On with Kara Swisher - 'I Feel Re-Famous': Rosie O'Donnell on Her Return to New York

Episode Date: August 3, 2026

After moving to Ireland at the start of President Donald Trump’s second term, Rosie O’Donnell is back in the U.S. to stage her one-woman show in New York and guest host “Jimmy Kimmel Live!” at the end of the month. While she’s taken some time out of the spotlight, Rosie remains an outspoken critic of the president and his policies at a time when a lot of public figures have gone quiet. Kara and Rosie talk about why she decided to turn her life into a theater production, the joys and challenges of raising a child with autism, and the new energy she’s found in her 60s. They also talk about why Rosie continues to speak out against Trump despite the personal costs. Questions? Comments? Email us at [e-mail] or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Threads, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, Donnie, know you're watching. Donnie, it's me, Rosie showing up on ABC. I want to do like a little love song, like you got a crush. Donnie, it's too much. I hear you're leaving Melania for me. Hi, everyone, from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is on with Kara Swisher, and I'm Kara Swisher. My guest today is the one and only Rosie O'Donnell.

She's staging a limited run of her one-woman play in New York right now. It's called Common Knowledge, and it's a deeply personal look at her recent move to Ireland, the challenges of parenting, and the death of her mother just before she turned 11 years old. Of course, the show also touches on a decades-long feud with President Donald Trump. Rosie was one of the very first people to challenge his image as a self-made billionaire back in 2006 when she was co-host of The View. She hasn't stopped since. I don't expect she to pull any punches when she guest-hosts Jimmy Kim. tonight later this month. But Rosie is a lot more than just a critic of Trump. She's won 11 Emmy Awards and won Tony Award. Her career spans comedy, daytime television, film and advocacy, as well as theater. And she's never been afraid to say what she really thinks, even when it comes at a personal

cost. And she's also had a lot of personal issues throughout her life that she talks about a lot. I think she's a really interesting character, and she's more often changed over the years. But one of the things she is is often right about people like Donald Trump, and she's willing to go out on a limb to talk about it. All right, let's get to my conversation with Rosie O'Donnell. Our expert question comes from retired soccer star podcast host and activist Megan Rapino. Rosie is a legend. You won't want to miss our conversation, so stick around. Support for this show comes from Odu. Running a business takes everything you've got. And a lot of the tools out there that are supposed to make your life easier just aren't great at talking to each other. And that means you end up having to toggle between

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ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier, CRM, accounting, inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, O-DU replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch. So why not you. Try O-D-O-D-F-R-Rose.com. That's O-D-O-O-O-O-O-com. Rosie, thanks for coming on. My pleasure. Thank you for having me. I'm so thrilled you're here in person. Well, I was very far downtown. Yes. I know it's far down here, but it's nice. You can come visit. You can go see the stock exchange. Exactly. If you feel like that, stuff like that. You can jump on the Staten Island Ferry if you feel like it. You have to be the very tip of New York. The very tip of New York.

Anyway, welcome back to the U.S. after moving to Dublin earlier this year, you sort of of did an opposite Statue of Liberty thing and went the other direction. Right. I just curious, what's the first stop you wanted to make when you got back to New York other than seeing your kids and your new grandson? Congratulations. You know, I wanted to see Broadway. I mean, that's really my love of New York is, you know, wrapped up in that.

And I've been to see so many shows since I got here a couple weeks ago, and I've seen Jellicle Ball three times. I took my kids to it this weekend. Wasn't it unbelievable? Unbelievable. And it's a lesson in gay history and ballwork. and ballroom and perseverance and minority presence in the world. And it works for cats.

And it works. And it works. Finally, cats work. Right, because cats was just poems without a book. It also was a little annoying. It was a little annoying, redundant, right? When they went on you in the audience and, like, licked you. It was like, this is very immersive in 1980.

And so you, theater. Theater is where you go first. Theater is where I go first. And then, you know, my old haunts, like Joe Allen's and, you know, know, Nobu and theater. And, you know, I mean, that's what New York is to me. And I really love it. And the people have been, you know, so great. You know, people now, when I'm getting in a cab, stop their car and scream out the window. I'm like, right. I'm like, what is this 30 years ago? Like, I feel re-famous. I feel like I left when I did in 2002. And then I moved to Ireland and

and with the help of Mango Mussolini, have become re-famous. And I just find it very interesting. I think people really want nostalgia. They want people with their voices and power to stand up to what's happening in our country. And they really respect you, as I'm sure you get all the time for doing it. Yeah. So let's talk about common knowledge, because it's a lot about that. It's about Mango Mussolini.

We'll get to him. We're going to talk about him, which is why you're back. It's an autobiographical show about your move to. Ireland, but it's also about parenting, motherhood, losing your mom before you turn 11. I lost my dad when I was five, so I completely relate. No matter what age you lose to parents, it's a tough thing, but when you're very young, it's sort of a loss that is forever. I agree. You become highly functional. I talk about how grief sometimes surprises you, because I think that was a lovely part of that show. You know, the beginning of the show was written when I was

in Ireland because I kept seeing women in their 90s who looked like that. like my mother's face. My mother was very Irish, 100% Irish. And she looked like a lot of these older women that I see. And I started thinking, God, this is what it would have been like to have my mother now. And, you know, in America, I didn't see a lot of people that looked like her. But in Ireland, I saw many. And I started writing about the day she died. Yes, the last time you spoke to her. And the last time she spoke to me is the end. The beginning is the day she died. and what happened as a result. And, you know, that's a grief that doesn't end, as you were saying.

