OverDrive - Naylor on expectations for the Argos for the rest of the season, Lemon being reinstated, and Rourke returning to MOP form

Episode Date: July 17, 2025

TSN football insider Dave Naylor joins OverDrive to share his thoughts on what the expectation should be for the Argos after a 1-4 start. Naylor gives his take on Shawn Lemon being reinstated and Nathan Rourke returning to MOP form.

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The station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required. Just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on I hear radio.ca or the free I heart radio app all right week seven of the CFL beginning tonight and Chad Kelly still not ready to return it sounded like you you know he's real close the Argos are in Montreal

They're a massive underdog. I think a double-digit dog. I think ten and a half on Fandl I believe Alouettes three and two they've off, you know off to a pretty good start the East seemingly like every other year is more watered down than the West Here's our CFL NFL reporter and insider. Here's Dave Nailor. How you doing now gun? Hey Brian, you know you mentioned the the West dominance over the East in the CFL Hey, Brian, you know, you mentioned the West dominance over the East in the CFL. This is one of the things that I always get asked about, like why, why, why, why? And I have no answer. I've tried to answer it a million times. There was a period in like the last four or five years where like for a year, remember when the Golden State Warriors were just rocking like just steamrolling everybody, like there were complaints that the

NBA had become non-competitive because of the golden state warriors right around that time for about a year and a half had a higher win percentage again pete in the cfl than the golden state warriors did in the nba well well i can't and and i can tell you what goldens had that win percentage I can't tell you why CFL West is

I'm not sure either and yet you get to the great cup and you know the Argos would sneak in a win Yeah, and you know would obviously you know you get to a one game playoff and anything can happen And even in the West with that being the case like the depth it seems like Winnipeg has just been the pace car for so Long, but you look at the Argos with that being the case like the depth seems like winnipeg has just been the pace car for so long but you you look at the Argos and you know there's been a lot of discussion about how many guys they've lost and especially on the defensive side of things and they're one in four they're in tough you know they're waiting for Kelly to

return as we said the east it does not appear as if anyone's going to run away with this it's still possible it's early in the season but what what do you think the are goes are are thinking right now like what is a reasonable expectation for them the rest of the way in and do you think they can get to a point the season where they feel comfortable they can and will

make the playoffs you know i i think we're really on the chad kelly train here and you know from from my my latest information at the start of the week was Chad Kelly was running Skelly, but he still wasn't running team drills. So I'm not sure it's like that close. It may still be a little while away

based on what he's doing in practice. And look, this is kind of deja vu for the Argos, right? Cause they missed Kelly for half the season last year because of the suspension. But here's the difference. And Nick Arbuckle basically was the guy last year because of the suspension, but here's the difference. And Nick Arbuckle basically was the guy last year like he has been this year. Here's the difference.

Last year, their defense was playing pretty well, especially after the first month of the season, and it was also a scoring defense. They were getting like a pick six or a fumble recovery, force fumble deep in territory, they're creating turnovers in short field. So it was a lot of complimentary football that the defense was providing to pick up an offense

that wasn't really in sync. Same thing on special teams. I mean, Janarian Grant was a machine last year in terms of giving the Argos field position. So, you know, I mean, the definition of complimentary football is basically when one side of the ball is not doing its job the other side will pick it up and compensate they were getting that last year when chad kelly was out they're not

getting it this year at that's the difference between last year's articles of kelly in this year what about down there and uh... hamilton i'd like to what you're seeing from their quarterback play enough of their defense it you know it's funny the the first few weeks of the season, everybody was jacked up to see what Hamilton would be like. Because they finished really strong last year, Boley by Mitchell had a huge second half.

They go out and sign Kenny Lawler, who's maybe the best receiver in the league. And the first two, three weeks, it was like, when's the show begin? Where are the fireworks? What is this? And the last two or three weeks, it was like, when's the show begin? Where are the fireworks? What is this? And the last two or three weeks, it's been a different show. I mean, Kenny Lawler is playing

at such an exceptional level right now. I think of the last time we've seen a receiver in the CFL who's that dominant. And look, this guy was a big time player in college. He played with Jared Goff at Cal, and he was a draft pick of the Seahawks, of course, former teammate of our friend Luke Wilson while draft pick of the Seahawks, of course, former teammate of our friend Luke Wilson while he was with the Seahawks,

and he's a guy who's had a lot of injuries, so they hasn't really put together that spectacular season, but the GM in Hamilton, Ted Gavaya, was the assistant GM in Winnipeg. So he knows Kenny Lawler, he knew what he was buying, he went out in the market, paid top of the value, and that's what they're getting from him. I mean, again, it's not like he's wide open.

