OverDrive - OverDrive - April 21, 2026 - Hour 1 - Darren Dreger

Episode Date: April 21, 2026

Join Bryan Hayes, Jeff O'Neill and Jamie McLennan for Hour 1 on OverDrive! They dive into the Hurricanes' win against the Senators and the offside call to Ottawa, Leon Draisaitl's solid return in the Oilers' Game 1 triumph and the Canadiens gearing up for the Lightning. TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger joined to discuss the Maple Leafs' GM search for the franchise.

This hour of overdrive is powered by Fanduil. Fan Duel, bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score. All right, here we go, Overdrive, off and running TSN 1050 on the TSN app, your home smart speaker up on TSN4, up on YouTube, live on TSN's YouTube channel, Brian Hayes, Ziodog, Jeff O'Neill, Jamie Noodles, McClennett. I was feeling this afternoon. Well, I mean, those pictures in the text. welcome friends welcome welcome i don't know what you guys are talking about am i missing something

just look at the text that brian said well because you're getting your camera set up and it froze and it was uh it was a yeah it was a compromising uh position it was another friend of ours that i was working with the other day that was his head was in the clouds a little bit staring the wrong direction That's the beauty of like technology, right? When you're getting set up to go on a show, like if you're doing this show, if you're doing sports center, you're doing the panel. Like there's cameras and producers, there's directors everywhere. You know, technology and stuff.

You're looking the other way and people are watching you. Like, what the hell's going through this guy's head? What are these people thinking right now? A lot of times, I just don't understand. When you're at, we'll call it your home or office base, there's only one camera. Right, exactly. Why are you facing the wrong way when there's only one camera, singular, in front of you?

Great question, noodles. You're right, because if you're doing the panel, they might be like, all right, four, you're going to three, now a solo, now a pan out. If you're doing a single into an iPhone, there's no reason to be looking this way, ever. But let me ask you guys this. Did you not find that the most nerve-wracking experience about broadcasting? is when they say, and I don't know why they do it, it's just a part of doing television and possibly at TSN,

once you kind of like engage with the host, you're looking into a camera and you are in no man's land. And when you're starting out, dude, I did it at the NHL network when I started working there. I just had that kind of, I lost my train of thought, and I was like, yeah. Yeah, oh, I know. It's horrifying, it is horrifying because I've been there too.

I'm still getting used to it. Like our show is very free-flung. Yes, there's one camera, but you're looking up, down. There's no, you know, you're not directly into a camera. But if you're doing a panel show where you have a 30-second dialogue on something, they expect you to look into camera. You might engage with other panelists to move around a little bit. But you're right.

Like the, you know, the way they make the sausage is the camera that's on. Usually it's got the red light, right? But there is a director in your ear also saying like, okay, camera four, camera too. And I've worked with guys before where they're always looking at the wrong camera. And then the director's like, all right, I guess we've got to go to that camera. Right when they do, the guy moves over to the other one. And you can tell the production crew's like, man, we can't get this thing right. Anyway, good to see you guys. Welcome. Welcome, friends. It's great to be here this afternoon. Welcome back, friends. I thought about it. I heard it. I heard it back. And it's gone. I got to come up.

Really? It's not happening at fine. I thought at five, I think you'd take it for another test run at five. One more at five. One more. I know what you guys do. It was stupid and you want me to say it again, just to hear it again. I want to, I want you to knock the rust off. Like you just said, your first time looking at cameras.

Send some ideas in how to bring in the second hour as something different than welcome back friends. I like welcome back friends. To me, that's personal. It's personal. And somebody who's listening and been waiting for us to come. back on TV or on the radio or a streaming device, you're welcome a friend back in. I love it. I like it too. I think we bring it up in five. Well, we've got a lot to get into today. I thought, listen, people in Ottawa aren't going to want to hear this, but justice was served.

I hate that offside rule. I've hated it ever since they put it in. And the Canes deserve to win the game because that goal never should have been called back, in my opinion. I know based on the rule, It's a millimeter offside. It's such a stupid rule. I hate it. I have hated it since day one. And I felt for people last night in the barn, like in the building, the guy wins in overtime. They start running out of the building.

And then all of a sudden, you've left and you're in your car. And the game's still going on. And then there's a penalty shot. It was Bedlam in Carolina last night. Yeah. It really was. It was a great hockey game. And I don't think Ottawa was dead.

I don't think they're dead. I think they'll fight. I think they'll come home and they'll win at least one of those games, if not both. I thought, did you guys not think for large portions of later in that hockey game? They controlled the play. Yes, I agree. And I'm like, these guys got to win this. They deserve it.

And what a shame when you have a goaltender like that to not piss away, but to not use up one of those performances. He played great. That's the best I've seen. Yeah. Yeah, he played great. I thought Freddie played well, though, too. Yeah, they both played well. They both, like that was a goaltender's duel.

Allmark is not a, he's not a flashy goaltender. He made five flashy, unbelievable saves, like glove saves, diving across. Like, it wasn't about style points, it's about keeping the puck out of the net. Yeah. Like, I thought he was unbelievable. And it sucked that somebody had to lose that game because that was, that was a great game. I felt for Ottawa because I thought, okay, the mini-gave. you get that goal called back, regardless of how you feel about it.