And I remember Nora Ephron used to say to me, is that the defining emotional moment of your life? And I'm like, it is. Yes. It is. It doesn't go away. Never. You know, and she had two parents who were very successful,

and she never experienced that. So I think people who have, and it's hard for them to relate. And when people like you tell me their story, I think right away, oh, I get them. They get me. Well, it's not a day goes by. Correct. Someone explained it to me that half the people in your life died one day. That's the same kind of impact.

Right. It's all about a mission, what you missed, right? Yes. And everything else. And I thought you effectively talked about that. And was being an Ireland or is that you thought of her more? Because you've been trying to make it for a decade, right? Yes, yes.

And you couldn't do it until now. So what about moving to Ireland unlocked it? Was it just seeing people like that? or taking you out of this country to find an emotional space? I think it was taking out of the country and take out of the presence of all the problems that are occurring now and have been since he's been on the scene. It was noise in my head. You know, I'm on Monjaro and have been for three years and all people talk about the food noise. Well, I had some Trump noise for a long time for 20 years.

And every time I thought, okay, it's going to die down now. It would be kicked back up by him, you know. and it felt like too much. And when I got there, I found peace in a way. And the welcome from the people was shocking and startling. And I was very moved by their acceptance. People would see me and say, you're welcome home. You're welcome here, Rosie.

Glad to have you in Ireland. Nobody would say, could I have your autograph? Could I have a picture? Everyone was just seeing me as an individual, not as a celebrity. And it's not a fame culture there. People don't really care. tell the story in the show about a couple. They knew who I was. We were at the beer garden and our kids were playing and we had like a two-hour dinner and right as I was leaving, they said, by the way, Rosie,

we're big fans. And I said, oh, you didn't want to bring it up till right now when I'm leaving. And they said, well, surely it's not the most important thing now, is it? And I thought, oh my God, if that isn't a line that defines my being here. Talk a little bit about the move to Ireland because one of the things you said also was a lot of celebrities threaten, you know, or public people, I'm going to leave this country. If this happens, right. You did it. Yeah, it came when I read Project 2025 and I couldn't believe that everyone didn't read it. And when I realized that they were bold enough to print what their intentions were, I knew it was time to leave. I really felt very threatened as the mother of an autistic child, as the mother of a non-binary child, and as a

gay woman myself, I thought, this is fascism, pure and simple. And, you know, I never, ever even like to travel. I like being around my kids. I like being around my family. I'm not a big traveler, you know. And so the concept that I would move, my friends and family didn't even believe me. No, they didn't believe that you would do it. No, I told my siblings, and they were like, my brother Eddie's like, this is no way you're going to go to Ireland. You wouldn't go to the Bahamas, And I was like, well, and I did. And I felt I had to. There was no decision to make.

Once I read that, I was like, we have to go if he gets in. So you said, had you stayed, you'd have immersed in another Trump administration. You also didn't think he was going to win, but you would have been able to emotionally be present for your teenage child, Clay. Talk about that relationship and what have you learned as a parent that maybe wasn't as obvious when you were in the state? Well, I learned that the public school in Ireland, which is so inclusive of all different times of children, that that is a better environment than just surrounded by neurodivergent children for my child. Now, every kid with autism is different, but this public school has been unbelievably beneficial for her. Now, you know, the crossing guard told me that she... This is correct. Explain the crossing guard.

Her name is... She's a lollipop lady. Her name is Angela, and she knew every kid's name in that school. And she said to me, after a couple of days of me dropping her off and picking her up, she said, do you notice Rosie? She walks in front you.

I said, yeah, she likes to get home early and she likes to get to the school early. No, she's embarrassed of you. And I was like, what the hell is this woman telling me? And, you know, sure enough, I said, well, I'm from New York. She's like, you're not in New York now, Rosie O'Donnell, or whoever you are, because she didn't believe it was me. That's right.

You look like Rosie. Yeah, you look like her. And, you know, so I took that to heart. I really did. And she started walking with her friends to school, which in L.A. is not even a possibility. And in New York, I would never allow. You know, I have fears in New York that I don't have in Ireland.

It's one of the safest countries in Europe. And I just fell in love with our life there, the smallness of our life there, and the genuine interactions that I would. was able to have with people that I'm not always able to have in the United States because of my notoriety. Talk a little bit about talking about your daughter. Do you say daughter? No, she says they prefer child. Child. Right, my child's autism. Yes. Yeah. Well, at two years old, I had her tested, them tested. They go by they, them, but it's very difficult. So you're going to see me struggle. Oh, I know. Right. Okay. I'm same. We're close to the same age. We try our best. I know, but it's

very hard. So I was. Kind of shocked when they said they had autism, even though I knew they did because they were so verbal. It was ridiculous how verbal they were at 10 months, able to form sentences. That was fascinating. I didn't know about that. Yeah. Mention in the show. Hyperlexia, that's what they have, where their vocabulary is extraordinary and at a college level in third grade. And, you know, it's disarming to see a little tiny child come up and conjugate all these verbs and multiple...

Yeah, doofy. Houser you, yeah. Totally. Right. Totally. And when they told me that they had autism, I panicked, and then I realized faith or fear. You have two choices in every big decision. You're going to be afraid or are you going to have faith that we're going to figure it out. We're going to have faith. We're going to figure it out. You know, and I never lied to my kid. I definitely didn't want them to be ashamed. They're very proud. They wear shirts that say, this is what an autistic person looks like. Or they wear a shirt a lot that says, ew, people, which I think is the funniest t-shirt that they own. It's a good audience. Right. And, you know, it's challenging, but it's also quite beautiful and poignant and in ways that I never expected. Did you consult them when you were doing the show? Because I have one of my kids who calls me a charant, and so I stopped.

Wow. That you share everything. Yeah, sharent. Don't be a shareant. Oh, that's interesting. One doesn't care. The other's young. I have two little ones and two older ones. And because I always like to joke, I'm a straight white man. I have a second family, essentially. And they all get along great.

