Ouvre ton jeu avec Marie-Claude Barrette - #107 Josée Lavigueur | Ouvre ton jeu avec Marie-Claude Barrette

Episode Date: May 26, 2025

Josée s’est donnée comme mission d’accompagner les gens pour atteindre un mieux être physique et ce, depuis déjà 40 ans. C’est une femme hypersensible, persévérante, travaillante et combien généreuse. Dans cet épisode, les rires côtoient les larmes. Elle y aborde entre autres, la famille, le deuil, le travail et le rapport avec le corps.━━━━━━━━━━━00:00:00 - Introduction00:16:27 - Cartes vertes00:39:56 - Cartes jaunes01:13:20 - Cartes rouges01:24:44 - Cartes Eros01:45:45 - Carte Opto-Réseau━━━━━━━━━━━L'épisode est également disponible sur Patreon, Spotify, Apple Podcasts et les plateformes d'écoute en ligne.Vous aimez Ouvre ton jeu? C'est à votre tour d'ouvrir votre jeu avec la version jeu de société. Disponible dès maintenant partout au Québec et au https://www.randolph.ca/produit/ouvre-ton-jeu-fr/?srsltid=AfmBOoo3YkPk-AkJ9iG2D822-C9cYxyRoVXZ8ddfCQG0rwu2_GneuqTT Visitez mon site web : https://www.marie-claude.com et découvrez l'univers enrichissant du MarieClub, pour en apprendre sur l'humain dans tous ses états et visionner les épisodes d'Ouvre ton jeu, une semaine d’avance. ━━━━━━━━━━━ Ouvre ton jeu est présenté par Karine Joncas, la référence en matière de soins pour la peau, disponible dans près de 1000 pharmacies au Québec. Visitez le https://www.karinejoncas.ca et obtenez 15% de rabais avec le code ouvretonjeu15.Grâce à Éros et compagnie et notre niveau rose, obtenez 15% avec le code rose15 au https://www.erosetcompagnie.com/?code=rose15Merci également à Opto-Réseau, nouveau partenaire d'Ouvre ton jeu. Visitez le https://www.opto-reseau.com pour prendre rendez-vous dans l'une de leurs 86 cliniques.

Hello everyone, welcome to Au va ton jeu, le podcast. Obviously, I always say the same thing when I start, because I'm always happy to be here, in the studio, where I'm waiting for the guest, always with impatience. It would seem that each guest is someone to discover, it's always the most important person of my day, it's the one who will come and sit in front of me. And as I do it every time I open, I like to read your comments. I want to confirm it, we read them all, even those who are sometimes a little more critical. And I just want to warn you that when there are some who are disrespectful,

me, the request I made to the team, we immediately delete. When we arrive on our social networks, it's like a little if we invited you to the team, we immediately delete them. When we get to our social networks, it's like if we invited you to our home. Well, I don't let people in who lack respect in. You can be in disagreement, and we can express that with words, being respectful, fortunately, on all platforms, whether YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, Facebook.

The comments, even Spotify, we also read the comments, or Patreon. The vast majority are always respectful, but rarely send you comments because when it happens, I tell you, don't try, we will always remove them, but I'm talking to those who are respectful because as I said, you are the vast majority. Thank for sharing your comments. And I want to tell you that it's good for our guests too. Because sometimes they rely on things they had never said before. And to see that people have empathy, or that it gives them a boost to continue because they just got answers

following a life experience that the guests have lived. It's good. We are beyond the professional image, the public image. Here, we are in the intimate, in the human, in the personal. So, our guests, you deliver personal things, and they also live your comments on a personal basis. So, I wanted to tell you to continue to write to us in the greatest of respects, and we are always respectful of you. One of Renée's comments says, Open your game, follow my steps.

It's an inspiring formula. Each of them brings me back to a retrospective. Marie-Claude managed to make us discover personalities from a different angle, more personal and deeper. I always answer the last question in my head to end my listening on a positive note. Long life to open your game. Well, thank you René.

And yes, the question in the optoreso, that's the goal, is to make this plane land. Sometimes it leaves for an hour and a half, sometimes two hours, we never know how long the meeting will last. But we always try to let ourselves be on a note. We start by reflecting on a positive note. Patricia tells us,

A podcast that I devoured by Jonathan Roy's immense transparency. I salute Jonathan's generosity and great interest in asking you questions about your life. Yes, it surprised me a little, but I really enjoyed this conversation with him. It really touched me right in the heart, really interested in his great authenticity, which we often see too little. What a deep and intimate exchange. This podcast is filled with truth, with sharing, and for that, I thank you both. Thank you very much, Patricia. Today, just before, I will introduce my team and after that I will introduce my guest.

We have partners. Marie-Cla, Espace mieux être, it's the platform we have set up for, it's mainly women who are members. We are open to everyone, but I think it speaks to women. It's a place where you feel good. It's a place where there's no judgment, there's no taboo. We do the laundry, we exchange together. We have experts who come to give you incredible workshops, both on meditation, on medicine, on psychology, on the middle-aged in general, on finances. We have a reading club. It's really, the more it progresses, it's been more than a year and a half now that there is the Marie-Clobe, the more this experience progresses, the more I want it to last a long time,

because it's really a place where you feel good. And we did an event a few weeks ago and really, once again, new members joined the Marie-Claude Club and eventually we will meet in person. We will do an event. So there are a lot of things to tell you, but be curious to go to Marie-Claude.com. You will have information about the Marie-Claude Club. marie-claude.com, vous allez avoir des renseignements sur le marie-club. Et si jamais vous dites « j'ai envie de m'abonner », alors si vous prenez l'abonnement annuel avec le code promo CLUB10, ben vous aurez 10% de rabais sur l'abonnement annuel. Alors ayez cette curiosité là. Karine Jonquo, qui est la partenaire des premiers jours, vous offre 15% de rabais sur tous vos achats en ligne avec le code promo OUVRETONJEUX15. And Ross et Compagnie also offers 15% discount on all your online purchases with the promo code ROSE15.

And I remind you that there are 86 clinics across Quebec for opto réseau. So now it's time to introduce you to today's guest. It's a woman that I've known, I imagine, like several, in my living room, through my TV. She made me buy VHS tapes at the beginning, then DVDs. She made me buy a lot of things, books too, among others, that she did with Isabelle Huot. We did some exercise at home with her. Really, the other time when my father moved, when we emptied his apartment, we found DVDs that my mother probably had bought

not even big VHS tapes from my guest, and we laughed because it reminded us of the fashion of big hair with the bandeau and the leotards to train. Because I'm talking about Josée Lavigueur. Josée Lavigueur, this woman who has been making us move for almost 40 years now, it's nothing. And I was preparing to receive her and I don't remember what she did during those years for us, for us to be healthy.

And over time, she became a friend too. Josée is an exceptional woman with a big heart. And I wanted to know her even more because every time I eat with her, I learn something about this woman. And then I said to myself, but if you open your game, she has to come, we have to see her from all angles. We have a lot to learn from that woman and tell you how she loves people, how she loves you.

So I have the impression that it will be a warm and moving exchange. So I'm going to stop talking, I'm going to make her arrive. So I leave room for Josée Lavigueur. I was never quite thin, Marie-Claude. I say that with a certain shame. But you have to get back to 1984-85.

The goal of all women at that time, the goal was to be thin. You went to the gym, you saw the girls, they were all on cardio equipment. Just cardio equipment. The guys were doing some weight training, the girls were doing cardio to be thinner or to stay thinner. And we were afraid to be a little fat. There were lots of models, very ugly, too skinny women. After, I started doing the shows at RDS, it was called Superforme, I don't know if you remember, we had our black black carpets on the sand.

We were like in a hole. The famous ovals in rubber. But hey, I was anorexic at that time. It was anorexic at the time. Ouvre ton jeu is presented by Karine Jonquat, the skin care reference, available in nearly 1000 pharmacies in Quebec, and by the Marie-Claude Club, which is a space dedicated to the best-being, where you can find more than a hundred masters, led by experts, available on Marie mariclaude.com.

The original games of the table, Ouvre ton jeu, and the couple edition are available everywhere in Quebec and on randolph.ca. I told you earlier, I was looking forward to her coming. She's here. Josée Lavigueur, hi! Hello, Marie-Claude. Are you going to make us do some exercise in Ouvre ton jeu? I'm already telling you, get ready because I'm moving a lot.

I don't know how long I'm going to sit on this chair, but no, I'm delighted to be with you face to face. Yes! No, no, I'm really honored by this invitation. Thank you so much. How are you going, Josée? I'm doing really well. Except for my little voice that's grumbling a little, you may have noticed. But I'm really doing well. I... Did you think it was hard? Did you think it was a big reflection? Well, it's the question, how are you?

Yes, it's just that. I'm really pissed. It's a very big question. But I'm really doing well. I had, you know, we talked about it. I... The grief of my parents, it was very hard, it was long. It's still very hard. And it's hard for everyone, the grief of parents,, it was very hard, it was long, it's still very hard. And it's hard for everyone, the grief of parents, you know that, I think. Because your parents are also close to each other. Yes, and very suddenly, both.

It was really hard. And, my doubt already, let's see. No, but for real, it coincided with the past. I was able to put everything in place, to put all my emotions in place and understand them. Because the year my father left, in 2022, I'm not really able to say the word RT. It's funny, isn't it? It's not funny, but it's weird.

But you're not in your mourning process, probably. No, no. But that's it. There are still steps to go. I know there are steps. I think of my parents every day. I think of how they left. You know, my mother left in a very violent way. She fell down the stairs, and it was the end. So I often think about that moment. I try to imagine it, instead of just putting myself in peace with it. I don't know, I started reading, you referred to a very nice book, but it's okay.

It's okay. It's the year that my dad Ron left, it's the same year that my Sarah left the house too, to the west of Canada. It's the same year that my daughter Leanne left in an apartment. So it was like, I understood after it was several griefs at the same time. Because it's griefs when the house is empty. It's great griefs.

