OverDrive - OverDrive - December 11, 2024 - Hour 3

Episode Date: December 12, 2024

Join Bryan Hayes, Jamie McLennan and Frank Corrado for Hour 3 on OverDrive! ESPN MLB Analyst and Host of Is This A Great Game, or What? Podcast Tim Kurkjian joins to discuss the Blue Jays' roster views, Vladimir Guerrero Jr.'s outlook in Toronto and Bo Bichette's next steps. The guys discuss Toronto athletes investing in the Bills, Terry Pegula's views Toronto as a market, Brett Favre and Mark Gastineau's clash and Bryan hands out his FanDuel Best Bets.

It's a brand new year. Time to review last year's financial decisions and set new priorities for 2025. Kelvin the Money Guy suggests the three-step approach. One, clearly define your goals for the new year. Two, create a plan tailored to your needs and ambitions. And three, make sure your portfolio is designed to serve that plan. Goal. Plan. Portfolio. Contact Kelvin the Money Guy and set your plans in motion. Call 416-457-PLAN

or visit askkelvin.ca final hour overdrive continues brought to you by fanduel bringing you everything from the opening line to the final score brian hayes frankie curato jamie noodles mclennan we got our best bets later in the hour. We've got Bobby Marks coming up later in the hour as well. Scotty Barnes, probably week to week. They'll reevaluate in a week. Ankle sprains, so Scotty goes out again. They've had so many injuries, man, and now they've lost a few games in a row. Yeah.

Kind of felt like, all right, the Raptors are moving back into a position where they're going to compete and maybe try to get into the ninth or tenth seed, and now Scottie's out again, and you're like, all right, just tank. You know, like just make up your mind here, and I think injuries and talent coming in and coming out probably is going to determine that for them. But they've been honest about this. Like no one's surprised.

You know, they're not going to win a ton of games, and they're youthful. They're fighting. They're giving the effort. There's been some positive stories. That happens, right? It's funny when you're honest with your fan base, you are going to get a bit of a leash.

It's probably about a year, year and a half, maybe two years, and then people will become impatient. But they're cool with it after you had a very successful decade okay that's what happened right rap is that a great decade now spin it back around it's a cycle of life in pro sports be likable work hard have guys that want to be here people can live with that i think rapid fans are handling it very well is that that's more i mean there's there's a a team just down Bremner that would probably be well-suited to take that message because you talk about conveying the message, not talking down to the fans.

That's what I think a lot of people crave from this Blue Jays front office. I know hockey's first and foremost here. This is not a dumb baseball market. There's a lot of passionate Blue Jays fans who are here through the good years, the bad years, the best players, the players you never heard of. They've seen it all happen. To kind of, I don't know, not shoot them straight and not give them the truth or talk around it, what's happening,

it doesn't do them any good. They haven't done themselves any favors with their messaging here well what about like i would love to talk to joe fan of the blue jays and joe fan of the raptors because you're right like they're both kind of now i mean the blue jays aren't in a rebuild or they were trying to be it just happened that they didn't have a great season but the messaging is a lot different and you you talk to somebody who's a blue jay fan and like they're pissed they're angry so much bitterness right now and so much anger and you said the raptors of people like yeah they're likable you know what's going on like you know a raptors fan

i don't know a lot of them but i have a few buddies who are diehards. They're still enjoying the process. They'll go to games. You know, there hasn't been a dip in, like, the support of the team because there's transparency there. Where the Blue Jays, like, people just, like, you mention the name and people, like, get their backs up. They're like, God, what is going on?

Directly towards the front office, really, is where a lot of that scorn goes and the anger. And listen, Ross Atkins is not going to change the way he operates 10 years into his tenure. Because that would be so disingenuous. In a way, I actually appreciate that he continues to give us these lines and these quotes because that is who he is. That's how he acts. That's how he's going to answer questions from the media. If he came out any differently, you could tell that he had been written or read the riot act

or the PR spin was telling him this is what you have to do to try to get the mob back on your side. He's not doing that. So in a weird way, I actually salute him for just consistently saying things that you almost can't believe he continues to say. But what's happened here with the Blue Jays is this has been about a 10-year buildup. You know, the glory years of 15 and 16, that was almost a decade ago. And they did the bottoming out, and now they're supposed to come back up. And unfortunately, I think a lot of Blue Jay fans have already turned the page on the era.

But the front office is reluctant to do that for obvious reasons because this was their team. This was their opportunity at greatness and building a winner and dynasty and all that. And it was going to revolve around Guerrero and Bichette and Springer and a strong rotation. And that's what they were going to be. and that's what they were going to be, and that's what they were supposed to be. And it all fell off last year, and it fell off dramatically.

And you look at their roster right now, even with the move they made with Cleveland yesterday, are they better today than they were yesterday? I would say that they are. Horowitz showed some pretty good statistics and pretty good splits at the plate last year. Again, younger, likable guy. But Jimenez is a legit ball player. A few years ago, he had a great, great season.

