Oh What A Time... - #194 Captains (Part 1)

Episode Date: August 23, 2026

Ahoy captains! We’re back after our summer break and this week we’re discussing Captains! We have for you this week, the big one: Captain Cook. Another huge captain in Captain Scott. And finally, then unbelievable true story of Captain Anderson.Elsewhere, so much going on. How longs have humans been around? How clammy are Tom’s hands? Wasn’t there a lot of walking in the past? If you’ve got anything to add on this (especially Tom’s clammy hands) please do: [e-mail] if you want more Oh What A Time and both parts at once, you should sign up for our Patreon! On there you’ll now find:•The full archive of bonus episodes•Brand new bonus episodes each month•OWAT subscriber group chats•Loads of extra perks for supporters of the show•PLUS ad-free episodes earlier than everyone elseJoin us at 👉 patreon.com/ohwhatatimeAnd as a special thank you for joining, use the code CUSTARD for 25% off your first month.You can also follow us on: X (formerly Twitter) at @ohwhatatimepodAnd Instagram at @ohwhatatimepodAaannnd if you like it, why not drop us a review in your podcast app of choice?Thank you to Dan Evans for the artwork (idrawforfood.co.uk).Chris, Elis and Tom x Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Oh, What a Time is now on Patreon. You can get main feed episodes before everyone else. Add free. Plus access to our full archive of bonus content, two bonus episodes every month, early access to live show tickets and access to the O Watertime Group chat. Plus if you become an O Watertime All-Timer, myself, Tom and Ellis, will riff on your name to postulate

where else in history you might have popped up. For all your options, you can go to patreon.com forward slash O Watertime. Hello and welcome to Oh, What a Time and welcome to our episode on Captains. This is a history podcast in which we talk about the past. And I've just come back from a music festival with my kids, where on each day, for four days, I walked in excess of 20,000 steps. Yes, it's impressive. But also, isn't this what it was like for everyone?

In the Stonehenge days, it was just a lot of walking. But you didn't know then? you didn't have your watch or your Fitbit or your phone telling you how many steps you've done and also you didn't have articles in the press freaking you out about how few steps you do. Now it is I check it before I got to bed for some mad reason. Do you?

Probably for the first 35 years of my life. I was like, oh, okay, yeah, felt the butt right? So quick Google tells me that Stone Age people were 3.3 million years away from Uber That's how far off they were That coming in and really making their lives much more manageable They weren't that long ago, were they? It says the Stone Age began between 3.3 million years ago And ended between 4,000 BC and 2000 BC.

Humans have been around for like 60,000 years. Yeah. Started 3.3 million years ago, people lived as a nomadic hunter-gatherer. Is this wrong? How long ago? How long will we be knocking around? Yeah, yeah. Hormos sapiens first appeared above 300,000 years ago.

Okay. Why am I being fed this information? Paleolithic. Old Stone Age started 3.3 million years ago. That's what Google's told me. Oh, well, you know, it's... Why would computers lie to ourselves? Stones existed. There were just no people there to enjoy them.

So stones themselves were 3.3 million years away from Uber. The oldest fossil remains of Homo sapiens were about 315,000 years ago. But you had, you know, Neanderthals. were before that, I think. Which is what most listeners are thinking I am now after getting that so wildly raw. That's about 400,000 years ago. Okay. So Neanderthals were 400,000 years away from Uber.

And they were around at the same time as homocipians and they used to breed. Did they? Yeah. I don't love that. Do we need to go into that? As an idea. One of the major reasons, I suppose, that Neolithic Man didn't have Uber is because where would you go? as in what was

if you got an Uber where are you then taking it to because everything you need is around your cave, isn't it? Neanderthals were much shorterness but they were much, much, much stronger.

Okay. And I knew like some Welsh farmers like that so I'm already scared of Neanderthals. Yeah. And it's the whole thing. Have you ever seen like AI images of a Neanderthal but like with a suit on at a wedding?

No, but I want to. I now know what my life's lacking. And they're like sort of They're almost believable as people. But again, you'd shake hands with them, you'd be like, ah! Do you ever shake hands with someone who's got incredible grip strength? Often if they're like a farmer or a builder? I think there's something worse than that, though, L.

