of men are slinging. Oh, yes.

They're bananas. So where do we go? Okay, now they're in the elevator. Michael and Ryan are coming back to work. They're in the elevator. Ben Franklin hops in. And Michael's like, are you wearing a thong? And he's like, what?

We had actually asked Andy about his wardrobe and what all he was wearing because it looked like so many different pieces. Yes. And here is what he had to say. One thing I remember from that shoot was that a few days prior to my coming in to shoot for it, I had to come in for a. a fitting. And I thought the entire time that I was at this fitting that I was about

to get fired because I thought like they're going to put together a look for me as Ben Franklin and then parade me up to all the producers to Mindy Kaling and all the executive producers which I was told ahead of time was what was going to happen and that somebody was going to look at me and say, no, go

get the middle-aged ponchy bald guy. Like this is not working and particularly since my wig was this ridiculous it really was like a Halloween store bald wig that they then glued it was meant to look cheap they glued hair you know cheap hair around to it I was like this is a definite direction to go in with this but I'm surprised by head it feels real weird and then yes when they did parade me in front of those producers it wasn't like they weren't like yeah awesome they were just kind

like uh-huh so I don't know I do remember that the other thing I remember about the costume yes it was elaborate, but to make me look chubby, they gave me a, like a pillow, like a real costume pillow, a pillow from the costume department for the purpose of making someone look fat. And I don't remember if it was right next to my skin or if I had an undershirt in between. It doesn't matter. The point is that if you wear a pillow underneath several layers for like 12 hours, you're going to get a rash on your stomach if you don't use like a baby powder or something like that, which it never occurred to me to use. So that is one of my enduring memories of that shoot, having a

very itchy rash that whole week, sweating as I was underneath that fat pillow. So just a hot tip, baby powder. I think that would have helped. Amazing. Poor guy, you had a rash the whole week. I feel like we should talk with him more because throughout the course of shooting this series, you and I had to wear fake pregnancy bellies. And I feel like the three of us could really go out and have a very like a bonding evening over what it's like. Oh, oh, we could. I remember wearing a tank top under all my layers that would tuck under the fake belly pillow thing to try to protect my body from it rubbing all day. Yeah, because you get a real. thin layer of sweat, and then that sort of breeds an environment that is real rash happy.

It's rash happy. Yeah, it's rash happy. Well, lady, we are in the conference room now. The lady's party is starting. Angela is enjoying sparkling cider. She says it's very good. Yeah, but then Pam tells her, I think that's champagne and she spits it back into her glass. She does, but later she's still drinking it.

Oh, my gosh. You spotted it, as did Olivia Fitzgerald. That was caught also by Mary N. Ashlyn, Phoebe, Meg, Paige, and Amy. They all pointed out that Angela drinks her champagne again at 11 minutes and 34 seconds. Okay, so after Angela spits her champagne back into her glass, one of my favorite all-time moments ever on the series, Michael brings sexy Ben Franklin in to the room. Everyone is very confused. Every time he walks into that conference room, it makes me laugh.

Just thinking about it, makes me laugh. Michael tells him that he is giving him permission to spank anyone. Especially Phyllis. Who misbehaves, especially Phyllis. And Phyllis looks a little bit like maybe tickled by the idea. Phyllis is maybe up for it. She might be up for it. She's like, I don't know.

I don't know. We'll see where it goes. Yeah. At 10 minutes, 20 seconds, there's an exchange between Ben Franklin and Michael that Andy mentioned was one of his favorite scenes to shoot in addition to a few more that he mentions, but here's what he had to say about doing this scene. This is just another favorite moment that I wanted to share. There's a moment in one of the scenes where Michael Scott asks Ben Franklin something like

what year were you president or something like that. And Ben Franklin says, actually, I was never president. And of course, that's true. Ben Franklin was never president of the United States. And then Michael Scott leans in and quietly says, yes, but Ben Franklin was thinking that that's a moment that the actor playing Ben Franklin has dropped character and thinking, you know, the way an idiot thinks other people are stupid that this guy is answering the question, that this actor is saying I was never president. Well, of course this actor was never present. Anyway, why am I explaining the joke? That makes me laugh a great deal and is one of my treasured memories from that shoot. And one of my favorite moments from the episode, along with, of course, the moment when, after all this refusal to drop character, Ben Franklin, or as we come to know him, Gordon, does finally drop character to a flirt.

with Pam and his what he thinks is going to be a flirty come on is to make it clear that he doesn't have syphilis which is not a great pickup line like if that's your pickup line uh you need to work on it because that's that's like the bare minimum requirement i would think for someone that you're going to hook up with uh it's not something to brag about okay that's all thanks bye He made me laugh. Yes. In that scene, he's like, well, Benjamin Franklin was never the president. This made me look up who is on our money, who wasn't a president.