Like, this is a guy who's a contested catch guy. Like, he's a physical receiver. He will go vertical, and he will fight you for the football. That's what we've seen in him. And on the defensive side of the ball, Hamilton, their second overall pick in the draft this year was a guy out of Windsor, from the University of Windsor named Devin Varasek.

And he got a look-see in Indianapolis and was a little bit late for Ticat camp because he was kind of waiting to see if he could sign in the NFL. But linebacker from U-sports to the CFL, especially middle linebacker, tends to be a very rare path. Like Mike O'Shea did it 30 years ago, coming out of Guelph and was starting for the Thai Cats but but most new sport linebackers

end up as special teams players in the CFL a lot of them and then a lot of them you know don't really good if they do get into starting roles it's not going to be very quickly. Devin Barasek has started three games and been a linebacker for Hamilton the last three games they've won them all he's I believe led them in tackles every one of those games let all players in fact and has a pick six so this is a special player uh... that that is you do you think we don't see very often so they're getting some presence on the

offensive side of all getting some presence on the defense inside of all i think people feel a lot better about the direction the tycats than they were the first couple weeks of the year david talked about knowing what you're buying and I think the Calgary Stampeders would be pretty happy with what they got in Vernon Adams jr. and of course BC was in a bit of a bind last year they had Rourke they had Adams and Adams moves on to Calgary they're 4-1 now what can you say about his play with that team this season? I'll tell you the Calgary Stampeders

must be looking at the stars going, what are the chances that when we bottomed out, you know, and we're ready to retool the roster and change a bunch of the coaching staff and begin that rebuilding process and look for our next guy, that Vernon Adams is available? 31 years old, seasoned, proven, I mean, it was anybody else but Nathan Rohr that with the opportunity to go to BC, Vernon Adams would still be their quarterback and and he's not just you know a dynamic player and a guy who can do all kinds of things at

his position, he's also a guy who sets culture. Everywhere Vernon Adams has been he's been a leader, he's a guy who understands this league and and you know kind of how to conduct himself off season, in season, I remember talking to Jalen Philpott, one of the Philpott twins who was a free agent last year after starting three years with Calgary, and I was talking to him about the decision to go back to the stands after they kind of bottomed out last year. And it was clear he'd spent a lot of conversations

in the off season with Vernon Adams. Vernon Adams arrived in Calgary and not only became starting quarterback, but he became the leader of the team to retain guys. And it's been dramatic. The other thing they did was, I mean, Calgary had the worst record in the league last year. So you get the first overall pick.

Getting the first overall pick in the CFL is not like getting the first overall pick in the NFL. You're still probably picking a developmental player, you're probably still picking a guy who's not gonna have an impact on your roster, till maybe late in his rookie year, maybe even year two. Well they took a guy named Damian Alford, who played most of his college career in Syracuse,

but that Utah last year was hurt all year. I mean he had, I think it was like six for 155 and two touchdowns on the weekend. Second straight game he's had a touchdown. He's a 6'5", 6'6", guy out of Montreal. He can high point the ball. He's got speed. We don't usually see rookie Canadian receivers

splash like this in their first two months in the league. So there are a few things going right in Calgary, but definitely Vernon Adams. I mean, it's just, it's such a luxury for a rebuilding team to be able to go out find a player like that right in the heart of his prime and start to build around it with dave nailer and the obviously the reason he was available was because

nathan roark was yeah on his way back to bc and uh... it didn't go well for for work last year the transition after you know taking kicks at the can of the nfl and jumping around you know taking kicks at the can at the NFL and jumping around you know to a bunch of different spots in the NFL obviously Jacksonville first and foremost but the last few weeks he's looked he's looked pretty good I mean they just laid a beating on on Struddy's Alkes in his backyard Edmonton and he's thrown he's very efficient in terms of throwing he didn't have to run the ball because they were winning so big the other day on