And I agree with you. Hey, it's like, that sucks. But I like, okay, Otto was going to win this game. Like, I kept thinking they're going to win. They got a second life. And, I mean, it's, you know, it was offside in the spirit of it, but I get it. Yeah. I get it.

No, listen, the rule is the rule. I'm not saying it was, it wasn't applied properly. You know, they reviewed, it looks so close. But I've said it forever, and I will say it again. that is not the spirit of the Matt Duchenne five feet offside rule. Like they put that rule in place because the league was embarrassed by how ridiculous it was that Matt Duchin was basically at the hash marks and they didn't call it properly. And they completely overreacted to the point where last night,

even the broadcast couldn't find it originally. They're like, when was the guy offside? They thought it was like, yeah, they thought it was the guy right at the Slavin or somebody right at the blue line. They're like, no, that wasn't out. And then it was, like, way back. I looked at it. And I know Greenie was adamant on the bench.

He was like, well, that's offside. And I'm like, I don't think that's not offside. I wasn't sure either. And what's brutal about it is, guys, it's like that game was so good. And you're talking about high-end, you know, skill, speed, playoff hockey. And that storyline dominates the conversation. It does. It does.

It's so stupid. Like, you're taken away from the best player. in the world because someone is making a judgment call on whether he had control of the puck didn't have, like, it's crazy stuff. I thought it was nonsense. I was watching it and I tweeted out. I was like, what the hell's going on here? What is this?

No goal, but by the way, there was a penalty shot. How was that even possible? And it was Martinuk who ends up scoring the winner. I know. Isn't that crazy? Like, it is the hockey gods or the circle of the game. but, you know, okay, no goal, but here's a penalty shot. Like, that was the curve.

It's like compensation almost. Unreal. And what a save that was, too. Like, it just... Well, I was thinking about this. Like, you know how some guys, like, names and players they just fit? Like, isn't Jordan Martinuk the most Carolina Hurricanes player ever? Like, it just, he just has to be a Carolina hurricane.

And he's just a really good player. Gritty. That is gritty, and he just goes out and plays, and he puts up like 30 points a year or whatever. And anyway, it was a great hockey game, and it was a biggest opportunity for Ottawa. I think with what you've seen this year, the one thing about that guy that makes him valuable, he just doesn't mail in shifts and just figure skates out there and just says, give me my check, and Callie Yarncrocks it threw 82 games. And there was a bunch of those guys.

Yeah, that guy, it's very simple. He cares about his craft, and he works out there, and he's effective. Yeah. And it's almost like he values being in the league so much that he bust his ass because he doesn't want to leave the league or leave the Carolina Hurricanes. The difference between that guy, number 48, and a bunch of them around the league is the guy cares, and you can see it on the ice, and that's what makes them effective. He's been in the league 10 years, and he's made a hell of a living off of it because, you know, he started in Arizona and then went on to Carolina. I think this is what, eight years in Carolina, seven, eight years. Yep, he's been there a long time.

But they know exactly what they're getting from a good, honest effort every night. And, you know, I've met him a few times personally. He's a great guy, and he knows how to play. He knows exactly how to be effective in the NHL. And you're right, oh, like this isn't a guy that just collects a check. He goes out and pays the price every night and battles. And, you know, no better coach for him, right? Rod Brindamore probably shown him every little trick of the trade and how to be maximize his potential.

And he's a great player. Absolutely. Yeah. Well, and that's what last night I think was. I mean, between him and Casperry Caputon and those are the heroes of the night, effectively for the Canadian teams playing, one going against a Canadian team, one going for a Canadian team. And I thought Dry Sato was a bull in a China shop last night. He was so good. McDavid, like, they were on him last night.

he didn't have a lot of open ice. I did think he had a good game. No, I thought he was very quiet, but they luckily didn't need him in the end. And I wouldn't say they stole one last night, but it was dicey. And, you know, that Dickinson scores two and then Kauffin. That's a blessing in disguise, though, Hayes. Big time. If they are going to go the distance, all we've been talking about all year is,

are their goalies going to hold up? And it's the McDavid and the dryside will show every night. So you've got a guy that gets a couple goals. you get a goal from Cap and nothing from Jesus and you pick up the win. So that's nothing but a, obviously it's nothing but a positive. If you're going to go the distance again, which something about these guys, and I talked about them on the panel, Jamie, the other day saying they might be out of magic tricks. These guys just light up, man, when the playoffs start, and they seem to get mojo and they got energy.

And I don't know, but you're going to have to do it a bunch of different times because how many times over the last two? runs that we said need a goal from somebody else need a goal from somebody else. Last night they got it. I thought it was fantastic and nothing to worry about. Well, if you go back on the game winning goal, it was a special effort by dry-sidal. Yes, it was. He went end-to-end. High-stepping, split the D, bullied this way through, then the cycle started. Like, that zone entry doesn't start. Most of the league doesn't make that zone entry if it's not for 29 bullying his way through. And then it's Pod Colson into Kaepinan.