Actually, I can think of a very famous comedian who has this affliction. I'm not going to name them. It's when you shake someone's hand and it's very, very limp and soft. Yeah. A little bit clammy. Like there's no grip whatsoever. Yes. You're trying to sort of shake hands of the jellyfish.

There's nothing robust about it. That happened to me with a very famous comedian two weeks ago. It was like, honestly, it was like shaking hands with velvet. There are the people with deliberately limp handshakes, which I don't like. And then obviously, this is slightly more common, the idiot male testosterone guys who try and crush your hand. Donald Trump, Donald Trump's guilty of that, isn't he? Oh, does he do that, does he?

His is more specific than that, actually, Chris. He does a thing where he grabs your hand, and then pulls it across his body. That's his dominant move. He always does that, clearly trying to. So he basically ends up yanking other politicians into his chest whenever he shakes their hands. It's really bizarre.

Just do it properly and get on with your day, for God's sake. I've got so little patience for power moves. Hello, man, nice to meet you. Then done, wallop, out, you're done. You've gone. Imagine if I did that to you. Imagine if the next time I saw you, I pulled you into me and shook your hand. like and sort of crushed it.

I've not only 22 years. I'd say I have a perfectly middling handshake. I have the handshake you're hoping to meet. Yeah, and that's all you want. Yeah, absolutely. It's completely dry. There's no crushing and there's no dominance. You do have quite clammy hands.

Can I just bit of feedback. No, I do not have clammy hands. A bit of feedback. I do not have clammy hands. Most of the time when I shake your hand, I always think that's quite clammy. Have you heard of talcum powder? Next time you shake someone's hand.

Next time you shake someone's hand. It's dry as a bone. Just as a little experiment, just see if they have a more pleasant handshake experience with you next time with a little bit of talcum powder. Just walk around with some kitchen wall in your pocket at all times and just it's the pre-dab, isn't it? Dab off the clam and in.

Just install a dice and air blade into every room. room of your house. Or have a mini one in your pocket and is always on. Chris, I do want you to quickly explain to listeners that was a joke and I do not have a clammy hands. Well, look, people listen to this podcast. They'll have to think, are you the kind of man to have clammy hands and subsequently want to deny it?

But this has been a horrendous start. So far, I've suggested that humans existed 3.3 million years ago. We found out that now in 2026, as a modern human, I have clammy hands, which I refute. And I will get my wife to record a voice note about this to prove that I do not have clammy hands. How can we test it? How can we test? How can we prove it once and for all? We don't need to. We don't need to. This isn't a crime scene.

We've just got normal, normal dry hands. Anyway, I would a show. I think. No, you don't think anything else. You stop thinking now. We can't have to be history. If 10 is wet and zero is dry, like too dry and five is normal, I'd put you in at a seven. Yes, I'm totally.

agree with that scoring system. I would say there's elements, there's elements of clam in there. Okay, so I'll score yours. So let me think. So I'd probably put Chris about a nine out of ten for claminess. And Ellis probably, maybe a billion out of ten. Wet hands at all times. You could remove a fish from the sea and it could comfortably survive on your hand for about three years. That's what I'm saying, Ellis. Just lying there, thinking this is plenty of moisture. I'm never thirsty. Just give it a lick that I'm ready. Oh, no. The clammy hands are most frequently caused by the activation of your sympathetic nervous system. You aren't quite sympathetic.

No, thank you very much. Yeah, it's the empathy in me. Tom is so empathetic to all of my needs. He's constantly sweating pints. It's a constant like night sweat situation. It's not up this to a sweating. No, absolutely not. We need to get this back on track.

So I have averagely dry hands. I shake politely. and I move on with my day. And if you guys were polite, maybe this would be more pleasant podcast. Right. Today we're talking about captains. You've seen a captain, World Cup, firm shake, handshake, you know, at the centre circle before flipping the coin, whatever they do.

Well, today it's all about captains. I'm going to be talking about the story of Captain James Cook, whose hands were wet because he spent his entire life at sea. So he's the opposite to me. Who are you talking about? I've got a great subject on mine. The first ever commander of a nuclear submarine for the United States, Mr. William Robert Anderson. Oh, nice.