So there are two. Alexander Hamilton, $10 bill, was not a president. Actually, he wasn't even born in the U.S. How about that? And then Ben Franklin, not a president on the $100 bill. Uh-huh. Then this kind of blew my mind. every person on our paper currency faces to the right except for one man who faces left.

And that is Alexander Hamilton. Angela is showing me a cartoon drawing called Faces on U.S. currency. Fascinating. This is the greatest podcast ever. I'm sorry. I'm learning so much today. We are now in the parking lot, and the stripper has arrived, Elizabeth, and Dwight is like, identify yourself. And she says, I'm the dancer.

And Dwight is like, what? I hired a stripper. And she's like, yes, I am the stripper. She's like, it's the same thing, that's what I'm saying. And then Jim is like, have you ever seen his stripper? And Dwight's like, well, kind of, Jennifer Gardner in alias. I don't think he says kind of. He says yes.

Doesn't he? He's like, of course I have Jennifer Garner on alias. You know, I auditioned for the role of Sidney Bristow on alias and I got really far. Are you kidding? No. Lady. But do you want to go ahead? Could you have done all?

It was a very athletic role. I'm not saying you're not the most. Are you saying? A person. She had to do all kinds of, like, kicks, flip over things. I mean, it sounds like you are saying I can't do those things, but I will let that go. Because listen to this. This was, okay, so I went in and I read for the role.

And my scene that I had to audition with was this really emotional, dramatic scene where I'm crying, I think, like, about my mother. And it was super intense. And the feedback that my agent got was like Jenna blew us away. We absolutely loved it. Her scene was she just did a great job. We're going to pass on her because we just unfortunately don't think she's hot enough. Oh. That was my feedback.

That was my feedback. You know, I have long fantasized that you and I would have a TV show where we were mom detectives. We've talked about this. What? We've never talked about this. Yes, we have where we would, like, drive around and solve just very, very small crime. Oh, yeah. We spent a few years, lady, but there was one night, there was one night.

There might have been wine involved, but you and I had a few glasses of wine, and we were like, here's a great TV show, two moms solving very, very minor crimes. Like lost pets and, like, is someone cheating on someone? Yes. And remember, I think what sparked the whole thing is I. got a flyer on my door that a house a few doors down was having massages in the garage if you would like a massage and this sent my whole street into a tizzy we were like oh my god you were like is this erotic massage yes like who advertises massage in my garage there's got to be something fishy here and i was telling you this story did you investigate oh i did a few drivebys i did a few and

and were they on the up and up the garage was never open, okay? I don't know whatever happened, but I took a few long walks past that house. Lady, you've seen the Americans. You need to dress up in a costume and go get a dang massage in that garage. That's how you're going to find out what's going on in there. I need to put on my wig and go for a massage. But me telling you that story, you and I decided mom detectives solving crimes no one cares about.

I once had a masseuse kind of offer me a happy ending and a massage. What? Was it a man or woman? It was a man. Where were you? I was. How did it come up? What did they say?

I need to know everything. It was this one place that I would go to in Studio City. You know it all the time. Studio City is like the suburbs. This is where we moved in like year 10. of living in Los Angeles. We moved out to the suburbs. And I went to this place all the time.

And I always had this female masseuse. And I was very loyal to this business. It's not in business anymore. Shocker. I'm not saying this is why. Did they move to the garage at the end of my street? They maybe did. They maybe did.

So I, you know, I went in and they didn't have my usual gal. And they offered me this, I'm not going to lie. Just this. Just a gorgeous man. What? I was a little bit like, do I get a massage from this hot guy? Do I, it feels interesting. This is a very personal question.

Do you go full commando or do you leave your undies on when you get a massage? I take it all off. I can't. I can't. You wear your underwear during massages? I use my underwear. I've also been known to wear my socks because my feet get cold. Oh, I do wear my socks because my feet get cold.

Oh, I do wear my socks because my feet get cold. And I never ever take off my underwear because I'm like, I don't know who's been on that table. I don't know. They changed the sheets. I don't care. I'm leaving my underwear on. There was just this like moment where it was near the end. And it was just like, what did he say?

Well, it was more like what he said with his hands, you know? What? What do you mean what he said with his hands? Where were his hands? They were just, you know, finishing up the massage. On your forehead, don't they normally finish the massage? Like, here's what it was. Tell me, am I misinterpreting?