And the big one that goes to the west of Canada, it's... Today, it's extraordinary. It's a eagle. It's crazy to have stolen it. It's crazy to have exhaled it. And there, it's developing its own business of physio for climbers, because they, Zach and Sarah, are really climbers. But Sarah is specializing. It's beautiful.

That's what we want from our children. We want to see them fly high in joy. And that's really bothering me. But the famous Livid syndrome, which you talked about with some of the guests, I heard about it. It's something. But I'm doing very well. I'm spoiled. I have an extraordinary family.

I have a chum. An incredible anchorage. I'm fine. I'm healthy. I'm in good shape. And I'm realizing big dreams too. I could elaborate a lot, but... But at the same time, what you taught me the other time, and I was surprised, is that it's been 40 years since you've been doing, I mean, you've done a profession, exercise, training, health, it's been 40 years, Joseph. It's crazy, huh? That you've been, you know what, that you've been graduated or that you've started giving classes.

I got my degree in physical education in 86, but in 85, in March 85 precisely, I went to audition in a physical conditioning center, competitor to Énergie Cardiaux at the time. Because I came from the dance world, I always danced. I danced, I did musical comedy, I did stuff that people don't know about because at 18, I stopped doing that to go to physical education. At the beginning, I went to a program, a dance certificate, at the BAC in physical education, because I thought,

I have to keep dancing, that's what I want to do, I've been dreaming of dancing all my life, and then I discovered the world of physical education. I discovered a passion for anatomy, physiology, exercise, movement. And all of a sudden, I have a friend, actually two friends, Nathalie Lafleur and Anne-Marie Sanches, friends from high school who knew my love of dance, who knew my fun of being ahead of a gang and doing shows, of animes, who told me, but why don't you do aerobics? It emerged, it arrived, aerobics dance in the 85s in Quebec. And you know when you say

fall on your X, because I had my music, I had my steppettes, and I had this passion that I discovered of physical activity, that I wanted to transmit so much. So you started giving classes at that time, 40 years ago. Exactly, I never stopped, except during the pandemic. Even during my pregnancy, I gave classes until the 39th week. And when I talk about it, I sometimes talk about it in conferences, but not a lot. Because I don't like to talk about myself, I don't like to talk about my career. That's not why you're going to see me skate a little today, I have the impression.

But when I talk about it, it's not to impress. 40 is a big number when you look at it like that. But I find it that I was privileged, I was spoiled, to fall so young on my ex, to find so much... So much! That's it. It's the case, that's it. It's the life of... You know, we have the impression that we're getting closer, whoop, that's not it, finally. So, you know, it's 40 years of happiness, for real.

I still trip. When I start the music, I give two more classes a week of steps. When I start my music, it speaks. I'm in a good mood, I'm happy to be there. And that's a gift. I often think of this gift that we can also give to our young people, to the young people around us, to our children, to the children that we can influence. This pleasure of moving, giving them the taste,

allowing them to discover the way to move, which will light them up for the rest of their lives, for all their lives. You quickly brought up the notion of pleasure. Oh yes, yes, yes. Yes, from the beginning in training, you quickly said that you have to love it, because otherwise we won't do it again. Well no, but it's the basis of motivation. Are you ready to open your judge's seat? Because we're opening it. We're doing this, we're doing this.

We're going there. So I'll explain it to you. I know you're listening, but there's the green level. These are general questions. I can't believe I see your cards in real life. And it's your cards. You're going to start with after, in addition. The yellow level is more specific questions.

The red level is more personal questions. The pink one is... Huh? We're getting lost? But wait, we'll put you first. The new question is for the Patreons subscribers. And after that, the ERA level is for the company, which is an inevitable. We won't have time, we'll be running out of time.

We have the question on the Pito réseau, which always ends in softness. And the Joker on which... Look at that! You can use it on any level. But you see, some people are afraid of the ross, they don't even realize they answered. Yeah, I understand.

Because it's still soft. It's very soft. Some people go further, but it's a choice. And some people go faster too. It's like in life, that's for sure. There's everything. Here you go, I give you the green cards, you burn them on the table, you give me five, I'm going to read them.

You'll see that I'm not a 4 player. But you can burn them on the table. But they're a little big. You give me five. I'm going to read them to you, Josée. You can turn them around as you want. One, two, three, four, five. And let's go! So you choose one, I'll choose one.

What is your greatest fear? When I look in the mirror, I see. What importance do you agree with the looks of others? What character traits did you have to work on? And which person made a difference in your life? That's a tough one. Should I pick one? Yes, go ahead.

The greatest fear. Is it too easy? No, it's your game. What is your greatest fear? Being too forgetful. What is your biggest fear? Being abandoned. Leaving without leaving a trace. It's funny, isn't it? I know I'm not the only one, but for me it's really very strong.

And I can't explain why. But the memories, for a very long time, probably since I had my daughters or even before, it has always been... It's not something necessary, it's something natural. It has always been essential for me to write, to take photos. Not just to take, because we all take photos. But I organize my pictures a lot. And not because I want to make a display album of pictures,

because I want to leave traces. I'm sure that's it. I'm doing my own psychologue. I'm happy that the albums are beautiful. But I've already told someone in my surroundings, when there will be my funerals, I would like my albums to be there. I would like people to see how grateful I am. But when my parents left, I tried so hard to find ways to leave them there.

I have an uncle who has a bank with his name on it. And it's very... In the West Canadian, there are a lot of people who will have a bench with the inscription on it, in the memory of Sylvain and the like. I don't even dare to say my name. But... And that's something like... Like I'm saying it, by saying, well, maybe someone will do it for me one day. Or, would like my name to be on a plaque, a room, a bath, I don't know, a chair, a chair, but leaving traces, leaving memories, yes, but yes, it's fear.

The biggest fear is really dying in oblivion. Dying is scary. Have you met people who feel like they have been forgotten after their death? Hey, Marc-Laude, you're going to find me serious, but it happens to me regularly when we talk about someone who has died, when we announce the death of someone, a personality, because it's from those we hear about. Sometimes I tell my boyfriend, you know, I'm touched, we talk about it a little.

Even I have this kind of reflex to look at the photo and to salute the person, you know, to say thank you to him. It's a little esoteric. But it doesn't matter, it bothers me, that's it. But sometimes I tell my husband, what are you saying? In a moment moment we don't talk about it anymore, it's over. And that makes me feel something. That makes me feel like I'm thinking about all these people who have done a lot of things, as well as well-known personalities as well as people who are not well-known. There are a lot of people who... It's my very existentialist side, I think, at this level.

And the more I take care of it, the bigger it gets, I think. But yeah, I tell myself that... that even if you've done great things in your life, when it's going to end, life goes on. I remember when my parents left. The next day or the day after, it doesn't matter. There was a moment when you said, OK, I'm suffering from an inauspicious grief, but I see someone riding a bike.

I was like, what are you doing? You don't understand. You can't be riding a bike today, dad is dead, mom left. You understand. And then you realize that life goes on. Life must go on. We can hear each other. I'm not saying that... No, but this awareness... I talk about it with Norm, my Norm, often. And it's very strong.

It's a bit like... It's like you never want to die. You want to keep living. That we know you're there. Yes, first of all, I want to live. For me, for the people around me. But I would like that we remember each other. I think everyone would like that.

Yes, but at the same time, you wrote books about health aspects, you made DVDs, I don't know how many. 35. 35, you have a platform called Mazone Fit. You have traces that are there. I think so. And you know, even yesterday I was in an event with a conference and there were women who came to see me.

Big women who said to me, there's one of them, it's strange that we're talking about that today, because there's one who said to me, I will never forget you, you changed my life. And that's like, wow! Because she doesn't understand how important it is for me. It's important. It's a big impact.

But I think it's huge for everyone, for you, for everyone who works in the public, or even, let's say, in medicine, nurses, all the people who work in health, that someone tells you, hey, what, you changed my life, you had a huge impact on my life. It's so precious.

We do it for that, but we don't wait for the testimonies, we don't wait for the big hugs in the milk of biscuits, the spices. Well, last time we had lunch together, and the waitress came to tell us that it was 30 years that she was following you, and that every day she was doing exercises. That touches me a lot. It was beautiful when she came to tell us that, and she hesitated, it looked like she didn't want to bother you, but finally, what a beautiful message she delivered. Oh yes. It's the most beautiful gift, it's the most beautiful recognition. We don't do it for that, we don't do it for people to come and see us necessarily, but when it happens, it's really nice because you realize that we're working more and more on the web, we're working more and more even on TV.

We're not in contact with people. So when you see them in person, at the restaurant, at the pizzeria, anywhere, in an event, that's why I love conferences so much. Because there you have people in front of you and this feeling. I have so much fun in conferences because of that. Because I ask questions, we exchange. But that's what feeds you. I think that when we do conferences, we have the chance to talk with people and take the time.

That's what feeds all the rest we do, because we always do it for these people. That is to say that we know what we need. Human contact is important in what we do. Your Fit Zone, my Fit Zone, it's called my Fit Zone. Do you respond to needs of these people when you hear them? Yes, and I'm happy that you say it. You know what made me hesitate to start the Fit Zone platform? Because for the first time in my life, in 2018, I was an entrepreneur. I was never financially independent. Some people would say, « Wow, 35 DVDs, did you make cash? »

I was like, « Yeah, it was perfect. I had rewards, I liked it. I accepted it. » But to start a business, I hesitated for a long time because I was afraid, I think, a part of me was afraid to... To go into the void with my money. But to start a business, I hesitated for a long time because I was afraid, I think, a part of me was afraid of... To throw you in the void, with the impression? No, not even, of people's reaction. Like, oh yeah, she wants to make money.

That's it, that's a big file, the money. Like, we're embarrassed to say that yes, I sell a product. You see? Hey, me too, that was when we launched the magic job. We're all like that, we yes, I sell a product. You see? Hey, that was me when we launched the magic club. We're all like that, we look like we're in Quebec. I didn't even know how to tell people that it wasn't free because we hired people. It's a business.

And look, you're justifying yourself. Yes, but I wasn't stopping. You know, you say, it's like when I buy a product, I pay because... Yes, yes, someone did it. There are people who don't understand that. You know, when you have all the time... You know, I give a the time, I give a lot of free time online on my social networks, but after, yes, Maison de Vite is a paid platform like all other platforms. So it was an important step in your life, that step.