And what he did on that nuclear submarine I'd never heard of is an incredible story. Okay, right. And I'm talking about Captain Scott, who had far more links to Cardiff than I'd realized. Before that, though, let's do a little bit of correspondence. This email is one of my favourite that we've received in a long time. It really, really made me laugh. So, you sent us some correspondence, have you? Well, let's take a look at you then.

So this email is from Jamie Territ, and it says, Hello, guys, love the show. I drive from South Wales to work in Birmingham and further north most weeks and save up your Epps for the drive and the time flies by. So thank you. Thank you very well. Thank you very much, Jamie. I'm delighted that you're enjoying them.

Listening to the abandoned theme park episode and hearing Ellis talk about Penscunner Wildlife Park brought back two of the best memories I have as a child. It really made me laugh. I was eating a pack of quavers outside the monkey cage. That's a great opening sentence to a paragraph. I was eating a pack of quaver outside the monkey cage and a monkey came up to the cage

and held out a piece of straw to me. I looked at my dad confused and he told me the piece of straw was a gift. I accepted this offer of straw graciously and the monkey then held out an open hand and it suddenly became obvious that our new fun friendship was transactional. I put a quaver in its hand and he ran off with it happily. So there you go. That's the initial memory. Can mungisie quavers? I don't know. It's one way to find out, I suppose, isn't it? Yeah. And also I want to know what Jamie did

with the straw. I think if monkey gave me a straw, I'm keeping that straw. Oh, my kids would definitely keep that. They'd keep it from weak. It's a good story. People say, why have you got a straw on a mantelpiece? I say, well, a monkey gave it to me. It's a good story. And he's my best friend. Yeah. They're so genetically similar to us, monkeys, that surely they could tolerate a quaver. Yeah, I think they'd be fine.

Yeah. I wouldn't give it, like, a grab bag. No, no. But I think like... The odd quaver here and there is going to be fine, isn't it? Just on the subject of monkey bartering, someone told me this. I've never actually checked it. But I went to a monkey centre.

in Indonesia, in Bali once. And the monkeys were, like, they were wild. If you bought, like, a bunch of bananas, they would just snatch them out your hand. But someone told me that the monkeys had learned to snatch your phone away and then basically hold the phone until you swapped it for a banana.

Really? Yeah. That can't be true. Is that true? That feels like it could be true. I suppose they'd observe people using phones all the time so they'd know they're of importance to humans. So they're aware,

that there may be, possibly, I mean, maybe I'm giving too much credit to the monkey brain there. Oh my God, it is true. I've just Googled it. The bartering monkeys of barley. How the monkey barter system works. Research shows that these animals rationally target high value items like smartphones and electronics instead of low value items because they have learned that humans will play a much higher food ransom to get them back. The monkeys refuse to give back stolen tech until temple guides or tourists hand over

appealing food items such as fruit or treats. If they take it and they realise it's like an old iPhone, do they give it back to you? You realise it's not worth anything. Oh, what's this? An iPod? No. The humiliation as a monkey gives you back your phone. I can't believe that's true.

I honestly thought that was nonsense. It's true. Well, there are like megafoxes in London that can basically unlock bins. And create startups and get seed capital. The megafoxes make it sound like they're massive though, like the size of a bungalow, doesn't it? When I imagine a megafox, I'm seeing one which is 15 times of size of a normal fox. Mega foxes is multiple foxes in a brown overcoat or stood up on each other's shoulders. Oist raccoons in Canada as well are just like they're incredible at getting into bins and, you know,

the raccoon is basically outsmarted Toronto City Council. Good on it. Shall we return to Jamie's email? Because the stories have not ended. There is. Yeah, absolutely. That was only the first of two memories in this wonderful email. Wow. Start, of course.

