One Song - The Beatles “Come Together”

Episode Date: August 31, 2023

This week on one song we’re talking all things joo joo eyeball, walrus gumboot, and monkey finger — That’s right, Diallo and LUXXURY are peering into The Beatles word salad masterpiece, Come Together. Come for John Lennon’s breathtaking isolated vocal stems, stay for LUXXRY’s hot takes on Ringo Starr’s drumming skills. Album: Abbey Road Artist: The Beatles Released: 1969 Genres: Blues rock, Swamp rock, Rock, Folk Featured songs: You Can't Catch Me by Chuck Berry, You Can't Catch Me by John Lennon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

One or two, a one, two, three, four. Here come a one song we be talking about music gonna, serious X-M gonna talk. And hopeful wanna thank Kevin Hart. This is one song and luxury. We threw you all so much that we were singing. Oh, I got so excited. That was exciting. That was fun. Electricity in here.

I felt like we were at the old EMI studios, aka now Abby Road Studios. I just felt an electric connection between it. This is what partnership and collaboration is all about. I just felt like an extra refreshers-level connection with you, my friend. I'm serious, though, like, we're going to talk about this show. By the way, what is this show? Talk about it. By the way, who are we, and what is this show?

I am actor, writer, director, and sometimes DJ Diallo-Rillowrilla. And I'm producer, DJ, and songwriter luxury, aka the guy on TikTok who whispers, Interpolation. And this is one song. The show where we deconstruct and celebrate some of your favorite songs from the past 60 years in music history and tell you why they deserve one more listen. You'll never hear these songs the same way again. No, you won't.

And if you haven't already guessed it today, we're talking about the Beatles come together. That's the one. I'm so excited to talk about the Beatles. Little known British group sort of underground. You know, just to expose them, expose them to a wider audience. So the funny thing about this episode is that like this is the, I can't. think of a more culturally big, they've been around for 60 years, and that duration is a huge part of their hugeness. And I feel like there's actually, it's hard to say anything about the

group that hasn't already been said, but we're going to try to say some things that get added to the camera. We think we found some cool ways to tell the story. First of all, focusing on just the single song, we're going to play for you some isolated stems, tell you some stories you may not have heard, and talk about why the song is so important to us. Exactly. Also, why is so important to us personally. There's some personal stories. There's some personal things. There's some personal stuff.

And like every other episode, we don't really know. We just have some, we're going to talk about some stuff and the rest of it's spontaneous. I have no idea the stories that Diallo has about the Beatles in his life. I'm excited to hear. I just want to start the show with this. Diallo, what do the Beatles mean to you? Oh, man. A lot of people don't know this about me now, but anybody who's known me since I was a kid,

I was a huge Beatles fan. The first piece of music that I ever bought at a record. store was a hard day's night. No way. I feel like it cost $4.99 at this random record store. It's the first album you bought. What, like you bought? Absolutely. It's the first I remember

actually buying. So my father was a huge jazz record collector. He had something like 3,000 jazz records and I had a Muppet Show drum set in the basement. And I would sit down there and I would drum along to his John Coltrane records.

And I even drummed along to like the soundtrack to Star Wars. But when it came time for me to my first piece of music. There was a cartoon that I used to watch that had like the Beatles. And I didn't know it at the time, but the Beatles didn't loan their voices to that cartoon.

They were a whole bunch of it. But there was like a Beatles cartoon. And I used to love them running around on like ships. It was very like, you know. It was like an unlicensed Beatles cartoon. No, it was licensed. Okay.

I feel like it was from like the Rocky and Bull Winkle era. Okay. Okay. And I would watch that show and I like the music. And I bought a hard day's night. And I loved it. I loved that album. And I wore a hole in it.

and then I went back and got please I got Love Me Do and I got into like the early era Beatles and then I got Sergeant Pepper's and I remember some of the songs on that album scared me like as a kid because I didn't know Like she's leaving home is kind of dark right? Yeah and I was also like who are these guys You know on the inside cover?

They don't look like the Beatles like who are these guys So you know I feel like the Beatles have been there From the very beginning I'll never forget real quick A friend of my father's telling him When he heard that I was listening to more of the Beatles than the R&B at the time. He was like, no, don't do that.

He's going to learn the wrong rhythm. Oh, no. He's going to learn that other rhythm. But thankfully, I learned a bunch of different rhythms. I've heard you clap. You're on the, you're on the, you're on the difference. Oh, yeah. The one and three is I actually,

literally had to like sit there and think. I was like, where's the one? Where's the three? You've got to do the two and four. That didn't become a thing. You're a backbeat guy. I will also say one of the first things I remember from, you know, my earliest, earliest memories

was John Lennon being shot and dying and seeing like all these people react to that and I just I knew something very bad had happened. I remember that year I asked my parents for a for a Beatles birthday cake and so I saved the little figurines from that cake and played with them like toys. You know, that was my toys. I just had my little Beatles, you know, toys, which I think are still in a closet somewhere. But yeah, that's sort of like I came into the Beatles pretty damn early in life. That's me. What do the Beatles mean to you? I can relate to everything you just said so hard, like from the idea of the Beatles just being like wallpaper on planet Earth.

It's just like they're always there. They've always been there. And they've always felt like this larger than life entity. They're not just a musical group. They're a cultural phenomenon. It's like Coca-Cola and Blue Jeans and the Beatles. The first two things being American, I guess. But as a British export, they represented this idea of musicness but also groupness

because they were for guys. Like you were talking about your birthday cake. That's important. The figurines. you kind of like, them as people were, you were connected to them. I lit the icing off and, like, they were officially toys. But that was there from day one for everybody, from what I understand. Like in 1962, 63, they start giving interviews and they're charming and funny.