Am I misinterpreting? Because the whole time during this one particular massage, I just kept thinking I'm getting massage by a super hot. Oh, no. Were you projecting? Was I projecting? He just, his hands were on my legs, but they were on my thighs. And he was just like, are you good? And I was like, huh?

Yeah, I'm good. And then he moved up to my head and finished the massage. Did he say drop de corsage? Can I have the right of the thigh? I felt like I was in Happy Ending territory. I felt like I was in a world where if I gestured toward Happy Ending Lane, I think he might have gone down it with me, perhaps. I don't even know where we go from there, lady.

Where are we? where we are, Angela, is that Ben Franklin is telling all the women about his life, the history of his life. Yes, he's telling a story. It was a dark evening, you know. Oh, and you're hanging on every word. I'm hanging on every word, and I have to share with you. This is a very actory moment. I decided to do this. No one told me that I made the choice that Angela Martin would literally be enthralled by this man. And so when Randall Einhorn was directing, he had Matt Sown, the camera operator, like, pan across all of our expressions. And I had this expression of like, you know? Oh, and you're loving it. I'm loving it.

And Randall was like, Angela, that is so great. Can you do that every time? And I was like, oh, yeah, oh, yeah. So that's my little actory choice, little nugget for you that I just thought that Angela Martin would be enthralled. Well, we had a very actory question for Andy Daley about this scene because we wanted to know if he did any research on the character of Ben Franklin in order to play this role. And here's what he had to say. I did prepare a bit. So as a office viewer, it always looked to me like the show was somewhat improvised.

I think it turns out, actually, that it's just really well written and really well acted and not really so much improvised. Of course, there is some improvising on the set, but I, not as much as I think I thought. It looks so spontaneous on television. But anyway, the point is that because I figured I would be improvising as a guy who impersonates Ben Franklin for a living, I figured I better know quite a bit about Ben Franklin. And so I just read Wikipedia, but I mean, I read it and I took notes and I kind of, you know, I read it a few times to trying to have. a lot of these biographical information in my mind.

And as I will address any later answer to a later question, it came in handy. But that is the preparation that I did. I would do that. We would go around about it differently, but we'd show up with information. What does that mean? Go around about it differently? Well, it's just kind of like our research process. You know, you always like, you look at my notes and you're like, oh, God, your notes make me like queasy.

have like a gazillion post-it notes and note cards and you have like a very like outline oh yes yeah i see what you're saying i would research ben franklin write an essay on it and bring it with me you would fill your script with 72 post-it notes filled with bits of information about ben franklin yes look and there it is there it is i mean the proof is right there you just held up your notes for this episode and it's like 72 post-it notes all around with arrows and highlighting well so listen, lady, before we get to Michael's man meet, should we take a break and then we'll come back and talk all about it? That's the segue of the month. It's definitely the segue for this episode.

We'll be back in a second. Okay, guys, we are back. We are back. Michael is grilling steaks on his George Foreman grill. down in the warehouse, and Ryan asked him, is it the same grill that he used to grill his foot? And he's like, no. Okay, yes. But I got all the foot off. Incredible. Then we go upstairs and, whoa, Ben Franklin is tying a cherry stem with his tongue. And Pam asked him what kind of undergarments he's wearing. I just want to point out that Rashida's response as Karen to Ben Franklin tying that cherry stem. Tim is so perfect because she's like, Ben Franklin did not just hit Jerry Stim into a knot. It's so good.

And then, yeah, Pam, when you ask him that, he has one of my favorite lines. Andy is so good with this line. He's like, you're very saucy. Well, guys, we got a lot of fan questions about this scene. Aaron, Brooke, Olivia, Laura, and Marie all wrote in to say, did Ben Franklin actually tie the cherry stem with his mouth. And here is what Andy Daly had to say. Absolutely not.

That is not something I've even ever tried to do. That's crazy. But I am struggling to remember how we shot it. I guess I must have sort of stuck the tied cherry stem. It sort of in the core, stashed it in the corner of my mouth, you know, and then put the other one in and just kind of mimed it and then spit out. But listen, that's hard, too, to have a tied cherry stem hidden in your mouth and then put a real cherry stem in there that's not tied and then make sure you pull out the right one. I mean, that's pretty impressive right there.

But I might be remembering it wrong. It may actually be that the camera kind of swung off me long enough to not have to be so sneaky about it. I don't remember. But the short answer to your question is, no, I did not really tie that cherry stem with my tongue. I can't imagine how one does that or why one would take the time and effort to learn how. I mean, I know why people do that. Is it like a look what my tongue can do kind of thing? Yeah.