If you get anything close to that, you're a better team. But they're still not a good enough team on paper to compete with the powerhouses of, I don't think the ALEs, let alone the American League, certainly not Major League Baseball. So you've got a lot of work you've still got to do. And what's your budget? And are you going to make trades? And what is Vlade going to be paid? And what are they going to do with Boba Shett?

There's just so many questions hanging over this team right now. And it is leading to a very frustrated fan base. And to chat about it, among many other things around baseball, here is longtime ESPN MLB analyst and co-host of Is This a Great Game or What podcast, here's Tim Kirchhen back on Overdrive. How are you doing, Tim? I'm well, fellas. How are you doing?

We're doing well. We're waiting for the Blue Jays to get cooking here. They made a deal yesterday with the Guardians, and I guess we'll begin there. You know, Jimenez comes in. He's maybe the best defensive second baseman in the league. A few years ago, he had an all-star level season. He had some pop in his bat.

He runs the base as well. But he also comes with a certain amount of money left on his ticket. I'm curious what you made of that move by the Blue Jays and why they would attack that first over what a lot of people have been waiting for them to do is go out and find a power bat. Yeah, I totally agree. But he's not just the best second baseman in the league. He's one of the best defensive players in the league.

And Stephen Vogt, the manager of the Guardians, told me during the Yankee series last year, which I covered for radio, that Jimenez is the best defensive player he's ever seen at any position, ever. That's what Stephen Vogt said about the second baseman. He made three plays in that Yankee series that no other second baseman in the game baseman. He made three plays in that Yankee series that no other second baseman in the game can make. And he's going to be a tremendous addition defensively for the Jays, who at this point are going to have to pitch and defend their way as far as they can possibly go. So even though

they picked up a lot of money there, I think it was a really good move by the Blue Jays to get an elite defensive player who, as you said, was a pretty good offensive player a couple years ago. I still think there's something in there, but there's no doubt they won on that trade. But now they have a lot more to go. Yeah, they sure do. And if it's going to be pitching and defense, and it does feel like that's likely going to be where they're going to have to really. Yeah, they sure do. And if it's going to be pitching and defense, and it does feel like that's likely going to be where they're going to have to really thrive here, it feels like they

need another arm in the rotation, and they might need to rework, well, they do need to rework their bullpen. They sign Garcia, they bring him back into the fold. They lost on Romano, he leaves for Philly, they didn't tender him. But you look at what else has happened in the division with Freed signing in New York, and now the Sox, they acquire Crochet today. Would you expect, do you believe the Jays are legitimately in on Corbin Burns? And if not, what other options could they have to try to bolster the top end of the rotation? Well, they have to be in on Corbin Burns if they're going to make a run in this division, Now, they have to be in on Corbin Burns if they're going to make a run in this division because the Orioles are going to get better at some point.

I mean, they played poorly down the stretch, but they're still a really good team. The Yankees are going to use all the money they saved on Soto and go fill the gaps, starting yesterday with Max Reed. And the Red Sox got the best pitcher available in the trade market today with Garrett Crochet. So even though the Blue Jays did well yesterday, they're going to have to do much more from here in order to get with this group. And as you guys have already said, they need another big-time hitter in their order. This has been a subpar offensive team for the last couple years. They need some help.

And part of the problem is some of the help is at the position where Vlade plays. You don't want to just tie up the DH. So they've got some work to do offensively. And you're right, they have to rebuild this bullpen because even though there's some power arms out there and some swing and miss stuff, they have some work to do in the bullpen.

The one thing they have, obviously, is a pretty darn good starting rotation, but you can always add another one because we know no one gets through a season with five, six, seven, even eight starters anymore. You need more than that, and that's why Corbin Burns would fit. But Baltimore is in on him. The Giants are in on him. There's a lot of competition for Corbin Burns. And after yesterday, he's going to command something close to $250 million

after Max Reed got $218 million. Tim, what is the perception outside of Toronto of Vladdy Jr. as far as what he could potentially get paid if he chooses to stay or move on, go to free agency. I mean, we think the world of him here in Toronto, but from the outside market, you see what Soto got. I mean, what could this guy's next contract look like? And where is he in the pecking order of importance of guys who need a contract soon? Yeah, he had a great year last year.

