On The Brink with Castle Island - Weekly Roundup 12/08/23 (JPM vs crypto, Do Kwon extradited, Nubank) (EP.482)

Episode Date: December 8, 2023

Matt and Nic return for deals and news of the week. In this episode:  Chainalysis Geography of Crypto adoption Jamie Dimon comes out against crypto – again Our vote for Time Person of the year The AICPA announces their stablecoin attestation framework Do Kwon is being extradited to the US Nubank is getting into crypto Rep McHenry is retiring Content mentioned in this episode: Chainalysis Global Crypto Adoption Index It's all a Game by Colleen Sullivan Sponsor notes: Coin Metrics STATE OF THE NETWORK—State of Stablecoins:Signs of Returning Liquidity In Coin Metrics State of the Network Issue 236, we look into stablecoin supply, usage, adoption and key trends in market evolution

Brought down by bad mortgage investments, Lehman, which has 25,000 employees, will be liquidated. The federal government loans American International Group, AIG, $85 billion. This is a different kind of market, and the Fed is asleep. The federal government is stepping it to stabilize Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the two mortgage giants that have been threatened by the housing crisis. The Bank of England has pumped 75 billion pounds more to Britain's ailing economy with a new round of Concentive Easing. You've printed a couple trillion dollars, and all of a sudden, people start to worry. So out of this worry, we have something called the Bitcoin. Welcome to On the Brink. I'm Matt Walsh.

And I'm Nick Carter. And this episode is brought to you by Coin Metrics. And here is the Metrics Minute. All right. Today's Metrics Minute. We're talking about the state of stable coins. The aggregate stable coin market cap has rebounded in recent months, reversing its contraction, climbing to $12 billion from a low of $112 billion in September. This has been primarily fueled by the growth of Tether on Ethereum and Tron.

Tether has an all-time high market cap of 88 billion. USDC has stabilized 22.5 billion. USC's supply in smart contracts has actually decreased from 20 billion in March 2022 to about $7 billion today. Tether in smart contracts, it was never a huge portion of tether, but it has increased from $4 to $6 billion. Stablecoin usage. defy lending has seen a revival utilization rates in lending applications like Ave are growing close to

80% or higher levels last seen in 2021. So there's a new demand for stable coins and appetite for leveraging them for yield generation strategies. Spot volumes have also surged. USDT did 18 billion in trading volumes on November 18th, only surpassed by volumes during key events like the Luna FTCX and Silicon Valley collapses. Stablecoin supply APRs and defyre nearing key levels like 5%, which is comparable to short-dated treasury yields. So basically the sort of native crypto yields are almost back in line with sort of triad-fired risk-free rates.

So I think that's a big part of the reason why you're seeing stable coin supply stop shrinking. The delta in yields isn't that significant. anymore. That's your metrics minute. Signs of a healthy market, huh? And there was a stable coin that was launched out of a bank, right? This week, there was a European bank that launched the stable coin. It was So sock gen. Sochgen launched a euro-backed stable coin. Yeah. So the foreign banks are able to do it and our local ones aren't. It's tragic story. These foreign banks, you know, they're going to keep on growing and growing. And then once there's regulatory clarity

in the U.S. They'll probably start buying some U.S. banks. The tale of two regulatory domiciles, we're going to get into what the nation's largest bank has been doing recently. Bad things. Suffice to say, we're not happy. Okay.

No. We've got stuff to say about it. Let's start with some happy stuff, though. We had a busy podcast week. So you sat down with Kim Grauer, director of research at Chanysis, to talk about their Chanalysis

2023 Geography of Crypto Adoption report, which is always a great report. So I enjoyed that one. Yeah, this one is so clutch. And I wanted to figure out how they come up with the numbers. And we went deep on the methodology. I think the report is so great and I use it all the time. It's one of my main tools for explaining where people use crypto, why.

And their main methodology involves tagging exchanges and brokers and DFI protocols, basically tagging entities, obviously, and then looking at web traffic to those entities. So they layer those two data sets on top of each other. And then that's how they create the geographic segmentation, which I didn't know. I thought they were doing something like time zone analysis. It's actually much more precise. They look at the geographic web traffic to these entities plus the on-chain flows. So that's the answer, basically, how they get the numbers.

