Ologies with Alie Ward - Spesh Ep: Drawdown Design Project with C. Andrew Hall

Episode Date: September 1, 2021

Art meets science! Problems meet solutions! Climate change meets … hope? In this atypical episode, things get casual as hell as Alie sits down to talk about the Drawdown Design Project: an illustration non-profit started by filmmaker, Emmy-nominated television editor and longtime friend Andy Hall. When he’s not having to edit Alie on Innovation Nation, Andy is the founder and creative director of the Drawdown Design Project, which commissioned some of the world’s most sought-after artists to illustrate climate solutions outlined by Drawdown.org. What resulted was the just-released limited-edition 200 print run of ENGAGE, EMPOWER, CULTIVATE and ELECTRIFY. Andy walks me through the passion, the production and the process of raising money for rainforests while making something gorgeous and uplifting. Also: I used to serve snacks on film sets.Get one of the 200 limited-edition Drawdown Design Project printsFollow Drawdown Design Project on Instagram and maybe win a poster!More info on climate solutions at Drawdown.orgMore about the illustratorsENGAGE by Brian SteelyCULTIVATE by Tula LotayEMPOWER by Khary RandolphELECTRIFY by MalleusA donation went to Rainforest CoalitionMore episode sources & links Sponsors of OlogiesTranscripts & bleeped episodesBecome a patron of Ologies for as little as a buck a monthOlogiesMerch.com has hats, shirts, totes, masks… Follow @ologies on Twitter and InstagramFollow @alieward on Twitter and InstagramSound editing by Jarrett Sleeper of MindJam Media & Steven Ray MorrisTranscripts by Emily White of The WordaryWebsite by Kelly R. Dwyer

Okay, it's technically expired yogurt. That's probably still fine and maybe even more alive. Allie Ward, back with a promised special episode of Allergies. Oh, what a couple of weeks it's been. My God. If you're a patron at Patreon.com slash Allergies, you know that I was in the ER and why, but if you're not and you're like, what, did you die? I did not, but I will one day, but just not today. At the end of the episode, during the secret portion, I'll tell you why I found myself in the ER for seven hours during a pandemic. But I thought I deserved some weekend loafing. I said to myself, fuck all, let's make this intended bonus episode a full blown Tuesday one, shall we? We shall, we did, here we are.

Okay, so this is a really great conversation with my old pal, C Andrew Hall. He is an Emmy award nominated editor, my first friend I ever made in LA decades ago, and the person who really helped me pave my path to being a science communicator by introducing me to the fine folks at Innovation Nation on CBS, which we're now shooting our eighth season. I'm recording this in a hotel room outside of Detroit shooting, actually, to be honest. Innovation Nation, check your local listings. It's on Saturdays, CBS. But first, I want to say thank you to all the folks supporting via Patreon.com slash Allergies. Thank you to everyone who recommends Allergies to friends and family and who writes, of course, to everyone who leaves reviews, such as this fresh one. It was written

by Sev, 12345. I have a feeling not the real name. But they said, I have severe depression, and listening to this podcast makes me feel so much better. Thank you, Alli. Sev, 12345. Thank you for finding the time to write that, and I really appreciate you back. I hope this episode helps with some of the existential gloom we all feel. Actually, I know it well. So let's get into it. Okay. So Andy first told me about the Drawdown Design Project two years ago. He was vexed by climate change, and he was inspired by the Drawdown Project discussed in the How to Save a Planet episode that we aired last week. And so Drawdown is the point at which greenhouse gases start to decline, which is the goal of folks aiming to reverse human-caused climate change.

So you will hear how Andy has always had environmentalism in mind and the power of art to start conversations and movements, how to approach climate change feeling less terrified and more empowered, how optimism helps scientists find solutions, and the social and cultural aspects of eco concerns, how sexism is not healthy for anyone really, plus solar panels, babies, steak, Zeus, voting, comic books, movie posters, snack tables, what choices you make matter most, and how commissioning the world's best artists and illustrators to make climate gig posters is his calling in life. So I went over to his house one night, after his kiddos were in bed, we were sip and whiskey, and we were talking solutions and shooting

the shit. With my old, old friend who is also the guy who now has to edit me on Innovation Nation every week, and the founder and creative director of the non-profit Drawdown Design Project, Andy Hall. Did you nerd? Do you know who the fucking editor is? Me. And the tables have turned. I know how many hours of my stupid face have you had to edit. I know. Okay. First thing I make you do is if you can say your first and last name and your pronouns. Are we on? Yeah, we're on. My name is C. Andrew Hall. Everyone calls me Andy. My pronouns are him, his, him. Yep. Okay. Correct. How long have we known each other, C. Andrew Hall?

Oh my God. 1999. I know. So that is 22 years. That's crazy. Do people want to hear our meeting story? Is that the kind of content people want? I think it's relevant. You were one of my first non- like came here, moved with roommates. Like you were one of my first people friends that I met in LA. Me too. And at the time you had a ponytail and Birkenstocks. I never wore Birkenstocks. I realized how you could add that to the image based on what I looked like, but I definitely never wore Birkenstocks. Did you wear Tivas? I probably wore Tivas. Okay. Potato, potato. Well, I disagree, but. Okay. They're a different vibe. They're a different vibe. Yeah. So I met you. You were a PA or you were a DGA trainee. I was a production assistant in Barbie commercial. Yeah.