And they're really fast with the comebacks. Like, someone will try to, you know, borderline insult them to their face. Like, there's some interview where Paul's being interviewed in the guys like, so what do you think your cultural impact will be? And right away, Paul's like so sharp. He's like, is this a joke, cultural impact? We're just having a laugh. Oh, I mean, my favorite.

responsible all time is, are you a mod or you're a rocker? I'm a mocker. And it's so effortless. And they come up with these things on the fly. And they absolutely like whenever they're in front of a crowd of like reporters, they just like absolutely win them over. They melt the hearts of the entire nation and the world. And we grow up many years later on a different continent. And we still have that impact on us. And you're in Atlanta, right? And I'm in San Francisco. Like this is crazy that their impact. And even in 2023, the impact only grows with You know what's interesting is that I think it's one of those things that can only come about when you have more than one mind come together. And I think we're going to talk a lot about the idea of these guys, specifically John and Paul, but the other guys too, you know, all throwing in, you know, you and I are in a partnership. I have a writing partner. Like the idea of like working with somebody else to create something more than what one person could come up with. Like I think John would have always had a successful music career. Paul, I mean, the man is a hit machine. You know, George might have had an amazing career, but at the end of the day, the fact that they all were able to come together.

And yes, Ringo, we're going to talk about Ringo. I was going to say you left one out, but we're going to get to back. Like, I think there's something to be said about collaboration, you know, in the arts. And even if you hate the other person, we know that, you know, we know how this story ends, even when you can't get along with the other person, whether it's the Beatles or it's outcast or whoever. Totally. Like, the idea that you can sit down with somebody else and create something is truly special. the way, I mean, we're going to get to so much today, but even the phenomenon of how sometimes that is short-lived, the duration, it just can't last past, in the Beatles case, seven, eight years,

they're together outcast, I don't know how many totally yours. Like a lot of these wonderful relationships, they have kind of a beginning and an end point. And then the personalities that have been fiery, fiery, making beautiful art for all these years, just it combusts and goes, you know, it can't last. Yeah. Okay, let's get into it. This song, come together. The first song off Abby Road, the 11th Beatles album from 1969. It's a song that came about when Lennon met Timothy Leary at a bed-in. And it's been covered by everyone from Tina Turner to Michael Jackson. Get ready to shoot some Coca-Cola.

It is Come Together. I'll tell you, from the first time I ever heard this song, I always felt like there was something evil going on. Like, there's all kinds of weird imagery, like, Ju-Joo Eyeball, you know, grooving up slowly. Always sounded a little bit sneaky. Yeah, spinal cracker. Holy Roller.

like, you know, it just, it felt like, you know, the Louisiana Beatles or something like that. There was always something, something going on there. Something real swampy going on. We're going to actually talk about the swampiness. I didn't even know. I mean, who's flat top? So many questions. And why is he grooving up slowly?

Well, there is, there might be a reason why it's flat top. And part of that comes from Lenin's love for one of his favorite musicians, which was Chuck Barry. And the origin of this song, the Genesis is kind of like some dovetailing ideas coming together for him. One was he was writing a campaign song for Timothy Leary's campaign for governor of California, and the slogan was come together. Imagine how different California would have turned out. If Timothy Leary had won in 1970, I mean, like, could have been a different decade. Could have been a different planet Earth.

Yeah, if Reagan hadn't had that second term and they'd have to be president. Reagan probably doesn't become president of the United States. That's crazy. Exactly. So Lenin is turning this phrase around in his mind. And as a songwriter, I recognize this. You're kind of walking around with like a bunch of fragmented ideas. and then you sit down one day and it's like you're in the studio and it's like what do i got what do i got

you either look at today you look at your phone where you've got like you know text um you know notes with different ideas you know in the back of lenin's mind he's got this phrase he's turning over and then this groove that he starts riffing on on the guitar in the studio and what comes out of his mouth is here come a little flat top grooving up slowly that first line which we just heard and as he plays it, McCartney goes, wait a second, I feel like I've heard that before. And sure enough, it comes from this. Now that is very similar.

Would you say that that sounds similar. Would you say that that sounds similar? Yeah, I mean, like, I had no idea. Clearly, I'm not listening to enough Chuck Barry when I'm driving around. Yeah, I mean, Lenin is the fanboy. And literally, I think, in his way of thinking. Now, this is a big topic. And as you probably know, if you've heard the show or seen my TikToks, my favorite topic is the origins of creativity and where does it cross the line from being

an homage to his hero, Chuck Barry, versus you are ripping Chuck Barry off. And also, like, the whole tradition of white artists. taking from black artists. There's some intersectionality going on here in a big way. Repackaging. I like the rebranding of stealing, if you will. But I actually don't even think of this as stealing. Yeah.

Go ahead. Well, I agree, but I want to hear what you have to say. Well, here's my thing. I'm a big hip-hop fan. We've talked about this on the show before. Jay-Z starts off, I just want to love you. When the Rimmie's in the system, ain't no telling will or I diss them.

That's what they'd be yelling. You know, Drake starts off for free, the song for free. with a I go on and on can't understand how I last so long I must have superpowers,

rap 23 you know like both in both cases Jay Z is going off of an old biggie riff Drake is going off of an old two short song like you know

I think the idea of like interpolating can I do that you absolutely can I just owe you like it's okay you don't know me anything but I think the idea

of taking like just a snippet of somebody else's lyrics sort of as an homage or I would even argue a continuation. I mean, like, if it's dope, just, I feel like that's okay. And I feel like in a weird way, Lenin has done this before hip hop makes this common practice. Does that make sense? You're absolutely just finding what his mindset is. So he is absolutely thinking, I'm not doing

this. So actually, let me, let me be clear. We don't know what he was thinking. I would speculate that he was doing two things at once and probably justifying it a little bit. He was taking the melody. And I'll show you in a second just how close they are. It's a little bit so close. Well, it's a lot fast. Chuck Berry is also totally different. Like that, that cadence is crazy. Let's a pause right there and I'll play it for you and then let's get into that. So here is a one-to-one comparison of the two. And what they did, so just to finish the story, and this goes into the collaboration thing. So Lenin's in the mindset of, listen, I love Chuck Barry. This is an homage to him. I don't think I'm fooling anyone. It's the same notes. It's the same, you know,

basically lyrics. And McCartney's like, yeah, and it crosses a line and we're going to get nicked. And there's going to be a repercussion. So they had that dynamic. We'll tell the end of the story in a minute. But just for now, here's what McCartney's hearing. And part of it to your point is, and by the way, they hadn't done it yet. Part of it to his point is the early version, it was faster. The earliest version is what we understand is that they hadn't decided to make it sound different from Chuck Berry's version. So I'm going to play John Lennon's vocal, isolated, from Come Together by the Beatles. And then after that, I'm going to play Chuck Berry's isolated vocal