And like that's the difference. A special player makes a special play. That's not even on the highlights. Joe ran the highlights of the fourth goal. You don't see the entry. The entry is probably the most special part about that goal because they don't get in the zone if it's not for dry saddle. It was like one on two.

And he just bullied his way through. And look who he's playing with. I mean, Plot-Colson and Getsd and Glemson. Kaepinen. You know, like this guy hasn't played in six weeks. For everybody that was like Matthews didn't have anybody to play with, he's going out there with Kaspery Kaepinen, caps out at 20 a season if he has a fantastic year,

maybe 10 or 15. And Pod Colson has turned himself into a possible 20 to 25 goal score, capped out, maxed out, and Leon Dreiselo goes out there and does business with them every night. Think about that. Yeah, like does a miss a beat. Now, he has been, I think, the most reliable play. performer in the league the last decade.

That includes McDavid, in my opinion. I know McDavid has more, he's got more hardware because he's got the consmite and he's got the points. Drysettle, every single game he seems to just lean on teams. And they do it in a different fashion. You know, that's what kind of makes it so fun to watch Edmonton is Nick David's flying and Dry Suttles like got three guys on his back. You know, they're just very different players.

but yeah, like he didn't show up and look for any excuses. He looked like he was 100%. He was ready to play and he was making plays all night. And you're right. I mean, that whole goal happens because of him. Just like, two guys on him. He's like, get out of my way.

And then he loses the puck. Here, it's fluttering. And he goes, all right, I got it. Pod Coles in. Brilliant play. Brilliant. Just heavy play. That's how good he is.

That's how good dry settle is to like to have that luxury. And there are other great players in the, league. But to be an oiler fan and not have to worry about this guy at all, even though he's coming off an injury. Now, maybe after the first, maybe he's running on adrenaline, you know, the next day he wakes up, his knees not feeling great.

Today, we'll see. We'll see what happens for game two tomorrow. But to just be able to pencil him out in to be like the most dominant player on the ice every night, it's an incredible luxury to have. Yeah. When you've got the other guy who if he gets cooking, it's lights out

for a team like Anaheim. You're the opponent, Hayes, you kind of know, like, I had to deal with the Big E. Like, when Big E was on his game, like, you got a serious problem on your hands. Yeah. Like, you're asking yourself in the locker room, and it was not a loser mentality. You're just, you're a normal human being. You're like, what if Big E is all horned up tonight out there and he's killing people and he wants to get two and two and break two defensemen's shoulder blades?

How, what are we going to have for that? Yeah. That's what they do. They make you think, like, what answer do we have for that type of animal? And this guy's a different beast, but that's what they make you think about. How are you going to deal with them? You're right. Like, special players find a way different every night.

Now, I will say this. Anaheim, like, good on them. They're a talented team, man. Like, they can play. Like, you know, I don't think they're just showing up and going lessons learned here. Like, they'll be adjustments from here. Yeah, they'll be ready for game too. But I, you know, Anaheim, if it's not this year, they're going to be a special team moving forward.

That Carlson is unbelievable. He's really, really good. And, you know, he's really good. Like, Terry is kind of the gray beard of the team. He's 27, I believe. Yeah. Like, you look at, you know, yes, they got veterans, you know, the colognes and all that. I'm talking to young players.

Yeah. Like, they don't play with any fear. They just, they've got skilled. Well, I thought Seneca was great last night. Yeah, he can dance. For a young kid, he's 19 years old. He's a rookie. key. And for him to be playing in that environment, like as a Canadian kid who knows he's walking

into oil country and they're rocking, like he plays with composure. He's a big boy that he's a really good player. And they took some heat for that pick. Remember? Like he was not, well, he went third overall. He was mocked at like going 18, 20 to 21st. Dude, he was shocked. He was shocked and he went holy bleep. Yeah, he couldn't believe that Patford Bee could take him. He couldn't believe Anaheim took them and that's the thing about like having the faith in your scouting and having the stones to say we're taking them. I don't care if

everyone else looks at us and goes, what are you doing? You know, like how you take a that guy? The Leafs did it with Cowan to an extent. Cowan was not, you know, the consensus was a first round pick. That was sticking on with that. Absolutely. Like if you've got belief and you pull the trigger

and Seneca was really good last night. Right? They see something. Wasn't, weren't we at, of the drafts where things went haywire. Wasn't it to Keck Aline and didn't take somebody? Well, it was Pooley Arby that he was going to take. And he took Pierre-Luc Dubois instead. Yeah, it was Matthews, Linae, and then he took Dubois instead of Pooley-R-Vee.

And then, yeah, Pooley-R-R-Vey dropped to Ford Edmonton, I believe it was. Yeah, exactly. Marmaduke. Yeah. Stated around this tongue-out. Right. Well, it was a good pick. I mean, Dubois.