Not a good year, a great year. And he's reestablished himself as one of the best hitters in baseball. And he's going to be 26 years old next year. So there's a lot of Soto in there. He's not Soto, but he's had two spectacular seasons. And I think everyone looks at him and says that's one of the huge free agents to reckon with after this season. And with so many teams needing a hitter these days

because it's so hard to score runs against the pitching that we see, I've got to think Vladdy has tremendous value out there. But the most value comes from the Blue Jays, because that's where he started out. That's where they need him so badly. So he's not going to get $765 million. But at his age, with his track record, he's going to get an enormous contract next year. Does the trade that the Blue Jays make yesterday,

do you have any belief that that would open up the door to possibly a Bo Bichette trade? And if that were the case, what does the return on Beau Bichette look like? Is that where you bring in a power bat into your lineup? How would that whole scenario play out? Well, I don't know if the two are connected. I think having that double play combination for a full season would be really fun to watch. And if the Blue Jays are going to get back in this thing having that double play combination for a full season would be really fun to watch. And, you know,

the Blue Jays are going to be get back in this thing and be become a good offensive team. Again, they're going to need Bichette and another bat to add to this lineup. So I'm not sure it makes sense to trade a guy who can get 200 hits and win a batting title to go get another hitter when you need both hitters so my my i think they should hang on to vladdy and bachette try to make the team better and see what happens after the season now it's risky because free agency is impending but um i wouldn't trade him i'd hang on to him and hope that he plays really, really well again and then go find another hitter somewhere else without trading Bichette. With Tim Kirkson of ESPN, the story

of Bo Bichette is a fascinating one, Tim, as I'm sure you're aware of. When he came on the scene, it was Vlade and Bo. They were basically a package deal. Vlade was the number one prospect in baseball, but the way Bichette hit the ground running, and just the last couple of years, last year was just a miserable season for him. Partially injury-related for sure, but when he was playing, the production completely fell off. Tons of strikeouts. He never looked comfortable, didn't hit for power.

I think he had four home runs last year. Plays a prominent position, though. Marketable guy. Legacy name with dante his dad i mean if he gets it back together if he gets back to that kind of batting title vibe that you were talking about and he starts running the bases better and plays every day hits for some pop like how quickly can he get back in your opinion to where his reputation was let's say two years ago do you need to see him do it for a month, two months, a full season? Where do you stand on reevaluating Bo Bichette?

Well, I think he needs a full season, but that's why I wouldn't trade him because I just refuse to believe that anybody with this kind of track record, this kind of background, and this kind of talent who's had these kind of seasons before, this just could not have been him last year. And again, a couple years ago, we were saying the same thing about Vladdy. Is he just a good hitter now? And then last year, he became a great hitter again. There's no reason that something like that can't happen again with Beau Bichette. And I think it will. I think he'll become a really good offensive

player this year but you can't just gauge that on spring training or April you got to see it for the whole year and they're going to need it for the whole year if they're going to be a dangerous team in the AL East so I'm curious how you reacted to the Max Freed contract based on on history where you know I remember growing up pitch no one pitchers were not getting more than two, three-year deals, four or five-year deals. Now here's a guy who's 30, and, you know, he's had some injury issues like every pitcher, and there's always concerns, and he gets an eight-year contract.

Is that a sign of the times? Is that a sign of the Yankees reacting to missing out on Soto and saying, you know, screw it, we're going to get the guy we want. We don't care what we have to give him. How do you react to such a long-term deal for a starting pitcher? Yeah, well, it's all of the above. After you lose Juan Soto, after offering $760 million, you can't just sit there and not do anything, especially when you're the yankees so they went out and got that i believe the second best starting pitcher on the free agent market burns first freed second he is 73 and 36 lifetime of the 3.07 era the only pitchers who've made more starts since 1920 for the braves than freed and

have an era that low are warren spawn and greg maddox this guy is really good is it an overpay of course it is almost everything is an overpay and the lesson that we've learned especially this offseason is what what an amazing starting pitcher's market it has been. Look at Luis Severino, got three for 67 from the A's. You look at Nate Evaldi, who was a world champion two years ago and a really good pitcher, but 25-year for three years. Look what Blake Snell got, and now look what Max Free gets. That's the most that any left-handed pitcher has ever gotten

in the history of free agency. And again, it was part because the Yankees look at things and say, all right, we just lost the best hitter in the league. We're going to have to win now with pitching and defense. And I really liked what they did, but you have to check back at about five years and see where that kind of how that contract looks then. Do you think Steve Cohen is just like, has he got it out of his system? And what I mean by that is, if there's someone he wants, he's going to dig deeper into his pockets, and he's going to throw more money than anyone,

and he's probably going to get that player. Is he done now that he's got Soto, or do you think he's just going to continue doing that with whoever comes up? I don't think he's done, and I don't think it will be out of the system until the Mets win the World Series for the first time since 1986. He's a Mets fan. When he came in, he said, you know, we're going toe-to-toe with the Yankees. We're going to take them on, and we're going to take everyone on,

and the Soto deal is a perfect example of what he's talking about. So I wouldn't be shocked if they went and re-signed Pete Alonzo, who has more homers since his debut in 2019 than anyone except for Aaron Judge. And they're in on all sorts of pitching, including Corbin Burns. So I don't think the Mets by any means are done because Steve Cohen's just not built to say, all right, we did the one thing, now we're done, that's it. We'll figure it out from here. No, they're going to go do some more things

because Steve Cohen's not going to rest until the Mets win the World Series. Who do you think has more pressure on them to win a World Series in New York? Aaron Judge with the Yankees or Juan Soto with the Mets? Well, that's a really good question. I think given the contract that Soto just got, it now might be even more so on him. And, you know, he's won a World Series. He's been to two World Series. So maybe that takes some of the pressure off. Judge has not only not won a World Series. He's been to two World Series. So maybe that takes some of the pressure off.