from You Can't Catch Me. And then I'll do kind of a slowed down and pitch down comparison so you can hear more directly how they're related. Here come old flat top. He come grooving up slowly. Okay, now for comparison, here's Chuck Barry. And again, this is slowed down, so it's a little different, but it is rhythmically and melodically the same,

and I'll make that really clear after I play this. So this is the part, and there's another conversation to be had about doing what I'm doing, because there is an argument in musicalogical circles that it's a little bit cheating. And in court, it's a really, it's an audience, it's a jury convincing device that may or may not be fair. I personally am doing it here because I do think it's fair in this case. But here's what it is. I'm now going to slow down. come together and pitch it down

so that it matches the key. Come together is in D. We're going to go into A and here's what that sounds like. Now this is layering Chuck Barry and John Lennon and you'll just hear that they're dead on the same. Listen, I think there's

he was obviously taking that part from Chuck Barry, but I will say the Chuck Barry song is fast. is this slow. Yeah. And again, he's just doing what I think, you know, especially, again, coming in a more hip-hop-centric era, is still acceptable. I actually think that this is just my theory. One of the great tragedies of John Lennon's death among all the tragedies of it is that he dies in 1980 in New York.

Yeah. I feel like John would have had such a great time with hip-hop. Yes. And I've always felt that way. You're right. He is the walrus. He is the walrus. Like, if you go back and listen to I am the Walrus, I'm serious, at the end of the song,

when he's going, chupa, chupa, chupa, chuba, chuba, chuba, chuba. And then, like, it's either his voice or Ringo's voices in the background going, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. It almost sounds like, ha, ha, ha, everybody, ha, ha. Like, I'm like, this dude would have loved hip-top. His pro hip-hippo. John Linden would have loved, I think he would have loved your attitude of it. I think he would, almost all the great John's songs have, like, this real percussive quality

to the singing. Like in this song, it's like he's basically going, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, you know, like, I am the wall, and the waller's, like, you know,

he comes with that force. Rhythmic, yeah, it's very rhythmic. I just think that that rhythmic force, I think he would have loved hip-hop, and he was almost there. Stop presses. It's not the 50th anniversary.

It's the 55th anniversary of hip-hop, and it begins right here with this gentleman. Now, that's interesting. It's a great connection that you made to those things. I think he would have loved it. I would have loved the attitude, the anti-establishment tone of it. I just,

I wish that those, Two things could have meant. Clearly, he loves appropriating black artists. So there's also that back there. He does like a black artist. So let's get deeper into the song. As you obviously know, stems, I collect these. It's one of my favorite things to listen to and to share.

So now for the first time on one song, we're going to listen to Ringo Stars, isolated drums. And by the way, this is all recorded. It's really dry. He's got tea towels on the kit. And Dialla, you were saying earlier, we were talking a little bit about that swampy vibe. Yeah.

And the slowing it down. It's like a smoky. Ms. Cal. It's a smoke. Oh my God, you're making me thirsty. We were also talking a minute ago about how to change the song from the original Chuck Berry. Now they're in Cahoots. Now the partnership, Lennon McCartney. Who do you want to be in this story? You're McCartney. We're Paul. We're in Cahoots. We're like, okay, we're doing this, John, because you insist, and it is a great tune. But we've got to, we've got to kind of make it different from what you're ripping off. We've got to start to hide elements of how this song is similar. Well, we're doing a key change. They're

already did that. We went from A to D and A major to D minor, D seventh. Well, whatever it is, it's D. And we're also going to slow it down. We're going to, that swampiness, that kind of New Orleans vibe comes from a conscious effort to slow, like the tempo is slower and more lugubrious. So that begins with and let's make the beat. And let's make the beat not do to do to do. Let's make it tom-toms and let's make it kind of abstract. So Ringo kills it. with what he comes up. I think that's one of his best songs. All right, let's hear these drums. Let's do it. Ringo, what do you got? That's the famous riff.

And here's what he plays during the verse. Not a high hat, not a symbol in sight, just Tom's. Not even a snare. This is an unusual beat. It's Tom, Tom, Tom, and Kick Drum. It's so minimal. He's like just getting out of the way. I've always felt like one of the things that makes Ringo special is that he does not get

in the way. I think that if he was more of a showboat drummer, you know, like, people are like, oh, he can't hold a can't hold a Keith Moon. I'm like, that wasn't his job, you know what I mean? Like, you can't have four people all try to share the spotlight at one time. That's not what the band was. I mean, like

George has his, you know, he's sort of like the spiritual center. These are things that have been said a million times, but I think, you know, let's talk a little about, I want to pause here to talk about the legacy. I'm so glad you're doing this. Ringo needs his flowers. No, I really do because you know, there's this quote that I think that most music nerds have heard.

Apparently some interviewer asked John Lennon, is Ringo Starr the best drummer in the world? And Lennon says he's not even the best drummer in the Beatles. Now, that quote has been disproved. It's not real. Lennon never said that. But where do you stand on this? Was he a great drummer,

or do you think of him as the fourth most talented member of one of the best bands ever? So I have a really strong position about this. And it comes from my own experience. as a musician. At the top of the show, you may have heard me. I was playing guitar. I am proudly a decent instrumentalist across the board. And that comes from the fact a little bit that because punk rock existed in my life when I was growing up, it was okay not to be great. So there's, but there is still in the world a very loud voice about technique and talent and these conversations. And there's, I think, an over emphasis. By the way, I also came up. So punk rock was thankfully

in my background. But in the world, in the 80s, there was 80 Van Halen and Inge Malmstein and just like fast, fast, perfect, perfect. And so those are really conflicting forces. And I think the second one tends to win too often, the perfectionism, the bigness, the loudness. I'm glad we're talking about technique because, you know, like there are drummers who are better technicians. Yeah. But I think of Ringo as a creator.

No, I think of him as a creator. He's a creative partner. He's there to set the mood to the song. That's right. To serve the song. He's not there to be the most technical. perfectly perfect drummer. He's there to serve the song. And can you imagine? I mean, like, this song has been covered by everybody from Ike Turner to Michael Jackson to God smack. Like,

everybody, Junkie XL. So many people have covered this song. And yet almost nobody changes the drums. And why? Because you can't imagine this song without that distinct drum. I'd even go so far. It's a huge part of the character of the song. It would be, it would be not boring, but it would be, it wouldn't be. I don't think any of us, again, we're not saying he's the greatest drummer. of all time. I love Ringo Starr. I'll tell you there's this Quincy Jones story. Oh, I love this story. You know this story, but like Quincy Jones, you know, apparently, you know,

he was being very truthful and remembering some things. This is the iconic Quincy interview that like everything came out. Everybody was like, ooh, somebody. And then later they tried to get him to walk it back. Tell him to stop talking. But it was all truth. I love this story. So Ringo's in the studio at the same time is a bunch of black jazz drummers. And I mean, I've heard, I've heard, Hedfield from Metallica.