So yeah, it is super smart. So here's the ranking. I'm going to what do you think the number one country is but for usage? And keep in mind it's per capita. Nigeria. Close. Number two. Number one is India. India, no kidding. Yeah, India and Nigeria both have kind of restrictions on banks dealing with crypto exchanges, I believe. But those are number one and two. Number three, Vietnam. Number four, USA. USA, USA, number four. Followed by Ukraine, Philippines, Indonesia, Pakistan, Brazil, Thailand, China. There's a bunch more.

But it's interesting. I mean, it's not, you know, just one specific geo. And it is a mix of sort of middle income, low income, and developed nations. But, yeah, I always find the data fascinating. We're going to put in the show notes. And I also recommend that episode with Kemp. I have to say to my fellow United States citizens, those numbers are way too low. We got to get those numbers way up.

We got to figure out how to come in number one in this ranking service next year in the U.S. Yeah, I think they're controlling for GDP or something like that. So the U.S. is certainly number one in the raw numbers of sort of on-chain flows, but not once you control for the wealth of the nation. It's like the Bitmex leaderboard. Once you put a leaderboard out there, you just have to win. You have to be competitive in these games. Unless you're the New England Patriots,

in which case you go the other way. We're going for high draft picks, which is definitely the good strategy. So I'm not complaining. But you're either got to be first or you're going to be last. Wasn't that how Alameda originally distinguished themselves, actually, was didn't they top the Bitmex leaderboard or something like that? They did, yeah.

They were at the very top. They were in top three for a while, and then they started FTX. Yeah. So actually, time person of the year, so it's Taylor Swift, right? I think it should have been Sam's, plural. I think it should have been Sam Bank, McBride, and Sam Alman. Because they were the most... Like a little good versus evil type of thing, or...

It depends on your perspective. people don't like Sam Alman either. They were the most interesting people of the year. Taylor Swift, okay, she sold a lot of tickets. But what did she say that was interesting? At the risk of offending the Swifties. I can't even think of anything she had to say this year. Well, I don't think she's trying to make political statements, is she? It's kind of like the Michael Jordan Republicans buy sneakers too. I think you'll be surprised in the next election. I think she will be political, but I think it should have been the Sam's. They were the most noteworthy people of the year, in my opinion. Yeah, Sam Altman would have been the easy choice there. Yeah,

I mean, come on. Like, there was just like such an interesting episode that we had with him. I guess he ended up back at opening eye, so nothing really changed. It seems like opening I got worse. Did you notice this? I have. So it's been a lot slower. I've been a lot slower. I've the way, I've been throwing Excel data sheets into Open AI and it's spitting things back at me that are better than my 22 year old analyst self could have done. It's completely, management consulting is going to be turned on its head once people figure out how to use this thing. I completely agree and I don't think people have figured it out yet. What is it the advanced data analysis module or whatever? You just drop any data set in there and then you just tell it to

visualize it, combine data, clean the data. I mean, it's unbelievable. It's so fascinating. You can build a due diligence report in, I don't know, like 10% of the time that it would have taken you

to do it without it. It's crazy the time saver. This is when things start to get scary in terms of white collar professions being made obsolete. Yeah. I'm concerned. I mean, what are the accountants

and the consultants going to do? you know you can't hire someone who doesn't know how to use this stuff these days it's if you are a new person entering the workforce and you don't know how to use these tools i don't know what you're doing i've subjectively estimated that it makes you 50% more productive using this easily easily i think you're way delinquent if you don't use it even as gpt4 has been nerfed from what i can see yeah something's going on there i don't think that it's not fast enough right now. If too many people were using it or maybe all the people were on vacation for those two weeks,

I don't know what happened. The D-cells got their hands on it. The D-cells. So that is our person of the year candidate. You sat down with Rood Smets and Mark DeKloaf Theta Capital for an episode this week as well. I really enjoyed this one. So Rude and Mark run Theta. They're two or the three partners at Theta Capital.