Judge has not only not won a World Series, but he hasn't been a particularly good postseason player. So it's equal pressure. But when you give a guy $765 million, I think the pressure just adds from there. So it's enormous on both. They'll hear it every single day. But I would say there's slightly more on Soto at this point,

given a historic contract. Great catching up with you, Tim. We always appreciate you doing this. Thank you. Okay, fellas, see you. Tim Kirchhen of ESPN. I don't know, because the Yankees are still the Yankees. Judge is the captain of that team.

It should be Soto, $765 million. You get the largest contract in history. That should come with an understanding that you have the most pressure on you to perform and to give back for that contract. And the ultimate way to do that is to win. But the Yankees, they're always going to be bigger than the mets like i credit met fans because they're all they're puffing their chest out and they should like this is such a huge monumental moment you know i'm not from new york but i have an understanding of what it's like

to to i think be a met fan to be uh an islanders fan to be a white socks fan in chicago to be an angels fan in la you're you're always going to be you know underx fan in Chicago, to be an Angels fan in LA. You're always going to be under the umbrella of... Number two. Yeah, you're number two. Exactly. You're always going to be. And the Mets still are. But they stole them from the Yankees. It's so different that the Yankees

offered the guy $760 million and he said no. He couldn't get the suite, right? He couldn't get the suite at Yankee Stadium. So there you go. There's your deal breaker He couldn't get the suite, right? He couldn't get the suite at Yankee Stadium. So there you go. There's your deal breaker. Couldn't get the suite, apparently. Security guard.

Yeah, Judge and Jeter had to pay for their suites for their families, so no dice on Soto. And then security guards are kicking his parents and his chef out and his driver out. Just wasn't going to work for one in the Bronx. The Mets feel like they have a little bit of the, you know, you're going through the second fiddle teams, if you want to call it that. I'm not going to say the New York Jets because they're not the Jets.

The Jets are a complete disaster. But there's almost a little bit of that with the Mets where it's like they have spent a gazillion dollars before. They've brought in all the big names before, and what did it got you? It gets you a dud. And the Yankees just always have that shine, like that Yankees glisten and shine that, like, this is the Yankees, and we do things different, and we have the high expectations.

Not that the Mets don't, but it's almost like just optically it feels different between those two franchises. It does set up for a sickening result if you're a Met fan. Soto shows up, doesn't play great, or has injury problems or something, and the

Yankees beat you. The Yankees win a World Series in the next two or three years. Yankee fans are just going to be so loud so obnoxious and I guarantee you every Met fan in the back of their mind they're thinking this so this might blow up like this may just not work but at the same time it's better to be in this position than I than the opposite one yeah I got to be honest though Tim and him talking about the Blue Jays, it actually kind of concerned me because you're kind of dancing around

and you're like, oh, what about this move? What about that? Yeah, you know, Baltimore is going to be. Like he basically said, like they've got no chance against the teams that are above them or in, which is concerning. Like I want to hear the optimism. It wasn't that long ago. It was two years ago.

They were like, yeah, that team's going to win the division. That team's got this. Manoa's going to be this. And all of a sudden, it's like, man, oh, man. Manoa gets forgotten in all this, man. We're talking again about Max Fried and Crochet coming in. That was supposed to be Manoa. If Manoa's healthy

and performing at the level that he did the previous couple of years prior to him just completely imploding, if you've got him into Gosman, into Bissette, into Barrios and now Bowden Francis has fouled money, if that's your your rotation

who cares what anyone else is doing and you'd still be you're not paying him anything he was under team control for a number of years so you could allocate that money instead of going for Corbin Burns and if it's true that he's going to get 250 million I just find that impossible to believe that Jay's going to give that to him. Their names are linked to Burns. That would be a pretty fascinating signing if they did it. If you bring in Burns and then again you've got Gosman and you've got Barrios under control. Bassett's up after this year. We'll see what happens.

But all of a sudden, yes, you have a very formidable rotation. Maybe the best in the American League if you were to bring in Burns, at least on paper. But if he's asking for 250 million i can't imagine they'd pay him that like i just find that impossible to believe you'd give burns that and scoff at giving vladi whatever you know i just i i'm not i don't see it i don't see them doing it i i will say this hayes like i have a lot of time and respect for the management group you know trying to pursue the big dog.