I've heard so many people say, the best drummers from a technical point of view are the jazz drummers. They can do things that, you know, like a lot of the rock drummers are like, I don't know how you freaking accomplish that. Hetfield will come back to this conversation in a minute, but go on.

So, you know, Quincy says that there are all these, you know, wonderful black jazz drummers in the studio. And Ringo's struggling to record. his part on some song and he's like, you know what, I'm going to go across the street and get something to eat. And so he leaves. And then one of them gets on and it's like, hey man, he tells the studio engineer, hey man, fire it up. Fire it on. I'm going to play

this part. And he plays it perfectly like the first time. And then they go back and then Ringo returns, he's like, hey, can you play me back my last take and the engineer being mischievous plays him the take that the jazz drummer played. And Ringo's like, oh, you know what, that doesn't sound that bad at all. The jazz drummers like, because it ain't you, motherfucker That's fucking genius. I mean like, so again, it's not always about being, you know, I would put this in my own career.

There have been comedy writers who I think are the perfect comedy writer. They can carry a script from the blank page to a perfectly finished, you know, 36 page script. Yeah. But they're not always the writer you hire to be in that room. Because when you're in that room, when you're collaborating with all these people. It's right person for the right job, right situation. You want somebody who's throwing out unique, I guess. even if they're not always the person to carry it from the blank page to the 36th page.

Because some people just have crazy outside the box ideas. It's the right circumstance for the right person, the right role. It's all got to be very specific to the situation. And Ringo's specificity to the Beatles, like if you ever listen to early interviews, the apocryphal Lenin diss aside, like they actually did not feel that way. Don't forget, like Pete Best famously, by the way, not the only fifth beetle. do Sutcliffe. But Pete Best was replaced by Ringo's Star,

and the story goes that it took place in a situation where once he sat down at the kit and started playing, they all instantly had chills because what Ringo brought to what the Beatles were doing was perfect. Yeah. And that's why they kept using him for a reason. I have another fun drummer aside. You know the Beatles song, it's getting better all the time.

It's getting better all the time. Do you know the story by then? I don't. That's from Sergeant Pappel. Ringo got sick and missed a couple of dates. And they had to bring on another drummer. This is actually during Beatlemania. Okay.

They had a, I forget the guy's name. It was during the tour. And after every gig, this guy kind of wanted the job so bad, he would always tell John and Paul. He's like, hey, I think it's getting better all the time. Oh, no way. After that line comes from? Yeah. And so Paul starts pinning a song called, It's getting better all the time.

Oh, my God. And famously, John pokes his head and he hears him singing this chorus. it's getting better all the time. John Polk said he's like, it can't get no worse. Yeah, yeah, that's great. Which to me encapsulates so much of what makes the Beatles special. But just to close out on Ringo,

I think it's a classic example of why a partnership is different than a solo mission. Totally. And, you know, leave, I, the only thing I hold against Ringo Star is Octopus's Garden. It's one of my least favorite Beatles songs. Sorry, Ringo. But I think that, you know, he was a great collaborator, and he brought so much to this song and others. And just to put a final touch also on the whole game,

giving Ringo his flowers. I think he's in a group with two other drummers that I just want to defend in public. So I'm ready to do it. Oh, here we go. I'm going out on a limb. It's not even a limb.

It shouldn't be a limb. No, this is a limb. This is the limb. This is the limb. Okay. Ringo, Meg White from the White stripes. Okay. And frankly, we were talking about Metallica. Frankly, Lars Ulrich from Metallica.

Ulrich from Metallica. These are three drummers that just like are notoriously always singled out as being like, that guy, you know, imagine if the band didn't have this dragging things down. I didn't know anybody would drag

the Metallica drummer. I didn't know that. Lars is famously considered like kind of lead-footed, like he's like kind of not doing, the fills are a little corny or whatever it is, but like Metallica without Lars wouldn't be Metallica. And I'm a big Metallica fan. Well, there you go.

And I love the fact that what he brings into the situation is kind of a Ringo-esque, not the technical guy, but the idea guy. He's serving the song. He's also a co-songwriter. He's also just a force within the band to like, let's go, let's win, let's be number one. Like, that's what Lars brings to the band. And if you had some, like, hired gun who was incredible, technically,

I think, frankly, it wouldn't be as heartfelt. And last but not least, in my, like, triumph, my holy trinity of drummers that deserve more flowers. Underrated drummers. Meg White is, they're a two-piece band. Jack White is playing guitar. There's no bass player. It's this sort of bluesy, kind of cute.

It's got the colors. That whole package works because Meg is playing from, a willfully, I don't want to say naive, but I think it really is sort of consciously naive in the sense that Jack heard her, and it's like, that's what this situation needs. So it's not to diss her or throw under the bus to call her drumming, simplistic, and naive.

That's on purpose. She wasn't a great drummer, but that's what the white stripes needed to be a great band. Let me tell you, you went out on that limb, and you are nesting, my friend, you are nesting on that limb. Rock and Robin. I'm proud of it, too. I'll stand by those words. By the way, just one more. more like we're due the, this is the Ringo

gets flowers episode. I just want to play one more thing. One fun thing about this song is that they like have this sort of freak it at the ends and here's, if you weren't sure about Ringo before, like check out Ringo freaking the hell out at the end of this track here. Here he comes. So simple, but it's so pleasurable. It's nothing

complicated, but that's Ringo in a nutshell. So we're out of finally big sound. And this is like 1969. This is pretty empty. This is like psych rock. This is a psych But it is funny they think of this as Ringo freaking out. Yeah, right?

That's a fair point. That's a fair point. You may have given some ammunition to the haters. This is not a Keith Moon freak out. It's not a Ginger Baker freak out. That is a Ringo Star, 1969 freak out. When we come back, we're going to go even deeper into this song. So stay tuned.