But one of my kids, I took it to heart. Like, you know, not talking about him or I am talking right now, but I thought he was right. Yeah. It definitely stopped me. Did you talk to play about this? What's interesting is that the first four, who are between 23 and 31, they didn't have any option because I was on TV and that was my life. And as an artist, you mold the clay in front of you, so to speak. And that's what I was doing. So when I was on the- And before social media.

Yes, before social media. So I wrote out the play and we were flying home from Ireland for a visit or something and I fell asleep and I wake up and their arms are folded and they're looking at me. And they go, you think it's okay to tell stories about me in your show? I don't want to want to be in your stupid show. And I said, well, you know what, honey, I can only write about my life. And for the last 13 years, my life has been about you and me. It's like she's an only child because the other ones are grown and out. And it's been a very different experience. And, you know, to not be partnered while you do it, too. It's just me and her. So she finally said she understood and it was okay for this, but that she doesn't know if she's giving me permission

in perpetuity. Yeah, in perpetuity. I said, okay, sweetheart, I get it. A lawsuit is pending. But when I read it and rehearse in the house, I hear her from another room going, that's not true. I never said that. That is a blatant exaggeration, mom.

I was not used that word. And you fix it. No, I don't. I leave it as it is because, you know, that's all I can do. But they're pretty good about giving me the space. You know, they are an artist, and they draw really, really well. And I say, you know, when you sit down to draw, you draw what inspires you. When I sit down and write, I write what inspires me.

And in many ways, Clay, this show is a love letter to you. No, it's a very touching. I can't imagine Clay wouldn't find it touching. Oh, no interest in seeing it. Oh, really? No interest. And my kids don't listen to my podcast either. No, they will not watch a movie.

In fact, my oldest boy who just had a baby. when he was about 18, he came home, he goes, I was at Joey's, and there was this baseball movie on, and you were like a teenager, and you were talking like you was Sylvester Stallone, and you were not very good. And I said, thank you, honey. That's my most famous movie, and you've never seen it, and you're 18. Yeah, my kids do the same thing.

Yeah, and especially when I interview someone big and then someone else interviews them, they're like, oh, I really like that interview that person. I'm like, you know, I did that three years ago, but you don't care. They don't care. They don't care. But it's better that they don't care, don't you think? Let me bring it to something. You don't know what we have met before. Yeah, I don't remember. I'm sorry about that. It's okay. You were playing Rizzo in Greece and you were in Washington, D.C., and I wrote the theater column.

And you and I did an interview with you about person to person. Person and person. I forget the hotel. It was probably the four seasons in Georgetown. I'm not sure where they put you. But you and I had an argument about coming out because you were very aware. It was gay, I think. Well, I had gay my whole life so I can spot it. another gay person a mile away. But we had a very off-the-record discussion about coming out. And I was like, I think you should.

And you were like, you can't because of Hollywood. We had a fascinating, which I wish I might have the tape to still to this day. But it was really interesting to me about what you reveal about yourself, because now you're very revelatory in this play and everything else. Well, coming out officially that I did after 9-11 was revelatory in my life and growth. And I never thought growing up. up as somebody our age, that you could be an out lesbian performer and still work in Hollywood and a pair. But when I became a parent, everyone in my life knew I was gay. Lois Smith, my publicist

used to walk between me and Kelly on the way into events so that nobody would think that I was with her. Like, everyone was doing their part. In fact, when I was doing Greece, Patrick Pichenko, I believe He was in a... Well, he did an interview with me for Helen Gurley Brown Cosmo. And in it, he asked me if I was dating anyone. And I said, no, I'm taking all resumes. And he said, would they be females or males that you would be looking for? I said, I'm open to all takers. And Helen Gurley Brown called Lois Smith, who was my elderly publicist, who was no longer with us. Yeah. And... Classic. She was a classic. She was a classic. I remember. Yeah, she was something else. And... Helen Gurley Brown and Lois decided to take that out of the interview. Not that I asked them to. You know, I lived my life as an out person. Everyone at my show knew I was gay.

Right. This was the argument we had. I said that wasn't good enough. It wasn't enough. And you know who else had that conversation with me? Chastity Bono. Oh, interesting. Yeah, before the transition.

She asked if I would do the same thing. And I was like, no way in hell I'm doing that. I mean, Ellen wasn't out. No, I know. Will and Grace wasn't on. I know. You know, it was a time where I was too afraid to be the first, and I was afraid of losing everything, including my children.

Yeah, yes. I remember you saying that. I remember you say it was a really hard time to do that. So when I did come out and people were shocked, I was shocked. Yeah. I'm like, they go, well, you said you liked Tom Cruise? I said I wanted to mow my lawn and bring me lemonade. Right, right.

You know, and there are men that I feel that way about. Yeah, yeah. Sydney Harcourt in the Jellicle Ball, who plays Rumtum Tugger. Runtum Tugger. He's a hot piece. Oh, my Lord. And he, when I was up there doing that, he gave me my face a caress and I was like, oh, my God, you know. But I don't want them naked in my bed. Right, right. I just love men in a different kind of way. I hate to quote Roseanne Barr, but she did have the best jokes. I don't know why people think lesbians hate men. They don't have to sleep with them. See, I don't like to laugh for Roseanne Bar these days, but it's a great joke. No, it's very sad what's happened to her.

The previous, the person formerly known as funny, Roseanne Barr. Yes. Anyways, interesting conversation. I'm glad you did because I think it means a lot to young people especially. Oh, yeah. And my life was so much more fulfilling, easy, and, you know, chaos-free. And then you had a gay cruise. I mean.