The other was something I look forward to every time I went, which was a lot. Every time we walked through the square where the peacocks were, they would all attack my dad. I remember bursting with anticipation, turning the corner sometimes, and seeing the peacocks and hear my dad go, oh fuck here we go here we go and seeing him try to push them away with his foot careful to kick the peacock as people were staring at him

sometimes I would ask to go to Penis-Cunner just for this moment keep up the good work all the best Jamie Territ Jamie that is one of my favourite ever emails we've received what an amazing image the idea that your dad is constantly without fail attacked by the Peacos that suggests it must be something about the way he looks

maybe his hair or did he wear a costume that resembled a Peacock was the sort of bright colours or something, I don't know. I want more information on that, because there must be a reason the peacocks are picking on him. I guess. I don't know. I'm not a peacock export. Peacock suit. Yeah.

Describe that for us briefly. What is that? What is it? Paul Well, Paul Well, Paul Well, it's on Peacock suit? Oh, is it? So, what is a peacock suit? Just bright? Well, peacocking is, you know, wearing your best clobber, isn't it?

Okay. That was, so maybe, maybe Jamie's dad would just go to Penscan and World Life Park. wearing one of his latest gear. All the peacocks are like, where on earth did you get that? Is that vintage? Really? Wow. Do you ever, I would put peacocks in a similar lane to foxes and that when I see one up close, I'm never quite sure should I run away? You know, I never quite know who's in charge.

Yeah, is it going to peck my dick off? And also the kind of things like you might go to a National Trust, you know, a National Trust House on holiday. and there'll be one in the car parking. Like, what's happening now? What do I do here? What do I do with it? Yeah.

Do I hit it with the spade or do I sort of feed it? What's going on? Do I kiss it? Do I marry it? Oh no, what do I do? What do I do? Yeah, it's funny how quickly the animal kingdom can turn the tables on you. I actually went to the churchyard about six months ago and there was a baby squirrel in it.

There was just started chasing us. And we ran away. We ran away. Yeah. Well, humans are pathetic. We're weak. We've got terrible bites. We're not very fast. We're bad at claiming.

We're not very strong. We're just shit. We're just clever. People say we're the top of the food chain. But one baby squirrel could take us all down at any moment. It's terrifying. So what's a take home there? Never trust any animal.

Is that the message for our listeners? Stay indoors. Exactly. Jamie, thank you for that email. Well, if anyone else has anything they want to send to us, Eddie's remarkable stories where your parents have been attacked by wildlife. Do get in contact with the show, and here's how. All right, you horrible luck.

Here's how you can stay in touch with the show. You can email us at hello at oh what a time.com. And you can follow us on Instagram and Twitter at Oh, What a Time Pod. Now clear off. Just to elaborate on that, we've got weak stomachs. We can't eat out of bins. Without toilet paper, we're in big trouble. We need to sleep on beds.

We're just shit. We're so weak and crap. But we've invented stuff. What have animals invented? A monkey picked up a stick and managed to open a coconut and loses their mind. What a brilliant monkey. We've got the internet. We're not covered in first.

We can't do with a cold. Yeah. We, you know, sort of ice sunburn terribly, so I can't deal with the heat. Some of these aren't resonating to me. I'm quite a good climber. I'm quite fast. I don't mind lying on the floor. But you're not a cat, you?

No, I'm somewhere between. I'm somewhere between you and a cat, basically. Now, each week on this show, we shout out one of our oh, what a time, all-timers. We take your name and we figure out where in history that name may have been placed before. We've got a great name for you this week. And oh-what time, all-timer by the name of Joe Sweeney. Joe Sweeney, that's a great name. Joe Sweeney sounds like a 1990s soap-style heartthrob.

That's so good, yeah. He's about 18, and he's incredibly handsome, and there's not a teenage gun in Britain who doesn't fancy him. Best friend with Adam Ricketts, remember him? Best friend with Adam Ricketts, and he gets all of the cool storylines in EastEnders. Unfortunately, I don't think you go on to have a great acting career. But I'd say your peak between 16 and 21, you are the king of the castle. You're the top of the tree.

You're winning every single soap star award on offer. Oh, yeah, the mantelpiece is bending under the strain of all of your soap star awards. The problem is you're one of the, you're like a real pretty boy. And so once you get to a certain age, you know, like sort of you see like child stars. And then when they're adults, they sometimes look a bit weird. You won't believe what Joe Sweeney is. looks like now is what the Daily Mail article would say. So you're sort of still like a button no, it's really cute, but you're 48, so I don't know what's

happening there. Yeah. But my God, 1993, 4-5. Presenting the smash hit to Paul Winner's Party. Highland out of take that. All that kind of stuff. Robbie Williams thinks you were a right laugh. Not a terrible pop solo career.