Yes, yes. Why did I end up in Maison de Vite? Because you said that in 2018, you became autonomous, somewhere, it's autonomy. That's right. But I realized that starting a digital platform, it was still my mission. It was still my mission, that's what we're talking about. During the pandemic. To help people, to give them tools, it's always been my mission. People who tell me, yeah, but now you're on the web, you're on DVDs.

Yes, but we're evolving. It changes. Look at how TV changes. And I want to follow. It's not true that I'm going to take the cable and I'm going to wait. I want to follow. I want to keep going back to people and give them tools. That's what I did with DVDs. With VHS even in the 90s. It's to go into the houses and tell you, look, even if you don't want to go to the gym, even if you're alone, you don't have anyone to

motivate you, you can just connect and move because it's your health, we're talking about your health when we talk about physical activity. And that's the message that's going to pass. But you know, in relation to leaving a trace, I want to tell you, Josée, and I think there are a lot of people who will agree with me, when we hear physical activity, life habits, it's your name.

We were doing a survey there. It's so crazy. 80% of people would say Josée Laviguere. As soon as we, in training, I mean, it's you, Josée, you know, she says hello, how many years have you been there? 20 years. You showed us everything, and sometimes it was fun. You had fun.

You always did it in pleasure. People still talk to me about Guy Montgrin. Of course. It's crazy. It's 2002, 2003. It's super nice. It's funny because I didn't expect that, but not long ago, I was in an event with Pierre Lavoie and Claudine Labelle, and it was addressed to generations, young people, younger people, and older people.

A little vague, but hey, there are very young people who came to see me. They said, hey, Madame Lavigueur, that would make me mad. Madame Lavigueur, always a little shock. Madame Bardot. Well, yes. But hey, I know you, my mother, she was doing your exercises, Madame Lavigueur, ça, ça me fait rire. Madame Lavigueur. Toujours un petit choc. Madame Barrett. Mais, eh, tu sais, je vous connais, ma mère, elle faisait vos exercices ou elle fait encore vos exercices

ou elle est abonnée. Mais tu sais, je m'attendais zéro à être reconnue par des jeunes du secondaire. Ça fait vraiment plaisir. Et encore une fois, c'est pas... J'ai jamais fait ce métier-là pour être reconnue. C'est pas... C'est vraiment... Ça a toujours été une mission I've never done this job to be recognized. It's really, it's always been a mission for me, to help people, to give them the means to move and grow old in health.

But I have the impression that leaving a trace, especially since you have children, you have friends, but I have the impression that you need to have a larger grip on that. Leave a trace. In the sense that your trace is already there. You leave it already because once you're not there, there's something you can't control anymore. You can't control anything when you're not there. But the trace is in what we keep as memories. She is in... In addition, you have things that are concrete, but I think your trace... You know, I'm not doing therapy for you. It's perfect.

But me... No, but wait, if I say, I had breakfast with Josée Lavigard, anyone... Oh yeah, Josée Lavigard. You know, it means something. You're funny. Your name is associated with something. It's really important. I also understand that life is more and more like that. It's very cliché, but I'm applying it more and more.

Yes, I would like to leave a trace, but I think the most important trace I can leave is this message of enjoying every moment, of being happy, of dying in life, of living family moments. That's my mark. Winning trophies, having a place, that's futile. The most beautiful mark I think I can leave is the memory that my daughters will have for me. It's the memory that maybe their children will have for me. To remember that maybe their children will have for me.

That's the track that counts the most. That's obvious. I'm aware of that. And the more I see it, the more I see the pride. I feel a certain pride from my daughters to see me work hard, to see me live intensely every day of my life. And I also think that all of this is part of the traces I will leave. I will choose a question that is a bit like the rest of what we just talked about.

Which person made a difference in your life? Hmm... I want to say... In fact, spontaneously, and it's funny, it seems like I'm looking for another answer, but again, I'm going to talk about my parents. My father was a train stopper. He was a man who bit me. He didn't have it easy. My parents didn't have it easy.

It's a long story. But my father always was, always looked for with mother, who was with him and who was his partner in crime, as they say. My mother was always at the game too. But we went camping with them, we went everywhere, we were always in the forest, we did sports with them. We didn't have big means, like a lot of families of our generation when you think about it in Quebec. We had never been awarded, we didn't have arms. You understand that. There was no credit for that either.

Things have changed anyway. It's true. So I want to say, it's my father, it's my mother. Because once again, regularly in conferences, I talk about this huge gift we give our children when we give them the taste to play. And playing is different from doing a sport and competing and becoming a hockey or tennis specialist. We just have to play. Often we just have to have fun. Yes, yes, specialization is a problem for young people.

It's a big discussion. But anyway, my parents have always impressed me. The story of my parents, the story of my father too, who is crazy. I don't know if you want to hear it. I want to hear everything. I know, but sometimes I tell myself, it's going to be too long.

I'm going to take a back seat. My father is the fourth of four boys. And when he was born, his mother died. And father Hubert La Vigueur, he panicked. He adopted the three big brothers and he literally gave in adoption, in saying, Adopt Ronald, Ronald is my father. And so, Alfred Le Royer, it was such a beautiful story, for real, I don't know how interesting it is for another listener, but it touches me so much, it touches the family a lot. Alfred Le Royer is a colleague of work, of my grandfather Hubert Lavigueur. So Hubert, he gives to Alfred Leroyer, my father, Ron, because they couldn't have children.

And so it goes like that, no papers. For ten years, my father, he's called Ronald Leroyer. He doesn't know that he's not his biological father. And one day, in the school, because my father, I had the impression that he was rather turbulent at school. I may know more about him. The principal was angry after him, and he yelled at him, he announced, now it's time for you to learn that you're not the king, but that your name is the vigor.

And then my father, when he tells this, he's emotional. I told you, I have an image of my father telling this story, it's very touching. He says, I'm going to go, I saved myself from school and I rushed to my father and my mother, to his father Alfred. And then he knew the truth, he learned later that he had three brothers. He found his three brothers much later, who were Lofelina Sorel. It's a really intense story. Anyway, after he took his name back.

And things went well, because he had two dads. The dads were friends, so when everyone spoke... So he discovered his dad too? Yes, because he discovered his three brothers, his three big brothers. So it's a beautiful story. My parents had great challenges. When I was three years old, just before the arrival of the disease insurance, I had a fracture in my skull.

It was super violent, it was a long story. It was really an open fracture. I fall on the cement. My father brings me to the hospital. And there, it's the drama, it takes surgery. There is no money. And I remember I was 25 when my father told me this story because he didn't want me to feel responsible. It created so much problems in the budget that they had to move. We had to move the five of them to my grandfather, the king, who lived alone. Because there was no way to pay for the surgery and the hospitalization.

It was too expensive. So in the budget, they had a choice between the surgery and the apartment they had in Ville-le-Moine. So they moved. We all moved to my grandfather's, who had a small apartment. We lived there for, I think, 15 years. We were there for a long time. And it's funny because we were the six of us, because I have a big brother and a big sister, Joanne and Luc, we were the six of us.

And I just have happy memories of that. I swear to you. Just happy memories. Me, being in the same room as my brother and my sister, it was perfect. We had a lot of fun. You know, I just have happy memories. At Christmas, I don't know how he did that,

but he had a thousand gifts under his tree. I'm exaggerating, but in my head, it's just memories of happiness. And it gave that apartment was in front of a park. We were always in the park, winter, summer, we were always outside. It was still the influence of my parents. But when you learn that, I thought about my mother, because my grandfather had health problems. She has three children.

She works in a temple. My mother was a cashier at Steinberg. My father was a vendor at Ford, a concessionaire on the river. His name was Pierre Broux. Listen, I remember that. And he worked hard, hard, hard. He had this apartment to maintain. Three children, the grandfather.

I know how my mother, especially, was struggling. But it never got out of hand. And with the worry for you of her being deported, you had a major operation on your head. I had to put a picture of me in black and white.

No, I'm not like that, but it looks like it's been 2025, the track sign. But I have big bandages, like a big turban on my head. It was my 4-year-old birthday at the hospital. It was impressive. It was really hard times for my parents. Their story impresses me a lot. But especially... Why did they tell you that at 25?

They didn't want me to feel guilty. They didn't want me to feel guilty. Because, in my opinion, they perceived this period at my grandfather, the king, as difficult. But we didn't. They didn't know that. We didn't think, how is it that we lived with granddad.

We were fine. Probably, their perception of that moment was so intense and maybe even sad, that they thought, it doesn't matter, they know that. It's not important. So, at 25, when you told me about it, they both cried so much. And what did it do to you to see the sacrifices they made?

It touched me a lot. It moved me a lot. But it impressed me. At 25, you see things that are different. They are strong. I really... Yes, that's it. And at 25, you also come out of a period where maybe your parents... They can hit you in the face at times. I was very close. I lived with my parents very late.

So, all of a sudden, you discover a little bit about the life of your parents, what they've been through, the emotions, their great challenges, you know, the story of my father, as well, in relation to his three brothers. I learned all of this quite late. So, they impressed me enormously, and they always impressed me. Their resilience, we often talk about resilience, but wow, impressive. I have only beautiful memories.

It's funny because we come from the city of Le Moine, and my grandfather, the king, he had a small apartment in Saint-Lambert. And we went back to Saint-Lambert. Sometimes I talked about it with my daughters at one point, and I found it interesting because people have clichés about Saint-Lambert. And it's funny because we went back to Saint-Lambert because of poverty, to tell the truth. We got there because we went to my grandfather's house. But we were so good in that apartment, we were so well surrounded

that we stayed there. We took a high duplex after that. When finally my parents got a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex.

On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex.

On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex. On a duplex.

On a duplex. It's one of the... Not for everyone. It's been several years since then. But it's funny to think about how things have changed, and the perception too. And the judgement, the judgement around where you come from, I would say clearly. Are you ready to move on to the yellow level? Should I? Well, it was really beautiful, the tribute to your parents, it's magnificent. I don't want to, it seems. I don't want to exaggerate. But at the same time, I'm going to say, it's just what you want to be.