Sunday night I believe it was but the previous few games his legs looked better Like that's what he was right now gun before he had that really tough injury a couple years ago Like he was a dual threat with his arm with his legs He looks like he's pretty pretty close to being back to form from my standpoint Where do you stand on Nathan Rourke and him possibly getting back to that MOP status? I very much agree with you Brian. I think we saw it right in week number one in their first win against the Alks and then

he has the injury the next couple of weeks and it's an oblique so it's the kind of thing that takes some time to heal and he's taken practice in first team one day and then not the next and that kind of in and out of the line up thing he was working but I thought he played very well in the game the other night. Look, I'm not surprised here. You know, Nathan works 27 years old, so he's not a kid anymore. He's right in the heart of his prime. And when you come back from the National Football League in mid-season, there's not much of

a history of guys like really coming back and lighting it up the second half of the year. I mean, there were three prominent players that came back from the NFL last year. Matthew Betts came back from the Detroit Lions, BC Lions last year, didn't have a great second half. Austin Mack came back from the Atlanta Falcons, the Montreal, the receiver, he didn't have a great second half.

And neither did Nathan Rourke. And look, I don't know this, but I'm gonna speculate that, like Nathan Rourke's a kid who grew up in Oakville, dreaming of playing in the national football league. And you know, he got himself there, and once you get there in the kind of position he was in as a free agent coming out of the CFL, you need some things

to break your way. I mean, it's just the way it is. Like, if Brock Purdy hadn't had everybody fall down in front of him in San Francisco, we wouldn't know who he is. I mean, it's just, they just don't make way for seventh round picks or free agent quarterbacks. You kind of just need things to fall in your direction to get an opportunity. It never really did for Nathan. And like, I'm sure processing the end of that

NFL dream, and I don't want to say it's over for him in the NFL, but the odds are unlikely that he ends up going back. It's just the longer you're here, the older you get, the less opportunity there is to make that jump. So I'm sure that was something that just emotionally was tough for him to process last year but you know he's reset him. I thought he looked kind of burned out at the end of last year but he's really reset himself this offseason. You know the Lions are a bit of a work in progress but I don't think Nathan Rourke is. I think you know if he's the outstanding player at the end of this year I will not be surprised at all and

I think he's going to have a very you know good season and a long career in the CFL. He really looks like the guy that we saw in 2022 before he went to Jacksonville. Dave, as you know, the Elks turned to some of their alumni to fill some important positions in their organization, including GM and president, got a new coach, everything's changed. Are you seeing enough traction that this team is gonna maybe find a different path into the second half? I mean, it's a bye week in Edmonton, and I think they got conversations about what to do on both sides of the ball. I mean, the Trey Ford thing gets a lot of the attention,

and just to put Trey Ford in context for people who don't understand it. Trey Ford played football at the University of Waterloo. In the last 50 years, the number of U-sport quarterbacks who have been handed the keys to an offense, like not as a fill-in duty, but like you're our guy, out of the gate number one, he's it. Like there's nobody else.

So he's trying to do something that isn't done very often. He's, again, an athletically freakish player who can, you know, make Lamar Jackson type plays at times, but he also can mess up simple plays. And that's, that's been the variance that, that people have seen in Trey Ford. And I think there is a discussion in Edmonton about, you know, looking at sort of what is his first five games of the season been. It was a big step backwards against BC, they gotta win.

I mean you can't rebuild a fan base once you get to one and six or one and seven. You're talking about next year, so that's one conversation I think is being had and the other is the defense. I mean they wouldn't spend a, in relative terms, a boatload on their defense, particularly the front six or seven. And they have given up the most points per game this season, they've given up the most yards per game this season, and they've given up the most passing yards this season.

When you go out and spend the kind of money, I mean, they've got a couple of defensive linemen that are making the excess of $250,000, which in CFL money is a lot for a defensive player. And it's just not getting it done. And I don't think that makes the assignment for Trey Ford any easier because as a young quarterback you don't want to put him in a position where you're chasing scores in the second half and that's where they've been you know most of the time

with Dave Naylor at TSN, CFL NFL reporter and insider week seven of the CFL beginning tonight Argos in in Montreal playing the Alouettes. So a big story that you broke this week, Sean Lemon has been reinstated by the CFL. Stewart Johnston, of course, the new commissioner of the CFL. Lemon famously was suspended indefinitely last April for wagering on CFL games. And he's not a young guy. He's, I believe, 36. He's a free agent now. So what does does this mean that he's been reinstated or he's surprised at all that

you know what seemed like a lifetime ban actually was fifteen sixteen months and what kind of market is going to be out there for yeah i would say what thirty six in the thirty six-year-old defense alignment suspended indefinitely that's probably the end of his career. I would have to do that at the time. And I think part of it was, like he appealed his suspension, right? And the basis of his appeal, I believe, was essentially, I didn't know you couldn't do that.

