Oh What A Time... - #30 Discoveries (Part 1)

Episode Date: February 26, 2024

Get the shovel and the pastry brush, because this week we’re unearthing some of history’s greatest discoveries! The magnificent ancient bronze statues that have been found in Rome, the incredible story of Sutton Hoo, the marvel that is the Rosetta Stone and what a tough nut it was to crack; and the OWAT: Full Timers this week will get the proof that the Vikings made it to North America in our bonus part. Are there any historical discoveries that you’ve made that could possibly be on a par with Tom’s revelation that Oreos, milk and salt and vinegar crisps in your mouth at the same time is a taste sensation? Please let us know about that or anything else by emailing: [e-mail] This is Part One (Part Two will be out tomorrow), but if you want both parts now, why not become an Oh What A Time: FULL TIMER? In exchange for your £4.99 to support the show, you'll get: - the 4th part of every episode and ad-free listening - episodes a week ahead of everyone else - a bonus episode every month - And first dibs on any live show tickets Subscriptions are available via AnotherSlice, Apple and Spotify. For all the links head to: ohwhatatime.com You can follow us on: X (formerly Twitter) at @ohwhatatimepod And Instagram at @ohwhatatimepod Aaannnd if you like it, why not drop us a review in your podcast app of choice? Thank you to Dan Evans for the artwork (idrawforfood.co.uk). And thank you for listening! We’ll see you tomorrow for Part 2! BYE! Chris, Elis and Tom x Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I'm going back to university for $0 delivery fee, up to 5% off orders and 5% Uber cash back on rides. Not whatever you think university is for. Get Uber One for students. With deals this good, everyone wants to be a student. Join for just $4.99 a month. Savings may vary. Eligibility and member terms apply. How do stop losses work on Kraken? Let's say I have a birthday party on Wednesday night, but an important meeting Thursday morning. So, sensible me pre-books a taxi for 10 p.m. with alerts. Voila. I won't be getting carried away and staying out till 2.

That's stop-loss orders on Kraken. An easy way to plan ahead. Go to Kraken.com and see what crypto can be. Not investment advice. Crypto trading involves risk of loss. See Kraken.com slash legal slash CA dash PRU dash disclaimer for info on Kraken's undertaking to register in Canada. Looking for a collaborator for your career? A strong ally to support your next level success? You will find it at York University School of Continuing Studies, where we offer career programs purpose-built for you. Visit continue.yorku.ca. dot your cue dot ca Hello and welcome to Oh What A Time, a history podcast that tries to decide if the past was just really, really, really rubbish.

Not good enough, in the words of a football manager. That's not good enough, the past. You're not hitting your levels. Exactly. I'm Tom Crane. I'm Chris Scull. And I'm Ellis James. Each week on this show, we'll be looking at a new historical subject. And today, we're going to be discussing discoveries. Yes, bronze statues in ancient Rome, the Rosetta Stone, the Sutton Hoo, and proof the Vikings made it to North America in our bonus part this week.

And I have to say, I'm going to say this, this is a brave statement. I think this is my favourite subject we've covered so far. I'm interested in every single one of these things. I'm just poised for history. They're also, they're the kind of subjects that I think, even if you just have got a relatively broad general knowledge and you watch the news, they're the kind of things that pop up.

Like you'll probably hear a reference to Sutton Hoo or the Rosetta Stone every few months if you're kind of a pub quiz person maybe. So finally we're getting to the bottom of it. What is the greatest discovery you've ever made? I can tell you what mine is. What? And I do genuinely feel this. discovery you've ever made i can tell you what mine is well and i do genuinely feel this it it's the combination of um oreos uh salt and vinegar crisps and milk at the same time in my

mouth no this is this is the second time you've talked about this i'm saying no to that it's the best flavor combination and i will keep pushing it that is the discovery that i on my gravestone i want anything marked as an achievement in my life. I want it to be that. That's my discovery. It's an incredible, crazy combination that just works.