There's no taboo here, there's no judgment. You know what I like about you? It's that we can be totally spontaneous. I love your openness so much. I really enjoy being here. You chose it. Yes, I'm watching. You're watching. You just wanted to give me a hint.

No, but that's the purpose of this game. It's to be free to talk. Because I knew the story of your parents. Yes, it's true. You told me that one day in a makeup room. And you were without knowing it. I was there, but what a family secret. Because at the time I had started, and I never finished,

I had started a book called The Family Secrets. It's something that attracts me a lot. Maybe one day I'll keep doing what I started. And then you tell me that in the dressing room, but I say, but what Secrets of Family? You learn that at 25 years old, that since there was not yet the Régie d'Assurance Maladie, Exactly. We don't have it, yes, that's it. You make a fall, you open the curtain, you learn to rise. The only way is to say, we have to get a loan, so we won't have the means to have our own apartment, we're going to live. When you told me that, I was shivering, and I had done a show on secrets,

and you had come to talk to me. I remember very well. I said to myself, it's crazy, it's still something. But do you remember the beginning of this story? Not at all because I wanted to make it short, but you know, my broken skull, the previous winter, we went to slide. My dad brought us to slide to Mont-Royal. We were in a wooden trailer with the front curved. And we had the trailer crossing the slope to go back up.

We hit another trailer. And my head hit the front of the wooden trailer. But you know, yes, I cried and you hit your head, I hit another We went to the emergency room. The examiner showed that if there had not been the second accident, there was already liquid, there was already a small fracture of the crown. There was already a spilling of liquid around my crown, which could have been fatal. It was as if the second fall, the second blow, saved my life. Usually when I tell this, there is someone who says,

Oh, that's it! You know, like, well, yeah. You're sure you didn't do it, you're very well filmed. No, I didn't do it. I just think that in the end, it's circumstances in life that we don't explain. No, there are people who will talk about age, you know, there are people who can believe

everything you want, but yes, this second fall, thanks to my brother that I salute, who pushed me down a swing without wanting to. But it saved your life anyway. I'll take two other four things. I had already given you two. I brought four, that's it. So we're in the yellow level.

I read the questions. What is the biggest challenge you have had to overcome? Are you the mother you would have liked to have? What do people reproach you the most? What type of lover are you? That's really hard! What type of lover are you? It's not in the Eros. Eros goes further. Oh, that's it. But imagine if I did it, does it clear Eros?

No, it doesn't clear Eros. Josée, you don't have a choice. You see, I hope when I did it with Jeannette Bertrand, she asked, at the green level, what do we... In fact, it's a level, what do we reproach you most often? She said, we always reproached me for talking too much about sexuality. Oh! She talked about Eros all along. Well, yes, well, I know. That's still very funny. about sexuality. Oh! She talked about eros all along. Well, yes, I know. That's still very funny.

Well, yes, so you can go, you can go. I love that. But anyway, we're not at the eros level, we're at the genus level. I can go there. What type of lover are you? Because... It's one or two that I choose. One, the other is me. It's one or two that I choose. One, the other is me. Oh!

I can try to... What type of lover are you? I'm a very patient type. In the sense that I always want... Yes! That I'm a dancer. You said I would be a dancer. I always want to... Yes, I want to skate! You said I would skate in these... No, but you know, I want it to move.

I want to explore. I want to go on trails. I want to move. And so I think I'm demanding in a certain way. And him... I'm talking about the type of lover he is, but he, and I think that's not it, that we've been together for so long, he's so patient. He's always game. He's always there for me. He's super rational. Because I'm a dreamy. Dreamy, maybe too much, because the dream is the dream. Like the long preliminaries,

the long soups in the chandelier, the sweet little music, it doesn't work, it's too long for me. So I'm a love-hate relationship. I like to spoil it, I like to spoil him, in the sense that I want to emphasize every moment, I want to be there for him. But I'm not the ideal lover. That's it, in short. That's what I would say. Why an ideal lover? Oh yes. You know, that, the woman who makes the soups, it's super cliché, I know what I'm saying. But we're talking about the feminine anyway.

What kind of lover, I would see as the one I would have liked to be, that's the one, ultra romantic, ultra sexy, let's say, who puts time to arrange for his or her partner, because we can reverse all that. And I'm not that. I'm like too in a hurry. I'm not that. And when you get to that, do you believe it?

Not so much. That's the problem. So you feel it less. If you put a little more... Like you said, sexy, you're the one who says the word. Do you feel like you're playing something or do you feel it inside you? I feel like I'm playing. And it's okay. When do you feel sexy? I had the impression of playing. It's not a big deal.

When do you feel sexy? It's rare. It's rare. It's rare. I'm not... It's... Let's say I'm going to feel sexy. I'm going to have a moment of sensation.

I'm a woman, I'm in my skin, if I'm, let's say, in a bikini, all alone, by the water, or on a kayak, or all of a sudden it's going to take me. I'm going to feel like, ah, I'm fine, I'm in my body. In your body. Yes. But it's a very delicate department for me, all of that, you know, like you can feel it. Well, yes, but you for me, all of that. You can feel it. Yes, but you're surprised by that. No, no, no. That comes... Check the girl who's going to put that on someone else's back.

It comes a lot from the family. A lot of taboo on sexuality in our country. A lot of unheard-of. Am I part of this gang that has long believed believed its parents never touched each other? Because they never questioned it. I was part of it. For me, it was a big mess. It's still very delicate. I think we really grew up in there.

And you know, as I said, normally he's cool, he's hungry, he's patient. We're just good together. You know, it's for sure that sometimes it happens, you know, I'm going to tell him, look, I dressed up like a real girl, you know, nonsensical things like that, big clichés. And it makes him laugh. He likes that. I know he's a real girl, he's a big cliché, and it makes him laugh. He likes it, he's able to appreciate it, but it's more of a game, I would say.

But the ideal lover for me would be, I would like to take more care of him, to be more... I do it, I do it, like he does for me, a lot. But I would like to be more present for him. Would you also need to take more care of yourself? Certainly, in a way.

Certainly. But you know, I don't have a big question. I'm fine, we don't have any issues. But your relationship is fine. You have an ideal, but you must already be the ideal of your partner. Do you understand? That's what he's telling me.

You know, that's it. You have an ideal. But sometimes it's... You know, sometimes we'll compliment someone. And the person has some misery to deal with. Let's say, hey, what you're wearing is beautiful. Oh, well, look. I'll tell you that. Well, yeah, look... I bought this for you.

Well, yeah, yeah, it's an old thing to do in the morning. Well, we have misery to learn that. Do you feel that you also have misery to learn that Norma, you know, what she sees as a woman, that's what she wants so fully, and that you don't need to think about what it could be to be in love? Yeah, no, that's a good point. Yes, I's a good point.

Yes, I have the trouble of... Let's say they regularly give me compliments. And that's exactly it. If they tell me, hey, you're beautiful. Hey, he's hungry. Regularly, he comes to see me and he says, you're really beautiful. And even saying it, it bothers me at the moment.

Do you understand? But that's the words of Norm Norman. Yes, that's it. And when he says that, I try to... You know, you have to learn to take, precisely, and accept it, and to do... Just like, ah, thank you, it's really funny, you know. But I'm always in the... Yeah, but no. You say that to please me,

or maybe because you want something more, or it's not like that in Normand. It's like you had an intention. Yeah, but no. For real, he's quite honest and so kind that the intention is so... It's spontaneous. He tells me, no, I just wanted to tell you, I think you're beautiful, that's all. Because sometimes I say, I'm going to react, I'm going to do, but why are you telling me that?

And then in my head I say, but why are you telling him that? Just accept the compliment, just take the compliment. And that's it, it's really spontaneously that he's going to give me compliments like that. I have to learn to appreciate him. To just say, wow, it's so thin, it's so loving to say that to his lover. It's like you didn't deserve that fully. Well, maybe. Do you want something like that? Yeah, because how many long have you been together?

Well, let me calculate. We met in Egypt. Yeah, it's been a few years. Hey, did you know I never counted? But yes, I know. It's not hard. Hey, keep that I'm calculating. I'm going to get my fingers out soon.

I'm 40 years old. 42? 42 years old? 3. 43? Let's continue, I said let years old. 42? 42 years old? 3. 43! We keep going, I tell you, we keep going! Listen, I started college, so I'd say... Well, it's... 44 maybe.

It doesn't matter. It's true, when I see a relationship, I have to read it as fast as possible. 40, 41... It's going fast. 44... I can't anymore! It's really weird how the numbers, the years, the dates, you know, I can't even say the date of my parents' party, I can't say the age of my brother or sister, I'm close, but I don't know exactly.

I don't know if it's just a relationship between a mathematician's trauma and a secondary error, which is real, from a completely crazy teacher. But it's like that. I have the trouble of getting the numbers back like that. And so every time someone asks me, how long have you been with Normand? I know it's since CGA.

I remember Stan Smith Blanc, he had so charmed me. But that's it. But that's it, it's a big, big part of your life. He knows you your years. Completely. Completely. He saw me evolve. He saw me change.

He saw me grow. Same thing for me, towards him, that's for sure. And do you give him compliments? Regularly. And how does he react? Like me. That's a good question, Marie-Claude. And he too, he's like, yeah, yeah. It's interesting to

see that both of them, and Norman is beautiful, he's beautiful in and out. Yeah, inside and outside. He's really a beautiful person. And when you make a compliment like that, hey, you're beautiful. That's beautiful. Let's say what you're wearing, or... Now we're really talking about the outside, you know, it's obvious, and yeah, you're going to be like, yeah, no, no, you know, it's, hey, stop it, hey, stop it, that, huh, you've probably heard that somewhere. Hey, I do it too, hey, stop it, like, what does that mean? It means I don't cut you in half, you waste saliva, You know, like, basically, it's mean. You know, it's mean. I just came to give you a nice compliment. If I took the trouble to tell you,

and you should see it in my eyes, you should feel it in my intention, it's because I really feel it. You know, it's funny, huh? Hey, stop it. But it's true that, you know, you say that, and I recognize myself in it. But it seems like we should do the exercise of trying to let go. Not to slow down, to see what it gives on both sides. I would tell you that it's funny, it seems that we're doing more of that. We even have, I'm jealous because I don't remember with whom you talked about it, but I know it the one who talked about that. The duration of a hug or the duration of a kiss,

there's like a number of seconds. Like, let's say, you know, because we're often in a hurry, we're ready to make a little kiss, and then bye or hello, you know. Whereas we know that if you hold that little kiss for two seconds, there's really like, something really happens at the level of the hour. We talked about it in the book. Yes, that's it.