Theta's got a great perch, similar to our perch, where we see a lot of strong. startups, they see a lot of fund managers. And so seeing these new categories that are popping up, and these guys have been super early. So it's fascinating to talk to them about their business, how they've built it, and the big themes that they're deploying capital tours in 2024. So that was a lot of fun. And you also did Witham's Cryptonomics podcast this week. Cryptonomics. So Witham, yeah, Wetham's still in this crypto game. You know, they're accounting and audit firm, and they like talking about crypto stuff. So I was excited to go on with Mark on that one. Yeah, don't sleep on the audit firms. I think, you know, they've been

running away from crypto. But I think things are going to change. In fact, there's an interesting development this week. We'll just dive right into this one. AICPA released their draft stable coin attestation framework standards report. It's very exciting for us, accounting firm watchers. It's good news. Yeah, you're excited about this. Yeah. Yeah, I enjoy accounting regulation news items, and this one is key. They've been working on it for two years. This is, I think it's essential that we basically get standardization of things like attestations so that the audit firms can do them, oversee them comfortably, feel comfortable

about doing it. The stable coins can get the marquee audit firms to cover them. and then in the long term proof of reserves, we need standardization of what a good and proper proof of reserve is. Hopefully that would be kind of the next framework that we get from the AICPA. I'm not holding my breath on the proof of reserves. That could be a while. No, it'll take, yeah, it'll take years.

Yep. But they'll get there. All right, so there are some deals this week. There's actually three deals in the Castle Island portfolio. So first one up is Dust Identity. So this is a company that we initially backed in 2018 when they were leaving MIT. This is a company focused on authenticating physical objects. So they have a, how would you describe this?

This is a ground-up diamond particles that go in a microscopic amount on the back of any part and allows you to scan the device to see if the item has been tampered with. So you can put it on high-value goods, for instance, and you won't even be able to tell. It's like an invisible barcode. And they have some clients that use it in the context of just a centralized database. So some of these government contracts, for instance, where they will just scan them and they'll hash them into a private database. But there's an emerging use case here around using a public blockchain to timestamp these objects into. And there's obviously a lot going on in the proliferation of NFT-like digital assets that tie physical to digital,

all sorts of interesting use cases around provenance and supply chain tracking. So anyways, Dust raised $40 million. $1, Castle Island, Clodd Perkins, 8VC, American Express Ventures, Highland Capital Partners. So congrats to the team over at Dust. Yeah, I remember when we got the demo five or six years ago now, the Dust demo. Yeah, we thought it was a Theranos type of situation based on the initial call where, like, we've got to see this thing. Yeah, we had to see it to believe it. And it was just so cool.

You know, we don't get to invest in real material science businesses very often. This might be the only one. But yeah, very, very cool. And it's cool that it's diamonds. I like that. Very cool that it's diamonds. And so they're industrial-grade diamonds. So they're used on drill bits and things like that.

So otherwise they'd be thrown away. It's not that they're taking, you know, diamond rings and grinding them up. No, not at a no. Post-industrial diamond residue. Next up in the SIV portfolio again, very chunky deal, Babylon. This is a protocol that frees up Bitcoin to be staked, basically, on other blockchain. So to inherit the Bitcoin security guarantees, the proof of work guarantees for Bitcoin onto other blockchains that need security. Very exciting company.

They raise 18 million from polychain, hackfews. framework, us, Polygon, and a number of others. Super excited to announce this one. Yeah, congrats to the Babylon team. And then a third one in the Castle Island orbit is Pith Data Association. So we've had Mike Cahill from Duras Labs on this podcast a couple of times talking about the decentralized data space and talking about Oracle networks. So think about this is in the same category as a chain link, for instance. Really dominant market share on a number of public blockchains at this point. So they announced a strategic round of financing that Castle Island, we participated in, multi-coin, winter mute, CMT digital, borderless, distributed global,

and others. So congratulations to the Pith team. Yeah, it's always great when we get to announce our own deals. Pith, I highly recommend the episode I did with Mike Cahill. You know, basically, I think there's like a second mover advantage in the Oracle space. The Oracle's 1.0 had a lot of problems and we saw that because D5 protocols kept on getting hacked with Oracle manipulation. I mean, we've learned a lot from that. Pith incorporates a lot of those lessons. And they have some awesome sort of tradfi and crypto firms providing data to the ecosystem. So very exciting protocol. All right. So next one up is Shadow. This is a blockchain infrastructure provider.

They raised $9 million from Paradigm. Then we have Flurry Finance, a D5 protocol. They raise $3 million from AU21 Capital, GenBlock, and Shema Capital. Then we have Versatis Labs. This is an Ethereum scaling company that raised $2.3 million from NGC Ventures and Republic Crypto. And then we have, meanwhile, a Bitcoin private credit fund backed by Sam Elman. They are raising $100 million. This one causes a bit of a stir on crypto.