It's a display of your tongue agility. It's like a sexual thing. Why did you say it was such authority? Hey, I know. I know why people do that. Well, people want to know if either of us can tie a cherry stem with our mouths. It's a little bit of an inappropriate. question. I mean, it's personal. Can you, Jenna? You know what? Here's, you know what I'm

going to say? I know if I can. I know the answer to that question. Wait, people are rodent asking if you and I can tie a cherry stem into a knot? Yes, it's a very, very personal question. Is it? It's very personal. Like, who cares? Who cares if you can tie one or not? Like, seriously? What does that mean? Really? Come on. Well, where did this start? I feel like this started in like a movie from the 80s or something. Does anybody know? I feel like this took off.

I remember this from my youth. It was like this whole like thing. Can you tie a cherry stem in your mouth? I mean, so we weren't we all doing it? Weren't we all tying cherry stems with our mouth? We all tried. Can this generation's youth tie cherry stems in their mouth? We'll never know.

You know what? Go on TikTok or something. They're probably doing it on the talk. Is that what they call it? On the talk? Get on the talk. I'm sure they don't. Now, Ben Franklin, winks at Pam.

Hey, sassy, wink. Jenna, I have a question for you. What is it? Is an unsolicited wink ever a good thing? Or is it always a dushy thing? Mm. It's a douche move. I think it's a little dushy.

I think, like, I mean, A, who even does it? Who's like, who's like, hey, huh? Yeah. Well, it's interesting because we had someone right in. Devin Crutchley said, did Pam secretly have a real crush on Ben Franklin because she seemed to be playing into the banter even after he becomes overly flirty with her? And others start picking up on it and playing along. here's the thing guys I was so utterly charmed by literally everything Andy Daly was doing as

Ben Franklin that I am only ever like smiling at him it had to have been coming through in my performance and so I think that might have given you the impression that Pam secretly had a crush on Ben Franklin because I personally had a crush on Andy Daley's performance well I did not see it that way at all I just I just saw it as like listen, none of us are having to work. We're in this room together. We're drinking champagne.

We're just like having a good time. So, you know, that's how I saw it. I mean, I didn't want Ben Franklin to leave. So, you know, I was going to egg him on. Yeah. That was, I think, Pam's, where Pam's coming from. Keep him talking. The longer he's talking, the last time I'm sitting there answering phones, looking at the back of Jim's head.

Wait, I just have to say, while this wink is happening in the conference room, In the warehouse, Michael has been grilling steaks, they're done. And he's like, hey, guys, who wants some man meat? And Dwight goes, I know. I want some man meat. And then Creed picks the steak up with his hands because Stanley tries to cut it with a plastic fork and it breaks, which made me laugh so hard. And then Creed just picks it up and starts eating it. We should have texted Creed to ask him how that steak tasted.

Oh, we should have. I have to tell you guys, you know, Creed lives down my street, right? He's at the end of my street. And he stopped by the other night And he said to us, guys, you have got to watch this show alone Where they drop people off in the Arctic And then they have to survive. It's like a survivalist show.

Jenna, I thought of you. What one man can do or whatever? Another one can. You know. No, don't whatever. Don't whatever. One of the greatest lines written by one of the great American playwrights, David Mamet, whatever.

what one man has done another can do okay well let me tell you jenna you've got to watch this show it's so so freaking good creed has got us in it we are so invested it's the most intense survival series on television and it's in the arctic i'm fascinated it's so good it's called alone do they have supplies they get to bring a few things but they have to pick and choose and so like oh like One guy, you could bring a fire starter thing, but one guy decided not to because he was like, I can make my own fire. But then the first day, he was like spent all day trying to make fire. And he was like, damn it, I should have brought that thing. But anyway, when I saw Creed, who had just told me about this survivalist show, grabbed the steak with two hands and gnaw on it.

Yeah. It has made me think of. It all came full circle in your brain. And you need to see it. You love survivalist stuff. I do. Okay. Now we have to get into the very, very awkward scene that is Karen and Pam, ooh, in the kitchen.

They're kind of joking about Ben Franklin. I feel like they're both like doing a bit about how did he become a Ben Franklin impersonator. And all of a sudden, Karen takes a sharp left turn and she says, hey, you know, I just want you to know, Jim told me, you know, that you guys kissed. and, you know, and Pam's like, what the what? She is, she's like, what is happening right now? It's like her computer shut down. Yes. Now, pretty much none of what she says after this makes any sense.