And I was working craft service. Was it Taco Bell or Jack-O-Box? It was Taco Bell. Before we move on, I think people should know about your craft service table. Okay. Yeah, we talk about it. I still stand by it. I stand by standing by that craft service table. So when I was as production assistant on the Barbie commercial, I was stuck in this hallway and also in the hallway. Same hallway, but from the stage next door in the Taco Bell commercial was Allie Ward and the craft service table. And I've seen a lot of craft service tables in my day and I'm pretty sure this is the cutest, quirkiest, funnest craft service table ever, right? You need levels. Levels. You had the risers. I had risers. Right? And with the tablecloth over it. Yep. So each

item was on its own little pedestal. Yep. And then you had a little placard for each item. Oh yeah. Yeah. You got to label it. People need to know, are these peanut butter pretzels? Are these sour patches? Right. What am I about to eat here? Is this hummus? Is this a cliff bar? Yes. What is it? Right. And you know, when Allie posts on her Instagram, she has that blackboard with that like Allie font that like tells you what theologist is. That is the exact handwriting. That's Allie's handwriting. I assume everyone knows that. I don't know. That's the exact handwriting that was on each placard. And the funny thing is that's not like, she doesn't try to do that. That's how Allie writes. Like if it was a grocery list, like that's

what it looks like. You're not wrong. You're not wrong. But I remember you were stuck by this Barbie door for so long and I was like, your craft service sucks if you want to eat some of ours. It's like, you know, go get some cheese, man. And then we start a conversation and we've been friends forever. It's a good thing at a good craft service table. Yes. And now I'm on your podcast. I know. What the fuck? I didn't realize that you had studied environmental engineering. Yes. So what did your, is that where your bachelor's is in? Yes. In environmental engineering? Yes. How did you get into film? I worked on a set when I was a senior in college and I got the bug and I moved to LA and then I ended up on a Barbie commercial next to Allie Ward.

The rest, as they say, is history. It's just slowly warming seawater rising under a bridge. So in the interim, we both got married. Andy is now the dad to two adorable kiddos with his wife, Dr. Erica Hall. And a few years ago, Andy bought the 2017 book Drawdown, the most comprehensive plan ever proposed to reverse global warming by environmental scientists Paul Hawken and Catherine Wilkinson, who was on last week's guest episode, How to Save a Planet. And Catherine and Dr. Ayanna Elizabeth Johnson co-edited the book, All We Can Save About Climate Solutions 2. But sorry, we're getting ahead of ourselves here. Tell me about Drawdown. Tell me about what kind of captivated you about that research and about that book that you read.

It's just basically a list of solutions to global warming, both sinks that suck greenhouse gases out of the atmosphere and ways to reduce putting more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere. And it's very nerdy and just like math. It's just like they got statistics, a bunch of scientists, they modeled all these solutions, and they just made a list of which are the different ones, which are maybe the best and what we should focus on. And it's like, I really responded to how pragmatic it is. It's super apolitical. It's just like, here's what we need to do. And it's so inspiring because, A, when you read it, you learn we have the solutions. This is something that is completely doable. And you realize how practical the problem is. It's just this practical problem that we have

to solve. It's not this pie in the sky thing. And the way the media covers climate change, the way climate anxiety spreads online, there's this fog around what to do about it. And this really cuts through that. It's just like, here's what we need to do. Here's a list. I just found that really inspiring because I don't encounter that a lot, right? When you're doom-scrolling on your phone, it's not this really pragmatic list of the things you just need to do. It's partially my personality. I just respond to that kind of thing. Yeah, I think a lot of us are like, do I use paper straws? Will things get better then? And all of us are very confused about our individual responsibility versus how can we move a needle politically or socially so that

this can kind of reverse itself? 100%. Yeah. I remember we met up for coffee when you found this book and you were like, what do you think some of the biggest contributors to global warming are? What are some of the biggest changes we need to make? And yeah, I was like, we got to stop toasting bagels. I didn't know. The fun game is to ask that question. Do you ever do that at cocktail parties? Anyone want to guess what's number three on the list? I mean, I've tried. That's not the best cocktail party. It's hard to do that. You have to pick your moments with that game. But yeah, it's really fun because when you look at the book, it's not always the things you think it's going to be. Which is the whole point. We don't have these conversations enough

and everyone runs around in their own little anxiety bubble about how it's their individual responsibility to reverse climate change. No one wants to be the bummer at a dinner party and the problem seems so enormous. So we don't talk about it in casual, positive, proactive ways. But when Andy showed me this drawdown book list, my verbatim reaction was like, wait, wait, wait, what? I did not know about this. What? If I recall correctly. Probably, I said the F word more times, but whatever. How many can you list off from memory in order? Probably at least the first couple, I'm sure. Well, it honestly, it keeps changing because they keep updating it. But the number one thing, I think it's no longer number one,

but the number one thing when the book first came out was properly recycling your refrigerants. Shocking. I'm like refrigerant. I had never heard that refrigerants were even a problem in terms of global warming until we were sitting in that coffee shop. It's a huge problem. And what's great about that one is it's not, it's something we think we can all agree on. Let's just recycle our refrigerants properly. It doesn't require a revolution in the energy sector. It doesn't require everyone to stop flying to see their grandmother. It's like the kind of thing that we could just do. And since the book came out, there has been a lot of movement on that.