Speaking of the Fin, like, is Patrick Liney? Does he even put his gear on anymore? No, he's been hurt. and he's yeah he he he he he that'll be it for him in montreal i don't know where he's going to go you know after this season but his deals up so though they're not going to i can't imagine somebody's going to find he it'll be interesting to see though somebody might be on a flyer on him exactly he'll be on a pto jamey if anybody wants to invest more than the minimum they're insane yeah the cap's going up and if you have room could you find me a two-year deal

that honest the guy like the guy can if he's healthy he can he's got talent he does have talent you saw how it went I don't want to start crapping on Patrick Blaine out of the blue on this show you saw

the trajectory in Montreal it was like fan favorite and then the competition level just went down and it went down and it went down and he stopped working and often hurt and then it was just like non-factor he's been hurt all year this year He's barely played.

He scored 15 goals, I think, from the exact same spot on that power play. Put it through the net. And now, I mean, that's Caulfield spot. Like the first power play, he is not going to that spot on the first power play. That's cool. And we talked about every dog has his day and you've got to find an adjustment. He's like, I'm either scoring or I ain't playing. I'm not going to be effective.

There's all kinds of first-round draft picks that are like, Can I, like, is there an opportunity for me to be a checker, a penalty killer, but they don't want to make their adjustment. They're like, I'm a score, and if I can't do that, they don't want to find any way else to play in the league. And Patrick has basically said, I take one tease on the power play, and I float around and I'm not really a worker. But when it ain't working, you're out of a job.

Yeah. Well, in Montreal, again, when they signed him or when they acquired him, it was, you know, they had these young guys. They didn't think they didn't think they were a playoff team last. year. They didn't. And they wanted some star power. They wanted a distraction that, like, allow the kids to come up and everyone scream about lining.

And there was a lot of excitement in that marker. Remember that parre kid knocked him out? The Leaf prospect or whatever. And then the place, like, they went nuts in Montreal over that. But the market has clearly moved past him, as you would expect. And when you've got Suzuki and Caulfield ripping home

50 plus, and you don't have to worry about that. But it's a big opportunity for Montreal tonight. Like, game two in Tampa. Tampa's a heavy favorite tonight. Two ways to look at this. You can be happy with your split and go home and you've got home ice and Bell Center is going to be rocking or you can put the throttle down here. Like you can really put some doubt in Tampa's room if Montreal comes out and finds a win tonight. And Tampa's got injuries, right? You know,

Edmund's not going to play. Yeah, it sounds like he's not going to play for a while. the kid, Das Deuce, he got hurt. He got hit. I didn't think that was a penalty. We never got into it. That was crazy. That was like a Malachi crunch, and he just kind of went awkwardly. Yeah. Some of the calls guys, I'm telling you, it's Andrew.

I didn't like that one. Like, Anderson, he's not responsible for what his teammates doing in open ice, effective. I get it was behind the net, but it was a big hit, man. And Anderson had a growl on the other night. Like, he was... Wow. When he wants to play, he's dangerous because he's shot a big guy. He's flying in there, too.

Like that, yeah. Yeah, that was a big hit, man. But he's a playoff performer. What did you call it? The Camachi Crunch. Malachi Crunch. You don't remember the Malachi Crunch? I don't know.

It was some old stupid TV show. Is that a wrestling move? I don't know what it would. It might have been from Happy Days or something, man. Somebody tweet in and say what the Malachi Crunch was from. Yeah, I've never heard of that one before. That's not. I thought, I guarantee you one of our listeners who's like a wrestler or something

will have a movie. Yeah, it might be like, oh, it's either old. school wrestling or like an old school television show. Stampede wrestling. Yeah. I was a big hit, but you're right. If he's not playing and Tampa's in one and Vasilevsky's going to have to play well tonight. But

this is where Dolbush, you know, he gave up three the other night, but I thought he played pretty well in the first period. I thought he was great the other night. And this is the goaltending conversation we always have. A goal he can step in there and say, we're winning tonight, boys. Like we're going home up to nothing. I'm not giving

up anything tonight. That is the game plan going in there. Like Marty St. Louis' message will be, we got to try to just take a cut out of these guys tonight. Yeah. Because they're battle tested, they're winners. And even if they go up to nothing, Tampa's going to have something to say in game three. But you build as big a lead as you can against those guys.

Absolutely. They talk about, we always talk about growth and taking a step and learning lessons and this and that. they'll show you if they've kind of learned and have grown they're with their approach tonight like if they go out there and kick ass and are dominant maybe you know maybe they're for real and they mean business this year big time big time they looked good game on yeah they sure did uh happy days is where that's from the yeah franklin sent a

no mowich crunch i used to watch i've heard of that i'm old enough sick the malachi crutch i don't even know what the hell it is it's probably some kind of knuckle sandwich it says it's from the Malachi brothers, so they must have been street tuffs or something that Fonzie hung out with. I don't know. Okay. I got to go back and happy days is so dated.

That's a long time. That's my era, guys. I'm older than you guys. That's my era. I grew up watching Gilligan's Island and Happy Days and, you know, what was the other Archie Bunker, whatever that show was all in the family. Those were crazy shows. Sanford and Son.