No, and, okay, so we had someone right in. Jackie Cortez said when Pam answers, oh, yeah, to Karen, when Karen asked if she still has feelings for Jim, do you think that was because? Pam was feeling brave in the moment, but that she was like trying to say her real feelings in that moment, and then she backs out when she sees Karen's face and also how much of this was scripted and how much of it was improvised. Okay, so first of all, this scene plays out exactly as it was scripted. All of those like awkward jumps in dialogue were all scripted. I just think it is such a great piece of writing. And I remember, I felt being challenged as an actor to make

all those different turns that Pam has to make in the scene. And so when she says, oh, yeah, that's because she heard the question, you don't have feelings for Jim, right? And she's like, oh, yeah, I don't have feelings. But that's not what Karen said. Karen said, do you still have feelings for Jim? And she's like, oh, yeah. But like, Pam is just like, She's not hearing everything, and she's just like her mind is being blown right now by the fact that Jim told Karen this. Yeah. And you know what? Because now it's everything we were talking about.

It's not a secret anymore. It's not Jim and Pam's secret anymore. That, I think, tells Pam that he's taking this relationship with Karen seriously because he's willing to tell her the real truth. And now I think Pam is just in like a Darren headlights kind of mode. Well, I thought it was fantastic. I thought the two of you did such a great job with it. It was written so well and acted so well. And, oh, it made me so uncomfortable.

So you guys know you did the right, you did your job. Rashid and I had a lot of fun shooting that scene. All right, should we go back down to the warehouse where Kevin is leading all of the guys in a card game? Yeah, he says it's a no limit deuce to seven lowball, which I think is the same one he did in Casino Night, right? Yes, that is what he won in the World Series of Poker, he tells us, in Casino Night. And then Michael shuffles the cards like a total idiot. Yes. Yes, we had a fan catch from Katie, who said in this episode around 12 minutes, 46 seconds, Kevin's wearing glasses again.

There he is. He wears glasses when he plays poker, but not when he's working. Not as an accountant, just when he plays cards. And this is when Elizabeth enters. She comes out of Daryl's office. She has changed out of her sweatpants and sweatshirt, and she is now in a breakaway, sexy office attire. We had a huge fan catch from Kristen Trowgill. Kristen, what'd you catch?

Pam's shirt in the Dundies is the same shirt that Elizabeth the stripper rips off in Ben Franklin. Oh, my God. Did they recycle one of your shirts? Did wardrobe make it like a breakaway kind of blouse or something? Yes. Yes. Elizabeth is wearing one of my old shirts. So I actually first wore it for basketball.

And then I wear it again in Dundies. And I reached out to Carrie Bennett, our wardrobe supervisor, about this. What'd she say? She said that this was not in the script. This was not like any kind of direction she was given. because a lot of people did write in and ask, like, was this on purpose? Did you want us to notice that this was the identical shirt that Pam has worn? Was that a joke that was written in the script? It wasn't. She said that oftentimes when a guest actor is cast at the very last minute, she doesn't have time to go shopping for them. So what wardrobe designers do is they go into their quote unquote retired wardrobe. And this is a stash of out for, that have been retired, but that used to belong to the main cast members. So she had to find a shirt that fit Elizabeth and then it had to be converted into a

ripaway shirt. And so they just didn't have time to go shopping and convert a shirt into a ripaway shirt because the timing of when Jackie was cast, they had to just go into Pam's old wardrobe. And that's what they did. And she said she can't believe that people noticed. Well, listen, Elizabeth, the stripper, you're lucky you didn't get any of Angela Martin's retired wardrobe. Oh, no. Oh, no. That would have been very bad. It would have been very bad. That's a great catch, though. I know. And Carrie also said that this happens all the time on TV shows. She said you will often spot retired clothing from the main cast being repurposed for guest actors. I feel like everybody, you can look for that along with the fake you.

bag. Well, now she starts her dance. It's to bad companies, feel like making love. No one wanted the dance. Bob Vance didn't want it. Michael's like, okay. And this is so awkward. He doesn't know what to do with himself. He's so uncomfortable. He just starts muttering, you smell like Tide. Yep, smell like Tide. Do you use Tide? We had a couple of people write in. Zouye and Dan asked when Elizabeth is dancing on Michael, how much of the dialogue was scripted. All of it. And you guys, we've talked a little bit about like scenes where someone has to slap someone, you know, and how we bring in a stunt coordinator. You do that kind of stuff in scenes like this, too. Any scenes that have any kind of like touching, dancing up on someone, a sex scene, they are

choreographed. You do not free. Yeah, it's really no different than like a fight scene. It's like, sit here. I'm going to put my arm here. Then I'm going to stand here. It's all rehearsed. You don't freestyle this stuff. Yeah. So where she sits on his leg, all of the dancing she's going to do, when she's going to rip open her shirt, very scripted. The dialogue was scripted. I wasn't surprised when I went back to the script because I thought, yeah, I don't think in a moment like this that they would have freestyled that. No, that was all scripted. And Michael is just overwhelmed. He's like, this is wrong. I have a girlfriend.

