OverDrive - Johnson on the Maple Leafs' frame of mind against the Panthers, Matthews' goalless skid and the legacy of the stars

Episode Date: May 13, 2025

TSN Hockey Analyst Mike Johnson joined OverDrive to discuss the priorities for the Maple Leafs to bounce back in Game 5 against the Panthers, Auston Matthews looking to gain his offensive stature, his skill set outside of his goal scoring, the legacy of the stars in the series and more.

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Visit a Bell store or bell.ca slash rate plans for details. Bell, mobile plans just got better. This May, iHeartRadio celebrates Asian Heritage Month. Discover powerful stories, vibrant cultures, and unforgettable music. From inspiring podcasts to playlists that span east, south, southeast and west Asian artists, we're honoring the voices shaping our world. Listen now on the free iHeartRadio app and at iHeartRadio.ca. I'm trying to think, if I was doing like overdrive in Sweden and I was talking about the World

Championships and I looked at the scoreboard without having seen the game because we've been on the air and I saw Canada only beat France 5-0, I think I would say that's disappointing and an underwhelming effort by the Canadians. Let's chat with a guy who actually was in the building watching the game. Here's Mike Johnson, our TSN hockey analyst. How do we only beat France five nothing? What happened here, Johnny? Well, I did set the over under at seven and a half. So they did hit the under. I'm with you. I thought, you know, eight or so. They, I'll get the team credit days. And I've been

in this tournament. I've played in it, I've covered it a million times. These first few games that you're playing Austria and France and Slovenia, and they're going to win. So like trying to up the intensity for 60 full minutes can be a challenge. And I thought they played the first 10, 12 minutes really well. They scored two goals and made it to nothing. And then they kind of got typically predictably a little bit sluggish a little bit separated They didn't really give up any chances. Jordan Bittington made his debut today in the tournament. So he's up and running Powerplay continues to cook two for two best in the power best in the tournament. That's good news

Um, but it was like a professional mature almost respectful Performance. They didn't want to try to score 18 goals whatever it might be so there could have been more yes what I think is gonna be more yes but I'm not gonna criticize them for it was a very very professional effort this tournament because there are games like this that go along where occasionally you'll get like a four two game you're like what happened there it wasn't really close never really felt close and they did what they had to do which is all you're trying to get through in the first three four

games exactly get out there and win find a way to win any way it happens you'll take it and move on the same logic will apply tomorrow night down at Scotiabank Arena game five Leafs Panthers it doesn't matter how it looks right it's not how it's how many find a way to. But based on what you've seen through four games and the way that this series has played out, what is your best guess on what the game might look like tomorrow? In other words, high scoring like the first few games,

low scoring like we saw in game four, kind of nervous energy early in the game. What are you anticipating or what are you projecting could be the kind of early in the game. What would, what are you anticipating or what are you projecting could be the kind of mood of the game tomorrow night? Yeah, I mean, I think it will be played more on the terms of the Florida Panthers in that lower scoring, probably tighter checking,

pretty physical, certainly nervy and tense for Toronto Maple Leaf players and fans because even though they're, you know, they're even with two out of three games at home, that is actually a pretty good position to be in. When they were the better team in the regular season, it just doesn't feel that way right now because game four went the way it did. But I think it'll be sort of floor is onto their game.

They make you play the way that they do and when they do it, they're hard to beat. But I think Toronto's gonna have to find a way to almost beat Florida in that style. Not at Florida's game, but playing that style to have success. I expected like 3-2, 3-1, empty netter kind of game, super tight and, um, and someone's going to have to find a way to, to break through for Toronto, get around the front of the net a bit more, right? Get the puck, possess it and get to the front of the net where the goal is

scored, where Matthew Nye seems to be about the only guy who can just handle on it in around there. Uh, I do think coming home, Hayes, the matchups will be different. I think you want to keep William Nylander away from Gus Forsling This for the money one of the few players who could sort of skate and have the feet to try to corral Nylander I don't know if they like the Lundell matchup with Matthew So like this make you can dictate the stuff there and maybe give Toronto a better chance to find some open ice Well, so Mike I chatted briefly with William Nealander today and he mentioned something

exactly what you're talking about. He said, we need more playoff style goals. I think that's probably exactly what you're talking about. But I was actually curious to know your thoughts on, it looks like they're going to keep the lineup the same. And I wonder like why you think Matthews Marner hasn't really been the same in the playoffs as it is in the regular season. Like why?

Why do you think it's just been a little? I don't know not there So I mean first off I'll say like I'm just checking today at five on five like I think Matthews is ten four three against Yeah, and that line in this series is five two Right. So so while the sky is falling because he doesn't have any goals This guy's not falling because when he't have any goals, the sky is not falling because when he's out there he's outscoring the opposition. I think why it has a hard time working against Florida specifically or maybe just in general

in the playoffs, the answers are obvious. It's tighter tracking, these guys thrive on open ice and they're better at open ice than the players that they play against the regular season. But there's less open ice there. So their numbers are going to go down relative to what they experienced. I think Mitch Marner, who's been good, he's been solid. He's been good. I think Mitch Marner specifically is a guy who thrives on sort of puck touches,

possession of the offensive zone and generally works the edges of the offensive zone and then creates for his line mates in the center and he doesn't get nearly as many touches and you certainly don't really score from the edges you get points perhaps but you don't often score he had the one goal was a wrister kind of through traffic that was not lucky but an unusual goal so I mean I think there's style reasons I think Florida obviously is a very good defensive team when they're on top of their game. That doesn't help. And I don't want to go back to it because if you have.