Oh, yeah. Back in the day. punky Brewster and the whole thing. Stinky old punky. Well, because what's his name was? Bob Euker was in that show, I think. Oh, Punky Brewster. There was, remember Gary Coleman was in a show?

Yeah, Gary Coleman wasn't something. What was he again? Conrad Baines was the guy. That show had problems. That show, the people, like the actors and actresses in that show, they had some problems. Like, I believe few of them have died and all of that. That's not good. Okay.

The Brady Bunch. We could come up with a bunch of old school ones. Yeah. Nice company. All right, Dreg's coming up. We've got Johnny on the show today confirm with Denier in about an hour. Like, where are we at with the least pursuit of a GM? There's reports out there.

Kevin Adams might start talking to the Vancouver Canucks. Well, hang on a sec, Hayes. Did Toronto just bypassed Kevin Adams, the team that won the division? And they just said he's not too, like it's not cool enough. It's not analytical. Like, they just didn't even give him an interview. Doesn't sound like it, but maybe Dregs has a different answer. And he's a long night.

him. Yeah, he played for the Leafs. He played for the Leafs. He could walk in in an alumni jacket. Dude, he put together the team that won the division and they don't even give them a call because they're just smarter than everyone else and they got all these brain surgeons in there. Would you? It's so stupid.

And be serious. If you were in pursuit of a GM job and you were an alumni, would you show up in the alumni jacket? Yes, absolutely. I think it actually, people are going to think I'm joking. I think it would be a brilliant play. Like, you show up in the alumni jacket and you say, this is how invested I. am i played for the team i love the team i want the team to do well see i wear this i just need to tell you i made my alumni jacket when i was a bit of a monster and now it's a car cover no no when you're a

monster you've got so much back fat that your arm i'm serious that your shoulders go up like this and the arms seem like way longer and when you start losing weight you got to get the arm length fixed. I'm going to wear the alumni jacket on Monday because I'm getting the arms. Are they like the sleeves past your hands then type of thing? Oh, yeah. Well, because when you're a mont, your neck grows like, you know those monsters with those giant necks?

Like, that's what happens. And when you start losing weight, your neck shrinks, so you got to shrink the arms. I got to be honest. I got to be honest, though, I, the next GM, and this is just the personal thing. The next GM for the Maple Leafs should be, somebody who has nothing to do with the city of Toronto or have played for them or whatever. Matt Sundin, that's a different story. You bring in legacy players that could help.

But we've seen too many times that tied to grew up here, all of that, it should be somebody who is a sociopath who doesn't care about anything other than just making the organization right. That's the way I look at it. It should be somebody that has an outside view of the city, not is in love with the city and yes you're passionate about it but to me this should be a business transaction not somebody who has ties to the city

but there's also some things that are just right in front of your face Jamie his team that he put together just won the division and they look pretty good and he's out there and you don't even give the guy in the interview to hear what he has to say like what am I missing here how dumb are these people well yeah again unless they're interviewing people we're not aware of you know the names that

floating around and we'll get into this with dregs. It does seem like they're trying to do what noodles is suggesting. Find someone who's completely detached, someone that needs a fresh start or give it an opportunity. It goes against conventional

wisdom here that this is too big of a job for someone that's raw and we'll see. I mean, ultimately the next two or three weeks cannot be overstated how important they can be for the organization. You've got to hire the right people and the lottery ball could fall one of two ways.

Like, they literally, in two weeks, you could have a great hire in the first overall pick. You know, I understand there's other issues, clearly. But if you get the right hire and you win a lottery, okay, let's see what you can do with that. Like, it opens up the door for some opportunity here into the future. So Darren Dregor coming up, Mike Johnson, in just over half an hour. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050 and up on YouTube Live. The newest tracks.

Let's go. We lose it. And the next big. Big thing. opening line to the final score. Got four games in Stanley Cup playoffs tonight. And a bunch of GM vacancy still out there. There's our TSN

Hockey Insider, Darren Dregger. What's happening? Dregs. Oh, you know, just getting ready for another barn burner or free tonight, right? Montreal, Tampa Bay. It's going to be exciting. Not the hockey. O'Dog and I talked about it on the podcast earlier today. I mean, the pace has been terrific.

The entertainment value has been there. There hasn't been a whole lot not to like. I mean, we always start to pick on the officiating, right? And the video review process, as we saw last night, the Ottawa Carolina game, but beyond that, man, the hockey's been rocks all. Dregs, is there any, like, is anybody going to be looking at last night saying we need to take a look at that, like from the league side, or is it just one of those things that was somewhat confusing? It's a part of the game, and that's just the way it goes.

Like, you think anybody from the league was like, I don't know if we can continue to have this? Like the offside call you're talking about in overtime? Yeah. Yeah, the offside and all that went with it. Well, look, I mean, I don't know this, so I'm not going to state it as fact. This isn't reporting. I'd be surprised if Tom Dunn and the owner of the Carolina Hurricanes did make some inquiries. You know, now that his team's won, he may loosen it a little bit. A little bit.

