OverDrive - Johnson on Price snubbed from the HHOF, Marner's team sweepstakes and Zegras' role in Philadelphia

Episode Date: June 24, 2025

TSN Hockey Analyst Mike Johnson joined OverDrive to discuss the inductees for the Hockey Hall of Fame, Carey Price's snub from the class, Mitch Marner's sweepstakes across the league, Trevor Zegras' deal to the Flyers, Brock Boeser's contract value and more.

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Joining us now on the Maple Toyota Hotline, Here's our TSN hockey analyst Mike Johnson. How you doing Johnny? I Just stepped off the golf course. Oh way rose Rose Like I'm not a massive Sweater in my life, but I tell you what you get one of those little corner pockets up on a tee box There's no wind and when the sweat starts pouring out of my forearms. I'm like too much do on yeah I'm good enough, and I don't care enough to be doing this what am I doing?

But it was my first round of the year, so I had to try to finish it off okay Well from that standpoint you're probably a walker too. You're like an athlete and in shape like this is mandatory carts mandatory in shape like this is mandatory carts when mandatory mandatory like I don't care if you're a triathlete you don't get any bonus points for being a hero and walking and trying to pass out with this none what right right it's like in Florida man like they have when it gets hot down there you're walking is not an option no you're not allowed to walk but don't like it aren't golf courses like abandoned in the afternoon in Florida because people yeah for the most part you go down there in April or May or something and tee off

at two there's literally nobody at on the course 40-degrees person the whole day no one yeah actually beautiful I pulled in at whatever noon today there was maybe maybe a dozen cars in the parking lot really nobody there why would you why would you the only people were like staying at the resort. Otherwise you'd be dumb. Or me. One of those two things. It's too hot. I'm getting pictures sent to me now that like back in the day pics. We were talking about how hot it is and like trying to just keep your look together, Johnny. And you know, it's a struggle man. It's it's a struggle right now So we were talking about the Hall of Fame an hour ago And I'm curious where your head goes Do you go to the to the players that actually got in her do you go to the guys that don't get in?

Where does where does your mind race to first? Well, it goes to the bubble guys, right? Well, it goes to the bubble guys, right? Because to me, the three guys who got in, first timers, Chara, Thornton, Keith, no brainers. There's no real need to have a discussion. We don't need to go over their resume. They're like, yeah, they're hall of famers. They were always going to be, they were always going to be first ballot guys. They deserve to be. So my thought is always, Alex McGillinley, I've been on his, like trying to support his candidacy for about five years. Now, I'm not that my word means anything, I don't vote on this, but you know, I just thought

one of those, you know, supernova guys who didn't maybe play quite as long, but in the Beret Lindroth-Forsberg mold, when he was great, he was one of the best in the world for a long time. So I guess I go to those guys, like the bubble guys that get in. And then, you know, Carey Price doesn't, you know, Kerry Price doesn't get in,

Duke Arash doesn't get in. Tough year. It was a tough year to be a candidate because there's too many good candidates that were coming up for the first time. But I guess I think of the guys, the bubble teams that got in and the bubble ones that didn't. And like, how do we feel about Patrick Marlowe?

Because, like, I've read he's 25th in goals in the history of the NHL. The 24 guys ahead of him are all in this Hall of Fame or will shortly be there, like, Jagger and Samcoz. So, I know he wasn't necessarily the best ever, but what he did for 25 years, like, that's gotta be worth something. That was the best ever at staying healthy and playing.

Like, it feels like, I get it, he's not with, he's not a bona fide surefire guy, but it feels like he's a guy who probably has to get in eventually, just cause he's played more games than anyone ever. Gold medals too, right? Yeah, gold medals. Yeah, that's what we're talking about the most.