That is absolutely disgusting. I would say cheddar cheese and raisins. Oh, nice. Does that work? Yes. There's something quite confident about saying that's

absolutely disgusting and then following up with cheddar cheese and raisins. Cheddar cheese and raisins. You try and tempt a mouse out of a hole with. How does that work? Is it nice? There's a sweetness to the raisin and there's a cheesiness to the cheddar.

Yeah, absolutely. I suppose quince is a fruit-based thing, which goes with that. Yes, thank you. Okay, there is a pass there. And I think the other great discovery of my life has been Amazon Prime. Was it? It's not fashionable to say.

You know, it's killed off the high street. An awful lot of our small retailers who are listeners are going to be angry with what I said, but it is very, very quick. As a working parent. I mean, as someone who's not particularly organised, when it comes to birthdays, it's an absolute godsend. It is remarkable, that, isn't it?

It's so quick. You can have a Lego set the same day. Yeah. It'll be like 4pm and you'll be like, yep, I can have a hairdryer by 6. What, so it's my son's birthday today and I can have juggling balls by 10pm after he's gone to bed? That is unreal!

Admittedly, they're made by a brand I've never heard of. And there's 3,000 reviews, a lot of them saying I wouldn't really let my children play with these, but still, you know, needs must. But also, needs must, and I'm not going into it in a position of ignorance, from a position of ignorance. I know they're dangerous.

A little rival for that, by the way, and it's very quickly. Argos actually does same-day. It's pretty good. That's the other little save. They do same-day delivery. If you turn up. Does it? Yeah, it does.

Now, I did not know that. If you're feeling slightly awkward about Amazon Prime, may I suggest that? What about you, Chris? What's your favorite discovery? I had two big revelations last year. Firstly, both kind of genealogy related. The first one was that I didn't realise Tom Ravenscroft was the son of John Peel.

That blew my mind. I was like, what? Yeah, yeah, yeah. What? And the second one, I didn't realise that Nigella Lawson is the daughter of Nigel Lawson. That's hilarious. Chris, they've got the same name. Come on, mate. They are worlds apart.

The name being the same doesn't come into it. They are from very different eras. I mean, obviously. It is difficult to imagine Nigel Lawson, who was, I think, probably the first Chancellor of the Exchequer I remember. Yes. When you think of Nigel Lawson delivering his budget, you know, the big red box,

when you imagine him getting Nigella Lawson ready for school, it's really weird. Exactly. I'm not a politics expert, but did he sort of reveal the budget in a really sexy way, in the way that Nigella does when she's doing a cookie programme? Was he really sultry with a red box? I thought...

Sniffing it. It was because Ken Clarke used to deliver his budget with a glass of whiskey, didn't he? Yes, he did. Because they often have a little tot of something. I can't remember what Nigel Lawson's drink of choice was during the budget. But either way, I'm not going to go

at him. It sounds like I'm about to have a go at him. His daughter is considerably more sexy than he is. Yes. The discoveries just don't end. They keep coming. I'm not going to go at the man. But it is almost impossible to believe physically that, I mean,

his wife must have been very attractive. Yeah. And genetically, I would imagine his wife was doing the heavy lifting. Nigel Lawson's wife is doing a lot of the heavy lifting there in the creation of Nigella Lawson. So today is discoveries. That's what we're talking about today. Have we discovered any great correspondence this week?

Yes, we have. Great. Listen, the one-day snog machine has been really firing up our inbox this week. Oh, sorry. It sounds like we're doing a sort of lad-based banter pod now. One-day snog machine. You should briefly explain what that is chris and where that's come from the jingle would be bloody horrible wouldn't it no i'm not i'm not go back and listen to

previous episodes go but you basically would you use the one day time machine to go back and snog someone and if so yes who and he or she is always consenting and it's fine. I have a perfectly understandable concern about maybe going back to medieval Britain, for example, when oral hygiene wouldn't have been as good. And meeting someone you liked and then they taste of turnips. That's my main concern. A taste of turnips. Turnips and gum disease. A taste of turnips.