And there is a lot of that happening. And those are the kind of things that are easy, you know, low hanging fruit solutions. Okay, what is up with refrigerants? It is not a chill situation. So hydrofluorocarbons are organic compounds. They're made of carbon, fluorine, and hydrogen atoms, but they're made by humans. And they can warm the atmosphere a thousand to 9,000 times more than carbon dioxide. Oopsie. We made this stuff. So a lot of the leakage about 90% happens at the disposal phase. So can we just use something else? When we can, there are natural things like propane and ammonium that are less hard on the planet. And so hydrofluorocarbons are starting to get phased out now more. There was even legislation

about winding down their production that was kind of just tucked in, just kind of crammed in there into the COVID-19 relief bill that was passed in December 2020, which is why voting in local elections and congressional ones has more impact than the paper bag that you had to use at Trader Joe's because you stopped on the way home from work and you forgot your usual tote. Stop beating yourself up about it. Forgive yourself. I forgive you. What are some of the other big ones? I mean, the big one is really electrifying everything. So the big ones in the energy sector are if you're trying to electrify your sources of energy, that's obviously solar farms, onshore and offshore wind, rooftop solar, nuclear, which is

controversial. There's other funky ones like burning biomass and converting waste to energy, but the big ones are all kinds of solar and wind power, really. And that's the main thing that really needs to happen. Yeah, is stop combusting a bunch of coal and barfing carbon into the atmosphere. Yeah, exactly. And let's start using all of this solar radiation that is bombarding the planet anyway. Absolutely. And I'm not a client scientist, nor am I an energy expert, but I'm just inspired by how doable it really is. All this technology exists. It doesn't need to be invented. It's way ahead of where anyone thought it was going to be 10 years ago. And we, and by way, I mean politicians and people who run big companies,

they, if we get them to, could just do it. It would be easy. Not easy is made with the wrong word, but it's doable. It's not completely unfeasible. We're not just on a crash course toward an incinerating planet where everyone's children and babies are all just crackling toast because it's too hot. Correct. It's worth noting that it's worth noting that no one really thinks that's going to happen in one of the worst circumstances, despite the fact that the media makes it seem like that's what's going to happen. But there are really terrible outcomes that we can still avoid. Right. I feel like when you started looking into this, you seemed like you were very motivated by the fact that you had a daughter, a very cute, smart, wonderful daughter, and you

thought, oh, I got to leave this place better than I found it, I suppose. So is that what motivated good old DDP, the Drawdown Design Project? Yeah, it's certainly part of it. And the other thing that happens when you have kids is it's like instant ego death. You just sort of reevaluate what matters. It's such a cliche, but it's completely true. You just realize all the bullshit that you've been spending your time on in your 20s is like, maybe it doesn't really matter. You see the clock ticking and you think, yeah, what can I work on? What can I do? I feel the same way about Grammy. She's going to die before me, but I'm still like, how can the planet be better for her?

But had you ever taken on a design project like this before? I mean, you've directed and you've produced and you've edited and you've been nominated for Emmys and all this stuff. I mean, no, in the sense of illustration, definitely not. But it wasn't initially, I didn't initially come to illustration. I was initially, after I read this book, just inspired by it and frustrated by how this approach to climate change, I didn't see that reflected in at least the media and art and conversations that I was having. So I wanted this way of seeing that we have the solutions positive mindset. I wanted to see more of that in the world. And when I didn't, then I started thinking about me, how could I get it into the

world? Yeah, we were talking about how it's not necessarily something you would bring up at a cocktail party at this stage in where we're at with culture. But I remember you saying, I want something that you can hang on the wall that would be a beautiful art piece that you could talk about with people so that climate change and what we needed to do as people wasn't just like, well, we're fucked. But actually, okay, this is a conversation I'm having. And I also think it should be noted that a big fan of fish and gig posters, is that kind of what led you to do something so visual? Yeah, of course. I mean, there is an aspect of it where I'm a comic book fan, and I love gig posters, and I love alternative movie posters. And because I knew that world and

I knew those illustrators, it just seemed obvious, an obvious way to tap into that kind of talent. And just to make cool climate art, you know, I mean, I'm trying to give a nice way to say this, you know, like, there's just a lot of really lame climate art out there. We don't need any more crying earths. We don't need any more sad polar bears on a nice flow. You know, we don't need another, there's no Planet B poster. I just want to see some cool climate art that's positive and reflects the excitement that there is going on in the kind of climate solution community. So in the Is Your Carbon Footprint BS episode of How to Save a Planet that we ran last week, Dr. Johnson and Alex Bloomberg talked about how the

term carbon footprint was pushed by fossil fuel companies to kind of shift the environmental burden onto consumers, sort of a why are you hitting yourself move, but involving mass extinctions. And then they crunched some numbers to reveal that the average American's pretty big carbon footprint, it's 16 tons of emissions yearly, is 0.00000003% of global emissions. So they said that is a decimal point, and then nine zeros, and then a three. So yes, pitching into lower ours matters, but there are big systemic things that are at work here. So the drawdown team of over 200 scientists and policymakers made a list of technically viable existing solutions and found that refrigerants were a big deal. Food waste is another big one. Family planning,

tropical forest restoration for carbon sinks, and onshore wind turbines were also biggies. So big solutions to big problems. So Andy read this and was inspired to help communicate these strategies in a very visually arresting way. He also loves concerts. So think of a gig poster or a movie poster or comic book art. He commissioned for each with one theme. We're going to describe them each. Also, just so you know, I really believe in this project from its very inception. I make no money from this. Obviously, this is a nonprofit endeavor. I'm actually buying some and we're doing a giveaway on Instagram this week via Allergy's Instagram and the drawdown design project Instagram. So follow drawdown design project on Instagram. But yes, the designs.