And... I didn't know you couldn't do that. Was that wrong? Was that wrong, the way during our hands or or nobody formally told me you can't do that i don't know that's really his argument right against actually and he went and got independent representation for that he's the cf it'd be the cfl p a did not represent him in his appeal which is pretty

unusual for a guy to go outside the union and and make that argument but i think i know the league office was not happy that he appealed, and maybe the fact that there's a new commissioner made this more possible. I think there was also a more contrite version of Sean Lemon in this case,

taking counseling, accepting counseling, not talking about the arguments that he made a year ago. But he lives in Montreal year-round. From my understanding, the Alouettes lobbied on his behalf in the background here and they do have a degree of interest i'm kind of surprised they haven't signed them or make a little while before you get the kickoff here's the other element of the story

he has a two game suspension for testing positive for banned substance so once he does get out no one told him that that was illegal to be fair to sean he wasn't aware that he couldn't do that was told that that was a little not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not not that everything finally about the next hour i think they can work out one of the two-game suspension tonight right uh... but uh... you'll be on the practice roster a few weeks anyway but what i think it comes down to precedent right if you look at

other leagues they'll he didn't back against his team he bet on his team it was i think one parlay ticket where he played like a hamilton tiger cat money line and a calgary stampede r plus six for like a hundred bucks canadian on an offshore so it wasn't like he you know he wasn't throwing games he didn't have ten grand on the game you still can't do it right but ultimately yeah the league didn't decide it was worth you know a lifetime ban okay and that's listen this is sticky

like the integrity of the sports stuff is sticky because everyone's in bed with with gambling gambling is legal now you know at least in the province of Ontario and I think we all know it's gonna be a ripple effect throughout the country at some point and it certainly is down in the states so it's going to be a ripple effect throughout the country at some point. And it certainly is down in the States. So it's a very different world than it used to be. Yet I think if anything more than ever, you probably have to be that much more diligent, right Dave? Because like now, like people that aren't gambling are really looking at this wonder like what's going on in the sports world.

What's right. Like it's, it's a different complexion today than it was 10 years ago. Well, absolutely. And, and to that point about diligence and listen, this is a real mystery. what's what right like it's it's a lot of production today that it was ten years ago well absolutely and to that point about diligence and listen this is a real mystery around the cfl i've had people from teams call me and say do you know how they caught up and i mean like not to tell me but ask me because here's the thing shon lemon played that bat with an offshore

right not with a license book right right so you would think okay you, if I find a book somewhere in Asia and place a parlay ticket on a, or Europe, because I believe that the currency that he bet in was Europe's, so it would have been in Europe somewhere, he bet one parlay ticket on a Thai cat and a stamp game, and the league found it. That's what's incredible to me, is that the league

found that. And's what's incredible to me, that the league found that. You've got to hide it in crypto now. You've got to hide it in crypto, Dave. Well, somebody from the team called me and said, do you know how they did it? Because I want to know, because I want to scare our young players by telling them, hey, don't try this. Because never mind betting on FanDuel or one of the partners or one of the well-known licensed books but even if you go to Europe on an unlicensed book obviously they can find it I have no idea how they did it but there is I think that tells you there is a level of diligence that the league was able to find that big time yeah that is very interesting yet you know Sean Lemon he's he's he's on his way back he to serve one more other suspension that is that'll get out of the way

you know i didn't do career fact that that and like the last time he was on the field for the first four weeks of last season and during the appeal and yet a product you get to the quarterbacks i expect he will be in our wet version okay yet pass rushing man yeah everyone's gotta have it you gotta have it

uh... right there Dave. Great catching up with you, man. Appreciate you doing this. Hey, awesome, guys. Take care. See you. There's Dave Naylor, this is Bryan Adams. Hey, my name's Brett Emmons. I'm from the Gloria Sons. Hi, I'm Nellie Furtado. Made in Canada, the station that champions Canadian music. Loud, proud, and all yours. No passports required, just press play. Tap into Made in Canada now on iHeartRadio.ca

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