Yeah, where are you at Johnny with Carey Price? Cause I mean, that's the one that I kind of circled as to, you know, McGill, again, not throwing stones at McGilillney but it's more about the omission of of Kerry you know. So would not a very good comp for Kerry Price be Henry Lundquist? Never want to stand on the cup but Hank was really good for a long time Hank won an Olympics Hank won the world Hank was you know you know the win-loss record all that sort of stuff yeah I mean I think Kerry belongs in there but would I put Kerry Price ahead of Keith, Charles or Thornton? Absolutely not. No. I go for

those other guys in first. So would he be ahead of Alex McGillin? He's powered apples and oranges noodles right? Like we might be a bit of prisoner of the recency bias of Kerry Price and how great he has been Obviously a sparkling international record as well. It's not just NHL stuff, but I think he gets in there but noodles. I'm curious your take so Kerry Price Took a risk Ryan Miller Cujo like all have pretty strong

Paces took a risk in the 13 years he played best goals against best save a rask in the 13 years He played best goals against best save percentage in the in those 13 years Carrie Price was in those 13 years Took us numbers. I'll be maybe on a better team were better than it's like How do you rank those four because those are all kind of you can make a case for each of them Well, I guess my my retort on that is what were any of those guys known as the best in their craft Because price won a heart and there was in 2010. Yeah, but did Brian Miller win a heart? No No, you won the best. I mean the heart is a heart is to the best player Yeah in the league like that's I I think I would put if I had a choice out of the goaltenders you just

I think I would put if I had a choice out of the goaltenders you just listed, I think Carey Price is the best out of all of them. Now he's not as decorated. But he has the best resume out of all of them. Maybe his peak might be the highest, but there's some longevity concerns as well. Right, but that's kind of where I went. It's like my argument- Isn't he the best goalie in the world for five years at least? I felt like I've had this argument with the quiz master.

It's not an argument, it's more of a debate. When you look at it, some of these players are deemed special. A lot of them are, that have gone in. At some point was this person known as the best at their craft. For me, I can make an argument for Carey Price. You're right. With some duration, Jamie. Right.

It wasn't just a one-off. It was known as, for me, and maybe I'm biased, but there was a stretch there and maybe it felt like a lot longer than it should have been, but I thought Kerry Price was the best goaltender on the planet for quite some time. Not just an 18-month stretch where Tim Thomas had that and you know to Brian Miller like I thought those guys were Brilliant in their own right, but I felt like Carrie Price was kind of the gold standard of that But maybe I'm you know, if you're looking at individual awards and stuff Yes, all of those guys are decorated, you know, and some of them decorated more than Carrie

But that Stanley Cups are a team thing Jerome McGinley Didn't win a Stanley Cup, but he won gold medal. You know just like Kerry Price did so that's kind of my thought process I don't think I'm right or wrong. That's just the way I look at it No, you know I mean I can't argue that Kerry Price was the best goalie for a longer stretch than Ryan Miller and probably for a longer stretch than To Garasco maybe never was considered the best goalie in the world better than Kerry, better than Hank, better than those other guys but yeah it's hard and it's hard to compare goal centers to positional players and you

know what is what is Alex McGilley being on the greatest World Junior line of all time? Does that work? How do you factor in what they do at World Juniors and what they do at the World Championships and those kind of those kind of events Which do factor in we're not as aware of them, especially for the Russian players from so maybe before you know The beret Fedorov McGillin group, but yeah, I mean I think I think Kerry gets in Kerry to me was the obvious fourth guy of the newcomers and clear clearly the fourth guy but You know where you're gonna go down Keith Kachuck or Al Mo or Kujo or you know, were you going to go down Keith

Kachuk or Al Mo or Kujo or a veteran guy or you're going to go back to, you know, another first-timer? And I guess they chose to go to a veteran guy this time. Yeah. We have Mike Johnson, our TSN hockey analyst. So, you know, the Mitch Marner pursuit is going to take place. You know, there's some rumblings who knows how truthful anything is this time of year that it's Vegas and you know maybe he's chosen that maybe they've already got it figured out wink wink nudge nudge and if that happens something's got to leave Vegas you know you would assume in order for the cap to make sense someone's got to go is that hurdle is that

Carlson of those two names that are seemingly out there, like how much value do you place in those two guys? How much do they have left in the tank? What are they worth? Is that something the Maple Leafs should pursue? Where do you stand on that? I mean, Hurdle's obviously better than Carlson. He also makes a lot more for a lot longer, so if that's a good or bad thing.