How did you come to the four that you decided on? Well, to be honest, with your help, I got together a room full of interesting people and we just talked about it. Way smarter than us. Way smarter than us. There were some scientists and some people in marketing and just some smart people we know. Yeah, we just looked through the book and all the different solutions and just kind of talked it through and kind of narrowed it down to four climate change solution themes. So the first one that I really wanted to present was like political engagement. When people list the things that anyone can do for climate change, they list that you should stop flying and you should drive

an electric car and you should do a plant-based diet. And yes, those are great if you want to reflect your values in your everyday life. But really, to me, you should vote for climate candidates and you should send money to climate organizations. There are a lot of studies that show that if you send money to organizations that are lobbying for climate change solutions, like that just impact dwarfs anything else you can do. So our first print is called Engage and it's about political engagement. That one is by this gig poster artist named Brian Steeley. And I knew his work because I'm a fish fan and I've seen his work at fish shows. And he has this really cool monoline style and it depicts three figures whose their arms are joined and

they're all presenting themselves as being engaged in the climate fight. So one has a ballad and she's maybe pushing it into a ballad box that shaped like the earth. There's a fun fisherman looking guy who has a megaphone who is shouting for his rights and there's another guy with a placard who's probably marching. And I didn't prescribe these images to the illustrators. Like I gave them the solutions that their print was going to be inspired by and they just went with it. Oh, that's great. Yeah. What was it like for Engage when you got some of the first art back? It was pretty exciting, you know, because it definitely, it's fun when you have this idea in your head of what you want something to be and then you collaborate with someone else who's really

talented and they do a better job and you get to see it. And it was just really fun learning about the printing process. So these are all screen printed, which is a really analog process with this traditional to gig posters, which is so it's not like a digital inkjet printer. If you haven't seen it before, it's like a press and the printer makes a screen for each color layer. And then they individually press each layer of ink onto the paper. So it's a very analog process. And the prints themselves have like a ton of texture. The paper on this one is this really cool blue cover stock. And so when you see the blue on that one, that's just the raw paper. So when you touch the blue part, it's just raw paper. There's no ink there. And then the rest

of it is the inked colors. It's just a combination of a super fun image that is inspired by climate change solutions. And the idea is you hang something like this on your wall. And when you first see it, the text that tells you what the solutions are is not, doesn't dominate the image. And so the idea is that it's kind of an art piece first, and then it allows people to ask, hopefully they ask you what it is. And then if you are familiar with the solutions that it's inspired by, then you can have a fun conversation about what those solutions are. And all the solutions are things that you can do. None of these prints depict things you shouldn't do. Because a lot of environmental language and press and propaganda around environmentalism is really negative focused.

It's really like about austerity and the things you shouldn't do. And that is important. There is a place for that. But I really wanted these to be positive about things that you can do affirmatively. Right. Rather than things you're doing wrong, you should be ashamed of yourself. I don't think, I think we've got plenty of shame. People who, people who believe in climate change and believe in the climate science and are scared about it, they feel bad enough. I don't think, I think there was a place for that initially. But I think now we need to start getting excited about what the world can look like if we do these things. And so the aim is to galvanize people and to essentially kind of get them

excited about making some change and yeah, being more involved. Yeah. And just be as fun as you should be fun. Yeah. And pretty. And pretty. And just, yeah, the whole, the point is to do something fun and exciting and like positive. You know, I want people to feel good. Right. Tell me about Cultivate. Cultivate is inspired by plant-based solutions to climate change. And it is by a UK-based artist. Her pen name is Tula Lotte. Her real name is Lisa Wood.

I've been a fan of hers forever. She does, she's a comic book artist. She's done some a really cool stuff for Marvel and a bunch of other comic companies. She also has done a bunch of alternative movie posters for Manda, which is how I know her. She has this incredible Mulholland Drive poster. And yeah, she was on my short short list and she said yes. Was it, was it bananas getting emails back from people that you really liked their work? And they were like, yeah, sure, I'm done. Yes, it was bananas.

Cut bangs, text your art crushes, eat more plants because your body and mind will thank you, to be honest. Your guts and forehead are going to be like, finally, finally, bitch. So for her, it was plant-based solutions. The background is all pink and the main figure is a woman in a blue dress. She's probably a farmer. You know, she's carrying a big bundle of wheat that is just gorgeously drawn. The detail in it is so, so beautiful. And she's got a bamboo pole over her shoulder and she's kind of looking off into the distance. You know, I kind of go back and forth. I don't know if she's sad or determined. It's just a beautiful image. It's, you know, like a lot of great illustrations. It's hard to pin down exactly what it means.

It's just, it's evocative when you see it. Every single one of these artists, when they sent me their initial idea, they would send the idea and they would invariably say, but you know, I'll tone it down a little is what they would say, because I think they were reacting to what they have normally seen in like climate art is this sort of NPR tote bag, sort of toned down, let's not be too crazy sensibility. And I would always email back and be like, do not under any circumstances tone it down. Go as crazy as you possibly can. Like the whole point is for this to be as expressive as possible. And then what about empower? I feel like empower is one of the most colorful of the bunch too. Yeah. So empower is about, so empower is inspired by

solutions to climate change based around health and education, primarily for women and girls. This one was, this one was, it took a long time to decide whether or not to include this one in the set because this is a controversial set of solutions to climate change. And if you're interested, I encourage you to go to the project drawdown site and read more about it there. They have a great way of talking about it. But these solutions, which are basically education equity, educating girls, giving girls access to family planning, and I included climate justice on this one because that seemed to fit in the theme of empowerment. But those first two solutions, education equity and giving girls access to family planning are controversial because

the basis of that solution is there'll be less people. Okay, let's get into this. So this is the drawdowns health and education solution. And there are a few components to it. First is universal education. So the drawdown website reports that 62 million girls around the world are kept from their right to education, but that making school affordable, helping girls overcome health barriers, reducing the time and distance to get to school, and making schools more girl friendly would help. And they say, quote, educated girls realize higher wages and greater upward mobility, contributing to economic growth, their rates of maternal mortality drop as do mortality rates of their babies. And education also equips girls and women to face the impacts of climate change.