And he storms off. It was just all too much for him. And quite, being the frugal fella he is, is like, hey, I paid you for three hours. I'm going to get three hours of work out of you. So now you have to go answer phones. And because Oscar is nowhere to be seen, even though he has returned. Did we shoot this out of order, Jenna? Why isn't Oscar there?

I don't know because the traveling salesman and the return were shot in October. Yeah. And this was shot in January. So it doesn't make sense why Oscar isn't there. It doesn't. So anyway, Dwight brings Elizabeth to accounting to sit in Oscar's seat. Elizabeth is very overwhelming for Angela. And she's like, ha, ha, like sort of like this very Elizabethan, like, fanning myself.

Well, here's the thing. She complements your baby poster. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. I know. She really is. She's a. fan of baby jazz like your character is, but a lot of people wrote in. Sierra, Tiffany,

Camille, and Krista are like, what is the baby poster doing back up? Angela, did your character put it up when Oscar went on his sabbatical? That's what they want to know. I love this theory. I fully support it. The minute Oscar left, she's like, my poster is going back up. Meanwhile, Ben Franklin, a.k.a. Gordon, is hitting on Pam at reception. And he said a little bit about this in his audio clip. Oh. So funny. So funny. And now Michael doesn't know what to do. He feels like he's cheated on Jan. He talks to Ben Franklin. Once Ben Franklin's advice, Ben Franklin slash Gordon basically says, I don't think she needs to know this information. And Michael is like, Ben Franklin, you're kind of a sleaze bag. And you guys, Ben Franklin, Franklin was kind of size bag with women. He, like, actually really was. If you look it up, he just, he, like, literally slept with so many women. And there's one thing that's inaccurate in this episode, though.

In this episode, you know, he had a child with one woman who was not his wife. And in the episode, he says that, like, she didn't know that he had. he sort of says to Michael, like, I fathered a child and I never told my wife about it. But that's not true. Actually, his wife raised that child like her own. Oh, my gosh. His wife, Deborah, was a saint, I'm going to say, and she put up with Ben's bad behavior. Well, now Michael did not like his advice from Ben Franklin, so he's going to go ask Elizabeth for her advice instead.

Here is her advice to Michael, quote, Secrets, secrets are no fun. Secrets, secrets hurt someone. Angela, do you know what that is? I was about to say, please tell me you researched this quote. Is it from like a children's book? What is it from? These are the opening lyrics to a song called No Secrets by a girl band called No Secrets. from their album.

No secrets? No secrets. And I asked Sam and Cody to pull a clip. Here it is, Angela. Secrets, secrets are no fun. Secret, secrets. Hurts someone. They had a game.

No Secrets, was a British American girl band, very reminiscent of Spice Girls. They had one hit, which was a cover of Kids in America, that song by Kim Wild. We're the kids in America. Oh, we're the kids in America. Do you remember that song? I kind of do. They followed up with another hit single, That's What Girls Do, but they only ever made one album. They started on a second one.

but it was never released. The band broke up over disagreements. And one member claims it was parent drama and interference. But I, here's the thing. Mindy Kaling wrote this episode. I have no doubt, no doubt in my mind, that she has the album No Secrets by No Secrets. And that's how she knew to quote this line.

I mean, it seems pretty specific. We also had a fan catch in the scene from Corinna Liu, who says at 17 minutes, 52 seconds, There is a flyer on the refrigerator behind Michael for silver on spruce. Corina says, I did a small deep dive and it looks like this is a real business with two different addresses. And the telephone number on the flyer is correct. I checked it out. Corinna is right.

Yes, silver on spruce. I wonder if this jewelry store has gotten like prank calls because you can see the phone number in our episode. Well, I imagine Corinna is not the first person to freeze frame on this. I wonder if the kids on the top. have called the number. Lady, it is not called the talk. And you're not going to get them to call it the talk. Okay.

Gosh, everyone on the talk. All right. Guys, we're almost done. I promise. I promise. But we cannot leave this episode without talking about this scene where Dwight is interrogating Ben Franklin because Jim has convinced him that this is the real Ben Franklin who has time traveled to visit him.

visit us at Dunder Mifflin. He's 99% sure it's not the real Ben Franklin, but he's going to interrogate him anyway. The scene was so funny. So funny. And Dwight is just like challenging him with questions about the time period when he lived. And Andy told us that this was one of his favorite to shoot and this is what he had to say. This is where my research into Ben Franklin came in handy. There were a bunch of scripted lines in that scene where Rain Wilson is challenging this Ben Franklin impersonator, trying to trip him up to find the lapse in his knowledge about Ben Franklin.