Stay tuned. So let's keep going into the stems. We've got Paul McCartney's turn at bat. And this is the iconic baseline from the track, which we all know so well. But I'm going to play you something. not have noticed before. So that riff that we're also accustomed to is actually the bass line and the guitar are doing a little harmonized thing because the bass by itself is this. While we've got Harrison, I believe, on guitar, because he's credited with the rhythm part, which is actually

part of the story. Lennon is freed up. He's only singing. He's not playing guitar and singing mostly on this track. He doesn't overdub later. But that frees him up to do. do some other stuff like handclaps and fun little things. So he's able to not have to do two things at once. So this is Harrison on guitar. And then in the mix, it sounds like this. Nice little harmony going on there. But then just because I played D.O Ringo freakout at the end,

here's the McCartney freak out at the end. It is arguably equally satisfying. It's just one note. And it's like Manson-esque. Like, it actually kind of sounds like helter-skelter. But if you hear that just with the drums, you'll understand, like, the combination of power. But, you know, that repetition works. I mean, like, I always say, like, if you find something repetitious that works, I mean, like,

that is, to me, the basis of almost every good pop song. And this is as drugs-y as the Beatles get. Like, this is a super drugsy moment right here. A minute of just this. Anyway, that satisfies me so wonderfully. I can't think about this song with a lot of it. thinking about the keys in it, that roads like that super,

we've used swampy and smoky. I'm running out of adjectives, but you know what I'm talking about. Can you tell me anything about that? Yeah, that's super bluesy solo, which, why don't we play it and then we'll talk about it? Let's listen. And in the background, you hear the solo happening, right?

Because they're all playing in a room, so you hear the lead. I'll need to look that up. I think it's Harrison, because Harrison plays lead in general. I really love that. that's sort of like an unsung part of the song. You know, as we listen to that right now,

I'm just reminded of how just a few months prior to them recording this song come together in mid-69, they had just brought Billy Preston into the band to collaborate on the song Get Back, which is actually the only Beatles song where it's the Beatles with Billy Preston. So this is an American keyboard player, if you don't know. In the song, Get Back, there's this wonderful Rhodes solo and part

and the rooftop concert. So this was a black, American keyboard player who had they had met with little Richard in Hamburg. He was in the back of their mind and they bring him in to kind of inject the band with some new energy. The second that they brought in a black man, the Beatles broke up. Oh, man. That's not something I'd ever considered before. So I'm thinking about that because hearing this, this is a very Billy Preston-esque thing to play,

this rhythmic part on a roads. And just a few months earlier, they were so excited by Billy Preston playing the roads. So it just kind of. occurs to me that there may be a connection there. But a funny thing also about this part is that originally McCartney was kind of the better technical player, especially on keyboards. And so Lenin sat him down and kind of said, you know, kind of gave him a description of what he wanted.

And McCartney plays this part. And Lenin's like, that's wonderful. I love that. And then he erases McCartney's take and does it himself. He just rips off what McCartney does wholesale. So that's McCartney's idea recorded by Lenin that we just heard. So that wonderful story about Lenin and McCartney kind of quasi fighting over who gets to play the keyboard part. Or maybe there wasn't a fight. Maybe Lenin was just like, hey, yo, it's my song.

Thanks for the idea. Take a hike. Go walk around the block and have a cigarette break. It's moments like that. And famously, although their partnership, man, their partnership. And famously all their songs are credited to Lenin McCartney. But really what's happening is they're kind of writing their own songs and bringing them to the group. McCartney writes the kind of sunny, shiny, major key, happy lyrics in another song.

Life is a classic example. We can work it out is another one. Gotta see it my way. We can work it out. We can work it out. And then Lenin comes in and the minor. Life is very short and there's no time. For fussing and fighting.

It's so funny and it's dark and it's minor. And then we're back to Paul, sunny and happy. The classic is, woke up, jumped out of bed. Right. Red comb across my head. The other guy's talking about blowing his brains out in a car. Blowing his mind in his car. Right.

Time and time again. that's the nature of the Lenin-McCartney interaction is a little bit of yin to the yang, a little bit of darkness to the light. It really gets to the heart of the tension, of potentially the tension in a creative partnership. There can be tension. There's a lot of trust that you build, but there's also probably resentments. There's all kinds of emotions that go into it. 10 years ago that didn't get resolved. I mean, you of all people, you and Bashir have been writing partners for like 20-something years, right? I've known them since 1994. Wow, that's amazing. I mean, that's, to me, that's beautiful that all these years later, you're still

writing. Well, yeah. I mean, like we still, we always call it going to the, we're always down to like, we may argue, but we generally are like down to get back on the playground and, you know, after 10 minutes of anger. Listen, I think that, yeah, partnerships, there can be tension there. I think that in the case of me and Bashir, we've worked on many TV shows and projects and commercials and all kinds of stuff. I think it's always trying to show the other person mutual respect. I would never try and figure out like who's the linen or who's the McCarty in that partnership because, no, seriously, I think there are things that, I do, without getting specific, I think there are things that I do in our collaborations that are

specific to me and my talents. And I think that there are wonderful, wonderful things that he does that I'm like, oh, shit, how did he do that? You know what I mean? So I think there's still, in the best relationship, sort of this fascination with, how did that person pull off that magic? I think as long as that's there, the relationship is so at some point if one of them is like, that person's not doing anything I can't do. Well, then that's when things can start to crumble.

But I think, thankfully, we haven't reached that place. By the way, you and I are in a partnership. Right. Well, we're like in earlier. Well, yeah, but it's funny because it's like you're, it's, there's so many parallels to relationships and marriages too. It's like, you know, over time, two people that first of all on day one were the way they were, but like they evolved differently. And you've got to sort of make sure that you bring it back and, you know, check in with the other person. There's emotional stuff that happens behind the scenes when you're making art and making TV shows and music. So it's interesting to think about like how similar it is to like relationships.

I mean, that's the crazy thing about a partnership is that you have to kind of know what the lines are. Like, you know, there's some... And by the way, it's like any kind of like long-term relationship. Like some things become completely sore subjects, you know to never bring them up. And then other things like, you know, Lennon knew that he could replace McCartney's part on that and it wasn't going to blow up the relationship. Are you a Lennon and McCartney guy?