They can be more effective stewards of food, soil, trees, and water, even as nature's cycles change, quote, which this brings up the family planning issue. So according to drawdown research, women with more years of education have fewer and healthier children and are better prepared to actively manage their reproductive health. I'm just going to quote the drawdown project directly here. They say, quote, some 225 million women in lower income countries say they want the ability to choose whether and when to become pregnant, but lack the necessary access to contraception. And the need persists in some high income countries as well, including the United States, where 45% of pregnancies are unintended. Currently, the world faces a $5.3 billion funding

shortfall for providing the access to reproductive health care that women say they want to have, end quote. Obviously, that gender language was binary, but non-binary and trans folks, I see you too. And the drawdown continues, honoring the dignity of women and children through family planning is not about governments forcing the birth rate down or up through natalist policies, nor is it about those in rich countries where emissions are highest, telling people elsewhere to stop having children. When family planning focuses on health care provision and meeting women's expressed needs, empowerment, equality, and well-being are the result. The benefits to the planet are side effects. So okay, what's the numerical bottom line here?

How much do health and education really impact the planet? So by centering human rights issues of reproductive health and universal education over the next 30 years, it would reduce or sequester 85.4 gigatons, gigatons of carbon dioxide, which is great if you weren't already sold on the more people having access to education and control of their own reproductive planning stuff. Personally, I am all for people of all genders getting the school they want and getting to make their own reproductive choices. Bonus, just a lot less loose carbon boiling the oceans. But this is one of those things that as you're researching solutions to climate change, you discover that even if there was no global warming, all of these things are worth doing.

All these solutions to climate change have all these incredible co-benefits. And so even if educating girls and giving them access to family planning made climate change worse, it would still be worth doing. But it just so happens that in the modeling and project drawdown, it reduces greenhouse gases over time. So it's a controversial one. I decided to include it because I have a daughter and I just believe in these things for women all over the world, regardless of climate change. I'll leave it at that. Also, some of our biggest voices I feel like in climate advocacy are women who had access to education and were empowered to use their voices. Yes. Well, if you look at the review of this in project drawdown, they describe how when women

get access to education, and we're primarily talking about women in other countries other than Western countries, they tend to rise into leadership roles and they tend to be leaders in a way that is climate friendly. In the businesses they run and the leadership positions they take, there's just a lot of knock-on and co-benefits to making sure women and girls have a fair shake all over the world. And just in general, gender equity across the spectrum, I feel like when there's more recognition of that, that tends to apply toward LGBTQ and trans folks in general, where we're just trying to across the board get more equity for people. Yes. Which is a good thing no matter what. Yes. Which is great.

Andy wrote me a note afterward just to reiterate how passionate he is about the co-benefits of these solutions. He says, climate justice also lifts people out of poverty. Access to family planning also lets girls choose their own path. Electrification also frees people from the silent epidemic of killer air pollution. Wildland protection also saves us humans places to enjoy, regenerative agriculture also makes produce more nutritious and saves farmers money, plant-rich diets also have personal health benefits. He says nearly all climate change solutions are worth doing even if global warming was a non-issue. Now I also love that he's made these posters and these visuals that can spark conversations and as they're doing it, remind

us to get more involved in the things that do move the needle. So if you can help reverse climate change, you can also clean out the garage. You can write a novel. You can adopt a bunny like you've always wanted to live your life. You can do it. So the next poster is called Empower. Yes. And can you describe that one? Yes. So that's by a Brooklyn-based comic book artist named Kerry Randolph. He's worked for a ton of different comic book companies and he wanted to do a print that was inspired by Jack Kirby. Jack Kirby is one of the godfathers of comic book illustration. A lot of the images that everyone has internalized from the 60s and 70s, he drew. He's a huge influence, especially on Marvel stuff. So the main figure in this one,

the girl in this figure, her costume is a very Kirby costume. And the background in this one, all the sort of intergalactic swirls and circles, that is a very typical of a Jack Kirby illustration and it's nicknamed Kirby Crackle. So it's a real Kirby homage. This one, it's a real comic booky one, which is great. And she's just an awesome figure. I love her expression. I love her attitude. I love that her hijab turns into a cape. Yeah, it's great. And the last one is Electrify. So Electrify is by an Italian collective of illustrators who are pretty well known in the gig poster world. They're called Malleus and their style is kind of trippy and flowy. They do these sort of vintage look, San Francisco Bay Area gig poster inspired illustrations.