It went his way in the end. But it is an area of concern that, look, I would say hockey operations, Colin Campbell, the head of hockey ops, you know, shared when that, offside review was instituted many, many years ago. Okay, be careful what we wish for here, because we're going to have no choice other than dissect it to a millisecond, a fraction of a centimeter, whatever description you want to use. The challenge that I would have and had last night and watching that is, you know, you've got the great experience that they have in that situation, but at the end, it's kind of a judgment call too, right? You know, you're looking at

the areas of criteria, the criteria, the constitute offside, okay, possession, control, all of that. And the issued statement from the Situation Room was, according to the rulebook, their interpretation was that Jordan Stahl didn't have control of the puck. How do we know what Jordan Stahl's level of control is? I mean, we're talking about, you know, top-in players here, right? Now, if that's Connor McDavid or Nikita Kutrov or an elite skilled player, not that Jordan Stahl isn't a skilled player, but how do we know what their level of control is

and exactly in the moment what's going on between their hands and their ears in trying to make that play? And then you get into the time sensitivity of it all too, right? Like, I mean, what were we talking here? Well, it took a while. And exactly, after the play had already been in, like there was a semi-breakaway that got a penalty shot called on it, and then they recycled the whole thing.

And my issue has always been they lose sight of the fact that it's entertainment. That's the business you're in. And there's an OT winner. The place goes nuts. And then you review it and call it back. It's not good for business. It's just not. And I understand why GMs want it.

And that's every GM we've ever talked to said, I want the calls to be right. Good for you. You don't own the league. Like, of course, GMs want it. This is where it's the responsibility of the commissioner and the owners to say, what's in the best interest of the product. And I don't believe the product was served properly last night. You know what the flip side is, right?

And we're reminded of this by the commissioner's office, by Colin Campbell, everybody involved in this decision-making is, okay, if we get it wrong, you guys in the media, myself included, are going to murder us through this process. You know, if that goal stands and Ottawa finds an offside after the fact, I mean, okay, granted, in this situation, call it the way that they did, issue the challenge so that they have a look at it. You know, credit in the process to them determining that there may have been offside on the play. But that's why they go through that process as painstaking me as they do,

because if they get it wrong, we're going to be the first column of. Yeah, sure. But get it right then. You know, it's simple. I expect your officials to get it right. It is true. But, I mean, they do a really good job. The hardest part is they're doing it in real time.

And then you go back, and it's five to eight minutes. And some of the fans, I guarantee you, we're in the, their cars and thinking that they were out of there. Now, would they let them back in? That's the interesting part. Like, there's probably people that were pissed going, I want back in. Probably not. No, usually you're, that's generally the policy.

You're out. You're out. And you know what those people that work at the rinks, like, that get the vest, they're going to have a power trip going, no, no, no, no. I guarantee you there will almost be a few fist fights. But, Dregs, I wanted to go to the GM search. You know, I mean, that's probably be the biggest hot topic throughout the league outside of the great games going on. Right.

You know, Kevin Adams' name being floated out there. You know, I wouldn't say household names that have been linked to the Toronto Maple Leafs. What do you make of all of what's going on here? Well, let's start with what we know. And I think it was the athletic who first reported that Kevin Adams has permission to speak with the Vancouver Canucks. Buffalo granted that permission. And that's confirmed. That's real.

And that makes a lot of sense. You know, there's history between Jim Rutherford, who's still in charge. and Kevin Adams. And as we watch the Buffalo Sabres make their way through the first round of the playoffs, I mean, how do you look at their year and not give Kevin Adams credit for finally putting together a team that can win, not just in the regular season? Granted, there's a lot of hockey ahead, including tonight against the Boston Bruins.

But it's a wide net that they've thrown out there from Vancouver's perspective. So there you've got a general manager with a level of experience. I'm sure there are other experience guys. but they're talking to AGMs, they're talking to other relatively inexperienced guys. They're lucky internally. They've got Ryan Johnson there. I wonder about Dale Tallon, who's associated with the Vancouver Canucks in some capacity, if not GM. So they're interviewing already in Vancouver, and I think they're going to begin the in-person process as early as next week.

In Toronto, man, we just, I don't think we want to go down that path yet again. And there doesn't seem to be a clear-cut favorite. There's a media favorite, and that guy's name is Mike Gillis. You know, we've all kind of anointed him as the quote-unquote frontrunner, but yet they continue to interview people. Now, you know, you bring Gary Roberts and others through, as they did this week, you're not looking at those guys. Matt Sundeen last week.

They're not general managers or president. But they can't have a voice and they can perhaps occupy a position within the bigger framework of hockey operations. My understanding is Ryan Martin interviewed this week with the Toronto Maple Leafs, and I think he's also interviewed or is interviewing in Nashville. So those are some of the fresh names, I suppose, we can add to the mix there in Toronto. Darren, how do you balance the idea of bringing in a relatively unknown type of executive? Because Brian was discussing it earlier.

I might have been Jamie, how it might be just better to have somebody fresh as opposed to a former player, somebody with a name. Like, that could work out, and that might be a little bit more forgiving for the fans if things don't work out. But it also could be risky if things don't work out. People are going to go above that and say, what the hell are you thinking hiring that guy? Yeah, so as you're asking the question, oh, this is what comes to mind. Brad Trillivings is a general manager with a wealth of experience. Let's call it that.