And so, you know, like, what do's it. You know, it brings a lot. You see, even at that level, we try, we make the effort. When you make a call, it's the same Norma who told me that you heard about the duration of a call. I was shocked, I was like, yes. And it's true that even if you force yourself,

even if it's not spontaneous, if you stick to the other for more than half a second, sometimes we're like... But it's not spontaneous, if you stick to the other for more than half a second, sometimes we're like... But it's because you develop the reflex of the other. Exactly. That's it too. That is to say that you understand the sensation that lives in you, so you will be brought to what lasts longer after you let this sensation go up. That's true. But we often tend to put brakes. It's brake a compliment break, a hug break, a kiss break.

It's like we're not there. You think we don't deserve it? Yes, it's... I think it's crazy. It's when you let it come in. Sometimes we'll say that someone is sensuous, and it looks like this person can do anything, that she'll let the others approach her.

You're right. There's something beautiful about sensuality. It's like an opening to the other, where you feel that you have your place. You feel that this person has made a compliment and will say thank you. Yes, that's it. The space is for both. The opening is there, yes, thank you. I'm happy that it does me good. You know when you say earlier, I'm afraid to be forgotten, I need to be recognized.

And if we tell you, sometimes you'll block it. When you want that. You say thank you, it's nice to say that. I do it more now. But it's good that you do it more, because others can tell you even more. Because otherwise, we're a little stupid when someone says, well, it's beautiful. No, we're a little stupid when people say,

well, it's beautiful. No, it's true. Then it's like, well, excuse me, I really didn't want to bother you. Exactly. It's a part of sensuality in there, Josée. You're so right, I love that. I love what I hear. I love sensuality.

The question I chose, are you the mother you would have wanted to have? Do you have the mother you would have liked to have? I think yes. In fact, I shouldn't think of my mother. I'm not like my mother was. It's completely different times, contexts. But you know, when you're young,

there are things that hit you harder. When you have a child, you say, what you did to him, as you would have liked it to be. I like to think about that because... Yes. It's easy to blame things like that. To say, I should have done that. I would have liked my mother to be more present. But I can never blame her.

She worked, it was crazy. My mother finished at Stangberg at 6 o'clock. We were all back from school, we had a note on the fridge, what to prepare for dinner, because she didn't have time, and she didn't want to make us dinner at 7 o'clock. That was a little hard, but it was impressive. I'm just going to go back a little bit. But the life of our parents... Today, I've been working for 40 years in pleasure.

I'm almost embarrassed to say it. We're spoiled, but we have missions, we have careers that feed us. I was looking at people at Attraction everywhere in the studios, and I was like, I swear I had that reflection. It's so extraordinary to see people working in happiness, in something they chose. And when I see my daughters do that too, I'm like, wow, it's completely different from the contexts that our parents have lived in.

They worked hard. We all work in a certain way, but they didn't have a choice. They didn't have a choice, they didn't have options. So my mother and my father, the two of them weren't present. My father, I saw him, we saw him at dinner. He came to eat quickly and then he came back. He worked until 9pm. Every night of the week, he was gone all day. He came to eat 20 minutes, he left. So we missed him a lot. But I want to remind myself,

without a doubt my brother and my sister one day who will be listening, we would never have blamed them for that. It's after we realized it, but we were fine. Because you totally understood it. It was clear, you knew she was working. There's no reference, no comparison either. That's right. No, no, that's right. That's the life you had.

Completely. When I was talking about the apartment we shared with my grandfather. There was no comparison. There was a moment, I'll always remember, in a primary school in Longueuil, which was rough, it was called St. Jude at the time, and it was, anyway, it was tough. And I had friends, I made friends at one point, who lived in a new neighborhood in Saint-Lambert. And they went to dinner by bus, you know, at their place.

And that, Marie-Claude, I was like... There, I remember that moment where I... I don't know, I made a statement that life was not equal, that it wasn't the same everywhere. One day, Hélène Blackburn told me, I was in fifth year, I think I was in sixth, I remember very well. She told me, if it's tempting, my mother invites you to come to dinner. I was really touched by this invitation. And I leave by bus at 11.45, I don't know where. Bus at noon, I had never known that. I was used to cafeteria with my thermos. And it was very good. I wasn't like, let's say we're not in a sad movie scene.

No, no, say, a scene, we're not in a sad movie scene, where is the child? Not that, I was used to it, I was happy. But then, to leave at 11.45 with my lunch, I didn't eat because I was going to have lunch at Helen's. To go down, listen, I'm going to the house again, I've never seen her house, to go home, welcomed by Mrs. I don't remember, we'll say Mrs Madame Blackburn, l'odeur du repas. C'est l'heure du lunch, c'est pas moi l'heure du lunch, c'est pas ça. Écoute, ça m'avait tellement impressionné. Et là oui, j'avais réalisé que c'est ça, qu'on vivait des trucs différents chez nous, mais c'était correct, c'était correct.

Mais sauf que moi, quand mes filles sont arrivées, But it was okay. But except that when my daughters arrived, there was a part of that I wanted to reproduce. I wanted to be there for my daughters. And there is one thing that I will never regret. I would say that I had promised myself to want to be there for my daughters. Maybe it's because my my mother being there. When my daughters started, even before school,

we were lucky enough to find a guardian. Because at that time, I was like, hi, hello, I have a lot of commitment. It takes a guardian. Normally, they work full-time in Montreal. But my brother, my big brother Luc, he had four children. And the guardian who worked at his place, who's called Nadine Thériault, who has a place in our heart, you don't even understand,

she's part of the family. Well, she had less time. Luc's children were at school. So I contacted Nadine. And Nadine, long story short, became the guardian of our children. So, there, Marie-Claude, I had Nadine who would come home in the morning.

My daughters were asleep. She woke up. No guardrails, no jitters. And it's not a judgment, you know. It's still a lucky day we had. And you started early, I imagine. She was in a period of cali. And even in the mornings, because I wasn't every day at the salut bonjour,

but in the mornings when I wasn't at the salut bonjour, Nadine had a super flexible aura. I told her, look, you can come just at noon. So it was perfect. For me, these are perfect memories. I was there when the girls woke up, we had breakfast together. For me, it was the ideal, it was really an ideal world. And when, listen, as we were wasted, when Sarah started her maternity leave,

Nadine obviously stayed with us to take care of Leanne a little more. I was still giving classes, I told her that I would never stop. When the girls arrived, I questioned my classes again, because it had always been Monday, Wednesday, Friday night. But then I said to myself, if I stop this, I'm going to be unhappy. Nadine came on Monday, Wednesday Wednesday because Normand was working late. She was there to feed the girls. It was really perfect. But just to tell you the story of Nadine, when Léanne finally went back to kindergarten,

well, a year after Sarah, Nadine finds herself without a job, but there, she is hired at's now working for the school's security service. It can't be more perfect. I'm like, the girls had a guardian who was following her to school, to the security service. It was really, really, it was really wow. And to come back to my role as a mother, I held on for a very long time to what girls

come to dinner at home. And I told you the story of Ellen Dagon and my visit. For me, when I saw the bus coming, I don't know if my girls, I would like to ask them one day if they remember it too, it had a certain impact in their lives. But when I saw the bus coming just on the corner, I saw it. And I saw the two bus drivers running home, and it smelled like soup, or it smelled like, I don't know, it wasn't the perfect time for dinner, we don't care.

But it smelled like something, you know. Sometimes you could even smell the Kraft Dinner, it doesn't matter. But you know, for me, that was happiness. We spent about 45 minutes together. Then I would go back to the bus with her. You were at the top of your pride. Totally. I was arranging myself.

I can't put numbers on it because it depended on my schedules. You know, we never have the same week, but very, very often when she got on the bus at 3.45, something like that, I was at home. For me, it was really important. And that, because you know, we all want to be present for our children. It's for sure that that's what we want. But after, do we have all the possibilities? No, you know, that's it. But you know, I find your story beautiful because dinners, it marked you. And you know, there are times that will say, I practice a sport, my parents were never there.

Now when my children practice a sport, I'm still there. I know, it's that we're going to look for what we missed. Exactly. No, no, exactly, that's it. I'm very, very proud of that. I'm proud to have always been there. The girls supported me, they danced. They were influenced, maybe by me. Your girls had to move too, I imagine. Yes, a lot. They did gymnastics, you know. And it's funny, I have a flash, a little relationship, but you see my role as a mother, there too.

I was very proud of it. They did gymnastics. And you know, the gym, it's intense. You know, earlier I was talking about specialization, and you know, you're going to be the next Nadia Comaneci. The coaches are intense. You know, like, wait a minute, your voice is progressing. And one day I'm going to pick up the girls at the gym gym training and Leanne is on the edge. Listen, she's like, I don't know, ten years old maybe, nine or ten years old, very young. She's on the edge and I see her shaking, she's got arms in her ears, I don't know if you can see it. The coach is next to her, Claude, a great, great man who died today, but he was so hungry and he really liked our family.

He used to tell us that often. Hi Claude. But Léon is standing on the pole and he asks Léon to do a back flip on the pole. I don't know if it says something like an image. It's that you go in the air, you put your hands on the pole and your legs go over it. But of a higher intensity, that is to say that you have to swing like a little swing. There is a moment when you are in the air. And it doesn't work.