And yeah, I gave them that they were, I gave them the climate change solutions that their print was going to be inspired by, which is building retrofitting solar voltaics and electric vehicles. And this is what they came up with. This one is really cool because it's hand pulled by them in Italy in their own studio. The other three, it's a screen printing machine that is still operated by a human. It's still analog, but it allows for more precision. Whereas theirs is hand pulled. It's literally just like, the artist is pulling like a glob of ink over the screen on this wooden frame. And so the ink just kind of gets denser. It's a little messier at the edges in a great way. And it gives it that really classic gig poster look. It's a sort of a Zeus-like figure

with crazy red hair. And he's got one arm pointed up to the sun. And I think he's sucking energy out of it like a solar panel. And his other hand is coming into the foreground and he's got some lightning bolts coming out of it. And there's a bunch of hungry electric plugs that look like snakes in the foreground, ready to get some juice. I love that they're European plugs. They're like the 220 volt plugs. And there's an awesome moon with this cool grid in it in the background and clouds. And the orange and blue inks in this one are metallic inks. So it has a little shimmer. It's just a great illustration. So people can get them as a set or they can get them individually? Yeah. So if you go to our website, drawdowndesignproject.org, then yeah, you can buy one,

you can buy two, you can buy three, you can buy four. And they're for sale by donation. So Andy's Drawdown Design Project is a non-profit and each print is 75 bucks and 100% of the proceeds go to the Coalition for Rainforest Nations. And the Coalition for Rainforest Nations develops policy and tools to achieve sustainability for forested and adjacent agricultural lands. They manage tropical rainforest areas in support of climate stability, biodiversity, sustainable development, and poverty alleviation. And they create financial tools and partnership with governments and communities and businesses and stakeholders. They improve living standards for forest dependent communities. And they're setting a precedent that enables similar outcomes

in other tropical forested countries. So I really encourage you to think about the messages you want to keep top of mind, the art that inspires you. Think about getting a Drawdown Design Project poster as a gift for someone and you can contribute to talking about climate change solutions, galvanize some others. So we are buying two sets of Drawdown Design Project posters and we're giving away eight posters this week via their Instagram at drawdowndesignproject. So that is on Instagram at drawdowndesignproject. So follow them and you can enter there. We'll be giving away eight. You can also just buy one yourself at drawdowndesignproject.org. And those proceeds will go to the Coalition for Rainforest Nations. Thanks to the following sponsors for making that possible.

Okay, the format and content of this episode, obviously not like other Allergy's episodes. So instead of Patreon questions, I just shouted a bunch of Andy at the end that I thought you might want to ask him. Can I rapid-fire questions? Yeah. Okay. Forming a non-profit. How big of a pain in the ass was that? It's a giant pain in the ass. Okay. Any tips for someone who's like, I want to be a non-profit, but I don't know what to do by red tape? You got to find every, so we're based in California and I found a website that basically laid it out for me, what I needed to do. Okay. Every state's going to be a little different. I put some links on my website at alleywar.com slash allergies slash drawdowndesignproject.

But those are 501c3.org, councilfornonprofits.org, etc. So find the one in your state. And you just kind of got a barrel through it. There's this one form I had to file. I got returned three times because I didn't, I mean, the reasons were insane. That's my nightmare. I did this at the height of COVID. So the IRS and the Secretary of State were really slow. Anyway, it was a pain in the ass, but it was fine. It was worth it. What is your dream scenario, global outlook for you? For the human race or for these posters? For these posters.

Well, my dream outlook is that we sell them all and raise a bunch of money for our charity, and then make more. I just want to make more of them. I have this list of my dream illustrators and artists that I want to make posters. But my other big thing is, I don't know how I'm going to find out if it happens, but I just want someone to hang one of these on their walls, and I want someone in their life to ask them about it. And then I want that to create a fun, non-judgey conversation about climate change solutions between those two people. So if that happens to anybody, please let me know somehow. Making dreams come true.

How do you look to on like a day-to-day or week-to-week basis for climate information? Who are some of your climate activists, climate scientists, heroes? I really like the Voltz substack by David Roberts. Just Google it if you want to subscribe to it. That's really great information. I really like reading Rebecca Solnitz's Pieces in the Guardian. She seems to absorb a lot of information that then she kind of digests for the reader, but she also has a kind of pragmatic and positive outlook like I do. Definitely How to Save Your Planet, which is a great podcast. Those are the main ones. There's a ton of other resources out there, and a lot of them,

like, it kind of depends on your personality, what you're looking for. But I would kind of caution people from overloading themselves on this kind of stuff. Like, I'm interested in it, and since I started working on this project, I really wanted to be up to date on the science, just because I wanted to make sure I was being as accurate as possible. But part of my goal in doing this is to kind of focus people on the things they can be doing without driving themselves crazy. I have a lot of friends who suffer a lot of climate anxiety, and they have a tendency to go too deep and make themselves crazy. There's a lot of amazing, wonky people out there figuring out the details. Like, I don't think everyday person needs to know

every nuance of how we need to upgrade the electric grid. You need to vote for people who are going to take care of that. Right. Any changes that you have made in your life since starting this project, like any infrastructure changes or personal changes, if you had to give advice to someone of things that they could help them sleep a little bit better if they've got kids or if they are just concerned about all the fish out there. Yeah. Well, it really depends on your life and your level of privilege. I'm fortunate in that I have time and the means to invest in some things that could improve my individual footprint. But there's a lot of people in this world who

are just trying to get through the day. That's part of why I think it's so important to vote for people and invest in leadership in this issue. But if you are the kind of person who has the ability to vote some of your free time to this, as long as after you voted for climate candidates and you've sent money to organizations that are doing a lot of great work, those are the number one things you should do. After that, it's really about electrification, like get nerdy about electrifying your house. My old natural gas stove died and I was like, I'm getting an electric stove. And so I had to dive into a whole pain in the ass situation of upgrading my panel. I didn't have a high enough amp panel to have an electric stove,