And so it's just throwing all these questions. But one that he improvised was, are you near-sighted or far-sighted? That was not in the script. It was never discussed beforehand that he was going to say that. he just threw that out in the middle of a take. And I, because I had just read the Wikipedia page about Ben Franklin, knew that Ben Franklin invented the bifocals. And he invented the bifocals because he needed him because his distance site was challenged,

as was his reading site. And so I was able to say, without having to think about it or hesitate, both, that's why I invented the bifocal. And that is an unusual kind of magical, improvised moment. It's so strange that he asked me a question for which I was prepared with the perfect answer. It's very strange. And in fact, when they called Cut, I remember Mindy Kaling saying, did you guys work that out beforehand? And we were both like, no. And we were all kind of stumped. It's very strange that that's an improvised moment. And yeah, it ended up in the show, of course, because why wouldn't it? So, yes, that's my answer. Amazing. Lady, this is, you know, my nerdy moment where I say it's the group

mind. Also, actors, this is why you need to do your prep work. Always, always. Guys, actors do not just show up on set and just make it up as they go. We study. It's a craft. We take it seriously. I always, always try to flesh out my character. And if they give it, me any kind of nugget like, you know, obviously he had Ben Franklin. I do a deep dive. So I have all this in my head in case I need it. Lady, do you think that's why we do all these deep dives for the podcast? Is it like, is that our actor brains at work? Because that's the kind of stuff I would do for a scene. Yeah. It's also, Jenna, a little bit of a glimpse into maybe the fact that we were kind of the dorks in college

who hung out in the library. Before we move on to the next scene, Angela, I have a very quick fan catch from Maggie Donner. I'm calling it proof of cold. Oh. You know, we've talked a lot about how our set was really cold all the time.

In the background of Dwight's talking head where he's talking about Ben Franklin, you can see Karen sitting at her desk and she has a blanket on her lap. Oh, no way. Maggie Donner caught that proof of cold. Oh, Maggie, that's a little bit of cold. Oh, Maggie.

That's such a great catch. Oh, that's a good one. Yeah, we were always freezing. Well, you know, Jenna, we can't wrap up without Pam having this moment in the break room where she tells Ryan in front of Jim, you know what? I'm ready for you to set me up. Yeah. She is. She's like, yeah, I want to go out with one of your business school friends.

What's that about? She's feeling it. She's had this conversation where Karen. Aaron now knows. Jim has told her. Jim is saying they're having all these, like, really long, heartfelt talks. Pam's like, oh, crap, I might as well get myself out there. Well, and Jim's like, oh, maybe you should go out with Ben Franklin. And I think Pam's like, you know what? You need to don't tell me who I should date. Okay. Just sit back to him and watch me revenge date now. Pretty much. Pretty much. Well, and then before we go, Angela, we have to discuss the fact that. Michael calls Jan and confesses that he had a woman dancing up on him. And Jan's like, when? This weekend? Last night? Like, when did this happen? He's like, no, it was at work in the warehouse.

And she's like, Michael, I'm, I'm like, and he's like, I'm sorry, are you mad? And she's like, I'm, like, close to firing you. And he's like, oh, what a relief. I have the best G.D. girlfriend in the world. Yeah. And she's like, yeah. She couldn't believe that it happened in the afternoon at work. That was her concern. And then Michael has the talking head where he says, Ben Franklin kind of turned out to be a creep.

And Elizabeth the stripper gave great advice that rhymed. And it just really makes you wonder how Ben Franklin can become president, but someone like Elizabeth can't. It does make you effing wonder. It's called misogyny, everyone. Here we go. go. I do love that he really appreciated that her advice rhymed, because I feel like this is just that callback to that giant owl that came and spoke at a school. Yeah. Yes. She had a costume.

She talked in rhyme. She really got through to him. Well, those are the two ways to get through to people. You either need to dress up in a costume or rhyme. These are very effective ways. Okay. We're coming to the close of this episode, but Jenna, there were two deleted scenes. that I thought were worth mentioning. Number one, at the very beginning of the episode, Toby is like, Michael, you can't have strippers at work, right? Of course human resources would not let this happen. Oh, I've wondered where Toby was in all of this.