Leanne has her shoulders, you know, at a certain angle on the edge. And there is another coach who introduces himself, who says, you're going to do it, and then I'm in the window, and I'm like that. And then in my head, it's like, wait, wait, wait. I keep telling everyone that we have to be in pleasure, that physical activity has to be pleasant, that we can get rid of the pressure. And then I see my daughter, my little cat, who is on the bed, in the process of getting wet because there is a coach who puts pressure on her and she doesn't feel it, she doesn't

feel it. Are you in pleasure? Do you think at that moment, zero minus a thousand? And so I go in and I'm like Leanne, look, I think it's going to be okay, we're going to go, you know, we're going. And you're like, wow, the relief, you know, I was a little... You were the mom.

I was there at the right time. I was, you know, and from there, the girls started to do tumbling. I don't know if you know the tumbling. Yes, perfectly. You jump on a carpet. Oh my God, you know, they roll, they turn, the sun is shining a little. Yes, perfectly. You jump on a carpet. Oh my God, and you know, he rolls, he turns, the sun's flashing a little.

Yes, but it's a long carpet. Exactly, with a little trampoline there. The fun they had there. And you know, I'm not talking about the gym. Look, it was very expensive for a certain number of years, but from the moment the pressure and the lack of pleasure settled for us, it's over. You did an intervention.

Yes, and Tumbling was like a solution. In any case, I think that... And now that your daughters are no longer with you, how do you live your role as a mother? Hmm... I would like to be more present, you know? I would like that... You know, sometimes I hear mothers talking about it.

Sometimes you tell me that you often call each other. Yes. It seems like I'm a little jealous. Oh, really? No, but I don't know. Maybe it's not normal for me, but... No, no, no. It's like we have our group of discussions,

we call each other, we get together somewhere, we travel together, you know, but... That's it. But look, when I hear, especially in phone conversations, I often hear that, you know, mothers tell me, «Ah, we call each other, you know, I'm like, «Yeah, you know, like...» I couldn't, it seems like I couldn't, first of all, myself, it seems like I wouldn't have any inspiration.

But it depends on the period I live, I think so too. I think so. Exactly. And you know, they're so in the juice that it seems like I'm afraid to disturb them. But I realize that we live super intense moments together. We travel together again. We arrange to share great moments. And I also feel that they want us to be together. They don't do it to please me. But that's the basis. Yes.

It's what's set, it's there. After that, well, at what moment it's possible. But that, when it's installed, it's extraordinary. No, I'm still very, very proud. You know, I don't know how all this will evolve, but we are close. We also have our group of conversations, but we are there once a week maybe. We take pictures. But it's rare that we will settle down, like in FaceTime, and talk for an hour.

We don't know. We do that for example when the holidays arrive. So what do we do? Okay, it's too complicated. They have lives elsewhere. So we do FaceTime, and then after half an hour, everything is set. There are moments where we do this because the discussion group, we put anything on it, a photo, something to show a girl. I think it's the humor of the family that comes from this discussion.

Sometimes it can be a week, but we read what the others are going to put, put a little card. It's funny. Just that. You know, family moments, moments with my daughters, it's what's most precious to the world. And at the parties last year,

we realized that we were missing it. It made the parties complicated. I'm getting away from the subject, but you'll understand. It made it complicated. I find it complicated. I'm moving away from the subject, but you'll understand. It's complicated. I think it's complicated. At the holidays, there are people who have holidays. Sarah is no longer available. Léa is no longer available. It's the time we meet, you know.

But just the four of us together. We decided that the next holidays, we'll spend two weeks together. Somewhere else. I don't want to see the rest of the family, but it's with them that I want to spend precious time and quality time. I don't want to live the stress of preparations and the expenses, and the other. Last year, we did a kind of questioning.

Why is it so complicated, the holidays? For us, it was complicated last year. And we thought, the essential is no longer there. The essential is no longer there. Girls want to see cousins, cousins, but suddenly, there are babies, the family is widening. It changes, and it's normal. Everything changes, and everything passes,

and that's normal. Everything changes, and everything passes, and that's life. But why do we have to take on traditions? My parents are no longer there, things have changed. So we have to change in that time, that's it. Yes, and I'm happy with that decision we made. We already chose what we were going to do. We'll see how it goes, but that's what I want to do. I want to stick to my precious gain.

It doesn't stop us from having a giant dinner with cousins, in another moment. But you'll be close to your birth. Completely. I think about the holidays, Christmas. For me, Christmas was the midnight mass with my parents, and we would go home, we would go to bed in the apartment with my grandfather, the king, and it was the day after, December 25th, that we would open the presents.

But now... You know, you're going to do your own traditions. Completely. Are you ready for the red level? Let's go, Guéman! Let's go, please give me three. But it's true that we have to question our traditions. Are you ready for the red level? Let's go, Guéman! Let's go, please give me three. But it's true that you have to question your traditions.

When life changes, yes, but it becomes the tradition of your family. Is it mandatory? Why do we do it? Do you have to feel it? Yes, that's it. Are we obligated to go? When the time of the holidays comes, there are some that are not, there are some that are. It's like an obligation obligation, not a feeling. Exactly.

How many? Three. We only chose one at this level, Josée. You will be correct. Okay, I survived. What are Normand's deep needs, he says? What is your biggest source of insecurity? Do you have regrets?

Wow! That's three great questions. All of them are great questions. Little regrets in connection with TV. What is your biggest insecurity source? Oh my God, where am I going? Where am I going? Oh, excuse me. So, take the time you have. Well, Normand, I'm going to take this one because at the same time it allows me to

pay tribute to Normand. What deep need does he respond to? Well, security, precisely. It's a bit of a connection to the biggest source of insecurity. You know, I said earlier, it's my anchorage. I have a little anxious side. I'm not anxious. I don't have a diagnosis, but I'm someone who might have a little idea not to assume or not to diagnose. For real, I feel a little bit, But there may be anxiety of being attached to that. I gave you an example, not long ago we made a trip, and I experienced the worst turbulence zone of my life.

I swear, Marie-Claude, a pocket, we lifted the ears. Seriously, there was a person not attached to the plane, and it was quite dramatic. In short, that made me so anxious. Apparently, there were lots and lots of people anxious in the plane, but that's not seen. I can imagine. It was really scary. But there, you have my Norm next to you, totally calm, that's Norma. This deep need for calm, that's Norma. He didn't laugh at me, he was like, calm down. I said, I came to his arms and I cried, I was really scared. It was a moment of anxiety.

I know that when we came back from boarding the plane, you know, all that came back. But anyway, it's my anchorage at home that calms me in my moments of insecurity, when I put things back in question, in line with the platform, with my zone of fit. The biggest source of source is that suddenly people don't want to count on me anymore, don't want me to do enough for my company.

That's an insecurity source. But you always have Normand to bring me back to reality, like, look how good we are but look how good we are, look how good you are, look how what you do has an impact on people's lives and on your life. I mean, no, he... He prevents your hamster from getting inflamed.

Yes. So much. He stops it. Every time. If he's there. Yes. When he's not there, it goes away. But you know, I'm not...

But yes, I'm someone who needs to move. It needs to move, things need to move forward. Do you stop sometimes? Could you be lying on your couch and listen to a series of 10 episodes? No. I can listen to a series of one episode. One episode.

One, two... Yes, yes, I can stop. There series of one episode. One episode. Two... Yes, yes, I can stop. There are shows we follow, just to get away. But are you on a bike? No, no, no. I can calm down. Except that...

That's funny, but you'll never see me or very rarely, let's say, but you'll never see me, or very rarely, put my Benavachi in my chair. You know, like, just without moving. I'll be pulling myself up. I'll be doing... Are you on vacation, for example, with a whole set? Is that possible? It's rare. It's not my kind of vacation. What are your kinds of vacations?

How do you know? It's going to be climbing a mountain. You're a bit of a boss. Yes. Because one day I was with a couple of friends, we were at the Mont Albert Gilles, we went for a walk, it was a recent couple,

and the couple's daughter, she's not here. She's a little bit of a bitch, but she's not going to tell you. She's a goat. That's what we were trying to say. She left in a second. It was really funny. And you know, it looks like I'm thinking about you. Ok, bye! Did you find her? Yes, but she had to find us there.

Because we found her fast. But you need to spend physically too. I need to spend physically, but... Yes, that's it. But I swear, I'm to spend physically, but... Yes, that's it. But I swear, mountains, nature, it's so strong. And that also goes back to my parents. I told you, we were always outside. We would play outside.

And it's super positive anchors. It's funny because my son Normand,a has German roots from the Bulgarians. And we went to visit the country, the city of birth of his mother, who died just after my parents. In the same year, this incredible grandmother, who we called Oma, because Oma means grandmother in German. So she comes from a village called Fussen in Germany, in the south of Germany, even more in the south than Munich. Let's say you have an image,

close to the Neuschwanstein castle, it's the castle of Walt Disney. Yes, which has never been finished. Exactly. It's also the Chidi Chidi Bang Bang castle, do you remember? Yes, we see it, but everyone know the Neuschachtstein castle. It inspired the image of Wadissey. Exactly. But to say that if you're in Bavaria, it's in the south of Germany, it's the mountains, it's the rivers.

Marie-Claude, it's beautiful. I don't know if I'm wrong, but it was 10 km from the border of Austria. It's the mountains. And so, all of that to say that it's in our roots. Except that it doesn't have anything to do with it. I appropriated that. I'm the mountain of Ville-le-Moine, let's go. But you've become like in the roots of a child.

I drank that, I don't know. Because you tell me sometimes how important it is in your life to be in the mountains. It gives me a feeling of freedom, of greatness. I was talking about the existentialist side. When I was in the mountains, we went on a trip to Montaigne not long ago, and I swear, we were on a summit. I had a moment of fullness. I talked to my parents,

and I was like, I feel so close to you, I can't be closer. At a height like that, close to paradise, imagine that, as you want. But it was intense, we would say. But you were good. So, you know, a whole intense, we would say. Yes, but anything. So I spent my days with books. And it's funny because it was a coincidence. We didn't know, but there was a sail.

I love sailing and there were little catamarans that we could take alone. I was so excited because with my hair, I could still sail. I organized myself, I was well settled. So it was like a good... But if I had to spend the week in my long chair between a palm tree, or worse, sorry, it wouldn't have worked. So it's not my type of vacation. You're in physical activity, it's not for nothing.