I mean, you know, beyond the days in Calgary, he was an AGM with Arizona for a long period of time, right? So he worked his way up the ladder. When they cut Brendan Shanahan loose, my understanding is that there were certain situations where at times, Cree Living maybe was a bit overwhelmed, not by the hockey side of things, right? Again, he's a general manager. He's worked in the trenches. You know, he's managed drafts, trade deadlines, free agency, all of that stuff. but I think it's not just Canadian market

when you're running hockey operations for the Toronto Maple Leafs that's an entirely different beast it's not one of 32 general manager jobs in which way like what do you mean by that well because you're if you don't have that goal between and I guess in this case it can be Keith Pelly but normally it's somebody again with a high level of hands-on hockey experience like a Shanahan right you look

Look at the Montreal Canadians. You know, Jeff Gorton still likes the juice, but he gets a little bit of that as head of hockey operations in Montreal. But he's got Ken Hughes, who's got multiple layers of skill sets there that he can lean on. But he's doing something different that Gorton isn't doing. And Kent Hughes doesn't have to deal on a day-by-day basis with Jeff Moleson, the owner, right? You know, in strong Canadian markets, that business aspect is a challenge because, you know, if you're an owner, if you're a member of the Rogers Brain Trust here, right? Of course you want to have a say.

You don't want to have a say on who's on the power play or what trade should be made or not made, but you want to be in tune, right? But what if you have a suggestion? Shouldn't that suggestion go to the head of hockey ops? and then that guy, person, can filter that away from the general manager unless it's legit, and it's something that, hey, you know what, that's not a bad idea, I'm going to pass that along. It's a difficult one. It was hard at times for true living, so I find it more difficult to appreciate how difficult it would be on a guy with far less. Do you get the impression that Keith Pelley and Rogers are aware of that?

In other words, are they going to hire two people here to make sure that they rectify those problems? Not initially. Because ultimately they're the ones that need to know that. Correct. If there's an issue here. Not initially. That wasn't the plan. Isn't the plan.

But, you know, again, if we want to give at least some credibility to the process and it has been exhaustive, like Pelley and company have talked to how many people I'm sure it will be disclosed, you know, when the process is over and they've hired their general manager. Maybe they've realized through this process that, okay, well, this candidate was really, really good. We feel strongly about that person being the general manager. But then we've got Mike Gellis over here. Again, he seems to be the media favorite. You know, and lots of reporting on him actually wanting to be the overseer.

Well, that makes some sense, too. So initially we didn't want to hire both, call it whatever it is. I mean, I keep going back to the label is. Whatever the label is, it doesn't matter. But maybe they've learned in this process that, okay, well, maybe we do need that, as long as whoever that overseer is can work shoulder to shoulder with Keith Pelly. His self-awareness is, I think, that's the first step that needs to happen here. Yeah.

Like from ownership, Peli, the board, et cetera, determining, you know, what is in the right, what is in the best interest of the whole hockey operation. And, you know, with Gillis, we've been saying it collectively, the three of us for weeks. I don't understand where his name came from. I don't. He hasn't been in hockey in 12 years. years. Dude, how did he pop out of the sky and just become this guy?

I don't remember. Has he been interviewed elsewhere for other openings over the last decade? Like, I know we hear Sherelli's name all the time. And we hear, you know, you'd hear we joke about Fergie. Hey, John Ferguson's coming in. I don't recall the last time. It was like, man, Gillis. It's between this guy and Gillis six years ago in this town.

Like, how did this happen? Like, does he know Keith Pelly somehow? Does he, what is... You got to know him. And true or not, I, you know, I heard that there were discussions well in advance of true living being let go. Okay. Between Pelley and Mike Gillis. Now, you know, I'm sure that Mike has interviewed in other vacancies between now and his time with the Vancouver Canucks.

You know, and not as public, not as under the microscope as the Toronto job would be for a myriad of different reasons. I guess the question that I have, though, is why hasn't he been hired? Yes, exactly. And now, I do know, and again, I talked about Ken Hughes, and we often look at Bill Zito because now he's a decorated general manager with back-to-back Stanley Cups. But, you know, if I'm Pelly or I'm ownership on the Rogers Group, I have no problem looking at, again, a layered executive, right?

Yes. You look at Billy Zito. He's a lawyer. He was a high-profile player agent. He went through management training in management with Columbus under the tutelage of Yarmokai Kalina and then became a general manager. So he can lean on many different things. Well, Mike Gillis has a lot of that, you know, including a former playing background, right? So I have time for the skill set, the resume of Mike Gillis, but I just don't understand why he hasn't had a job in a decade.

Yeah, 12 years. Yeah, over a decade. And furthermore, how he leapfrogged every executive currently in the NHL, and he's up for the most sought-after position in hockey. How's that possible? It's, oh, you know what? Look, again, I'm not trying to devalue Mike Gillis because... I'm not either.