Twitter. Yeah, so what's the deal here? So they're raising $100 million and they're going to lend out the Bitcoin to earn yield, basically? Yeah, not entirely clear to me. They're targeting a 5% Bitcoin denominated yield. I'm not 100% sure where the yield comes from, but it's a 2 and 20 fund. I mean, it is a fund. I don't think there's carry on it. I actually don't think there's carry on it. Oh, well, then the block is wrong in their reporting because it did say that. All right. Well, maybe it is. So that's meanwhile. All right.

So those are the deals of the week. A lot to talk about this week. Why don't we talk about our nemesis, Jamie Diamond here? So Jamie Diamond, CEO of J.P. Morgan Chase, who's at it again this week. He was part of this Senate Finance Committee hearings, a bunch of the bank, CEO. were down there. And he had this exchange with Elizabeth Warren that looked like it was quite rehearsed, if I'm being honest. It was a question about crypto, and he basically said, cryptocurrencies are primarily for money laundering and nefarious activities. If he was in

charge of the government, he would shut it down. I guess I would just note that if you want to talk about nefarious activities that are happening, since 2000, J.P. Morgan has had to pay $39.3 billion worth of fines and settlements relative to banking drug traffickers. They were banking Jeffrey Epstein after he went to jail the first time. They were defrauding their customers and manipulating the precious metals market. So I don't know that Jamie Diamond's really, I guess, I mean, he is an expert in financial crime. I don't know that he's, that's kind of the pot calling the kettle black, though, to some

extent. You were very fired up about this. I don't think I've seen you this upset about anything in years. All right. So here's my thing. Don't you just expect it from Jamie Diamond at this point? I mean, you know, this isn't new. I'm sick of it.

I'm sick of it. So J.P. Morgan has 218 people at the company that work on crypto blockchain stuff. They've got this onyx network, private blockchain money movement thing, but they're working on all sorts of stuff. they've invested in consensus. They have done some crypto stuff. Jamie Diamond doesn't appear to be aware of it.

First thing, if I'm working over there, I'm looking for a job. If I'm working on crypto stuff and everything I'm doing is not going anywhere because the top of the house doesn't care about this stuff. Not only does he not care about it, he's trying to protect his entrenched interest

with Elizabeth Warren and appeal to her and do this rehearsed choreography, there's no way that I'm sticking around. So if any of these 218 folks that are working on blockchain initiatives want to graduate to a public blockchain focused startup, I think they should get in touch because there's plenty of them that are hiring. There's also plenty of other financial services firms that are doing real attempts to build things in this market.

So you can stay in New York. You go to Bank of New York Mellon. They're doing some interesting things. Goldman Sachs doing some fascinating work in the space. Go to an asset management firm, Fidelity, Franklin Templeton, Ark. There's plenty of places that would love to hire talented engineers, anyone who's really deep in the blockchain space. Now, the other thing is there's plenty of services that J.P. Morgan is offering to folks that are in and around the blockchain ecosystem or even just sympathetic to the blockchain ecosystem.

And I think we should be deleting J.P. Morgan in mass from our financial footprints. So I, for one, I canceled my credit card that I have with J.P. Morgan. So I usually most of my wallet shares with a Fidelity cashback card, but I have that Amazon JPMorgan Chase card, which gives you 5% back on Amazon purchases. and I enjoy that card because you get, you know, free money on it. And it's, I spend a lot on Amazon. But I canceled that. You can't cancel it online. I called up and I canceled it.

I said it was because your CEO is trying to shut down an emerging technology industry that I'm a part of and I want no part of it. And I was a little bit rude. What did they say to that? They just said, thank you. And please hold while I shut down the account. They didn't ask any follow-up questions. They didn't push back.

Yeah. So I would encourage everybody to get off of a Chase credit card. It's just the points, guys. You can get plenty of points elsewhere. So you go, this Fidelity cashback card is great. So I've been using that for years. It pays you, I think, 2% cash back on every purchase. You can roll that directly into an account where you can buy more crypto on Fidelity.com,

someone that's really doing good things. Why would you try to make Jamie Diamond and his cronies richer? They're going to spend their money on lobbyists that are trying to shut down the industry. You could roll it into Fidelity, who's going to spend their money on hiring more people to build out great Bitcoin and Ethereum stuff. I think that's a no-brainer. So I'd encourage everyone to shut down your credit cards with Chase, get the points elsewhere, and support someone that actually cares about the industry. Secondly, checking and savings accounts, there's plenty of places to get those. So switch over to a bank that is pro-crypto or just move your money over to a brokerage.