I like the sea. For me, going in the main, going to the beach, what I like about the ocean, what I like about the sea, is the size, the immensity. When you contemplate the ocean, you're like, oh my God!

It's a form of meditation. Totally. You see, at one point, Yes, it's a form of meditation. I think so. Yes, totally. You see, at one point, we had done a mission on meditation, and I kept saying, I have misery. It's just when I'm on the edge of the lake, and someone told me, I think it was Frédéric Lenoir, he told me that it's meditation with full consciousness. That's what it is.

It's when all... Thought continues, but it doesn't stop. There is a fluidity in the thought, which makes you savour the present moment. You're not thinking of anything else than what you see. Exactly. And that, there are some that it can be the mountain, it can be something else, but the water, there is a force. But that's maybe why I like to be alone. If I'm in a mountain, if I'm by the lake or by the ocean,

there's nothing that annoys me more than being in a group. It's like, yes. Because it's something spiritual for you. I think so. Without knowing it, you reconnect. Yes, yes. It often happens to me to plant myself in front of a lake or a mountain, in front of a magnificent landscape,

and to meditate in a certain way. I am completely in gratitude in these moments. These words are clichés, but it's not important. It's important. I think we all understand what you mean. It's like we were purified. It's like the topures of what we are. When we have these moments of grace or of fullness,

for me there's something very spiritual. I understand your word gratitude because we would like it to stay that moment. But you can have someone who says, Josée! And that's it, you're out. It's when it happens, it's hard. It happens sometimes in the kitchen. Oh yeah, in the creme or not. Sometimes I put music. It's too it's hard. It happens to me in the kitchen. Oh yeah, in the creme or not. Sometimes I put music on.

It's too complicated for me. I know that there are people who come to me, especially when the children were young. I heard them playing, and you were in the kitchen preparing something. I like that. Everyone is fine. And you too. We are just good. I feel like I'm doing what I should be doing at this moment.

It's like a movie scene. It doesn't last long at this moment. But when you feel it again, it feels good. I feel it, I hear it, I see it. It's a relief. You have to know what it does to you sometimes. It's true.

Officially, the level is company. Oh yeah, we're here. You have five cards. It always seems like you want to move away from the level. So in that level, you have five cards, you give me four and you choose one. I give you four and I choose one of the four that I give you. And I don't choose one. It's like the first time I saw your gesture.

Yes, but it's like when you're young, it's not the same. Exactly. I give you four, but it's like when you're going, it's not the same. Exactly. I give you a card. I chose or I... No, by chance, by chance. You chose by chance, you said that. I chose, but by chance. So, here it is.

My finger. What role does emotional intimacy play in your relationship with your lover? Are you comfortable with nudity? What place do you give to your intimate life? Is it easy for you to express your desires within the couple? Yes, my joker. I'm hiding it from you. No, no, he's there.

Let's play the game. I'm here for that. At the same time, it's super nice to be with you, really. What is emotional intimacy? It's the girl. You see that I still have a lot to learn. Yes, but it's about talking about what you feel, you know, because you have the sexual intimacy, the intimacy that we know. But often, this intimacy, I'm not a sexologist, I tell you everything I've heard. That you've learned too. But what I've learned is that sometimes we get to sexual intimacy more quickly in a relationship, when we know each other.

And quietly, over time, there is an emotional intimacy that sets in, that complements sexual intimacy or enriches sexual intimacy too. I tell myself that people who listen to me will say, «Listen, well…» You're already saying that? No, but it's not the terms we used when we were… We didn't grow up in that. We didn't grow up in…

And I've never had a world where people talked to me about having an emotional, loving intimacy. That's true. That's extraordinary for our children as well. You know, the girl who's right. That's right. That's extraordinary for our children too. You know that the girl who's trying to change the subject. No, but... We're talking about our children. Come on. But so, at home, it wasn't a subject.

I mean, your parents... Zero. They didn't talk about sexuality. Zero. It was a taboo. Yes. Yes, yes, it was a taboo. I think...

Again, we never blamed them for that. I think that, again, we never reproached them for that. I think that, you know, let's say if we were analyzing the generation of our parents, in my opinion, it wasn't something that I was doing a lot in the... No, no. I learned a lot of things listening to, for real, Janet Bertrand. Ah, that's for sure! Yes, you named her. Well, to talk, to talk, the great Moirainte, and even she had, I'm not talking about Georges, where there were people who were going to talk about all the subjects, I mean, it's true. And even she had a page like Jase where there were people who were going to talk about all

the subjects. I mean, it's true. It's not necessarily at home. And there were no books. I don't know. We didn't have the Internet. There was no education for boys. No, boys, I remember, it must still be like that.

But I remember I had friends who had Playboy magazines. But for girls, at the same time, it was a physical sexuality. We weren't in the emotion. But I have the impression that it was a physical sexuality. We weren't in the emotional side. But I have the impression that when you have a hard relationship, there is something to develop in the emotional intimacy, to have this zone where you are yourself with the other, in what we have more vulnerable too.

It's super interesting. I'm keeping this game. Yes, I'm going with you. Ha ha ha! I will answer this question. Wait, wait, okay. I'm going to change the subject. Perfect.

Are you comfortable with nudity? Yes. No. The answer is no. I have to elaborate. Well, yes, you will elaborate. No, OK. Well, actually, I don't know how to explain it, but I've never been at ease with nudity. You will never see me naked. You will never see me naked.

What is that? I'm super comfortable. I'm not the kind of person who will run through the living room naked because I'm taking a shower. I'm at home, taking a shower. I don't know if I'm going to go to the bathroom and get some underwear, or if I want to have my napkin stuck on me, and normally he can't even see me,

I can't escape my napkin. It's like that. I don't hide. You said I don't hide, but... it takes a certain shadow. Has it always been like that? Yes, always. Always, always. And yet,

it's not... In fact, there is no yet. It's... It's certain that if I try to do a sort of analysis, the work I do has changed a lot.

The world of physical activity has changed a lot. The world of physical activity has changed a lot. Today, we accept the bodies and thank God. I am 100% there, in all forms, in all sizes. But 40 years ago, when I met Normand, and at that time, we said 44 years old. I think you stopped at 44. I was never thin enough, Marie-Claude.

I say that with a certain shame. But you have to get back to it in 1984-85. The goal of all women at that time, well, the goal, yes, almost, was to be thin. It was thin. You went to the gym, you see, the girls were all on cardio devices, just cardio devices. The guys were doing some weight training, the girls were doing cardio to be thinner or to stay thinner. And we were afraid to be a little fat. There were lots of models with very sharp faces,

too thin women. Then I started doing the RDS shows, it was called Superform, do you remember we had our black black shoes on the sand? We looked like we were in a hole. The famous ovals in rubber. But well, you know, I was anorexic at that time. I never really said it was not a case followed, you know, to diagnose, but I know Ben, too much.

We went there, we were shooting, I don't remember how many shows, we were shooting about fifty shows in a week. And we had to eat, we had to eat, we were training for a week like crazy, in the sun, in the heat. And one day I did a heat stroke, literally in the middle of shooting, with Isabelle Luotte in front of me, we were in a chronicle. Isabelle was more into the time of Tonus,

which was produced by TVA. You know when I really put my feet on TVA with Tonus. And Isabelle was doing a chronicle for each show, while we were sitting, we were in the sun. And we had all shot, we had finished our week of shows. So we went into Isabelle's capsules, you know, and we were face to were face to face, and Isabelle saw me, you know, as I was watching. And I left. I literally fell from my palms, a heat stroke. But I wasn't in shape. You know, I was badly hydrated, I was badly fed for a week because I was afraid of being too big, you know.

And I told you, I weighed 20 pounds less than today. And the number doesn't matter, but it's to tell you. How small you were. How, 20 pounds, you know. And it was never enough. I was never small enough. And that stayed very strong. A control.

Yes, control, appearance. Even today, I realize that If I look at Instagram accounts where I see ultra-lean girls, ultra-mine, I should say, is it impressing me? What does it do to me? It brings me back. There are little clicks that bring me back to that time when I was never quite thin. There was always a pressure that we put ourselves, that we put ourselves, that several women still put themselves today, completely. A lot, a lot.

And so, to return to my question, because I don't want to avoid it, even if I seem to avoid it, but I think it's related to that. In my head, I've never been thin enough. In my head, I've never been thin enough. In my head, I've never been... I know. But you still have some reactions today. Yes, yes. And I know, and I'm sure I told you that really honestly. And really, I'm not saying I'm fat, I don't think I'm fat.

It's not that. It's something... It's really innate. It's something that's very, very strong. You know, after the girls, it's like I have a little belly, and I'm like embarrassed that Normand sees my little belly. And then there's this part, and then on the other side, there's the other little character who says, but let's see, you know, you're in shape, you're in good health, you have energy. Let's see, you focus on the small percentage of fat, barely too high, you know, like it doesn't matter. It's not, it's not full, it's not conscious, I don't know how to explain it.

It's a bit like, no matter what body you have, you would have that kind of game. I would never be happy with your look. I would never be happy with your look. But I say that at the same time, since the time I was in the Minopause, I am more and more comfortable in my body. But at the same time, I wouldn't walk around naked in the living room, with all the lights on. You know, you understand? So I don't know, it comes from there.

I'm sure it comes from there, but it comes... It's like a personal story, but at the same time, I think that so many women who grew up in this pressure of, you're not big enough, you're not big enough, you're not... You're not that big enough. Well, we'll remember the covers of the magazines. She lost 10 books, she lost 5 books. Here's the Mirac secret, she lost, let's say, two inches of size, of a turd of size. Remember, with Michel Richard, all the magazines. I take her because she's a souvenir.

Yes, yes. And it's not a thousand years now. With such a product, I remember one, we saw it with a... A measuring gallon. A measuring gallon. I remember one where we saw it with a gallon to measure. The front, you know, all the shows, there's still some of that. Before, after, it's always impressive to watch, but it comes to mind all the time. Totally. And I'm sure there are plenty of women who could testify in the same way.