You know, he's younger. He's a dynamic center man. you know, put up 30 goals. A big, huge guy should be good in the playoffs with that, you know, the physical stature, but I don't think I don't have it in front of me. Does he, I would assume he has no move protection. Now maybe that doesn't matter in Vegas because they just make you wave it, but I would assume he wouldn't be harder to get out of there if you're going to do like a sign and trade or something like that.

William Carlson seems like a good stopgap guy for me. He's still a very good defensive player. So long as he stays healthy, he's like as a third line center, brilliant. And for 5 million bucks, I think that's what his salary is. That's a good third line center. That's what Anton Lundell makes exactly $5 million. And he's a great third line center. Now Carlson might not be that, but he's pretty close to it and that would

if Marner's leaving anyways and you need to replace the guy to play down the middle not the two centerman spot but at least a good quality guy I think if you could get William Carlson for that contract and give him the way that he would produce for this team I think that would be a pretty good transaction for the Maple Leaf. He's not going to give you the offense, but he fills a valuable role that you need to fill, and then you can focus the rest of your time and your money on finishing the rest of the top six. I would like it. If they could pull that off, I'm a Leaf fan, I wouldn't complain about that transaction. Yeah. Yeah, see that's where I'm at, like trying to figure out, you know, how they get creative

here like maybe it's simple, maybe they they work this out with Tavares and it sounds like that's still very likely. You know, and maybe it's a pipe dream, but Brad Marchand is a guy that gets to July one, and they they make that work. But you know, very rarely does it play out the way people expect it to play out, you know, especially on June 24th or June 25th. You know, like there's always curveballs

and there's always things that management is looking at that the general public is just not even thinking of. You know, like this time last year I don't remember referencing Oliver Ekman-Larson as a guy that the Leafs were going to target. Tanev? I thought that was possible. Ekman-Larson wasn a guy that the Leafs were going to target. Tanev? I thought that was possible. Ekman-Larson wasn't sure that was going to happen. So I'm curious where Tree Living takes this because we've been talking about Marner leaving and if Tavares leaves that's a lot of goals, that's a lot of points, that's a lot of continuity, that's a lot of consistency.

That's basically your guarantee to make the playoffs could be in question, but it also opens the door to so much opportunity in terms of how you want to spend your money and how you want to build your team out. And that's and that flexibility is something that is completely foreign to the Maple Leafs. Right. Like how many years, basically since COVID, have the Leafs had any sort of, well, maybe we can get creative. Maybe we have some money to spend. Never been the case.

It's been, they're locked in and then they're just trying to fill around the edges wherever they can. So yeah. And then the other part about it, Hazen, while we get a little bit focused on the Toronto-centric aspect on this, there's 31 other teams that also want these players. Yes.

Who are also smart people, who are also creative in management, who can think about good players. The Maple Leafs aren't the only ones, and the players the Leafs want are the same players the other teams want, for the same reasons the Leafs want them. So yeah, like, best laid plans today,

leading up into the draft at the end of the week, and on into free agency next week, they're hard to pull off, which is why if you can be proactive, if you can get something done before July 1st, because once July 1st hits, there's a lot of variables in play and you lose a lot of control over what's going to happen because other teams get involved in the timing of it all. If you could be proactive and if Marner's leaving anyways and he's going down to Vegas, then even if it's for two years,

if Vegas has to shed salary, if he's a player that you want, like take that guy, take Nick Wah off their hands, take whatever because then at least it's a no, burden the hand. You have it figured out, you have one item identified, you can apply a value to it and then have that piece of information to work the

rest of your 10 days off of that could help you. Johnny, how big of a factor do you think GM's being a dum-dum is going to be in the next 10 days? Because I've already seen some trades where I'm like there's some stupid people working in the league and I don't know if they know what they're doing, like acquiring different players. It's like, if you're trying to get better, I have no idea what you're doing. And by the way, guys, next week or maybe later this week, I want to do like a helpline where Doogie can call us and say, there's a GM thinking about signing this player for that money. Should we talk him out of it?