Well, then we went all the way gay, right? We cut the hair short. We did the whole thing. You did. We'll be back in a minute. Support for this show comes from Framer. Framer is a complete website platform, not just a builder, so teams can launch and keep improving their sites in one place. Thousands of businesses from early stage startups to Fortune 500s are choosing to build their websites in Framer,

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I thought the most moving part is obviously about your family and you were returning to Ireland. And that was very beautiful. But politics are there everywhere hanging over you. And just this week, Trump attacked you. I don't know if you saw. He did another attack of you on true social. No, I didn't see that one. I'm sorry to say. Yeah, he just, it's not even a good one, actually. He brought you up in a very strange speech he gave at the White House correspondent. Oh, yes. Sorry. I did see that. That I saw. Oh, there was another one. Yeah, there's another one. People know you're an outspoken critic Trump. And people don't realize you've done it since 2006. But what do you want the audience to understand about how your public feud with the president affects your daily life? Because you talked a little bit about in the show. Well, you know, when I talked about him on The View, I told the truth what every New Yorker my age knows about him. That he is not a self-made man, that he got his father's money, that he is a grifter, that he is a logo slapper, that he's not, in fact, a builder.

that, you know, his apprentice days were all fiction sold as fact and people believed them. Like, I saw him for who he was from the time I was a little kid, from the time I knew who he was. I was like, this guy's a joke. He's a used car salesman. He's a snake oil salesman. And I said it. And he went absolutely bad shit crazy. Yeah.

You were sort of the first that you really did focus on. Yes, exactly. And I think it's because I'm from a. Comac, which is on Long Island, and he's from Queens, which is part of Long Island. And I think on those girls that he didn't like in elementary school, who were tough and maybe grew up to be gay, who would talk back to the idiot rich boys who thought they were funny, who were obnoxious, and make fun of them and say, you're not playing with us. You're not playing kickball. And I think that is what got him, that he thinks he has elevated himself from where he used to be to who he is now.

and I am one of the peasants. And how dare a peasant from my community speak to me like that? Right. Although I think it's a little more common. I think he actually thinks he's just still as low. He's still the person looking. Oh, that's the point. He still feels that low.

That's why he had to come after me because it reminds him that I get his number and so does so many millions of people. Right. And so in being a vocal critic of the Trump administration, you get a lot of harassment for it. And then you remain as outspoken as ever. Talk about what compels you to keep speaking out. And if you feel if you could have taken that back, I don't believe you would. No, I never would have taken it back.

I feel it's my responsibility to stand up for this country that has given me so much. That here I'm a young girl with a, you know. Star Search. Exactly. I'm a young girl that came from nowhere and made, you know, this life for myself and these children. Only in this country could this happen. And I feel beholden to that. feel responsible for that. I feel like it is my responsibility to give back. And this is what I feel

is the best way that I can do that is by saying, please take note of this, please remember this, please know who we are as a nation. Do you ever get, the online harassment is rather large. I mean, now he has lots of targets, right? Like, as they said, at the White House correspondent, he went after Caitlin Collins. He goes after, it's always women. It's often women. Or men, he receives as weak in some fashion. Or many's afraid of, like De Niro. Yes, De Niro. I believe he's afraid at De Niro.

I believe De Niro is everything he wishes he was. Yes, yeah, that's a good point. He keeps going, too. What is the cost to you at this point? Well, you know, I don't feel it's a cost to me. I feel that all the love and respect and admiration that I have received since being back in New York and all of the success of the show and then getting to do Kimmel is because of it.

I don't think it's cost me. Now, I know I've heard a lot of people, including Anna Navarro, talking about how people come up to her and say things to her. No one has ever come up to me besides once in a CVS when I was with my kid. A MAGA guy wearing a MAGA hat and a MAGA, everything started sort of loudly yelling. And I said, I have a small child here who is autistic, and I think you better back up. And then we left and Clay said, why is that man so mad? And I said, he really likes the president. And she says, oh, that bad guy. And I say exactly right.

He likes the bad guy. So he's full of bad stuff. Right, right, right. So only once. That's only once. So no one has like, people don't stop me and go, I love Trump. People stop me and say, thank you. Yeah.

So I haven't experienced what Anna Navarro has experience. Now, online is a different thing. Right. But I have words that you can put to block, you know. And so I don't see a lot of them. Yeah. If you go on my feed, you might be overwhelmed by, oh, my God, look at this. But when I watch it, I go, well, it's not that bad.

It's been clarifying for some people to see how being rich doesn't make you brave. I think when you're talking about these rich guys. And I've seen it for ages with the tech guys. And Scott talks a lot about how they have fuck you money. In reality, it's made them more scared. They don't say fuck you, which is really interesting. When Jeff Bezos had that lavish wedding in Italy last year, you wrote about the gross excess of it all, turn your stomach. I agree completely.

What do you think has happened with these people? These are the current rich, right? And you're mixed with lots of rich people. Yes, I think that people who only measure in money have lost the reason for living. And when I left my show, that was the reason. I had more than enough money to take care of myself and my children and the people in my life for the rest of my life. Should I spend it wisely and not go crazy, right? And that's what I've done. And I'm in a good place and I don't need to work. I love to work. I'm happy when I get to do. do a wonderful piece of art, but it was never my motivation. Now, to say that I didn't want a better life than the one I had, that's the truth. I didn't want to have to be struggling and my mother cutting coupons and us wearing hand-me-downs and, you know, shopping at Corvettes. But the people who only measure in money and don't care about anyone else, I just think they're selfish idiots.