Mmm. Well, I'll just read you this whole email in full. It says, Jet from Gladiators regards Jim. Wow. We have a slightly more thought through We have a slightly more thought through One Day Snog Machine.

This is from Duncan Millen. I mean, it's a lot of men who are making use of the one-day-strong machine. Yeah, I know. It really does speak volumes, doesn't it? Let me just have another look. Suddenly, the lads have started emailing a history podcast. I just can't see any ladies

who are taking use of the one-day-strong machine. But okay, we're going to go with this one from Duncan Millen. He says, for brevity, guys, as all true historians know, the correct answer for one-day snog machine is not Marilyn Monroe, but is, of course, Helen of Troy, though perhaps more lad points if he managed to bag Mary as in the Virgin Mother. Love the show. Doubtless to make it through.

Keep up the good work. Helen of Troy. Has he explained why Helen of Troy has he explained why Helen of Troy er no okay that just sounds like

someone trying to be really highbrow at a dinner party they've been going around the table saying which celebrity you fancy most and people will be

naming you know models and all this sort of stuff and then he said can I shock you yeah yeah yeah probably Helen of Troy what who did I have

a poster of on my wall when I was a teenager Helen of Troy actually exactly yeah just a figure poster of on my wall when I was a teenager? Helen of Troy, actually. Exactly. Yeah, just a figure in Greek mythology said to be the most beautiful woman in the world. Yeah. The daughter of Zeus.

Actually, she's got a lot going for her, actually. Yeah. I won't have a Foster's, I'll have another sherry, thank you. Her booty inspired artists of all times to represent her oh wow frequently is the personification of

ideal human booty I don't think she existed though so it's like it's like going back in time and I don't know

trying to get off with Scrooge or something like an initial character as a teenager most of my girlfriends didn't exist either yeah

they were girls you met on holiday yeah that old chestnut exactly wouldn't stop me strutting back into school come september with great stories of her yeah i have got a girlfriend but she is living in centre parks in bedford forever and no you won won't meet her. No, she hasn't got a landline. She's never been photographed because she's shy. And that is just, you'll just have to take my word for it.

Is she fit? Mate, she looks like Helena Troi. Exactly. But Helena Troi is not a real person though. No. He's using one day snog machine Exactly. But Helena Troy's not a real person, though. No. Oh. He's using one day's snog machine to go back in time and get off with a drawing.

It's very weird. So if you want to go back and snog Betty Boo or anyone like that, here's how you can get in touch with the show. Jessica Rabbit. All right, you horrible lot. Here's how you can stay in touch with the show. You can email us at hello at oh, what a time dot com. And you can follow us on Instagram and Twitter at oh, what a time pod.

Now clear off. What does possible sound like for your business? Twitter at Oh What A Time Pod. Now clear off. Miss Platinum. Breaking news coming in from Bet365, where every nail-biting overtime win, breakaway, pick six, three-point shot, underdog win, buzzer beater, shootout, walk-off, and absolutely every play in between is amazing. From football to basketball and hockey to baseball, whatever the moment, it's never ordinary at Bet365. Must be 19 or older, Ontario only. Please play responsibly if you or

someone you know has concerns about gambling visit connectsontario.ca all right so on the show this week i'll be telling you about bronze statue discoveries of ancient rome in modern rome i will be talking about the rosetta storm at the end of the show i will be talking about the Rosetta Stone? At the end of the show, I will be talking about the discovery that Vikings made it to North America in our additional bit for subscribers. And first of all, to kick things off, I'm going to be talking to you about Sutton Who. Who?

So, exactly. Sutton Who, well, you'll find out. Doctor Who's sister or something. Sorry, just my idea. Insert your own gag there. Doctor Who's cousin. Okay. Just before you launch into this, can I say something?