I'll answer it in a second, but it's... You're absolutely right, but what's funny to think about is in 1963 that may have been tolerated, but maybe in mid-69 when they're like Lennon's about to leave the band of few minutes later. Like maybe this wasn't the best timing for him to have done that. But am I, so back to the question, this is, this is a question we all grow up in. By the way, I don't think it's a binary choice. You don't have to be. I'm just curious if you are. You know, because it is such a part of our cultural landscape, you get these sense, like McCartney's the cute one, the melody one. He's the sort of like song and dance guy, you know, like 30s musical kind of

influences. He's the, you know. That's because of the lady Madonna. I'm sure. Among, yeah, among other things. And Eleanor Rigby, you know, he's the one who brings strings indirectly with George Martin's help. And Lenin's the cool one, the angry one, the one who's really into the blues and American music. And then Ringo's the...

Ringo was like the child. When I was a child, to me, I was like, oh, Ringo's like the cool little brother who gets to play with the band. And he's kind of the peacemaker. And he's kind of the oldest member of the band. He's older than the other three. You're right. And he ends up, again, and get back, you'll see how much of a peacemaker he is.

He's just like he's serving the song. He's just there to serve the band. In a weird way, he was the journey man. In a group, I'll say for me, I, growing up, I was always like a linen guy. He seemed cool. He seemed like the leader. You know, when I got to my 20s and I started to deconstruct music in my head and sort of go off the, you know, off into just music construction,

I really grew to appreciate Paul. I was actually sad that I had been a drummer and not a bassist because whether it was the Beatles or Daft Punk or most of my favorite hip-hop songs, the bass line was always what drew me in. And I was always like, oh, man, people who can play the bass. That's like pure magic. Now I feel like I'm legitimately like a person who respects everybody's contribution.

I'm so glad you landed there because I was thinking about how I didn't answer the question because I couldn't. As I was going through the whole thing, it's like I like my mom, I like my dad. I can't just pick one. It's the Sophie's choice to pick a beetle. I'm always trying to figure out in our relationship who's the linen, who's the McCartney?

I have my theories. Who's the violent? No, see, we can't. We're not saying anybody's violent. But who's the cutting sarcastic one? I think, look, it's challenging. The image of Lenin is cool. The reality of his story is far more complicated.

We don't need to get into all the things that made him an imperfect person. McCartney is a lovable, literally a living legend. We both have a shared friend. shout out to Chris Holmes, our buddy, who literally is his DJ. Our friend's job is to go on tour with Paul McCartney and he is a DJ. So the idea of- He's now the fifth beetle.

He's not, Chris, you're the fifth beetle. I don't think it's an easy answer, but I think we're both- But I think I'm George. Oh, okay. George is like the younger one. Well, you are the younger one between the two of them. And what was the other A-side to this come-together single, but something? Right, it all comes together.

It comes together. Harrison's probably most beloved composition. It's been covered, like, come together. It's been covered by whatever, 300 people. I think something may have been covered by 3,000, including Frank Sinatra. Like, so, yeah, this is the partnership. If you're the George and I'm the Paul, I can live with that. I can live with that.

Oh, you claim Paul? Oh, wait, I thought you just said you claim George. You were supposed to say. Now I'm seeing that violent Lenin side come out in you. You're supposed to say George Martin. Nobody's supposed to claim linen or Paul McCartney. You know, one of the eerie things about the song is the shoot me refrain. Can we hear a little bit of the vocals?

Because I will say growing up, and even up until you did a TikTok video about it, I never knew he said, shoot me. I always thought it was shoot, I thought it was just like some scatting or something. I may overuse the word chilling in this room in this context, and I'm sorry, but this is the chillingest of all is hearing what Lenin was actually saying,

because it's actually a little bit covered up. You can't really tell. It just sounds like, right? You can't really hear the whole thing. But he is actually saying, shoot me. hears Lenin's isolated vocals from that section. Now, there's a sound over the me, clearly, and I still don't really hear shoot me.

He's clapping. This is the yonnie, whatever that thing was for the internet. Yeah. What you're hearing there is a couple of things. One, you're hearing Lenin with delay on his vocal. So it's kind of like his hero, Elvis, got the slap back in the room. He wanted that all the time. But he's also, because he's not playing guitar, his hands are free, and he's

clapping. So he's saying, shoot me. and they're both going through this delay and it becomes this kind of layered denser noise that makes the lyrics a little harder to make out. Wow, yeah, because I got to say I still don't hear Shoot Me, but you know, I feel like if I'm really listening

for it, I can kind of pretend it's there. Well, and also we know it's there because it was another phrase he'd been turning in his head for another song that incomplete and never was released. And two people who wonder about these things, he was saying Shoot Me probably as a heroin reference and

all the people who were into like the Paul is dead theory thought it was oh you know they killed Paul they shot him you know like there's and then obviously there's the ultimate irony that doesn't even really need to be stated it doesn't need to be said you know yeah it's it's crazy that he said shoot me but I

will say his death in 1980 affected all of us at the time but I remember somebody had because I was really little but somebody had spray painted it John Lennon 1940 to 1980 right by our house like on a wall near us so for years we would drive past that and it's just embedded in my head

this idea of John Lennon 1940 to 1980. As I grow up, I'm like that age 40 gets more and more like, wow, that is the tragedy of it only being 40 years old. Speaking of Lennon, let's talk about his vocals. Let's talk about him. Can we hear some Come Together vocals? Let's do it.

Hold you in his object you can feel his disease. Come together right now over me. That's it. It's a short chorus. Wow, that's incredible. Yeah.

That's incredible. You know, one of the things I love about this song are the lyrics, you know, even though I said earlier that, like, you know, it kind of, it sounded spooky and a little bit scary to young me. Like, it actually has some of the things that I appreciate the most about, especially like the John sort of lyrically driven songs, which is they have a sort of nonsensical. Right. Sort of Dada-esque.

It reminds me of David Burden talking heads. Yeah, yeah. Who, you know, famously says stop making sense to him. himself while recording a song. Yes. Because he was like, oh, you're making too much sense. I love that. But I will say growing up, I thought that each verse was about a different beetle.

I thought each verse was that. So I thought that, you know, Holy Roller, Juju Eyeball, it was all about, like, spirituality. So I thought that was George. Right. I thought, you know, obviously bag production, spinal cracker being a reference to the car accident he got into when Yoko was pregnant. Oh, man. I thought that was about John. he's so, what is he, he's so good looking, but he's so good looking.