But the reality is like I am fully anticipating some sort of update whenever the league season ends, whether it's in a month or it's in four days that Austin Matthews has something wrong with him. Like something because in that dynamic with Matthews and Marner, Marner works the edges, Matthews works the interior, right? You've got the body to get there. You've got the quick release when he gets there, but he's just not quite as good at it right now. He's not quite as explosive getting there or shooting it once he has it there.

And so the whole thing doesn't look quite as good. So That's the synopsis and that's not new what I'm talking about except for maybe Matthews health That might be the newest development this year But that's sort of been the story of their existence in the playoffs and it's exacerbated Because they're playing Florida who is as physical as organized and as pressuring at what i think you believe yeah i don't want to like i don't want to put the cup for the horse and start

discussing hypotheticals after the series but but matthews was pushed on what happened to last year against boston he said nothing so why would we expect he's going to give you details and if he does give me details, six months, right? He's like Ben, since training camp, he's had stuff going on. So it almost, he, I'm not saying he owes. And when I say we're going to hear about it, he's very private. He might not say anything.

He'd rather just take because if they don't say anything, it reminds me from a Joel Thornton had that one playoff series in Boston. He's playing with, I think they're playing Montreal. He's playing with I think they're playing Montreal He's playing with like a broken rib or torn rib muscle and he was a shell of himself But in the postseason presser, nobody said anything and he was crucified for the way he played Even though everyone the organization should have known why he was playing the way he was I almost think for Matthew's own benefit, if there was something wrong with him, they should say, like, yeah, all year he was dealing with a herniated disc, all year he had a hernia in his groin, whatever. Just to let people know that this is what

was going on, it wasn't just fully healthy and this is what he looked like, because that would be a stranger answer than than nothing yet again in the past they've they've they've done that i get it this is longer we believe you know it's been longer yet the guys averaging over twenty two minutes a night killing penalties taken draws you know playing well just not for that but that and that's that's my thing i don't like he's got a score i'm sorry i just i can't i can't accept you just a sorry man like it you're in your nine here and he's he scored three goals in

his last 20 playoff games I'm sorry you just like dry subtle played with what did he have a couple years ago it was a little sprain oh I ankle sprain gruesome barely move gruesome what did he do scored every single night so like this is the playoffs man every Every putt he's heard. Kachuk can barely move. You know. You can see he's not the same right? Like in which way? When he shoots the puck he's not it's not the same. How? It's not as quick. It's not that he's not beating goalies clean. Could he be overthinking it? Does it look the same to you? I would argue that the one the back door Bobross key where he waited on a minute tried to put it out that that's not

injury man that's over thinking is that the one where you kind of double-clutch yes that's not going to have a really need to yeah i'll pay the pay in velocity on his mid-range shot like the twenty to thirty feet it down like seven miles an hour average last year yeah and that's what i mean feet is down like seven miles an hour on average from last year.

Yeah, and that's very beatiful. Like that's a massive amount. If he goes from 85 mile an hour average to 78, all of a sudden he shoots it more like Mike Johnson. That's not working for anybody, right? Like what separates him is that shot. So if the injury is related to his ability to shoot the puck, then there is something.

And I'm not giving anyone a pass, like I get it. You're right, Dave, this is the playoffs. This is the second round. And you know we have this conversation all the time, Jonas is on my side, like I very much can appreciate the process and the randomness of the results. And sometimes you can't control the results because you gotta control the process. That's in the regular season. Right now process

means diddly, means absolutely bupkis. All that matters is results. This is the playoffs. You can get out shot by 40 to 15 if you go and score two goals. That's all that matters. And so for him he knows this. He knows this but if you're asking me why that's what I'm suggesting is the reason why. And I don't know how that gets solved for tomorrow's game, other than perhaps getting away from some matchups, other than perhaps a change in strategy or philosophy on the power play.

And maybe a smidge of luck would be nice for him as well. Well absolutely there's things around it right? Yeah for sure I mean and the beauty of it is Jonas you can jump in here is this these are the legacy games now like more so than game one or two or three like this is what was always going to be remembered. He got through the first round he had he scored the first goal in game six that was very significant and but this was always going to be remembered. He got through the first round, he had a, he scored the first goal in game six, that was very significant. And, but this was always going to be the difference maker for all of them is what do you do in the best two out of three when the series has been shrunk and you're playing an opponent like this. This is it. So the previous parts are completely irrelevant.

Remember, they are up three oh, then it's's 3-1, then it's 3-2, and then it was this conversation again. I do want to ask Mike one thing related to all this. You're probably the perfect person to ask. How much, if anything, do you think the style of play affects Matthews in terms of how they play offensively, if at all? I think it affects them for sure. I mean, I think the offense was easier and more bountiful.