It's a helpline. We're the free agent frenzy helpline and we'll say do it or don't. But Johnny, how dumb do you think teams are going to be with this class of free agents? Well, I think history will have shown us, oh, that when there's money to spend, they'll spend it. Oh my gosh. us, oh, that when there's money to spend, they'll spend it. Right? Like, you know, and and they may value a guy at $7 million. But because everyone's got $15 million in space, that guy's gonna get seven and a half or eight or eight and a half or nine. And you're gonna

be on the desk going, what the heck is going on here? Why? I'll pass out. Crazy. Yeah, well, and I think we might see some of that. And I always think back to, hey, what year was it when the NBA had the massive salary cap jump? And you were, like, guys you didn't even heard of, I always say Lewald Deng, the old Duke player, he signed like a $120 million deal from the Lakers. And you're like, what? He was like an eighth man. Like, what is going on here?

Because they had to spend the money. And there are teams in NHL, like I looked at Anaheim after their deal with Zegras. They got like $33 million to spend. And that's before they maybe trade John Gibson as well. Like they're sitting on $36 million heading into July 1. Like you gotta spend 20 of it just to get to the salary cap floor. So, oh, I guess guess i'm saying is that

not that they're down but they will be caught up in the availability of money and using it to try to make their team better in a way that they would not have done in previous years when that cap increase was not such a guarantee in john i a baryat's dumb if you're gonna have a half a day off when and about what trade with particularly dumb in the last week? Which one was the most?

No, I'm not going to get into that. I'm not ending my year on this program. I'm not going to start crap talking people and players. I'll save that for a fresh start in September. But there's just moves where I'm like, what did you need to do that for what the hell is that gonna do here's here's what I mean if you're Philadelphia is their upside on the Zegrist I mean they didn't give up much right like you're you give up Ryan Paling a second and a fourth immediately noodles what's that if you look at Paling's numbers last year from

the egress they're almost identical Jake who in the right man the games played goals, they're almost identical. You're like, who in the right man, the games played, goals assist. They're almost identical, paling to Zegras. Not to suggest they will be in the future, but yeah. But when I saw that tree, guys, the first thing that came to mind was not good move Philly, good move Anaheim. All I could think was, if you're Trevor Zegras today, you're like, damn, that's what the league thinks of me right that's that's my value around the league I was on the cover of the video game two years ago I

was the biggest star on the rise two years ago yeah he was a year to trick shot artist that's what he was he hasn't become a hockey player yet and that's what he has to decide if he wants to do you want to be a guy that does trick shots behind the net flip arounds or do you want to be a grown-ass man and play the game properly? Well, but I think what the message that was just sent from the league saying anyone could have traded a first-round pick for him. Nobody wanted to. You don't think Anaheim would have preferred a first-round pick over respectfully Ryan Poehling in a second and a fourth, but nobody did. Like that's my first

reaction. That trade was noodles. It was like, if you're Trevor Ziegres you should take that to heart and take it as motivation like I better get my act together change the way I play so I can change the perception because the whole league doesn't think that much of me right now yeah that's kind of what we talked about a little bit yesterday like it's not a King's ransom to get him. He's 24, he makes 5.7 million. He might be at a little bit of a crossroads in his career as to where are you going to head? What is your ceiling?