Got to be good looking because he's so hard to see. Because he's so hard to see. I thought that was Paul. Okay. You know, before we did this episode, I went back and I read him. And now I actually think that every verse might be about John. Okay. You know, I could be wrong about this.

Because I don't see where the stuff in the second verse is about Ringo at all, unless there's just some part of Ringo's personality that we don't know. But, yeah, for most of him. my life, I thought each verse was about a different beetle. And then, now I don't know. That's an interesting take. I never considered any of that. Really smart. That's the stuff I'd be thinking about

when I'm listening to the Beatles. I do feel like come together is one of those songs that has like a universal appeal. Right. You know, I feel like you can play it for people who claim to not like the Beatles. And there's so many. Shout out to all the people who don't like the Beatles. I think that's a perfectly fine position to take. It's not my position.

but like, you know, nobody should force you to like The Beatles. But I do feel like this is one of those songs that truly has a universal appeal to so many different types of genres of music. But if I can piece both of those two ideas together, what's interesting is, and this as a songwriter, I know this from experience, like, you can get away with an awful lot in the verse in terms of the storytelling where it doesn't all have to make sense. It should tell a story. It should be evocative. But a lot of it sometimes is just like throwing a phrase. out that there's very specific, or just a line that you know everyone's going to love, feet down

below his knees. Yeah. It doesn't... Feet down below his knee. It sounds like, wait a second. Self-evident. We all have people on it. It's not very special. What's your favorite lyric in the song? I mean, I think it's hard because one and one and one is three. Such a good line. It's a great one. It's a one and one.

Like, it's like, again, repetition when it works, that shit powers. And it's like almost a self-evit. It's like ironically delivered, but accurately, truthfully delivered because it's like kind of like it's so powerful the delivery like this is an important thing i'm saying but it's like this is the thing that every two-year-old knows at the same time by the way i think it's the it's apparently the only linan mccartney song to never go number one anywhere the song one and one is two and it was written by paul mccartney and it comes in

the verse that i thought was about paul mccartney's it comes it's in that last verse that I don't even know that. It's a song called One and One is Two. One is two. I don't know that one. And it was a song that was rejected. Oh, okay. And so, you know, like some of their songs were rejected for the group.

So they gave them to other people and they usually went on to do pretty good for those other groups. But I think that that's got the record as like the worst Beatles, you know, Beatles written song of all time or something. That's interesting. In the verse, you can almost do whatever you want as long as in the chorus. You land with something big, simple, universal. Yeah. And two words come together. What an idea that, first of all, is.

easily understood. It's not abstract and Dada-esque and William Burroughs inspired. It's just come together, which, by the way, let's face it, maybe Timothy Leary deserves a little songwriting credit along with, you know. I just like the lyrics because John is the king of like the ironic, you know, baby you're a rich man, you know, like things like that, you know, got to be good looking because he's so hard to see. Yeah, he really packs a punch in a like a little bumper sticker size chunk.

They're just little, they're not puns. Well, I don't know what you would call that, but they're humorous. They're humorous and they're clever. And I think it speaks Just some humorous couplets From the Lenin himself Yeah, yeah So many good lyrics in this one

So many lyrics I actually got wrong When I first heard them For sure, me too. You know, there's that one line Like, hold you in his arms Till you can feel his disease Is that now what he says? That's what he says

I think like so many people It's like I heard like hold you in his armchair Or something like that Like it's kind of... That's what I thought it was. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought it was armchair. By the way,

Not armchair. You know, I am a Nirvana fan like this because a lot of things remind me on Nirvana, and that line about you can feel his disease will always remind me of, you know, wish I could eat your disease until you turn black, you know? Oh, right, in heart-shaped box? Disease is not a word that a lot of people have put into a song.

Kind of infects the song with a little bit of like, dark. Yeah, just spores, little mold scores. Oh, my gosh. Come for talk about music, but stay for references to mold sports. But it's funny about lyrics, too, because I'm the kind of person. And I know that there's both, I'm, there are people that are lyric-centric and they're Bob Dylan fans. I'm just, I'm, that's not who I am.

I'm sound first. And I'm as a musician, performer, DJ, like. I didn't know we have that in common. Yeah. There's a part of me, and we'll talk about this on another show. But the Bob Dylan Colt, I'm not a part of it. I just, and I saw an Elliott Smith show once and I just like fell asleep. Like, I can't do, I'm sound-centric, I think, in the way I listen.

And that includes lyrical analysis where I'll hear something for years and not really, notice even that I didn't know what the words were. And like even as you were saying it, I could have gone either way. You could have told me that it was armchair. You could have told me it was arms. I mean, like, I don't know even now. Listen, I mean, like it happens all the time. People still think you said like, you know, excuse me while I kissed the sky to kiss the sky.

You know, we should do a whole segment on what you thought the lyric was and what that lyric actually is. When I was growing up, I thought Boogie Wonderland was Boogie was a man. You know, I was like, boogie was a man. I was like, who is Boogie? Wait, that makes more sense. than Boogie Wonderland? That's not a sensible phrase. Boogie was a man. Boogie was a man. That's a story.

The story of Boogie. It's more than that. It goes deep. Boogie was a man, but he was a man, so he's dead. Oh, you can dive deep on Boogie. That's a rich analysis right there. I was looking for stories even then. You know what? You just made me think my favorite version of that. It's not even my own story to tell, but our friend from high school, Hannah McElhenney,

if you're out there, I love the fact that she always thought that the Michael Jackson song was, take a walk to the post office. Don't stop pig. I think of that to this day, whenever I hear, don't stop until you get enough. He was just trying to mail a letter. He was just trying to mail a letter. But by the way, what the actual lyric is is weird, too.