It's something that's remained despite the evolution of the discourse on this. Despite the chroniclers like me, for example, who say more and more, it's not that, what you need to do is build muscles, it's aging in health, aging with energy. But we still have this old concept of thinness that haunts us. It's really like a ghost, unpleasant. Yes, it's still what we want.

Completely. There are still lots of bullshit. I mean, it's not part of it. We evolve the mentality in acceptance, but when we look at what we are presented with, it's not that. It's not that. And I often tell people, I'm talking about conferences, I tell people, you're probably following accounts that upset you. You're watching pictures, you're watching pictures of, let's say influencers, and every time you see them, you're like, oh well, and you don't like the pressure that it imposes on you because you're being suggested or you're being sold a product, a food that will burn fat.

Hey, we are in 2025, can we stop hanging on to patterns like that? Can we stop thinking that there will be a miracle, that there will be a miracle product or a miracle machine? There won't be any, it's been centuries since we've been looking for this machine. It doesn't exist. So, more and more people are intelligent, are informed. Stay away from those accounts. Disabon yourself.

I'm disabonned from accounts of people, for example, who only talk about botox. I'm not capable. I'm tanned. I'm not capable of hearing about botox. I don't judge you if you do botox, but you don't need to talk about it. Why do you have to talk about it? Why do you have to do a TV show about it?

That's not what we want to hear. What we need to hear is the importance of discovering the pleasure of moving. I know I'm moving away, but it's all linked to the pressure we have. I mean, everything that is plastic surgery, botox or injections, I will surely do it at some point, but it's not your business. It's not the auditors' business. I don't need to talk about it publicly. You know why? Because our young girls, Marie-Claude, they are influenced, they have the pressure to improve at 25 years old the... how do you say it? The pulp of their lips, the size of their lips. Yes, yes, yes. Because, you know, do botox right away,

because your ribs will settle down, and if you don't do it right away, it will be too late. Let's see. No, I know. Let them discover that. It's okay, everyone will discover that, but it will rather influence them on the aspect of physical activity nutritional aspects.

Yes, several years ago I had put down a project that didn't work, but I thought we were going to grow old in two speeds. Oh yes! That's true! That was in 2012 that I remembered, because I was telling myself, it's like growing old in two speeds. It's that there is some, the appearance will be more frozen in time, and there are others, there will be an evolution of age, but inside, we will age. You know, I mean, our life experiences accumulate.

You know, everything accumulates in life, but we don't want that. You know, I was wondering, I think it was in 2012, the first time I had deposited it, it was how we will live in our head by telling others, here's the age I have, which is a frozen age, but not inside. Yes, that's it. You're going to want to go. There's a difficult logic to grasp. Yes, and it's going to stay there, all that. I'm not against anything, I'm like you.

There's still a reflection to be had. And it's true that we can be influenced, and it's true that with all the care that comes to us, we can say, hey, that's what suits me, and that's okay. But to camouflage who we are inside, I think we have to be careful. We have to show who we are and not give a perception of what we are not. I agree. Through everything we can do. In any case, we understand each other.

There is a lot of pressure. But it comes back to what you said about nudity. Imagine if we have the misery to show these vertical words that come out every day, that are there, that show that I'm getting older, that show that my experience is getting longer. You know, it's for sure that when you start focusing on it, imagine the rest of the body. It's for sure.

There are choices to make. It's a big discomfort. You're not feeling well. I see people sometimes so comfortable with their bodies. It's a great discomfort. It's not good. I sometimes see people so comfortable with their bodies. And I say to myself, wow, there's freedom in this possession of the body. Totally. Totally. That's what I wish. I look at my daughters or friends of my daughters in swimsuits, bikinis. They are beautiful, they are comfortable, they are good.

It's extraordinary that this pressure is not there to hide because maybe they don't have the thighs of such a model on Instagram. But they are so smart, they don't follow these models. They have to make choices. There are choices to make at some point in your evolution as a young adult. Who am I going to let influence me in a certain way? Who am I going to follow? Who am I going to listen to? We see that you were influenced by yourself and it stayed. Yes, it's very strong. Imagine if you are 25 years old and you are already making injections to have surreal lips. Normally, he goes crazy when they see that.

But why? What are you going to do in 30 years? It's the last of their worries, and it's not my business. But it's just that this pressure will always be there, this concern of the appearance. I'm going to tell you an anecdote. Actually, it's not funny. One day, for two girls, I was doing a topo in the morning.

I went to the Rivière des Prairies hospital. There's a center for young people who are dependent. It's a center for those with symptoms. Of the game. This kind of person, someone who's not 18, but who doesn't sleep, who communicates with people at night, who stops eating, who stops going to school.

You have to bring them back in a routine. There were also young girls I met who had an Instagram addiction. Addiction. Yes. And then you say. Tu comprends? Oui. Donc ils corrigeaient tout leur corps et l'image qu'elles projetaient était une image fausse d'elle mais c'était une image espérée. Donc ces jeunes filles-là commandaient plein de produits pour So these young girls ordered lots of products to try again because they were afraid to go out. Because this image wasn't the one they showed, so they tried to reproduce this image. You understand, you're not 18, in which circle you entered. And you know that there are still several who, throughout the world, have taken their lives because of that.

The American Senate met with a meta after that. But I still talked to these young girls on the corner of a bed in a room where they were there for at least three weeks, and I had never realized the gravity of the filters, of these images where we metamorphose to resemble something that does not exist in real life. And to say, how do we manage to put that equal? When we don't have a solution, well, it becomes people who get locked up, people who spend all their money. Who are literally hidden. Yes, so very quickly, it's the desensit being made aware of on Instagram, among other things in this case. Wow. And it really made me think about, oh boy, it's sad.

But how long has it been? I did that a few years ago. Because it doesn't stop growing? It doesn't stop growing. At the moment, it must be 5 years. It's still being used. There is really a line that you can't go beyond. But it's true that you can't face the public

after, or even your family, who follow you, for example. But I think people are comfortable in their nudity. I'm proud too. I think it's beautiful. I wonder if one day I will be able to do that. The other time, Janet Bertrand told us in the podcast that she gave her mother her bath when she was young. She now asks her daughters, sometimes she says, you will give me my bath. Because to touch it, because of the intimacy it creates, and she says to see a body of 100 years, that's a body of 100 years.

That's what it feels like. She doesn't say it's worse than that. It's beautiful. Is that beautiful? Is it beautiful? I was like, oh, one day I'll get to that. It's beautiful. To allow this incivility.

To allow this incivility. It's really an being of acceptance. Really, really. It's beautiful. It's not because she's not capable. Look, I'm giving you a moment of intimacy. We're going to do that together. I was like, my God, it's beautiful. It's very impressive. You see your question, Eros, how beautiful the answer is.

I love it. It's beautiful. I'm happy. So the question, Optoraiso, the one who always ends this podcast in softness, when you look back at your life, what are you most proud of? Oh, it's beautiful.

Of my family. It's really my family. Yes, my career, but career, you know, what is that? It's my family. I've talked about it for a long time, I think, but career, you know, what is that? It's my family. I've talked about it for a long time, I think, but my daughters. But you know, I don't know if you're the one who's already talked about it. I'm not sure about that, but it's going to mean something. Someone once said, we don't have the right, I found that very intense, to be proud of our children.

You know, when sometimes you put a publication of your daughter who, I don't know, who is receiving a diploma, and then you write, I am proud of my daughter, you know. And she said, we can't be proud of our children because they don't belong to us. But then I'm like, wow. I think we can be proud of our daughters, of our children, of our family, of what we have in some way influenced. We have been present for our children, we have found it important to always feel free to make choices. And I remember a concrete example, the secondary school and even the CIS for both, it wasn't fun at school, my girls. It was going well. We were touching wood, you know, like it was going well.

The grades were very, very, very correct. It was pretty easy, you know, to... But it wasn't fun, you know. And you know, we were saying, yeah, but you know, it's okay, you know, the effort you're making today will allow you to be free later. You know, we were so much emphasis on that. Your role as a parent.

That's it. It's easy to fall into a little bit of pressure too. We didn't do that. And we're both really proud of that. Leanne is an artist. Today she finished graphic design and she worked on Marie-Claude in Sibol. I'm going to, in good French. Because you know what artists are, you know them, you're one of them.

It's harder to be in a university setting. And Lucas' program is so intense, and Laurent's is so intense. And we were looking at it and we were crossing our fingers, until the end. But we understood at some point that what we had done in advance, what we had said, and the absence of pressure, to do what you can, but remember that it will allow you to choose one day. And we reminded them to what extent, They saw the pleasure we had in our work, in our careers.

And I think that was also a sort of influence. So, yeah, I think that what I'm most proud of is my family. It's how they fly high. As I said earlier, I like the voices of my family. It's how they fly. How they fly high, as I said earlier. I like to see them like eagles. They miss me because sometimes they fly far away. But the family with Joanne, with Luc, with my parents, you know, it's... I have no regrets. I find that my parents, where they come from, and we often say it anyway,

they must be so proud of the values that we have developed, that we have passed on to our daughters, and that they continue to be passed on to maybe another generation. Thank you Josée Lavigueur. Hey, I had a great time. I'm the one who said a huge thank you. You're extraordinary. Thank you Marie-Claude. And now you have a lot of comments. Yeah, I don't know.

Comments are always good. Yes, absolutely. Don't worry about that. Thank you for your generosity. It was a real joy. I learned things. It's very touching in many ways. Oh yeah? Well, I'm really happy. Thank you for this very good moment. Let's say that the question of Patreon, it's rare that I'm emotional like this. It's true. In a podcast, really. Thank you for your generosity.

Thank you for your welcome. And thank you to everyone for being there and we'll see you in the next podcast. Bye bye. Thank you for your generosity. Thank you for having me. Thank you for being here. See you in the next podcast. Bye bye. This episode was presented by Karine Jonquas, the reference in care for the skin in Quebec, and by the Marie-Club, a space dedicated to the best-being. The table games Open Your Game, original edition and couple edition, are available everywhere in stores and on Randolph.ca