Go out there and try and get them. You obviously have an owner that's motivated and is letting you go into the piggy bank. That's all good. But don't you think part of this is they would be better served trying to outsmart everyone and realize, listen, we're not going to get Soto because we're competing with the Yankees and Mets, so why don't we just put our time and energy into filling these other holes and maybe just spending a little bit more in these other places, and we'll get ahead that way instead of putting all our time in the big dog.

Like, hey, optically, looks like you're in there. You're willing to spend money. I'm sure there's part of the fan base that appreciates that, but I'm sure there would be a part of the fan base that would say man these guys are smart like they're they're playing chess when everyone's playing checkers right look at everyone else over there talking to them we're over here working on different deals and trying to bring people in and get in front of the game i think the other reality is and i think this is what tim kirkton was just hammer, is that you have a front office

here that is so desperate for this season to work that they may let Vlade and Bo play out their contracts. Pray they have great years to save themselves, even if Bo and Vlade then leave and use the Blue Jays on a platform here and say,

we're out of here. We're signing somewhere else. That might keep their jobs. If they find a way to win 90 games and make the playoffs they're going to come back they're going to keep shabar and atkins that's what's going to happen it seems pretty clear cut i think mark's more complicated as president i don't know what's going to happen with him he may stay regardless ross is clearly in a very difficult position. Ross Atkins has got to put a winning product on the field, so why would he concern himself with 2026? When is he worried about what's going to happen with Bo Bichette and Vladi in the future?

He needs them right now. And, again, that may lead to a better team in 25, but it may be a crippling decision by 26 and onward if these guys leave and you have nothing left and you're not going to sign them and you don't trade them before you get to that point. These are the complicating factors that they've got to figure out. But they put themselves in that situation.

Don't kid yourself. They did. They did. And, again, this is where Mark is – Shapiro is the president, needs to lay out a three-year plan, five-year plan, ten-year plan. And it seems like right now it's simply about a one-year plan. Yeah. All right, Bobby Marks coming up.

We'll get back into a couple of games in the NHL tonight. Start looking ahead to week 15 in the NFL tomorrow. Wow, where's it gone? Flying, man. Niners, Rams tomorrow night in San Fran. What a ball game. That's going to be hazen bro on the clock doogie's already sent out the games on sunday and it's an absolute rick berry layup for owen wilson at the one o'clock spot it's disgusting what's happening here with doogie and

luke's obviously turned him luke said he'd give him like a signed Super Bowl helmet or whatever. I saw it on the text chain. I wasn't supposed to be on it. Greasy behavior, but it's all good. We will continue to push forward. Al's brother and I, we have no issues. We will continue to roll. We're plus two on the year.

So looking ahead to that as well. Overdrive continues. TSN 1050 and on TSN 2. It's a brand new year. Time to review last year's financial decisions and set new priorities for 2025. Kelvin the Money Guy suggests the three-step approach. One, clearly define your goals for the new year. Two, create a plan tailored to your needs and ambitions.

And three, make sure your portfolio is designed to serve that plan. Goal, plan, portfolio. Contact Kelvin the Money Guy and set your plans in motion. Call 416-457-PLAN or visit askkelvin.ca. All right, our best bets brought to you by FanDuel later in the hour. A couple of games in the NHL, and I think all eyes are going to be on Ottawa, Anaheim. Ottawa's got to get a win there.

And Buffalo, New York tonight. Sabres and Rangers, man, two sinking ships. You know, someone's got to float and pick up two points tonight, whether it's the Sabres or the Rangers. Someone's got to find a way to pick up a win. Well, and don't you think, guys, that both of those situations, although they're different, I mean, the Rangers won the President's Trophy last year. Like, regardless if the Rangers win tonight, like, they're trying to win a cup. They're not just trying to, hey, like, let's just coast their way.

Like, there still has to be major changes there. Like, and major changes might be, you know, they moved out Truba. They've still got money on the cap now. They've got to be, to me, they're To me, they're big game hunting for an impact player that can change the dynamic of that team. And then with Buffalo, you're looking for consistency, and I still think change is coming there because they're looking to make the next level, the push. So I think both organizations are at a crossroads. It's just for different reasons.

And I think change is going to be added to both of those groups for separate reasoning. Yeah, the thing with Buffalo is that they had money to spend in the offseason, and they kind of just went with, like, the non-name brand kind of guys, like the, you know, just speedy guys that don't cost a lot of money. And the fan base didn't like that because you bought out Jeff Skinner, like the speedy guys that don't cost a lot of money. And the fan base didn't like that because you bought out Jeff Skinner, so you got some of that money off the books.

And it was really underwhelming. And now it's underwhelming how they're playing this year. And the Rangers, I don't know how you guys feel, but they are very noisy. And I feel like there's a lot of teams... The Senators probably wouldn't appreciate how noisy the Rangers are doing their business because Brady Kachuk's name gets dragged into it, but everything about the Rangers is noisy. There's nothing neat

and tidy about their game. There's nothing neat and tidy about how the front office is operating. It's just there's so much happening around there. I don't know how much business they get done quietly or how much business they're going to get done. It's loud. It's arrogant.