It's like for the force don't stop. It's like a Star Wars reference. He had seen Star Wars. No, a lot of people don't know this. If you take away one day, that is a Star Wars song. Yes, it's a Star Wars song. That's what people don't know about that. And we're not even kidding. We're not kidding. So come for the Beatles. Stay for the Michael Jackson facts. This is no joke. Here's another Michael Jackson fact. He covered come together. What? When he owned their catalog, he had to, he like sent

an email to himself, an early, you know, CC mail email to himself. He's like, hey, can I cover the Beatles? Yes, you can, Michael, because you own that shit. Oh, that's right. That's right. Famously, the end of the Michael Jackson Paul McCartney friendship is when Jackson bought out the, bought out from under McCartney's nose. In one of the greatest commercials of all time. The Revolution one. Yeah. That's actually another Lenin song. Lennon song. So early we were talking about Chuck Berry and we were also talking about how in the partnership, how John and Paul were sort of like debating, okay, if it is a Nick, if it isn't a Nick, how are we going to get away with it? If this is an homage, is it something that we might get

sued for? They had some disagreement about that. And clearly Lennon was like, you know what? All we have to do is slow it down and make some tweaks. And McCartney was like, okay, brother, sure enough, they got sued by Chuck Berry's publisher, Morris Levy. who took him to court and he won. And as part of the settlement, Lennon ended up having to record, ironically, a few songs from Lilley's catalog, including You Can't Catch Me,

the Chuck Barry song. Like in the mid-70s, right? In the mid-70s, they come out on these kind of lesser-known records that were pressed up by Levy's kind of cheap. This guy's literally a gangster, by the way. Does this mean that, like, Chuck Barry

didn't own his own publishing, this other guy did? The Big Seven publishing or whatever it is called? There's so much, this is such a trope that I'm almost embarrassed and annoyed to have to say it. But Morris Levy was a gentleman of whiteness in the music industry who ripped off his black clients, including Chuck Berry, and specifically how he did it, you're dead right. He would literally put his name on the publishing credits so that Chuck Barry wouldn't get his own royalties as a writer on his own material. Now, is that because nowadays everybody in the business knows about publishing and is it because that first, like that 50s generation of black artists didn't know about publishing or were they muscled out?

The simplest answer to a very deeply complicated, not complicated question, but like there's a lot to unpack there, but the simple answer is absolutely not. They were told that this would happen, but that this would happen was a complete lie. And they didn't have the structure, the lawyers, the knowledgeable people with the label owners themselves of color who could tell them, you know what, you should look at this is not good for. Make sure that you have your publishing. They had no way of knowing. Also, it's early in the music industry. So there isn't a lot of like history behind like stories of other people that can. say don't do what I did. But publishing has been known about since Tim Pan Alley in the 1920s.

I mean, like, I have to think at some point these artists knew about publishing. They just, I feel like they were probably muscled out of it. The specific way in which they were ripped off, I'm sure, buried from situation to situation. Levy's version was to have them sign whatever the agreement looked like. And then in the background, however the accounting books were being cooked, just not pay him out what was owed to him. And so, and just to be clear, like Morris Levy, the publisher, Barry's publisher who sued Lenin was himself a criminal and was literally had mob ties and was about to serve a prison sentence and then he died before he could go to jail. Got off Scott Free.

Got off Scott Free as it were, yeah. Okay, so that was come together. The Beatles, we hope you learned some things about the Beatles you didn't know. We hope you learned some things about us you didn't know. Before we take off, everybody always asked this, Beatles or Stones? Beatles or Stones, that is the question. And boy, do I wrestle with that one. I think I know for you.

Interesting. What do you think my answer is going to be? I mean, I think you like the Beatles more than the Stones. So you're technically right, and I do like the Beatles more than the Stones. But like in recent years, I have to say kind of rising above, because this is all the pantheon of great British rock bands from the 60s. You've got also the Who's in the corner saying, what about the Zeppelin thing? But Cher is a huge fan of the Who, by the way.

And then there's Sabbath and Zeppelin and Queen saying, hey, we're coming soon. What about us? Are we in this conversation? actually from that kind of wider lens, the kinks in recent years. The kinks have really been rising in my esteem, a band that does not get there due. The kinks, one of the great British rock bands, we all know you really got me and, you know, all of the night. One reason why they-

Which was covered by two-live crew masterfully. The kinks got robbed basically of their opportunity to be in that question. Because it could have been the Beatles versus the kinks or it could have been the Stones versus the king. but literally they went to America in 64, 65. They were bigger, arguably, if not on par, because you really got me was the number one single and their first single. So out of the gate in 64, they're huge. They come to America and they piss off the wrong people.

Because they're brothers fighting, by the way, which is another, right, back to the collaborations. These are two brothers fighting. They're fighting too much. They get kicked out of America and banned for four years. They missed the entire 60s British invasion. They are not part of everything where the Beatles come and take over the planet. Oh.

Yeah. And it's all because they just sort of fought with the wrong, like, TV producer behind the scenes or something like that. Okay. And meanwhile, they're writing all these songs, Waterloo Sunset, that like super inspire McCartney and the Beatles. So they're like a huge influence undersung. I'm actually going to answer Beatles versus Stones officially. I'm officially saying kinks. Okay.

I like what you did there. And I'm going to take that ball and say, I think go back and discover the. seeds because the seeds are one of my favorite groups from the 60s. I do not even know the seeds. The seeds are really, really cool. Check out a song. Can't seem to make you mine by the seeds. It's really good.

You know, I guess it would be considered garage rock. Maybe psych, this garage rock. Check out the seeds. Can't seem to make you mind. Are you going to put them above the Beatles or above the stone? No, I'm not putting it. Okay. I'm not, I hate comparing groups.

You know this. Like, I don't even like comparing genres because it's so different. You know, like you and I will talk. about, well, who are the stones of hip-hop? Who are the Beatles of hip-hop? There are no perfect analogies. That's the third time on this show. You've brought that up saying that you don't like to talk about it.

But we love to talk about it. Clearly, I hate it so much. I'm always fascinated by it. Future episodes, stay tuned because we're going to burn. This is going to have to be exciting. By the way, Outcast is the Beatles of Hip-Up only because that is a partnership that did not last as long as some of us would have wanted. Does that mean the stones?

That's interesting. I'll think about that one. We'll have a good answer by next week. discussion. Yes, it is. Dude, that was so much fun. Luxury. Help me in this thing.

Let's end this thing. Well, I've been producer and DJ and songwriter luxury. And I am the actor, writer, and sometimes DJ with feet below his knees, Diallo Riddle. And this is one song, Diallo Riddle. We'll see you next time. Luxury. Fibing name. I'm really good at my job.

Yeah. Seven, a one song. After I do eight takes.