Three or four decent singles in there. Yeah, yeah, a couple of top ten hits. You did top the pops. I mean, you didn't write any of them, which means you get hardly a lot of. any money for their plays. But still, I was going to go with

someone who was a rival to the craze and either got shot in a pub or chased out of the country by them. Yes. So in the book, there'd be one of the early rivals in East End gang land would be Joe Sweeney or the Craze.

Yeah, Joe Sweeney was from Camberwell and he was the most feared gangster in St. London. Unfortunately, he made the mistake of treading on the craze turf and he had his brains blown out in 1960. So there you go, Joe. You can choose a failed acting career

Petered out at the age of 24 or the craze did you over. Up to you. Dealer's choice. Well, there you go, Joe. And if you want to support the show and subscribe to us on Patreon, get bonus episodes, all that good stuff,

here's how. Hello again, you horrible lot. Enjoying the show. Well, why not show the love? by becoming a Patreon supporter today for a mere handful of fatherings you can get ad-free shows

two bonus subscriber episodes each month access to all the past bonus eps first dibs on live tickets and even help decide what subjects the boys cover next your support makes

everything possible so sign up today at patreon dot com slash oh what's a time or oh what'satime.com. What are you waiting for? Stop dawdling. Okay, right, well, we're discussing captains this week on all of time. So let's get on with the show. Tom.

I'm going to kick things off today by telling you lovely boys about the life of Captain James Cook. Now, do you know much about James Kirk or Captain Cook? He's better known. Discovered Australia. Yeah, amongst many other things. Chris, how sort of across him are you? Murdered in Hawaii? Very good.

Oh, yes. Yes. Ding, ding, ding. Lived in Myel End? Did he? Westamperfan. Is that true? Actually, not far.

He's from not far from the craze. Am I remembering that, right? I'm pretty sure he's from... He did something in Mile End. There is a plaque in Mile End for him. Okay. Why? I don't know. He's from Yorkshire. I really hope it's one of those things that he finished the world's biggest burger in under half an hour on a T-shirt or some of that.

What did he do in Mylan? Because I don't have the Myland information in here. He has got a blue plaque at 88 Mile End Road. And it says on this site stood a house occupied for some years by Captain James Cook, circumnavigator and explorer. So James Cook lived in Mile End not far from where the craze would have been. In the middle of their reign of terror. Well, I say discovered Australia, obviously, the Aboriginal Australians. Yeah, yeah. He was the first European.

Europe, exactly, yeah. There's a blue plaque on my house that says here lives the man with the least clammyest hands in Britain. You know that, that's what it's said. But it's often defaced, isn't it? Britain's driest palm reside herein. Okay. I'm going to take you back, first of all, to 1768, okay, to tell this story, when the Endeavour, which is a former coal ship, left Britain, bound for Tahit.

in the Pacific Ocean. So to give you some context, this is kind of in keeping with 18th century and the age of discovery exploration. They're just, they're mad for this, essentially. On board this vessel is a group of astronomers. We talk about jobs in the past that sound quite fun. This could be quite fun, but then there's a risk at being at sea. I'll let you decide. Their mission was to study the transit of Venus, which is a rare celestial phenomenon, which occurs when Venus passes between the sun and Earth, producing a black dot visible on the solar disk. This is an event which, when it had finish would not happen again for another century. Okay?

So this boat has these astronomers on board. They're observing this celestial thing. Does that sound pleasant or do you think the idea of being away at sea, even if you're doing something like that, would just be horrendous? What's your views on this sort of an overarching sense? When the weather's good and on day one and two, when you haven't run out of food yet, fine. Everything's fresh.

When everything's fresh, once you're eating dry biscuits and all that kind of stuff. And you can't see land. I think that's a big one. I think while I can still see St. Ives, I'm okay. But when it's the open water, that's the stress. So this is sort of a ship that he is captaining. He's captaining the Endeavour. He's a Royal Navy officer, James Cook, and he's also a budding explorer in his own right.