That's New York. It's an original six team. You know, they're rich. That's what comes of it. I think, again, we talked about it earlier in the week why Michael Andlauer, the owner of the Sens, came out on the attack on the soft tampering stuff he must have known this isn't going to go anywhere there's nothing the league

can do to larry brooks about this report but he's catering to his market because ottawa like this is a third party the rangers but think about their existence they have the least to the left and the halves to the right. That's their world. If you're the Ottawa Senators, if you're a Sens fan living in Ottawa, you've got the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Montreal Canadiens right beside you on both sides. And that's what they've had to deal with their whole life is the Leafs.

And you talk about bold and arrogant. Leaf fans are like, we'll just take this guy. We'll beat you. We'll beat that. The Habs are the most storied franchise in the league, and they've always had to deal with that. They've always, I'm sure, felt like the little brother with the Leafs and the Habs, and now you've got a third one with New York saying,

actually, we're just going to pluck your captain because we want him now. It's a wild story. It doesn't work that way. It doesn't work that way. It doesn't work that way. And the other thing, like, if you go back through the history of the Sens, right, a lot of star players have played there. A lot of star players have left there, whether it's Heatley, you know, Spezza, I believe, was the trade.

Alfredson didn't leave on great terms. Like, that is an area of sensitivity when it comes to star players there. And there's scar tissue there. So I'm sure if Brady Kachuk's name comes up, it's like, whoa, whoa, whoa. If you want to be loud in New York about your business, I don't recommend it, but that's fine. Go ahead. Leave our guy and us.

Leave out of your loud business. For sure. And they should be sensitive because Carlson had to go to start the rebuild. Mark Stone apparently had to go. You don't want that to symbolize, again, it's not going to happen, but that would symbolize that didn't work. Those were legends in that market, Carlson in particular, and Stone was a really good son.

And look what Stone did. Stone goes to Vegas and captains a cup. And you don't want that to be Brady, Kachuk the next time around. So, yeah, we'll see. I mean, again, Ottawa's got to take care of their own business. They've got to win tonight. That's where you were. I just was going to double down on what you said a couple days ago.

If you're placing yourself in a situation where you are competing for a playoff spot or right there or in the playoffs, then maybe it's not as noisy. Because people are like, well, why? Now, it's noisy and weird things. McDavid. Yeah, well, McDavid when he's here when mcdavid's there like that's wishful thinking as opposed to if you're a playoff team uh you know if otta was entrenched in the third spot in the atlantic or something it just doesn't come up because it doesn't make

sense what what i think it got tied to is conjecture is like truba's eight million came off the books and like okay who's an eight million dollar player on a team that's not in the playoffs oh brady kachuk makes eight million dollars and his brother left calgary left the canadian like you can just even if you're making stuff up and throwing spaghetti against the wall i'm coming back to your point brian you can get there just even trying to draw the lines. Even if it's completely and 100% false, which I believe it is, it's just don't place yourself in that situation. So it comes back to the senators control their own fate.

They have to do that. And then you don't have people trying to pick out a carcass. What you're picking at right now, I'd be all over Nashville. I'd be looking at Nashville. I'd be looking at teams that, like I say, are in this uphill battle that doesn't look good when you're last place in the National Hockey League 28 games in. So that's an interesting one. There's an interesting one.

He makes $8 million. He was a former captain. I don't know if New York is thinking that's our guy, but that would be money in, money out. And getting back to the Sabres and them not spending money, maybe Terry Pegula can ask Vince Carter and Tracy McGrady and Josie Altidore for some cash because you see that story came out today and it had been reported on that the three of them have bought in a stake into the Buffalo Bills.

And I didn't see the details on when the ownership becomes official, but this would be a brilliant move by those guys if they get in right before a Super Bowl. Like, would you get a Super Bowl ring? If you're Vince, what a year you could have. You get your number retired in multiple places, and then you jump on a moving train. You throw in some money and become a Bills owner. They win a Super Bowl. you get a Super Bowl ring. I mean, he's never won anything his whole life.

It would be unbelievable timing, but you know what's crazy? When you hear what Pegula said about the former Toronto athletes that he brought in, like icons in Toronto, I'm sorry, man. He knows nothing about the city. I am not buying Tracy McGrady as an icon in Toronto. Barely a footnote. Give me a break. One of the most hated athletes when he and Vince came back.

Now, out the door was a beauty. I love Josie. He's been on the show a bunch. He was an awesome guy. Great guy, good player for TFC. A winner in the golden era of Toronto FC. Big game player. He scored some – the biggest A winner in the golden era of Toronto FC. Like, big game player. He scored some – the biggest goals probably in the history of the franchise.