It's just curious to me. He pops up out of nowhere. Kind of, but again, we go back to that media availability, where Pelley made it abundantly clear how heavy he believes in analytics and data. And you do go back to the time of Mike Gillis in Vancouver, where he was ahead of his time, right? All the sports science that the Canucks leaned on, the sleep studies and all of that stuff. I mean, teams weren't. If they were doing it, they were doing it somewhat quietly, right?

But he made it seem like he was way ahead of the game and this is direction in the future. That's fine. And that's great. He was way, he's a mad scientist and he was way ahead of his time. Okay? Yeah. The team went to the finals one year. other than that, what does this guy have in his resume where you can put the two together and say,

that's why you've got to get this guy and he'll all of his data solutions and everything. I can say that I do experiments with smoking bubbly stuff in my garage, but if I don't do anything with it, who gives a brat's ass? Here's a question that I'll put to everybody, though. Is there anybody, and it's an honest question, is there anybody out there that fits the exact bill that we're all talking about, the experience and oh what you're talking about like what is the guy done so if Doug armstrong was unemployed maybe that's the guy but is there anybody out there that fits every checkmark if you've got a five you know a five bucket list yeah well not not necessarily

that's unemployed but like have they looked into poaching anybody like that's exactly what i would do like if you're the leaves yeah like can you not tampering isn't it but they did it with Burke back in the day. I mean, they, they, it's a wink, wink, wink, nudge, I'm out of here, and I'm going to Toronto. I mean, yeah, you'd have to do it above board. You'd have to see permission and, and speak to those candidates if you were given permission. But, you know, look, again, I, I appreciate, I think it was Jonas wrote about the guys that, you know, they should go after. And I think, who was it, Kelly McCrimmon, Julian Breezeblaw, and who am I maybe Bill Zito? I mean, yeah, exactly. I get it.

Of course. But again, for me, it's somewhat a show of the arrogance of Toronto. Yeah? You know, like, why would any of those guys, aside from, and I will say this, because Brad Trilliving is living proof, Brad Trilliving knew there were going to be challenges. Even, you know, he came in under the leadership of Brandon Chanahan. But there is something about the reality of potential. in becoming that general manager to lead this team to another Stanley Cup championship.

Yeah, it's the White Whale. That is intoxicated for all of these executives. Absolutely. Because other than that, why would you leave Tampa, Vegas, or Florida, exactly. Exactly. 100%. Yet it is the White Whale of the League and maybe the money, possibly it's more up here.

Anyway, we'll see. One of these days, we'll have a resolution. They'll hire a few people. Sooner than later. Sooner than later. All right, Treggs. Good seeing you. Darren Dregor, a TSN Hockey Insider.

Confirmate and I coming up. Overdrive continues up on YouTube live. IHeart Radio is throwing it back. 20s, the decade. To the days of huge hits and unforgettable items. A non-stop stream of the biggest and best. Drake, Rihanna, Beyonce, Katie Gaga, the weekend. And more.

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Jeff Hoffman, our boy with three Ks in the night to close out the game last night. Yeah, I can't, like I love Schneides, but he said it about little. He's got to keep stop going back to the wall and saying, I trust this guy more than anybody. No, you don't. No, you don't. It's not possible, man. possible, but he's going to say it publicly.

I know. But just be a little bit more honest. Like, this guy's got to just get the job done for us, and that's all he needs to focus on. Good night last night. It's one night. Good night last night. Varlane's been outstanding. Rogers was good again last night. Like, if they can get Hoffman going, easier said than

done, but if he can start throwing strikes and getting out of jams, Barlin Rogers, Hoffman, has a real opportunity to close out games. Like, if that's your 7th, ninth inning in high leverage, you might have something there. Cease was good. Sees was phenomenal.

12Ks last night. He looks like Wyatt Earp. Dude, he's got a wild looking vibe. Like just a wild look and vibe and he's just out there. He's got a big Lebowski vibe to him and he's just out there throwing heat. Like his stuff is so nasty. Yeah, it's so nasty. It's so nasty. It's so nasty.

Tuck and hide move. Yes. It's effective. I think I watched him when I first put eyes on him. I think he was with the white socks. And I was like, this guy is nasty, man. Yeah. And he is nasty.

I love watching a pitch. He's always had great stuff, and he stays healthy. He just, when he gets off the beaten path, it's trouble, right? You start throwing, if you miss the zone, you're in trouble, and that's been his issue in the past. But this year, it is not. He has been phenomenal. He has been so good.

Gosman's been good. And we'll see what the Jay's having store tonight. Back in L.A., the Rappler's coming home for game three again, ugly last night. We'll get into that. into the next hour. NFL draft later in the week. Overdrive continues up on TSN4 and YouTube live. You've been listening to Overdrive, powered by Fandul. FanDuel, bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score. I'm Luke Wilson. Join me each week for Film Never Lies. Since

retiring from the NFL, I've had a lot of my mind, and now got my own show. So if you're tired of lazy takes, if you want honest conversations, join us each week. Film Never Lies, available on all TSN platforms and the IHeart Radio app. Thank you.