And this voyage is one of three major voyages. He just does these incredible trips that have a profound effect on European understanding of the world. There's three of them. He leads one in the 1760s, one in the 1770s, and this one here, which utterly transformed European knowledge and understanding of the following. Listen to all these things that he kind of has an effect on our understanding of.

The Pacific Ocean as a sort of general mass. The recently resolved theory of longitude and therefore almost half of the globe because of that. Also of Australia, New Zealand, the Pacific Islands, the Arctic Circle, the Antarctic, the Bering Straits and the entire Western seaboard of America. Isn't that amazing to have that impact on a whole continent's understanding of the world? You know what? Funerals, when people say, oh, he or she, they're a life well-lived. And that usually means they used to drink too much at barbecues and were quite a good laugh. Captain Cook's, yeah, I did do quite a lot, actually.

Yeah. In my time. I didn't waste time, did I? I mean, it is a life well-lived. It's also a life it's worth saying that has some controversy attached to it. He's been implicated in the anti-colonial sort of backlash since then. but his naval career does remain one of the most important in world history. What's your view, Chris? I know. I've had controversial opinions on here before.

We all remember the killers, the Beatles debate. But I always think with James Cook, just the ending, the way he gets murdered by the Hawaiians and it's just so unseemly that for me it's always kind of overshadowed a lot of his career. Yeah. Because I just think about it is the guy kind of loses his mind a bit at the end. I think his death in Hawaii is so avoidable, I think. but he did just

and I guess maybe that's a lot of our great naval heroes that Nelson had a bit of this where their ego is the thing that makes them such a great historical figure but it's also their undoing partly and I think Eat Cook suffers from a bit of that let's see the rest of your section Tom also his brother Thomas

set up that really successful travel agency didn't he as well so there's the competition there in the family yeah his brother Peter is a pretty good comic as well I mean they're sort of real high achievers so let's first take you through who he was. Okay, so Cook is born in Yorkshire, 1728. He's the son of a Scottish farm

worker turned farm manager, also called James, incidentally, and his wife, Grace, who is from Thornaby. After five years of schooling, James joins his father on the farm. He leaves that to work at age 16 to work in a shop, but he just doesn't enjoy this, so he joins the Merchant Navy, which for me feels like quite an about turn. I'm not enjoying working in a shop, I'm just going of a life at sea, but that's what he chooses to do. Also, hilarious. Can you imagine Captain Cook working at a shop? I mean, that's what I did during the summer when I was at university. Yeah. Although, he wasn't referred to his Captain Cook at that point. It wasn't until the test. He was Jimmy Cook. He's named by saying Captain Cook. So he's working at a shop. He doesn't

like it. He leaves to join the Merchant Navy in Whitby. And on the Yorkshire coast, he learns the maritime way of life. He adds to his schooling through the study of algebra, geometry, other skills essential for marine navigation. He applies his newfound trade on coal ships, is where he starts working on coal ships that are travelling up and down the coast of England. And once he gains enough experience doing that, he ventures out into the North Sea, travelling as far as the Baltic Sea into St Petersburg and also sailing westward from Whitby to Dublin. And now in 1555 he's sort of 26, 27, that sort of age. And Cook, he's now qualified as a ship's mate. So he's doing quite well. He's rising up the ladder very quickly,

and he's so impressive, in fact, that he's offered a captaincy at that young age by his patron. However, he turns it down. Instead, enlisting in the Royal Navy as an able seaman, several rungs below his position in the Merchant Navy. So he decides to drop down the ladder to join the Royal Navy because he thinks that would be a much more exciting, rewarding, respected life, essentially. And this was on the eve. This is how bravely. he is. I would say this is the time that I would not do this. This is on the eve of the seven years war against France and a Royal Navy career was far more prestigious than that of the Merchant Marine. But he chooses to join at a point where clearly we're tumbling into war. He

still goes for it at that point. Thought? Yeah, some people, they like, they love that idea, though. And honour and pride, especially at that time, was such a big deal, I suppose. A friend of the show, Dan Snow said last week, your options are, go to the workhouse or have quite a grim life working a field or the adventure of the seas. War, glory, victory or death. Although he had quite a nice job in Tesco, when I sound of thing. He was quite a pleasant job in a shop. He's doing all right.