Fidelity has bill pay. Schwab has bill pay. You know, Schwab's not the most crypto-friendly place on Earth, but they're at least not openly hostile. Get off of that platform. Third thing, wealth management. There's a lot of crypto people that have financial advisors. Some of them work for JP Morgan. I would encourage everybody to revisit those relationships. Get a ton of inbound from these wealth managers that are always looking to have a meeting.

Don't take the meeting with the JP Morgan person. It makes absolutely no sense to support J.P. Morgan Chase in this category whatsoever if you're working in this industry. Or if you're even sympathetic to this industry, if you're listening to this podcast and you like public blockchain technology, why are you doing things that are actively hurting our industry by supporting J.P. Morgan, if they had their druthers, they would shut you down. They would not allow you to buy Bitcoin. They would not allow you to buy Ethereum. They would not allow you to deal with a decentralized finance pool. They're going in front of Congress and they're telling you what they think in no uncertain terms,

you should not have a financial advisor that works for J.P. Morgan. And then lastly, startups, let's talk about investment banking. So there's this rumor that figure is going to spin off part of their business and ticket public. Goldman Sachs has upper left on that, but it looks like J.P. Morgan's on that as well. I would hope that that would be revisited in any of these high-flying crypto startups that will inevitably be public, you know, the chain analysis of the world, the TRMs, the Bitwazes, the TALO, the talos is. It makes no sense to take the meeting with J.P. Morgan. There's plenty of banks out there that are pro-crypto. Why pay these fat fees to J.P. Morgan? They're just going to funnel it back

to Elizabeth Warren and all these political action committees, protect their fiefdoms. No crypto or emerging technology startup should be using J.P. Morgan as an investment bank. So credit cards, checking and savings, wealth management, and I banking, delete them. No J.P. Morgan. All right. Is this the part where I mentioned that I'm very happy client of JPM Private? You were kind of legacyed in, right? They bought something that you were on the platform with. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'll consider it. It's not every week we get a Matt Welsh rant on this podcast, but it's like a rare treat when we got one. It's time for us to stop being so defeatist as an industry. It's like, oh, Jamie Diamond's out there punching us again. It's like, okay, well, what do you do? to make Jamie Diamond richer.

Jamie Diamond came out this year and announced that he's selling $120 million worth of stock in the next few months. He owns over a billion dollars worth of JP Morgan stock. Why are you trying to make this guy buy another house?

What is this guy ever done for you? When he first said anti-crypto stuff, I think he was reported that his daughter owned two Bitcoin, two bitcoins. Yeah, she seems smart. She's been thriving. I mean, she's been crushing it.

so good good for her i have nothing against her it's it's all about him yeah so probably a bit of familial tension there but uh yeah delete jpm okay you heard them in yeah okay well also up in news this week do kwan founder of terra luna he will not be extradited to south korea from honor negro he is coming to the usa to phase justice welcome to welcome How is that going to work? So is he, is this guy going to be in the double jeopardy type of situation here? So he's going to get charged in the U.S., but then South Korea is also wanting him. I call me soft, but I had a little moment, I had a moment where I was feeling really bad for him today when I saw that.

I mean, he did, it appears that he kind of lied rampantly about maybe everything involved in Tara, Luna. Yeah, there's that. It wasn't just that he set up an unstable system. People should have really known better. But it's that he wasn't honest about it. And then he lost billions of people's dollars. So I don't even know what the charges are. I mean, is it a legal to create just a terrible stable coin?

Like the world's worst stable coin? Is that a crime? Maybe, probably. Yeah, we don't know what we don't know to some degree on this one. So he certainly believed. his own hype on what this thing was. He thought that this was a stable coin, and it wasn't. But I don't know.

It'll be interesting to what they torture him with. Yeah. I think it's just fraud. I mean, you know, he wasn't honest about the chai element of the terror system. I mean, he, I don't think he was honest about the decentralization of the terror system. You know, he was clearly pulling the strings in the background. Yeah, it'll be very, I'm very curious to see what they come up with here. in terms of his sort of alleged crimes.

Now, does he go to Brooklyn, MDC? Do you think? Do you think he's going to end up in the same place as Sam? Could be. Could be. Can you imagine how much chaos those guys are going to wreak on that jail? Sam has been reportedly trading mackerel tens in prison. He's just a hustler.