There was a recent film about the Sutton Hoo discovery with Ralph Fiennes, I think it was. I never remember all the names of the Fiennes family. And I had never heard of the Sutton Hoo, and I was watching this film, having no knowledge of the of the Sutton Hoo, and I was watching this film, having no knowledge of the discovery of Sutton Hoo. I was like, what? Did this actually happen? I couldn't believe it. It's remarkable. Well, if you've seen that film, Chris, you'll have heard a lot of what I'm about

to talk about. So no spoilers for us. So Sutton Hoo, okay, is one of the most important Anglo-Saxon discoveries of all time. And what's kind of drastically important about it is it really shifted the way that people viewed the Dark Ages. It had a real impact. So I'm going to talk to you today about the discovery because it's quite an interesting story. I'm going to take you back to June 1939, quiet corner of Suffolk, just before the outbreak of Second World War. So there's a group of amateur archaeologists working in the village of Sutton Hoo, which is near Ipswich. And they revealed an intact medieval burial, complete with a longship, into which a dead individual had been placed to take them to their journey into the afterlife. Now, can you imagine how exciting that would be if you were an amateur archaeologist? You'd start digging and you'd be like, oh, this looks good.

After a couple of minutes, fucking hell. Is it another crisp packet? No, it's not. Jesus Christ! The beef's not jesus christ decent reason it's an ing it's literally an ing in a boat god i wish we were professionals i'm a little bit worried i'm messing this up no absolutely it's incredible um so they found this boat into which an individual had been buried, and this boat was to take them on their final journey to the afterlife. Brief question on that.

We're thinking about this. What vehicle would you like to be buried in as a way of getting to the afterlife? I'm going, if you're interested, four by four with central locking. Because I don't know what the afterlife is going to be like. I want to be able to lock the doors. I want it to be able to deal with certain different terrain. Smart car. Gets you from E to B.

Eurofighter. Oh, nice. Okay. That's good. A bit aggressive, though, for the afterlife. Get there in a minute. Yeah, absolutely. Eurofighter suggests that you're not

entirely convinced you're going up to the good afterlife either that suggests that part of you thinks you're going down and you need

you need to be prepared you need to be heavily armed heavily armed turning up in hell heavily armed come on then let's have it

with eight cruise missiles under each wing that would be a great film you get buried Eight cruise missiles onto each wing. That would be a great film. You get buried with all this heavy artillery and you turn up in hell. You just have to survive as long as you can. But also you're blowing Stalin and Hitler to bits. And where does that leave you, hell-wise?

Yeah, because isn't that what they want? Yeah. Like, if you're blowing, you know, some of history's greatest monsters to bits in your Eurofighter in hell, does God look at that and think, he's probably got himself a promotion to purgatory at the very least. No one has ever gone to hell and redeemed themselves.

Apart from this absolute nutcase. Until now. Who was incredibly heavily armed. Who chose a Eurofighter for the afterlife. Let's say you're allowed to be buried with two objects. One that you can use

in case you go to hell. One to heaven. I'm taking an Uzi. A hand grenade for hell. The complete works of Shakespeare. Would you?

Okay, I'm taking sweet chilli sauce for heaven because I need it on everything. So it's, I'm taking sweet chilli sauce for heaven because I need it on everything. And then so it's an oozy and sweet chilli sauce, whatever way I go. So this incredible find, okay, this incredible find would not have been found if it wasn't for one amazing woman, who you will have seen in the film, Chris, her name was Edith Pretty. And on her ground for years, she'd been fascinated by these 18 unusual mounds. There were

these mounds basically in her garden. She just didn't know what they were. She was so interested so much that she spoke to the curator of the Ipswich Museum, a guy called Guy Maynard, who agreed that the mounds should be investigated. He thought, yes, there is something unusual about these. So he proposed a local self-taught archaeologist called basil brown should lead the project to discover if these mounds contained anything so the first dig began in 1938 initially just scheduled for two weeks however and i love this brown didn't have any professional tools so he he just used stuff that was in edith's house oh my god including the first one's a coal shovel, which I like,

and the second one's absolutely my favourite, her pastry brush. Oh my God. I think as soon as he was getting my pastry brush out of the drawer, I'd be thinking, this might not be the guy for the job. Is this guy legit? And who doesn't have a shovel? Yeah, yeah. I know even if you're an amateur archaeologist,

surely you have a shovel. How amateur are you that you're just using your hands previously? But also, it's so delicate, this stuff, and it's so fragile. And that is why they've got to be so careful. And because this is such a significant discovery, I don't know if any of this stuff got damaged by a lot of amateurs, but it does make you think, could they not have sent the professionals down? Well, at a point you will see they do arrive.