Now, talk is, you know, it'll be interesting to see. I guarantee you talk is saying to Danny Breyer, I want some more talent in here. So he is a talented player. But I feel like in Anaheim there's some players that push past him with his development now he was injured I get that but he is a guy like like Oh said he's a little bit more like Pavel Barber is that his name Pavel Barber yeah I own Instagram I love watching his his videos okay but but in the end you know like you've got to be a player that is relied on, you know, five on five shift

and in scenarios on the power play. He's certainly going to get looks in Philadelphia, but you're right. It's a great point, Johnny. This is how the league views you right today as where you were 18 to 24 months ago when you were on the front cover of PlayState. It does, man. Well, that's it. Yeah, it's- You can disagree, it doesn't matter what you think. Because the only thing that matters is what the league thinks.

And the league's pretty clear. The league is really clear. I do know that you're right. Ryan Strowman's under contract, so he's not going anywhere. But Leo Carlson and Mason McTavish, Aston, at center, they're better than him. And I'm just a bit better than him. contract so he's not going anywhere but leo carlson and mason mcdavish after at that center they're better than him and i was just not certain that

didn't watch is not some vancouver the gm make a comment about brock best sir in the offers that he got for him last year where he was left you would be a lot of money yeah i would be shocked at what the offers were for Brock Besser this year. Yeah. What's the GM out there saying? Yeah, Patrick Alveen. Alveen, sir.

We're ending on a high note here. We'll carve him in September. What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts?

What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? What's his nuts? not about that in a common expression that's on the way we're going to get a lot of guys yes exactly that's what i would have like i don't have to be very happy about it

yeah we are well besters besters an interesting case man because it's a money i well but i think that has that job with what we just said how do you how johnny is he going to get seven million a year no he can't get anything they could get any form of the trade that line but now he's going to make a fortune did we just established the league trade deadline but now he's going to make a fortune didn't we just established the league is telling you that he's not worth that much well johnny you go into the jam

i mean i i mean i'm like who i don't know what he was asking for maybe that before help that was going to be there right now and i think i've done a progress or get thirty million dollars on that contract however the term is to be pictures to be five could be five, whatever, you're gonna get $30 million. Could be four, could get seven and a half for four. Yeah.

Roll score, like look at the UFA class and the money out there. Which is why, Hayes, back to your original point, I think league-wide, everyone is thinking creatively now. Like offer sheets and sign and trade and different ways to move and get assets because with all the money there's not enough good players as UFAs to warrant the amount of money that is out there.

So Brock Bester being what? Is he like the seventh best UFA? I mean you have Mara obviously one, Tavares is up there as well. Nick Ehlers would be right there. Yeah. Am I missing anyone? Are you talking to Florida guys? Yeah, Bennett, obviously Bennett and Marchand. Yeah. And Eklad. So like whatever. He's in the top 10.

There's 30 teams. There's all this money. Goals are hard to come by. He scores goals. Someone's going to give him $7 million. Someone or more. I don't disagree. And you know what what like I could name a few teams but I think the Ottawa Senators will look at him. That's a guy like the Ottawa Senators need guys who can finish. Okay Jamie let's start the hotline right now. Hey this is Craig calling in with a scoop for you three guys. The Ottawa Senators are gonna give Brock Besser three years times eight.

Discuss amongst yourselves. This is a helpline. Talk to the Sens. Should they do it or should they not, Hazy B? You want, I'll start. You know what, I actually like that because the shorter term you can get out from underneath it a few years. Yeah, I know. Like Ottawa is not a team that generally is spending to the cap. Right. You know, like if it's going to go up seven million a year, eight million a year, there's going to be a lot of teams, including Canadian teams, they're going to have a difficult time not

necessarily getting to the floor, but they're not going to be up against the cap. Okay, so another part of the helpline is there's different parts of the deal. Besser says to you, it's got to be five years. Well, then I start to have a different possible look at that because auto i i don't see anything happening this summer or auto or launches in the cup contender next year but i i still think

some patients but i would say that about the habs as well like the habs have a real i think they could have a fork in the road which people much or all may not want to hear but if you play your cards right and you're patient one more time, like one more year, you could really accumulate some assets from desperate teams, from teams that really wanna win

or feel like they can win right now, kick the can down the road one more year. Doesn't mean you're gonna be awful. Doesn't mean you can't still make the playoffs. But like there's this viewpoint in Montreal, like, okay, you made the playoffs, the last 20 games were great, get better, get better, get better get better get better

I'd make the argument maybe be patient And in a year, that's when you lost Here's a word for you have to do but Ottawa could be the same thing internal improvements Yes, Dan Adoff, you know another year for those that top line Elaine Hudson Ryan backer. Yeah,, like you've got some players. Don't expedite the process quite yet. Just because you played five more games in the spring. Getting back to the hotline.