Josie out the door. So Josie's cool. Yes. Vince, we've been down this road. We've talked about it. We all have our own opinion on it. But the idea of Vince and TMAC, you're right, being the guys that are going to somehow bring in the Toronto market

to western New York. Terry Pagula has no idea what he's talking about, nor would I expect him to. But if anything, this would hurt the Bills here. And he made the comment today, Toronto's our market. And listen, there's a lot of Bills fans up here. I hate hearing comments like that, though. If we're your market, if Torontoonto's your market then start acting like it and let's get games back up here and let's do it right yeah right let's they're never going to do

it again never going to happen never going to happen again and toronto's got to own some of that too it didn't go well the tickets were were overly priced the dome wasn't a great place the team was bad at that point the matchups weren weren't great. But, you know, the Bills, I would say they're probably the most popular team in Toronto and Southern Ontario. I think that's certainly the case. But there's a lot of football fans that are fans of all the popular teams. Dude, there's a lot of Steelers fans here. Like, there's a lot of Dolphins fans.

Cowboys, Packers. Oh, my God. I probably know more Cowboys fans here than I do Bills fans. I might. I'm not even joking. I think you're right. You might. But that's because they're a huge brand.

Like I say, the Cowboys are one of the biggest logos on the planet. It's like in hockey, it's the Leafs. They travel well. Like, you know, it doesn't matter what city you go to. There's people that have been Cowboys fans since Tom Landry was their coach back in the day. That's the way I look at it. So you're right. It doesn't matter proximity.

You can just go, oh, there's people you know that love that brand just because they've been one of the biggest brands on the planet, regardless of success or not. Of course. That's just how they are. And another part of it is access, right? Like there was a time not long ago, all you could get was a Bills game. All you could get was like the Browns. The Browns had a stranglehold over this market for a while because that was the team you could see on TV for whatever reason.

Now you don't have to just watch the Bills. And as a result, the NFL has exploded here in Toronto. But I know why he says that. I do believe that they make a lot of money from north of the border. I think a lot of their season ticket holders, I think a lot of their ticket holders in terms of gates, in terms of individual games, in terms of jersey sales. The Bills, of course, they would covet a market like this,

but they do not own it this is not a bills city and it's not even close they have a percentage but it's it's nowhere close to what i think pagula would like it to be i'm sure pagula would love exclusivity but uh so if they're not playing games though like if they're not coming up here to play games what are you doing are you just open up like a pop-up shop on Queen Street and selling merch? That's a good question. I mean, I think the NFL would do that, right? NFL Canada would do that, the NFL shop.

But, again, it wouldn't just be exclusively Bills. And I think if you're in Toronto, you want your own team up here. Again, I don't know if that's ever going to happen. I would guess it likely won't. But what I also don't love hearing about that is, again, it's like if that's Pagoula's pitch and the NFL is willing to accept that, then what are we getting out of it? If a team's never going to come up here and represent Toronto,

it's just accepted that the Bills get to own our market? I hate the sounds of that. But it's also like, okay, those are the guys that you're, you know, are they your liaisons to Toronto, if you want to call it that? What does Tracy McGrady know about Toronto? Even Vince, for that matter. Like, Vince doesn't. He's not going to be able to tell you, like,

this is really going to play with the people in Toronto. And I don't think that's why they're here. Josie Altidore would know, but the other two are not going to know. Listen, TMAC was here for like a couple of years and left as a kid. And he had the right to leave. He didn't demand that. He didn't do what Vince did. It was a CBA, a stupid thing in the CBA that allowed him to walk that early in his career.

And he left. He went to Orlando. He had a Hall of Fame career. He was a great player. But that was 25 years ago. And, again, I don't think T-Mac's doing this because of his connection to Toronto. People here are connecting that. And in Buffalo, if you're Pagoula, you're like, yeah, why not?

I guess I'll use these guys to try to make some more money. And let's be clear, if you're McGrady, if you're Carter, if you're Altidore, now you're in ownership, that's in your best interest too. Like, I'm sure Pagoula's like, all right, you're a part of the party here, guys. Like, we got to make this bigger and better. How are we going to do that? Can we use you guys in the Toronto market? But I'm sorry.

Tracy McGrady selling the Bills in Toronto is simply not going to happen. Nobody is going to be like, oh, now I'm a Bills fan because TMAC is an owner, part owner, and wants me to be. It's just never going to happen. This transaction, this kind of anger towards the situation, I mean, what's going on with this Brett Favre? Oh, man. This transaction, yeah. I thought that was a skit.