Would you use your pastry brush again if it had previously been used to excavate an Anglo-Saxon grave? Or would you go and might get a new one? Slightly worried it'd be cursed. Nothing good would ever come. You'd never cook a good pastry again. That would be the curse. Notice a tooth between two of the hairs.

Well, you've got friends round, and you're giving them some, I don't know, it's a chicken and mushroom pie, and you're like, there you go. No, it's actually my mother's recipe. Yeah, no, no. The top, ignore the bits on the top. That's, as a sideline, I excavate Anglo-Saxon burial grounds. Just forget it.

Do you know what I would do? I would cut the pie open and then eat the middle. Excuse me, there's a hair in my pie. Can I shock you? That's not actually my hair. That's an Anglo-Saxon hair. That's a thousand years old. So initial attention was given to three mounds, okay?

And he quickly found pottery and axe and rivets from a ship. And that very quickly made him think, okay, this is a burial site. This must be a burial site. And these rivets were sent to Alderberg Museum so they could be compared to another ship that had been excavated sometime before called the Snape ship. And indeed, these rivets were shown to be of a similar style. And so more digging was scheduled for 1939. digging was scheduled for 1939. And when Brown returned in early May, he then turned his attention to the largest mound on the site, which if I was an archaeologist, what I'd do first, surely you'd go, I'll go for the big one.

Yeah. But he's gone for the small one first, but that's what's happened. And he starts excavating this large mound and soon more rivets are found and indications that below is buried a substantial ship. Now you talk about that excitement, Ellis. The idea of scratching away the surface and then finding something as huge as that. It must be, I can't even begin to imagine what that feeling must be like.

My degree was in modern history. Yeah. And when I used to talk to the archaeologists in the archaeology department, I did start to think, it's not my area of expertise, and I've never studied it, but doing digs must be fantastic fun,

and it must be really, really interesting. And it's the kind of thing that I sort of, if I wasn't so busy with work and the children, I would love to volunteer at a dig. Yes. Because I think everything you found would be exciting. Yeah. It may not be a fair comparison, but think about how at a dig. Yes. Because I think everything you found would be exciting. Yeah. It may not be a fair comparison,

but think about how exciting a scratch card is. And there might be three little pots of gold meaning you've won a tenner. Now, replace those pots of gold with an Anglo-Saxon ship. Historic scratch cards. Exactly. When you think about the great discoveries, Tutankhamun's tomb is obviously up there,

but it doesn't have the scale of a ship. You know, an actual seafaring ship. That is real... That's the thing I love about digs, is that it's real history. You can touch it. You can see it. Yeah, yeah.

You know, it's like that element that item has time traveled into your hands and also this item is an item which completely shifted the way that people viewed an entire period of history is as you'll find out so uh these indications proved correct they dusted away and there was a grand ship under underneath if i did dig, what would happen is I would get excited at everything, right? So say my boss was called, I don't know, Sandra or Andy. Every single thing I found,

I'd be like, Sandra, Andy! Andy! And they'd be like, that, Ellis, is a 50p from 1989. I'd be like, okay, okay, sorry,

sorry, sorry. You can keep that, Ellis. That's yours. I found something. It's a scratch card from 2016. So they find this grand ship, and as you've predicted, very quickly the national authorities are drafted into hell. Poor old Basil.