So he's first assigned to a boat called the HMS Eagle. He quickly rises through the ranks once again, spends much of the seven years war aboard a boat called the HMS Pembroke, which saw Cook involved in the conquest of Cape Breton, Ireland in 1758, the exploration of the gas peninsula, and the final one, which to me sounds like a sort of thing, people do in retirement, the exploration of St. Lawrence River, which sounds quite nice. That sounds sort of quite a pleasant thing to do. I mean, it sounds like a Channel 5 programme that in 25 years

time when sort of either Michael Portillo, Josh Middickum will be doing. Absolutely. All for it and I'd watch it happily. So that's what he's doing then. But his most notable scientific achievement during this point is mapping Newfoundland, okay? This blew my mind, this fact about this, is how good he is. He's got such a skill for charting and mapping. His maps of Newfoundland were so accurate that they continued to be used into the 20th century some 200 years after he'd completed the world. Isn't that mad? I've heard that.

So Seafarers were still using his map. They were the best map still 200 years after he had drawn them. Isn't that incredible? I have done nothing and will do nothing that will still be relevant in 200 years 10. I cannot explain how transient. and disposable everything I do is. So there we go. Well done, Jim's Cook.

These podcasts are still remain. Yeah, they'll be out there somewhere. The history we're talking about remain true. Sat on a server somewhere under the sea. Yeah. Exactly. Well, the earth burns around it. And it was because of these incredible skills, okay,

that everyone takes note of him so quickly. And it really establishes Cook as an ideal choice for this 1768 expedition. This expedition is a three-year boy. which takes the endeavour from England to Rio de Janeiro, then round Cape Horn out to the Pacific towards Tahiti. That's three years away from home. For some context, he's a married man and he has six kids.

Imagine telling Sophie or is he that? Just let you know you've got to look after the kids for the next three years. I'm off to work. I'd be 48 coming back. Exactly. Well, Elle, it doesn't end there. From Tahiti, he cooks sales onto New Zealand. He maps everything.

He goes to Australia. He then returns home. via the Cape of Good Hope, arriving back in the summer of 1771. What do you think he does them? What do you reckon? Any guesses? Oh, does he go on another one straight away? Yeah, he gives it a year, spent a bit of time with his wife and kids, and then sets off for another three-year voyage to Tahiti in 1772. So that's three years, back for one year, away for another three years.

You know how if you are married to Premier League footballer? You've got to accept that they're going to be away weekends. Is it, I'm genuinely asking a question. Is she like, well, he is, you know, it's a very... job. I've always thought that. Like the obvious one is Nelson's wife. And that's my only window in what it must be like to be the spouse of a great naval personality. And I guess most people in the Navy would have done the same. You're just, you're hardly ever there. And you're expected to raise a family in the meantime. It seems like a mad deal. And I suppose on the plus side,

he's also high up the ladder. So he's bringing back a lot of money. Think about the people who've been press ganged in who do three at sea get back and then immediately press ganged out again who are making hardly any money who still have family at home I mean at least there's that but it's you know it's a real choice and but the danger the danger too it's not like oh you're going away for three years you're going away three years and you might die in fact quite likely you're going to be widowed tough old gig oh a tough deal it's not a great deal for your wife and mother of your children. So he sets off again, as I say, this time he takes in the eastern route via the Cape of Good Hope.

He ends up visiting Easter Island, arriving there in March 1774. However, it's the third expedition, which is the one you talked about earlier, Chris, with Andrews, this horror in Hawaii, this time on the HMS Resolution, which remains the most famous, not least because of the grizzly end, which befalls him in 1779. This trip, it's launched in 1776. It takes much the same route as 72, and was commissioned. to find the fabled northwest passage. And Cook was able to visit Tasmania, Tonga, Tahiti, Christmas Island, Hawaii for the first time,

the Western Sea border of the United States, notably those areas we know as Oregon and Washington State, Vancouver Island, and finally the Bering Straits all before returning to Hawaii. And it's this second trip, this second journey to Hawaii that is Cook's fatal error. The first time Cook and his crew arrives in Hawaii, they're greeted enthusiastically, because then it's like a time of plenty, a time of celebration. They're heralded as welcome visitors. When he comes back a second time, it's a time of scarcity, and there's tensions as well,

because the island's inhabitants steal a small boat from Cook, and some would argue he kind of overreacts. He takes the Hawaiian chief hostage and holds in for ransom. There's a struggle, it's armed, and Cook is killed there on the rocks. There's an amazing book called The Wide Wide Sea, which I've been reading. I mentioned actually in the Dan Snow episode, and it describes his death, just like Cook basically doesn't back away.