And especially Bezos, what he does to his employees at Amazon, and then he has the balls to go have that indecent wedding? And all the people who showed up, I was like, oh, this is horrifying. Right, right, yeah. You know, absolutely. One of the things that's interesting is they think of themselves as victims. You do know that. They talk as if they're the victims and how dear. I had many of them come up to me after my book was written. They said, you are so mean. I'm like, I'm not mean enough. No. And it turned out, as it turned out, it got worse and worse. Yes. And this was pre-standing in the front of the Trump inauguration. Why do you think they're doing that? having enough has not become a concept in America.

It seems to have gotten out of control. But it certainly is a concept in Ireland. Yeah. It totally is that you should spend your days happily working at something you like in order to take holidays. And that's what the Irish do. They take long holidays every year. Right.

It's beautiful. And it's a balance in life. I think we've lost the balance in America. Capitalism. With Trump as president. Correct. corporate ownership of everything, including our fourth estate, which is horrifying to see what has happened and the fact that President Trump can berate a woman and the press court just

ask the next question, why they don't ask the same question that Caitlin Collins asked, why they don't stand up for each other, why they don't walk out together, why they don't, it boggles my mind. Well, because there's money to be made by the corporations that own it that are not seeking the truth. And without the fourth estate, one of the pillars of our democracy, we're doomed. Yeah, I would agree. Although there's a real surge in independent media at the same time. There sure is.

And that's the only place to go for it. Right, absolutely. And also, Trump's popularity is in the toilet right now largely due to the war in Iran, is handling the economy. People are tired of his act, I think. And the fact that he's falling asleep, that he's very physically ill, that he doesn't look like he's long for this earth. that he shouldn't be the man in control of the nuclear codes. Like, these are things that everyone around him knows, but America just goes photo.

Well, no, his polls are proven to the low 30s. This is the lowest of many president. And do you think his base is finally breaking in a meaningful way? Yes, I think people are waking up. Yes, they are. And I think it's taken a very long time. And so many people have suffered and people have died because of him. Many people.

And they're over the charades. He thinks this is a reality show. And I do blame Mark Burnett for teaching him that you tell a lie long enough on TV. It becomes the truth. I think it was a natural for him. Well, Roy Cohen taught him that too. And I think he was born that way. But you talked a lot of the need to welcome people back who've realized they've been conned by Trump.

I have said that too. I get a lot of pushback. Like, no. I do, too. I get people who write on the thing, I will never forgive them. I'm like, well, then we will never be the country that we once were. Right. And I think the pain is deep for a lot of people.

So how do you do that personally, you too, because, you know, you get attacked online quite a lot, and I get attacked quite a lot. And I have to say you have to let them back in, or some of them, not all of them. Not all of them, but I'll tell you a recent one. You know, Michael Cohen, who was the creator of many of the Rosies of Fat, Disgusting, Pervert stuff. Right. When he turned on Trump and Trump was doing all kinds of things to him, I wrote him a letter and said that, you know, I forgive you. for what I know you did, and I want you to know that I'm proud of the stance that you're taken.

And he wrote me and asked me to come visit him in prison, and I did. And I had a six-hour visit with him, and we maintained, you know, a friendship over the phone or online, and now he's back with Trump. And I blocked him, and I will never speak to him again. I can't believe that this man had to come to Jesus and understood his role in this horrific, catastrophe that is Trump. And then he reconciled with him. And I was stunned. And it made me feel at that moment, oh my God, these people are not to be trusted. And I don't want to live that way. When I see people on the internet, on Instagram saying, I voted for him three times,

and I'm really sorry, and I didn't realize. And I always write, thank you and welcome back. That's what I write to them. You're going to keep doing that. I'm going to keep doing that. What if Michael Cohen came to you and said, oh, I was wrong again? No way. Like an alcoholic. You know, fool me once. Right.

Right. You don't get to come back in. No, Michael Cohen caused tremendous damage to me personally. So doing that was for me as well as for him. And then I think he basically spit in my face by doing that. Yeah, no good deed, right? Right. New York Times interview with Jennifer Lawrence late last year.

They asked about speaking out versus now versus the first term. And she gave a very candid answer. She said, as we've learned, celebrities do not make a difference whatsoever on who people vote for, so then what am I doing? I'm just sharing my opinion on something that's going to add fuel to the fire that's ripping this country apart. When you think about speaking up, how important is it to keep speaking up? Very. Very. Yeah, because a lot of people are grappling with that. No, I think fairly grappling with it. Right. And I feel as though anyone with a public platform needs to speak out if they believe in the United States of America. And right now,

we're on the precipice of disaster. And he's trying to overthrow the election. And he's trying to overthrow the election and he's going to cause some kind of catastrophe and then say they're off. And, you know, it's very clear. And we all have to be ready for this because if that happens, we're doomed. We're doomed. Unless we stop it, correct? Right. Unless we stop it, stop him or he's no longer running. So you're still nervous about that possibility. Because they say they're going to do it. I always say when they say it, believe them, essentially. They say they're going to do what? Stop the election. They talk about it. Of course. And it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, you know, to me, it's quite obvious. That's, that's another thing. Like, things to me that seems so obvious that I don't

understand why they're not obvious to other people. Right. It's taken me a long time to go, the way that you view the world is not the way everyone else views the world. Right. It's taken me 64 years to do that. We'll be back in a minute. Support for this show comes from Odu. Running a business is hard enough. So, why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other? Introducing Odu. It's the only business software you'll ever need. It's an all-in-one fully integrated platform that makes your work easier.

CRM, accounting, inventory, e-commerce, and more. And the best part, O-DU replaces multiple expensive platforms for a fraction of the cost. That's why over thousands of businesses have made the switch. So why not you? Try Odu for free at Odu.com. That's O-D-O-O-O-com. So every episode we get a question from an outside expert. Here's yours.