so I had to get an electrician out to do that work. And then I could finally get the electric stove so I could eliminate that fossil fuels from my house. And as much as a pain in the ass of that was, doing that work is great because I like that electrician now knows how to do that job. It's just a way of refocusing everyone. And any changes you've made diet-wise? Do you eat more plants? Yeah, more plants. It's really about beef. That's where it's at. That's where it's at. I mean, if you look at the chart, it's beef and farmed shrimp. Farmed shrimp? Farmed shrimp. There's all kinds of reasons to eat less meat, but it's really beef and farmed shrimp. We also talked about shrimp in the oceanology episode

with Dr. Johnson. I previously thought they were the cockroaches of the sea, just plentiful to gobble. I had no idea about the bycatch issues and the mangrove destruction, so the Monterey Bay Aquarium seafoodwatch.org has more info on what the better farmed shrimp species and sources are. Some farms out there are doing it more safely, more power to them. But anyway, now you know. Damn, surf and turf is out. So it's worth noting that one of our solutions on our cultivate poster is regenerative agriculture. So anyone, if there's any regenerative farmers out there, now they're mad at me because they're going to tell me that their farm with their pasture land and their grazing grass-fed beef is actually a good thing, which is true.

So regenerative agriculture is amazing and there's a ton of really fun opportunities to make farming better. But again, I think that kind of narrative is distracting people from what's more important, which is the big system changes that need to happen and that can only be made possible by politicians and corporate leaders. Those people need to be pressured, whether it's through voting or other ways, to make the big changes. If you're obsessing about your lightbulbs, I think your energy is being put in the wrong place. No pun intended. Right. Listen, I changed all my lightbulbs because I want to live my values, but I know that that's why I'm doing it. I just got solar. That's awesome. I have panels also. It's so fun. Well,

that's part of it. It's just so fun. I go up there on the roof and I look at them and I look on my phone and I see all the volts coming into my panels. It's just fun and a lot of these climate change solutions are just so cool. They're just worth doing even if we didn't have this problem. Yeah, they're just on the cutting edge of technology anyway. The notion that we are still digging into the earth to burn oil when we have all of this sun coming at us is bananas. I'm trained as an environmental engineer. That's where I got my bachelor's degree. That was in the 90s. At that time, there was no consensus around climate change. I remember being shown the data as a student and the professor being like,

is what's going on here and it not really being that clear. I've watched the issue evolve since then into where we are now where everyone knows it's happening. Everyone knows it's human caused and everyone knows we have a limited amount of time to do something about it. That's not that long. That was only 25 years ago. This is moving fast and so yes, we should stop digging up fossil fuels but we're not being punished for doing that. It made sense at the time and a lot of people's lives were made better because of fossil fuels. They're not evil. It's just an inert substance. We need to stop using them but just practically speaking, it's a practical problem. It's not a moral one. Fossil fuels aren't evil. They're just bad for

us. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. When it comes to choices like solar, there are a lot of co-benefits there too. The technology there is progressing pretty fast and depending on whether you lease or buy the panels and your roof in your house, the reduction in your electric bill can offset the cost in just a number of years. There are also tax benefits to it too. If you're at all in a position to remodel a bathroom or look into solar, check out the solar panels. We finally got them a few months ago even though our kitchen cabinets are from the 80s and they don't really close but we'll get to that. The next thing that really needs to happen is the grid needs to be modernized

and to be able to take in all the solar and there needs to be storage installations so that we're storing all this solar because we can use it at night. Whatever, you should just do it. It's fun. It's just so fun. We have the app too and my dad is like, send me some screen caps. I want to see how much you're generating down there and it also does ease the... I'm going to use the AC but I know it's coming from solar. I don't feel as bad, which is nice. Yeah, don't feel bad though. Don't feel bad. It's hot. It's hot. People die in heat waves from heat stroke. AC is, you need the AC.

I don't feel bad. Yeah. And just a side note, there was a great piece in the New York Times in June by Christopher Flavell and Callan Goodluck about how indigenous communities are affected by things like rising tides, melting ice, dried up wells and rising temperatures, threatening not just subsistence or cultural practices but basic safety and survival as infrastructures on reserved lands tend to be underfunded. So it's a lasting impact of being forced onto small tracks of sometimes the least desirable lands and another example of how climate justice intersects with a lot of human rights issues. We can all go back to living off the land.

That's just not where modern society is. Yeah. And also, our standard of living makes us healthier and saves lives and we live longer lives. We need to get excited about the fact that we can, to a certain extent, have everything we have if we make these changes. The fact that it is feasible that we can make sweeping progress on this without everyone having to go back to pre-industrial times is exciting. And it's just true. There's another great resource this guy Saul Griffith, he's an Australian inventor and engineer and he has this organization called Rewire and he

wants to focus everyone on how electrifying everything is the way to go. Like, let's get excited about this awesome world where everything's electrified and there's no more air pollution. I mean, climate change aside, it's just going to be better if we can do it. I love that you have taken the excitement of a gig poster and a show you want to see, gathering with friends and something that's cool and applying it toward cool shit that we can do to make the planet better and make it better for people. I guess that's how things get done. No matter what the problem is, I feel like if you're acting from a place of optimism and hope, you're going to get more done than if you're acting from a place of doom and shame.