Right? Like just the quantity was so much higher when they played under Sheldon Keefe, right? Offensively speaking. It just, he just got more. Got more looks, more chances. They also gave up more, but they got more. So I think offensively, it's more of a grind. It's harder, right?

Cycle chances, dump and chase is harder to create than the way they, you know, the way they used to do it. But the reality for him is he's the greatest goal scorer in the world. He's the highest paid player in the league. You have to find a way to thrive regardless of the system. And you know, he's maybe not thriving. I don't know if the system is part of it, the opponent is part of it, the health is part of it. Who knows? Maybe the pressure of the moment is part of it. We don't want to say that, but who knows? Right? It might be, it might be because there's a lot of pressure on these guys. They care so much and they understand

what's at stake. And you make a great point Hayes, because you know what people are talking about today in Edmonton? Not Stu Skinner in his safe percentage in the first couple games of the playoffs when he wasn't very good. They're talking about a guy who sat out for two weeks, came in and pitched a shot out and was rock solid. And like that's what people remember. When the chips are on the down, game is on the line, who comes through? And you come through.

And you know, they have that opportunity. And maybe that's how you have to spin it, right? Not that they have that pressure or that responsibility or that burden. They have that opportunity. And can you imagine if Austin and Mitch and Willie and John and Moe and they go out there and they have big games, two games in a row and knock off the defending champs. What that would do to just not erase but rewrite how their entire existence is viewed whether they win a cup or not if they were able to do that it would be would change everything absolutely how there and that's the

opportunity they have in the next couple games. That's what I'm driving at is you know listen heavy is the head that wears's the crown austin where's it and he's worn it for nine years what comes with with what comes with that is a lot of responsibility and a lot and a lot more expectation than the guy behind you and certainly than the guy eleven slots behind you but you know that and that's all that's the end and yet the beauty of sp of sport and the the

luck i think the fortune that these guys collectively out and I don't know if they look at it this way is That Brendan Shanahan in particular has continued to put trust and faith in them that they will Do it and an understanding that when they do it if they do it Everything else will be washed away. Yeah, and that is what is in front of them over the next six nights. Less than that, five nights. Is literally if you go out there and play like rock stars and win two of the next three games, no one's gonna remember well, game four against Columbus, exactly. No one's like, hey, it's all

gonna be, it's all gonna change change and then you have an opportunity to even to leapfrog even further from that with the next round and the next round and it is it's just a massive massive opportunity for them and you know if it's right there in front of them they just they've got to do it again a factor in the take advantage of this chance in yes it's it's more difficult for matthews in this system because also he's killing penalties now. He didn't under Sheldon

Keefe like he sat there. I don't think that hurts though. I mean Having I mean played my whole career now. I've never been Austin Matthews like killing penalties. I Don't know how much that like, you know the the the Minute he plays there if that takes away from his five on five energies I don't I don't know it's more the freebie at the end of the penalty I guess right like because Keith was famous for that like penalty killed he'd throw the three of them over a lot of times right load them up after yes well when there's a first period like the other night where

Neal under just doesn't play right right yes and I guess that was not but that's the office the opposite is austin state in the game and which they have his airplane you know they had the legs and i don't know it's uh... but i think that they've right there you know perfectly you laid out perfectly i think in a normal sort of team situation the overriding sentiment would one would be one of sort of hope and maybe optimism because of what you just said. What you just said.

But because of the reality of their history and how bad game four looks, there probably doesn't steal that sense of hope and optimism. It's more dread and pessimism About what could happen and what if it goes wrong? What they shut out when they can't score because that's what's happened in the past This is the you know

This is the reality that that the guys have been here for a long time that they have to carry until they Until they push it aside, which they could in just two good games or not even two good games haze It could be two crappy games and two wins Yeah, like that's it. Yes, that's it. When two games could be Joseph wall being great It would be maxed only coming through it could be Stephen Lawrence off his butt and like, you know what? They're different Yeah, these guys are different. Yeah, that's right What is that state that is what's at stake, starting tomorrow night. All right, Johnny, we'll leave it there.

Enjoy yourself over there, buddy. We'll do it again later in the week. All right, it's gonna be a late night tomorrow night to watch that one. I might have to go live with it because I am, honestly. I know, I'm jacked. I'm not the car trash guy. Like, I don't want, like, I'm not staying up

to see Toronto do poorly. I generally kind of want to see the guys do well I want to see the guy like whether they win or lose I want to see these guys who care and have been through the ringer and will go through the ringer if it doesn't go well I'd like to see them come out you know playing by their standards playing well and then see what happens I'm with you on that go out and exactly just play well try to control the game find a way to get a win They deserve it moreover and more importantly the fans they deserve it like leave fans

Deserve it go find a way to them up Alright, Johnny good luck with that You too Mike Johnson our TSN hockey analyst. 28th and 29th at Burles Creek. With VIP weekend passes and camping plus $500 cash to spend on merch. Don't call it a phase. Enter daily at iHerbRadio.ca