They're going to launch some new exotic financial product based on mackerel's. That's apparently, the currency, along with stamps, I think that's the currency of choice in prison. Even expired mackerel, even mackerel that doesn't have any sort of edible use. So it's like a synthetic commodity of sorts, a monetary good. It's quite an interesting little case study. Well, in other news, New Bank, which is the big Brazilian digital bank, they did a bunch of stuff this week to further their entrance into the crypto ecosystem. So they partnered up with Talos, the trade execution platform.

And so now customers on NewBank will be able to access the crypto markets through the Talos infrastructure. And they also announced an integration with Circle that's going to allow USDC, the US dollar exposure on chain to Brazilian customers. Pretty fascinating development there. Those are two pretty big moves there. Yeah, I love to see these basically FinTechs, Neobanks, getting more deeply. involved in the crypto space, stable coins specifically. I mean, there's basically no reason not to

at this point. Stable coins are so much more efficient than using the corresponding banking system. They're more globalized. They're more interoperable. They're just better. People are always asking like, hey, what is crypto actually? Show me one thing where crypto is better. It's like, you ever sent a wire transfer? Have you said an international wire transfer? I had a wire transfer the other day. They got lost. The wire transfer was lost. That's crazy. How do you lose a wire transfer? We had one a couple weeks ago. We were sending to a portfolio company and just didn't land.

And so, of course, you get on and you investigate it. It's not that the money was lost. It's just sitting with some correspondent bank somewhere. They're just sitting on it. It's like, well, that's our money that we're sending to a portfolio company. We send it to them. Yeah. I think it was Chris Berniski that tweeted the other day that, like, the last dozen of his deals,

he's funded Justin Stablecoins. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense. It's much more efficient to do it that way. It's a little more nerve-wracking, but far, far, far more efficient. Oh, it's open 24-7, 365. Anyone in the world can get on the infrastructure. It's, I mean, it's such a better technology. It does blow my mind how few banking hours there are. I feel like there's always a banking holiday. Like, whenever I want to send a wire, it's a bank holiday for some reason. I don't know why they need so many holidays. It's being a banker that difficult that you need that amount of relaxation. And you can't really send a wire, what, after 4 p.m.? Yeah. Forget about trying to send a wire on a Friday.

They're on the golf course. Yeah. I mean, it just, it doesn't happen on a Friday. It's crazy. It's a terrible system. Really, not a great system. All the more reason for getting off of those platforms to the extent possible. So did you see that Patrick McKenry is not running for election?

So Patrick McKenry is the chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, Republican out of North Carolina. We've talked about him a ton of times on this podcast. He's certainly, in my estimation, the most knowledgeable person in elected office about this technology. And it's a shame to lose them. Yeah. We unfortunately keep on losing our best advocates and allies in Washington. So that's a shame. we'll see what he does next.

Maybe he'll work in crypto. I don't know. Yeah, it'll be interesting. I guess he's still pretty young guy. So, you know, maybe he wants to go to the private sector. He's been a politician since he was 29. So maybe there is this element of wanting to make some money. Although, you know, you can make a ton of money as a politician.

Nancy Pelosi's done a great job. Yeah, I mean, the whole insider trading loophole thing is quite a financial inducement to getting higher office. So I want to direct your attention now to a piece of content created by a long-time member of Brink Nation. Colleen Sullivan, co-head of Venture at Brevin-Hauer Digital. She wrote an essay, which is more of a book almost, I would say, than an essay called It's All a Game, which is about the intersection of Web 3 and gaming. It's over 100 pages, and she's been working on it for a year. So we're going to put in the show notes. I had probably the most comprehensive resource ever produced on this specific topic.

So I highly recommend that one. Of course, calling one of the keenest thinkers on this exact theme. So highly recommend it. That's awesome. Yeah, we'll check that out. Put that one in the show notes for sure.

All right. So I think that's it for the week. Call to action for the weekend is get yourself off of JP Morgan Chase. get yourself onto a financial institution that is actively not trying to sabotage this industry by getting in bed with Elizabeth Warren and pre-rehearsing answers. The way to do that if you have a Chase credit card is by calling 1-800-432-3117. That is 1-800-432-3117. And let them know the reason that you're shutting the account is Jamie Diamond is trying to shut down an emerging technology. industry. That is my message. Okay, you heard them in. Get to it. All right. All right,

everybody, have a safe and healthy weekend. We will see you on Monday.