Right. And I don't know if that's true, to be honest. We've had a lot of doom and shame when it comes to climate change. So let's see if this works too. And maybe different things work for different people. That's part of it, right? Some people are going to get motivated by fear, but a lot of other people are going to get motivated by getting excited about it and all the awesome things that are just co-benefits to climate change solutions. There's this Kurt Vonnegut quote that is like a huge inspiration for me. So the quote is, we are what we pretend to be, so we must be very careful of what we pretend to be. It's just really the inspiration for this whole thing because I think we need to tell stories

that depict the future we want, not the future we're afraid of. Oh, jeez. That's a life lesson. Yeah. I mean, if we're telling stories about how terrible everything's going to be, I think everything's going to be terrible. But if we tell stories about how awesome it's going to be, maybe it'll be awesome. That's really good advice, Andy. And I have to say, it's unlike you. It is weird, right? It is weird. It is so unlike me. It's funny. I like it.

That should give you confidence because I'm not coming from some place of pie in the sky optimism. I've just read the articles and done the research and read this amazing book that everyone should read, Project Drawdown. It's impossible not to come to the conclusion that this can be done. That's really good advice. So ask good friends for great advice and ask smart climate scientists basic questions, and then make something good out of it. Thank you so much to founder and creative director Andy Hall of the Drawdown Design Project for letting me hang out and chat with him about it.

You can find out more at drawdowndesignproject.org. Follow them immediately on Instagram at Drawdown Design Project. We will be giving away eight posters this week. You got to follow them. We are at oligies on Twitter and Instagram. I'm Ali Ward with 1L on social media. Do say hi. Special thanks to friends Drs. Christine Corbett and Casey Handmer for hanging out in the initial meetings and giving some great feedback and ideas to Andy. Thank you to Aaron Talbert for admitting the oligies podcast Facebook group. Thank you, Shannon Feldes and Bonnie Dutch of the podcast. You are that for handling all the merch at oligiesmerch.com. Thank you, Susan Hale and Noel Dilworth for all of the behind the scenes oligies business.

To Emily White of the Wardery for transcribing episodes and Caleb Patton for bleeping them. Those are available for free at the link in the show notes. Thank you, Kelly Dwyer, who made my website, alleyward.com. If you need a website, her website is Kelly R. Dwyer, and that's linked in the show notes. She's great. Thank you, Hankarama, and honestly, the best husband I have ever had. Editor, Jared Sleeper of Mindjam Media. And of course, thank you to Stephen Ray Morris, who's also helping on our edited down short kid-friendly Smologies episodes that come out every two weeks, alongside Zeke Rodriguez, Thomas also works on those. Nick Thorburn made the music, and if you stick around, I'll tell you a secret and is promised.

Here's why I was in the hospital, okay? Get comfortable. I'll try to make it quick. So over the pandemic, some of my regular schedule, doctor's appointment got pushed back, right? So if you've heard other episodes, you may know that I'm in this slim percentage of very exclusive uterine people whose ovaries just decided to fuck off decades early. So my ovaries pieced out, literally shriveled up and stopped working sometime in my 30s. So I'm on a cocktail of estrogen patches and testosterone creams and such, but for the first few years, they were giving me progesterone so that I would bleed like a normal person. But they didn't mention that progesterone pills heads up. Y'all can make some people just straight up not want to exist anymore and can be

reduced to a weeping pile of hair and tears, which was what happened to me. Not everyone, again, slim percentage happened to me. So the doctors gave me a new kind to try at the start of COVID. Once again, it was not good for my brain. And I stopped and I hadn't been able to see my OBGYN again. Unopposed estrogen means maybe some endometrial cancer risks. So I went to my OBGYN last week and she was like, oh, shit, you stopped taking the progesterone. I was like, oh, I did, but I couldn't come in here. Everything was so busy. And she was like, well, let's check you for cancer. So what we'll do is we'll scrape your insides out like a pumpkin, and then we'll send some chunks off to the lab. Also, I should note there was a new resident doctor in the room,

and they were like, can he practice on you? And I was like, sure, man, you got to learn to be a doctor somewhere, right? That somewhere starts right now in my crotch, which I'm fairly certain was the first one this particular doctor had ever used a speculum on. Bless his heart. Did it hurt? The whole thing, of course, it hurt. They scraped my insides. But yeah, I chewed on my tongue. I got through it. The newbie doc got some chunks for pathology thumbs up way to go. The next day, however, I had the worst weirdest pain of my whole life. So much pain, freakish spasm or something. Jared had to call my doctor. They were like, bring that lady in the ER stat. And then later, I saw on my medical notes that the nurse on the phone had typed in, patient can be heard in the

background, audibly moaning, which was accurate. Anyway, went to the ER, people barfing everywhere, people bleeding, hallways filled with beds. Anyway, I had a bunch of ultrasounds, a bunch of pelvic exams. I had a COVID brain tickler for good measure. And they were like, well, that was weird, but you're fine. Get out of here. So I was like, we'll do. So I was woozy for a few days. And then your pod mom, Jared, shredded his meniscus. That's part of your knee in jujitsu and can barely walk. And so we spent the rest of the week in and out of MRI places and physical therapists and urgent care for him. What's my point? My point is, cut me a little slack. This bonus episode is out a little late. And this is also just a super aside. I'm hiding this at the end, but every once in a

while, I'll have someone leave a comment or a tweet about how politics and science don't belong together. But literally, policy is like based on information and information is science. And I just big, big sigh. Anyway, everything's fine. I'm in a hotel room outside of Detroit. I'm going to go get a salad. I'm feeling better. Thank you for your patience. Aren't you glad you will never scrape a pumpkin the same? Also, you got to let doctors practice on you. He didn't do the scraping. It was actually my OBGYN. He was fine. He was just a little nervous, but he was great. Okay. Thank you for being doctors. I appreciate it so much. Okay, bye for bye. Are you a fish head too?