Yeah, and so how they got around this is that Michael just says, well, you know what, Toby, you can just go home. And then the other deleted scene that I thought was kind of funny, where Kevin has a talking head and he shares that he bought his girlfriend, Stacy, a stripper pole for her birthday, but he doesn't know how to install it. Oh. So he has an uninstalled stripper pole in his house.

Yeah. This is going to be a huge tangent, but you know the comedian Nicole Beyer. Oh, she has a stripper pole. She has a stripper pole and she's like real good on it and she's posts videos all the time on Instagram and they talk about it on their podcast. They're like, it's like an exercise.

now. The stripper pole as exercise. Yeah. I don't know if it's been a while for you since you tried to crawl up a pole, like shimmy up a pole. Been a while. That implies I ever tried to shimmy up a stripper pole. Stop. Not a stripper pole. I just want you to know when I watch Nicole's videos on Instagram, I am always amazed because at the playground with the kids, like a few years ago, there was like the pole that's like the fireman's pole. You know, you can climb up the place structure and then slide down it. And the kids were doing the thing where they scooch up it. And they were like, Mom, come on. Jenna, I got like two feet off the ground. I was like, I can't. I'm so horrible at it. I tried to climb a rope recently and I didn't get far. Yeah. I also tried to do a cartwheel and I threw my back

out. Oh, but the worst is when I tried to do a somersault and I really jacked my neck. Well, I don't think I'm stripper pole material. You also... It's not in my future. You also maybe couldn't have been Sydney. I'm just kidding. Say it. Jenna, I don't know.

Listen, you are a phenomenal actress. I don't see you doing a, like, a handstand and, like, taking a, like, a grenade out of your back pocket and throwing it through a window as you flip off a table. Okay. You clearly have strong feelings about my limitations. You know what? I traveled with you with a guitar and I saw what it was like. You navigating a guitar through an airport, getting it on a plane. It was very difficult for you.

All right. Fair enough. Fair enough. I will say this. I did recently purchase. I'm so excited to get it. A portable tap dancing floor. This is who you are?

Yes. So get ready for that. I've already started learning a tap dance to the song, Footloose. And I'm going to send you a video I'm going to put on my overalls. And I'm going to dance in front of my barn on my portable floor. I will come and sit at the end of your driveway and play a few glasses of the glass harmonica. Fru-da-Food-Foo-Fu-Fu-Fu-Fu-Fu-Fu. And I'm going to tap dance my little heart out.

Guys, that's Ben Franklin. Before we go, we have a final audio clip from Andy Daley. I was curious, I had to know, has he ever played any other historic figures or founding fathers? Here's what he had to say. I did play Teddy Roosevelt in an episode of drunk history that was very memorable. I got to ride a horse and wear a fake mustache, and that was great. But, you know, a long time ago, back in I would say 2002, I put up a sketch show at the UCB Theater in New York,

and one of the sketches was about Alexander Hamilton debating federalism with someone, which sounds like a terrible comedy sketch, and maybe it was. But I played Alexander Hamilton in that, and it is my opinion that Lynn Manuel Miranda, Miranda saw that sketch and was inspired to write Hamilton. And I've always felt kind of ripped off. Like it's, you know, it's nice that Ron Chernow, who wrote the Hamilton biography, gets kind of, he gets credit for the extent to which he inspired that play, but I am not.

You will never see my name in the playbill or in the credits of the movie. I am just very conveniently, completely forgotten. And I can't prove that Lin-Manuel Miranda was in the audience or ever saw. that sketch. But you know, common sense dictates that that's how Hamilton came about. But that's it. Teddy Roosevelt, Alexander Hamilton, and Ben Franklin are the only founding fathers I have ever played in my entire career. Wow. Three more founding fathers than I've played. I love it. I love Andy Daley. You guys, if you want to keep listening to this very, very, very funny person, you can find him on his own Earwolf podcast called Bonanas for Bonanza, which is a rewatch podcast of the classic Western

TV show, Bonanza. You can also find him on Twitter and Instagram at TV's Andy Daily. His last name is spelled D-A-L-Y. I cannot wait to listen to that podcast. I used to watch Bonanza with my dad. It's Andy Daly. That's all you need to know. All right.

Well, thank you guys so much for sending in your questions for listening to us. ramble on about all of these deep dives we did. This was a lot of fun for us. We love this episode. And we hope you guys have a great week. Yeah, we'll see you next week. Thank you for listening to Office Ladies' second drink. This episode was initially created in collaboration with Earwolf.

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey. Our executive producer is Cassie Jorkins. And our audio engineer and associate producer is Molly Nugent. Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Reese Dennis. Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Shultz. Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton.