Ouvre ton jeu avec Marie-Claude Barrette - #98 Pascale Renaud-Hébert | Ouvre ton jeu avec Marie-Claude Barrette

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

Pascale est arrivée en studio en me montrant une photo où nous étions ensemble, elle avait 7 ans! Le fait de l’avoir connu si jeune fait en sorte que je ne manque rien de son parcours professionnel. J’ai une grande admiration pour la femme qu’elle est.Une rencontre où on apprend beaucoup sur cette femme, amoureuse, actrice, réalisatrice, scriptrice et tellement plein d’autres choses.━━━━━━━━━━━00:00:00 - Introduction00:22:32 - Cartes vertes00:41:56 - Cartes jaunes01:10:38 - Cartes rouges01:25:02 - Cartes Eros01:43:54 - Carte Opto-Réseau━━━━━━━━━━━L'épisode est également disponible sur Patreon, Spotify, Apple Podcasts et les plateformes d'écoute en ligne.Vous aimez Ouvre ton jeu? C'est à votre tour d'ouvrir votre jeu avec la version jeu de société. Disponible dès maintenant partout au Québec et au https://www.randolph.ca/produit/ouvre-ton-jeu-fr/?srsltid=AfmBOoo3YkPk-AkJ9iG2D822-C9cYxyRoVXZ8ddfCQG0rwu2_GneuqTT Visitez mon site web : https://www.marie-claude.com et découvrez l'univers enrichissant du MarieClub, pour en apprendre sur l'humain dans tous ses états et visionner les épisodes d'Ouvre ton jeu, une semaine d’avance. ━━━━━━━━━━━ Ouvre ton jeu est présenté par Karine Joncas, la référence en matière de soins pour la peau, disponible dans près de 1000 pharmacies au Québec. Visitez le https://www.karinejoncas.ca et obtenez 15% de rabais avec le code ouvretonjeu15.Grâce à Éros et compagnie et notre niveau rose, obtenez 15% avec le code rose15 au https://www.erosetcompagnie.com/?code=rose15Merci également à Opto-Réseau, nouveau partenaire d'Ouvre ton jeu. Visitez le https://www.opto-reseau.com pour prendre rendez-vous dans l'une de leurs 85 cliniques.

Hello everyone, welcome to Ouvre ton jeu, always a pleasure to meet you again. I want to read you comments right away. By the way, you are many to write to us every week and every comment is read. And I always hope that our guests read them too because it gives so much meaning to everything they say in front of me, to read to you, to how much it helps people. It's also fun, it makes you meet new people. There are a lot of people who say, I started listening to it, I wasn't sure, and finally I finished it and I discovered someone.

That's a big compliment. There is Josée here who speaks of Alexandre Ossant alias Mona de Grenoble, and she says adorable. I am 62 years old and I am always very impressed to see six young people being so passionate, conscious, committed. This is not my case despite my age. I always over-adapt myself too much.

In short, beautiful human this Alexandre. Thank you for this wonderful meeting. You have been numerous to talk to us about over-adaptation. It's a theme that made sure that some people understood what it meant to be over-adapted and to what extent it could be decisive in our lives. We have Francine who says, it's always enlightening and enriching to listen to the life journey of the guest who reveals himself when we find almost all of a sudden a part of his story that joins us, touches us and speaks to us. Thank you, Mr. Denis Bouchard, for letting us

have your little paradise corner for a few hours to offer us this beautiful moment with generosity. I can just tell you that Denis, after his passage here, it was the first time he participated in a podcast, called me and said, maybe I talked too much, I don't know what to think. I talked about a lot of things I had never mentioned, stories, I had never told this story. And finally, as I felt insecure, I asked the team to send him the episode before we broadcast it. The episode of Ouvre ton jeu.

Finally, he left me a great message saying, don't change anything, everything is perfect. When I hear it in his ensemble, everything has its own charm. And I found that very generous. So he left everything he had said. But Denis Bouchard is really someone to discover. together, everything has its own They are all there or on podcast broadcast channels, all episodes are there. I would like to tell you that the new game, Open Your Game, is a game of tables that speaks to couples, that addresses couples and also to those who have their first meetings, their first meetings sometimes where we don't know too much, we don't want to be mean,

we don't dare to ask too many questions. The game can help you. We have a series of questions for these first meetings. Obviously, several questions for couples. The big challenge is to know how to listen. Sometimes, in a relationship, that's what's more difficult. If you're interested in coming to see us on stage, because we're going will do several Open Your Game on stage in the coming months. Go to www.ouvretonjeuxsurscène.ca. You will see the guests, the dates, if you are available. Come and see us. It is still an experience that is completely different from doing Open Your Game in front of the public. And maybe you will come on stage because before the guest arrives, I'll have people from the room come on stage to answer a question.

It becomes an Open Your Game, we pick your names on purpose, and then you come to meet me. So we're waiting for you in large numbers. Meet you on openyourgameonstage.ca. Our partners, Marie-Club, Espace Bien-Être, Espace mieux Être, sorry, and vous intéresse de faire partie de cette grande communauté qui est le Marie-Claude, vous pouvez vous rendre sur marie-claude.com et si vous décidez d'y aller avec un abonnement annuel, le code promo CLUB10 et vous aurez 10% de rabets. Karen Jean-Claude, who is the main partner of Ouvre Ton Jeu, offers you 15% of rabets if you go to do online purchases. And the promo code Ouvre Ton Jeu. 15. Access special promotions and exclusive rabets by booking a home demonstration with Eros and Companier. Because Eros is one of our partners, you know,

we have the pink level, which is the Eros and Companier level. So you can go to their website and if you do online purchases, they offer you the promo code ROSE15, which is for 15% discount. And I remind you that Optoraiso, which is also a partner, because we also have this question, Optoraiso, you save $100 on purchasing progressive glasses with high precision, only in clinics, and hurry up because it's until March 31. I remind you that we are available on Patreon, which is really a podcast broadcasting channel

where there are a lot of people who are there with their podcasts. You have it one week in advance. There is no advertising if you are interested. Go to Patreon, open your game and you will get the offers we make. And also, the Marie-Club episodes are there one week in advance without advertising. So, that's what we have for our partners. Now, I want to thank the team. Caroline Dionne for the coordination, David Bourgeois for the online presentation, Jonathan Frichette for digital creation, Etienne Collard for the capture, Jérémie Boucher for social networks.

And today, I've known her since she was very young. I've known her family, I know how much she's a woman who still has a lot to offer us. But to know someone very young and to have her emancipate and flourish like that in the artistic world. I find that very touching for me to see her shine that way. And I haven't spoken to her in a long time, so I'm really, really happy to receive her today. I'm talking to you about Pascale, Renaud and Baird. So, they're the guests of this podcast. So, I leave all the space to Pascale.

And I have a lot of friends around me who told me, not just friends, but women around me, mothers who told me, I love my children, and imagining myself without them, it's impossible. I imagine that my children are no longer there, and I have a hole in my heart. But I could imagine a life without children,

and it would suit me. And I have to admit that it's beyond making me say, it's the child, it's the child, it's the child, it's the child. Of course, you have children, you have a baby in the nipple, you have time to eat, you have time to wash, you have... It's full of periods. That's it. Where are these debates?

But this very rational idea that life can also be without children, and it can be very beautiful, it's like it's new for me to hear that. Open Your Game is presented by Karine Jonquas, la référence en matière de soins pour la peau disponible dans près de 1000 pharmacies au Québec, et par le Marie-Claude, qui est un espace consacré aux mieux-êtres où on y retrouve plus d'une centaine de classes de maîtres dirigées par des experts disponibles sur marie-claude.com. Les jeux de table ouvre ton jeu original et l'édition couple sont disponibles partout au Québec et sur Randolph.ca.

Aujourd'hui, je suis vraiment fière de recevoir cette jeune femme-là. Je l'ai connue, elle était, je vous dis, à peu près haute comme ça, peut-être un peu moins. C'est une fille qu'on voit à peu près partout. On la voit devant les écrans, elle travaille aussi derrière. Elle fait plein d'entrevues un peu partout, puis à the screens, she also works behind the scenes. She does a lot of interviews everywhere, and every time I find her super inspiring. I really feel like she's a girl who will be in the artistic landscape for several years. I'm talking about Pascale Renaud-Hébert. Welcome Pascale!

Thank you, Marie-Claude! I got your name right! Yes! I had some trouble, it looks like with Renaud and Bert, yet it's a name I've known for a long time. Listen, you're really beautiful to see. Ah, it's fine. I mean, you evolve in all spheres.

Do you feel free? Because you do so many different things. I feel free. I do a lot of business. I feel really blessed too. When I finished high school, I did a bachelor's degree at UQAM in production strategy. Then I worked on TV as a production coordinator for a year and a half. I wasn't very happy, so I went to do my studies at the conservatory. I was in Quebec for three years in a row.

And already, it seems like taking that cette décision-là, tu sais, j'avais 22, 23 quand je rentrais à l'école de théâtre, tu sais, comme si déjà prendre cette décision-là, je mesure encore plus la chance que j'ai parce que j'ai fait un choix drastique à un moment de ma vie. J'ai complètement changé. J'ai fait vraiment ce que j'avais envie de faire. Parce que t'aurais pu faire une carrière. Ah, bien oui. Comme productrice en CD, là. Bien oui, complètement. Mais oui, si j'avais juste continué, tu sais, puis aussi je pense I did what I really wanted to do. Because you could have done a career as a self-employed producer.

Yes, completely. But if I had just continued. And I think that every time we start in a environment, it's maybe more difficult. I would have ended up finding my account, but there was really a call for art. When I wanted to do that, to make that decision and take a risk, finally,

it made that today, as soon as I finished school, it's like if I say to myself, I'm so lucky, so quickly I started writing. I didn't have a job as an actress, so I started writing theater and making stage plays. So what makes that now, because at the beginning, by obligation, we'll say, or by default,

if you want, I started writing and making stage staging, and I love it. But now I have several strings in my bow. And it makes me very happy because I don't think I would feel so satisfied if I just did one thing. Do you remember the day you decided to go to the National Theatre School? I remember having a discussion with my husband, Nico, Nicolas Ouellet. I was with him since college. I was 21 when we started going out together.

I remember having a discussion with him where I said, I'm not feeling well, I don't think that's what I want to do. He said, do your aud I'll do it. I don't think that's what I want to do. And he said, do your auditions. Do it. And then I said OK. And then I did my auditions, but I didn't talk about it much around me. Because it's like I was a little embarrassed.

It's like I didn't find it a loser. I don't mean to say that, but there was a part, I think I was afraid in the end of the failure, that it didn't work, and then having to tell the end of failure, that it didn't work, and then having to tell the world, yeah, but that's it, it didn't work. So, Nico knew a few friends and that's really a key moment in my life, in my decision. And you never regretted that decision?

Oh my God, never, never, never. And it's that I, very young, c'est ça que je voulais faire. Je voulais être comédienne. Je voulais être comédienne ou gardienne d'enfant, c'était comme mes deux sessions. Je sais pas pourquoi. Pis à un moment donné, en vieillissant, quand au secondaire, je me suis mise à faire de l'impro, c'était très présent à moi, je veux faire ça, je signais des autographes à ma mère. Pis à un moment donné, je suis devenue comme très, très impliquée à l'école, I signed autographs for my mother. At one point, I became very involved in school and a lot in the organization.

It's as if this dream of mine became a little... It's as if I quickly said to myself, it's your child's business. So I did my studies after that at the Cégep in communication, then I went to university in communication, as if it wasn't for me, that thing, to be a comedian. Because you don't have people in your family either, who come from that field, from the artistic world. No, no, I don't have anyone. But you know, I went to the LNI every week, high school,

and my parents, they made me books until I was in Montreal, they waited for me throughout the game in their return. They came to see my theater or improv shows. But you didn't pass auditions. After high school, no. I didn't even go to the theater in Cégep in an orélette program. I went back to communication. It's like... I have the impression that children are extremely connected to their instincts. I'm hungry, I eat, I'm tired, I sleep,

I'm not happy, I scream or I cry. But it seems that the older we get, it's as if we shut that instinct away. We do it sooner, and we learn, I find, quite quickly in our lives, not necessarily listening to the instinct. It's a lot of what we have to do, and how we have to do things.

You need to have good grades, you need to succeed, you need to have friends. I'm a very good student. It's like this structure, I understood that this is what you needed to do. Which makes it seem like I completely disconnected from my instinct that said to me,

that's what you want to do, you want to be a comedian. Until the point where I did my studies, I did my DEC, I did my BAC, I worked on TV, you know, I was miserable like the stones. And then, at some point, I also, quickly in my life, I had the impression of being a bit of a stumbling block. I don't know why. When I was 10 years old, I was crying, I was crying bit of a I'm already 30, I'm 10 years old. Yes, it's weird. You find that it goes by quickly.

Imagine when I'm 22, I have my baccalaureate, I could have my career, and then I say to myself, ah, I'm going to the conservatory. So it asked me, in my nature, how I did it, it asked me to be really connected to myself and to my instinct, and to do what I really want. So it's impossible today that I regret this decision.

First of all, I'm so excited about my work. And I feel like I'm in my place. Ah, you have so much air in your place. I feel the same way. Yeah, yeah, because I feel like you've arrived in the middle, and we've seen you everywhere. Did you go fast? No.

Ok, it's like an impression we have. Well, I think it's a bit like that, that it works for a lot of people. I finished my studies at the conservatoire in Quebec in 2014, so it's been 11 years. So the first years, I worked a lot in Quebec, I wrote plays, I did staging. Then in 2016, I did M'entendu with Florence, and I had a role in M'entendu.

But I didn't feel like I was exploding all of a sudden. Then after that, because of M'entendu, I had a small role in Underdra. And a small role in S'en Rendez-vous. And then, these two roles, which were supposed to be one episode, came back in the subsequent seasons. After that, I worked as a screenwriter with a production company called Pass Ego. I had worked on season 2 of Pour toujours plus un jour. And at one point, I told the producers, I said,

Patrick, I say hi, I said, I just want to tell you, I'm an actress and I'd like to play that. So if one day you think of me, I'd be very happy. And a few months later, they called me and he told the team, the producers at Passégo and the producers. And a few months later, they called me to come and do an audition for Chouchou, to play the sister to Evelyn. So it's like a lot of little things that add up, and really the moment when it exploded,

I would say, it's really with, well there was the conjecture, stat, I come to you, watch over me. So it's been maybe two years that it's like in a boil, but I've always had work, that said. But you don't wait after others to get you work? No, I don't wait for others. I've always been like that. I finished the conservatory, I wrote things, I put them up, I played in them. That's the point I find very inspiring in your story.

You develop, you do business, and then you look at if it works or not. But already doing it for you, it's important. You don't necessarily expect what it's going to give you at the end of the road. No, no, no, no. Doing it is already a learning process. Yes, yes, and that's in my nature. I've also been anxious in life. Sometimes it's become very handicap, but more often than not, it was an engine. Exactly. Not waiting.

I can't wait. I can't be in a position to wait. It makes me so anxious. So it becomes an engine for me. And you know, sometimes what I find, it's because sometimes I tell myself, well, no, I'm not waiting. But at the same time, I tell myself,

I still have the luxury of not waiting because I can write. I have this interest. You know, if I didn't have this interest to write, what do you want to do? There is also that, how I am made in my nature, it's part of me. I want to do a lot of things, I'm curious. Yes, but you write and then you go present them, you write, do you understand? Yes, that's it.

It takes courage sometimes when you write. Yes, because I often say no. People also have the impression that everything works. Not everything. I finished M'entendu in 2020. First, while I was doing M'entendu, I was doing M'entendu with Florence. Florence L'Entrée. I was playing in it and I wrote some things on the side. I wrote a little on Pour toujours, plus un jour, saison 2, etc.

But when it finished M'entends-tu, j'avais pas pensé à prévoir la suite. J'avais pas vraiment de projet. Quand ça a fini, j'ai développé des projets. Depuis 2020, j'ai dû développer. Je peux même pas le dire. Je sais pas combien il y a de projets au paradis des projets, que je suis allée

présenter au diffuseur, puis je me suis fait dire non partout. Là, tu fais, bon, mais écoute, on s'est fait well, listen, we were told no everywhere, so this one is in the trash. And then you start again. And sometimes you've gone to stages, you've written two episodes, because there's a broadcaster who said, because you also have to say how it works, is that you develop a project, you go see a producer, you say, I have this project, perfect, we work a little on it and then we'll see the different broadcasters. TVA, BEL, Radio-Canada, there's Série Plus too, and then you present your project.

And if they say yes, but they don't say yes, we're going to do that in a year. They say yes, you can write a bible that we call, so a summary of the season, of the characters, and then let's put two episodes. But it's not guaranteed that it will work. Sometimes at the end of these steps, you're being told, no, finally it's not guaranteed that it will work. Sometimes, at the end of those steps, you say, no, it's not for us, we stop the development. So it's still... So there are costs to be taken. Still, there are refusals and it requires... In any case, I learned not to take it personally,

because there are also auditions, you audition and it doesn't work. But it's rarely personal. In fact, it's never personal. This learning has helped me a lot. Now it's like when it's not, I go to another call. But there have been a lot of, for real, I could say 15, 20 projects that are just what I thought... or that I thought about, that I worked on, that it didn't work.

And at the same time, it makes you meet people. Really. It makes you... We never do anything for nothing. No, no, no, no. And I also... First, we never do anything for nothing, but also my work...

I work as an actress, director, screenwriter, but as a screenwriter, my job is to write. And if I'm in development, a screenwriter, a screenwriter, but as a screenwriter, my job is to write. And if I'm developing with a broadcaster and I can write two episodes, I'm winning my life. Okay, maybe it won't come true, but it's not less than I'm winning my life with my job. I'm not doing something, a sideline, to be able to pay my rent. And that's really a chance too. Bravo. It's really...

You know, I think it's good to hear that. Because sometimes we hesitate. We hesitate to knock on the door. You know, we're often afraid of a refusal. And then you realize, but what's the impact of a refusal? What did you do already if you refused? Well, yes, at least you got into action. Yes, you got into action.

And I've never been afraid of that. But that's really my education. I had parents who taught me very young to express myself, to express my emotions, to express my dissatisfactions, my joys, and to affirm myself. That's one thing that comes from my education. And I've never been afraid, never, of taking the phone, of asking for something, of writing a mail.

So it's made me, you know, I've been ignored often. I've been told no many times, but it's not less so that it's like that. In the end, it's like if one day I said to myself, well, I'm putting 40 lines in the water. There's a lot of people one day who will die. Well, yeah. So that's it. So I put 40 lines in the water. There's a lot of money going to die. So I think that's one of the greatest qualities that my parents have passed on to me. It's really not being embarrassed to ask.

And to engage in what we do. And to engage completely. So here's the game. Because we're going to start opening your game. The green questions in a generic order. The yellow questions are more specific. The red questions are in a generic order. The yellow questions are more specific. The red questions are more personal. The pink question is the erotic and companion level.

So sensual or sexual, depending on what you want to answer. The question of Toro and Zo, I think it's always the sweet question that closes this encounter well, you open your game. You have a joker, if you think that at some point, the sub-questions are going too far, you don't have time for that. You put it on the table and I'll move on to another question. Perfect. So you're going to put the cards on the table. You give me five. And I'm going to read them to you. You choose one.

She? You're going to answer them and then I'm going to choose one. Did you throw that one away? No, I gave it to you. Okay. She, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, What character traits did you have to work with? Which person made a difference in your life? Now I choose the one I answer. Are you going to answer just one? After that, I'm going to choose one. You're going to answer two.

I think I want to answer which person made a difference in my life. Because it's a group of people, and there are obviously a thousand of them, we can hear it. My grandparents, my grandmother, my grandmother, my grandmother, it's still a crazy young man. But I want to talk about teachers. Because in my career, I've had very, very good teachers, and teachers who have pushed me to surpass myself. And who have really gave me confidence in myself. From elementary school to high school, I really met good teachers.

Let's say a teacher in fifth grade, Anne Laplante, she made us write a book during our school year, a little book, but it's like the first that got me in touch with writing. Then, in high school, I met my first drama teacher, Sylvie Cloutier. She got me in touch with theater, theater writing. We wrote a little sketch, we did high school in show performance, we went to the regional final. At that time, for me, it was incredible. After that, my teacher in drama, Philippe Charon, he contacted me with the improvisation.

Thanks to him, I started doing improvisation. I got interested in the LNI, I went to the National Ligue d'Improvisation, I spentai passé mon adolescence là-bas, j'étais complètement fan. Là après ça, au cégep, j'ai des profs, Pascal Fontaine, Pierre Fontaine, les deux Pères Fontaine, Eric Monpetit, des enseignants qui m'ont mis en contact avec le cinéma, mais aussi qui m'ont, dans ce programme-là, disons, fallait qu'on écrive des critiques, fallait qu'on écrive des essais sur des films. Puis un de mes profs, Eric Monpetit, had three subjects. One day, I went to see him and I said, I have another idea. Could I write my essay on this subject?

He said, yes, go ahead. I had teachers who took me for who I was, and they didn't try to put me in a box or bring me back to a path that was ideal for them. It's like... and that... and we were talking about not being afraid to ask and all that. It's for sure that when you meet teachers, it's so important the time you spend at school in your life. important le temps que tu passes à l'école dans ta vie. Quand tu rencontres des enseignants qui te donnent confiance, puis qui t'encouragent à sortir de ta zone de confort, à tromper, mais ça c'est fondamental dans l'adulte que tu deviens. Au conservatoire j'avais un prof, Michel Nadeau, c'était mon prof au conservatoire, puis ensuite il est devenu directeur artistique d'un théâtre à Québec, Michel Nadeau was my teacher at the conservatory, and then he became the art director of a theater in Quebec.

So I presented shows at a theater called Premier Act for the relève. Then Michel programmed two of my shows in his theater. So it's as if I'm unable to separate my professional career from my academic career. And the teachers I've met, I find myself very lucky to have met these teachers. It's like they've unlocked levels. Really. They've removed barriers every time they bring you there or kill you today. I'm not sure that teachers are so aware.

It's really difficult jobs, it's very demanding. I think it can be very discouraging sometimes. I'm not sure if some are aware of the place they occupy in someone's life and what they do to be born. I'm not sure they are always aware of that. Because it's true that you name them, I don't know if you have already told them in person. Well, a few, but Anne Laplante,

I often talked about her. She wrote to me every time. Because the first time I talked about her, it was... She had a show and I said, I think I typed Cénar. And she wrote to me, Let's see, Pascal, you didn't type Cénar at all, at all, at all. Because I was, you know, when I was a child, I think I was a bit of a wimp. And she wrote to me, Pascal, you weren't a wimp at all, at all, at all. Because I was, you know, when I was a child,

I think I was a little bit of a wimp. Wimp in the sense that curious, is that it? You let nothing go, you asked questions. Yes, and you know, I wanted to be with the adults. Well, you knew me, after all. Well, yes. You know, so I was a little bit like, I want to be at the table of the greats and...

But we look alike on that. Ah, well, you see. I've always liked more, you know, like, well, not liked more, but when I went to be at the table of the greats. But we look alike. I always liked it more, not more, but when I went to my friends' house, I was more at their mother's table, cooking. I wanted to listen, to hear, to understand what I was doing, the things that had happened at school. And you, how are you? I liked that, those things. But waiting for my mom, my grandmother, who's in the kitchen, it was like,

oh my God. But one day my father told me, because I was, I could become a little overwhelming, you know, it's like adult-panda, and then you have the little one who's there and who wants to do it. And he told me, what, we should find a code, you know, sometimes it becomes too much, we should find a code that I could say and that the others wouldn't be. And then, you know, I had said, Rose. If the code is Rose, I was like, it's good, you know, it's so subtle, nobody understands. So there we are in a Pascal Rose soup. Perfect.

It was like, let the adults talk. But your parents always talked to you like an adult. Oh my God, yes. That's it too. Really. You didn't have parents who were like, not infantilized, but you have parents, I have the impression, who didn't have... How can I say that? Because I know your father, among other things. It's telling you the real things.

Yes, exactly. By telling you, she will understand with what she has to understand them. Yes, and the parental relationship has always been clear, but there was still an equality in the conversation. That is, we talk about equal to equal. Your opinion mattered. Yes, exactly. Yes, really. And I explain something to you, I don't take you from above, I explain it to you as it is.

That has really been my dynamic with my parents. Well, you see, my son, at one point, he went to friends' when he was in primary school. It was a long time ago. And he told me, their parents, the adults don't look me in the eye when they talk to me. They say, it's like I didn't exist. Oh yeah.

I say, oh yeah, it's true. Maybe we've always done that by saying that, whether it's children or adults, it's the same. It's a human being who sometimes has less references to understand, but he understands what he has to understand. Completely. Really. Yes, yes. And children, I think we underestimate

what they understand too. Sometimes we have the impression that, you know Sometimes I hear parents or adults say, « They don't understand. » No, they understand. They understand. In any case, children, it must be how I was raised, but I hold on to the fact that children understand 40% more than I think they understand.

Yes, that's it. And you haven't been protected in the words? No. I mean, preserved, but not... You weren't in a unicorn world? No, not at all. The question you chose,

on which traits did you have to work? Oh my God, rejection issues. Oh yeah, you've lived that? Well, yes, when I was in primary school, I still lived through rejection. You know, I was often the... And it's maybe related to the kind of child I was, you know, very volatile. But I was often the one in the gang of friends who said, well, we don't want to be your friend anymore.

You know, I was often like... In primary school, a lot, you know, often been like, at the beginning, you know, and I think it's a mark, you know, it's a form of intimidation that's... that marks... But that you live alone too. Yes, yes, and there was a form of shame too, you know, I didn't talk about it much at home about that thing. I think I didn't want to worry about my parents, you know, like...

And yes, a form of shame. It's a bit humiliating. I didn't talk about it when it happened. I was struggling to buy back my friendships. What can I do? That's something I've been dragging in my life. And I still hang out today. Hey, as a teenager, sometimes I was very close to friends. We were a little gang in high school. And if I was lucky enough to go for a coffee together without being invited,

I could blow out the candles, shout, it's not done! It was super lucky for my friends. And then, at one point, when I was maybe six or eight, I started consulting myself, and I was maybe 18, I started to look into it. And I worked a lot on that. And it's something I'm still working on today. And obviously, I don't live it the same way anymore.

And I don't have that explosion in me anymore. But what it's going to look for, like the child who was rejected in school, it brings me back there directly. It's like a simple trip. But how did you live that? When I was little? Yes. Well, that's it. I think I felt, it made me feel very sad. I felt very humiliated.

But you were moving on your own? Yes. I was moving on my own. Let's say one week, two weeks on the afternoon. I had a friend who was still my friend, but you know, it was like I didn't have to say it. But after that, I still want to nuance because I wasn't... You know, there are children who are victims of severe and serious intimidation. It wasn't like that. No, no, I understand the nuance. It was really a little bit of a...

But it's because, you know, it's with girls... You know, those shenanigans, it's because... I like that you talk about it. Because it's not anonymous in life. I mean, it's not a visible intimidation necessarily, but it affects trust in itself. It's super pernicious, you know, it's like... Because that's how you were blamed for one of your character traits.

And it was very hard to understand. It's not like I wasn't a mean little girl. You know, I wasn't... It's not like I wasn't nice to others, and then one day it came back to me, and then I rejected you. It wasn't that. So it was very hard for me to understand.

Was it your intensity? Maybe. My intensity... You know, I'm still the kind of person to say... No, but that's't work for me. But I wasn't saying that when I was little. You wanted your opinion. Yes, that's it. And surely, like a child,

my mother, you see, she told me the other day that she was being told by friends, she needs you to... He thought I was taking too much space, that I was taking too much. And my mother said, she has a temperament of a leader, and that's something that's taking hold. If I learn to shut down that thing now,

she's going to lose it. So you have to frame it, but you have to let it experiment too. And I think there was maybe that, you know, a difficulty in controlling that temperament that I had. So maybe sometimes I was too rough with the kids or I wanted to lead the parents too much.

I don't know, I don't remember, but I know that it didn't deserve that, that ruckus. And yes, it's a mark. Yes, it's a risk because it's like, one, what it does is that as a child, you become on your guard. What is it? You have to not...

Is it okay if I say that? It's going to bother you. But it also makes you drag this thing. And I have people around me. I introduce myself, he introduces me to a friend, and then that friend becomes my friend, and then I go to dinner with that friend. There is no problem.

The person will never tell me. Me, I introduce you to a friend, you're just going to have dinner with her and you don't invite me. I have to talk to her. Even today? Oh yes, I have to talk to her. I don't do what I did when I was 17, 15, take the phone and blow a fuse.

But I talk to her. I tell myself, it's okay, it's not against you, you're okay, people love you. You know, there's really like, I think it's a trait of character or at least an injury for me that I hold. I think that I would have liked, in any case I would have believed that when I got older, it would have gone completely away. And it's like I'm like, hey, after that... You're still living it a little bit. Well, every time, yes, that's it. It's like... Even if I'm able to reassure myself now, I don't know if I've done therapy, I mean,

for my anxiety and other things, but that's a challenge we've addressed. And one year, it's like I did, oh, listen, it'll never go away, I think. So, I won't have to try to get it to go away, I'll have to understand how to live with it. And in your case, does it become a challenge? A challenge too? It was a challenge more at the beginning. Because me, before Nico,

I had a chum from 17 to 20, you know? A chum very steady, you know, very, very little lady, very little gentleman, our business. Very young. Really, yes, yes. So I got into my relationship with Nico a little bit like that, and he had never had a blonde. And he is very independent, so it was like, and now, wow.

So, me, my injuries, it's rejection, or my or my fragility is going to be that. And for him, his fragility is really more someone who tries to... someone who wants too much, someone who wants to merge. Yes, who wants to merge, exactly. So, it was completely incompatible because what came to me... I'm just triggering in my head... What was coming to me, it made me have a behavior with him that was coming to me to look for exactly what was wrong with him. You understand that we were always feeding each other, it was like the first eight years, it wasn't the same as the first eight years, but during those eight years,

because it's going to be 15 years, you know, so during that time, maybe seven years, in any case, it was... We were more all the time in the same genre, even if it was the same kind of conflict that comes back all the time, you know, in a moment you say, why do we fight all the time?

Yeah, but it's like profound things, like in our profound values. Exactly! And one day we did therapy, and then we caught a few things, we were like, oh my god, okay, that's what's going on. So you had this initiative to say, okay, we're going to break the pattern. We're going to consult, but also, if I'm honest, there was a moment where I was like, it's going to take us a witness, a witness to our conversations,

because it looks like we have conversations, and we get out of those conversations, and it looks like we didn't have the same. Our reading of the conversation we had, if I had to tell the conversation we had, I would tell a whole other movie than you. How is it done? How is this possible? The psychiatrist explained that it was a lot of that. We didn't talk about the water glass. We talked about your injuries from rejection.

Not the same starting point. Not at all. So the perceptions are completely distorted at that time. But rejection is something that lasts. It's really a difficult feeling to live with. When you live it small, you said it earlier, it's difficult to live and it's difficult alone. Because yes, there is a gap between that. And you also had a form of guilt by saying, what did I do?

So imagine all the questions you had as a little girl alone. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you.

I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. I was so happy to be able to talk to you. Did you have more friends after that? Yes, there was a time in high school where it was a bit... Even at university, there was a time where it was like... I switched and I got closer to more guys. I made a lot of friends. For a long time, I said, I don't have many girlfriends. I find it too complicated.

And if I hang out with guys and stuff, and at one point during the conservatory, I think I had read an essay or a thesis on relationships between women, and how we learn relationships between women, and why we are competing with each other. I was thinking, ah well, okay, I understand where it comes from, what I say, this idea that girls are too complicated comes from. But it's really problematic. I did a project, I hired ten girls, all of them were just women,

the actresses, the designers, all of that. I said to myself, it's over, from now on, I don't want to have that discourse anymore. And now, I really have as many friends, guys as girls. I've never said that again. I find it complicated, girls. Well, I think that... I had a period when I was younger, I moved a lot. And it seemed easier, especially in high school, to go to the guys. Because there were girls, I had the impression that sometimes it was more closed circles. And that a new one that arrived in January, it was unbalanced.

And I thought that the boys were like, it's okay, come on, it's going to be cool. But as I got older, I really, my female friendships become so precious. Well, really, that's it too. It's that you see the level that you can reach with women. Of understanding, of what we live. Conversation, but in relation to what you were saying, entering a circle of women, there is really something, I think, in our education that,

it's not me who invents it, I mean, all the other feminists will say that, but we learn to perceive other women, very very young, as potential threats. We are put into competition quickly between us. It's true that Picante arrives in a school environment, a little bit of any time in the year, what you say, it's sure that... Who is she?

Who is the threat here? That's it. Why is she... You need to know yourself a little bit before, you know? And when there's news, well, then, the time to get to know yourself is difficult. And the bands are already done. Yes, it's very special. Yellow level, my dear. Please give me a frame.

It's because the reggae is so easy to interpret sometimes also gestures, too. Gestures, words... You know, there are some for whom... You know, you've consulted and all that, but wait a minute. Okay, this one, no, that's it? Oh, it's four?

Four, yes, that's it. Oh, well, she's ahead of her. She's ahead of her? Okay, so here are the questions. Okay. What is the biggest challenge you've had to overcome? Oh! What type of lover are you? What is your biggest challenge you've had to overcome? What type of lover are you?

What is your relationship with death? What did you not receive from your parents and what did you miss? Hum... OK... You choose one and I choose another one at this level. What is the biggest challenge you've had to overcome? What type of lover are you? What is your relationship with death? You see, I'm going to merge two questions.

What is the biggest challenge you've had to overcome and what is your relationship with death? It's going to seem like a pretty low-key challenge. I think that's a sign of my life privilege. But the biggest challenge I've had to overcome so far is my grandfather's death. My maternal grandfather. So he died in 2022. 2021? Yes. I was very close to my grandfather.

My maternal grandparents were extremely present in my life. They kept me a lot. I'm the eldest of my cousins-cousins on my mother's side. We are eleven. So I had a really... You were the first. I was the first. So we can imagine the grandparents.

How did you call your grandfather? Grandfather. Grandfather. When I told you, I called him Grandfather. So we were very close. I'm 36 years old, so I had my grandparents. My maternal grandmother is still alive. But I had my grandfather until I was 33 or 34.

It's a long time to maintain a bond with a person as fundamental in a life. When he died, he went to the hospital and it was like, there's a problem, I think he was doing something wrong with his lungs. It was like, we're going to treat that. And then, over the week, it's like, you know, it's not getting any better, you know, it's not getting any better. And it was all the time, the doctors were all the time, no, no, but you know, it's going to be okay, we're going to manage this and that and that. And on Sunday morning, my mother called me and said, come to the hospital,

your grandfather decided that it was over. So we gathered the whole family in the hospital room, we all said bye, and then it was... I don't know what happened, but anyway, he died there. So it was very sudden, and since he was a grandfather, a grandfather, people around... Because for most people, this relationship either ended a long time ago or the proximity is not that great. Les gens autour, parce que pour la plupart des gens, cette relation-là, soit elle est terminée depuis longtemps, ou soit la proximité est pas si grande. Ce qui fait que les gens comprennent moins bien le lien. C'est pas comme quand tu dis mon père ou ma mère est décédée.

C'est comme, ah ben oui, un grand-parent, c'est le courant des choses. Tu vois, genre quatre fois par année. Ben oui, puis tu sais, c'est comme, c'est la vieillesse, c'est ça la vie. Là, la vie, çaimated my grandfather's mourning. I underestimated the time it would take me, the pain it would make me. And so it's like every morning, I wake up and say, Chaque matin, je me réveille en faisant, voyons, j'ai encore autant de peine, voyons, j'ai encore aussi mal, et cependant de longs mois, jusqu'à un point où je pense sincèrement que j'ai fait une dépression, puis là j'ai pris de la médication. Mais le point de départ, c'est le décès de mon grand-père. Puis, donc, quel est mon rapport avec la mort? Moi, depuis que je suis très, très jeune, j'ai peur de la mort. So, what is my relationship with death? Since I was very young, I was afraid of death.

I think a lot of children ask questions about death to their parents. But it started when I was maybe three or four years old. Why do we die? But if we die, why do we live? I was afraid, I was afraid that when there would be nothing left, I was afraid that my parents would die all the time. One year, my father had taken an apartment next to my mother's house,

so I saw from my father's kitchen window my mother's parking lot. And then, if he hadn't come back before I fell asleep, I couldn't sleep. It's impossible for me to fall asleep. I was afraid that she would die. Last year, I set up a rule at our place. Every time we hang up, we say to each other,

I have to say I love you, in case someone dies. It was like almost everything was driven by this fear of death. The finitude. Yes, that someone dies, that I die. So that's it, it's like a challenge because it's the... And also, it was the first time that I was seeing death so close. I have a aunt who died around me in my family, and it was, but I was younger and person I met in such close proximity. I have a aunt who passed away around me in my family. I was younger and we were less close.

It was like the first time I lost someone who was such an important figure for me. I really underestimated how difficult it would be for me to go through this test. But it manifested itself after how long? point j'aurais de la difficulté à passer au travers cette épreuve-là. Mais ça s'est manifesté combien de temps après? Ah mon Dieu, il est décédé le 5 décembre, puis j'ai été rencontré ma médecin le 5 juillet. Donc t'as attendu beaucoup? Bien c'est comme si je me disais, OK, ça va passer, ça va bien finir par passer.

Mais est-ce que tu l'attribuais à cette peine-là? Bien il y avait plusieurs affaires, professionnellement justement, il y avait des projets que j'essayais de faire, It will pass. It will end well in the future. But did you attribute it to that pain? Well, there were several things professionally. There were projects that I was trying to do that didn't work. It was like a period a little bit. I heard it had ended not long before. So it was like, I think there was a lot of... There was a lot of end. Yes, that's it. Exactly.

So it was a funny conjecture, but really, I... I think that... that propelled me into a into a great, great sadness. And I wasn't able to overcome that sadness. And I think that, also, you know, like I've always been anxious, and I've always consulted to manage that, and I've never taken medication. I think I made a direct link, you know, I said to myself, well, I'm more anxious, it's a more anxious period,

I have a lot of tools. But in the end, I couldn't do it. And there was no shame in taking the drugs because it's like, I'm doing Iron Money. But maybe a shame in not being able to... To get over it. To get over it. A debt that... And nobody told me, come on, let's get along, I was able to go over it. A mourning that...

And nobody told me, come on, let's get along. But still, people don't learn news that long. Because he's a great-grandfather. There's so much that everyone would say, we lost our grandparents. We didn't hear you. Well, you know, I didn't express it that much either. I talked a lot with Nico.

You see, I talk about it and I have a little emotion, but I think it's the first time I talk about the moment when we went to see my grandfather at the hospital to say goodbye without crying. And it's been four years now. It's been three and a half. It's been a long time of pain, and I kept a little shirt from my grandfather.

I put it in a bag. Sealed? Yes, sealed. And when I have a big day or stress, I'm going to take a little puff. It smells like him again. Does that reassure you? Yes, it's like, ah, he's there. But what you say about the grief of grandparents, even in like, ah, he's here, okay. But what you say about grief of grandparents,

even in Open Your Game, there are still a lot of people who talk about the death of their grandparents, it's striking. Yeah. Maybe we underestimate that. I listen to you and I say to myself, maybe it's true that we go through this grief by saying, well, it's said in the order of things.

Yeah, I think... I also think that life expectancy has increased a lot, which means we've been with people for a longer time. When before, let's say you lost your grandparents, you're 12, 13 years old, you have a hard time, but you have 12, 13 years of life, when you lost your grandparents, you're 30 years old,

you've lived through it. They were witnesses and a part of life. It becomes almost a parent. So yes, I think we underestimate how painful it can be for someone to lose their grandparents. And also, when we're lucky, like I was lucky to have grandparents that I had, these people, when we're lucky, like I was lucky to have grandparents that I had, these people become like a parent figure, but a parent figure just for fun.

You know, my grandparents, I mean, they didn't scold me, they never scolded me. My grandfather was like, we go fishing, we go to the blu-ray, I go to sleep at their place. Grandfather, you go to your friend's room, I sleep with grandmother. You know, it's like a relationship. One day, he was collecting money in a small bank. Every time I went to his place, he said, go to the bank. You know, there's something, you know,

it's just magic. It's just, just magic. So it's for sure that when that person goes, it's all that's left, it's all, my God, he brought me so much beauty and magic in my life. Yes, and you were already afraid of death. And then you faced it.

Yes, really. It was the first time. Yes, because it's also facing that it's over. You said goodbye and after that it's a big awareness. The first significant person we lose, it's a shame. Really, our sense of shame. Really, shame is a good word because even today, sometimes I say, «Ah, if I could talk, 30 seconds, I'm like in Big Brother. I would just have my little screen. Hello, hello, I love you. I just want to hear him laugh. It makes me go, ah! Do you feel like he's giving you signs?

It's funny because when I did my live show of the universe, because there's that too, you know, precisely in the last two years, it's so much gone. There are so many beautiful things that have happened. I often think, ah, I would like to be able to share it with him. And when I did my live show at the Univers, my uncle, he came to play harmonica and the day before he dreamed that he was doing the show at the church of Saint-Eustache,

because we just came from Saint-Eustache, and that my grandfather was there and that he said, my grandfather said to him, like, you'll tell him that I'm happy, you'll tell him that I'm happy, you'll tell him I'm happy, you'll tell him it's going to be good, it's going to be good, Luc. You know, he did something, or what? And then he said, my uncle, I like to think he's there. So after that, you know, I have the impression that he gives me signs, I don't know. That's a thing that, I don't know, it's hard for me to say, I believe in that, I don't know. That's something that... I don't know.

It's hard for me to say, I don't believe in that. It seems like you shouldn't be rational. Does it do me good? Exactly. I think we're more involved in that. Exactly. Does it do me good to say, there was a message to pass?

Well, in any case, when I think of him, when there's something that makes me think of him, it's funny because when he died, he had like... Sometimes I saw a light and it's like it made me... there light. And that makes me feel good just to think that this exists, that this is there with me somewhere. And how is your grandmother? She's fine. My grandmother is also there, she's in good shape, she's lucid, she's present.

Like I was teaching at the unicorn, she went to see my show, she was there with me, I was inventing it. It's very present, very lucid, very... It's funny, I often say that my grandmother, at another time, she would have become an artist. I really think that. When she was little, my grandmother told me invented stories.

Every time I went to sleep at her place, I asked ask for stories, and I didn't ask for one. I asked for 18. She would tell me stories, and I would say, No, the other day, you said that the other day. So, I had to find... I had to invent a new story all the time. And it wasn't right, Blanche-Nege. It wasn't right, and it wasn't right that the story she told me two days before. So, she had a creativity in her.

I think she had a time when it wasn't... Because she had kids, she married, she had kids, she was a housewife. So she lives a little with you. Yes, but I don't think she wanted to listen to it, but the other day she said it. After my talk with the universe, she called her brother, who was talking about it, and she said, Paul, I just want to make something clear with you. It's not because we went on TV that we changed. She said, we're not Vedettes, and I don't want it to change how we're going to talk.

That's funny. Yes. But it shows how important it is for her too. Yes, really. When I hear you say that, it's beautiful. So she continues to live, obviously, without your grandfather. Yes. Is it difficult for you to have her alone?

Still, it's difficult because my grandparents still loved each other a lot. It's not like grandparents... Sometimes, old people talk to each other. You say, my God, Lord, you don't love each other much anymore. I understand, it's been 60 years. My grandparents loved each other a lot. They talked to each other. Sometimes, my grandmother would say, I asked her what she missed. I was talking to him, and he was still talking. Sometimes my grandmother would say,

I asked her what she was missing, and she said conversation. Oh yeah. She said, I still had good conversations with your grandfather. I don't remember how she said that, but she said debriefing. She said, we were sleeping, and I don't remember what word she said, but she said, we were sleeping and we... I don't remember what word she said, but she said, we were talking, well, let's say, Pascal, such a thing, when someone in the family was doing less well, what could we do?

How could we? You know, so she still had her partner, she debriefed with them, and we did all that, we went out for dinner at the world's house, hey, such a thing when they say that, you debrief, what do you think? How would you react? You know, we do that in life, in any case, I don't know if you do that with Mario, but my husband is like...

It's true that we forget how... That's a chance. The debrief with someone... That's a chance we have. Ah, but... That's like the daily life, I find. Really. Of a couple. There's something in there.

It seems like we know what the other person will say before they say it. Yes, and then, well, yes, I knew it. That's a little bit of a tie. Yes, that's it. Exactly. What had that energy, that... Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So it's an inspiring couple. Really, huh, my God, yes, yes, yes.

Really inspiring. The question will stay on the family theme. What didn't you receive from your parents that you missed? I... and now I'm going to say something because it's difficult to answer because I don't want to look like a person against divorce. Obviously. But I didn't... In fact, what didn't I experience? If I can turn it around like this...

I didn't experience a home, my parents, my sister, my... I experienced a life where my parents divorced, I was 3 years old. We went to my father's house for a week or two, and then another week or two, so it was a shared war. I didn't experience a more traditional life. And as I said, I don't want to sound like someone who's against divorce because I really think that my life is easier for children to have happy parents, not together, than unhappy parents together.

But this life, this traditional life, I think I would have liked to live it. You know? After that, it's always another thing that I find delicate in answering this kind of question. It's like, would I have been the adult I became? Would I have made the same choices? Would it have made me develop the same kind of attitude or quality? But live a life just more traditional, I think I would have liked that.

A little bit longer. What would you have liked in there? I think stability. The... Yeah, stability. And also, you know, just doing it, it's so difficult that I'm going to say, but doing it by two parents at the same time, I'm sure it's going to... You know, I was a negotiator.

My mother often told me, stop negotiating. It's like, no, but 15 minutes more. No, but, no, but, okay, but I'm going to do it, but after that, for example, we're going to do this. It was always negotiation, my business. You had the last word. Ah, but I wanted to, you know, and I have the impression that, and in my life today, I'm still a little bit the same. All the time a little bit, and my husband says to me, you're negotiating, you're negotiating things, there's not even a discussion at the moment. It's like, you're in a negotiation.

All alone. Okay, perfect. I'll go with you. But for example, you're coming with me. He says, I didn't even ask you to come. I said, I don't care. Do you think it's coming? Because I've known a lot of children, I have a lot of friends separated,

close to their children. I feel like these children had to negotiate rather early in their lives between two parents. In relation to the holidays, in relation to a lot of business. Because I thought, now there are more children in the divorce system than I was when I was young. And I find that young people, when they arrive in the job market, you see that they are used to negotiating, which is a strength for me.

I find that it's a strength, but I often wondered if it would have a relationship with that. I don't know if it's a... Anyway, what I can observe is that, as a child, when you have one parent, the parent has quite a lot of them. So when you start negotiating, your nose is like... You squeeze it. Yeah, and my nose is like, OK, that's nice. Perfect, perfect, you're going to listen year it's like... You take it.

Yes, and one year it's like, OK, it's beautiful. Perfect, perfect, you're going to listen to it four and a half. There it's like... You know, so there may be that. One year I learned, OK, if I negotiate,

I can get to my ends. So there may be that. While when you have both parents, one year you have to say, yes, my cousins, there was my uncle and aunt still together. When it was no, you said it was no. And it also makes, I think, that you learn,

it deals a little bit better with the no. I don't deal very well with the no. Having to say no, it's like, okay, perfect. It provokes you. I'm going to find you, yes. But you know, I'm not after that, I mean. But it challenges you. It provokes you. I'm going to find you. Yes. But I'm not after that. I mean... But it challenges you.

It challenges me and I find other ways. I'm not a... How can I say? I'm not a coward. I accept. It's not a kind of rigidity. No, but it's good. But it's something that rises.

And I also think that I would be a less anxious person. I still notice that having been a child, a little in my luggage, it made me anxious about certain things. But that's it. I repeat, you said it, I prefer to have lived that life and have had parents. But it's good that you talk about it, because you know, Pascal, for parents who are currently separated, or other children like you who have become adults but who have experienced this,

it's still good to talk about the impact on life. Yes. You understand, because we all have impacts on our childhood, no matter if we were separated or not, but still sometimes, you know, like what you just said, you know, to pack your suitcase. Yes. That for a child is a challenge. When you decide to separate, there are reasons, that's not what we're asking ourselves.

Except that there is a reality that is not permanent, but that is temporary. Yes, you're always a little bit... In any case, I always felt a little bit... And now I'm coming and I'm going to leave. Now when I... Well, younger, I haven't moved in years, but when I arrived in a new apartment,

I wasn't able to make a new routine. Because it's like my brain had recorded a new place, and you're going soon. So it took me months before... To let you go. Yeah, OK, I think I can go to the bakery near the street. place, tu t'en vas bientôt. Fait que ça me prenait des mois avant de... De te laisser aller. Ouais, OK, je pense que je peux aller à la boulangerie au coin de la rue. Là, je pense que je vais rester ici un petit bout. Fait que... Mais c'est ça. T'sais, c'est...

Après, ça m'a pris tellement d'affaires, mais oui, je pense qu'il y a un... C'est pas tout noir, c'est pas tout blanc. Non, pas du tout. Mais est-ce que toi, tu veux des enfants? Ça, c'est une bonne question. J'ai toujours children. I was little and I was like, I'm 24, I'm going to have my first child, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then,, we are socially built, so we learned that there is family. When you're in a relationship, you want children. And when you've been in a relationship with someone for 15 years,

you have a jobstab, you have 30, it's like, what are you waiting for? As if we weren't normal. Then there is also the idea of being very selfish, of extending the line, of being like a human, two humans making a new human. There's that, I think it's just... Would you try to have a family? I think so. But then there's also, for me, the idea that I really like my life. I really like my life as it is right now.

I really like my freedom. I really like my relationship with my husband, my complicity with him, the simplicity of our relationship, the spontaneity of our relationship. And I know very well that a child will come, boost all that, and change a lot of things. And I have a lot of friends around me who told me, it's not just friends, there are women around me, mothers who told me, I love my children, and imagining without them is impossible.

I imagine that my children are not there anymore, and I have a hole in my heart. But I could imagine a life without children, and it would suit me. And I have to admit that it's beyond making me say, it's the end, it's the end, we have hair. That's like, of course, it's the end for children, it's sure you have hair in your head, you have no time to eat,

no time to wash, you have like... It's full of periods. That's it. Where is this debate? But this very rational idea that life can also be without children, and it can be very beautiful, it's like it's new for me to hear that. Because you felt like there was a step there. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it.

You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it.

You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it.

You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to do it? No, I'm not going to do it. You're not going to be happy, I'm sure, as parents, and we're going to... But... And still, our life is good. So, do we want that? Do we want that? Is that the decision we're making? It becomes much more rational as a reflection. Because desire, I think, is there, and it's always been there, Nico, too, but desire to keep, or sorry, to preserve this life.

I'm in these thoughts right now. These are great thoughts. Yes. And around me, my sister has three children. I'm close to my nephews and nieces. I have friends who have children. I'm close to others too. So sometimes I think, maybe that would be good for me, to be close to children, people I love and who are important to me.

So you have these discussions in couple? Yes. But it's so mature because it's true that... You know, I know you, I know you somehow, I know I can ask you that question. Because for me, saying, well, children are not my choice, it's an acceptable answer. And I know there are women who feel guilty about that.

About saying, well, I don't feel that need in my life, but I need to be able to name it to free my voice. I think it's important that this is said, but I don't feel that way. I don't feel like I don't want to. No, that's it. You feel that in a decision-making period, where you're going to make your decision.

And I know that it's going to change a lot of things. So, I tell you, it's like I'm in there. And when I say having children is selfish, we agree. I think having children is great. But there's still something very... Well, that's it. It's like, oh, we're going to do this, we're going to create a new human. An extension of the line.

Yes, so that's it. In short, these are big questions at the moment. And I think it's like in life, we like it when it's all black or all white. It's like I'd like it to be. No, I'm sure I want children. No, I don't want them, that's for sure. And then, okay, I'm in a kind of gray zone, very strange, that I learned to see, I think. I asked you the question because I was thinking, you know, if you want to have children, maybe you'll get to know this environment that has you somewhere, has been also called a place where everyone stays

in the same place all the time, for as long as it lasts. Did you find that when you were living in an apartment, you were all alone, I don't know if you lived alone, but it was the first time you left home, and did you feel like a happiness to invade? No. No? No, not at all, I was so anxious. I was never at home. At that time, the first time I lived in an apartment, it was all by myself.

It was my third year at university. And that's when I met Nico. Nico and I, we didn't go out together, we were friends at that time, but there were three roommates. And there was an apartment at 4, next to the camp. I was there all the time. All the time. I was there all the time. I slept there all the time. I never slept at our place. I think I slept at our place twice a month. I hated it. I hated being alone.

OK, you need others. You're not a loner. No, no, no. Oh no, no, no, no, no, no. Even I, it's like... And sometimes, a friend comes friend who comes to our house, he says, come, we'll order some skewers and we'll listen to a movie. That's it. We don't do anything. We don't talk. I just like being with people. And it's not because I'm not good all alone.

It's not because I don't have... It's just that I like being with people. A chalet, when you wake up, we're in the chalet, and it smells like coffee, and... That's my life. And especially when everyone is on vacation in the chalet. That's happiness. Not knowing that no one is leaving.

That makes me go crazy. I go see people leave. It's like we're there three days, everyone together. Oh yeah! So much. Just thinking about it excites me. Oh yes, it calms me down. Sometimes, let's say we come often,

you know, I would come on Friday, you would talk on Sunday, and on Saturday, I would go to Anko. I can't believe there's still a devil. Everyone will stay. Oh yeah, it feels good. Red level already, Bastard. You give me three. There's just one question, it's you who will choose.

And beyond her, how is she? So you're jazzing, Icare, they choose you. Yes, it seems so. The third one is this one. Okay. What profound needs does Nicolas respond to? Have you already reached the end of your physical or psychological limits? What is your biggest source of insecurity?

What is the biggest source of insecurity? What deep need does Nicolas answer? I think of a need... I don't know if it's going to sound pejorative or negative. I don't know if it's something that is... But a need for security. Security at many levels. Security of the family, of the relationship, of the psychological,

of the conversational. My husband, he keeps me safe in life. And it's like, you'd have to say, he doesn't have a need for passion. We've been together for 15 years. It's like, you'd have to say, oh, he doesn't need passion. We've been together for 15 years. It's not passion. But that's the question that Jeannette often asks. I took it back into the game and when we asked her,

I already asked this question to Jeannette, and she answered, safety too. But that's it. I think we're so confused about a lot of things in love. I think we confuse love. I think we confuse... Passion is love. I think we confuse love and friendship. For me, passion is a very subtle thing that doesn't last very long, that goes away and doesn't come back. Passion is literally hormones. But love, that's something that...

I could say he didn't meet my need for love, but I think that it's still so specific. Love, of course, I wouldn't be with this guy. It's like the base in the end. Because if you're not in love, this state, the state of love, which is stronger than the feeling of love, it's something that is grounded.

But security, that's very... And we met very young, so I think that in those years, you know, it's still your family, it's still your parents, you know, waiting for your sister and all that. And my family is still my family, but now I really have the feeling for a few years that my immediate family is Nico. And that, for me, it's... It speaks a lot of my comfort with him and the depth of our relationship.

So yes, it responds to a profound need for security. And then, you know, earlier we were talking about separation and being in two houses at the same time. I think that seeing Nico, it's like it also, in a way, it responds to that thing, you know, to settle down, to be anchored. You know, we do a lot of projects together, we travel. Seriously, I'm alone with him for three weeks, we talk to no one else, there's no problem. We're going to have something to say during these three weeks. We'll laugh, we'll giggle.

Sometimes we won't talk, we'll do our own business. We have a lot of freedom in our relationship, freedom to be who we really are. That's precious. Yes, really. The freedom to be with the loved one, with whom you share your life. You have to feel secure about that.

It's impossible to be fully who you are, and not censor yourself. To show yourself vulnerable. It's impossible if you don't feel secure. If you don't feel that you can... Hey, there's a day day you can be a shit. And it happens. What do you want? It happens. You're supposed to be a day.

You're not just a nerd. You're stupid. It happens. And I have people around me who are in relationships where this moment, let's say that day where it doesn't go well and they're a little stupid, it creates a stress of, ah, how is he going to be okay, am I going to go? Is it going to create a mess, is he going to let me go? You don't ask yourself questions.

That's not what I ask myself. So, that's it. But it's like, you know, it reassures me, you know what I mean? You said that because there's something that sometimes I say to myself, ah, it's like, does it sound flat as an answer? Well, I don't think so, because it's still the fundamental need to be secure. You know, as you say, love is already there to talk about relationships,

that is to say that love is already there. After that, it means that you're free. You know, when you're secure, you feel free too. Yeah, yeah. You know, you feel good, you're ready to exploit it, you don't survive. That's also when you're not safe. Sometimes you're in a state of survival. Completely.

To be safe. And you're vigilant because you say, what's going to happen? So you're confident. Completely. It's not very sexy to say, in life, or very fashionable to say, I'm proud. It seems that we tend to be very humble and not want to express our pride.

In life, by nature, how I was raised, and also, my family works in of Nico. Today, I shot so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes,

so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, so many scenes, I'm so proud. I'm so proud. Imagine when they wake me up. I'm so proud, Nico. Today, I shot such a tough scene. It was hard. It was hard to get into that emotion. I did it.

I saw it on the monitor. It's good. I'm proud of myself. For real, not being embarrassed to tell someone I'm really proud. And just take the time to name it. In any case, I think it's a... Maybe because it's like zones where I don't feel like I'm... And to feel admiration in the eyes of the other, too,

while you're saying it. He hears, he understands what it means. You know, when someone knows your path so well, he understands where it is written in your journey, that pride. You just talked about watching over me, it's just because you say, I was turned upside down by this series, this series so true. You and Guylaine Dramblet together, it works, It's powerful. We forget where we are. We are with you. We are in this misery too.

It's a human misery. At the same time, with human beauty. But everything that life brings us, it's not necessarily where we want to go. Life brings us back. It's like an ocean with waves, there are tides. It's really...

But that's a big project for you, to be on me. Oh my God, so much. It was the first time I wrote alone. I wrote alone with Carvintage, I put the Stanwebs series on. There I was in a project of... Did I say something else?

No. No, no, it's me. Yeah, it was big anyway. And to have Guylaine and France and Marie-Hélène, the producer, but France-Baudoin, Guylaine Tremblay, and Hélène Norin, to trust me to write, you know, I was very flattered and I didn't take it lightly. And then, you know, in the game, really, it's a project like,

you know in life that there are projects that are cornered. That, it's one of them, I know. And not necessarily because there is also that, I find that we are in a place where we can often see projects as opportunities. That is to say, there I do a theater show and maybe the director of the casting will come and see me and I'll have as opportunities. I mean, I'm doing a theater show, maybe the casting director will come and see me, and then I'll have auditions.

I try not to do that because I think it's a good way to be disappointed. I take projects for what they are. And this project, it could be the last time in my life that I have a dramatic role on TV. This project will have occupied a fundamental place in my career. I know it. I developed confidence in writing, alone, and in the game. Going into these areas, I didn't think I was capable of say that because I asked to say that, but I was wondering how I was going to get there. And if it was going to be hard.

Was it hard? No, it wasn't hard. It was... It took a lot of work, a lot of preparation, a lot of letting go. It took a lot of giving up, but it wasn't hard. On the contrary, it was rather fun. It's so... I don't know how you were after the shooting days. Because you're a character who doesn't have it easy. No, well, it depends.

The scenes that I shot with Guillaume, who plays Joey, my boyfriend, I realized that afterwards. I had never understood that. The actors were saying, I was in a funny state. But we shot those scenes at the beginning, in my apartment. And maybe a week after we finished shooting them, we shot something else. It's like I said, oh my God,. And it was like I was going out. Well, while we were doing it, I didn't realize it. And I found it fun anyway.

It's still a real beautiful challenge as an interpreter to go in those areas. It's something, you know. And how does it feel to be in the same place as you? It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge.

It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge.

It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's a real challenge. It's still a real challenge as an interpreter to go into these areas. It's something. And how did it change you? To play it. To write it, to play this project. Because you say it's a flesh project, but the before and after... I think from a personal point of view, it gave me confidence.

I think that I had... I'm still a person who doubts a lot, who doubts about me, about my choices. And I think it's good, doubt, you said it. I wouldn't want doubt to exist anymore because... But you know, when doubt doesn't stop you from moving forward... That's it. I think it's a way... It's simple. Yes, because it's also a way to question yourself and to do introspection. But sometimes it became like, well, where are you capable? There was like a business where I found that a little tiring, this business like,

I'm not sure you'll be able to do it. Like a little imposter. Yes, that's it, this business. Let's see. Then it looked like this project really gave me confidence. Oh, okay, I don't need to go into that area. It's true that there are things we do in life, and we're going to take a lot of it for my next brand.

Well, in any case, I think it's going to... It's going to make... Let's say I play a role, and it's not the performance of the year, I'm not going to say, oh, I'm the one who's bad. I'm going to say, ah, this project has less well-being. Because you've had it. Because I've done it, because I know I'm able to go to darker areas.

But if people haven't listened to you, it's Radio Canada, watch out for me. Really, I have the Marcl vraiment. Je me souviens, j'ai le Marc-Club qui est une plateforme numérique, pis on fait des causeries, pis un soir, Guylaine était là pis je parlais de ça. Pis elle aussi, elle est fière d'avoir joué la veille sur moi, tu sais, elle disait arrête pas de parler du texte pis de, tu sais. Mais c'est aussi que, c'est sûr que Guylaine, tu sais, c'est comme un, moi j'ai, c'était très impressionnant là, j'avoue, de, c'était impressionnant dans tous les sens du terme, It was very impressive, I must admit. It was impressive in every way.

It was impressive because she's a great actress, but it was also impressive. It could bring a certain level of power. I don't know if I can take that away. It really made me think, you don't have the time to be a jerk. There's a scene in episode 1, we're playing cards in the kitchen. And we're playing cards. When Guilaine starts running, you have to run.

Because you have to go. She's so full, she's so there, she's running and she's unstoppable. She doesn't ask. You know, you feel it sometimes, even as an actress sometimes I tell myself, what am I doing? And it's sure that it feels like that with the game partner, but Kylaine, it must exist somewhere, but she has so much work and so much instinct that Guylaine, on dirait que... ça doit exiter quelque part, mais... A tellement de métiers, puis a tellement d'instincts que c'est comme... Quand elle est partie, elle est partie, puis la scène, elle roule,

fait que... Ah ouais, elle embarque dans le train. Fait que dans le fond, ça t'aide, t'arrives dans cette espèce de vacuum-là, qu'elle l'installe. Oui. Oui. Puis elle est pas du tout... Elle est pas rochante, pendant tout, c'est très simple. Le monde est comme nous autres, vraiment comme nous autres. Guylaine, c'est très simple avec elle sur un plateau, She wasn't at all... She wasn't a rock star. She was very simple. Everyone was like us. Really like us. Guylaine, you know?

It's very simple with her on a set, talking to her. She made jokes. So... It was a really nice experience. Because for those who didn't listen, it's your mom. Yes, she plays my mom. She told me, we're talking.

And it's true that the card game, I think it was a crescendo, if I remember. It's that it's going well and it's bringing me back. You say, OK, who knows what happened? How does it flip out of the blue? It's like we're talking and in two seconds we create ourselves. And then we understand so much about family dynamics. We understand where it comes from.

There are things from the past, it's a little thing and it goes back. Completely. Are you ready for the pink level? Yes! Sensual and sexual. Oh my God! There, in there... OK, give me a 4. 4? Well, yeah. 4. Oh my God! Okay, you give me four.

Four? Yeah. Four. You have a big choice of answers. You have her, and them. Perfect. Okay. What is your definition of desire?

Is sexuality a taboo subject in your family? Do you prefer to seduce or be seduced? Excuse me. What would you have liked to know about sexuality at 20? Oh my God. Excuse me. What is your definition? Is sexuality a subject of interest in my family?

Not at all. Do you prefer to seduce or make you seduce? I will answer this question. It's particular because I've been in a relationship with Nico for 15 years. It's a little bit about the definition of desire, but it's redefined a lot, seduction and desire, because it's not something I'm going to look for. It's not an ephemeral or spontaneous, it's not radical. At some point, it's like I'm not going to an event. So I think that, do you prefer to seduce or seduce yourself?

I think that what I like in my partner is that it's like a thing that we go through. Sometimes it's more Nico, sometimes it's more me, and sometimes we're like, hey, I think we're... So I think it's good in a long-term relationship to be able to still... still not play that, but... Light the fire? Yes, but even, you know, I think seduction is also just organizing a date. Yeah, but taking care of each other.

So, hey, Saturday night, I booked a restaurant at this hour, and before that, we'll have a drink there, just the two of us. I think that in seduction, in a relationship, it's as if you become more limited in seduction, or, on the contrary, it becomes more broad. Sometimes, the daily life will go up. Yes, and what we've learned from seduction, it's as if we haven't really learned what seduction is in a long-term relationship.

You're right, we learned more when you're single. Yes. Seduction as if you were attracted to the other person. Yes. So the other person is to feed the relationship. Yes, it's that in year, in a relationship, how long have you been with Mario? Well, you said you were 21 years old.

Yes. With Nicolas, I was 21 years old too, and I'm 56. So it's been 35 years. 35 years. Is it long? Well, it's super long. You who counted by ten, you see,

it's three tens plus half a dozen. Yes, that's it. It's three tenths plus half a tenth. Yes, it's very long. It's been a very long time with the same person. I'm talking about 15 years old, I'm thinking 20 years old. There's something about it. I think it brings a redefinition all the time. I think that at some point, when the cuts last, and as they say, you can't make the cut last either. It brings a redefinition all the time. But I think that at some point, when the couple lasts,

as they say, you can't make the couple last to make it last. I think that's important. But it remains that we fall into other phases. Because for me, it's like the scenario, it's my whole life story. There is no shadow zone. That is to say that Everything has been seen. We've lived so much together, both publicly and in our house, without the eyes of others.

There are so many things we've lived through that it can become a great wealth too. Yes, it really is. It's a kind of couple heritage that is super important. A reference to how many times people don't understand what we're saying. Exactly. Because there's one comment, we look at each other, we just understand everything. But for the others, it's OK, but we missed you.

We didn't miss you, we really missed 30 years of life. Yes, you missed us in the last 35 years. Yes, exactly. And we became grandparents. It's like we laugh a little bit at each other because we see ourselves aging. It's like that role. It's like, look, we're going to stop thinking we're young. In that sense, because we haven't been called grandpa or grandma yet because he's too young, but there's still something to accept in there too. And it's like we accept it together. And I think it's beautiful to see us gaga, to say,

look at the photo we took. You know, it brings back something of wonder that does good. Oh wow, yes, that makes you wonder. Oh wow! I think that's what this role is about. Did you see? It's all about that. It's not possible. We had less of that wonder capacity. Because it's beautiful in a couple, the wonder capacity. But in life in general, and in the old age, we lose it. Imagine in a couple sometimes, we, I think we decide one day, do we become an old couple or do we remain a couple without seeing the word old couple in front of us?

You know, it's a couple that lasts, but that's it. So, as you say, you have to put things on the agenda. Well, there's really, in any case, for me, I think it's a real chance to grow old in a relationship. You know, I find that... Well, obviously, I repeat, you know, we'll never say it enough, but it's important to be in love. I would never be with Nico if I wasn't in love with him,

and he wouldn't be with me either. We are deeply in love, but... But still, it's the couple that stays over the length. It's a choice. It's a real choice that we make. Because it doesn't mean that those who make the choice to separate, they weren't strong enough, they didn't work enough. But sometimes it's like, when you go to consult,

it would be easier to stop that. But no, because love is there and the desire to stay together is there. It has always been the two of us. We always loved each other, we always wanted to be together, even in difficult times. And yes, seduction for me, it's like it's redefined throughout these 15 years. And I think it will continue to be redefined. And I think having children, must change the relationship completely. And then when children grow up, when they leave and become grandparents...

It's full of stages. It's beautiful. And you know, the challenge of long-term couples is that at each stage, we don't live the same way. No, but no. You understand? We don't live the same way. For example, at the beginning of children, we don't live the same way. It doesn't happen. We don't have the same way. For example, at the beginning of childhood, we don't live the same way. We don't have the same lives, we evolve differently.

So it's about finding the common ground. And that's still a conscious decision, what you have to do. It's not done alone. Sometimes you can meet, ok, the paths are on the ground, what do we do? Because it would take us back to the common projects. I met your, and I was like, OK, what do we do? Because it would take us back to the same old projects. I met your father in politics, and I had so much fun with Jean-Claude. You're a bit delinquent, your father. Yes, yes, it was really great discussions.

There were a lot of things, and he was a parent before me. I remember because he advised me a lot when the children were young. But why am I talking about your father? Wait a minute, I'm getting lost in... wait, what are we... Politics. Politics, that's it, I mean, politics, I was alone anyway last week. Yes. You know, Mario was in Quebec, so I knew the kinship. It's like if Mario and I didn't know for years the same kinship.

The same kinship, no. We knew it from 2009 when we arrived in the big region of Montreal, where we lived in real time at the same time, everything that was happening. But we didn't experience it. So that too, it's like there's a awareness to say how we bring it back on the same path. It's not done all by yourself, there's no magic thought.

I've talked a lot about it with friends, that's where friends come to help too. You have to dare to name those moments and not think that there will be magic and that it will be replaced by something else. Yes, yes, yes. How do you talk? That's it. How do you deal with conflicts? How do you talk about your dissatisfactions? But also how do you talk about a harder moment? Because I have a friend in particular, she often tells me that she lived with her boyfriend

three months ago, a difficult period, and I say, why don't you talk about it? Oh, I don't know. Me, my friends, when I live a difficult period with Nico, I talk about it to my friends, and to my mother, let's say. And then I dig, and I think about how I can talk about it with Nick and all that. That's what makes you evolve together one day, and you find yourself. I often say that in a relationship, there are moments when you let yourself go without telling yourself,

and you take it back without telling yourself. There are moments when you meet up after, but you say, hey, we were fine, not connected. It was me. But you meet up after. You meet up after, while you're not saying, hey, I'm not with you anymore. I wasn't connected. It was me. But you realize it afterwards. You realize it afterwards, but you don't say, I'm not with you anymore.

But there are really little disconnections. And then, whoop, it reconnects. And then you're able, in retrospect, to say, OK, in that period, we were like, we were together, but we weren't really together. No, and sometimes we don't get along. Yes, yes, really. Women and hormones, huh.

Oh, well, that's it. I was telling myself, my SPM is a nightmare, I can't get out of it. Oh, yes, it's a nightmare. I'm a monster. A monster. Every month, you have your monster periods.

How do you live that? Well... Do you hide? Compared to Nico? Yes. Oh no. Oh no no no. Does he make faces?

He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He does.

He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He does. He's it, there's this understanding. And there are women who say, hey, it insults me enough when my husband tells me, listen, are you SPMO? I think there's something in some relationships, it's like it's a way of gaslighting a little bit,

the woman, what she's going through or her emotion. Me, in my couple, in any case, I'm happy that they know. I'm happy that they tell me, well, could it be that... Because it brings me back, too. It makes me feel like, OK, I know what I'm really feeling right now, I'm going to find it really anonymous in two days.

I know. And if I don't find it anonymous in two days, we'll talk about it again. Well, you know, very often. So I still think I'm lucky that my husband understands this. But at the same time, you say it, you talk about it, you know it. Yes, yes, yes. Oh no, but that's because the fans and hormones, I'm going to say, you know, it's not for nothing that there are a lot of books written about it. There are conferences, there are walks.

It's something that takes over from us. I had the impression at some point, at the beginning of my menopause, to be possessed. That's it, menopause seems like a... I really doubt it a lot. It's a transition, in the end, it's a big transition. It's the complete hormonal drop. So you can imagine how it takes place, there are some for whom it's stronger than others,

there are symptoms that we don't know, that we associate with something else, while it's related to that. And then we start to talk about it openly. That's it, it's not been a long time since we've talked about it. There was a taboo around menopause. Completely. Because it's a transition to another stage of life as a woman. And it seems like it was like a taboo to talk about it. Well, and also, it's a little bit for many women, I think it's the feeling, and not just the feeling,

which reflects society, but it's the beginning of the invisible life. Oh, completely, yes. You know, I dream of writing a series about it. About women, I would say between 50 and 65, the area where you say, oh, it's because we don't know too much, because you're not the woman we wanted, you're not the mother, you're not the grandmother yet. We don't know what you could be.

You'll call me, I'll help you, I'll give you some tips. I find that even sometimes I'm with people and I don't feel heard. When you say invisible, I didn't have that feeling before. Oh yeah! And now, I tell myself, well, I haven't changed my mind. It works so quickly and I still have a lot of opinions. But I think you still have to insist more on certain things.

But you don't feel taken more on certain things. But listen, you're not taking it seriously? A little bit, yes. There's like a little bit where you talk about technology or whatever, you know. It's like, well, there's not so much that you won't understand. I understand, talk to me and you'll see how I'm going to understand. You know, there's a, yeah, there's something in our society that's like this thing that's How do people react? Well, it's a bit of a seizure, but it's because I refuse this status of invisibility. I think that at any period of our lives, we must exist. We can't say that during a period, and I remember that Jeannette Bertrand had a period in her life

where nobody asked her for anything, and she asked if she came back. And I said to myself, well no, we have something to bring to all the moments of our lives. Yes, and it's as if this area, it's as if you're not grandmother yet, you're not wise yet. But this area, it's an area where women, for probably one of the first time in a very long time, take back their freedom back their independence. The children are often older. They take back their incredible power. Exactly. It's like, no, you don't have a job anymore.

You don't have a job anymore. You don't have the job we gave you since you were little. You can't just be... It can't be a career thing. You can't just have a job. Let's see! Hey! Yes! While we see in the fictions of men of that age, it's like that, it's a big shot, it's a VP of a company.

You see all the time men of that age, in full possession of their means. You just see women who are mothers, amateurs, blondes, mothers, and now the grandmother. It's like, can we give them a word? Absolutely. Because it's the most beautiful period of my life. Ah! You know, because I'm proud of what I did as a mother, for example.

I'm rich from all my personal and professional experiences. And I have time now. In the sense that, yes, I work a lot, my personal and professional experiences. And I also have time now. In the sense that, yes, I work a lot, but I mean by choice. And I have freedom. My mental burden is reduced. As much as it was overloaded. You're talking about when you were alone all week with your children. With a full-time job, I would say you have a lot of work in the bag. That's why I have so much empathy for young families.

Because every day is different. When there is a virus that comes in, listen, you have it for two weeks to get rid of it. There is one evening you don't want to eat, but you have to eat. You take a bowl of cereal, well no, you can't. No, that's what you don't decide much anymore. Yes, you live great moments of happiness. There are plenty of things that make you go through that. But when you arrive elsewhere and you look at it,

you say, OK, I did it, now I can help others. I can give, I can give back, I can make others speak. Like now, I think, maybe, what can I do for women in their 50s? I want to hear them. I want to free that word that is rich, that is necessary too. But you're right, there is a gray zone, anyway. I would say it's a dead zone. A dead zone, yes. It's the dead zone. The great invisibility.

I really don't have it at all. You're not in it at all. No, but it really comes to me anyway. I don't know. It's sure, I'm very close to my mother, waiting for me to say something. And I listen. And I like to be friends with all generations. I like it.

I did theater with myique Pétain. We jaded so much. She talked to me a lot. There's something very enriching in this kind of discussion. I think that at 50, it's like we're about to take off our plane. We're not looking for a landing strip. Sometimes, someone shows us a landing strip. But I'm not interested in that. I'm in course, but I'm not interested. I'm flying, I'm not going to land.

It's the first time in 20 years that I sleep more than 6 hours a night. I'm able to accomplish a lot. What I say, we're going to eat, I'm free. Yes, that's it. I'm not saying I suffered, but there has been a lot of privacy at the level of freedom when children are young. It lasts a long time. I've been close to helping, like many people are close to helping their parents. It's another stage that's difficult.

You lead your children to autonomy, you lead your parents to death. I mean, you're not in the same state of mind. So after that, you need oxygen, you need to exist in the eyes of others. So one day I'm going to go talk to these beautiful women of 50 years. It's necessary. Last question, Pascale. What look would little Pascale put on the woman you are? Oh my God, a capotre.

Like, happiness. It's funny, I often think of myself as a teenager. Like, 12,-13 ans. Ouais. Je pense à moi, à dos, quand je veux me réjouir. Parce que, évidemment, en avançant dans la vie, on a des opportunités, puis un moment donné, non pas que ces opportunités-là sont pas importantes ou ont moins de valeur, mais ils sont un petit peu plus On a moment, these opportunities are not important or have less value, but they are a little bit more in the continuation of things.

That is to say, you wrote such a series, so you will have such another opportunity to write a series. Earlier, I said I don't do projects by seeing them as opportunities, but sometimes it also works like that. And when I take myself, when I grab myself, doing like, ah, that's cool, I do, there, remember what you wanted when you were 12, 13 years old, and react for her. And then I told myself, it's disgusting, it's incredible. And I find that really important. And I'm not saying that because I'm doing it for real. When I was taken to the LNI, I mean I was 32 years old, it had been 20 years since I did the improvisation. It wasn't any more important, but it was like, yes, I got there, in my career as a player.

I remembered the 13-year-old Pascale who was doing the lineup in front of the medley for two hours to get the space she wanted. After that, she went to see the Claude Legaults, then François Tienne-Parré, then Sophie Corron, then Yésine Coquine, then Pissing, me an autograph. Then I came back the week week with my photos developed, sign the photo, and for her, for little Pascal who is doing the lineup for two hours in February, in front of Le Medelé,

please, you will rejoice as he should. And that really helps me a lot. It allows me to take advantage of opportunities without things happening to to me without... without wanting to do it. Yes, yes, but you know, it's not... No! It's big!

It's okay to be proud, and it's necessary, it's necessary. And it also allows me... and I know we talk a lot about privileges and... but I find it important to recognize it, and it allows me to measure my privilege and tell me what you wanted, what seemed unattainable to you, important de le reconnaître pis ça me permet de le mesurer, mon privilège. Pis de me dire ce que tu voulais, ce qui te semblait inatteignable et ce pourquoi aussi t'as décidé de pas faire ça parce que ça te semblait trop inatteignable. Finalement t'es revenu à ça, c'est en train de se passer, c'est vraiment important. Pis c'est important que tu le reconnaisses. Pis

je pense que c'est une affaire qui me permet un de me réjouir, mais aussi qui va m'empêcher I think it's something that allows me to rejoice, but also that will prevent me from falling into cynicism or... To be amazed. Yes, to be amazed and hold things back. That's something I'm doing. But pride, at one point I had talked about it, I was in a show, I think it was at Bien at the time with Saskia Thieu, and I had talked about pride because I think it's something that we don't dare to name enough. That we don't dare to attribute enough. And there was a Frenchman who was behind the backstage, who was behind the set. And when I finished, he said to me, you're talking about pride. He said to me, in Quebec, it's crazy, nobody talks about pride.

I have the impression that Quebecers have the misery to be proud. Maybe because we have the impression of boasting, you know, you've talked about it, but the only thing left is pride. I think the difference between walking with one hand in front of you and with one's shoulders open to the other. Yes. It's a column inside, pride. But I think that's it. I think people say that expressing their pride is a sign of a lack of humility. Yes.

So for me, it's not worth it. It's so much to do. And I can be extremely proud of what's been going on in the last few months, while recognizing that it would never have happened si Guylaine Tremblay, France Baudoin, Marie-Hélène Lorrain, André Béraud chez Radio-Canada, Raphaël Ouellet, le réalisateur de Veille sur moi, Louis Morissette, François Saint-Ament, tout ce monde-là, sans ces gens-là, ça se serait pas passé. C'est vrai. Tout comme ça se serait pas passé, peut-être, sans Anne Laplan de ma prof de cinquième année. Je trouve qu'on est... c'est que je peux être fière de moi, it wouldn't have happened without Anne-Laplante, my fifth year teacher. I think we are... I can be proud of myself while recognizing the importance of team work

and while recognizing that it wouldn't have worked without all the people around me. And at the same time, you had this intelligence to take what they gave you. Do you understand? That is to say that every person who has who guided you at some point in your life, you were able to capture that and make it yours. Yes, yes. Now that I'm... But it's not less than in the present, a series, well, it's probably...

But they're not only in you. Yes, but not only that, but they're collective works. You know, we often talk about a series of... a series of putting such and such person in the spotlight. For me, a series... There's nothing to believe, there are teams behind it. It's really a collective work. And I'm not saying it with false modesty, it's the pure truth.

When you write a series, the number of people who give you comments on your texts, it's like the scriptwriter or the script editor, producer, broadcaster, director, there are people who give you notes enormously, it's not true that you write it alone. Even when you write it alone, it's not true that you write it alone. So it's like, yeah, that's it. For me, I think there's a way to be proud of yourself, and to enjoy what's going on, and to feel at your place. Without crushing the odds.

Yeah, without doing it like I was the only one there, because that's the least real thing. But you know, I find this question interesting all the time, because from the point of view the little Pascal's look, that's where we see the path we're taking. That's for sure. Have you ever heard someone say, «Ah, it would be so sad?»

No. No. But maybe no one dared to say it. Notice if they felt it, but I've never heard anyone who... Because I think we're also going where we're proud. You know, in this sphere of life, the child would be proud of that. Because you realized your dream, it's still...

Yes, well yes. It's still incredible. You were very young and you already realized that. Yes, it's funny because two years ago I gave an interview to maybe Emile Hiperot. I said that my mother had asked me what my dream would be and I had answered, she creates a series and plays in it. It's crazy. What would your dream be? And I replied, oh, create a series and play in it. It's crazy. What would your dream be? Do you have any other?

My dream would be that it would continue like this for years. I see the precariousness of our environment. And I say to myself, honestly, if I could have this kind of professional, personal, intimate, family life, if it could have lasted for years, I would be fulfilled. I don't dream of going abroad, I don't dream of having a career in France, in the United States, not at all. I dream of doing... That's what I dream of.

You're in your dream. I'm in my dream, so my dream is that. You don't want to wake up. No, that's for real. That's beautiful. Yes. Yes, that's really what I dream of. A great period of life.

Yes, a beautiful period. Well, anyway, I hope you won't wake up right away because we benefit from everything you do. No, but really, if I say it in passing, but I find that you're beautiful to have gone. Everywhere I see you, it seems like, wow, you have a lot of relevance, you have a lot to share. You said it when you were little, you talked a lot, but you also think a lot.

Yes, sometimes I don't have much to say, honestly. It seems that I have things to tell about myself, but I don't think I'm a person with so many points of view on life, on politics, on society. Sometimes I think I have less to say. But... In any case, when I hear you, I'm always... I loved jazzing with you. One thing for sure, I love to jazze. I like that. But it seems so. I like that. I'm a joker.

I'm not talking on the phone. There's someone at home. Do you talk to your mother every day, for example? Not every day, but not bad. But we have like a day, let's say we call each other seven times, and we don't talk for 3 days. And then, yes, it's very... But sometimes we also talk on the phone while we listen to something. You know, it's... There's not really a routine at that level.

I'm the same with my daughter. Oh yes, that's it. We text while we listen to the TV to say what we're thinking. Exactly. That's funny. Relationships, my daughter. Well, thank you, Pascal. Thank you for. The relationship between mother and daughter. That's right. Hey, thank you, Pascale. Thank you for the invitation. It was really fun.

It really was a great, great, great pleasure. And it continues to be that way. Fascinating. I'm not going to let go. I didn't even use my joker. No, again, Aline. I thought you were going to use it. I didn't even think about it.

No, no. There was nothing that... No, you were all in great friendship and honesty. Everything was fine. I think there was no question of being a trap. No, not really either. Sometimes there are days when people feel less comfortable. We're not the same from one day to the next, so it's maybe... But it seems that it's even more incriminating to say, ah, Joker, that's the question.

It's like, what's wrong with her? Why are you my Joker? Why are you my Joker? Yes, that's it. I think we can answer that question. So thank you everyone, thank you Pascal. See you at the next podcast. This episode was presented by Karine Jonqua,

the reference in skin care in Quebec, and by the Marie-Clob, a space dedicated to the best-being. Table Tennis Open Your Game, Original Edition and Couples Edition are available everywhere in stores and on Randolph.ca.