Okay. Hi, you two. It's Megan Rapino here, retired athlete and fellow podcast hosts. Rosie, I am curious what you think, especially leading into the midterms, what the Democrats can learn from a lesbian, first of all. But most importantly, how to handle Trump with repeated attacks and sort of a playbook. And also how you plan to deal with him in. your guest host role on Jimmy Kimmel Live. So let me know. I love Megan Rapino. She's fantastic.

I got her just for you. Thank you so much. That's really beautiful. Yeah. I think that I plan on doing what Jimmy Kimmel has done so beautifully, which is giving it to him in a comedic, honest, truthful way. And I will do that as big as I can. Now, the song that I sang in my show, if he only had a brain, I wanted to do that on Kimmel, but they just told me I can't. Oh. that they couldn't get permission for the parody because it's political content. And I was like, well, that is absurd to me because we used to do parodies every day on my show. Wait, I don't understand. Well, I've been told I'm not allowed to do that.

Now, I don't know. It's not Jimmy. Do you like to sing a bit of it here? Yes. Go ahead. His approval rate is 30. His diaper's always dirty. I think the guy's insane.

He ain't no stable genius got a teeny tiny penis, and he doesn't. doesn't have a brain. But it's a long song, and I got tremendous response at the show. You did. You did. But I plan on doing whatever we can and working with the writers and his team and honoring just how brave and bold he has been. Yeah, he has been. And I admire him greatly.

I've never been on his show. So this will be the first time as the guest host. And I'm thrilled that he... I have a full week. I have a full week, yes. And I'm thrilled that he asked me. And I hope I can follow just his... You give us a preview of your guest, for example?

No, no. I wanted to have Ms. Rachel, but she, I think, is, you know, Mr. Rogers now for our contemporary time. And she's brilliant and brave and bold, and I admire her greatly. And we are going to give away her doll, but she couldn't make it or they couldn't book it. I don't know exactly why. But they've asked me not to tell who the guests are. Right, that's okay. That's okay.

You know, but they're not political like that. It's not like I'm getting, you know, Jane Fonder and De Niro and. all of the people like Mark Ruffalo, and we can all just talk about the loathing of this man, you know, and what he's done to the country, you know. That would be a good show, maybe like The View, we can have the... The View, you could do that. Yeah. Are you going to go back on the View while you're here? They're off now for the summer, but, you know, if when their 30th season happens next year, they're bringing everyone in. Yeah, I would do that. And, you know, I saw Whoopi, you know,

we had like a kind of difficult time when we were both on the show together. And but, you know, we're both grown-ass women. And I have tremendous respect and admire all that she's done. This egot, again, an unlikely woman only in America. Yeah, what a great story she has. Oh, my God. You know, really beautiful. And I think she's doing a great job on that show.

And, you know, for me, talking politics is not the best use of my talent. But I feel the need to do it because- Comedy. You can do it through comedy. Do you want to have another show? I would go back to daytime if they asked me because I really feel that those are my people, the mothers at home with their kids. And, you know, I would do that. And because Kelly Clarkson left and there seems to be a vacancy in some capacity. Can I ask you, you just use an interesting term if they asked me. You know, you don't have to be asked. You don't have to be waited to be asked anymore in the new digital universe. Well, that's so true. But, you know, to do one, the way and the style that.

that I would like to do it. I would like to do it on a streaming service or a network that we could have a live audience and still give away free things to the, you know, I would like to do it similar to what I've done. And I believe America really is craving nostalgia right now. They're craving an easier time. And back then when I was on the show,

you know, the Internet wasn't really around. You've not thought of a podcast or a YouTube show. I tried a podcast, Tara. And it was very difficult for me. because I didn't have somebody to talk to all the time besides someone I was interviewing. Right. So in the morning when they'd want me to tell a funny story, it would just be me. And I thought, this is not fun for me.

Oh, you like an audience. I like an audience and I like people, a staff around me. I like to get to know their stories. I like being in that environment. Yeah. Yeah. So what is the advice? What would the advice for Democrats from...

The advice for Democrats is stand up to him at every turn, not meekly, strongly. come at him with the force he comes at you and stay intellectually superior because that's not too difficult with him, right? And just, you know, do some words with multiple syllables and he'll be lost, you know? When do you stop, though? Because Rahm Emanuel said to me,

you come at him really hard until the midterms and then he's an old man who needs to go home. Like that's, he said, forget him after you win after the midterms if it's a huge success. We can't forget him because he's constant, doing evil, horrific, inhumane things to everyone, enriching himself in broad daylight. And I don't understand why Jimmy Carter had to sell his peanut farm, but these idiots are making billions of dollars and announcing it and no one is doing anything. Right. Right. Well, what's

interesting is we realize there's nothing to be done. Well, that's the scariest part. And when he's out there needs to be a whole new series of laws about never having this happen again. Right, absolutely. Let me ask you, are you worried that Trump's speaking of doing things? He'll obviously be watching you because he's riveted to you in some fashion. Will you think he will, you worried about any FCC? They went after ABC. They went after the view. They're continuing to go after the view. But are you worried about the FCC? Doing what? Coming after you on the show, for example, doing anything? No. What are they going to say that you can't say?

that? I mean, I want to do a song. Yes, actually, Brendan Carr, who is a moron, is saying those things. Well, I don't listen to them. I don't pay any heed to them. I'm going to go, like, I want to sing a song the first night, hello, Donnie, know you're watching. Donnie, it's me Rosie showing up on ABC. I want to do like a little love song, like you got a crush. Donnie, it's too much. I hear you're leaving Melania for me. That's what I want to do. I think you should sexualize the whole thing.

That's what I'm saying. Make that he's totally wanting of me. You want to grab me, Donnie. I want to stab thee, Donnie. I don't know. I have to make it up as I go. I like it. Well done.