He's just like he's really about standing his ground and honour and all this sort of stuff. Well, his shipmates are tumbling back to the boat. He just basically isn't moving and then ends up getting killed there on the rocks. I think I'm right in saying the first time he arrives, I'll need to check this. The first time he arrives, they think he's a god. Because the technology that he's sailing on is just so advanced. It's like it blows their mind. Well, it's not just to do the technology, though.

It's also to do with the timing and the idea that they would be visited at certain time. It chimed with a religious belief or a calendar that they had, and so they happened to arrive at a time that suggested that as well. This is what some people believe, yeah, exactly. But they also felt the same about their leader as well. And I think that when Cook took him hostage, essentially he was seizing a god incarnate. That was, you know, that was their god. So this is part of the reason there was such an angry and violent reaction.

It's a little bit like the Brit. and like a 1980s package holiday who is maybe not respecting the local customs. That's James Cook. Exactly. Sort of thing, Thomas Cook would not stand for. I'm Peter Cook, we're right jokes about it. Exactly, exactly.

So apocryphly, it is often said that Cook was eaten by the Hawaiians, but nothing of that sort happened. Instead, his body was given an appropriate ceremony afforded to high-ranking dignitaries, including cremation of most of him. The point of this cremation was to allow other spirits, the manner to escape from the person's bones where the Hawaiians believe it resided.

And the remaining bones were returned to the Resolutions crew to bury at sea. And so Cook's life comes to an end. But his significance lived on coming from the sheer quality of his surveying and the charts and maps produced. And his scientific mind provided other gains as well. This is incredible, including the use of sauerkraut and other fermented food stuff to combat scurvy on long voyages. This thing that would ravage boats. He had something that would kind of keep it at bay. In fact, he believed that the idea of eating everything to survive

was just part of the adventure. There was one thing he did not like the taste of, though. Do you want to guess what that was? And I think I'm with him on this. Ruts. Penguin. I was a massive fan of penguin. Yeah.

The chocolate bars are fine. They are, exactly. It doesn't say here whether it was referring to the animal or the chocolate bar, so it could have been there. When he said to Australia, did he start eating Timta? Very good. Do you know what my Australian friend does, and others do? You bite the end, both ends off the timetam and you drink your tea through the timetam. Oh.

It's a thing that people do. And then finally, in 1966, there's one final piece of this legacy. Do you say 1960? Yes, I did indeed. When Cook became the inspiration for one of television's most famous explorers, Captain James T. Kirk from Star Trek. So that's his final bit of legacy. Really? Cook's famous line was, ambition leads me farther than any other man has been before me.

That was reshaped by the writers to become, to boldly go where no man has gone before. So that's where the idea for that line came from, and that's where the inspiration for this captain came from. So that is the story of the, you know, somewhat problematic, but also to be fair, he could draw a map, Captain James Cook. The other thing about Cook I read is that the islanders that killed him in the years after they had a lot of regret about. about it. And actually they had quite a lot of hardships in the years after that and they thought they were being punished. So they need a map. Yeah. But the maps, 10 out of 10. Yeah.

God, shit, we could have really done with that kind of maps. That's the end of part one of captains coming up. You're about to hear about the first ever commander of a US nuclear submarine. L, what are you going to tell us about? I'll be talking about captains. Got two great captains for you in part two. But if you want to get that part right now, plus bonus episodes, which include a recent clip show, plus an extra episode of July correspondence. You can get all that at patreon.com forward slash oh what a time. Otherwise, we'll see you tomorrow. Bye. Bye. Bye. Oh, what a time is now on Patreon. You can get main feed episodes before everyone else, ad free,

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