Including the British Museum, Cambridge University, who decided that in 1939, from July, Charles Phillips, who was a fellow of Selwyn College, Cambridge, he should take charge of the dig. So Basil Brown was demoted. I feel genuinely gutted for him. Finding a huge ship and then being told, yeah, you and your pastry brush aren't needed anymore. Basil, fuck off, mate.

What? But my off, mate. What? But my pastry... Yeah, go on. Off you go. I bet as he was walking away, the pastry brush hit him on the back of the head, hurled by someone from Cambridge University. Well, in fact, he wasn't quite as sad as that

in that he had a brief period before they arrived that he was allowed to continue excavating. In fact, by the time Phillips and the Cambridge team arrived, the entire ship had been uncovered by Basil. He had done that. Wow. Apart from the burial chamber. So the one bit that was left to be excavated was a burial chamber. And when this new team opened up the burial chamber, they found a treasure trove.

They found the Sutton Hoo helmet, which is just an incredibly intricate iron helmet. It's a beautiful piece. If you haven't seen it, do go online. We'll pop it on our Instagram. It's incredible. They found weapons. They found a shield. They found clothing buckles, all this stuff which had been handcrafted. Incredible objects. Objects that were such value, they immediately decided to be regalia. And with most scholars concluding the man buried with Sutton Hoo was a king, namely a man called Rawald, king of the East Angles, who reigned in the first quarter of the 7th century.

That's incredible, isn't it? And these pieces were so important that Edith Pretty immediately employed a team of police officers to stand guard around the site to keep looters away. And soon after, an inquest was... I know, because it really caught the public consciousness. It actually wasn't meant to hit the press. Nobody was supposed to find out about it.

But quite interestingly, Ipswich Museum, who'd initially been involved in kind of hooking them up with Basil Brown, was so annoyed that they'd been booted out of this work that they leaked it to the press themselves. And that's how the public found out about it. And then an inquest was was taken to find out who should take ownership of these incredible items and they were given to edith edith it was said that as it was her land edith owned them and she donated the entire lot to the british museum rather than sell them she could have made endless money but

donated them to the nation so the nation could enjoy them. Interestingly, because she donated them during World War II, instead of going directly into display in the British Museum, they were stored in the underground rail network to protect them from bombs. So they were placed under the ground in London in the tube network so they would be safe throughout and the nation didn't join them became completely fascinated by them and this this is kind of the interesting point I'm going to close on the reason they completely changed the way that we view

the dark ages is because of the worldly nature of the goods that were found inside so here's some examples there was a silver platter bearing a maker's mark from Constantinople there were bowls from the Byzantine empire there were spoons from the same empire with Greek inscriptions. There were coins from the Frankish kingdom. There were decorative garments as far away from India and Sri Lanka. That's incredible. We had this idea of the dark ages being people just stuck in muddy huts and fighting for their lives and with no idea of culture or travel, all this sort of stuff. But this completely turned the way people viewed the dark age. Yeah, trade and how can I put it, sort of cultural exchange.

That's exactly it. Cultural exchange, that's the nail on the head, exactly what it was. This one find by this amateur archaeologist and this lady who just had a, it's just a fascination with these strange markings in her garden and a pastry brush

led to a complete shift in the way that people viewed the Anglo-Saxon period and the Dark Ages. It's amazing. Yeah. So there you go. That's the discovery

of Sutton Hoo. Really going to have to think of some foreign items to stash in my Eurofighter when I get buried with it. Could be a football top like an Argentina, the one that Maradona used to wear, that sort of thing. There you are.

Show of interest, exactly. Okay, so that's the end of part one. If you want to hear part two now, you can sign up and become an Oh What A Time full-timer by clicking on your app and finding the links or going to ohwhattatime.com. Just £4.99 a month. You'll get full shows on the Monday, the whole show in one piece, an additional part at the end of every episode. First dibs on tickets for live shows that come out. There'll be no ads in your feed and other things to boot.

So do join up if that sounds good to you. If not, join us tomorrow and you'll hear the rest of the show then. And thanks so much for joining us Thank you.