I'm sorry, watching that, I thought that that was kind of like a WWE skit. It looked like it. It looked like it, and then I knew it went south where Favre puts the hand out and it's not shook at all. I don't want to play the whole video because I don't think the audio is great, but maybe you can run it, Joe. You can run it without any audio because it's Mark Gastineau who was the sack leader

up until Strahan got it in the early 2000s. And the last sack he got on Favre was, I believe it was the last week of the year, week 17, I guess it would have been at that point. And Favre takes a dive. Strahan basically just taps him, like almost makes sure that he gets him and there's he's so angry he's so angry like i was like i thought it was a skit it looked very awkward and they're doing some documentary on it and again gastineau is a guy that for obvious reasons i mean that was his that was his record and strahan took took it, and he blames Favre for it, which is wild because, again,

Strahan did a lot throughout the season to get to that point, but incredibly awkward. And Favre is – exactly. He's thinking he's joking around. Then he realizes this guy's actually serious. Like, what the hell's the matter with this guy? I don't know. And it's been pointed out to me, like,

they didn't start officially counting sacks until the early 80s. So even Gastineau, like, yeah, that's a bit of a dive. Oh, my God. Is that it? And then look at him. He's like, I got it. That's ridiculous. It was bad.

It was bad. I've never seen that. That's wild. Yeah. And Favre was tough as nails. Like, you know him. He would have taken a hit, like a run or tried to escape it. And he's right in the huddle hugging him, too.

That's embarrassing. It was not good. Well, it was. Like, it would be, I don't know. What's the equivalent? Like, Matthews needs a goal to get 93 or something like that. And the goalie skates out of the net and lets him shoot it in. That's kind of what it would be like.

He lifts his stick up and then goes into the celebration. No butterfly. No butterfly. Just lift the stick, look between the legs like, oh, it went in. I don't know. For some reason, I don't know. Remind me, did this Gastineau, like, he's had some weird stuff like after football. Did he not?

Like, was he a boxer? I don't know his whole back story. I'm not familiar enough to give you an answer on that but um man oh man he was angry oh he and that that's a guy who's been bent out of shape for 20 years he's wanted a piece of brett farve that reminds me of those see remember those older cfl gentlemen at the great cup they started beating each other with those cans absolutely like if this if this dragged out i don don't know, 20, 30 more years, he would have beat him with his cane when he saw him.

I'm pretty sure I interviewed Angelo Mosca right after it. I don't mean to laugh. We did. But it was tough because that was at a TSN event, wasn't it? That was Grey Cup week. It was, I believe, the 100th Grey Cup and bringing back. These two hated each other from their time in the CFL. And they obviously, it was like Gastineau and Favre.

The only thing is they both were in on it. Favre was not in on this with Gastineau. He didn't realize that he was that bent out of shape. And I can't remember who was doing the interview. It might have been Dutch. Someone was up on stage. It was Dutch or Naylor or somebody. It was Naylor or Brian Williams or something.

Yeah, it was someone. And then, yeah, Cap Mosca comes up, and I think he was the one that did the flowers in the face. Yes, yeah. And Cap came over the top with the cane and just but god or vice versa there was a right there was a right hook it was really really unfortunate man it was that like a oh my like because they were both in their late 70s at that point i believe if not early yeah like it was it was a wild something man like a cane hit and a right hook falling back off the stage

and we were we were watching it live i remember that we came on the next day we talked about it i'm pretty sure we interviewed one of the guys i cannot remember yes and we asked we're like what happened there like yeah you know he wasn't backing down either like there was hate that was hatred of like 50 years. Yeah, and there was no apology afterwards, no remorse, nothing. Just, yeah, well, here it is. There it is. There it is.

The flowers. Get out of here. Mosca hits him with the cane right here. Capper comes. Oh, man. Was that something else? But then he realizes. Remember, he comes on and he's saying like peace love like

he said something like kind of realize what are we doing this is yeah what do we do i thought there was someone up on the stage it was a cfl there was i yeah it was a mediator over to the left over to the left there was okay i don't know anyway crazy let's hope that doesn't happen again with anybody but uh i don't know maybe that. Maybe that'll be me and Owen 30 years. We'll have some crazy breakup in 10 years, and then we'll see each other for the first time. You're a fraud. He's like, you're a fraud. You're a fraud.

And I'll be like, yeah, look at you. You slob. And then it'll just turn into chaos. You know somebody's going to put your two faces on that meme now, right? That'll be us in 30 years. All right. Best Bets brought to you by FanDuel. Coming up, Overdrive continues.

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physically located in Ontario. Alright, boys. Frankie, good seeing you. Thank you for doing this. Thanks for having me, boys. Frankie, good seeing you. Thank you for doing this. Thanks for having me, boys. As always. I think Strutty with his knitted sweater that we saw last night will join us tomorrow. Homemade sweater. Homemade sweater on the leaf panel.

On TV, everywhere, and he's like in a homemade sweater. Like he knitted it himself, I swear. I love it. Well, we'll see it tomorrow, I think. That's the plan. The Strud muffins will be baking overnight, and they'll be fired up tomorrow at 4. Thanks to everyone behind the scenes for helping out.

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