There you go. Anyway, I want to end up on positive talking about aging, actually, and freedom that comes with it. Now that you're back in the spotlight, people are going to notice. You look different. You've been very open about GLP-1s, which I think are the, I just did a show for CNN called Kara Swisher Wants to Live Forever. We had a whole show on GLP-1s because I was like, this is the groundbreaking technology.

I agree a thousand percent. Everyone's focused on AI, I'm like GLP-1s will change everything for all kinds of people. And you, to lose weight after you're diagnosed with type 2 diabetes is, right? And that you got a facelift. Talk about the stigma and why it was important for you to talk about. I really appreciated that you talked about both. Well, I had to, you know. Yeah, well, yeah, what happened?

Just fasting. No, that's what people say. There's someone who I don't like who has gotten really skinny and they're like, just fasting. I'm like, you need to stop. Yeah, it's just the shots and don't lie to us. And the people who do lie, there are some famous people who said, oh, I'm not on them. And then years later said, oh, by the way, I am.

And I always judge them, too, to tell you the truth. Talk about that. Yeah, because I feel like it's such a lie to perpetrate on people, you know. So I had lost a lot about 60 pounds. I only go on GLP1s on the lowest dose for a year. This was what my doctor recommended. Right. So I only go up very slowly.

So I lose like about 15 to 25 pounds a year. So in the three years, I've lost 60 pounds. And there was a lot of extra skin on my face. And I had lines here that they call marionette lines. And in Ireland, people would come up and go, what's it matter, Rose? You're so sad. I'm like, no, it's just my face, you know? And so I started asking friends who had, I have many friends who have had facelifts,

but some of them, you know, I didn't want to go that far. I just wanted really just this part. And so my friend Jenny Hut told me about this doctor and she had hers and she looked fantastic. And I went and met with him. And he was the first doctor that agreed to only do what I wanted. And before I went under, I said to him, Mark, listen to me, I am never going to say, I wish you did more. And he said, you're the first person that's.

said that to me. Right, because you can get convinced of it. Many people do that. Exactly. If you could fix this, why not fix this? Why not fix that? You had talked about your daughter talking about the feminist part of it. My daughter was very upset. In fact, to this day, she doesn't really know that I did it. Because I went in January, I did it. Ten days later, I went home. The bruising was gone, and they didn't notice. Yeah. Because, you know, it was subtle. It was. Yeah, it can be that way. My mom had one and pretended she didn't. And she had bruises and everyone. And she goes, what are you talking about? And I was like, oh, my God. Yeah, how do you deny what's right in front of your eyes? And I was like, why deny it? If you have it, you have it.

Yeah, what's the difference? Admit it. And I wanted to tell people. And I also told them the truth. It's very expensive. And I tell him my doctor, Mark Zimbler, if people want to know, he's in New York. That's the guy who was able to do exactly what I said. And if you want a big full facelift, go to the Kardashian guy, you know, pay $400,000 if that's what you want to do. But you did know the feminist aspects of it. Well, my daughter, my child, Clay, said to me, I can't believe that you went to London to talk to doctors about surgery, face surgery, plastic surgery. This is a rejection of everything that you say that you represent. I can't believe there are young girls who look up to you. What are they going to think when you do this?

This is not the best performance for a lesbian or for a feminist. And then the biggest one was, I don't know if I'll ever be able to look at. at you the same way if you do it. And that one really stopped me for a few months. That was like last summer and I was like, Jesus, I better not do this. But then come January when, you know, I was looking in the mirror going, Lord Almighty, I look so old and so like not fresh, you know, I said I have to do it. So, you know, being a feminist means you get to make your own decisions on what makes you happy and what you want to do. And that's really what I believe feminism is about.

me in tattoos. I'm like, I'm doing it for me. It's not true. Yeah, I love my tattoos too. And people say, why do you do that? I like it. I like the way it looks. I like this individuality that you get to adorn your body with, you know, ink of some artists that you love. Yeah, so it makes you feel better. It made me feel better and it made me feel not so sad. I think that GLP wants is that, is revolutionary. It's revolutionary. No, I think it's going to help addiction in many, many areas, because, you know, the food addiction is real. And the noise that your brain hears when you are an obese person and you like... Same with drinking.

Well, right. Every October after Halloween until Christmas, my kids would hide their candy from me. And at night, I would go search for it because I would know there was a butterfinger somewhere in the house and I couldn't sleep. There can't be a butter. Right. And so, you know, it was very, very difficult for me to not overeat sugar. And this drug has changed my life. And whenever I see someone struggling with obesity,

I wish I could convince the company that makes Manjaro to let me do commercials, even though they don't need it, because everyone wants it, if they would drop the price for people. Which they will. They have to. Prices will be lower and lower. I hope so.

Yeah, it's something that they should do, which is, this is to me something like the Trump administration should do. Like, it would be health care costs would go down so considerably around it. I was, you know, sort of a diabetic industrial complex along with the food industrial complex. Yes. Yes, indeed. The only thing I agree with the R of K Jr. is the stuff and the food is really addictive. Well, and you taste it when you go to Ireland. The food tastes different. The steaks taste different. Everything tastes different. Yeah. See, not so much from your time away. Yes. So I want to finish up talking about that. So you move to Ireland, you want to move back to the United States, correct?

When he's done. When he's done. Because I miss my other children greatly. and I miss, you know, New York and my life here. And I think it's very important as I get older for Clay to be around her siblings so that, you know, when I go, they'll have a strong connection, stronger than it is now. Very good point, yeah. And so those are the reasons that I would move back. I would keep my house in Dublin, which I love in Sandy Mount, a little village in the midst of a city. It's gorgeous. Gorgeous. You live in a very nice area. I really do. And it's a beautiful house. It's by far. the cheapest house I've ever lived in as an adult, and it's my favorite house. And I feel very at home there. One of the things, when you did an interview with your old co-hoots of you, Nicole Wallace, is wonderful. You said you don't really travel. You've performed this now in Australia and in Scotland, and you told Nicole, you're stretching in your old age. Is this show going anywhere?