Same thing with Ottawa and Besser. Johnny, where are you at? Three years at eight for Brock. I'm going to say, you know what? I like Brock Besser. He serves a need. Ottawa, a good team, one of the lowest scoring five on five teams in the league. But I think we should send that money on defense.

We can find something closer to Brock Bester in trade or for less money, Mason Marchman, players like that that could be floating around out there. More than give him eight, I'm rather looking at defense that could help us because I think they're harder to find. So I gotta save my money and prioritize the different need and stay away from Bester, not because I don't don't like them because I need to spend that money elsewhere. The hotline's blowing up

man like different viewpoints this is great stuff. I love the hotline we're doing it all week yeah doing it all the week. What about I would we have to come up with a fake call. You would take best or not. It is a bit written but I still believe like you do need goals they need finishers. What about Vancouver? Don't they need finishers? But who's scoring goals in Vancouver? Vancouver is out of trouble crossroads. Yes Vancouver cake Vancouver was on the cusp ascending last year Patterson Hughes all these great players JT Miller Demco healthy tempo and all of a sudden now

And all of a sudden now, in the next, well, what do you mean? We're in June here. By next March, could Quinn Hughes be out of there? Like think if he leaves, then it's all, like, it's completely a different looking, rebuilt, fielding team from a team that was right there on the cusp a year ago. Like they are a team that almost feels like they got to make something happen or they got to be good this off season because of it goes wrong. And Quinn Hughes to his credit has sort of acknowledged, I think I might want to go play with my brothers in Jersey,

unless you give me a reason not to, they got to give him a reason not to, or else he's out of there. I would just move off the barrier. That's the game. because if you're just going to try to pretend and like... He's the second best defenseman in the world. Yeah. Dude, I get that. He's a hard guy to move off of. I know, but if you're going to bluff him and say... In a market that doesn't come to the game unless you're good with an owner that likes to be good so he can make money. It's a really good with an owner that likes to be good so we can make money. It's a really tight needle to thread out there right now. I get that, Johnny, but if you're going to just go ahead and put skinny jeans on a monster,

it's not going to work. Sorry. Skinny jeans on Tim Heron? Is that what you're suggesting? Lumpy. All it is is just like, I'm going to try to make this thing look good, but all you've got is a monster walking around in skinny jeans. That does not have a lot to do with the NHL, but you guys know what that looks like. But that guy thinks he looks great. We established that.

That's the problem. I know he does, but when you pull his t-shirt off that's halfway up his barrel it's a mess uh... and one of the best analogy to prefer to be able to work for her that's the man who works on its and he's using on a monster uh... look at this guy look at this guy getting the golf ball not not bending

down i'm using the suction it's got a suction cup uh... it's a professional has a suction cup on the end of the potter not tremendous let's just add knee surgery or back surgery on the horizon but he's inexcusable now two-shot penalty uh... that's an installed thing you know you install a such a fraction dude that's that's that's been cut construction that's right and that's an installed thing you know you have stall as a contraption dude that's that's a ten-count contractions that's right and that's literally batman stuff but i would not be against pg a rules like you're not allowed any additional

side here he doesn't need not make the cut anyway yeah i guess i'm suctioning this on the back of the home but i think they have over there at the hoover uh... over heron alone on the back line going home. Nickname Hoover. Yeah, the Hoover. Hoover, Heron. I love it. All right, Johnny, we'll do it again soon. Thank you for this.

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