Are you taking it? Well, this was sort of a proof of concept, right? I wanted to see how it would work in America because in Ireland there were far more Irish parts of it. So we took some things out and added more family things for New York. And I wanted to see if it would get the same response that it did over in Sydney and in Ireland. So we only did 12 shows just to see if Darrell Roth, who has the right to do it on Broadway, if she would want to next summer, I would be able to do that. So it's up to her and it's up to, you know, what happens on Broadway and whether or not ticket prices. It's a cheap show, but the ticket prices were still high. I thought they were too high.

I asked that they be lowered and they were like, well, this is the way that we have to do it for whatever. You know, I was like, my God. So if I could do like a little tucked away booth theater, you know, and have the ticket prices not be extraordinary, that would be. Would you take it elsewhere in this country? I would like to, you know. I would like to at some point, but with my child, it's hard to go away. You know, this summer has been a lot for them, and they have a little bit of autistic burnout. They want to get back home.

They want to get back home. Too much traveling, not enough routine. Yeah, I get it. I have adult kids and kids at home. I have a four-year-old and a six-year-old, too. Oh, good for you. Are you so excited about that? They're so great.

Oh, there's nothing better than that age. All the kids have a really, we're about to go to San Francisco next week to be with their older brother, so it calls me every day about them. It's a really wonderful relationship. I'm very happy about the whole situation. Is parenting different in your 60s? I know how it is for me. Oh my God, yes. Thousand percent. Meaning better? First of all, an autistic child forces me to have a patience level that I didn't have when my other kids were little. I think that because my mother died so young, I had a 10-year-old's idea of what a perfect mother would be. And in some ways, I made mistakes. I think I tried to flatten the bumps in the road for them a little bit too much, which, you know,

made it difficult then when a bump occurs in adult life. And I also didn't realize that adult children need their mothers and fathers so much, like when my kids now in their 20s and 30s would call me and tell me what's going on. And, you know, and also the sense of sadness and desperation that they feel about the current state of the world and their lack of ability to ever own a home. and, you know, it's a very different experience. It is. Yeah, it never ends. Yeah, it never ends.

And I didn't realize that. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the best part of it, actually. I do too. I think I'm a better parent to even the older kids now. Yeah, I think the same thing for me. I think I try to connect more. You know, connection is very big with clay.

And because I do that on a daily basis, make a point to connect and to get inside there, I do it now with my bigger kids too. And it's been very rewarding. Yeah. I think lesbians to raise all the kids, honestly. I do too, frankly. We have strong, confident men who like women and girls who are confident and also like men and women. Exactly. Yeah. So it seems like you have a new kind of energy and confidence now. A lot of people have said that to me. Yes. I don't know that I sense it. I sense it. Yeah. Other people have said that they sense that. Yeah. And I don't know you well, but it feels like that. You seem mentally healthier. Yes. Yes. In your long career, you've done stand-up comedy, hosting talk shows, acting in movies. Obviously, you've been an advocate in this one-man show. What do you hope the next act

looks like? You know, I hope I get to do something that still provides me with enough time to be around my family in a really meaningful way. But, you know, I would like to come back. If I could do something in the daytime area, I would do that. So I don't know. We'll see what happens. But I want to be able to be central and available to my children as a priority more so than I do out of my career. So you'd never run for office? Never. Never, I would be. No, because, you know, my mental health is something I have to stay on top of.

And I think that, you know, I wouldn't have the patience to deal with all the bullshit that is required when you are a politician. Would you go out on the road for any politicians? Oh, and I have before. Is there anyone you're loving right now? Well, I'm a fan of Gavin Newsom. I like the way he talked back to Trump. I like the way he stands up for what he believes in and gay marriage, which he did all those years ago and was there when I married Kelly. I think he's he reminds me of a Kennedy. He's a handsome man. Yeah, he's a handsome man. And the only thing. Not that you want to sleep with him, just like no, I do not. But I like to look at him sometimes. And I don't think of anything below the waist. Trust me on this one, people. But I'm a big fan of him. supporter and always was of Hillary Clinton and went out on the road with her and did a lot of events and interviews and I do whatever I can.

So you want to be part of what's next coming. What do you hope for the country right now? That we can restore ourselves to what we, the founding fathers originally intended and that we can stop the corruption and the misogyny and the racism that permeates this land. Yeah. Well, hello, Donald. Yes, hello, Donnie. Hello, Donnie, well, hello.

Donnie, it's me, Rosie, and I'm looking at you right here on TV. Okay. Thank you so much. It's great. And thank you for coming to my show. Of course. It was wonderful. It was fantastic.

Thank you. I appreciate it. Today's show was produced by Michelle Alloy, Catherine Millsop, Madeline LaPlante Dubey, Megan Bernie, and Kaylin Lynch. Nishat Kerwa is a box media's executive producer of podcast. Special thanks to AIM and Whale. Dave Shaw and Julia Sharp Levine. Our engineers are Fernando Arruda and Rick Juan,

and our theme music is by Trackademics. If you're already following the show, you're sipping a pint with the locals. If not, the crossing guard in Ireland is going to have a word. Go wherever you listen to podcast, search for On with Caraswisher, and hit follow. Thanks for listening to On With Caraswisher from Podium Media, New York Magazine,

the Vox Media Podcast Network, and us. We'll be back on Thursday with more. Support for this show comes from Odoo. running a business is hard enough, so why make it harder with a dozen different apps that don't talk to each other? Introducing Odu, it's the only business software you'll ever need.

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